Ottoman Collapse; Fall of the Ummah.

format_quote Originally Posted by Zuzubu

Asalamu Alaykum. =)

Wa'a alaikumsalam.

Does any brother or sister know about the fall of the Ottoman Empire? What date did it end? Day, month, year? It's good to know when the last Islamic country collapsed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottoman_Empire

Whose foult was it? M. K. Atatürk, arabic rebels???? Please explain.

Arabs were not rebels but freedom fighters. They fought for their freedom, their homeland and their rights. And Arabs fought Turks only in Arabia and did not attack Turkish land.

format_quote Originally Posted by Humbler_359

After World War I. Ottoman Empire completely collapsed due to arrogant Arabs.

I hope this is not another anti-Arabs sentiment.

I don't blame Arabs although they made collaboration with British, they just wanted to have their own free countries. But of course, now is different. Collaboration between Saudi Arabia and USA that happen nowadays is totally wrong.

format_quote Originally Posted by Zuzubu

Ardianto, the caliphate is important. Take a look; Link Removed

Luckily I had read the links before moderator removed it.

My brother, I hope I don't offend you if I say it's better if you learn more about caliph and caliphate.

Calliphate = Ummah

Monarchy = A stupid ruler

And you think monarky is freedom? Besides, the europeans betrayed the arabs after killing the Ottoman muslims. A muslim killing other muslims = non-muslim, means that the arabs did go against the Ummah and Islam. You should respect the caliph, there can only be 1 right caliph.

And you think Ottoman was not monarchy ?.

Brother, I don't blame Arabs, I understand if they wanted to establish their own caliphate, but I blame British that cheated those Arabs.

Ottoman caliphs were not voted according to sunnah, but they adopted dynasty system that started by Muawiyah (ra) with his Umayah dynasty. And although Ottoman was a caliphate, it was not caliphate of all Muslims. Muslims in India and South East Asia never lived under Ottoman empire. Even according to salafis, Ottoman empire was not legitimated Islamic caliphate because its caliphs were not Quraish.

format_quote Originally Posted by Zuzubu

Mustafa Kemal Atatürk changed letters from arabic to latin. He changed the great mossques in Istanbul to museums. Lost his country size by aprox. 10 times. Lost world war 1. Destroyed the caliphate. But people still love him.

Turkey that lost World War 1 was not Turkey that ruled by Kemal Ataturk, but Turkey that ruled by Ottoman empire. Kemal Ataturk himself was a colonel in Ottoman army when the World War 1 began, and later he became a brigadier general after the battle of Galipoli. But yes, he's known as anti-sharia person. He changed Turkey from Islamic empire into secular republic.

first i am afraid that it is a very long thread so i wasn't going to read it but it was short.

first as some of us i believe first nationalist was şeytan why he said i am from fire he is from dirt.

Am i turk ? First what a turk writer said: A turk has to be a muslim to be a turk.

But in ottoman empire people didn't even know that padişah was turk. A man who was a gardener said something bad about turks then padişah said i am a turk are you saying it to me too ? This shows how there was nothing nationalistic in ottoman empire. And noone can be turk. Maybe a little bit of some turks are turks. But we believe that we all came from Adam and eve . Jews dont believe that but that is another subject.

And it ottoman empire people married with girls they found as long as they were muslims at ages now we would think young. And had children which now we would say insane. What i mean is i see examples of having 20 kids or more in ottoman empire.

But ottoman empire is not important. In islam there is place for nationality. And ottoman empire had nothing to with nationality. It is work of atatürk who put some rules. I think he wanted to put this rule instead of islam's 5 rules. One of his rules is you MUST be a nationalist. Which is stupid in too many ways but that is another subject.

About the "arab betrayel"

ONLY ARABS WHO BETRAYED INTENTIONALLY WAS ARABS WHO OWNS ISRAEL. WE THINK THAT ISRAEL PEOPLE ARE ARABS TOO. AT LEAST THAT IS WHAT I THINK MAYBE THEY AREN'T BUT THAT IS ANOTHER SUBJECT. Because they don't believe they are coming from adam und eve.

Israelis offered incredibly high number of money to ottoman empire which could save empire and help in future wars.

Why did they offer it ? to buy palestine.

Sultan ULU HAKAN PADİŞAH Abdülhamit Han hazretleri said:

If ottoman empire retreats from palestine there will be blood there until the doomsday.

Me personally believe that arabs betrayed ottoman empire. But they betrayed less than turks betrayed ottoman empire. But that is another subject.

Victory of Kutl amare and çanakkale is a prove that ummah is one and should be one. Muslims from all over the world died in that battles aganist kfr.

And indian muslims. They gave us money to kill the kfr. But ataturk took that money and build a interest system. BANKS.

Ottoman empire was going to fall. there was no escape from it. And name ottoman empire is not a name ottoman empire used. Ottoman empire used name state of Prophet Muhammed. ANd name turkey is found by frankreich. And flag of ottoman empire which is now the flag of turkey means SHADA i already explained in another message.

So only thing we need to do is unite.

And about the monarchy

it is up to us. Islam allows us democracy or any way of ruling under some circumstances.

But Khalif will come back it is a must.

How it can be done already researched by some historiker i loved. There are too many ways of bringing Khalif back. I found Khalif congress best.

Ottoman empire were not a turkish state even cleaners in palace did not know padişah was turk.

We should know that nationalism is sunnah of şeytan.

Ottoman empire tried to be state of our prophet. Sav.

I am tired of not having power

In His Name, be He glorified!

And there is nothing but it glorifies Him with praise

Peace be upon you and God’s mercy and blessings for ever and ever!

My Dear, Loyal Brothers!

format_quote Originally Posted by Scimitar

You never had power. You was born into a slave mentality because of that statement.

And by Slave Mentality, I do not mean slave of God, but slave of Dunya, because you seek power.

For what purpose? Conquest? Political gain? Haughtiness?

Turkey will not rise from the quagmire of a political dumping circus it has become by its separation of state from the Ummah, so don't go about entertaining ideas of "power" when the truth is - wahuwa ala kulli shay'in kadeer.

Scimi

veybni

very nice words to hurt someone while you look like you talk about another thing

First let me explain to you my friend.

la havle vela kuvvete illa billahil aliyyil azim

One who has power already can challange the universe.

I wont speak very hardly . Because if i do that you will think you are which you are absolutely NOT probably.

First ottoman empire was not ottoman empire.

Ottoman empire was state of our prophet. SAV. I already told that too many times. Not too many. Because until everyone knows that it can not be "too".

Since the establishment until the TANZIMAT . OTtoman empire was our prophet's state. SAV. After the tanzimat there were some great leader who followed path of our prophet.

I dont know why you dont like osmanische reich. Can you give me some examples. I feel nice if i can repair the western and infidel ideology's damage.

I will quote from very respectiv historiker.

Then i changed my mind.

But you use word TURKEY. It shows that you use western language.

Source of word TURKEY comes from frankreich. FRANCE. They used that word. OTtoman empire WAS ERHABENE STAAT VON PROPHET MUHAMMED. SAV.

Introduction to the Turkish Translation of the Original Arabic‘Damascus Sermon’

In His Name, be He glorified!

And there is nothing but it glorifies Him with praise

Peace be upon you and God’s mercy and blessings for ever and ever!

My Dear, Loyal Brothers!With a presentiment of the future, the Old Said perceived the truths expressed in this Arabic sermon, which, on the insistence of the Damascus religious authorities, he delivered forty years ago in the Umayyad Mosque to a congregation of close on ten thousand, which included a hundred religious scholars; he gave news of those truths with complete certainty as though they were going to be realized shortly. However, the two World Wars and twenty-five years of absolute despotism delayed their realization; it is now that the signs of this, which were predicted then, are beginning to be seen in the World of Islam. Therefore, if you consider it appropriate, you may publish the translation of this most important and instructive piece, not as an old, outdated sermon, but as fresh, pertinent instruction on social and Islamic questions addressing directly, in 1371 instead of 1327, the congregation of three hundred and seventy (now more than a million) million in the mosque of the Islamic world, rather than in the Umayyad Mosque.It is fitting here to write the most important answer to a most important question. For the Old Said spoke prophetically in that lesson of forty years ago as though he were seeing the wondrous teachings of the Risale-i Nur and its effects. It is for this reason that I am writing that question and answer here. It is like this:Many have asked both me and the Risale-i Nur students: “Why is it that theRisale-i Nur is not defeated in the face of so much opposition and so many obdurate philosophers and people of misguidance? By preventing to an extent the dissemination of numerous valuable, true books on belief and Islam, and by means of their worldly pleasures and vices, they have deprived many youths and others of the truths of belief. But their most violent attacks, vicious treatment, lies and propaganda have been directed at the Risale-i Nur, to destroy it and to scare people away from it and make them give it up. Despite this, the Risale-i Nur has spread in a way never seen in any other work, six hundred thousand copies of itstreatises being written out by hand with unflagging zeal and published secretly. How is it that it causes itself to be read with such enthusiasm, both within the country and abroad? What is the reason for it? In reply to the many questions of this sort, we say:Being a true commentary on the All-Wise Qur’an through the mystery of its miraculousness, the Risale-i Nur demonstrates that in misguidance is a sort of Hell in this world, while in belief is a sort of Paradise. It points out the grievous pains in sins, bad deeds, and forbidden pleasures, and proves that in good deeds and virtues and the truths of the Shari‘a are to be found pleasures like the pleasures of Paradise. In this way it saves the sensible among those who have fallen into vice and misguidance. For at this time there are two awesome conditions:T h e F i r s t : Since man’s emotions, which are blind to the consequences of things and prefer an ounce of present pleasure to tons of future joys, have come to prevail over mind and reason, the only way to save the dissipated from their vice is to show them the pain present in their pleasure and to defeat their emotions. Although they are aware of the diamond-like bounties and pleasures of the hereafter, as the verse,They deem lovable the life of this world1indicates, while being believers, the people of misguidance choose worldly pleasures, which are like pieces of glass soon to be shattered. The only way of saving them from this love of the world and from the danger of succumbing to it is by showing them the hellish torments and pains they suffer even in this world. This is the way the Risale-i Nur takes. For at this time, due to the obduracy arising from absolute unbelief and the intoxication caused by the vice and misguidance arising from science, perhaps only one in ten or even twenty can be induced to give up his evil ways by proving the existence of Hell and its torments, after having told him of Almighty God. Having heard this, such people are likely to say: “God is Forgiving and Compassionate, and Hell is a long way off,” and continue in their dissipation. Their hearts and spirits are overcome by their emotions.Thus, by showing through most of its comparisons the grievous and terrible results in this world of disbelief and misguidance, the Risale-i Nur makes even the most stubborn and arrogant people feel disgust at those inauspicious, illicit pleasures, leading them to repent. The short comparisons in the Sixth, Seventh, and Eighth Words, and the long one in the Third Stopping-Place in the Thirty-Second Word lead a person to feel repugnance at the vice and misguidance of the way he has taken, andcause him to accept what they teach. As an example, I shall recount briefly the situations I beheld on a journey of the imagination, which were in fact reality. Those wishing for a more detailed account may look at the end of Sikke-i Tasdik-i Gaybi (The Ratifying Stamp of the Unseen Collection).When on that journey of the imagination I looked at the animal kingdom through the eyes of materialist philosophy and the people of misguidance and heedlessness, the innumerable needs of animals and their terrible hunger together with their weakness and impotence appeared to me as most piteous and grievous. I cried out. Then I saw through the telescope of Qur’anic wisdom and belief that the Divine Name of All-Merciful had risen in the sign of Provider like a shining sun; it gilded with the light of its mercy that hungry, wretched animal world.Then I saw within the animal world another grievous world which was swathed in darkness and would make anyone feel pity and in which young were struggling in their need and powerlessness. I was sorry I had looked through the eyes of the people of misguidance. Suddenly, belief gave me other spectacles and I saw the Name of All-Compassionate rise in the sign of clemency; it transformed and lit up that pitiful world in joyous and beautiful fashion, changing my tears of complaint and sorrow into tears of joy and thanks.Then the world of humanity appeared to me as though on a cinema screen. I looked through the telescope of the people of misguidance and saw that world to be so dark and terrifying that I cried out from the depths of my heart. “Alas!” I cried. For they had desires and hopes that stretched to eternity, thoughts and imaginings that embraced the universe, the earnest desire for everlasting happiness and Paradise, an innate capacity and powers on which no limit had been placed and which were free, yet despite their innumerable needs and their weakness and impotence they were exposed to the attacks of innumerable enemies and the blows of innumerable calamities. Under the perpetual threat of death, they lived out their brief and tumultuous lives in wretched circumstances. Ever looking to the grave, which for the misguided is the door to everlasting darkness, they suffered the continuous blows of death and separation, the most painful state for the heart and conscience. I saw that singly and in groups they were being thrown into that black well.On seeing the world of humanity in this darkness I was about to cry out with my heart, spirit, and mind, and all my subtle inner faculties, indeed all the particles of my being, when the light and power of belief proceeding from the Qur’an smashed those spectacles of misguidance, giving me insight. I saw the Divine Name of All-Just rising like the sun inthe sign of All-Wise, the Name of All-Merciful rising in the sign of Munificent, the Name of All-Compassionate rising in the sign of, that is, in the meaning of, All-Forgiving, the Name of Resurrector rising in the sign of Inheritor, the Name of Granter of Life rising in the sign of Bountiful, and the Name of Sustainer rising in the sign of Owner. They lit up the entire world of humanity and all the worlds within it. They dispelled those hellish states, opened up windows onto the luminous worlds of the hereafter, and scattered lights over the world of humanity. I declared: “Praise and thanks be to God to the number of particles in existence!” I understood with complete certainty that in belief is a sort of paradise in this world too and in misguidance, a sort of hell.Then the world of the earth appeared. On that journey of the imagination, the dark, hypothetical rules of the philosophy which does not obey religion depicted a ghastly world. Voyaging through space on the ship of the aged earth —which travels seventy times faster than a cannon-ball a distance of twenty-five thousand years in one year, ever disposed to break up, its interior in a state of upheaval— the situation of wretched human kind appeared to me in a desolate darkness. My eyes darkened. I flung the spectacles of philosophy to the ground, smashing them. Then I looked with a view illumined with the wisdom of the Qur’an and belief, and I saw the Names of Creator of the Heavens and Earth, All-Powerful, All-Knowing, Sustainer, Allah, Sustainer of the Heavens and Earth, Subjugator of the Sun and Moon had risen like suns in the signs of mercy, grandeur, and dominicality. They lit up that dark, desolate, and terrifying world so that the globe appeared to my eye of belief as a well-ordered, subjugated, pleasant, and safe ship, or aeroplane, or train. It contained everyone’s provisions, and had been decked out for trade and enjoyment and to carry beings with spirits through the dominical realms around the sun. I exclaimed: “All praise be to God to the number of particles of the earth for the bounty of belief.”This has been proved with many comparisons in the Risale-i Nur, that those who follow vice and misguidance suffer a hellish torment in this world too, while through the manifestations of belief, the believers and righteous may taste through the stomachs of Islam and humanity the pleasures of Paradise. They may benefit according to the degree of their belief. But in these stormy times, currents which numb the senses and scatter man’s attention on peripheral matters, plunging him into them, have deadened his senses and bewildered him. As a result of this the people of misguidance are temporarily unable to feel their torment, while the people of guidance are overwhelmed by heedlessness and cannot truly appreciate its pleasures.The Second Awesome Condition This Age: In former times, compared with the present there was very little absolute disbelief, or misguidance arising from science, or the disbelief arising from perverse obstinacy. The instruction of the Islamic scholars of those times and their arguments were therefore sufficient, quickly dispelling any unbelief arising from doubts. Belief in God was general, and they could persuade most people to give up their misguidance and wrongdoing through teaching them about God and reminding them of Hell-fire. But now there are a hundred absolute disbelievers in one small town instead of perhaps one in a whole country. Those who lose their way due to science and learning and obstinately oppose the truths of belief have increased a hundredfold in relation to former times. With pride like that of the Pharaoh and their terrible misguidance these obdurate deniers oppose the truths of belief. A sacred truth is therefore much needed that will completely destroy the bases of their disbelief in this world, like an atom bomb, and will halt their aggression and bring some of them to belief.All praise be to Almighty God that with its many comparisons, as the perfect remedy for the wounds of this time, the Risale-i Nur —a miracle of the Qur’an of Miraculous Exposition proceeding from its effulgence— has routed even the worst of those obdurate deniers with the diamond sword of the Qur’an. Its proofs and arguments to the number of the atoms of the universe demonstrating Divine unity and the truths of belief show that in twenty-five years it has not been defeated in the face of the severest attacks, but has itself prevailed and been victorious. Yes, with its comparisons of belief and unbelief, and guidance and misguidance, theRisale-i Nur proves those truths self-evidently. If note is taken, for example of the proofs and flashes of the Second Station of the Twenty-Second Word, the First Stopping-Place of the Thirty-Second Word, the ‘Windows’ of the Thirty-Third Letter, and the eleven proofs of The Staff of Moses (Asa-yi Musa), it will be understood that it is the truths of the Qur’an manifested in the Risale-i Nur that will smash and destroy absolute disbelief and perverse misguidance at this time.In the same way that the parts of the Risale-i Nur which solve the greatest mysteries of religion and the riddles of the world’s creation have been collected together in The ‘Mysteries’ Collection (Tilsimlar Mecmuasi), the pieces which describe the hell in this world of the people of misguidance and the paradise-like pleasures of the people of guidance and show that belief is like a seed of Paradise while unbelief is a seed of the Zakkum-tree of Hell, will be put together in a small collection, God willing, and published.


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