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K444
06-24-2010, 01:15 PM
Both my parents are muslim. I am a 38 yr old female. I married twice both to muslim men, but these marriages failed. I spent 10 years alone single, depressed. My parents worried for me. Now i have found someone who loves me and i love him. He was not a muslim but agreed to convert. He sought out info from the mosque etc. I thought my parents would accept him as 3 years previous they accepted my sisters husband who converted from christianity.

But they dont want anything to do with me anymore if i marry this new man. They said one convert in the family was enough. Surely this is not islam?
I am one of 6 children and it breaks my heart that all my siblings can visit and talk to my parents and i cannot. Even the sister who married the convert now has two children and they are all welcome to the house. I know and they know her convert husband does not even practice! They allow my brother to bring his haram girlfriend into their house. They have full knowledge that he lives with his girlfriend, but they say its ok as her parents are muslim.

I hate them for hating me so much. My mother went as far as to say she would rather see me depressed and lonely for the rest of my days than carry the shame of another white man joining our family. My other sisters do not get involved or stand up for me. They are all happy to stay out of the war path. Sometimes i visit my parents and they let me in, but do not talk to me, other times, i am told through my siblings to stay away from the house.

I believe i am doing nothing wrong. I continue to practice islam, he is learning, whats the big deal? But they make me feel like i am going straight to hell for upsetting my parents and bringing shame to them. Please please please.. Is there any advice or help out there? Are there support groups for people like me with hypocrite parents?
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Muhammad
06-24-2010, 06:41 PM
Assalaamu Alaykum sister,

It's extremely sad to hear of the difficulty you are going through. I'm sorry but I cannot give any advice, other than perhaps it would be best to contact a scholar and seek advice.

Also, du'aa is the weapon of a believer, so make du'aa that Allaah (swt) guides your parents and eases your difficulty. Try to be patient with your parents, and do not let shaytaan fuel your anger towards them.

May Allaah (swt) guide your family and facilitate for you the best outcome, Aameen.
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Salahudeen
06-24-2010, 07:58 PM
You are right this is not Islam, you're not allowed to discriminate on grounds of race or nationality, this kind of discrimination makes me sick. Is this not racism? rejecting some 1 cos of the colour of their skin? In some cultures they make it fard (obligatory) that you have to marry some 1 from your own race which is against Islam. What are reverts supposed to do? How are reverts supposed to get married if racist Muslim parents don't give their sons/daughters away to any 1 else other than their own race. It really is sad.

Why don't you show them evidence from Qur'an and sunnah that they can't discriminate on grounds of race.
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CosmicPathos
06-25-2010, 10:59 PM
This is a difficult situation to be in. I do not know what to say.

If your parents want to disown you, its their choice. What can you do except to keep trying again for them to accept you? You will have to accept that if you have the freedom to marry whomever you want then they have the freedom to disown whichever of their children they want to. I know its hurting and saddening for you but what can you do? In the same way, your parents might have felt hurt when you disobeyed them and married someone they did not like. I guess you and your parents have the right to exercise free will and everyone is right: you and your parents as well. You are right for marrying the person you loved, they are right for disowning you for you disobeying them. That is how life is.

You can still deal with them with kindness, maybe that might change them but again, its their decision even if its hurtful ...

may Allah help you.
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CosmicPathos
06-25-2010, 11:05 PM
Originally Posted by squiggle
You are right this is not Islam, you're not allowed to discriminate on grounds of race or nationality, this kind of discrimination makes me sick. Is this not racism? rejecting some 1 cos of the colour of their skin? In some cultures they make it fard (obligatory) that you have to marry some 1 from your own race which is against Islam. What are reverts supposed to do? How are reverts supposed to get married if racist Muslim parents don't give their sons/daughters away to any 1 else other than their own race. It really is sad.

Why don't you show them evidence from Qur'an and sunnah that they can't discriminate on grounds of race.
Excuse me. How is it discrimination? Discrimination is when you hold off someone's rights based on their skin color or whatever. When parents do not want their children to marry someone from another race, its not discrimination against another race because was it the right of "another race" to marry into the race in question? No, it was not. I think everyone, including parents' preference for their children, can have preference to marry someone from certain race or someone with certain ideals. But I do agree that parents cannot force their children into marriage of parents' choice. But they can still be sad if their children married someone against their choice. They have the right to, since they were disobeyed.
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cat eyes
06-25-2010, 11:14 PM
it is quite a serious situation thats why brother mohammad said she should get scholars opinion on it. the parents might have disowned her but she won't get punished by Allah for choosing to marry the man she wanted. i think its punishment enough that her parents have disowned her for this little thing. may Allah guide them Ameen
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CosmicPathos
06-25-2010, 11:21 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
it is quite a serious situation thats why brother mohammad said she should get scholars opinion on it. the parents might have disowned her but she won't get punished by Allah for choosing to marry the man she wanted. i think its punishment enough that her parents have disowned her for this little thing. may Allah guide them Ameen
indeed. As I said, she is right and her parents are right. Both sides have exercised their free-will. What is concerning me is that she has called her parents hypocrite just because her parents chose to exercise their right of disowning her, and I do accept that it is much saddening to be disowned by one's parents. As a proof "Are there support groups for people like me with hypocrite parents?"

Yes, she should talk to a scholar for a more insightful analysis.
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Salahudeen
06-26-2010, 12:17 AM
Originally Posted by mad_scientist
Excuse me. How is it discrimination? Discrimination is when you hold off someone's rights based on their skin color or whatever. When parents do not want their children to marry someone from another race, its not discrimination against another race because was it the right of "another race" to marry into the race in question? No, it was not. I think everyone, including parents' preference for their children, can have preference to marry someone from certain race or someone with certain ideals. But I do agree that parents cannot force their children into marriage of parents' choice. But they can still be sad if their children married someone against their choice. They have the right to, since they were disobeyed.


Originally Posted by K444


I hate them for hating me so much. My mother went as far as to say she would rather see me depressed and lonely for the rest of my days than carry the shame of another white man joining our family. My other sisters do not get involved or stand up for me. They are all happy to stay out of the war path. Sometimes i visit my parents and they let me in, but do not talk to me, other times, i am told through my siblings to stay away from the house.
That's the bit where they are rejecting him cos of his skin colour, they don't want the shame of a "white man" joining the family. Is it shameful in Islam to marry outside your race? or are you allowed to reject a proposal cos you don't "want the shame of a white man" joining the family?

She hasn't given any other reason why they're rejecting him, merely cos of the fact he is white, what is the correct term for this then akhi? when parents refuse cos of skin colour? cos they see it shameful to marry some 1 who has different colour skin?

Englighten me as to what this is called akhi as I thought it was discrimination when some 1 refuses you on the grounds of your skin colour, as the sister said they are merely rejecting him because he is white and they can't take the shame of having another white man in the family, gosh what a shameful thing it is.

what is the correct term for this akhi? I've learnt something new from you :) we can refuse a legitimate marriage proposal simply because of skin colour :)

when a man from another races comes for my daughter I will say "go away I don't give my daughter to your race, it's shameful marrying your race" alhamdulilah I never knew I could do this
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CosmicPathos
06-26-2010, 12:35 AM
Originally Posted by squiggle
That's the bit where they are rejecting him cos of his skin colour, they don't want the shame of a "white man" joining the family. Is it shameful in Islam to marry outside your race? or are you allowed to reject a proposal cos you don't "want the shame of a white man" joining the family?

She hasn't given any other reason why they're rejecting him, merely cos of the fact he is white, what is the correct term for this then akhi? when parents refuse cos of skin colour? cos they see it shameful to marry some 1 who has different colour skin?

Englighten me as to what this is called akhi as I thought it was discrimination when some 1 refuses you on the grounds of your skin colour, as the sister said they are merely rejecting him because he is white and they can't take the shame of having another white man in the family, gosh what a shameful thing it is.

what is the correct term for this akhi? I've learnt something new from you :) we can refuse a legitimate marriage proposal simply because of skin colour :)
Whats wrong with refusing to marry a person if you do not feel attracted to his/her skin color which is part of how one looks? Notice that i am not saying that it is good to take their rights away, I am just saying that one can have preferences.

Now if OP's mother really rejected the man just cuz hes white then that is a bit problematic but we cannot know what really happened. We will have to talk to her mother to discover the truth. As Umar (ra) advised us to never believe in hearsay. To Seek evidence and proof.

I do agree that OP's mother cannot have any say in rejecting husband for her daughter based on hwo he looks etc cuz attraction is between the husband and wife, not husband and mother-in-law.
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Salahudeen
06-26-2010, 12:58 AM
Originally Posted by mad_scientist
Whats wrong with refusing to marry a person if you do not feel attracted to his/her skin color which is part of how one looks? Notice that i am not saying that it is good to take their rights away, I am just saying that one can have preferences.

Now if OP's mother really rejected the man just cuz hes white then that is a bit problematic but we cannot know what really happened. We will have to talk to her mother to discover the truth. As Umar (ra) advised us to never believe in hearsay. To Seek evidence and proof.

I do agree that OP's mother cannot have any say in rejecting husband for her daughter based on hwo he looks etc cuz attraction is between the husband and wife, not husband and mother-in-law.
I agree, especially as the prophet pbuh said In Tirmidhi: “If there comes to you one with whose religious commitment and character you are pleased, marry (your daughter or female relative under your care) to him, for if you do not do that, there will be tribulation in the land and corruption.” They said: “O Messenger of Allaah, even if he has something (some other disadvantage)?” He said: “If there comes to you one with whose religious commitment and character you are pleased, marry (your daughter or female relative under your care) to him” three times.

I may have a preference for my daughter to marry a brown man however if a white man comes for her hand I ain't gonna refuse him cos he's white, as long as I am pleased with his religious commitment and charachter I will give her hand as the prophet pbuh said to do so. It is not upto me to refuse him because he is white as this is not allowed, from this it goes to other things like nationality, tribe, cast, skin colour, what village they are from, these are all preferences on which I don't have the right to refuse as It is narrated by Abu Daud that the Messenger of Allah (S.A.W) said, "He is not one us who calls for `Asabiyah (nationalism/tribalism) or who fights for `Asabiyah or who dies for `Asabiyah." too. However my daughter can refuse if she wants.
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Hamza Asadullah
06-29-2010, 08:52 PM
Originally Posted by K444
Both my parents are muslim. I am a 38 yr old female. I married twice both to muslim men, but these marriages failed. I spent 10 years alone single, depressed. My parents worried for me. Now i have found someone who loves me and i love him. He was not a muslim but agreed to convert. He sought out info from the mosque etc. I thought my parents would accept him as 3 years previous they accepted my sisters husband who converted from christianity.

But they dont want anything to do with me anymore if i marry this new man. They said one convert in the family was enough. Surely this is not islam?
I am one of 6 children and it breaks my heart that all my siblings can visit and talk to my parents and i cannot. Even the sister who married the convert now has two children and they are all welcome to the house. I know and they know her convert husband does not even practice! They allow my brother to bring his haram girlfriend into their house. They have full knowledge that he lives with his girlfriend, but they say its ok as her parents are muslim.

I hate them for hating me so much. My mother went as far as to say she would rather see me depressed and lonely for the rest of my days than carry the shame of another white man joining our family. My other sisters do not get involved or stand up for me. They are all happy to stay out of the war path. Sometimes i visit my parents and they let me in, but do not talk to me, other times, i am told through my siblings to stay away from the house.

I believe i am doing nothing wrong. I continue to practice islam, he is learning, whats the big deal? But they make me feel like i am going straight to hell for upsetting my parents and bringing shame to them. Please please please.. Is there any advice or help out there? Are there support groups for people like me with hypocrite parents?
Asalaamu Alaikum Wr Wb, jazakallah Khayran for sharing your issue with us. My sister i do empathise with you on your situation and there are a lot of similar cases in todays western societies as more and more Muslims originating from the east are marrying into other races and cultures. Unfortunatley our parents who are the first generation in these western countries are not as accepting because their mind set and mentality is quite different from ours being second and third generations. They still have strong cultural roots and are still not as open minded in regards to marriage as they should be. However we should still respect our parents regardless and never even say "uff" to them because Allah has given them a very high status and they still want them best for us even though they may act unreasonable towards us.

Deep down your parents love you more than anything but they are just very hurt inside so my sister just be patient towards them and NEVER show any resentment towards them because this is what shaythan wants you to do. He wants to build hatred up inside of you for your parents but you must NEVER let your sworn enemy shaythan make you hate your parents. You should love them and treat them the best regardless and just accept that they do love you but they don't agree with your decision for who you want to marry.

I would also emphasise that you go to a reliable and learned scholar and discuss your matter with him. He will advise you as to the best steps to take and if he sees fit he may even mediate things between you and your family. Do this immediatley but always try to reconcile things with your parents and even give them a bit of space sometimes and then try again. Also make isthikhara to ensure that this is the right decision for you and follow the scholars advice. Make dua to Allah abundantley to do what is best for you and to soften your parents hearts towards you. Whatever is best will happen inshallah.

and Allah knows best on all matters
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S_87
06-30-2010, 12:29 PM
youre 38 now and in 10years they havent foundu someone, u have a right to marry and if there is nothing wrong with this guy besides the fact that he is white then it is oppression to say no.
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K444
07-01-2010, 09:55 AM
I called my parents Hypocrites because on one hand, they allow my sister to marry and have two children with her white american husband, and then they say to the rest of the children "Thats it, no more converts or reverts or white or black, if any of you choose to marry, find someone local who speaks the same arabic dialect as us" This is Madness. Where will i find this man at aged 38? This perfect muslim who speaks the same language as my parents who happens to live in the same small town as me in England and who would be willing to marry a divorced woman who is nearly 40?? HA WHAT A JOKE. if such a man existed he would find himself a fertile 23 year old to settle down with.
My point is.. they know how hard it is to find someone to love and love you back - but they continue to say "stay unmarried and lonely - work to pay the bills on your own and suffer hardship, rather than bring shame to the family" And whilst they speak this nonsense, they play happy families with my sister and her children. Am i then expected to obey them, watch quietly from a distance as my sister produces more children and has happiness in her life and a man to look after her? Am i a robot? Do i not want the same things as her? They make me sick. Sorry
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K444
07-01-2010, 10:08 AM
Thank you for you reply. Its very hard to put into practice any kind of mediation if your mother is screaming and hitting her head shedding tears worthy of an oscar performance. Then My dad feels sorry for my mum and says "look what you are doing to your mother" and then I am told to leave the house. Same ritual everytime I bring the subject up. The only time I see my mother smile is if I visit her and I confirm that I have been working all week, I havent been out anywhere, I havent met anyone and my life is SAD SAD SAD. Then she is content that all the rest of the community is not gossping about me. So when everyone tells me my parents love me... I find this too hard to believe. I have a son, and I know exactly what NOT TO DO! He has freedom of choice, freedom of expression, he can come to me with anything. And still thank god, he chooses Islam, not because i beat it into him, but because he has been taught with love. People talk about our parents being from another generation, and to a certain degree, I understand, but when did love become cultural, how is it this first generation (my parents) have only CONDITIONAL love. We love you if...... I will never be like my mother...
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Salahudeen
07-01-2010, 10:18 AM
I understand how hard it is sister, but I'm sure they can't refuse without a valid reason. Since you have been divorced twice, I do not think you need a wali's approval to marry again, however the dilemma for you is, do you marry him without your familys approval and maybe risk them cutting you off. Or stay alone for the rest of your time and keep your family happy.

Do you sacrafice your happyness to please them? or do you make yourself happy at the risk of upsetting them? it's a hard choice to make.

Which choice are you leaning towards? Have you tried getting someone they respect to speak to them? like the Imam? Have you tried telling them they can't refuse simply because he is white? Have you showed them the prophet pbuh said a race has no superiority over another?
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K444
07-01-2010, 02:47 PM
Thank you Squiggle.
I have tried everything. I tried to appeal to my father as he is more knowledgable is Islam, but it seems their protests sound personal. My father said "Who ever wants to convert, converts for themselves, I dont want any white man coming through this door" My mother says (or screams) "I dont want to speak English to anyone, I want a son in law that speaks arabic" Fair enough, i tried this, twice. they didnt even like the first arabic husband. Its not like there are a few men to choose from - everyone I am surrounded with is English. i tried Islamic websites to marry again but I swear, none of the muslims wanted anything to do with me because of my age and the fact I have a son already. And who can blame them? They want their own children. A man aged 40 has his choice of women.. most are blatant about the fact they are seeking women aged 18-30. My point is, finally I have found someone who loves me and is happy to embrace islam - but my parents said anyone who embraces islam for love is not really embracing islam. They are doing it just to be with me. If a man converts a woman, there would be no quarrel.
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cat eyes
07-02-2010, 03:49 PM
my dear sister what id suggest is do the istikhara and ask Allah whether you should go ahead with this marriage even if your parents object to it :)

just ask Allah for a sign in your dream about what steps to take. of course you'd have to marry, a woman can not be alone her whole life, its very dangerous, she'd surely fall into zina so by the sounds of it you have already been rejected before by many men because they want a woman with no kids, its very difficult sis i know but hang on in there.

you can not waste a second more, you can not stay single for so long to please your parents, you'd surely be doing destruction to yourself. islam is easy, its not meant to be difficult by obeying yo

ur parents in this situation theres no such thing so do your istikhara sis. inshallah you will get your answer

just ask Allah whether you should wait or go ahead with this marriage.

i will keep you in my dua
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Danah
07-02-2010, 05:15 PM
This is a very hard issue, whats wrong with reverts?? The majority of them practice Islam more sincerely than us born Muslims as they struggle in their life to find the truth hence cherish it more than us. This is surly not Islam. May Allah help you and decide what is best for you dear sis, keep making duaa that things will be better. You will be in my prayers too.

Cant you get any relatives to deal with your parent?
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