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    Freedom of Speech (OP)


    I wish Muslims knew what Freedom of Speech really is
    but I know there's no hope.

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    Re: Freedom of Speech

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    Quote Originally Posted by fschmidt View Post
    I don't understand what you mean. At a legal level, you can still express any opinion in America (as a citizen) without worrying about being arrested. The only other country where I know this to be true is Japan. In all other countries to my knowledge, you can be arrested for expressing the wrong opinion. This is a simple concept.
    You mean america the arm of the rothschilds which props up the fake state of israel, the fake government of egypt, and every other corrupt tyrant on the planet?


    Quote Originally Posted by fschmidt View Post
    The battle between the financial elite and righteous religions has been going on throughout history. The battle between the Quraysh and early Muslims was the same battle. The financial elite win when religion is weak. The only connection between this and free speech is that free speech tends to increase when good religions dominate, and decrease when the financial elite dominate.
    Just speech dominates when taqwa of Allah is prevalent.





    Quote Originally Posted by fschmidt View Post
    Like most of the West, Israel supports blasphemy and opposes free speech.
    A bit stupid to then claim legitimacy based on the torah innit?
    Think we can't see past the deception?
    Freedom of Speech













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    Raymann's Avatar
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    Re: Freedom of Speech

    Quote Originally Posted by Abz2000 View Post
    You mean the americans who murdered the men, women, and children of hiroshima and nagasaki
    No, those Americans are long gone, divine justice or mother nature have done whatever is appropriate with them.
    Should the germans (all germans) forever pay for the crimes a few nazis committed without the consent or knowledge of their own people ?

    It's a new day, the lessons of the past have taught us to be wiser this time.
    Let's not hold grudges nor hateful feelings towards our brothers.
    It's all forgiven, isn't it ?

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    Re: Freedom of Speech

    Quote Originally Posted by Al Khorasani View Post
    Originally Posted by Raymann
    Of course not, I said if before, there is something called "Hate Speech" which basically draws the line between what is allowed and what is not. People go to jail for saying the wrong thing. People get sued all the time for the same reason so obviously we're not allowed to say whatever we want.
    There is a limit and every country has different laws on the subject.

    So what's the problem? Nobody disagrees with you about that, we just find it funny how you claim your society has freedom of speech, when it clearly doesn't (and for a good reason).
    Freedom of Speech is much more prevalent on western countries.
    Islamic countries, communists, Dictatorships, etc, severely restrict the right to free expression and that's the whole point of the discussion.
    100% Freedom of Speech is a noble concept but humans have the tendency to take advantage of a good thing and turn it into a bad thing. That's when some necessary restrictions had to be brought up for the sake of peace (hate speech laws).
    Blasphemy is not a thing on western countries and religion also exist on western countries.
    Which one is right which one is wrong nobody seems certain (except the atheists).

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    Re: Freedom of Speech

    Quote Originally Posted by Raymann View Post
    No, those Americans are long gone, divine justice or mother nature have done whatever is appropriate with them.
    Should the germans (all germans) forever pay for the crimes a few nazis committed without the consent or knowledge of their own people ?
    I don't think that policies reboot with every new generation unless the new generation makes amends - and by the fact that they still occupy parts of japan and control much of its policy through treaties as a result of the bombing shows that it's the same people who carry the torch of their unjust fathers unless they repent..
    I don't think palestinians should pay the price for crimes carried out by the european puppets of the rothschilds either.





    Quote Originally Posted by Raymann View Post

    It's a new day, the lessons of the past have taught us to be wiser this time.
    Let's not hold grudges nor hateful feelings towards our brothers.
    It's all forgiven, isn't it ?
    Why are you asking me as if i'm the one responsible for the consequences of your actions - when i have no bearing on your actions as far as you have admitted?
    I'm concerned about obeying God and walking straight now and in the future - are you? And will you at least allow me to?
    Freedom of Speech













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    Re: Freedom of Speech

    Quote Originally Posted by Abz2000 View Post
    You mean america the arm of the rothschilds which props up the fake state of israel, the fake government of egypt, and every other corrupt tyrant on the planet?
    This has nothing to do with free speech.

    Just speech dominates when taqwa of Allah is prevalent.
    Yes

    Quote Originally Posted by fschmidt View Post
    Like most of the West, Israel supports blasphemy and opposes free speech.
    A bit stupid to then claim legitimacy based on the torah innit?
    Think we can't see past the deception?
    You mean me or Israel? Israel is based on Talmudic Judaism which redefines Torah to include the Talmud. That is how they justify their claim. From my Old Testament view, Talmudic Judaism violates the Torah.

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    Re: Freedom of Speech

    Quote Originally Posted by fschmidt View Post
    This has nothing to do with free speech.
    It does when america claims to be the bastion of free speech and then murders journalists and common citizens for speaking just and truthful words, and also props up other corrupt crooks to do the same.

    This kind of event has been happening through bush who set up the "patriot" act, obama who murdered anwar for his speech, also his son abdur rahman who knew the facts, had people murdered with drones, asked the yemeni government to take the blame, then killed more people and arrested and broke the teeth of joyrnalists who remain incarcerated, and we know how nora awlaki was murdered and hard disks were robbed as soon as trump took office and how trump justified it by saying that the families of "terrorists" (even though the war on terror is a fraud) should be killed.
    Do you know that when students in America began demanding the end to the vietnam war - that nixon ordered the protests to be violently put down, and that police opened live fire on the crowds and the deaths of two of the students nade it big and that huge protests ensued?
    It looks like the american media and public is more docile and apathetic to the crimes of its leadership now than it was then.

    Both of these are worth watching in their entirety as they contain essential facts and information:

    The second is also hugely entertaining too -




    Another method used is to buy up media outlets and make clowns out of them.
    And we know how the copyrights to many books, interviews, articles, documentaries and patents are simply purchased (sometimes via illegal threats and pressure) and then chucked under the desk.





    ........Ultimately, both the United States’ and Israel’s investigations deemed the attack on the Liberty an accident that resulted when Israel mistook the American spy ship for an Egyptian freighter. Bamford considers that conclusion a cover-up, however, citing the gag order issued to survivors, as well as the fact that NSA’s deputy director at the time, Louis Tordella, referred to the Israeli Defense Forces preliminary inquiry into the attack “a nice whitewash.” Still, other sources assert that any notion of cover-up is mere paranoia. According to a spokesperson at the Israeli Ministry of Foreign affairs, the Liberty assault was “a tragic accident … that was settled between the parties involved years ago,” and that, “as is the case with many of these matters, there are always enough conspiracy theories to go around, but they never hold water.”

    The USS Liberty’s legacy indeed fed conspiracy theories, and Bamford is not alone in asserting a cover-up. The Liberty Veterans Association, an organization comprised of survivors of the 1967 attack, has called for a robust and transparent investigation into the incident for decades, to no avail.

    In a statement to The Intercept, Ernie Gallo, who currently serves as the president of the Liberty Veterans Association, said, “We now know that the Navy Court of Inquiry was merely for show, as the officers were told to come to the conclusion the Liberty did [its] job and the attack was accidental.” Bamford also references the magnitude and length of the attack as proof of its deliberateness: The ship was hit repeatedly, first by planes dropping thousand-pound bombs and napalm, and then by torpedo boats. Israeli forces also jammed the Liberty’s antennas and communication channels, took out the four .50-caliber machine guns on board, and reportedly shot at life rafts and crew members as they attempted to evacuate the vessel. “It was an attack in broad daylight,” said Bamford. “They were flying a large U.S. flag. [The ship] said USS Liberty on the back. … I mean, what do you need?”

    The incident and its aftermath took a significant psychological toll on survivors, many of whom were reported to suffer from PTSD. One survivor and member of the Liberty Veterans Association, James Ennes, was shot in the femur during the attack, and was then instructed never to discuss it. Ernie Gallo had a fellow crewmate die in his arms. It was decades before survivors began sharing their experiences, and they were sometimes criticized for being anti-Semitic or slanderous of Israel for doing so.

    Not all veterans involved believe in a cover-up, however. Former Navy Chief Petty Officer Marvin Nowicki, the chief Hebrew-language analyst aboard a U.S. Navy EC-121 spy plane that was intercepting Israeli aircraft communications as they were assaulting the Liberty, believed the attack was an accident. He stated in a letter to the Wall Street Journal in 2001 that though he heard and recorded Israeli pilots’ and captains’ references to the U.S. flag flying on the deck of the Liberty, these remarks were made only after the attack was underway, and not before. It was when aircraft and motor torpedo boat operators moved closer to the Liberty, recalled Nowicki, that they were able to recognize and therefore reference the American flag.

    “The last time I spoke publicly, I was visited by NCIS agents.”

    Unbeknownst to Nowicki at the time, his letter to the editor sparked concerns at NSA that he had revealed classified information on the Liberty. The second Snowden document, dated 2002, referenced several disclosures in his letter “surrounding National Security Agency sources and methods or NSA’s ability to successfully exploit a foreign target.” Though the document does not specify which details in Nowicki’s article constituted such disclosures, it does reference materials related to the investigation. Nowicki, in a statement that would stir apparent concern at both the NSA and the Naval Criminal Investigative Service, called the accident a “gross error.” “How can I prove it?” he wrote. “I can’t unless the transcripts/tapes are found and released to the public. I last saw them in a desk drawer at NSA in the late 1970s before I left the service.” After several unsuccessful attempts to reach Nowicki by phone and email, he ultimately responded to a mailed request for comment. He returned The Intercept’s original posted letter, on which he had hastily scrawled: “I cannot comply w[ith] your request. The last time I spoke publicly, I was visited by NCIS agents.” (NCIS stated that it had no records related to Nowicki’s claim.)

    Even 50 years after the attack, and in a radically different geopolitical climate than that of the Six-Day War, extremely limited information is available about the assault and its subsequent investigations. Inquiries by the media and by the survivors have yielded profoundly limited results, despite considerable attempts; ABC’s Nightline interviewed survivors decades after the attack, the results of which never aired. And while James Bamford presumes this is because interested parties didn’t want unsavory information about Israel broadcast on mainstream American television, Nightline’s then-host Ted Koppel said otherwise: “At the risk of contributing to the veneer of ‘cover-up’ that surrounds any discussion of the USS Liberty story, my only recollection is that we did nothing because we found nothing new or substantive.” Neither, it seems, has anyone else.

    https://theintercept.com/2017/06/06/...attack-secret/


    Quote Originally Posted by fschmidt View Post
    You mean me or Israel?
    That's my method of addressing all whom it involves and is therefore of concern to.


    Quote Originally Posted by fschmidt View Post
    Israel is based on Talmudic Judaism which redefines Torah to include the Talmud. That is how they justify their claim.
    The talmud is a blasphemous article made by those at babylon who cast the book of Allah behind their backs as if they did not know, and went on to directly contradict the original message of the (albeit heavily redacted) torah on a fundamental level. It's attempts to deny the messiah and cast blasphemous slanders on mary is telling of the carefully thought out intentions of its authors.
    The people who finally authorised the talmud knew more about the signs of the messiah in the old testament than the common layman - so it is obvious that they had dark anti-Christ and above that - Anti-God aims.

    Quote Originally Posted by fschmidt View Post

    From my Old Testament view, Talmudic Judaism violates the Torah.
    [/quote]


    It violates the original message of the torah without a single shadow of a doubt.
    Last edited by Abz2000; 09-20-2018 at 01:11 AM.
    Freedom of Speech













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    Re: Freedom of Speech

    Well, in Islamic countries as you stated, Freedom of speech is of course banned, as most Muslim will agree that freedom of speech mean free to express anything includes the hate of speech, we believe 'free but limited' is not free at all, it's our common sense after all.

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    Re: Freedom of Speech

    Quote Originally Posted by air View Post
    Well, in Islamic countries as you stated, Freedom of speech is of course banned, as most Muslim will agree that freedom of speech mean free to express anything includes the hate of speech, we believe 'free but limited' is not free at all, it's our common sense after all.
    it's quite a wide generalisation to use the term "islamic" when the majority of governments in the world are hostages to usurious banking institutions - which are the antithesis of Islamic.

    Also - freedom of speech is just when tempered within obedience to Allah since He is the author of truth and justice, this is the method of gaining a uniform consensus whilst retaining the ability to argue exceptions to statements in court based on a stable foundation.

    We notice from the conversion sa'ad ibn mu'aad and usaid ibn hudair at the hands of mus'ab ibn 'umair that the leadership in al madinah were more fair and just than the Quraysh of Makkah when it came to debating with foreign ideas.

    We also notice from the public debates of personalities such as Imaam Abu Haneefah with atheists and such during the height of the Islamic caliphate, that when Islam itself shines in the hearts and people are using their brains to think rather than to only follow traditions of forefathers like talmudic jews, and when this strength of faith is reflected in government - there is no suspicion and paranoia, and people are very secure in their faith.



    The age i grew up in was something of the begining of a revival, Quran was a ritual chant in a foreign language, and islam was the study of the books of rules by fulaan and fulaan - with rarely any reference to the wise, mind expanding verses of the Quran.

    Things are now changing for the better fast - why do you think satan is angry and why do you think 9/11 was staged?

    America's love for and support of corrupt tyrants such as hosni mubarak and sisi whose islam is limited to putting a skull cap on your head and your hands up in silence while a dodgy imam makes hollow invocations is a perfect example of why some so called "islamic" leaders dislike just and honest speech.

    The jewish censorship of the people during the first coming and their method of sitting on the pathways and muttering illogicalities and false slander with the aim of casting doubts upon the truth is also a perfect example of how people become insecure when they become greedy and corrupt whilst standing on falsehood. (See john 9:22, john 7:11-13, john 7:20 and john 7:25)
    Last edited by Abz2000; 09-20-2018 at 03:42 AM.
    Freedom of Speech













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    Re: Freedom of Speech

    Greetings and peace be with you Raymann;

    No, those Americans are long gone, divine justice or mother nature have done whatever is appropriate with them.
    Should the germans (all germans) forever pay for the crimes a few nazis committed without the consent or knowledge of their own people ?

    It's a new day, the lessons of the past have taught us to be wiser this time.
    The Germans have learned a lot from the war, and they have become a more peaceful nation. When national leaders use free speech it can be dangerous, the Americans and British are still using the same recipe for war that the Germans did


    Hermann Goering – The People Can Always Be Brought to the Bidding of the Leaders


    “Why, of course, the people don’t want war. Why would some poor slob on a farm want to risk his life in a war when the best that he can get out of it is to come back to his farm in one piece. Naturally, the common people don’t want war; neither in Russia nor in England nor in America, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy or a fascist dictatorship or a Parliament or a Communist dictatorship…

    Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country.”

    – Hermann Goering (as told to Gustav Gilbert during the Nuremberg trials)



    Let's not hold grudges nor hateful feelings towards our brothers.
    It's all forgiven, isn't it ?
    Forgiveness is divine, and the separation of church and state seems to show when searching for ways to forgive. If all has been forgiven then why do we keep fighting in other people's countries?

    In the spirit of praying for justice for all people.

    Eric
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    Freedom of Speech

    You will never look into the eyes of anyone who does not matter to God.

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    Re: Freedom of Speech

    Quote Originally Posted by air View Post
    we believe 'free but limited' is not free at all, it's our common sense after all.
    So you don't believe in percentages, shades, proportions, fractions, restrictions, etc, is all or nothing to you ?
    Well, there you have it, you get nothing because you are a Muslim and as you mention, Freedom of Speech is banned in Islam.
    Actually I didn't know Freedom of Speech was banned in Islam, I just though it was restricted.
    In the west we can pretty much say whatever we want but we have to be careful not to incite violence.
    Even if we incite violence is not easy to prove that the language or expressions used were meant as hate speech.
    As a westerner who has learned from past experiences (Charlie Hebdo and similar incidents) I would include known offensive expressions towards Islam as hate speech.
    That's the advantage of man made laws, we can adjust to the present time and current cultures.
    You have no more prophets coming up to bring some needed updates so I wonder about the future.

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    Re: Freedom of Speech

    Quote Originally Posted by Abz2000 View Post
    it's quite a wide generalisation to use the term "islamic" when the majority of governments in the world are hostages to usurious banking institutions - which are the antithesis of Islamic.

    Also - freedom of speech is just when tempered within obedience to Allah since He is the author of truth and justice, this is the method of gaining a uniform consensus whilst retaining the ability to argue exceptions to statements in court based on a stable foundation.

    We notice from the conversion sa'ad ibn mu'aad and usaid ibn hudair at the hands of mus'ab ibn 'umair that the leadership in al madinah were more fair and just than the Quraysh of Makkah when it came to debating with foreign ideas.

    We also notice from the public debates of personalities such as Imaam Abu Haneefah with atheists and such during the height of the Islamic caliphate, that when Islam itself shines in the hearts and people are using their brains to think rather than to only follow traditions of forefathers like talmudic jews, and when this strength of faith is reflected in government - there is no suspicion and paranoia, and people are very secure in their faith.



    The age i grew up in was something of the begining of a revival, Quran was a ritual chant in a foreign language, and islam was the study of the books of rules by fulaan and fulaan - with rarely any reference to the wise, mind expanding verses of the Quran.

    Things are now changing for the better fast - why do you think satan is angry and why do you think 9/11 was staged?

    America's love for and support of corrupt tyrants such as hosni mubarak and sisi whose islam is limited to putting a skull cap on your head and your hands up in silence while a dodgy imam makes hollow invocations is a perfect example of why some so called "islamic" leaders dislike just and honest speech.

    The jewish censorship of the people during the first coming and their method of sitting on the pathways and muttering illogicalities and false slander with the aim of casting doubts upon the truth is also a perfect example of how people become insecure when they become greedy and corrupt whilst standing on falsehood. (See john 9:22, john 7:11-13, john 7:20 and john 7:25)


    I'm specifically referring to "Islamic country he stated", but sorry to generalize thing like this.

    I'm not saying that I accept 'freedom of speech his version', what I mean is the term of freedom itself does not truly express the freedom as they boast, they still limiting with some rules, of course society where they belong and the audiences they want to gain, play big role for the rules. So the 'freedom of speech' itself does not really exists.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Raymann View Post
    So you don't believe in percentages, shades, proportions, fractions, restrictions, etc, is all or nothing to you ?
    Well, there you have it, you get nothing because you are a Muslim and as you mention, Freedom of Speech is banned in Islam.
    Actually I didn't know Freedom of Speech was banned in Islam, I just though it was restricted.
    In the west we can pretty much say whatever we want but we have to be careful not to incite violence.
    Even if we incite violence is not easy to prove that the language or expressions used were meant as hate speech.
    As a westerner who has learned from past experiences (Charlie Hebdo and similar incidents) I would include known offensive expressions towards Islam as hate speech.
    That's the advantage of man made laws, we can adjust to the present time and current cultures.
    You have no more prophets coming up to bring some needed updates so I wonder about the future.
    I mentioned 'Islamic countries as you stated' not Islam, but sorry if you interpreted it that way, my bad I should not use 'banned' word, it's the word I'm familiar with in internet. In Islam the version of your 'offensive expressions' is not allowed, I don't think this need to be updated.

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    Re: Freedom of Speech

    I recall when muad dib the author of 7/7 ripple effect was being sentenced for posting dvds of the events of 7/7 to the judge and jury in a trial where some youngsters were being tried for certain acts associated with 7/7, he felt that justice wasn't being done when 7/7 was mentioned by the prosecutor on the schnide without any evidence and was dependent on assumed prior knowledge (which is prejudicial slander when the facts aren't available or are hidden via perjury/perversion of the course of justice) the british government were audacious enough to accuse him of perversion of the course of justice.





    Here is a longer and more thorough interview:

    Last edited by Abz2000; 09-20-2018 at 10:17 AM.
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    Re: Freedom of Speech

    Greetings and peace be with you Raymann;

    Quote Originally Posted by Raymann View Post
    That's the advantage of man made laws, we can adjust to the present time and current cultures.
    The 'Golden Rules' are at the heart of religion, do unto others as you would have them do unto you, love your neighbours as you love yourself. If we could truthfully live by these rules, then we would not need any other laws. Presumably the Charlie Hebdo cartoonists would have been offended if someone had made the same cartoons about their mother or daughters. So why should they deem it ok to make cartoons that would equally offend others. Don't kill or swindle, because you do not want to be killed or swindled yourself, these are just spelling out the golden rules in detail.

    Any new law that is made today should acknowledge the Golden Rule, and help us to apply the said rule; so we can live in peace and justice with our neighbours.


    Quote Originally Posted by Raymann View Post
    You have no more prophets coming up to bring some needed updates so I wonder about the future.
    We have all the instructions we need, I am not sure what another prophet could do. Kindness is not rocket science; and that is at the heart of our religions.

    In the spirit of praying for justice for all people

    Eric
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    Freedom of Speech

    You will never look into the eyes of anyone who does not matter to God.

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    Re: Freedom of Speech

    One thing a prophet cannot easily do is save a person from themselves, we hear talk in some circles about how the messiah will come and save them and usher in a racist kingdom and do away with all the goy who refuse to become subordinate to the race, what becomes obvious is that they're among the last people who want to be saved from their own evil actions - who find it difficult to accept the concept of a prophet who tells them how it is instead of them telling him how it's got to be for them to accept him as the truth, as if he's fake one minute - and then all of a sudden real the minute he confirms their every conjured ancestral tradition.
    pale horse is bye bye time and adios, you've got to search for the hero inside yourselves - coz God is watcher and judge. Li man al mulk al yawm?


    Here's all parts of the short compilation of how it's currently going -nudity and confusing parts removed- please make extra special dua for me as i had to go to the depths of hades and battle a stiff as i forced myself to endure through the editing process:

    It really shows how warped the concept of "free speech" is especially when there are groups such as memri watching for a single slip of the tongue or pen feigning shock at hamas cartoons which contain zero blasphemy and comparatively watered down responses due to their unwillingness to stoop to such depths of hate and decadence:







    Freedom of Speech













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  20. #55
    Alamgir's Avatar
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    Re: Freedom of Speech

    Quote Originally Posted by Raymann View Post
    Freedom of Speech is much more prevalent on western countries.
    No it's not, as explained earlier, every country chooses what speech can and cannot be said.

    Quote Originally Posted by Raymann View Post
    100% Freedom of Speech is a noble concept
    Are you crazy? People should NOT be allowed to say anything and everything, that's dangerous and would create tension among different communities.

    Quote Originally Posted by Raymann View Post
    That's when some necessary restrictions had to be brought up for the sake of peace (hate speech laws).
    Exactly, which proves that free speech is not a 'noble concept', certain speech needs to be banned from the public space.

    Quote Originally Posted by Raymann View Post
    Blasphemy is not a thing on western countries
    You won't punish people for insulting a religion, but you will punish people for insulting other things, or even just denying them. If we applied the same logic but used it for the topic of religion, you'd go crazy, so it's clear that your views are rather hypocritical.

    Quote Originally Posted by Raymann View Post
    Which one is right which one is wrong nobody seems certain (except the atheists).
    Atheists can't be certain about what's morally correct, beyond religion there is no fixed criteria for what is wrong and what is right, so as per your outlook on the world nothing can be objectively good or bad.
    2 | Likes Eric H, Zafran liked this post

  21. #56
    fschmidt's Avatar
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    Re: Freedom of Speech

    Quote Originally Posted by Abz2000 View Post
    It does when america claims to be the bastion of free speech and then murders journalists and common citizens for speaking just and truthful words, and also props up other corrupt crooks to do the same.
    I just want to point out that I do not claim that America has free speech today. I said:
    Quote Originally Posted by fschmidt View Post
    America generally had free speech until recently.
    Througout history, powerful people always hated free speech because free speech allows their corruption to be exposed. Now that speech has moved to the internet, American free speech has been lost. Here is an example of how this really works:

    There is a YouTuber who I followed because she translated Russian stories into English.

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCei...S6FprsJIsjVyQ/

    Her last post links to Patreon where she describes how she was silenced.

    https://www.patreon.com/posts/21566933

    This is how disgusting America works today.
    Last edited by fschmidt; 09-22-2018 at 08:24 AM.
    Freedom of Speech


  22. #57
    Raymann's Avatar
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    Re: Freedom of Speech

    Quote Originally Posted by Al Khorasani View Post
    Freedom of Speech is much more prevalent on western countries.

    No it's not, as explained earlier, every country chooses what speech can and cannot be said.
    Speaking purely from experience I don't know what are the restrictions of what I can and cannot say
    I never had a problem with it and never heard of anybody having problems with free speech.
    It's my assumption that speech that incites violence might be restricted (UK is the only country I know uses it) but most western countries are pretty good with truly free speech. Obvious exemptions are dictatorships (Cuba, Venezuela)

    Some Al Jazeera reporters are still in prison in Egypt. The rest of Muslim majority countries are not much better.
    Russia, North Korea no need to explain. Yes, the west is the best by far.

    Quote Originally Posted by Al Khorasani View Post
    Atheists can't be certain about what's morally correct, beyond religion there is no fixed criteria for what is wrong and what is right, so as per your outlook on the world nothing can be objectively good or bad.
    That's what religious people wrongly assume but the numbers show how far from the truth you are.

    http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed...101-story.html

    https://www.alternet.org/tea-party-a...ent-its-prison

  23. #58
    anatolian's Avatar
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    Re: Freedom of Speech

    There is no absolute freedom of speech no where in the world. America was the first modern nation that adopted democrasy and establish the republic so they regarded the freedom of speech as a basis of their nation but still it is a country of capitalists imperialists and tyrants. Their freedom has boundaries. You can definately get arrasted there if you reveal the secrets of the state as in the example of Edward Snowden. You are free as long as you dont speak the full truth.

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    Re: Freedom of Speech

    Quote Originally Posted by anatolian View Post
    You are free as long as you dont speak the full truth.
    Why?
    You were doing so good, why saying something so ridiculous ?

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    Re: Freedom of Speech

    warning: Straw man fallacy

    Quote Originally Posted by raymann View Post
    i wish muslims knew what freedom of speech really is
    but i know there's no hope.
    Freedom of Speech


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