How should he tell her that he wants to marry her?

[Ummu Sufyaan]

:sl:
I thought this fatwa was cute, so i figured i should post it!

I was recently informed of this site, ma'shallah. What is the correct way to approach a sister whom you intend to marry ? I've known this sister my entire life, in the same regard as my own blood sister and recently it was brought to my attention that she would be a perfect candidate for marriage. I believe she respects me, but I am unsure if she can accept me as her spouse. How can I know ? And what is the correct, halal way to approach ? I have nothing but the best intentions, yet my entire life I always felt I would marry her, yet out of respect I have never approached. My father and aunt (my mother has passed, allah yarham ha) are very fond of her and encourage me to pursue her, since they know her and her family extremly well.
Praise be to Allaah.

If a man feels that his heart is inclined towards a particular woman, he should follow the way that is permitted in Islam, which is marriage. If a person intends to marry a woman, he has to propose marriage to her through her wali (guardian), who is her father if he is alive, or one of her other close relatives. It is not permissible for a man to propose marriage to a woman who is not his mahram through ways that are not permissible according to sharee’ah, such as getting to know her or meeting her frequently or getting in touch with her often and speaking on the phone; these are means through which Iblees causes people to sin and which lead to regrettable consequences. It is not permissible for a person to justify his relationship with a girl by saying that she is like his sister and other silly excuses. You have to follow the proper channels as prescribed in Islam to marry this woman. When you propose marriage, it is o.k. if you try to win her over by giving her a gift through her wali. We ask Allaah to give us and you strength and to keep us away from haraam things. And Allaah is the Source of strength.

See also question no.2572.

Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid

Source



awwww :-[

[nebula]

thats a good fatwa, i didn't know you could give her a gift through her wali but now i do.

This reminds me of a friend, he knows this sister he likes and intends to marry her, so hes got her dads phone number and he said hes gonna phone him when he thinks hes ready.

[fasih]

hmmm nice jazakillah khayr

[Najm]

AsSalamOAlaikum WaRehmatuAllah WaBarkatuhu

So what if i present a gift to the wali, and he rejects to give the gift to the daughter? :exhausted

FiAmaaniAllah:-[

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[Yanal]

:sl:
That is the fathers choice,if he does not wish that you get married then you will have to follow him because if you don't and still get married it will be a haaram marriage.

[Najm]

:sl:
That is the fathers choice,if he does not wish that you get married then you will have to follow him because if you don't and still get married it will be a haaram marriage.

AsSalamOAlaikum WaRehmatuAllah WaBarkatuhu

:P Well maybe i should give the Wali a gift too :-[

Think outside the box bro :P

FiAmaaniAllah

[Yanal]

:sl:
Yeah to get on his good side...

I'm 13 what do you expect Im doing my best.:)

[Najm]

:sl:
Yeah to get on his good side...

I'm 13 what do you expect Im doing my best.:)

AsSalamOAlaikum WaRehmatuAllah WaBarkatuhu

Aww!!! 13....thats sooo young!!! Are you sure you should be answering such delicate issues?

Need any help, send me a PM:D

FiAmaaniAllah

[Yanal]

:sl:
Need help in what? I think I am mature enough to do so.

[Najm]

:sl:
Need help in what? I think I am mature enough to do so.

AsSalamOAlaikum WaRehmatuAllah WaBarkatuhu

You think ? Aww!!:D

I was on about.....Helping you "to get on his good side" :rollseyes

FiAmaaniAllah

[Ummu Sufyaan]

:wasalamex

AsSalamOAlaikum WaRehmatuAllah WaBarkatuhu

So what if i present a gift to the wali, and he rejects to give the gift to the daughter? :exhausted

FiAmaaniAllah:-[

save it, and give it to her later?

[Najm]

:wasalamex


save it, and give it to her later?

AsSalamOAlaikum WaRehmatuAllah WaBarkatuhu

I guess thats a fair comment. So what gift should it be?

FiAmaaniAllah:-[

[Ummu Sufyaan]

:wasalamex
are you getting married?
whatever you think she may like...jewelery? perfume? chocolates?

[Sahabiyaat]

...i know this method is prescribed in Islam and all.....but if my dad (or any dad) got a random phonecall one day from a guy wanting to marry his daughter.....first of all i would be in big trouble....get accused of setting this all up,..........even accused of having a haram relationship....and God knows what else...and all the while this guy whos just seen me, and somehow gotten my fathers no., is sitting safely on the other side, oblivious to the hell that hes just let loose.


So this cant be the best fatwa.

I think the best way is for the boys father to first, in person, acquaint himself with the girls father, then they can get talking, and the boys father can express his sons wishes.

So brothers, ringing up her dad yourself, is not a good idea.

[Ummu Sufyaan]

:sl:
^lol true, but not all guys proposing will be random :p

[Sahabiyaat]

..well if it wa sa relative, my dad would be even more freaked out as to why he is not saying this through his parents.


besides, i think no guy would have the guts to ever phone up a wali....


i mean what would you say....

guy : salam
dad: wasalam...whos this
guy: er...my name is muhammed uncle....how you doing....*starts to panic and thinks what the heck am i doing*
dad: who are you...and how did u gt my no.......?
guy: i got ur number (off so and so....),...*here goes*... and i wanted to ask for your daughters hand....


*SILENCE*

...A number of scenarios can follow..., :D

[Najm]

..well if it wa sa relative, my dad would be even more freaked out as to why he is not saying this through his parents.


besides, i think no guy would have the guts to ever phone up a wali....


i mean what would you say....

guy : salam
dad: wasalam...whos this
guy: er...my name is muhammed uncle....how you doing....*starts to panic and thinks what the heck am i doing*
dad: who are you...and how did u gt my no.......?
guy: i got ur number (off so and so....),...*here goes*... and i wanted to ask for your daughters hand....


*SILENCE*

...A number of scenarios can follow..., :D

AsSalamOAlaikum WaRehmatuAllah WaBarkatuhu

I wouldnt mind at all!!! Not my preferred way though. Id rather get my dad to do it, because he sould be able to ask better than me :embarrass

If the guy has done nothing wrong, then i dont see any other reason to panic!!! :rolleyes: Plus i would admire the guy's directness, the fact that he doesnt want his marriage process to waffle. He wants to simply get it done without all the unrequired hassle


guy : salam
dad: wasalam...whos this
guy: my name is muhammed ali!!! uncle....how you doing....
dad: who are you...and how did u gt my no.......?
guy: i got ur number from your best friend and i wanted to ask for your daughters hand in marriage....
dad: oh really what qualifications you have etc etc etc

15 mins talk on the phone about the guy and gurl later....

dad: Son when will you be free to sort out the arrangements, ill bring the nikkah papers, and you bring your family over.
guy: Ok uncle, im glad to be part of you family, and i will take care of all you daughters needs, inshaAllah.
Dad: MarshaAllah, ill meet you soon

*JOY!*

:embarrass

FiAmaaniAllah

[convert]

...i know this method is prescribed in Islam and all.....but if my dad (or any dad) got a random phonecall one day from a guy wanting to marry his daughter.....first of all i would be in big trouble....get accused of setting this all up,..........even accused of having a haram relationship....and God knows what else...and all the while this guy whos just seen me, and somehow gotten my fathers no., is sitting safely on the other side, oblivious to the hell that hes just let loose.


So this cant be the best fatwa.

I think the best way is for the boys father to first, in person, acquaint himself with the girls father, then they can get talking, and the boys father can express his sons wishes.

So brothers, ringing up her dad yourself, is not a good idea.

Yeah, that would mean converts would never get married. Which is generally what happens anyway. Then again, without the community support, converts generally don't know any sisters' fathers or even sisters, for that matter. Its a vicious, lonely cycle.

[Sahabiyaat]

AsSalamOAlaikum WaRehmatuAllah WaBarkatuhu

I wouldnt mind at all!!! Not my preferred way though. Id rather get my dad to do it, because he sould be able to ask better than me :embarrass

If the guy has done nothing wrong, then i dont see any other reason to panic!!! :rolleyes: Plus i would admire the guy's directness, the fact that he doesnt want his marriage process to waffle. He wants to simply get it done without all the unrequired hassle


guy : salam
dad: wasalam...whos this
guy: my name is muhammed ali!!! uncle....how you doing....
dad: who are you...and how did u gt my no.......?
guy: i got ur number from your best friend and i wanted to ask for your daughters hand in marriage....
dad: oh really what qualifications you have etc etc etc

15 mins talk on the phone about the guy and gurl later....

dad: Son when will you be free to sort out the arrangements, ill bring the nikkah papers, and you bring your family over.
guy: Ok uncle, im glad to be part of you family, and i will take care of all you daughters needs, inshaAllah.
Dad: MarshaAllah, ill meet you soon

*JOY!*

:embarrass

FiAmaaniAllah

:D Love the optimism, but najm to earth! lol.

Yeah, that would mean converts would never get married. Which is generally what happens anyway. Then again, without the community support, converts generally don't know any sisters' fathers or even sisters, for that matter. Its a vicious, lonely cycle.

what about....a converts daughter?!
bet u didnt think of that one!
He will understand exactly what ur going thru.....now go on a hunt to find one.

[convert]

what about....a converts daughter?!
bet u didnt think of that one!
He will understand exactly what ur going thru.....now go on a hunt to find one.

I have, and its hard to find such a sister. Especially given the fact that a great portion of us don't have the community support to know which uncles have daughters or not.

For example: I have been muslim for a few years now and I know no sisters. They have purdah pretty well done at my home masjid.

[Sahabiyaat]

actually revert sisters are not so strict about their hijaab as their still getting used to the idea, so it shouldnt be such a problem to spot some.

It would be ideal for you as your family is still non muslim and so would hers be and she would be in exactly the same position as you.and apporaching her family with urs shouldnt be so bad.

difference is, in the asian culture, boys can marry anyone they want mostly, and revert girls are near the top of the list of preferences, ...i guess they love the idea of having a 'white' wife. :rolleyes:, and thus they are getting snatched up pretty fast :D

So u better get in there first!

[Najm]

:D Love the optimism, but najm to earth! lol.

AsSalamOAlaikum WaRehmatuAllah WaBarkatuhu

I know what you mean. Really marriage can be that simple.

check this out....

http://www.islamicboard.com/family-s...ml#post1140259

It can be as simple as this!!!!

Parents are too pushy lol, just give the spouses what they want!! :embarrass

FiAmaaniAllah

[convert]

actually revert sisters are not so strict about their hijaab as their still getting used to the idea, so it shouldnt be such a problem to spot some.

It would be ideal for you as your family is still non muslim and so would hers be and she would be in exactly the same position as you.and apporaching her family with urs shouldnt be so bad.

difference is, in the asian culture, boys can marry anyone they want mostly, and revert girls are near the top of the list of preferences, ...i guess they love the idea of having a 'white' wife. :rolleyes:, and thus they are getting snatched up pretty fast :D

So u better get in there first!

I'm not interested in a non-practicing sister.

I have noticed this phenomenon. "White convert sister takes shahadah today, is married tomorrow."

The worst part is white converts don't get looked at because the convert sisters wans an arab or desi brother to teach them the deen.

I reiterate: how can I beat them to the punch when I don't have any community connections?

I agree with your advice in theory but practically it won't be too effective and it is frustrating as all get out.

I even asked around my masjid about trying to find a wife (either convert or born muslim) and was told they look out for their own and keep it in their families first. That kinda grinds my gears (so to speak).

[Sahabiyaat]

MashaAllah :) .the guy was pious, which is worth more than any amount of riyaals. i would have forgiven him the mahr for his piety.

May Allah make it easy for us all. Ameen.

[Sahabiyaat]

I'm not interested in a non-practicing sister.

this does not mean that she has to be non practising, maybe she is just finding her footing in the new faith, just as you once did :)

I have noticed this phenomenon. "White convert sister takes shahadah today, is married tomorrow."

ah the advantages of being a white female convert!

I even asked around my masjid about trying to find a wife (either convert or born muslim) and was told they look out for their own and keep it in their families first. That kinda grinds my gears (so to speak)

darn it.

....the problem for them is the mixing of a muslim and non muslim family, and the associated arkwardness and difficulties. As i am told, when u marry, its like you marry the family more than the man.

I gta put it brutally.It luks like no uncle jee will be giving his daughter to you any time this millenium.discriminating racist people that we asians are.

get a tan, and deny ur a convert. :D..

[جوري]

I have, and its hard to find such a sister. Especially given the fact that a great portion of us don't have the community support to know which uncles have daughters or not.

For example: I have been muslim for a few years now and I know no sisters. They have purdah pretty well done at my home masjid.

akhi you do know that there is a sister on board looking to get married (see advise and support)
http://www.islamicboard.com/advice-s...nt-let-me.html


.. by no means am I suggesting you proposition her..
I am merely stating that, your chance will come insha'Allah, just like her chance will come.. make your intent known to Allah and leave the rest to Allah swt..
He'll find you, your special someone..




p.s. on gift giving through wali.. I thought that was common?

should get something respectful at first, like a book you loved (she'd know more about your interests)

second gift should always be a gaming system (nintendo DS) lol just kidding :p

:w:

[convert]

this does not mean that she has to be non practising, maybe she is just finding her footing in the new faith, just as you once did

well, lets put it this way: if she has issues with the hijab she will most likely have issues with my beard (its kinda big)

....the problem for them is the mixing of a muslim and non muslim family, and the associated arkwardness and difficulties. As i am told, when u marry, its like you marry the family more than the man.

I gta put it brutally.It luks like no uncle jee will be giving his daughter to you any time this millenium.discriminating racist people that we asians are.

get a tan, and deny ur a convert. :D..

its ok, i realize that. my problem is to not let it carry over and make me bitter towards people for having that attitude.

for the longest time, people at my masjid assumed i was turkish (i guess i look like a turk). one uncle even took to calling me abu turki for while until he could remember my name

akhi you do know that there is a sister on board looking to get married (see advise and support)

i do not know if i am fully comfortable with internet proposals but thank you for the advice

[aadil77]

well what if you're about 18 have no degree (not yet), no job (not a proper one) and no house, how do convince a wali to let you marry his daughter?

[جوري]

well what if you're about 18 have no degree (not yet), no job (not a proper one) and no house, how do convince a wali to let you marry his daughter?

you don't, unless you have some financial independence, which is one of the conditions that need to be met before you decide on marriage.. you should be able to support a family financially above all...

Times have changed unfortunately--
the best thing is to be forth coming and let the father and daughter know of your situation, see if she accepts you under these conditions while working on attaining all your afore mentioned..

:w:

[aadil77]

you don't, unless you have some financial independence, which is one of the conditions that need to be met before you decide on marriage.. you should be able to support a family financially above all...

:w:

Yh I thought so,

Don't want to go too off topic, but islamically do you have to be able to financially support her at the time of marriage or does it totally depend on what you've agreed on?

[جوري]

Yh I thought so,

Don't want to go too off topic, but islamically do you have to be able to financially support her at the time of marriage or does it totally depend on what you've agreed on?

I think it is relative.. I am not a scholar... but some women are able to manage on $250 a month, and some can only manage at $2500 or $250,000 month .. so I think it depends on the woman? :-[

May Allah swt bless you with someone who is content with what you offer and makes mercy and kindness flourish between you!

:w:

[convert]

I think it is relative.. I am not a scholar... but some women are able to manage on $250 a month, and some can only manage at $2500 or $250,000 month .. so I think it depends on the woman?

May Allah protect me from the woman who demands $250K per month.

Ameen.

[Najm]

I think it is relative.. I am not a scholar... but some women are able to manage on $250 a month, and some can only manage at $2500 or $250,000 month .. so I think it depends on the woman? :-[

May Allah swt bless you with someone who is content with what you offer and makes mercy and kindness flourish between you!

:w:

AsSalamOAlaikum WaRehmatuAllah WaBarkatuhu

I noticed a lot of the times the pushy parents get involved, and explore the materialism route never the deen route!!!. And the pushy parents dont really let the woman say what she wants, needs and desires.

So if i find one, i should give a gift, which i give to my dad to pass it on to her wali??:-[ What the main things to agree on to put in the marriage contract?

Its summer and everyones getting married ( including addil?) :X


FiAmaaniAllah

[جوري]

May Allah protect me from the woman who demands $250K per month.

Ameen.

May Allah bless you with $250k a month so that you can afford to help your ummah and support a lovely wife..

:w:

[Najm]

May Allah bless you with $250k a month so that you can afford to help your ummah and support a lovely wife..

:w:

AsSalamOAlaikum WaRehmatuAllah WaBarkatuhu

Ameen!!!

FiAmaaniAllah

[aadil77]

I think it is relative.. I am not a scholar... but some women are able to manage on $250 a month, and some can only manage at $2500 or $250,000 month .. so I think it depends on the woman? :-[

May Allah swt bless you with someone who is content with what you offer and makes mercy and kindness flourish between you!

:w:

JazakhAllah, :D I never said I was getting married well not any time soon anyway, lol the biggest step for me is to first convince my mum about it - which could take a few years

And Jesus who In the world would need 250 grand to survive a month :ooh:, a woman like that would need a slap

[aadil77]

May Allah protect me from the woman who demands $250K per month.

Ameen.

lool ;D, you wouldn't have a chance because the mahr would be a multiple of that

[convert]

May Allah bless you with $250k a month so that you can afford to help your ummah and support a lovely wife..

:w:

More money, more problems. I'm happy with what I've got (its a better than average salary too). Besides, if a woman needs that type of money thats kinda a telltale sign of a materialistic woman... and she wouldn't make it past the q&a portion of the courtship phase.

[HopeFul]

Awww very cute!!!

indeed I regularly go through that website too, the moment I saw the question I recognised!!

JazakAlah!!

P.S this is my first post here!!! any ideas how to browse around? Its a very good forum:)

[Najm]

:sl:

You have to follow the proper channels as prescribed in Islam to marry this woman. When you propose marriage, it is o.k. if you try to win her over by giving her a gift through her wali.

AsSalamOAlaikum WaRehmatuAllah WaBarkatuhu

I dont think parents do it by the propers channels of Islam.. I remmember the wali rejected alot of proposal because he wanted to be the one to find the spouse lol

You cant win her over, if the wali rejects. Lol what if you win her over, but the wali isnt..........*Doomed* :-[

FiAmaaniAllah

[جوري]

JazakhAllah, :D I never said I was getting married well not any time soon anyway, lol the biggest step for me is to first convince my mum about it - which could take a few years

And Jesus who In the world would need 250 grand to survive a month :ooh:, a woman like that would need a slap

it is an exaggeration of course, but when I say she needs, I really mean it as management of the entire household not merely on her vanity (also assuming your wife isn't financially independent herself) nonetheless, It is a man's duty and obligation to cover, groceries, rent, private schools for the kids, Islamic classes, car insurance, trips to the doctor, clothing for everyone, a percentage to charity etc..
Also depending on the city or state where you live, what requires only $200 a week in one town can require $400 in another.. you see it isn't etched in stone.. there really is no baseline.. the $2500 sounds more realistic but my feelings are that at least double that is needed to support a family with all the needs given above plus whatever problems arise, and God knows do they ever arise on weekly basis-- that is why more often than not, you find two parties working instead of one.. although it is still the man's responsibility to secure all these for his family...

and Allah swt knows best

:w:

[جوري]

More money, more problems. I'm happy with what I've got (its a better than average salary too). Besides, if a woman needs that type of money thats kinda a telltale sign of a materialistic woman... and she wouldn't make it past the q&a portion of the courtship phase.

most divorces indeed occur an issue over finances.. I think people mismanage or have an unrealistic idea of expenses needed in a marriage and today's age.. and I am not even talking luxury, but just the bare minimum..

Consider you my friend whose aunt was diagnosed with breast cancer, she didn't have insurance and her family spent $37,000 out of pocket and I promise you, those were only to cover the bear minimum..

You just never know what curves life might throw your way.. indeed I meant the above as an exaggeration but they can be a very realistic financial burden to someone unprepared and not necessarily because your spouse is a greedy woman either...

So may Allah swt save us the ills of this world and grant us all righteous partners in marriage.. those of us who are married and those who are not

ameen

:w:

[Sahabiyaat]

it is an exaggeration of course, but when I say she needs, I really mean it as management of the entire household not merely on her vanity :w:

phew.:exhausted

i thought u meant 250k for only her wardrobe and makeup lol. (indeed a woman like that would need more than one slap to put her straight!..im all for domesic violence here :D) jokinggg..

[جوري]

Awww very cute!!!

indeed I regularly go through that website too, the moment I saw the question I recognised!!

JazakAlah!!

P.S this is my first post here!!! any ideas how to browse around? Its a very good forum:)

:welcome: aboard.. love your name :D

:w: