Are we in a position to......

[Rabi'ya]

and greeting everyone

(note to mods - please feel free to move this to the most appropriate section inshAllah)

I was informed by a sheikh this week that the Prophet (saw) never ever called anyone a Kafir. Should we then use this word so liberally amongst ourselves. Especially seeing as it causes a lot of upset among non-Muslims (and Muslims alike) As the Prophet is the best of all examples to follow, shouldnt we be following his example?

Just a thought I had, thought maybe I could share it and we can discuss other points of view.

[aadil77]

If you know the meaning of kaffir and the conditions to becoming a kaffir, then why not?

The Quran refers to disbelievers as kuffar all the time

[Rabi'ya]

Indeed it does. I just wondered peoples opinions on this. What the sheikh was saying, in essence, is that as Muhammas (pbuh) is the best of examples to follow we should not label people as Allah knows truly their intention. Just as the Prophet behaved in a certain manner we should see him as our role model and try to follow his example inshAllah. Every week the sheikh gives examples of how we can improve ourselves as Muslims and improve our relations and conduct in a general manner.

I thought it was an interesting point to make, and would like to see other peoples feedback.

[Zafran]

Salaam

Your right and I agree with you - I think the shouting of "Kuffar, Kuffar, Kuffar" wasnt the way of the prophet pbuh because ultimatly Allah swt knows who the real kuffar are and as nobody knows the intentions or whats realy in peoples heart. Its realy not a smart thing to say -

The one that people call kuffar today might even become muslim later - The pagan arabs were far worse but they ended up accepting Islam - I dont think that happend by shouting Kuffar.

peace

[Ummu Sufyaan]

wa alykum us-Salaam.
kaafir just means non-muslim.

if a kaafir is willing and acknowledges and call themselves a kaafir, then im not seeing what the problem is?
if allah has called the kaafr a kaafir, again what is the problem?

[cat eyes]

sister i think what the imam meant is not to call any ''MUSLIM'' kafir.

but if they openly admit to not practicing the deen and mock the rulings in islam and do innovations and things such as this then the scholars have agreed this person has committed the act of kafir

[Rabi'ya]

We were discussing the beliefs of Non-Muslims. Specifically Christians and Jews, but also of those who follow other religions. We were not discussing the calling of Muslims, kaffir

[aadil77]

Anyone who rejects islam is a kaffir, we have clear example of kaffirs in this dunya, those that insult our prophet, those that defile our Quran and those who wage wars against islam etc. I'm not gonna stop calling them kaffirs just to please them.

[Insaanah]

As mentioned, Allah has referred to people as kaafirs in the Qur'an. Rasoolullah has referred to people (as a group) as kaafirs in the ahadeeth. E.g:

عن أسامة بن زيد رضي الله عنه ، أن النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم قال : " لا يرث المسلم الكافر ولا الكافر المسلم " . رواه البخاري ( 6383 ) ومسلم ( 1614 )


A kaafir is that person who rejects the guidance of Islam. It is a word that has been used for such people since the time of the revelation of the Qur'an. Now, the kuffar are viewing it in some way as a derogatory term for them, and thus object to it, and some Muslims are getting embarrassed of the term too. All it means is a person that rejects the guidance of Islam.

No one may be judged to be a kaafir except the one whom the Qur’aan and Sunnah indicate is a kaafir.



Say, (O Muhammad, to mankind): If ye love Allah, follow me; Allah will love you and forgive you your sins. Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.



Say: Obey Allah and the messenger. But if they turn away, lo! Allah loveth not the disbelievers (in His guidance). (Surah Aal Imraan, 3:31-32)



In the Qur'an, Allah uses the present tense of the word for Muslims too:



There is no compulsion in religion. The right direction is henceforth distinct from error. And he who rejecteth false deities and believeth in Allah hath grasped a firm handhold which will never break. Allah is Hearer, Knower. (Surah Al-Baqarah, 2:256)

Here, in the present tense verb form, it is referring to the rejecting of false deities. The most common usage, however, in the Qur'an, is for the rejectance of the guidance of Islam.

Muslims don't object about it's usage for them in the Qur'an. It is simply someone who rejects something.

I see no problem in using the term kaafir correctly if Allah has done so and Rasoolullah has done so.

[Muslim Woman]

Salaam

now a days , the word kafir normally used to show hatred / dislike towards them or to degrade them . Sometimes it creates unnecessary tension between Muslims and people of other faiths.

Those who are not Muslims , personally I like to call them non-Muslims.

[aadil77]

Those who are not Muslims , personally I like to call them non-Muslims.

thats because they are non-muslims, we can't call all non-muslims kaffirs

because they may not have rejected islam or even know anything about it

[Ramadhan]

I think one of the causes why people of other faiths (ie. kaafirs) feel it is derogatory term is because the word kaafir is usually translated into english as "infidels", which in my opinion is not an accurate translation, although I'm no arabic speaking, but I understand what the word kaafir means in Islam.
Who wants to be called infidel anyway?

[Zafran]

salaam

The biggest point everybody misses is that did the propeht Muhammad pbuh actually call people Kafir the way muslims do Today?

peace

[Rabi'ya]

salaam

The biggest point everybody misses is that did the propeht Muhammad pbuh actually call people Kafir the way muslims do Today?

peace

JazakAllah kheir brother for trying to bring the point back to discussion. I am not asking really whether Allah says in the Quraan. but how the Prophet (pbuh) approached the subject, for he was the kindest person, and most understanding person.

The sheikh was telling a story about how a non-Muslim used to dirty the streets every day and the area around the Prophets(saws) house. Muhammad(pbuh) would clean the street/area each day in order to go about his business. One day the man did not do his usual task, and so the Prophet(saw) called at his house to enquire as to whether the man was ok.

I thought this was such a lovely story as Muhammad(saw) was concerned enough for this guy to ask of his health. not that he was bothered that the guy hadnt disturbed him but depsite him being a non-believer still showed concern for his well-being. and the Prophet(saw) is the best of all examples.....no?

[Insaanah]

Did you mean directly saying to someone "You are a kaafir?" Generally that's unnecessary, it's like saying to someone, "You are a Christian", when you already know that person is a Christian, it's a bit obvious and goes without saying that they are. I'm not sure if it's wrong, but probably unnecessary as it's mostly obvious. However you can refer to people as kaafirs (but correctly, with the correct grounds), in the same way that you might refer to people as anything else eg Jew, Christian.

It's not the term of insult or ridicule that Muslims and non-Muslims alike are today making it out to be. It is, as stated before, simply someone who has rejected the guidance of Islam. And there is no reason we can't treat the kaafirs in our neighbourhoods kindly.

[aadil77]

JazakAllah kheir brother for trying to bring the point back to discussion. I am not asking really whether Allah says in the Quraan. but how the Prophet (pbuh) approached the subject, for he was the kindest person, and most understanding person.

The sheikh was telling a story about how a non-Muslim used to dirty the streets every day and the area around the Prophets(saws) house. Muhammad(pbuh) would clean the street/area each day in order to go about his business. One day the man did not do his usual task, and so the Prophet(saw) called at his house to enquire as to whether the man was ok.

I thought this was such a lovely story as Muhammad(saw) was concerned enough for this guy to ask of his health. not that he was bothered that the guy hadnt disturbed him but depsite him being a non-believer still showed concern for his well-being. and the Prophet(saw) is the best of all examples.....no?

I'm pretty sure it was a lady and she accepted islam afterwards

The point is no one ever goes up to a kaffir and calls them a kaffir or disbeliever or infidel or any other name. We only ever use those labels when a person or a group of people clearly demonastrate the attributes of those labels.

[~Raindrop~]

I'm pretty sure it was a lady and she accepted islam afterwards

There have been narrations regarding both.

[Rabi'ya]

Regardless of the gender of the person, i thought it was a beautiful example of the character of the Prophet(saw). The sheikh told another story about a lady who would leave rubbish on Muhammad(pbuh) doorstep also. but either way, it was a lovely story.

[joedawun]

No doubt the Prophet Muhammed would present a far more appealing case for Islam than the Muslims on this forum who barely hide their contempt for non Muslims (aka: kaffirs or kufar or whatever derogatory references I have seen presented here). However the dictionary defines the word kuffar, it is frequently thrown out as a derogatory term.

In any case, we all (Muslim & non-Muslim) would benefit if the Prophet Muhammed's example were followed by Muslims. Just saying...

[glo]

Regardless of the gender of the person, i thought it was a beautiful example of the character of the Prophet(saw). The sheikh told another story about a lady who would leave rubbish on Muhammad(pbuh) doorstep also. but either way, it was a lovely story.

To be treated like that and to react with such grace and humility shows what a great man Muhammad must have been.

I cannot think of many people who would show such self-control, grace and love for their fellow men/women under those circumstances!
It's a tough example to follow ...