“One of the great tragedies of our time is this impression that has been created that science and religion have to be at war.” - Francis Collins
the other night i heard on npr that francis collins, director of the National Human Genome Research Institute was retiring. there was a brief interview with him, which pricked my interests - i thought the guy was pretty cool because his thinking is sort of like mine - which of course is cool. francis collins has no problem combining science & religion (in his case, christianity) whatsoever. i have heard of scientists who are religious (and i'm sure there are many more than the few i've heard of), but this is the first time i've run into A Big Guy, mainstream and well respected.
personally, i don't understand those who seem to think that science and religion are incompatible - for me, learning more about nature and its sheer awesomeness has played an important part in my developing belief in god.
for those who want to read more about him i found this interview:
Why do you dismiss certain scenarios as unlikely when you would be quite happy to accept that God could have created us from clay and left false evidence pointing to evolution within the DNA of humans and apes?
I don't see DNA similarity or fossil record as being false evidence. Just because there is a lot of similarity between the DNA of apes and humans it does not neccessarily indicate to me their decent from a common ancestor, but I am not dismissing that it could have happened. I personally believe that it is more likely that Allah actively created the species through a process akin to what we know of as evolution as opposed to His physically molding a male and female of each species out of clay, but then again even those "creation events" could have happened in that way. The problem that I have with evolution per se is the development of new species of magnitude greater complexities than the supposed "common ancestor" without the active involvement of a Creator. However, I admit that the existence or the involvement of this Creator most probably can never be scientifically proven because Allah exists in a higher level or dimension that is beyond our human perception.
Personally, I see this science and religion debate as flawed.
Allah created the universe and all that is in it through whatever means he wanted. You say that evolution poses a problem to Islam? Only when you say that it doesn't require Allah, which is an entirely absurd claim to tell a Muslim.
Atheist: Hey! Animals evolved by themselves through a combination of random processes and environmental influences.
Muslim: You mean through the processes and environment that I believe Allah created and directs?
Atheist: ...
Muslim: So what?
Allah has shown us enough through every Prophet and miracle he has sent us to detract us from such views as " A world without Allah" when the world was created and is sustained by his will. Quite ironic that you try to question Allah through his work. You don't see a pattern but I do, and so does every other theist.
P.S. Kudos to you Mustafa for holding the sharks at bay for so long. Its quite sad to see so many people madly gripping evolution is the delusion that it lets them say " No!No! I don't have a creator... I am just RANDOM CHANCE!!@##$%"
“And with Him are the keys of Unseen, none know them but He. And He knows whatever is there in the earth and in the sea. Not a leaf falls but by His knowledge; there is not a grain in the darkness (or the depth) of the earth, nor any flesh or dry (green or withered) but is written in a Clear Record.”
Last edited by AntiKarateKid; 07-11-2008 at 04:11 PM.
You don't see a pattern but I do, and so does every other theist.
Your atheist would argue that the only pattern you see is one you yourself impose as a way of making sense of things, even if you are unaware you are actually doing it. It's a hard charge to refute because, to some extent or other, it is one we are all guilty of whatever our religious beliefs.
Your atheist would argue that the only pattern you see is one you yourself impose as a way of making sense of things, even if you are unaware you are actually doing it. It's a hard charge to refute because, to some extent or other, it is one we are all guilty of whatever our religious beliefs.
Allah and his messengers are a reality. So is religion. There is a right way of making sense of things and a wrong way. Now, a debate on what I have just stated will lead into you asserting anti Islam claims and me asserting pro Islam claims which I am not interested in at all. You people have plenty of posts on this forum and have been exposed to Islam, whether or not you reject it is your loss. My point in the end is that this thread is ridiculous to any clear headed theist.
Back on topic guys. As I said before, religion and science can be compatible if there are no contradictions. Remember this, you can believe in evolution and be a muslim.
Back on topic guys. As I said before, religion and science can be compatible if there are no contradictions. Remember this, you can believe in evolution and be a muslim.
Absolutely. The Prophet ( pbuh) affirmed this by saying
To listen to the words of the learned, and to instill into others the lessons of science, is better than religious exercises.
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