Tarawih - 20 rakah or 8?

Abdullah Ibn Abbas رضي الله عنه reported that: "During Ramadan, the Messenger performed 20 rak'ah salah as well as the witr salah without the congregation."
This hadith has been recorded by the following:
* Ibn Abi Shaybah (rh) in his Musannaf
* Imam Bayhaqi (rh) in his Sunan
* Tabraani (rh) in his Kabeer
* Ibn Adi (rh) in his Musnad
* Baghawi (rh) in his Majma Sahabah
"Al-Bayhaqi has related in al-Marifa (The full title is al-Marifatus-Sunan wa'l athar): 'In the time of Umar ibn al-Khattab (radiallahu anhu) the people used to observe 20 rak'ahs and the witr.' Al-Nawawi said in al-Khulasa: 'Its Isnad is Sahih.'"
"(Bayhaqi) has related in al-Sunan [2/496] - "In the time of Umar ibn al-Khattab, radiallahu anhu, they would perform 20 rak'ats in the month of Ramadan. He said (also): And they would recite the Mi'in (A group of medium sized chapters from the Qur'an), and they would lean on their sticks in the time of Uthman ibn Affan, radiallahu anhu, from the discomfort of standing." All the men in the (above) isnad are trustworthy, as mentioned by the Indian research scholar, Shaykh al-Nimawi, in Athar al-Sunan [2/54]."
The evidence which proves that Umar (radiallahu anhu) ordered the practise of 20 rak'ahs has been recorded by Shaykh Ali al-Muttaqi al-Hindi in the largest collection of Hadith available today: Kanz al-Ummal fi Sunan al-aqwal wal Af'al (4/284, no. 5787 (8 vols. 1st edn; Hyderabad, India, 1312-14 AH), reported by him on the authority of the Muhaddith, Ibn Man'i), as follows from Ubayy ibn Ka'b (radiallahu anhu): "Umar (radiallahu anhu) ordered him (Ubayy) to lead the people in prayer at night in Ramadan, because the people fast during the day and can not recite (the Qur'an) well, therefore it is better that you should recite (the Qur'an) during the night. I (Ubayy) asked: "O commander of the believers, this thing was not done before." He said: "I know, but it is a good practise", and so (Ubayy) led (the Companion's) for 20 rak'ahs."
In "Fatawa Rahimiyyah", v.2 p.253 to 258, Mufti Abdul Raheem Lajpuri gives overwhelming evidence making it clear without a doubt that twenty rak'ah taraweeh salah was accepted by everyone. This is reproduced below:
"Here we will cite a few excerpts making it clear that twenty Rakaahs Taraweeh salah has been accepted by the Ummah throughout the ages:
1. Imam Tirmidhi (rh) [passed away 279 AH] states that 'Umar رضي الله عنه, 'Ali رضي الله عنه, Sufyan Thawri (rh) and Imam Shafi'i (rh) all accept the taraweeh salah as being twenty Rakaahs. He quoted Imam Shafi'i رضي الله عنه as saying that he saw the people of Makkah performing twenty Rakaahs. (Tirmidhi, v.1 p.99)
2. The famous compilation of Ahadith Kanzul Ummaal (v.2 p.284) reports that after 'Umar رضي الله عنه instructed Ubay bin Ka'b رضي الله عنه to lead the people in twenty rak'ah of taraweeh salah, Ubay رضي الله عنه then led the Sahabah and Tabi'een in twenty rak'ah.
3. Bayhaqi (v.1 p.492; Nasbur Ra'yah, v.1 p.294) reports a narration in which Sa'ib bin Yazid رضي الله عنه states that they performed twenty rak'ah taraweeh during the periods of 'Umar رضي الله عنه, 'Uthman رضي الله عنه and 'Ali رضي الله عنه.
4. The other narration of Yazid bin Rooman (rh) in the Muwatta of Imam Malik (p.40) states that during the Khilafah of 'Umar رضي الله عنه, people performed 23 rak'ah of taraweeh together with the Witr salah.
5. Ma'rifatus Sitta quotes an authentic narration from Imam Bayhaqi (v.1 p.477; his Sunan Kubra, v.2 p.496) stating that 'Ali رضي الله عنه summoned the Qurra in Ramadan and appointed someone to lead the people in the twenty rak'ah of taraweeh salah. 'Ali رضي الله عنه then himself led the witr salah.
6. The Muhaddith ibn Qudaamah (rh) writes in his al-Mughni (v.1 p.803) that the Sahabah were unanimous about performing twenty rak'ah taraweeh.
7. The research of the Muhaddith Ibn Hajar Haythami (rh) also reveals that the Sahabah were unanimous about performing twenty rak'ah taraweeh. (Tuhfatul Akhyaar, p.197)
8.The famous Hafidh of Hadith Allama Abdul Birr (rh) says that it is a fact that the Sahabah performed twenty rak'ah taraweeh during Khilafah of 'Umar رضي الله عنه. (Mirqaat, v.2 p.174)
9. Allama ibn Taymiyyah (rh) writes that Ubay bin Ka'b رضي الله عنه led the Sahabah in twenty rak'ah taraweeh during the Khilafah of 'Umar رضي الله عنه. (Fatawa Ibn Taymiyyah, v.1 p.148). He further writes (v.1 p.191) that because Ubay led the Sahabah in twenty rak'ah taraweeh and three rak'ah witr during Ramadan, most 'Ulema regard this to be a Sunnah because all of the Muhajireen and Ansaar performed the salah without an objection from any of them.
10. Imam Sharaani (rh) writes, "'Umar رضي الله عنه then gave the instruction for 23 rak'ah to be performed, three being the witr salah. This was then practiced in all the cities." (Kashful Ghumma, v.1 p.16

31. Imam Ghazali (rh) writes, "The taraweeh salah comprises of twenty rak'ah and is Sunnah Mu'akkadah. The method of performing it is well known." (Ihyaa'ul Uloom, v.1 p.208). He also writes, "Twenty rak'ah is the opinion of the consensus of 'Ulema because of the narration of Yazid bin Rooman (rh) in the Muwatta of Imam Malik, stating that during the Khilafah of 'Umar رضي الله عنه, people performed
23 rak'ah of taraweeh together with witr salah. (Ihyaa'ul Uloom, v.2 p.66)

32. Ahmad Roomi (rh) says, "There were a great number of Sahabah present at the time (when 'Umar رضي الله عنه instructed Ubay رضي الله عنه to lead them in twenty rak'ah taraweeh). Amongs them were 'Uthman رضي الله عنه, 'Ali رضي الله عنه, Abdullah ibn Mas'ud رضي الله عنه, 'Abbas رضي الله عنه and his son, Talha رضي الله عنه, Zubayr رضي الله عنه, Mu'aadh رضي الله عنه and many other Muhajireen and Ansar. None of them objected to 'Umar رضي الله عنه, but rather supported him and practiced accordingly with steadfastness. In fact, 'Ali made du'a for 'Umar saying, "May Allah illuminate his grave just as he illuminated our Masaajid." Rasulallah also said, "Hold fast to my practices and the practices of the rightly guided Khalifahs after me." The taraweeh salah comprises twenty rak'ah". (Majaalisul Abrar, p.187)

33. Shah Waliullah Muhaddith Dehlawi (rh) also writes that the taraweeh salah during the times of the Sahabah رضي الله عنه and tabi'een comprised of twenty rak'ah. (Hujjatullahi Baaligha, v.2 p.67)

34. Shah Abdul Aziz Muhaddith Dehlawi (rh) also mentions that consensus was reached amongst the Sahabah رضي الله عنه to perform twenty rak'ah taraweeh and three rak'ah witr. (Majmoo'ah Fatawa Azizi, v.1 p.162)

35. Maulana Qutbud Deen Khan Muhaddith Dehlawi (rh) also mentions that consensus was reached amongst the Sahabah to perform twenty rak'ah taraweeh. (Mazaahirul Haqq, v.1 p.433)

36. Allama Shabbir Ahmed Uthmani (rh) writes that since none of the Sahabah ever differed about the twenty rak'ah, all scholars are unanimous about it. (Fathul Mulhim, v.2 p.320)

Allama Nawawi (rh) writes in his commentary of Muslim that the twenty rak'ah taraweeh is a hallmark of Islam just like the Eid salahs (v.1 p.259). Therefore, the Ta'leeqaat of Hidayah (v.1 p.131) states that anyone performing only eight rak'ah of taraweeh will be guilty of forsaking the Sunnah."

Yahya ibn Sa'id (rahmatullahi alaih) narrates that: 'Umar ibn al-Khattab (radiallahu anh) appointed an Imam to lead them in twenty rak'ats." (Musannaf Ibn Abi Shayba 2:393)

'Abd al-'Aziz ibn Rafi' (rahmatullahi alaih) narrates that, Ubay ibn Ka'b (radiallahu ang) would lead the congregation in twenty rak'ats in Madinah during Ramadan, followed by three (rak'ats) Witr. (Musannaf Ibn Abi Shayba 2:393)

'Ata' (rahmatullahu alaih) reports: "I found the people observing twenty-three rak'ats, which included witr." (Musannaf Ibn Abi Shayba 3:393)

Abu Khusayb (rahmatullahi alaih) narrate: Suwayd ibn Ghafala (rahmatullahi alaih) would lead them in prayer during the month of Ramadan. He would perform five tarweehas (sets of four rak'ats) - twenty rak'ats (in all). (Sunan al-Bayhaqi 2:496)

Nafi' ibn 'Umar (rahmatullahi alaih) narrates that, Ibn Abi Mulayka (rahmatullahi alaih) would lead them in twenty rak'ats prayer during Ramadan. (Musannaf Ibn Abi Shayba 2:393)

Sa'id ibn 'Ubayd (rahmatullahi alaih) narrates that, 'Ali ibn Rabi'ah (rahmatullahi alaih) would lead them in five tarweehas (i.e. twenty rak'ats) and three witr during Ramadan. (Musannaf Ibn Abi Shayba 2:393)

Ibn Abbas (radiallahu anhuma) relates: "The Messenger (salallahu 'alayhi wa sallam) would perform twenty rak'ats during Ramadan and three rak'ats witr." (Musannaf Ibn Abi Shayba 2:394)

It has been narrated from Shutayr ibn Shakl (rahmatullahi alaih) (a companion of 'Ali - radiallahu anh) that, He would lead them during the month of Ramadan in twenty rak'ats (taraweeh) and three rak'ats witr. (Sunan al-Bayhaqi 4:496)

Muhammad ibn Ka'b al-Qurazi (rahmatullahi alaih) says, The people would perform twenty rak'ats in the month of Ramadan during the caliphate of 'Umar (radiallahu anh). They would lengthen the recitation and perform three rak'ats witr. (Qiyam al-Layl 91)

A'mash (rahmatullahi alaih) reports that 'Abdullah ibn Mas'ood (radiallahu anh) would perform twenty rak'ats (taraweeh) and three rak'ats witr. (Qiyam al-Layl 91)

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Courtesy: Bro Sefeiddine-M

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Praise be to Allaah.

Firstly:

The report that ‘Umar ibn al-Khattaab ordered that Taraweeh prayer should be twenty rak’ahs came from four of the Taabi’een. These are their reports:

1 – It was narrated that Saa’ib ibn Yazeed said: ‘Umar ibn al-Khattaab (may Allaah be pleased with him) gathered the people together in Ramadaan to be led by Ubayy ibn Ka’b and Tameem al-Daari in praying twenty-one rak’ahs, and they used to recite hundreds of verses, and they dispersed before dawn broke.

A number of narrators narrated it from al-Saa’ib, some of whom mentioned twenty rak’ahs or twenty-one or twenty-three. They were:

Muhammad ibn Yoosuf, the son of the sister of al-Saa’ib, from al-Saa’ib, as was narrated by ‘Abd al-Razzaaq inal-Musannaf(4/260) from the report of Dawood ibn Qays and others.

Yazeed ibn Khusayfah. This was narrated by Ibn al-Majd inal-Musnad(1/413), and via him by al-Bayhaqi inal-Sunan(2/496).
Al-Haarith ibn ‘Abd al-Rahmaan ibn Abi Dhubaab. This was narrated by ‘Abd al-Razzaaq inal-Musannaf(4/261).

These reports are saheeh reports narrated by trustworthy narrators from al-Saa’ib ibn Yazeed. They mention twenty rak’ahs at the time of ‘Umar ibn al-Khattaab (may Allaah be pleased with him). The extra amount mentioned – twenty-one or twenty-three, refers to Taraweeh plus Witr.

2 – It was narrated that Yazeed ibn Rumaan said: At the time of ‘Umar ibn al-Khattaab the people used to pray twenty-three rak’ahs of qiyaam in Ramadaan.

This was narrated from him by Maalik inal-Muwatta’(1/115). Al-Nawawi said inal-Majmoo’(4/33: It is mursal, because Yazeed ibn Rumaan did not live at the same time as ‘Umar. End quote.

3 – It was narrated from Yahya ibn Sa’eed al-Qattaan that ‘Umar ibn al-Khattaab (may Allaah be pleased with him) ordered a man to lead them in twenty rak’ahs of prayer. This was narrated by Ibn Abi Shaybah inal-Musannaaf(2/163) from Wakee’ from Maalik. But Yahya ibn Sa’eed did not live at the same time as ‘Umar.

4 – It was narrated that ‘Abd al-‘Azeez ibn Rafee’ said: Ubayy ibn Ka’b used to lead the people in praying twenty rak’ahs during Ramadaan in Madeenah, and he would pray Witr with three rak’ahs.

This was narrated by Ibn Abi Shaybah inal-Musannaf(2/163).
From all these reports it is clear that twenty rak’ahs was the way that Taraweeh was usually done at the time of ‘Umar ibn al-Khattaab (may Allaah be pleased with him). A matter such as Taraweeh prayer is something that is well known among all people, and is transmitted from one generation to another. The report of Yazeed ibn Rumaan and Yahya al-Qattaan is to be taken into account even if they did not live at the same time as ‘Umar, because undoubtedly they learned it from a number of people who had been alive at the time of ‘Umar, and this is something that does not need and isnaad, rather all the people of Madeenah are its isnaad.
Imam al-Tirmidhi (may Allaah have mercy on him) said in hisSunan (3/169):

Most of the scholars are of the view that what is narrated from ‘Umar, ‘Ali and other companions of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) is twenty rak’ahs. This is the view of al-Thawri, Ibn al-Mubaarak and al-Shaafa’i.

Al-Shaafa’i said: This is what I learned in our land, in Makkah they pray twenty rak’ahs.
Ibn ‘Abd al-Barr said in al-Istidhkaar (2/69):

Twenty rak’ahs was narrated from ‘Ali, Shateer ibn Shakl, Ibn Abi Mulaykah, al-Haarith al-Hamadaani and Abu’l-Bakhtari. It is the view of the majority of scholars and it is the view of the Kufis, the Shaafa’is and most of the fuqaha’. It was narrated in saheeh reports from Ubayy ibn Ka’b, and there was no difference of opinion among the Sahaabah.

‘Ata’ said: I grew up at a time when the people prayed twenty-three rak’ahs including Witr.
See that inMusannaf Ibn Abi Shaybah(2/163).

Ibn Taymiyah (may Allaah have mercy on him) said inMajmoo’ al-Fataawa(23/112):

It is proven that Ubayy ibn Ka’b used to lead the people in praying twenty rak’ahs in qiyaam in Ramadaan, and he used to pray Witr with three rak’ahs. Many scholars think that this is the Sunnah, because he established that among the Muhaajireen and Ansaar and no one objected to that. Others regarded it as mustahabb to pray thirty-nine rak’ahs, based on the fact that this was the practice of the people of Madeenah in the past. End quote.

Imam Abu Hanifa, Imam Shafi'i, and Imam Ahmad (rahmatullahi alaihim) are unanimous that twenty rak'ats are to be performed for taraweeh during Ramadan. There are different opinions recorded from Imam Malik (rahmatullahi alaih): one states twenty rak'ats; another is of thirty-six rak'ats, about which Imam Malik (rahmatullahi alaih) said, "This is our former opinion;" and a third view is of thirty-eight rak'ats. There is also an opinion which states forty-one rak'ats (Bidayat al-Mujtahid 1:210). '

Allama 'Ayni (rahmatullahi alaih) mentioned the second of view of thirty-six rak'ats to Imam Malik's (rahmatullahi alaih) more popular opinion.

What becomes clear at this point is that none of the four prominent Imams held a view of taraweeh being less than twenty rak'ats. Twenty is the minimum number mentioned, and the reason for Imam Malik's (rahmatullahi alaih) view of thirty-six is that it was the practise of the people of the noble city of Makkah to perform tawaf (circumambulation) of the Ka'bah after every four rak'ats of taraweeh. During the pause between each four rak'ats of taraweeh, the people of the illuminated city of Madinah would observe an extra four rak'ats of prayer in place of the tawaf. (see al-Mughni 2:167)

Therefore, since taraweeh was performed as twenty rak'ats, consisting of five sets of four rak'ats (each set called a 'tarweeha'), the people of Madinah would perform an extra four rak'ats after every tarweeha, bringing the total number of extra rak'ats to sixteen. Sixteen extra rak'ats plus the twenty rak'ats of taraweeh make thirty-six rak'ats. Hence, the actual number of tak'ats of Taraweeh was twenty even according to Imam Malik (rahmatullahi alaih).

For centuries, ever since taraweeh came to be observed in congregation, no less than twenty rak'ats were performed by Muslims throughout the Islamic world. Nafi' (rahmatullahi alaih), a prominent tabi'ee states, "I never found any one performing less than thirty-nine rak'ats (three of which were Witr)." Nafi' (rahmatullahi alaih) remained in Madinah for most of his life and passed away in 117 A.H. (Fath al-Bari 4:254). At that time, the number of rak'ats observed for taraweeh in Madinah were thiry-six (twenty rak'ats taraweeh and sixteen supererogatory (nafl) rak'ats).

Thereafter, Imam Shafi'ee (rahmatullahi alaih) states, "I observed the people performing thirty-nine rak'ats in Madinah (which included three Witr), and twenty-three rak'ats in Makkah." Imam Shafi'ee (rahmatullahi alahih) was born in 150 A.H. and passed away in 204 A.H. Hence, this report accounts for the second century of Islam. Furthermore, Ibn 'Abd al-Barr (rahmatullahi alaih) states,

"Twenty rak'ats was the opinion followed by the majority of scholars, including those of Kufa, Imam Shafi'ee (rahmatullahi alaih), and most other jurists." This specifies that, throughout the earlier period of Islam, the minimum number of rak'ats performed in taraweeh was twenty.

Sufyan al-Thawri (rahmatullahi alaih) (died 161 A.H.) and Imam Abu Haneefah (rahmatullahi alaih) (died 150 A.H.) of Kufa both held the opinion of twent rak'ats.
Imam Ahmad ibn Hanbal (rahmatullahi alaih) of Baghdad (died 235 A.H.) held the same opinion as did Dawud al-Zahiri (rahmatullahi alaih) (died 270 A.H.). 'Abdullah ibn al-Mubarak (rahmatullahi alaih) (died 181 A.H.), one of the prominent scholars of Khurasan, also held the view of twenty rak'ats (Bidayat al-Mujtahid 1:210).

From the above, one can comfortably conclude that the predominant view of the scholars from Makkah to Khurasan and beyond was of taraweeh being twenty rak'ats. There is not a single opinion of eight rak'ats to be found during this extensive period, neither from the great Imams nor from any other jurist.

The mass of people who follow the Hanafi, Shafi'ee, Maliki and Hanbali schools of though, and who constitute the majority of the Ummah, have until today adopted the view of twenty rak'ats for taraweeh. In the two sanctified sites of Isalm - Makkah and Madinah - twenty rak'ats are performed in congregation for taraweeh until today. It was not until approximately a century and a half ago, that the first arguments were made, after the consensus reacher bu 'Umar (radiallahu anh); claiming that taraweeh was only eight rak'ats and not twenty.

Imam Tirmidhi (rahmatullahi alaih), well known for recording in his Sunan the various opinions held by different scholars in jurisprudential (fiqhi) issues, does not mention so much as even a weak opinion of taraweeh being eight rak'ats when discussing the issue. If there had been an opinion of eight rak'ats concurrent among the earlier scholars, he would not have failed to mention it. (see al-Tirmidhi 1:166)

courtesy: bro seifiddine

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1) Shaykh al-Islam ibn Taymiya (rahmatullahi alaih) writes:

"Whoever assumes that there is a fixed number of rak'ats reported from the Messenger (salallahu 'alayhi wa sallam) concerning taraweeh, and does not accept any greater or lesser amount, has erred." (Majmu' al-Fatawa 46, Mirqat al-Mafatih 3:381)

2) 'Allama Subki (rahmatullahi alaih) writes, "Let it be known that it has not been narrated as to how many rak'ats the Messenger of Allah (salallahu 'alayhi wa sallam) performed during those nights (in congregation), whether they were twenty or less." (Tuhfat al-Akhyar 116)

3) 'Allama Suyuti (rahmatullahi alaih) says, "The scholars have differed on the number of rak'ats (in taraweeh). If it (the number) had been established through the practise of the Messenger of Allah (salallahu 'alayhi wa sallam), they would not have differed (regarding it)." (al-Masabih 42)

4) 'Allam Shawkani (rahmatullahi alaih) writes: "What has been understood from the hadiths in this chapter is the validity of the nightly prayers of Ramadan, and that they can be performed either in congregation or individually. However, to confine the prayer known as taraweeh to a stipulated number of rak'ats...is not understood from the Sunnah." (Nayl al-Awtar 3:53)

5) Mawlana Wahid al-Zaman (rahmatullahi alaih) states: "There is no fixed number (of rak'ats) for the prayer in the nights of Ramadan, i.e. taraweeh." (Nazl al-Abrar 1:126)

The scholarly statements mentioned above clearly establish that there are no authentic narrations stating that Allah's Messenger (salallahu 'alayhi wa sallam) performed a fixed number of rak'ats for taraweeh. Hence, this strikes down the claim that the Messenger (salallahu 'alayhi wa sallam) only performed eight rak'ats and that to perform anything besides eights is a "reprehensible innovation" (bid'ah), as claimed by some.
There are however a handful of weak reports which inform us of the number of rak'ats performed by the Messenger (salallahu 'alayhi wa sallam) in taraweeh.

For instance, there is a narration of Ibn 'Abbas (radiallahu anhuma) which states that the Messenger (salallahu 'alayhi wa sallam) performed twenty rak'ats. Although the hadeeth scholars have classified this narration to be weak, it could still be used as evidence, because it is supported by the consensus of the Companions (radiallahu anhum) and the practise of the whole Ummah, generation after generation, for more than twelve hundred years.

Other weak reports from the Messenger (salallahu 'alayhi wa sallam) on this issue that are not substantially supported by the practise and statements of the pious predecessors, will be rejected. One must understand though that even if the narration of Ibn 'Abbas (radiallahu anhuma) is rejected, the scholarly consensus (ijma') reached by 'Umar (radiallahu anh) - which established that taraweeh was twenty rak'ats - would be sufficient evidence to prove that taraweeh is indeed twenty rak'ats.

The reason why there are no authentic and direct reports from the Messenger (salallahu 'alayhi wa sallam) concerning the number of rak'ats in taraweeh, is that the Messenger (salallahu 'alayhi wa sallam) performed the prayer in congregation for a few days only, after which he performed taraweeh in the confines of his home. Hence, many of the the Companions (radiallahu anhum) did not observe him performing the prayer. Thereafter, the prayer continued to be performed individually or in small groups until the time of 'Umar (radiallahu anh), when he appointed an Imam to lead everyone in twenty rak'ats. Thus, it came to be performed as twenty rak'ats in a large congregation. The few Companions fortunate enough to have observed it with Allah's Messenger (salallahu 'alayhi wa sallam) in congregation did not voice any objection to the decision of 'Umar (radiallahu anh).

If the Messenger (salallahu 'alayhi wa sallam) had performed more or less than twenty rak'ats on any of the nights during Ramadan, these Companions would surely have refuted 'Umar's (radiallahu anh) decision for establishing taraweeh as twenty rak'ats.

format_quote Originally Posted by Parker

Assalamualikeum,
I have a dobut regarding the night prayer tarawih. Is is a must to perform all the 20 rakah of tarawi or can we perform just 10 or 8 rakah and then start witr?

Wa'alaikum as'salaam,

You can perform 8 or 20 or anything in between. It's all from the sunnah. Prophet said that they are to be done two by two, and he did not specify any particular number. So you can do even a 100 if you want and then do witr.

format_quote Originally Posted by Zzz_

Wa'alaikum as'salaam,

You can perform 8 or 20 or anything in between. It's all from the sunnah. Prophet said that they are to be done two by two, and he did not specify any particular number. So you can do even a 100 if you want and then do witr.

Do you understand Quran and sunnah better than Hz sahaba ikram ra and salaf....?

You people always claim to follow first 3 generations but in this issue you leave them as well as khalaf.

The one who creates grouping on such an issue is an ignorant fool who thinks himself all wise.
The issue of Taraweeh is simple.People make it difficult.
The fact of the matter is.The Sunnah is to pray 8.But if this Sunnah is difficult,then the amount of rakahs can be increased to 20.
You will get your answer here.Simple and easy and impartial.
https://islamqa.info/en/82152
If you pray 8 rakahs,then you have to read as much Quran in it as those who pray 20 rakahs.Hence,you will have to read more Quran in each Rakah.This will make the Rakah longer.Hence,Islam has allowed ease in this matter for the Muslims and they can increae the number of Rakahs.The Sunnah is still 8.But ease is given.

It's not grouping, rather answering the question asked in OP.

What someone does or thinks is entirely his personal matter, but it's proven that some people are brainwashed and they almost worship their scholars.

This applies most to the Hanafi Scholors than anyone else.
Do you know how?
Define Taqleed in Hanafi Fiqh.Since you are a Deobandi,you are a Hanafi.So explain it to me.

format_quote Originally Posted by azc

Do you understand Quran and sunnah better than Hz sahaba ikram ra and salaf....?

I understand it better than the people of indian subcontinent.

You people always claim to follow first 3 generations but in this issue you leave them as well as khalaf.

who are we "people" ? You sub indian continent people compile your ammal books of weak and fabricated hadiths and shikr and blindly follow that while the Quran and ahadith collect dusts on the shelves. And you are extreme in following your maulvi saabs and exaggerated sunnahs and yet call those who follow the As-Salaf as "wahabi" and "extremists". Majority of Muslims in your subcontinent do not pray salah, can you tell me why?

What someone does or thinks is entirely his personal matter, but it's proven that some people are brainwashed and they almost worship their scholars.

Stop following such shady so called scholars like Tariq Jameel then and stop being brainwashed.

format_quote Originally Posted by Zzz_

I understand it better than the people of indian subcontinent.


who are we "people" ? You sub indian continent people compile your ammal books of weak and fabricated hadiths and shikr and blindly follow that while the Quran and ahadith collect dusts on the shelves. And you are extreme in following your maulvi saabs and exaggerated sunnahs and yet call those who follow the As-Salaf as "wahabi" and "extremists". Majority of Muslims in your subcontinent do not pray salah, can you tell me why?



Stop following such shady so called scholars like Tariq Jameel then and stop being brainwashed.

hmmm perhaps I hit on target....!

Do you have good to say about topic of this thread and talk with evidences...?

Al-Irbad said: One day the Messenger of Allah (ﷺ) led us in prayer, then faced us and gave us a lengthy exhortation at which the eyes shed tears and the hearts were afraid.

A man said: Messenger of Allah! It seems as if it were a farewell exhortation, so what injunction do you give us?

He then said: I enjoin you to fear Allah, and to hear and obey even if it be an Abyssinian slave, for those of you who live after me will see great disagreement. You must then follow my sunnah and that of the rightly-guided caliphs. Hold to it and stick fast to it. Avoid novelties, for every novelty is an innovation, and every innovation is an error. [Abu Dawud]

The Sunnah of Taraweeh in congregation as established by 'Umar ibn Al-Khattab is to pray 20 as mentioned above. The command of Rasulullah is to follow him and that's what we are supposed to do.

For all these centuries, Muslims all over the world were praying 20 or more in Taraweeh. They would add nafl in between after 4 rakat while the imam rested for some time. The people in Makkah would even perform Tawaf in between.

Allah says,
And whoever opposes the Messenger after guidance has become clear to him and follows other than the way of the believers - We will give him what he has taken and drive him into Hell, and evil it is as a destination. [An-Nisa: 115]

Nobody prayed 8 until the last century, opposing the way of believers and opposing the Sunnah established by Umar .

format_quote Originally Posted by azc

hmmm perhaps I hit on target....!

Desi imams going 100mph during taraweeh and pecking like a chicken to get his 20 rakah done in time isn't benefitting himself or anyone else. I rather pray 11 rakahs slowly with kushoo and get more out of it then just a headache and a physical workout.

Do you have good to say about topic of this thread and talk with evidences...?

The evidence that there is no set number for prayers at night - which include Taraaweeh - is the hadeeth of Ibn ‘Umar according to which a man asked the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) about prayer at night. The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: "Prayers at night are to be offered two by two (two rak’ahs at a time). If any of you fears that the time of dawn is approaching then let him pray one rak’ah as Witr." (Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 846; Muslim, 749)

Where is your evidence that anything other then 20 is haram?

format_quote Originally Posted by AabiruSabeel

Nobody prayed 8 until the last century, opposing the way of believers and opposing the Sunnah established by Umar .

We do not think that the Muslims should be so sensitive with regard to issues that are the matter of scholarly differences or make them the cause of division and fitnah among the Muslims.

The point is that the one who prays eleven rak’ahs in the manner narrated from the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) is doing well and is following the Sunnah. Whoever makes the recitation shorter and increases the number of rak’ahs is also doing well. A person who does either of these two things is not to be denounced. Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyah said:

If a person prays Taraaweeh according to the madhhabs of Abu Haneefah, al-Shaafa’i and Ahmad, with twenty rak’ahs, or according to the madhhab of Maalik, with thirty-six rak’ahs, or with thirteen or eleven rak’ahs, he has done well, as Imam Ahmad said, because there is nothing to specify the number. So the greater or lesser number of rak’ahs depends on how long or short the qiyaam (standing in the prayer) is.

https://islamqa.info/en/9036

format_quote Originally Posted by Zzz_

Desi imams going 100mph during taraweeh and pecking like a chicken to get his 20 rakah done in time isn't benefitting himself or anyone else. I rather pray 11 rakahs slowly with kushoo and get more out of it then just a headache and a physical workout.




The evidence that there is no set number for prayers at night - which include Taraaweeh - is the hadeeth of Ibn ‘Umar according to which a man asked the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) about prayer at night. The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: "Prayers at night are to be offered two by two (two rak’ahs at a time). If any of you fears that the time of dawn is approaching then let him pray one rak’ah as Witr." (Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 846; Muslim, 749)

Where is your evidence that anything other then 20 is haram?



We do not think that the Muslims should be so sensitive with regard to issues that are the matter of scholarly differences or make them the cause of division and fitnah among the Muslims.

The point is that the one who prays eleven rak’ahs in the manner narrated from the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) is doing well and is following the Sunnah. Whoever makes the recitation shorter and increases the number of rak’ahs is also doing well. A person who does either of these two things is not to be denounced. Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyah said:

If a person prays Taraaweeh according to the madhhabs of Abu Haneefah, al-Shaafa’i and Ahmad, with twenty rak’ahs, or according to the madhhab of Maalik, with thirty-six rak’ahs, or with thirteen or eleven rak’ahs, he has done well, as Imam Ahmad said, because there is nothing to specify the number. So the greater or lesser number of rak’ahs depends on how long or short the qiyaam (standing in the prayer) is.

https://islamqa.info/en/9036

Instead of parroting what your scholars have taught read the above all posts, all your questions have already been discussed.

format_quote Originally Posted by azc

Instead of parroting what your scholars have taught read the above all posts, all your questions have already been discussed.

you need to read what you posted above. What i'm saying is the same thing as you posted but you are too busy calling people brainwashed ignorant scholar worshiper cult followers to see that. I'm done talking to you, go educate yourself on the sunnah of talking to others.

format_quote Originally Posted by Zzz_

you need to read what you posted above. What i'm saying is the same thing as you posted but you are too busy calling people brainwashed ignorant scholar worshiper cult followers to see that. I'm done talking to you, go educate yourself on the sunnah of talking to others.

I've sympathy for your predicament....