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    Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

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    https://www.alaraby.co.uk/english/bl...f-men-to-drive

    Homepage : Blog : Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men


    Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men
    The New Arab
    Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men
    The unofficial ban on women driving has been hotly contested in recent years [Getty]
    Date of publication: 21 September, 2017
    In Saudi Arabia, where women cannot drive, a senior state cleric has said women should not be allowed behind the wheel because they have "a quarter the brainpower of men". Tags: Saudi Arabia, women, driving, Islam
    Sheikh Saad al-Hajari, the head of the government's religious edict authority in the southern province of Assir, recently made the comments at a lecture on "the evils of allowing women to drive", Saudi daily Sabq reported on Wednesday.


    "It is not their fault, but women lack intellect do they not?" Hajari asked an audience.


    "Their lack of intellect does not harm their piousness because they are made that way," he said, explaining that in Islam a woman's testimony is worth half of a man's.


    "Would you give a man with half an intellect a driving licence? So how would you give one to a woman when she has half an intellect," he said.


    "And if they go out to the market this gets halved again! So they now have a quarter of an intellect," Hajari said without giving an explanation for his reasoning.


    He then argues that because women pray less than men - during menstruation women are prohibited from prayers - they also have half the "faith" of men.


    The sheikh's comments have been circulated widely by social media users in the conservative kingdom with many people harshly criticising his reasoning.

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    Re: Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    I must say I disagree with him. I dont see how women have less intellect than men.

    They might use their brains differently tho.

    On the praying less than men - meaning having half the faithof men is soo wrong... Women are prohibited from praying when on their period. Meaning they'd disobey Allah by praying while on their period.

    Women shouldn't be shamed for not praying when menstruating.. It is part of their nature, and since Allah forbade them from praying when menstruating, wouldn't it be disobedience to pray, and obedience not to pray in that period?

    Belittling women for not being able to pray, because Allah disallowed them, is soo wrong. Why? Because Allah SWT made that part of their nature, and forbade them when on their period. So how can one belittle someone for doing what Allah commands (to abstain from prayer when on their period)?

    Correct me if I am wrong.
    Allahu alam.
    Last edited by Serinity; 09-23-2017 at 08:53 PM.
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    Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    Meaning of Shirk according to The Qur'an
    " Worshipping anyone or anything besides Allah " or " distributing anything exclusive to Allah, to anyone or anything else "

    Meaning of Tawheed according to The Qur'an
    Worshipping none but Allah. Affirming whatever is exclusive to Him, Him alone.

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    Re: Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    "Leaders" who make comments like this is exactly why people steer away from even LEARNING about Islam
    5 | Likes Al Sultan, muslimah_B, czgibson, beleiver, ChosenTCO liked this post

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    Re: Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    "Would you give a man with half an intellect a driving licence? So how would you give one to a woman when she has half an intellect," he said.


    "And if they go out to the market this gets halved again! So they now have a quarter of an intellect," Hajari said without giving an explanation for his reasoning.

    ...wow,

    Although..

    To be fair..

    ...I been shopping with the wife.#

    *runs away*

    This my fav at the moment.

    c6uq74e78ulz.jpg

    No.. women are not slow...

    I have to say, my wife was an accountant in a bygone era.

    This is why you should say joke.. after everytime you tell a joke.

    Alhamdulillah.

    # mashallah.

    I wouldnt talk bad about my mother.


    ...to maintain wit and keep relevant to the religion probably takes some doing, Usually takes me a week to figure out what i should have said.

    Honestly, took me 5 attempts to pass a driving test.
    Last edited by M.I.A.; 09-23-2017 at 10:38 PM.
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    Re: Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    Bismillah Ir-Rehman Ir-Raheem (In the Name of God, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful)

    Imagine being that cleric and believing that you've actually made a sound argument when you've just in fact made a laughingstock of yourself in front of the entire world and reinforced the image of Muslim men automatically thinking women to be second-class citizens. I feel not only dismay that today the right-wingers of the world have another reason to mock Islam but also pity for his female relatives whether they be his wife, mother, daughter, or sister.

    By the way, if there are legitimate reasons for women to not drive in Saudi Arabia due to cultural expectations or values, he should just say that instead of uttering nonsensical mathematical calculations to justify the cultural practice.

    Yes, there's a prophetic tradition that talks about intellect and women, but that scholars have explained to be in the context of generally a higher level of susceptibility to emotional persuasion and also menstruation in which women are not allowed to pray or fast for practical spiritual reasons. That said, let's remember the scholar from whom many Companions (may Allah be pleased with them) came to learn is a woman, considered in essence one of the first scholars of Islam: Aisha (may Allah be pleased with her). Maryam (a.k.a. Mary) (peace be upon her), mother of Jesus (peace be upon him), is considered one of the best and most pure person to be ever born and she had achieved grade in piety that men of today and even yesteryear cannot even imagine and will never be able to attain.

    By the way, it is entirely unnecessary to say any of the above simply for the purpose of saying that Saudi women will not or should not be allowed to drive in Saudi Arabia. Even in the United States, driving is considered a privilege in legal terms and not a right. Therefore, using similar reasoning, Saudi Arabia's officials or clerics can simply state that privilege is not afforded to women for safety concerns and preservation of cultural values; I would respect and value that line of reasoning more than any offer of hasty words couched in religious terms seeming to sting women's intelligence and contributions to society, especially considering Islamic history in which we learn that the first human being to accept Islam was a woman: Khadija (may Allah be pleased with her). And in Qur'an, there seems to be a great emphasis on spiritual intelligence of which I should emphasize women generally have in abundance. Even in today's times, statistically most of the converts to Islam are women, not men.



    Last edited by Search; 09-24-2017 at 03:27 AM.
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    Re: Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    Salam. I completely disagree with "women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men". Because Allah (SWT) says in the holy Quran:

    O Mankind! Be wary of your Lord who created you from a single soul, and created its mate from it, and from the two of them scattered numerous men and women. Be wary of Allah, in whose Name you adjure one another and (of severing ties with) blood relations. Indeed Allah is watchful over you. [Quran:4:1]

    "Verily, women are the twin halves of men." -
    [Abu Dawood #234 , Tirmidhi #113 & others]
    2 | Likes Grandad, muslimah_B liked this post

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    Re: Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    Well woman are half of men. In everything as per hadith in whixh oyr our prophet alihe asalam described..
    Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    قال النبي محمد صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم:*الـحياءُ شُعْبَةٌ مِنَ الاِيِمَانِ*
    و قال ايضا:*الحياء لاياتى الا بخير
    و قال ايضا:*اذا لم تستحي،فاصنع ما شئت*

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    Re: Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    Quote Originally Posted by فصيح الياسين View Post
    Well woman are half of men. In everything as per hadith in whixh oyr our prophet alihe asalam described..
    It is not that women are less than man or half of man in intellect. They just use their brains differently, and thus the need for 2 female witnesses is tailored in such a way as to take into consideration their nature.

    Women have a generally higher susceptibility to emotional persuasion, as sister Search mentioned. This does not make women less, or inferior. The same way we are not inferior to women for not being able to give birth.
    Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    Meaning of Shirk according to The Qur'an
    " Worshipping anyone or anything besides Allah " or " distributing anything exclusive to Allah, to anyone or anything else "

    Meaning of Tawheed according to The Qur'an
    Worshipping none but Allah. Affirming whatever is exclusive to Him, Him alone.

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    Re: Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    Quote Originally Posted by Serinity View Post
    It is not that women are less than man or half of man in intellect. They just use their brains differently, and thus the need for 2 female witnesses is tailored in such a way as to take into consideration their nature.

    Women have a generally higher susceptibility to emotional persuasion, as sister Search mentioned. This does not make women less, or inferior. The same way we are not inferior to women for not being able to give birth.
    I thought u have keen eye.. but differences between men and women kept u of anware wht i wrote..
    Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    قال النبي محمد صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم:*الـحياءُ شُعْبَةٌ مِنَ الاِيِمَانِ*
    و قال ايضا:*الحياء لاياتى الا بخير
    و قال ايضا:*اذا لم تستحي،فاصنع ما شئت*

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    Re: Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    Awesome..


    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...d=tmg_share_tw

    “The Ministry of Education regrets the inadvertent error,” said Ahmed al-Eissa, the Saudi education minister.-


    Quote Originally Posted by Serinity View Post
    It is not that women are less than man or half of man in intellect. They just use their brains differently, and thus the need for 2 female witnesses is tailored in such a way as to take into consideration their nature.

    Women have a generally higher susceptibility to emotional persuasion, as sister Search mentioned. This does not make women less, or inferior. The same way we are not inferior to women for not being able to give birth.

    Agree, men and women are different.
    Last edited by M.I.A.; 09-24-2017 at 12:32 PM.

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    Re: Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    Honestly and we wonder why people make fun of us. Maybe the dude who said this should say that a neuroscientist or an astronaut. Would he say that about Aisha RA? Dont think so somehow.
    1 | Likes SHO liked this post

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    Re: Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    No, man and woman are equal. No other religion give the rights to woman at par the man...http://islamicweb.com/begin/myth1.htm
    Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    Allah (swt) knows best

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    Re: Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    Quote Originally Posted by azc View Post
    No, man and woman are equal. No other religion give the rights to woman at par the man...http://islamicweb.com/begin/myth1.htm
    Exactly

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    Re: Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    Salaam

    With leadership like this who needs enemies?
    1 | Likes cinnamonrolls1 liked this post

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    Re: Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    Salaam

    Another update. Wise words.

    Turkey’s top religious body head urges Islamic preachers to be careful when making comments on women

    Turkey’s Directorate of Religious Affairs (Diyanet) head Ali Erbaş has urged Islamic preachers across Turkey to be careful when making comments about women.

    Speaking at a meeting on March 10 in the southeastern province of Hakkari, Erbaş said the way to preclude the abuse of religion was by revealing the truths about Islam.

    “Even preachers who speak and work with good intentions and sincerity should be extra careful not to make their comments open to misinterpretation. Everyone who writes, talks, or reports about Islam has to be more careful,” Erbaş said.

    “On July 15 [2016 coup attempt], we saw how all the truths of Islam were misused and exploited. We have seen how terrorist organizations, especially those like the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant [ISIL], exploited Islam’s principles and concepts. It is abusing the religious feelings of our citizens with the basic sources of religion and information. It is the abuse of our religion that gets used for commercial concerns and instrumented for others’ own benefits,” he added.

    Erbaş’s statement came after President Recep Tayyip Erdoğan slammed some Islamic writers over their sexist comments.

    Erdoğan also called on Diyanet to take a more active role in adapting religious practices to current social conditions.

    “We would never take into account the words of some marginal people who aim at nothing but to abuse the values of our religion, our nation,” Erdoğan said at an event on March 8 to mark International Women’s Day in Ankara.

    His comments came after conservative Social Fabric Foundation head Nureddin Yıldız stirred debate by making a controversial comment on violence against women.

    “Women should be grateful to God, because God allowed men to beat women and be relaxed,” Yıldız said on March 3 in a video posted online.

    http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/turkeys-top-religious-body-head-urges-islamic-preachers-to-be-careful-when-making-comments-on-women-128552
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    Re: Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    Quote Originally Posted by Junon View Post
    Turkey’s top religious body head urges Islamic preachers to be careful when making comments on women
    Brother you have cited a secularist-liberal news paper, which should not be trusted in such matters. Nureddin Yıldız is among the most respected moderate Muslim scholars in Turkey who has a long history of Islamic studying, having graduated and studied from many different institutions and scholars, and preaching activities. His statements about women were taken out of context to discredit Islamic circles in general. He never praised violence against women, nor did he make any sexist statements.
    Then, Mr. Erdoğan is a secular president who is inclined to the reform movement, his statements on religion have no value for Muslims, nor is he in the position of making any statements regarding that. Basically his statements were merely a further instance of demagogy this time trying to repair his image among international and Turkish leftists.

    As for ''Turkey's top religious body" Diyanet, it is subordinated to the secular Republic of Turkey and officially described as an organ intended to replenish the cultural and religious needs of Turkish citizens - putting it on a par with various other cultural activities like sports, art or music. In reality this entity is an intervention into the independent organization of religious affairs, which should be the norm in a secular state that claims to represent no religion. Historically Diyanet was founded to prevent the reasonable anti-state inclination of Muslims and can be compared to the Nazi Gleichschaltung attempt of the Christian church in order to undermine any religiously motivated opposition.

    I have not read the beginning of this thread and am not aware of its motive, but I disagree to the last post and that which is being implied.
    Last edited by Yahya.; 03-12-2018 at 06:41 PM.
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    Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    And [there is a share for] those who came after them, saying, "Our Lord, forgive us and our brothers who preceded us in faith and put not in our hearts [any] resentment toward those who have believed. Our Lord, indeed You are Kind and Merciful." (Surat al-Hashr, 10)

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    Re: Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    Salaam

    Thanks for the context brother, Ill take note.

    Ill still think the general gist is correct. We should be considered and careful when making comments (in this case) about women.

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    Re: Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    So what did this Nureddin guy say?

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    Re: Saudi cleric says women have 'a quarter of the intellect' of men

    Excerpt:

    http://www.foxnews.com/world/2018/03...tion-push.html


    Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman says women are 'absolutely' equal to men, continues modernization push
    Christopher Carbone By Christopher Carbone | Fox News
    Who is Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman?
    A look at Saudi Arabia's Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman from his spending habits to his policy changes that are making waves across the globe.


    Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman is a man on a mission.


    Known to many simply by his initials, MBS, the 32-year-old was given expansive new powers by his father just nine months ago and arrives Tuesday in Washington, D.C. for a summit with President Trump in the midst of a major push to modernize his conservative Islamic Kingdom.


    Bin Salman has already instituted a series of surprising reforms to make the Muslim country -- known for its bearded religious police enforcing strict social codes -- more open and accepting of Western norms.




    Last fall, the Kingdom agreed for the first time to allow women to drive. After 35 years, movie theaters will open again (they were shut in the 1980s during a wave of ultra-conservatism). In a break with the rigid guardianship that’s defined the kingdom for decades, it was recently announced that women can launch their own businesses without consent from a husband or male relative. And a prohibition on women attending sporting events in national stadiums was lifted.
    During an interview on CBS’s “60 Minutes,” the crown prince, who has curtailed the ability of religious police to arrest women for dress code violations, said women are equal to men: “We are all human beings and there is no difference.”


    FILE PHOTO: Saudi Arabia's then Deputy Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman reacts upon his arrival at the Elysee Palace in Paris, France, June 24, 2015. REUTERS/Charles Platiau/File Photo - RC16762C2D00
    Saudi Arabia's Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman is pushing for modernization in his conservative Islamic country. (Reuters)


    Although Saudi women have been dictated by custom and the religious police to wear the abaya, a full-length black cloak that covers everything except their hands and face in public, bin Salman pushed back against that idea during the interview.


    “The laws are very clear and stipulated in the laws of Sharia: that women wear decent, respectful clothing, like men,” said bin Salman. “This, however, does not particularly specify a black abaya or a black head cover. The decision is entirely left for women to decide what type of decent and respectful attire she chooses to wear.”


    Bin Salman went on to explain that “extremists” forbidding the mixing of men and women are pushing ideas that “contradict the way of life during the time of the prophet and the Caliphs.”


    In another sign of liberalization, Saudi Arabia will issue its first tourist visas later this year to attract money from overseas visitors. Under bin Salman’s ‘Vision 2030’ initiative, the Kingdom wants to have 30 million visitors per year by 2030 and it wants annual tourism spending to hit $47 billion by 2020.
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