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    The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy. (OP)


    Assalamu Alaikum.
    Please note.
    1)-That the Earth has to be billions of years old for the theory of evolution to be true.Evolution is a slow process that requires billions of years.Hence,if the Earth is let us say,only a few thousands or even some hundred of thousand years old,Evolution cannot occur and this theory is false.
    2)-The Presenter is a Christian.The Quran has ordered us Muslims to judge previous scriptures by using the Quran as criterian,i.e,that which agrees with the Quran,Muslims agree that it is the truth.And that part of the scriptures,which disagree with the Quran,we disregard them.The Presenter presents Bible verses throughout his presentation.And they are in agreement with the Islamic view.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_OlX7M5MLA

    - - - Updated - - -

    Moreover,this person is also a Zionist.I recommend you not to listen to his videos other than Evolution and his debates with Evolutionists.

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    Re: The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Silas View Post
    But there is another way of looking at this yes? As one scholar writes:

    "(Allah is He) who has made everything He created better, and He began the creation of the human (being) out of clay (Al-Sajda, 32: 7).

    In this verse, we are told that the first creation of human beings was out of clay, but that was the beginning. The most relevant word in this verse is "began" (bada-a), which tells us clearly that the creation happened in a process that had a beginning. It did not happen at once"

    In other words, creation is not something that occurs in an instant (although Allah could certainly make it so), but is a process of becoming. As in the earlier passages of the Quran, which state that the heavens and the earth were like one before being separated, we see hints at how the world was formed. Science tells us cosmic dust and heavy elements swirled around (by gravity) and ultimately coalesced into the planets--there was a separation. Later, it is mentioned that life comes from water, and this is clearly the case, as water has existed on Earth for 4.7 billion years (before any living being) and is a necessary element of all life.

    So could it be that Allah has gathered up the "dust" or "clay" necessary to create Adam and Eve, and set the process of evolution in motion, knowing full well where it would end?

    7 million years is but an instant to a God that lives beyond and outside of time
    "O mankind! if you have a doubt about the Resurrection, (consider) that We created you out of dust, then out of sperm, then out of a leech-like clot, then out of a morsel of flesh, partly formed and partly unformed, in order that We may manifest (Our Power) to you; and We cause whom We will to rest in the wombs for an appointed term, then do We bring you out as babies, then (foster you) that you may reach your age of full strength; and some of you are called to die, and some are sent back to the feeblest old age, so that they know nothing after having known (much). And (further), you see the earth barren and lifeless, but when We pour down rain on it, it is stirred (to life), it swells, and it puts forth every kind of beautiful growth in pairs" (22:5)

    Indeed, process of creation, from the beginning till completion is a fact
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    Re: The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

    Quote Originally Posted by reyditia View Post
    Yes , I even heard that it is formed in 7 days , do you believe that ?
    We defined one day as the time the sun needs to "travel" across the sky and make one full orbit.
    When Allah created the universe, there was no Earth, sun or moon...so no years, months days or hours.
    So, 7 days in the Quran does not have to mean 7 Earthly days.
    sure you have heard how time can be experienced totally different in thehereafter.
    one second on Earth can take several years on thehereafter...or vice versa, several decades on Earth can be experienced as seconds in thehereafter.
    also 7, 70, 70.000 can be used differently in Arabic for what I know.
    like in english saying something like "I've already told you 100 (or 1000) times"...you do not actually mean 100 or 1000...but you mean a lot.
    2 | Likes Good brother, ChosenTCO liked this post

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    Re: The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

    Islam does not at all agree with Darwinian evolution.The one who says so is going against the consensus of the Scholors and must repent.Darwinian evolution says that all living things have arisen from one single PROKARYOTE.Secondly,Darwinian evolution has no evidence.It is based on assumptions.Scientists cannot even consider creation.As it is clearly unthinkable from secular point of view.But as said in the video,We can prove the existence of God by proving that it is impossible for things to have been created by their own,hence,showing that there has to be intelligent design.The few attempts to create life in the laboratory,had to have some artificially induced and created situations in these experiments.Also,please research about law of Thermodynamics.

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    Re: The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

    Quote Originally Posted by MuhammadHamza1 View Post
    Islam does not at all agree with Darwinian evolution.The one who says so is going against the consensus of the Scholors and must repent.Darwinian evolution says that all living things have arisen from one single PROKARYOTE.Secondly,Darwinian evolution has no evidence.It is based on assumptions.Scientists cannot even consider creation.As it is clearly unthinkable from secular point of view.But as said in the video,We can prove the existence of God by proving that it is impossible for things to have been created by their own,hence,showing that there has to be intelligent design.The few attempts to create life in the laboratory,had to have some artificially induced and created situations in these experiments.Also,please research about law of Thermodynamics.
    Dear brother,
    Sorry to say this, but I see here some arguments without properly backing it up.

    Islam does not have to agree with Darwinian evolution. Islam is a fact. In science, we just collects the facts and trie to come up with an explanation for them. we develop theories and test those, and then we modify our original theory. that is how science works. indeed, some assumptions are being made, but always in combination with facts.
    About the Darwinian evolution. Facts point in the direction of evolution (I am not saying that it is proven...but they point in that direction.) Darwin came up with this theory of evolution. I am not saying that evolution fully took place as Darwin described it. I am sure there are some errors in it which will be proven in the near future.
    But what I mean: Allah could have used the evolution as a tool for his creation...So I think that evolution is pretty plausible...we must not rule that option out.
    whether or not everything existed out of a single proka-something does not make a difference.

    In classical laws of physics for example everyone agreed proven that speeds in exactly the same direction could be added up.
    if you are in a train moving forward with 100mph and you stand up and walk towards the front of the train with 5mph, then your speed would be 100+5=105mph.

    this was always logical...and it was proven...but then came Einstein and he has proven this unnaccurate for speeds approaching light speed.

    So science develops all the time.
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    Re: The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

    Quote Originally Posted by MuhammadHamza1 View Post
    Islam does not at all agree with Darwinian evolution.The one who says so is going against the consensus of the Scholors and must repent.
    scholars are fallible

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    Re: The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peacefully View Post
    scholars are fallible
    but consensus of scholars is protected from error
    The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

    Allah (swt) knows best

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    Re: The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

    Quote Originally Posted by azc View Post
    but consensus of scholars is protected from error
    did allah say that?

    while hadith are fundamental, hadith are also fallible too.

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    Re: The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peacefully View Post
    did allah say that?

    while hadith are fundamental, hadith are also fallible too.
    1-Allah said Adam is the first human.

    2- Neo-darwinian theory is non-provable and non-falsifiable. It's just conjecture.

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    Re: The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

    i dont disagree brother.

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    Re: The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peacefully View Post
    did allah say that?while hadith are fundamental, hadith are also fallible too.
    ''And whoever opposes the Messenger (s.a.w) after guidance has become clear to him and follows other than the way of the believers - We will give him what he has taken and drive him into Hell, and evil it is as a destination. {Quran 4:115} ....Therefore, if the believers maintain consensus over an issue, those who oppose are threatened with torment in hell

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Peacefully View Post
    did allah say that?

    while hadith are fundamental, hadith are also fallible too.
    Are you a hadith rejector.? This clarification is needed
    Last edited by azc; 01-31-2018 at 06:03 PM.

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    Re: The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

    no, i am not a hadith rejector. i just approach hadith with modesty and stay intuned to the fact that hadith are fallible.

    as for the quran quote, believing that darwinism is deserving of more investigation instead of being blindly ignored because of hadith is not opposing muhammads (pbuh) message or deem a person and unbliever.

    - - - Updated - - -

    *nor deem a person an unbeliever

    sorry, dont know how to edit a post on here yet

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    Re: The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peacefully View Post
    no, i am not a hadith rejector. i just approach hadith with modesty and stay intuned to the fact that hadith are fallible.

    as for the quran quote, believing that darwinism is deserving of more investigation instead of being blindly ignored because of hadith is not opposing muhammads (pbuh) message or deem a person and unbliever.

    - - - Updated - - -

    *nor deem a person an unbeliever

    sorry, dont know how to edit a post on here yet
    When we have Quran and ahadith in our hands then what is the need to believe in any other 'ISM

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    Re: The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

    Quote Originally Posted by azc View Post
    When we have Quran and ahadith in our hands then what is the need to believe in any other 'ISM
    “Seeking knowledge is an obligation upon every Muslim.”

    Source: Sunan Ibn Mājah 224

    - - - Updated - - -

    no need to believe in any other 'ism, but knowing (seeking knowledge) is an obligation.

    i do not say you are wrong for not believing in darwinism, but telling someone they are wrong for learning it is unislamic.
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    Re: The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peacefully View Post
    “Seeking knowledge is an obligation upon every Muslim.”

    Source: Sunan Ibn Mājah 224

    - - - Updated - - -

    no need to believe in any other 'ism, but knowing (seeking knowledge) is an obligation.

    i do not say you are wrong for not believing in darwinism, but telling someone they are wrong for learning it is unislamic.
    “Seeking knowledge is an obligation upon every Muslim.”
    Yes, here obligation meant to getting the basic knowledge of shariah which enables you to differentiate between haram and halal.

    "O Allah, I seek beneficial knowledge, wide sustenance and cure from all ailments from You".
    (Hisnul Hasin)

    And the knowledge which goes against the Islamic shariah in any form is harmful for iman.

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    Re: The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

    i leave it to god (quran) to tell me what is not beneficial knowledge as humans are fallible.

    i will agree to disagree.

    - - - Updated - - -

    i feel you can not say something is wrong, haram or against shariah if you have no knowledge of it.

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    Re: The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peacefully View Post
    i leave it to god (quran) to tell me what is not beneficial knowledge as humans are fallible.i will agree to disagree.- - - Updated - - -i feel you can not say something is wrong, haram or against shariah if you have no knowledge of it.
    Do you want that Allah swt should tell you about this matter as humans are fallible...?
    The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

    Allah (swt) knows best

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    Re: The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

    I did not click the link but....

    Evolution is real (not the humans came from monkeys part) but things change over time...etc. God created evolution, science, the solar system, nature...and how it all works.

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    Re: The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

    Quote Originally Posted by azc View Post
    Yes, here obligation meant to getting the basic knowledge of shariah which enables you to differentiate between haram and halal.

    "O Allah, I seek beneficial knowledge, wide sustenance and cure from all ailments from You".
    (Hisnul Hasin)

    And the knowledge which goes against the Islamic shariah in any form is harmful for iman.


    Brother, I would have to disagree with you there. Seeking beneficial knowledge is something and actively looking for it is something else. You can never know if something is fully useful to you or not until you study it thoroughly and attaining as much of information as you can to give it a fair case. For example, if you and i were to look into the usefulness of making a full multi-billion-dollar organisation like NASA just to send people and advanced telescopes in to space, we would probably quickly dismiss the idea as we would feel that it is completely useless to look into the void not knowing what to look for. However, God ordered us to do so in many things, even ourselves. He ordered us to ponder about how he created the heavens and earth, humans and animals, plants, rivers and mountains. All of theses’ origins ... If we (as humans) didnt send those advanced telescopes to space, we would not have been able to definitively confirm the bigbang theory Proving what Allah has already stated in the Quran 1400 years ago. Likewise, evolution and the origins of life. When you look into evolution and carefully study it, you will find that the logic behind it is almost infallible (i say almost!).

    HOWEVER, when it comes to the origins of humans. Thats where we, as muslims, draw the line. This is because there are plenty of saheeh ahadeeths (From what i have been told) that talk about the formation of Adam and is origins, so we cannot say that evolution applies to him. On the other hand, there is no mention of the origins of the other living creatures on earth, and that is why we can apply the theory of evolution to other earthly beings without contradicting our Religion. Hope this clears things up a little ...

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by azc View Post
    Yes, here obligation meant to getting the basic knowledge of shariah which enables you to differentiate between haram and halal.

    "O Allah, I seek beneficial knowledge, wide sustenance and cure from all ailments from You".
    (Hisnul Hasin)

    And the knowledge which goes against the Islamic shariah in any form is harmful for iman.


    Brother, I would have to disagree with you there. Seeking beneficial knowledge is something and actively looking for it is something else. You can never know if something is fully useful to you or not until you study it thoroughly and attaining as much of information as you can to give it a fair case. For example, if you and i were to look into the usefulness of making a full multi-billion-dollar organisation like NASA just to send people and advanced telescopes in to space, we would probably quickly dismiss the idea as we would feel that it is completely useless to look into the void not knowing what to look for. However, God ordered us to do so in many things, even ourselves. He ordered us to ponder about how he created the heavens and earth, humans and animals, plants, rivers and mountains. All of theses’ origins ... If we (as humans) didnt send those advanced telescopes to space, we would not have been able to definitively confirm the bigbang theory Proving what Allah has already stated in the Quran 1400 years ago. Likewise, evolution and the origins of life. When you look into evolution and carefully study it, you will find that the logic behind it is almost infallible (i say almost!).

    HOWEVER, when it comes to the origins of humans. Thats where we, as muslims, draw the line. This is because there are plenty of saheeh ahadeeths (From what i have been told) that talk about the formation of Adam and is origins, so we cannot say that evolution applies to him. On the other hand, there is no mention of the origins of the other living creatures on earth, and that is why we can apply the theory of evolution to other earthly beings without contradicting our Religion. Hope this clears things up a little ...
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    Re: The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChosenTCO View Post


    Brother, I would have to disagree with you there. Seeking beneficial knowledge is something and actively looking for it is something else. You can never know if something is fully useful to you or not until you study it thoroughly and attaining as much of information as you can to give it a fair case. For example, if you and i were to look into the usefulness of making a full multi-billion-dollar organisation like NASA just to send people and advanced telescopes in to space, we would probably quickly dismiss the idea as we would feel that it is completely useless to look into the void not knowing what to look for. However, God ordered us to do so in many things, even ourselves. He ordered us to ponder about how he created the heavens and earth, humans and animals, plants, rivers and mountains. All of theses’ origins ... If we (as humans) didnt send those advanced telescopes to space, we would not have been able to definitively confirm the bigbang theory Proving what Allah has already stated in the Quran 1400 years ago. Likewise, evolution and the origins of life. When you look into evolution and carefully study it, you will find that the logic behind it is almost infallible (i say almost!).

    HOWEVER, when it comes to the origins of humans. Thats where we, as muslims, draw the line. This is because there are plenty of saheeh ahadeeths (From what i have been told) that talk about the formation of Adam and is origins, so we cannot say that evolution applies to him. On the other hand, there is no mention of the origins of the other living creatures on earth, and that is why we can apply the theory of evolution to other earthly beings without contradicting our Religion. Hope this clears things up a little ...

    - - - Updated - - -





    Brother, I would have to disagree with you there. Seeking beneficial knowledge is something and actively looking for it is something else. You can never know if something is fully useful to you or not until you study it thoroughly and attaining as much of information as you can to give it a fair case. For example, if you and i were to look into the usefulness of making a full multi-billion-dollar organisation like NASA just to send people and advanced telescopes in to space, we would probably quickly dismiss the idea as we would feel that it is completely useless to look into the void not knowing what to look for. However, God ordered us to do so in many things, even ourselves. He ordered us to ponder about how he created the heavens and earth, humans and animals, plants, rivers and mountains. All of theses’ origins ... If we (as humans) didnt send those advanced telescopes to space, we would not have been able to definitively confirm the bigbang theory Proving what Allah has already stated in the Quran 1400 years ago. Likewise, evolution and the origins of life. When you look into evolution and carefully study it, you will find that the logic behind it is almost infallible (i say almost!).

    HOWEVER, when it comes to the origins of humans. Thats where we, as muslims, draw the line. This is because there are plenty of saheeh ahadeeths (From what i have been told) that talk about the formation of Adam and is origins, so we cannot say that evolution applies to him. On the other hand, there is no mention of the origins of the other living creatures on earth, and that is why we can apply the theory of evolution to other earthly beings without contradicting our Religion. Hope this clears things up a little ...
    in short, if you are a scientist and do research and it makes you closer to Allah swt then it's beneficial knowledge but if you become an atheist, it's not beneficial, rather it changes into an haram act as you will mislead other Muslims as well.
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    Re: The Theory of Evolution is a Fantasy.

    Quote Originally Posted by azc View Post
    in short, if you are a scientist and do research and it makes you closer to Allah swt then it's beneficial knowledge but if you become an atheist, it's not beneficial, rather it changes into an haram act as you will mislead other Muslims as well.
    I am not sure of this. If you keep your conclusions based on facts...not influenced by personal feelings, interpretations, or prejudice...then it should not mislead other Muslims. As a scientist your goal is to discover the unknown, not to persuade Muslims into atheism.
    Under these conditions, the knowledge of this particular atheist scientist, could still bring Muslims closer to Allah....and therefore be beneficial.

    In fact...isn't all knowledge beneficial? of course there can be personal information sometimes which is better for you to not know...but I mean knowledge in general...can that be unbeneficial, and if yes, can you give one example of unbeneficial knowledge?

    How I think about unbeneficial knowledge is this:
    knowledge is like a weapon. in the hands of the goods, the weapon is good. in the hands of the wrong, the weapon is bad. But the weapon on its own is good nor bad.
    the same with knowledge. The same knowledge who brings someone closer to Allah can cause some other away from Allah and therefore becom unbeneficial for this person.
    like evolution...evolution appearantly was unbeneficial to Darwin...but to me personally it is beneficial knowledge because know I understand better how Allah created us Alhamdulillah.
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    By News4U in forum Comparative religion
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    Last Post: 02-26-2005, 09:25 PM

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