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  1. #1
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    Kurdish women scarred by state violence

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    https://ahvalnews.com/turkey-kurds/k...utheast-report

    Turkish security forces subjected Kurdish women to rape threats and abuse and denied them access to medical care during the long curfews in southeast Turkey from late 2015 to early 2016, often leaving deep psychological scars, said a report by the Istanbul-based Migration Monitoring Association.Fierce urban fighting broke out across the mainly Kurdish southeast of Turkey in late 2015 when the outlawed Kurdistan Workers’ Party (PKK) declared autonomy in parts of many cities and its youth wing erected barricades to troops out. The army responded by shelling the areas with tank and artillery fire and sending in special forces to crush the insurrection.Based on interviews with 480 women, the report paints a picture of the deep impact on local women of their fraught existence during the waves of violence and destruction during the period. More than 90 percent of those interviewed blamed the state.“They tore apart my underwear in the bedroom. Condoms were everywhere around the house. There were a lot of hideous and derogatory writings on the walls,” said a 31-year-old woman from Cizre, who said security officers used her home as their sleeping quarters for an extended period. In addition to common problems like dangerous streets and the lack of electricity and water, women also faced not being able to find necessary feminine products, no access to doctors when sick or pregnant, and an increase in domestic violence.“They even left sh*t on women’s underwear. They wrote nasty things,” said a 43-year-old woman from Diyarbakır. “It has been three years since then, but these writings are still on my mind, like ‘Get ready, girls, we are coming soon.’”As a result of the experiences, many women are now experiencing deep psychological problems, including depression and post-traumatic stress. Some still see dead bodies on the ground and refuse to leave their homes. Some are unable to handle the trauma.“Our neighbour’s daughter-in-law killed herself after the curfews. She became depressed, she told her mother-in-law that she was going downstairs and then hanged herself,” said an 80-year-old woman from Yüksekova.“We could not go out during the curfew. We stayed in the basement for three months. We were seven families, all of us hungry and thirsty. There were a lot of sick people among us. We could neither go to the hospital, nor buy medicine, nor go outside at all,” said a 23-year-old woman in Cizre, where security forces killed more than 130 people who had been stuck in basements as violence raged.“There were many sick people. We could neither go to the hospital, nor get any medicine. We could not go outside. The state did not treat us as humans, so we do not recognise the state. I do not go to school anymore, I’ve quit, I do not want to,” said an 18-year-old in Cizre.Many of the women are scarred for life by what they witnessed or what circumstances led them to do. Yet following the curfews and the coup attempt in 2016, the state shut down all of the women’s organisations and initiatives that had been established during a two-year peace process with the PKK that ended in July 2015. As a result, the women now have nowhere to turn for help.“Soldiers were firing at our house. We hanged a piece of white cloth as a flag on our house, but they continued fire. They shelled our house, making a huge hole in a wall,” said a woman in Nusaybin. “A woman was killed in front of our house. They were firing guns, so we could not go outside. She was a pregnant woman, shot on the stairs, she died right where she was.”“[My second son] was wounded, but it was not serious. He told me, ‘Mom, do not take me to the hospital, if you take me there, they will kill me’,” said a woman from Cizre. “We took him there and they killed him. This is my greatest regret.”
    Last edited by SintoDinto; 05-02-2019 at 11:31 PM.
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    xboxisdead's Avatar
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    Re: Kurdish women scarred by state violence

    Brother please...can you edit your post? Separate them into lines..make them less crowded...format them better. Bold headings and underline essential points. You do not understand the power of formatting and beautifying your sentences because then it easier to transfer the message to the reader and attract audience to the read whatever you want them to read. Especially in an age with attention span is short and people don't have the patience to read struggle to read, they lost interest fast and skim through it.

    You need to represent your message in a well package for the people to read them.
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    SintoDinto's Avatar
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    Re: Kurdish women scarred by state violence

    Quote Originally Posted by xboxisdead View Post
    Brother please...can you edit your post? Separate them into lines..make them less crowded...format them better. Bold headings and underline essential points. You do not understand the power of formatting and beautifying your sentences because then it easier to transfer the message to the reader and attract audience to the read whatever you want them to read. Especially in an age with attention span is short and people don't have the patience to read struggle to read, they lost interest fast and skim through it.

    You need to represent your message in a well package for the people to read them.
    I dont understand what is so difficult about CLICKING the link to the ARTICLE I provided. Sorry if I sound triggered it's just that imams never talk about rights of Kurds and its REALLY irritating. Must still be loyal to Saddam or be afraid to upset Erdogan fans
    Last edited by SintoDinto; 05-03-2019 at 10:19 PM.
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    Re: Kurdish women scarred by state violence

    Fake news

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    Re: Kurdish women scarred by state violence

    Quote Originally Posted by CuriousonTruth View Post
    Fake news
    UN website: https://www.ohchr.org/EN/NewsEvents/...22853&LangID=E

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    Re: Kurdish women scarred by state violence

    Unfortunate things do happen in war I'm afraid, kurds should never have started campaign of rebellion and terror
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    Re: Kurdish women scarred by state violence

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahmed. View Post
    Unfortunate things do happen in war I'm afraid, kurds should never have started campaign of rebellion and terror
    There are anti-Turkey websites that are funded by the west to smear Erdogan. Such as: Turkish minute, Ahval, Der Spiegel, The Guardian, Kurdistan24, etc

    It's best to avoid taking these websites as some sort of reliable source of information. Btw, I'm not saying pro-gov sites liek Yeni Safak is reliable (although I follow it).

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    Re: Kurdish women scarred by state violence

    Its hard to find a neutral reliable Turkish news reporter today. Its either pro or anti goverment. I follow BBC Turkish. But it doesnt have an alternate English version.
    Kurdish women scarred by state violence

    “Either seem as you are or be as you seem” Rumi

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    Re: Kurdish women scarred by state violence

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahmed. View Post
    Unfortunate things do happen in war I'm afraid, kurds should never have started campaign of rebellion and terror
    brother, do you honestly believe the KURDS started a campaign of violence and terror? that was the PKK, a millitant group. it's like saying women who live in areas that were previously taken over by khawarij dogs of hell like isis or al qaeda should be raped by shiite militias or assad forces?. see the analogy?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahmed. View Post
    Unfortunate things do happen in war I'm afraid, kurds should never have started campaign of rebellion and terror
    also, why do we as Muslims cry foul when westernes fail to take into account the factors that drove muslims to terrorism, such as lack of education, oppression, etc. in places like gaza, etc. where they do school shootings, blowing up buses etc. all those heinous crimes on israeli soil, or hezbollah, or al qaeda dogs, or isis dogs, or houthis, or iran.....but when kurds do it, KILL EM! you expect the kuffar who lack the deen of allah to show you more compassion than your muslim brethren?
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    Re: Kurdish women scarred by state violence

    Quote Originally Posted by SintoDinto View Post
    brother, do you honestly believe the KURDS started a campaign of violence and terror? that was the PKK, a millitant group. it's like saying women who live in areas that were previously taken over by khawarij dogs of hell like isis or al qaeda should be raped by shiite militias or assad forces?. see the analogy?

    - - - Updated - - -

    also, why do we as Muslims cry foul when westernes fail to take into account the factors that drove muslims to terrorism, such as lack of education, oppression, etc. in places like gaza, etc. where they do school shootings, blowing up buses etc. all those heinous crimes on israeli soil, or hezbollah, or al qaeda dogs, or isis dogs, or houthis, or iran.....but when kurds do it, KILL EM! you expect the kuffar who lack the deen of allah to show you more compassion than your muslim brethren?
    Very well said, Brother!!! Yes: I feel very sorry for those poor Kurdish women! It's disgusting: they way they've been treated!!
    Kurdish women scarred by state violence

    Allahu Akbar!

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    Re: Kurdish women scarred by state violence

    first of all...how do we know this is reliable?
    second...every story has two sides...since when İ was a little boy i remember there were news about turks living in thoses areas with similar faith on a regular basis. this happens for over decades now. There is a reason why the PKK is on a terrorist list in some countries. and they often hide in small villages like these where they get supported by the lokal kurds...İ am not trying to say that they got what they deserved...of course it is terrible....

    but still it is war against PKK...

    besides...the violence from the kurdish side intensified in the last years...the kurds want tobe independant...and why? because of 2023 comes near.

    Turkey has oil in that area...but they are not allowed to harvest untill 2023...and the Kurds want exactly that area as an independant Kurdistan...and if possible before 2023. so it is just about the money

    i am not an Erdogan fan...but neither i am against him...but again...there is more below the surface than this one sides story about the kurds as victims.
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    SintoDinto's Avatar
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    Re: Kurdish women scarred by state violence

    Quote Originally Posted by Ümit View Post
    first of all...how do we know this is reliable?
    second...every story has two sides...since when İ was a little boy i remember there were news about turks living in thoses areas with similar faith on a regular basis. this happens for over decades now. There is a reason why the PKK is on a terrorist list in some countries. and they often hide in small villages like these where they get supported by the lokal kurds...İ am not trying to say that they got what they deserved...of course it is terrible....

    but still it is war against PKK...

    besides...the violence from the kurdish side intensified in the last years...the kurds want tobe independant...and why? because of 2023 comes near.

    Turkey has oil in that area...but they are not allowed to harvest untill 2023...and the Kurds want exactly that area as an independant Kurdistan...and if possible before 2023. so it is just about the money

    i am not an Erdogan fan...but neither i am against him...but again...there is more below the surface than this one sides story about the kurds as victims.
    I don't quite understand what you're trying to say, especially about 2023 (perhaps the theory of when treaty of lausanne expires or erdogan's 2023 vision?) but i get what youre saying about their being deep state forces at play and how not all is at it seems.
    Last edited by SintoDinto; 05-05-2019 at 12:30 AM.
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    Re: Kurdish women scarred by state violence

    Quote Originally Posted by manofIslam View Post
    Very well said, Brother!!! Yes: I feel very sorry for those poor Kurdish women! It's disgusting: they way they've been treated!!
    As IO said completely fake news. Sinto Dinto is member/supporter of a terrorist organization in Turkey, which are Gulenist. He is trying to smear Turkey and Erdogan by using fake news about kurds as fodder nothing else.

    What he doesn't mention, AKP gave more freedom to kurds than ever before. Even Erdogan's wife is kurd.
    Last edited by CuriousonTruth; 05-05-2019 at 04:20 AM.

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    Re: Kurdish women scarred by state violence

    Quote Originally Posted by CuriousonTruth View Post
    As IO said completely fake news. Sinto Dinto is member/supporter of a terrorist organization in Turkey, which are Gulenist. He is trying to smear Turkey and Erdogan by using fake news about kurds as fodder nothing else.

    What he doesn't mention, AKP gave more freedom to kurds than ever before. Even Erdogan's wife is kurd.
    Who said I was a "member" of gulen movement. Lol they dont keep rosters detailing how many members there are, it is decentralized (contrary to popular belief they dont just sit around waiting for orders from the top ie gulen considering I know what it's like to visit him (i never did others) based on personal eyewitness accounts (and an article) ) am I a supporter all iki can say is they didn't do any terrorist acts like July 15 all those testimonies about "gulen ordered it" were obtained under duress of torture and later redacted and they later blamed zekai aksakalli among others and said they were forced to do the coup, thought it was a military exercise among others
    Last edited by SintoDinto; 05-05-2019 at 05:37 AM.
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    Ahmed.'s Avatar
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    Re: Kurdish women scarred by state violence

    Quote Originally Posted by SintoDinto View Post
    brother, do you honestly believe the KURDS started a campaign of violence and terror? that was the PKK, a millitant group. it's like saying women who live in areas that were previously taken over by khawarij dogs of hell like isis or al qaeda should be raped by shiite militias or assad forces?. see the analogy?

    - - - Updated - - -

    also, why do we as Muslims cry foul when westernes fail to take into account the factors that drove muslims to terrorism, such as lack of education, oppression, etc. in places like gaza, etc. where they do school shootings, blowing up buses etc. all those heinous crimes on israeli soil, or hezbollah, or al qaeda dogs, or isis dogs, or houthis, or iran.....but when kurds do it, KILL EM! you expect the kuffar who lack the deen of allah to show you more compassion than your muslim brethren?
    Pkk is not an outside entity though and are from the Kurdish areas right? So they can't be compared to isis who are foreigners from other countries and who have no support of the locals, and do not all kurds support the rebellion? The woman in your article said she does not recognise the Turkish state authority anymore so it seems like they do

    Secondly did all these opressions you listed exist in the Kurdish areas before the rebellion? Or was it just a desire to form their own independent state?

    It forbidden in Islam to rebel against Muslim Rulers even if the Ruler is oppressive:


    https://islamqa.org/hanafi/daruliftaa/7879

    The break up of Muslim countries plays into the hands of the kuffars divide and conquer policy that's why the West supports the Kurdish rebels
    Last edited by Ahmed.; 05-05-2019 at 05:40 AM.
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    SintoDinto's Avatar
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    Re: Kurdish women scarred by state violence

    PKK terrorize both Kurds and Turks but because of the oppression of the Kurds that has existed for decades in the form of military brutalization predating the PKK Kurds often feel they are between a rock and a hard place. But PKK kill many Kurds as well even teachers, and recruit child soldiers and get soldiers addicted to drugs so yes they are very real terrorists. Just because they are in the local area does not mean people support them they hide. Also yes the PKK wanted their own state but then they wanted autonomy culturally now they want a state again when peace talks failed.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahmed. View Post
    Pkk is not an outside entity though and are from the Kurdish areas right? So they can't be compared to isis who are foreigners from other countries and who have no support of the locals, and do not all kurds support the rebellion? The woman in your article said she does not recognise the Turkish state authority anymore so it seems like they do

    Secondly did all these opressions you listed exist in the Kurdish areas before the rebellion? Or was it just a desire to form their own independent state?

    It forbidden in Islam to rebel against Muslim Rulers even if the Ruler is oppressive:


    https://islamqa.org/hanafi/daruliftaa/7879

    The break up of Muslim countries plays into the hands of the kuffars divide and conquer policy that's why the West supports the Kurdish rebels
    The west supports the YPG in Syria which Turks allege is an offshoot of the PKK, but which YPG and US denies but they dont support original PKK. I don't know too much about it.
    Last edited by SintoDinto; 05-05-2019 at 05:47 AM.
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    Ahmed.'s Avatar
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    Re: Kurdish women scarred by state violence

    Quote Originally Posted by SintoDinto View Post
    PKK terrorize both Kurds and Turks but because of the oppression of the Kurds that has existed for decades in the form of military brutalization predating the PKK Kurds often feel they are between a rock and a hard place. But PKK kill many Kurds as well even teachers, and recruit child soldiers and get soldiers addicted to drugs so yes they are very real terrorists. Just because they are in the local area does not mean people support them they hide. Also yes the PKK wanted their own state but then they wanted autonomy culturally now they want a state again when peace talks failed.

    - - - Updated - - -



    The west supports the YPG in Syria which Turks allege is an offshoot of the PKK, but which YPG and US denies but they dont support original PKK. I don't know too much about it.
    Ypg and pkk is two sides of same coin, they are working towards cessation fromTurkey and their great 'Kurdistan' they dream of
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    Re: Kurdish women scarred by state violence

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahmed. View Post
    Pkk is not an outside entity though and are from the Kurdish areas right? So they can't be compared to isis who are foreigners from other countries and who have no support of the locals, and do not all kurds support the rebellion? The woman in your article said she does not recognise the Turkish state authority anymore so it seems like they do

    Secondly did all these opressions you listed exist in the Kurdish areas before the rebellion? Or was it just a desire to form their own independent state?

    It forbidden in Islam to rebel against Muslim Rulers even if the Ruler is oppressive:


    https://islamqa.org/hanafi/daruliftaa/7879

    The break up of Muslim countries plays into the hands of the kuffars divide and conquer policy that's why the West supports the Kurdish rebels
    it says the ruler should not be challenged unless he commits open kufr or a grave sin. How is oppressing people like Gaddafi, Mubarak, al-Bashir, leader of Algeria who just got overthrown etc did not a grave sin?
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    Re: Kurdish women scarred by state violence

    Quote Originally Posted by SintoDinto View Post
    it says the ruler should not be challenged unless he commits open kufr or a grave sin. How is oppressing people like Gaddafi, Mubarak, al-Bashir, leader of Algeria who just got overthrown etc did not a grave sin?
    But any form of rebellion is forbidden; only peaceful objection is allowed to grave sin:


    The ruler’s leadership should not be challenged unless he commits Kufr or a grave sin, in which case, it should be condemned without using any violence. Also, this ruling is when one is capable of doing so.”

    Ibn Teen narrates from al-Dawudi:

    ‘The scholars have stated that if one is able to remove a transgressing leader/ruler, without causing any Fitnah and oppression, then he should be removed, otherwise it is necessary to be patient.” ( See: Ibn Hajar al-Asqalani, Fath al-Bari, Vol.13, P.11/12).

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by SintoDinto View Post
    it says the ruler should not be challenged unless he commits open kufr or a grave sin. How is oppressing people like Gaddafi, Mubarak, al-Bashir, leader of Algeria who just got overthrown etc did not a grave sin?
    And even if the kurds were rebelling against 'grave sin', they want to change it for something even more grave; Abdullah Ocalan is an athiest who started of the rebellion to form a state based on athiesm:

    http://atheistforums.com/index.php?topic=6654.0
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    Re: Kurdish women scarred by state violence

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahmed. View Post
    But any form of rebellion is forbidden; only peaceful objection is allowed to grave sin:


    The ruler’s leadership should not be challenged unless he commits Kufr or a grave sin, in which case, it should be condemned without using any violence. Also, this ruling is when one is capable of doing so.”

    Ibn Teen narrates from al-Dawudi:

    ‘The scholars have stated that if one is able to remove a transgressing leader/ruler, without causing any Fitnah and oppression, then he should be removed, otherwise it is necessary to be patient.” ( See: Ibn Hajar al-Asqalani, Fath al-Bari, Vol.13, P.11/12).

    - - - Updated - - -



    And even if the kurds were rebelling against 'grave sin', they want to change it for something even more grave; Abdullah Ocalan is an athiest who started of the rebellion to form a state based on athiesm:

    http://atheistforums.com/index.php?topic=6654.0
    Lol I'm not advocating PKK and i dont like how you keep saying Kurds are advocating this or Kurds are advocating that. Also speaking of which I thought I'd lighten the mood https://m.facebook.com/watch/?v=641620329607136&_rdr
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