PDA

View Full Version : The Event: How Racist are you?



Uthman
10-29-2009, 03:16 PM
Channel 4, Thursday 29th October, 10:00 PM

Are we all more racist than we realise or would like to admit?

For this Channel 4 documentary Jane Elliott, a controversial former schoolteacher from Ohio, is recreating the shocking exercise she used forty years ago to teach her nine-year-old pupils about prejudice.

Elliott is asking thirty adult British volunteers - men and women of different ages and backgrounds - to experience inequality based on their eye colour to show how susceptible we can all be to bigotry, and what it feels like to be on the other side of arbitrary discrimination.

Does Elliott's exercise still have something to teach us four decades on and in a different country? Presented by Krishnan Guru-Murthy, the exercise is observed throughout by two expert psychologists, Prof Dominic Abrams and Dr Funké Baffour, who will be unpicking the behaviour on display.

Source
Reply

Login/Register to hide ads. Scroll down for more posts
OurIslamic
10-29-2009, 03:23 PM
Racism is bad....
Reply

Woodrow
10-29-2009, 03:52 PM
Originally Posted by OurIslamic
Racism is bad....
That is true. But sadly all humans are racist or prejudiced. The cure is for each of us to recognize and admit we have this fault and work to keep us from acting unfairly or with bigotry.

Fighting the Greater Jihad is the most difficult and the longest battle we will face daily. May Alaah(swt) grant all of us the strength and wisdom to see and recognize the enemy that lives within each of us. May he help us in our struggle to defeat our inner enemy.
Reply

Eliphaz
10-29-2009, 04:18 PM
Thanks for that!

I will definitely be watching and look forward to discussing it. I definitely feel that racism is still a major problem within our society. There are so many incidents of "casual" racism amongst youths and adults nowadays, in the office, in schools, etc, that people just have kind of accepted it as the normal way to be.
Reply

Welcome, Guest!
Hey there! Looks like you're enjoying the discussion, but you're not signed up for an account.

When you create an account, you can participate in the discussions and share your thoughts. You also get notifications, here and via email, whenever new posts are made. And you can like posts and make new friends.
Sign Up
Raphael
10-29-2009, 04:21 PM
This might sound odd, but Asians from the Indian subcontinent are quite racist themselves. They literally slander each other based on variations on skin pigmentation. A light skin vs dark skin battle, and I'm talking about people who are ethnically the same!

Crazy stuff. :hmm:
Reply

Blackpool
10-29-2009, 06:05 PM
Racism is far from healthy but I find muslims to be very selective on race when it comes to marriage. I doubt many here would marry a white person born in the UK.
Reply

Woodrow
10-29-2009, 06:23 PM
Originally Posted by Blackpool
Racism is far from healthy but I find muslims to be very selective on race when it comes to marriage. I doubt many here would marry a white person born in the UK.
I doubt if you see it as such, but that is a racist statement.

More than a few of the Muslims on this forum are white people born in the UK. I believe you will find that for most of the Muslim members piety of a future spouse is more important than race.

However, that does not mean any of us do not have prejudiced or racist bias. To some extent we all do, even you. The question is do we control our prejudices or do they control us.
Reply

M.B
10-29-2009, 11:11 PM
:sl:

it was soo funny just watched that it was amazing.


:w:
Reply

Woodrow
10-29-2009, 11:17 PM
Originally Posted by M.B
:sl:

it was soo funny just watched that it was amazing.


:w:
Did I miss a link to of a video or something???

Oh, I see you are talking about the experiment reported on the first page. I agree it is funny, but it is very sad when we realise people are like that. All people, not jus the ones in the experiment.
Reply

czgibson
10-29-2009, 11:23 PM
Greetings,
Originally Posted by Woodrow
Did I miss a link to of a video or something???
It was on Channel 4 in the UK and it finished 20 minutes ago.

Here is a link to it on the Channel 4 website. It may or may not be possible to view it outside the UK, I'm not sure.

Peace
Reply

Muezzin
10-29-2009, 11:32 PM
Originally Posted by Blackpool
Racism is far from healthy but I find muslims to be very selective on race when it comes to marriage. I doubt many here would marry a white person born in the UK.
For the word 'Muslims' substitute 'Indo-Pakistani Asians' and it's true that certain members of that ethnic group are prejudiced against people outside that ethnic group. Heck, even Indians and Pakistanis hate each other.

I personally am colour-blind to any potential wife's ethnicity so long as she can fluently speak a language we share in common and is not a dumbass.
Reply

Raphael
10-29-2009, 11:35 PM
Originally Posted by Muezzin
I personally am colour-blind to any potential wife's ethnicity so long as she can fluently speak a language we share in common and is not a dumbass.
Seems to me you've ruled out a lot of people! Why so picky? :D
Reply

The_Prince
10-29-2009, 11:35 PM
Originally Posted by Blackpool
Racism is far from healthy but I find muslims to be very selective on race when it comes to marriage. I doubt many here would marry a white person born in the UK.
lol this is funny, you say Muslims are selective and wudnt marry whites, yet when i go to EDL forums and many other English forums they keep saying how they shouldnt let their WHITE DAUGHTERS marry the Muslims cause the Muslims haveeeeeeeeeee a plot to take white women and breed with them!

and just for the record, two of my friends who are gulf arabs are the sons of WHITE mothers, one welsh, and one scottish.
Reply

GuestFellow
10-30-2009, 01:30 AM
Originally Posted by Blackpool
Racism is far from healthy but I find muslims to be very selective on race when it comes to marriage. I doubt many here would marry a white person born in the UK.
Not really. I would only marry a Muslim lady for obvious reasons. Race does not matter to me. I know from my cultural background they would prefer me to marry a women who is Asian but that is because she would be more familiar with our customs.

My cousin is married to a white women....believe it or not she wears the Burka.
Reply

Ummu Sufyaan
10-30-2009, 01:43 AM
Originally Posted by Blackpool
Racism is far from healthy but I find muslims to be very selective on race when it comes to marriage. I doubt many here would marry a white person born in the UK.
they are very few people-Muslim or not, Asian or not-who dont let different cultres marry into thier family.
i have 2 neighbors both non-Muslim...one was Greek the other Yugoslavian. he loved her, she loved him, but they were forced to break up due to their cultural differences.
Reply

Mysterious Uk
10-30-2009, 06:26 PM
I wish this was tried out on the BNP members when they were kids, may have lead to them being a bit less racist.

I was very surprised to hear that school teacher saying she was shocked to see pink skin when a black kid fell over and scraped her skin. She was expecting to see black skin.. erm why does it even matter? ethnic minorities are not aliens!

Racism is very subtle in Britain, there have been SO many occasions where i would be in a line holding some clothes or food (ready to pay for it) and a person would just walk straight in front of you. I obviously give them a look and they say "oh sorry were you in the line".. Well duh, if a person is standing with shopping in a line you would think they were in the line. I'm probs reading to much into it but i felt they thought i was some confused non-english speaking person standing around for no reason.
Reply

Cabdullahi
10-30-2009, 06:37 PM
some Arabs to me are very racist but every human being has a bit of racism in them some more than others
Reply

Mysterious Uk
10-30-2009, 06:39 PM
Originally Posted by Abdullahii
some Arabs to me are very racist
I think evrybody in the world is a bit racist.. some extemely more than others.
Reply

Raphael
10-30-2009, 06:41 PM
If you are Indian, Pakistani, Bangladeshi etc, and think England is racist, I urge you to try working in the middle east for a little while.

You'll want to jump back to Britain in a hurry!
Reply

Uthman
10-30-2009, 08:10 PM
Originally Posted by Raphael
If you are Indian, Pakistani, Bangladeshi etc, and think England is racist, I urge you to try working in the middle east for a little while.

You'll want to jump back to Britain in a hurry!
True. Racism here in Britain is a little more discrete whereas in the Middle East, I guess they tend to stare at you if you are different. Is that right?
Reply

IAmZamzam
10-30-2009, 08:11 PM
I'm sorry but my blood positively boils at this "every human being is racist at least to some degree" nonsense, which is itself a stereotype just by definition (and even for a stereotype a particularly unfair, ridiculous and blatantly untrue one), and therefore itself just as prejudiced a thing to say as hurling a racial slur at somebody would be.
Reply

Raphael
10-30-2009, 08:26 PM
Originally Posted by Uthmān
True. Racism here in Britain is a little more discrete whereas in the Middle East, I guess they tend to stare at you if you are different. Is that right?
Over there, if you enter a shop, and wait in a cue to be served, and an Arab walks in, the Arab is automatically served first. Regardless of how many Arabs walk in. No questions asked. They tend to generally look at the people from Pakistan etc as lower class peasants. Yes and they make no intention of hiding it from their looks.

Some Arabs are incredibly kind though, so you do get a massive variation. I guess it depends how you were raised. However the overt racism there is much more intense.
Reply

GuestFellow
10-30-2009, 08:37 PM
Originally Posted by Raphael
Over there, if you enter a shop, and wait in a cue to be served, and an Arab walks in, the Arab is automatically served first. Regardless of how many Arabs walk in. No questions asked. They tend to generally look at the people from Pakistan etc as lower class peasants. Yes and they make no intention of hiding it from their looks.

Some Arabs are incredibly kind though, so you do get a massive variation. I guess it depends how you were raised. However the overt racism there is much more intense.
I was thinking of moving to Saudi Arabia when I get older once I had passed my exams however...I did some research and I got put off. I heard of many stories like the one you mentioned above.

Britain is not at all racist. It has many laws to tackle racism. It is unfortunately not recognised how much hard work they put into the system to ensure equality. Britain sets a very good example!
Reply

Uthman
10-30-2009, 08:50 PM
Originally Posted by Guestfellow
Britain is not at all racist. It has many laws to tackle racism. It is unfortunately not recognised how much hard work they put into the system to ensure equality. Britain sets a very good example!
I agree that the British government and the legal system are not racist, but I think racism amongst the people is widespread and some of it is institutionalised, the London Metropolitan police force being one example of this.
Reply

Eliphaz
10-30-2009, 11:31 PM
Lol watched the programme last night.

I love how the hijabi and the other Muslim guy were totally silent the whole time (or maybe edited out) until the last five minutes. It was almost like they had made a mutual agreement: 'let's just not get involved in this, we have enough problems to deal with!'

I agree with the psychologist woman that all white people are brainwashed from birth to believe they are superior, it is a shame but its true. It is not something they are at fault over though. I think this is the point the schoolteacher woman and even the brown-eyed dissenter woman couldn't understand. It is an invisible issue to them so they couldn't see the point of the demonstration.

I was really peeved that the exam experiment was interrupted, that would have been priceless (and educational of course)!
Reply

Raphael
10-30-2009, 11:35 PM
Originally Posted by Omar_21:30
I was really peeved that the exam experiment was interrupted, that would have been priceless (and educational of course)!
She was trying to be a hero!
Reply

Eliphaz
10-30-2009, 11:44 PM
Originally Posted by Raphael
She was trying to be a hero!
Stupid brown-eyed people... :p


EDIT: Just in case anyone doesn't get it, that was a joke.
Reply

julesfly
10-31-2009, 12:42 AM
Just watched the panorama special - 'Undercover hate on the doorstep'. I was actually in tears! Disgusting. The program shows 2 undercover muslim reporters moving into a Bristol community and the racist reaction from youths in the area (not all of the community acted in this abhorrent way). One thing that struck me was that the area was pretty socially deprived. I have become aware from views expressed on the forum that alot of the more radical Muslims that we see in the media carrying placards or whatever (who do not really represent the muslim community on the whole), who have stricter ideas re women and infidels etc. are from poorer rural regions across the globe and it struck me that this is not a religious or even cultural problem but purely social. It seems that if you feel you have not been given the advantages others may have, that you will lash out at anyone you can. This might sound a bit naive but it has only just struck me. A well known phrase sprung to mind - ''no-one below me fancy that, all i can do is kick the cat.''
Reply

Woodrow
10-31-2009, 02:19 PM
Originally Posted by Yahya Sulaiman
I'm sorry but my blood positively boils at this "every human being is racist at least to some degree" nonsense, which is itself a stereotype just by definition (and even for a stereotype a particularly unfair, ridiculous and blatantly untrue one), and therefore itself just as prejudiced a thing to say as hurling a racial slur at somebody would be.
Do I detect prejudice in your statement? Seems to be a touch of racism against those who believe all people are racist.
Reply

Raphael
10-31-2009, 03:47 PM
Originally Posted by Woodrow
Do I detect prejudice in your statement? Seems to be a touch of racism against those who believe all people are racist.
I love how the word racist is thrown about nowadays. :nervous:

I even heard a guy shout 'racist' at a bus driver, who told him he didn't have change for a 20 - and they were both white!
Reply

Woodrow
10-31-2009, 04:03 PM
Originally Posted by Raphael
I love how the word racist is thrown about nowadays. :nervous:

I even heard a guy shout 'racist' at a bus driver, who told him he didn't have change for a 20 - and they were both white!
Racism is over used. What is being called racism these days more or less seems to equate to prejudism. I find that many people today do use racist when what is meant is prejudiced. But, as the language changes, we have to flow with the changes. Many words I used in my younger days have now changed to very different meaning from what they meant 50-60 years ago.
Reply

Raphael
10-31-2009, 04:11 PM
Originally Posted by Woodrow
Racism is over used. What is being called racism these days more or less seems to equate to prejudism. I find that many people today do use racist when what is meant is prejudiced. But, as the language changes, we have to flow with the changes. Many words I used in my younger days have now changed to very different meaning from what they meant 50-60 years ago.
Dude I thought you were a teenager!
Reply

Uthman
10-31-2009, 04:15 PM
Nope. He's our wise Uncle Woodrow. :)
Reply

Woodrow
10-31-2009, 04:35 PM
Originally Posted by Raphael
Dude I thought you were a teenager!
When I was a teenager was probably before your parents were born. My youngest Daughter is over 40 years old.
Reply

Raphael
10-31-2009, 04:38 PM
Originally Posted by Woodrow
When I was a teenager was probably before your parents were born. My youngest Daughter is over 40 years old.
Have you lived in the States your whole life?
Reply

Woodrow
10-31-2009, 06:47 PM
Originally Posted by Raphael
Have you lived in the States your whole life?
Far from it. I've lived at least half my life outside of the States. A good bit in North Africa and the Mideast. I've actually lived in Arab speaking nations longer than a couple of our Arabic members. Although my Arabic is still poor.
Reply

Re.TiReD
10-31-2009, 07:14 PM


(Sorry I just love this icon :$)
Reply

Iris
10-31-2009, 08:55 PM
Originally Posted by Raphael
If you are Indian, Pakistani, Bangladeshi etc, and think England is racist, I urge you to try working in the middle east for a little while.

You'll want to jump back to Britain in a hurry!
I totally agree.
Reply

Mujahideen92
10-31-2009, 09:31 PM
Yeah recently my aunt married a white Muslim. He is a very good person and a good Muslim but her parents wasnt happy because he was white
Reply

JaffaCake
10-31-2009, 11:06 PM
Originally Posted by Omar_21:30
I agree with the psychologist woman that all white people are brainwashed from birth to believe they are superior, it is a shame but its true.
I'm not even sure how to respond to that, the accusation itself is so mind-boggling.
Reply

Eliphaz
10-31-2009, 11:25 PM
Originally Posted by JaffaCake
I'm not even sure how to respond to that, the accusation itself is so mind-boggling.
I'm not accusing white people, but rather the system: the media presenting ethnic minorities as a problem, the European-centric version of history taught in schools, the entertainment industry promoting lighter-skinned heroes and heroines, the list goes on. The whole thing is creates a superiority complex in white people without them even knowing it.

And I may have been hasty in agreeing with her "all" but I would still say a "great many". Some are able to break out of that but some aren't. As much as I thought the woman was a crazy witch, this phrase did have some truth in it.
Reply

Iris
10-31-2009, 11:28 PM
^And sadly enough, I agree to that too.

In some of these middleeastern countries, the 'whites' have separate passport controls and get to go faster. Heck one airport has the best,most elite terminal, Just for whites.
Reply

Woodrow
10-31-2009, 11:54 PM
I am now curious as to what defines a White person? Where did white people originate? Since we all have the same ancestors at what point in time did any group come to be identified as White?


The answers to these questions can be answered in a short review of modern history. Before I post any answers. I would like to see what you think or know.
Reply

GuestFellow
11-01-2009, 12:07 AM
Originally Posted by Woodrow
I am now curious as to what defines a White person? Where did white people originate? Since we all have the same ancestors at what point in time did any group come to be identified as White?


The answers to these questions can be answered in a short review of modern history. Before I post any answers. I would like to see what you think or know.
:sl:

I'm not sure. All I know is the colour of your skin is affected by the sun. Those who live in hot countries are more darker than those who live in cold countries.... :/

A white person skin can get darker by visiting a hot country...
Reply

IAmZamzam
11-01-2009, 08:04 AM
Originally Posted by Woodrow
Do I detect prejudice in your statement? Seems to be a touch of racism against those who believe all people are racist.
That makes absolutely no sense at all if it's a serious statement and if it's a joke then I'm sorry but it's just not funny.
Reply

Woodrow
11-01-2009, 08:24 AM
Originally Posted by Yahya Sulaiman
That makes absolutely no sense at all if it's a serious statement and if it's a joke then I'm sorry but it's just not funny.
It was not intended to be funny. I apologize if it makes no sense.

My point was that each and every one of is is prejudiced and biased to some extent.

When each of us recognizes that quality in our selves we can use it as a tool to reduce some of the tensions in communications with those who we perceive to differ from ourselves.
Reply

JaffaCake
11-01-2009, 12:31 PM
Originally Posted by Omar_21:30
I'm not accusing white people, but rather the system: the media presenting ethnic minorities as a problem, the European-centric version of history taught in schools, the entertainment industry promoting lighter-skinned heroes and heroines, the list goes on. The whole thing is creates a superiority complex in white people without them even knowing it.

And I may have been hasty in agreeing with her "all" but I would still say a "great many". Some are able to break out of that but some aren't. As much as I thought the woman was a crazy witch, this phrase did have some truth in it.
1. I don't ever recall the media presenting ethnic minorities as a problem. Immigrants yes, but that's not on the basis of race, but economics. People are just as upset by large numbers of white (e.g. Polish) immigrants as non-white.

2. European centric history taught in Europe is... understandable, no? There are limits to the amount that can be taught in a certain time, and trying to teach a little of every culture in existence would almost certainly lead to students receiving just a superficial outline of most topics, doesn't it make sense for European students to learn European history? Look at the UK GCSE history syllabus, it has sections on world affairs including colonisation and the Arab-Israeli conflict.

3. Entertainment industry.. I had a look at this myself and here are a few numbers (UK specific).

Overall the white population is about 92%, so non-whites are about 8%

70% of this weeks UK top ten singles are non-white artists
30% of Premiership footballers are non-white
40% of the England football team are non-white
23% of the England cricket team are non-white
~20-25% of BBC presenters are non-white

Are you just talking about Hollywood films or entertainment in general? Any counter examples?
Reply

Raphael
11-01-2009, 01:14 PM
Originally Posted by Iris
^And sadly enough, I agree to that too.

In some of these middleeastern countries, the 'whites' have separate passport controls and get to go faster. Heck one airport has the best,most elite terminal, Just for whites.
What?! For real?
Reply

Iris
11-01-2009, 01:21 PM
^Yeah, in Dubai, it's there. (Okay my bad it's not really white-only, but more like exclusive for all europeans ands americans, that's racism!!) Middle eastern countries Really put down the Subcontinental people as compared to the respect they give to Americans etc. I don't even know why.
Reply

Woodrow
11-01-2009, 01:43 PM
Originally Posted by Iris
^Yeah, in Dubai, it's there. (Okay my bad it's not really white-only, but more like exclusive for all europeans ands americans, that's racism!!) Middle eastern countries Really put down the Subcontinental people as compared to the respect they give to Americans etc. I don't even know why.
One thing I found to be common in some Mid-Eastern countries is Non-Arab Non-Muslims are treated very well but, Non-Arab Muslims are treated poorly. Sadly it is not uncommon for Muslims thinking they will find the strongest support among Arabs too often find themselves treated poorly.

I should point out this is not true in all predominately Arab nations. To be fair I have actualy seen the opposite occur. It is much more common for an Arabic Muslim to be treated poorly in Non Arabic Muslim countries ie: Turkey, Iran, Syria, Jordan
Reply

S_87
11-01-2009, 01:55 PM
Originally Posted by Raphael
This might sound odd, but Asians from the Indian subcontinent are quite racist themselves. They literally slander each other based on variations on skin pigmentation. A light skin vs dark skin battle, and I'm talking about people who are ethnically the same!

Crazy stuff. :hmm:
veru true and unfortunately not only asians. dark skinned is seen as ugly even by people who are dark themselves. Why anyone would hate the skin Allah blessed them with :hmm: ?
Reply

Woodrow
11-01-2009, 02:18 PM
Originally Posted by amani
veru true and unfortunately not only asians. dark skinned is seen as ugly even by people who are dark themselves. Why anyone would hate the skin Allah blessed them with :hmm: ?
To be ridiculous to the extreme Here in the US Dark Skinned people spend a fortune on bleaching creams to makes their skin lighter and white people spend just as much going to tanning salons to make their skin darker. Nobody ever seems to be happy with what they have. If Allaah(swt) had made us with black and wite stripes, we would have people hollering "I'm better I'm white with black stripes but you are black with white stripes."
Reply

Raphael
11-01-2009, 02:43 PM
Originally Posted by Iris
^Yeah, in Dubai, it's there. (Okay my bad it's not really white-only, but more like exclusive for all europeans ands americans, that's racism!!) Middle eastern countries Really put down the Subcontinental people as compared to the respect they give to Americans etc. I don't even know why.
I guess it shows in their public policies as well!


Originally Posted by Woodrow
One thing I found to be common in some Mid-Eastern countries is Non-Arab Non-Muslims are treated very well but, Non-Arab Muslims are treated poorly. Sadly it is not uncommon for Muslims thinking they will find the strongest support among Arabs too often find themselves treated poorly.
Sad isn't the word Woodrow!


Originally Posted by amani
veru true and unfortunately not only asians. dark skinned is seen as ugly even by people who are dark themselves. Why anyone would hate the skin Allah blessed them with :hmm: ?
Its usually the culture that they are brought up in that make them feel that way. I have heard that the reason that some women what to be lighter maybe because someone in their family, like a sister, cousin etc, have light skin - and everyone sings praise about her looks, but she is ignored.

Did you hear that Asian magazines sometimes use white women and dress them up in Asian clothes to promote the desire for lighter skin?!!

Its hard to say racists discriminate against skin colour when their own community is at it too!
Reply

Eliphaz
11-02-2009, 02:02 AM
Originally Posted by JaffaCake
1. I don't ever recall the media presenting ethnic minorities as a problem. Immigrants yes, but that's not on the basis of race, but economics. People are just as upset by large numbers of white (e.g. Polish) immigrants as non-white.

2. European centric history taught in Europe is... understandable, no? There are limits to the amount that can be taught in a certain time, and trying to teach a little of every culture in existence would almost certainly lead to students receiving just a superficial outline of most topics, doesn't it make sense for European students to learn European history? Look at the UK GCSE history syllabus, it has sections on world affairs including colonisation and the Arab-Israeli conflict.

3. Entertainment industry.. I had a look at this myself and here are a few numbers (UK specific).

Overall the white population is about 92%, so non-whites are about 8%

70% of this weeks UK top ten singles are non-white artists
30% of Premiership footballers are non-white
40% of the England football team are non-white
23% of the England cricket team are non-white
~20-25% of BBC presenters are non-white

Are you just talking about Hollywood films or entertainment in general? Any counter examples?
1. Firstly do you watch the same news channels as everyone else, and secondly do you think any news network in its right mind would openly admit to its coverage being "on the basis of race"?

2. I am not saying that the curriculum in European countries shouldn't focus on European history, but I am criticising the European-centric way history is taught.

Take the Renaissance for instance. It is taught as if it was some bright spark of bright ideas which paradoxially came out of nowhere (the Dark Ages), when we all know it had its roots in the intellectual and cultural revolution which took place in Medieval Spain under Islamic rule several centuries earlier. Ask any U.K. school pupil about this and you'll just get a blank look. The most they will attribute (from memory) to a non-European civilisation is Ancient Egypt inventing papyrus or China inventing fireworks!

3. Sports is not considered part of the entertainment industry, although there is cross-promotion between the two nowadays. Sports is also one of the few arenas where people of different backgrounds can (are allowed to) compete equally (as long as we politely don't mention South Africa).

But by looking at cold hard statistics of non-white artists in the music charts (70% a more convincing way of saying 7 out of 10 huh?) I'm afraid you are missing the point. The music industry is more destructive than any nowadays in perpetrating racial stereotypes, today's "gangsta rap" being a prime example. Many music videos featuring black artists conform to this kind of destructive stereotype of black people abusing drugs, women and violence, and reinforcing that in the eyes of a predominantly white audience.

Yes, I am talking more about the entertainment industry otherwise known as the 'mass media': music, film, television. videogames, and everything in between. When you talk about "just talking about Hollywood films" you do realise that you are talking about the single largest entertainment industry in the world and most far-reaching in terms of cultural globalisation? I do not need to quote the countless films featuring handsome do-no-evil white lead actor against some barbaric ruthless enemy of colour? I don't deny that lately the trend seems to be an effort to reverse this but the last few decades speak for themselves. To try and pull examples would be an insult to the gravity of the problem.
Reply

JaffaCake
11-03-2009, 05:17 PM
Originally Posted by Omar_21:30
Firstly do you watch the same news channels as everyone else
I don't watch TV much any more, I just picked the most popular and went through the presenting staff. I couldn't find a list for ITV, but do you seriously think a station that had Sir Trevor McDonald OBE as host of it's flagship news & current affairs shows for two decades is promoting white supremacy?

Have you ever sat and watched children's TV, surely if there was a good time to indoctrinate people it would be when they're young and impressionable. Non-whites are more than adequately represented, and were when I was watching it 20 years ago.
Originally Posted by Omar_21:30
do you think any news network in its right mind would openly admit to its coverage being "on the basis of race"?
You're right, so how could you possibly know their intentions?

Originally Posted by Omar_21:30
Take the Renaissance for instance. It is taught as if it was some bright spark of bright ideas which paradoxially came out of nowhere (the Dark Ages), when we all know it had its roots in the intellectual and cultural revolution which took place in Medieval Spain under Islamic rule several centuries earlier.
I'm not sure why you associate Europe-centric with white superiority, there are plenty of European nations who are not ethnically white. Nobody pretends that the ideas of the Renaissance came out of nowhere, "During this period, there was an enormous renewal of interest in and study of classical antiquity." However you look at it, it's hardly promoting white superiority as the Greeks certainly weren't white either.
Originally Posted by Omar_21:30
3. Sports is not considered part of the entertainment industry, although there is cross-promotion between the two nowadays. Sports is also one of the few arenas where people of different backgrounds can (are allowed to) compete equally (as long as we politely don't mention South Africa).
You were talking about heroes, for a great many young boys in the UK their heroes are their favourite footballers.
Originally Posted by Omar_21:30
(70% a more convincing way of saying 7 out of 10 huh?)
Sorry for being consistent in my formatting. Even 7 out of the top 100 would be proportionally representative of the minorities in the UK, and there are far more than that.
Originally Posted by Omar_21:30
But by looking at cold hard statistics of non-white artists in the music charts I'm afraid you are missing the point. The music industry is more destructive than any nowadays in perpetrating racial stereotypes, today's "gangsta rap" being a prime example. Many music videos featuring black artists conform to this kind of destructive stereotype of black people abusing drugs, women and violence, and reinforcing that in the eyes of a predominantly white audience.
I'm pretty sure they didn't drag all these guys out of ballet classes and force them to act like hooligans. If that is how black artists want to be perceived that is entirely up to them. You can't just go and sling the blame on some invisible white overlord who manipulates the work of innocent young minority artists for some unknown racist agenda. Even if you could, what about the black owned record labels and production companies? Chart positions are based partly on sales anyway, that's what the racist white public seems to want to buy.

Besides, if you wanted to reinforce those stereotypes, just film someone walking around Brixton until they get stabbed.
Originally Posted by Omar_21:30
Yes, I am talking more about the entertainment industry otherwise known as the 'mass media': music, film, television. videogames, and everything in between. When you talk about "just talking about Hollywood films" you do realise that you are talking about the single largest entertainment industry in the world and most far-reaching in terms of cultural globalisation? I do not need to quote the countless films featuring handsome do-no-evil white lead actor against some barbaric ruthless enemy of colour? I don't deny that lately the trend seems to be an effort to reverse this but the last few decades speak for themselves. To try and pull examples would be an insult to the gravity of the problem.
Comparatively speaking, how much time do you think your average person spends watching non-white TV presenters, listening to non-white artists and speaking to non-white colleagues/schoolmates versus the time they spend going to see a 'white good/black evil' Hollywood release? Is that all it takes to 'brainwash' a whole population? After all the time I spent watching Fresh Prince I should want to be black.
Reply

Iris
11-03-2009, 08:12 PM
But the superiority of white color is what makes it different. It's a concept that's prevailed through centuries before, it's not a new development.
Reply

Supreme
11-03-2009, 08:18 PM
Originally Posted by amani
veru true and unfortunately not only asians. dark skinned is seen as ugly even by people who are dark themselves. Why anyone would hate the skin Allah blessed them with :hmm: ?
Something I've never understood is this view. I'm currently in a relationship with a black girl, and can I just say, black women are amazing and beautiful, if not more so that white women.
Reply

IAmZamzam
11-06-2009, 02:51 AM
Originally Posted by Woodrow
My point was that each and every one of is is prejudiced and biased to some extent.
And my point, which you've just reinforced again, yourself, with your own example, is about the supreme offensiveness of people justifying or projecting or presuming their own prejudicial nature into everyone else via, ironically, yet another prejudice. "I'm prejudiced and so I'm creating yet another prejudice: the stereotype that everyone else is prejudiced too." I don't know what the motive or possible psychological reason is for this extremely common phenomenon or why what we might call the EIRP (the "Everyone Is Racist" Prejudgment) is the most common form of this sort of projective sterotypic thought I've seen, and I don't really care. All I know is that whether or not it's a valid line of thought, it's still hypocritical and, again, itself a form of prejudice, and that's why it makes my blood boil. If you really must know, not only have I never had a racist thought in my life, racism confuses me so much that I even started a thread at this very board trying to gain aid in understanding it (and at the Understanding Islam board too).
Reply

Supreme
11-06-2009, 09:51 AM
Can I just say, did anyone else find it rather ridiculous how the black woman complained of subtle racism and then said people 'push in front of her in line'? People push in front of me in the line, but I never once suspected racism. Obviously racism exists, but that woman did not justice to victims of racism by using such a ridiculous example.
Reply

Uthman
11-06-2009, 07:47 PM
Greetings,
Originally Posted by Supreme
Can I just say, did anyone else find it rather ridiculous how the black woman complained of subtle racism and then said people 'push in front of her in line'? People push in front of me in the line, but I never once suspected racism. Obviously racism exists, but that woman did not justice to victims of racism by using such a ridiculous example.
From what I remember, she said that the cashiers would serve the person behind her in the queue while totally ignoring her. That's subtle because it's not something ostensibly racist but it's racism nonetheless. I would argue that, not only does racism exist, it is actually quite common. However, I wouldn't go as far as to say that all, or even the majority of white people, are racist.

As part of my A-Level French course, we were studying racism in France as one of our modules. My French teacher (who is white) also remarked that she believes racism is more common in Britain than it is in France but that racism in France is much more open and explicit as opposed to more subtle and discrete here in Britain.
Reply

Kabeer
11-10-2009, 02:39 PM
Originally Posted by Uthmān
As part of my A-Level French course, we were studying racism in France as one of our modules. My French teacher (who is white) also remarked that she believes racism is more common in Britain than it is in France but that racism in France is much more open and explicit as opposed to more subtle and discrete here in Britain.
Interesting,

From the large popularity of the French National Front party, I would have assumed racism was more rife there.
But it seems Britain has it's own ways (well some)
"look like the innocent flower, but be the serpent under't" - Lady Macbeth (Shakespeare).

Peace
Reply

Amadeus85
11-10-2009, 11:26 PM
I have come across with few definitions of racism.

1. Racism means a belief that people have different races.

2.Belief that people have different races and one are better than the other.

3. Belief that people have different races, one are better than the other and the better races have right to remove/destroy the lower races from their territory.
Reply

Hey there! Looks like you're enjoying the discussion, but you're not signed up for an account.

When you create an account, you can participate in the discussions and share your thoughts. You also get notifications, here and via email, whenever new posts are made. And you can like posts and make new friends.
Sign Up

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 53
    Last Post: 10-22-2007, 07:13 AM
  2. Replies: 33
    Last Post: 05-01-2007, 06:42 PM
  3. Replies: 2
    Last Post: 10-17-2006, 05:12 PM
  4. Replies: 204
    Last Post: 05-08-2006, 05:29 PM

IslamicBoard

Experience a richer experience on our mobile app!