are you kidding me? 21,000 of those fired or arrested ARE NOT SOLDIERS they are TEACHERS.....Professors are BANNED from LEAVING the country, and 3,000 judges have been dismissed....all for ties to the gulen movement! I see a serious problem with the muslim world today, and that is the inability to confront tyrants.....
Well, I agree that I am always on the floor laughing when the rather violent types, such as soldiers and policemen, get a taste of their own medecine. Concerning the teachers and professors, I am also more careful, because their weapon is not the use of force but the use of deception. As you know, Satan never, ever uses force. Satan only misleads you. Seriously, Satan's ONLY weapon is deception. That is, of course, the weapon that teachers and professors are also very proficient at using. Since they teach things like: Take off your headscarf because it is better for you!, I would indeed not shoot at them but rather say to them something like: Drink this because it is also better for you!
Concerning the judges, I would simply say: If you beat up that judge for no reason at all, this time, it is me instead of him who will be most helpful in justifying your injustices.
Concerning Gulen, he is indeed a fantastic excuse for getting even with people who needed a lesson anyway. I would also accuse lots of people of having ties with him. If I don't like you, you must also be some kind of Gulen supporter! Just in case Gulen is no longer useful in that role, I would even appoint a second person in this role of guilty-by-definition. Let's call this second evil person Nelug. From there on, everybody associated in any way with Nelug must also be punished!
Seriously, if you want a National State, you must also desire and embrace its purges and other obnoxious sides. Otherwise, you are inconsistent.
I would create a copy of the ertswhile All-Soviet State Directorate for hunting down, apprending, and neutralizing State enemies. The true nature of the National State is : paranoia. Everybody is a potential enemy. As a National State, we get even with real enemies, but also with potential, and even imaginary ones. I love it when the National State lashes out. It is truly evil. It then shows its true nature.
Seriously, this is the perfect time to denounce everybody to the Gestapo, that you do not like. Fill out the accusation forms already! Now is the perfect time to denounce your neighbour! There is no more fun than denouncing! So much fun! Don't make the mistake of liking the same girl as me, because you are going to regret it. First I will blackmail you, and if you do not pay up, I will denounce you, so that you land in prison forever. They will never release you. This is a fantastic game. I really feel like jumping on the plane, flying to Turkey, and join in on the denunciation fest already!
Last edited by kritikvernunft; 07-21-2016 at 06:23 AM.
Looks like this coup was used as a performance to scare people and make them support Erdogan, to confuse international community and justify repressions which were the real goal of this performance.
Forbidding scientists to live country may have only one reason: to prevent them from emigration, to force them to do things which they wouldn't do voluntarily. Like it was in ussr, where scientists were put to the jails with criminals first, then moved to a softer jails in exchange for cooperation with regime.
And there's nothing about religion. Oppressors likes to use distorted dogms to control masses via hypocrisy.
Just a point of view, i know nothing about turkey's politics but on the first look i've got such an impression.
appearantly Mustafa 16 is from Gulen movement who made this military coup.So dont believe him.Actually it is not real military coup it is a coup of soldiers who are member of gulen movement.Fetullah Gulen claims himself as the Mahdi.His members are everywhere in Turkey.military, police, education ,politics but they hide themselves.Some experts say that this gulen movement is like Ahmadiyye movement in India. http://www.milliyet.com.tr/tarihe-ge...undem-2280552/
Look at the news in the link.His man a judge declared him mahdi in a court decision.
lastly gulen's soldiers threw bombs from Turkish jets on innocent and unarmed Turkish people at the coup night.tanks went over people killed them.some soldiers shot unarmed civillians at several places in Turkey.
And this Mustafa 16 says Erdogan is crook or dictator.
Shame on you Mustafa 16.If you still support this gulen shaitan you are guilty as much as him.Ya eyyuhel muslimin dont believe this gulenist freaks.millions of people(Muslims) were on the streets at that night.Alhamdolillah , Allah protected us from this wicked US guided Gulen and his sinister men among us.Remember they had jets , tanks , and guns against innocent unarmed civillians.they killed hundreds of people at that night.
yaa sister dont listen to media listen to your sisters and brothers in Turkey if you are Muslim.You will find the answer.This gulenists are hypocrates.Listen to the Quran 'O you who have believed, if there comes to you a disobedient one with information, investigate, lest you harm a people out of ignorance and become, over what you have done, regretful.' (Quran 49-6)
France is under state of emergency for nearly nine months.Why?because they needed it. Turkey needs it more than France.Dont manipulate people here.Sister and brothers hundreds were killed by this gulenist men using jets tanks and guns.Dont you think the country needs a state of emergency?dont believe this gulenist Mustafa 16.Listen to the Quran 49:6 'O you who have believed, if there comes to you a disobedient one with information, investigate, lest you harm a people out of ignorance and become, over what you have done, regretful.'
this wasnt a performance of scare that night.People were killed by gulenist soldiers.all the media in turkey pro or against Erdogan admits this was an action of US guided Fetullah Gulen.No doubt.Follow the Muslim media!Why a Muslim would believe non muslim media I dont understand.
Have you asked the people in Gaza about this agreement with Israel?Do you know what contains this agreement?Food and health supply for Gaza!Why did Hamas thank Erdogan for the agreement?We of course dont love israel as well.i am sure erdogan doesnt love israel personally.but this is international politics.ruling a country is not like running a house .everybody in the world has pros and cons.erdogan is one of them as well.most of the muslims in turkey loves erdogann because of his pros about muslims and Islam.Maybe you dont understand now or you dont see the clear picture.but soon you will understand how Turkey and Erdogan is important for all the Muslim in the world.a strong Turkey means a strong Muslim world.Read some history...you will see.
If you dont believe me follow and read https://twitter.com/AkyolinEnglish Mustafa Akyol.Read his articles before the coup.See how he was against erdogan.and see him after the coup in the first minute.He didnt know the result of the coup when he talked against the coup.
this is Turkish tweeter account https://twitter.com/AkyolMustafa?lang=tr
this wasnt a performance of scare that night.People were killed by gulenist soldiers.all the media in turkey pro or against Erdogan admits this was an action of US guided Fetullah Gulen.No doubt.Follow the Muslim media!Why a Muslim would believe non muslim media I dont understand.
you have no proof of gulenist involvement other than baseless accusations by erdogan
you have no proof of gulenist involvement other than baseless accusations by erdogan
Proof is not what matters. Erdogan has fired a large number of people accused of gulenism. Some of these jobs are considered important and make good money. These jobs are available now for staunch anti-gulenists. Therefore, now is the time to repudiate, reject, despise, disavow, and totally dismiss anything that reeks of gulenism. Seriously, you should be able to prove your allegiance to Erdogan by denouncing enough people. These people do not even need to be gulenist at all. It is more than enough that they could be gulenist. If there is no proof that they are NOT gulenist, you must consider them to be surely gulenist. I am telling you. Denounce them before they denounce you. If you manage to denounce enough gulenists, nobody will be able to denounce you too. Seriously, it is you or them. So, let it be them. Erdogan may very well reward you with one of the jobs that he has taken away from gulenists. These people must be punished so that you can have a good and well-paid job. That is the real truth about gulenism. I am telling you: Gulenism is evil. It stands between you and the money and power that you deserve. In that case, how can gulenism be something good? It can only be utterly evil, believe me.
Last edited by kritikvernunft; 07-23-2016 at 05:39 AM.
It's hard to imagine better promotion for gulenism
Quality of followers says a lot about the leader.
Without even getting into gulenism, i'd rather believe that Gullen is potential Mahdi, than to conspiracy theory that so many intellectuals were fooled by some secta and hold extremely low disappointment/betrayal ratio.
To cut a long story short, everything that you have said about the alleged necessity of a National State are not tautologically-true, nor provable, neither falsifiable, and not even corroborated, but merely unsubstantiated ideological claims.
That sure seems like a well practiced response. The Westphalian nation-state is basically the global standard, it came to be that way for reasons pertaining to overall effectiveness and pragmatism, and I think you just like to be a contrarian with a completely different idea because it makes you feel like the smartest person in the room. After all, everyone else is just lazy with their thinking but you are busy making intellectual discoveries that you lessers can't even comprehend. Is that about right?
At any rate. Let's take a look back at the British Isles and their varied relationship with Roman colonization, then we'll see what happens when military force and with it government is suddenly removed from the picture.
Fifth century. The decolonization of Roman Britain ws even more abrupt than that of Africa. Britain had the single largest unit of the Roman army, around 15 percent of the imperial force, paid for by astonishingly heavy taxation, which the people of Britain certainly did not appreciate whatsoever. Whoever was in charge of this army had the potential for conducting a coup d'etat. As the Empire hit political turbulence in the late fourth century, twice in 25 years the head of this army in Britain tried to become emperor.
Since the first attempt in 380 had failed, the leader of the second attempt in 403 decided to improve his chances by taking his army with him on a march toward Rome. He still lost, but in the process Britain suddenly lost its army. Since the Roman government in Britain had been military, not only did Britain lose its army, it lost its government. The history of Britain post-403 makes the post-colonial history of Africa look like a staggering success. Within a few years Britain had petitioned Rome to be re-colonized (!) even heavy taxation was preferable to loss of security and government. But Rome was in no position to do so at that time, so British society was on its own.
What followed was a descent into civil war. It never occurs to you that without any monopoly on violence, many people engage in unrestrained violence, yeah? There was a collapse of public goods to the extreme extent that the urban economy disappeared. Peole fled the country, the mass of emigrants across the Channel nostalgically naming their new home Brittany.
So this is our beginning, in Britain. It took Britain, and much of the rest of Europe, centuries before local thugs coalesced into miniature states, and it was a very long and arduous process.
So yes, monopolies on force are important, if difficult to navigate but they are essential. Let's remember the lesson of Britain and Brittany, the sudden removal of military and government was a disaster even if the Brits did not like much else about their situation.
appearantly Mustafa 16 is from Gulen movement who made this military coup.So dont believe him.Actually it is not real military coup it is a coup of soldiers who are member of gulen movement.Fetullah Gulen claims himself as the Mahdi.His members are everywhere in Turkey.military, police, education ,politics but they hide themselves.Some experts say that this gulen movement is like Ahmadiyye movement in India. http://www.milliyet.com.tr/tarihe-ge...undem-2280552/
Look at the news in the link.His man a judge declared him mahdi in a court decision.
lastly gulen's soldiers threw bombs from Turkish jets on innocent and unarmed Turkish people at the coup night.tanks went over people killed them.some soldiers shot unarmed civillians at several places in Turkey.
And this Mustafa 16 says Erdogan is crook or dictator.
Shame on you Mustafa 16.If you still support this gulen shaitan you are guilty as much as him.Ya eyyuhel muslimin dont believe this gulenist freaks.millions of people(Muslims) were on the streets at that night.Alhamdolillah , Allah protected us from this wicked US guided Gulen and his sinister men among us.Remember they had jets , tanks , and guns against innocent unarmed civillians.they killed hundreds of people at that night.
again, where is your PROOF that gulen is behind this?
Erdogan and Gulen were two close friends once upon a time and now they want to kill each other. Time changes many things...But they **** on my country...
Erdogan and Gulen were two close friends once upon a time and now they want to kill each other. Time changes many things...But they **** on my country...
are you kidding me? 21,000 of those fired or arrested ARE NOT SOLDIERS they are TEACHERS.....Professors are BANNED from LEAVING the country, and 3,000 judges have been dismissed....all for ties to the gulen movement! I see a serious problem with the muslim world today, and that is the inability to confront tyrants.....
fetullah gulen is a USA based terrorist. his followers are terrorists too and they attempted a coup against elected president and Turkey! and they murdered 250 innocent ppl and injured about 2500 people.
if a so called "teacher" follow and obey a terrorist leader like fetullah gulen or abdullah ocalan(pkk leader) then he is not a legal teacher anymore. if a civil servant doesnt obey his chief but obey so called " gulen cult abi's (big brother) orders then he is not legal teacher anymore.
that doesnt matter which title they have. all gulenists are terrorists must be neutralize like all other terrorists around world (isis, pkk, eta, ira, boko haram etc.)
- - - Updated - - -
format_quote Originally Posted by Physicist
Looks like this coup was used as a performance to scare people and make them support Erdogan, to confuse international community and justify repressions which were the real goal of this performance.
Forbidding scientists to live country may have only one reason: to prevent them from emigration, to force them to do things which they wouldn't do voluntarily. Like it was in ussr, where scientists were put to the jails with criminals first, then moved to a softer jails in exchange for cooperation with regime.
And there's nothing about religion. Oppressors likes to use distorted dogms to control masses via hypocrisy.
Just a point of view, i know nothing about turkey's politics but on the first look i've got such an impression.
are you mentally ill? erdoğan is already 8 times elected president/prime minister/mayor for 25 years since istanbul mayor! %50 of Turkey people support erdoğan forever and love him so much. there is no other leader got that much vote and love now ! why he needs to kill his own people? how he persuaded coup plotters to attempt a coup and to get stuck in to the jail forever?
fetullah gulen is a USA based terrorist. his followers are terrorists too and they attempted a coup against elected president and Turkey! and they murdered 250 innocent ppl and injured about 2500 people.
if a so called "teacher" follow and obey a terrorist leader like fetullah gulen or abdullah ocalan(pkk leader) then he is not a legal teacher anymore. if a civil servant doesnt obey his chief but obey so called " gulen cult abi's (big brother) orders then he is not legal teacher anymore.
that doesnt matter which title they have. all gulenists are terrorists must be neutralize like all other terrorists around world (isis, pkk, eta, ira, boko haram etc.)
- - - Updated - - -
are you mentally ill? erdoğan is already 8 times elected president/prime minister/mayor for 25 years since istanbul mayor! %50 of Turkey people support erdoğan forever and love him so much. there is no other leader got that much vote and love now ! why he needs to kill his own people? how he persuaded coup plotters to attempt a coup and to get stuck in to the jail forever?
he used MIT (the National Intelligence Organization) to send false word to commanders that a coup was in order, or he had MIT send word that the soldiers were going to be fired and arrested in order to instigate a coup. In other words, the soldiers weren't working for Erdogan, they were deceived by his henchman, Hakan Fidan.
he used MIT (the National Intelligence Organization) to send false word to commanders that a coup was in order, or he had MIT send word that the soldiers were going to be fired and arrested in order to instigate a coup. In other words, the soldiers weren't working for Erdogan, they were deceived by his henchman, Hakan Fidan.
You are WASTING your time. How can you talk to someone who is blind, deaf, mute and unable to feel/touch. Let the one who shouts keep on shouting, for the people who think it falls on deaf ears. For the ones who blindly follow is the truth.
Majority of people these days religious people and non-religious people alike cannot face reality as it is. They rather want to keep sticking to the blue pill as the illusion is more comfortable.
Last edited by Simple_Person; 08-19-2017 at 09:52 PM.
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