Advice Need:Co-Wife

[AishaRayann]

As salam(u) alaikum,

Im at the age that its essential that I get married. I want to marry.It's so hard to find someone.
My sister in Islam Aisha...is my bestest friend in the whole world..shes family to me.She thinks same as me.Well I've been wanting to ask her if her husband would be interested in a 2nd wife.I'm not sure if he find me attractive or not..hes only seen me once when he dropped her off at my house one time.Me and Aisha have talked about co-wives in general..we both are not opposed to it in general. I think her husband is very attractive,..he seem nice...and she is always happy..so he must treat her well...but I don't know how to go about asking? Should I ask her to ask him...or speak to them both in same room.

[May Ayob]

Salaam sis,


Honestly, Are you Serious?!!?
How on earth can she be your friend and you want to steal her husband. No offense Sis but i wouldnt take anyone who agrees with co-wife isssue as a friend at all , the family should be and only must be The Man, The Woman, and the Children , and that's final


Leave her husband , and God will give you a better man, please i'm begging you it isnt fair that you do this to someone you call a friend


Again Please leave her husband alone this is the worst thing you can do to someone you take as a friend would you actually like another woman or girl sharing your husband i don't think so , and definately not for me


So my request is please move on and look for another man , there are plenty of them in this wonderfull plenty they are good muslims and devoted husbands.





p/s i know this might be somewhat of a mean reply that is unexpected but pardon me and please forgive because i personally oppose to such issue


i hope i helped :)

[Perseveranze]

I was wondering, do you live in a Muslim country?

Anyways, if she's open to the idea in general, then just ask her lol. Personally, would think its better to ask her and if she approved she can ask the husband.

Just as long as she's understanding and your friendship doesn't break up because of this or anything.

[CosmicPathos]

Salaam sis,


Honestly, Are you Serious?!!?
How on earth can she be your friend and you want to steal her husband. No offense Sis but i wouldnt take anyone who agrees with co-wife isssue as a friend at all , the family should be and only must be The Man, The Woman, and the Children , and that's final


Leave her husband , and God will give you a better man, please i'm begging you it isnt fair that you do this to someone you call a friend


Again Please leave her husband alone this is the worst thing you can do to someone you take as a friend would you actually like another woman or girl sharing your husband i don't think so , and definately not for me


So my request is please move on and look for another man , there are plenty of them in this wonderfull plenty they are good muslims and devoted husbands.





p/s i know this might be somewhat of a mean reply that is unexpected but pardon me and please forgive because i personally oppose to such issue


i hope i helped :)

whats that non-sense? (in bolded part)

If the first wife is cool with it (ask her straight up), and the husband is cool with it, and the OP is cool with it, what's your problem? .

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[Salahudeen]

Salaam sis,


Honestly, Are you Serious?!!?
How on earth can she be your friend and you want to steal her husband. No offense Sis but i wouldnt take anyone who agrees with co-wife isssue as a friend at all , the family should be and only must be The Man, The Woman, and the Children , and that's final


Leave her husband , and God will give you a better man, please i'm begging you it isnt fair that you do this to someone you call a friend


Again Please leave her husband alone this is the worst thing you can do to someone you take as a friend would you actually like another woman or girl sharing your husband i don't think so , and definately not for me


So my request is please move on and look for another man , there are plenty of them in this wonderfull plenty they are good muslims and devoted husbands.





p/s i know this might be somewhat of a mean reply that is unexpected but pardon me and please forgive because i personally oppose to such issue


i hope i helped :)

Sister you're speaking as if the OP suggested doing something haraam when in actual fact we know polygamy is allowed in Islam and is a sunnah of the prophet (saw) as well as many of the companions of the prophet (saw). And if her friend has no problem with it and she has no problem with it then what's the problem. I find your statement that you would not take anyone who agree's with the co wife thing as a friend a little disturbing, because it implies that you would shun many great women of Islam if they were alive today such as the sahabiyat.

As salam(u) alaikum,

Im at the age that its essential that I get married. I want to marry.It's so hard to find someone.
My sister in Islam Aisha...is my bestest friend in the whole world..shes family to me.She thinks same as me.Well I've been wanting to ask her if her husband would be interested in a 2nd wife.I'm not sure if he find me attractive or not..hes only seen me once when he dropped her off at my house one time.Me and Aisha have talked about co-wives in general..we both are not opposed to it in general. I think her husband is very attractive,..he seem nice...and she is always happy..so he must treat her well...but I don't know how to go about asking? Should I ask her to ask him...or speak to them both in same room.

I think firstly you should speak to his wife about it, ask her would she mind if her husband married another women, and if she is open to the idea and says stuff like she'd encourage it, then you could put your idea forward to her and see what she says. If she says "that would be my worst nightmare having a co wife" then don't mention it ;D

[Cabdullahi]

Plenty of brothers ready for zawaj

[Rhubarb Tart]

Salam

ask her dont assume she wont mind. If she doesnt mind, ask her to ask her husband.

[May Ayob]

i just wanted to explain a few things based on what i said, i think we muslims should understand each other more, firstly i didn't think it was very nice saying that what i'm saying is non-sense because that's my opinion and i hope you respect it just as i would want to respect yours,


what i said about polygamy wasn't out of ignorant statements as you guys are trying to say , but i think before you accuse me of shunning the Female Sahabas please understand that i said what i said on the basis of this:

A man has one heart and it will belong only to one female , this is what the Quran has confirmed and i think it's pretty clear from the Prophet's Seerah that his heart PBUH was only inclined towards Aisha May God be pleased with her

the Holy Quran also states that IF the man cannot be just and impartial, which the Holy Quran its self has confirmed that Men will never be just towards equality in polygamy , and if you fear (i.e) the men ) that you will not be Just them Marry ONE or What is under your Gaurdian ship ____ CAn anyone here claim that the Quran didn't say this???
i dont think so these verses are Clearly stated in the Chapter of Women, (Correct me if i am wrong)

The other thing is that these verses were in first place revealed regarding orphans, this is one point , and what many muslims fail to understand is that God almighty did not permit Polygamy as a some type of fun or Worldly lust , Polygamy only started occuring in the days or the Sahaba after the Ghazawat ( the Islamic Battles) because more and more female companions were widows and they needed men to care for them as we know at that society there wasn't many options for women to go to , especially the muhajerat.

Another thing about Polygamy is that one has to understand the way God has created Women , read all the prophetic traditions about LAsy Aisha and you will see that even though she was blessed with the prophets love , she was still very jealous of her Co-wifes who werent at the same level with.

Secondly the muslims of today are not the muslims of the Prophet PBUH time , and i don't think anyone can argue with me about that , the time has changed , the peoples mentality has changed, and many people from our global humanitarian community will not understand the issue of polygamy

they will come up with questions like --Do you all sleep in one bed..etc which is very sad because it seem from their point of view that islam is this Arabian,Lustfull , Women surpressing religion which God knows is not true and it is verily the responsibility of all muslims to clarify to their fellow human siblings that this is not what God has created us for..we have a much bigger purpose than to discuss such issues.


One last thing i would like to comment on , some of you muslim women think that you are the female sahabis sisters and that you are the second or third khadija or Aisha this is wrong because you isolate yourselves from other people especially women ar girls who are not at the same religous level as you are and it really shows that you atek islam for granted and you are supporting it is us verses them and belive you are not doing yourself or Your religion any benfit know well that there was a jewsih prostitute who found a thirsty dog and she quenched his thirst by filling her own shoes God Almighty has forgiven her and has granted her paradise, and know as well that there was devoutdly worshipping women who used pray and fast regularly but she used to hurt people with her tongue and God had destined her to Hell fire , and finally i would like you to know an important thing know very well that it is not your good deeds or your externally piety that will take you to Jannah it is Only God's Mercy and Prophet Muhammed Pbuh himself with all his greatness is not excluded from this.



I know i took very long to reply , but i wanted to explain my point of view very further , and honestly Life isn't Worth living if you are going to hurt a human being internally and emotionally




With all respect, Salam Peace be upon you.

[May Ayob]

I mean't to say Lady Aisha RA

[al yunan]

Salam ask her dont assume she wont mind. If she doesnt mind, ask her to ask her husband.

I think firstly you should speak to his wife about it, ask her would she mind if her husband married another women, and if she is open to the idea and says stuff like she'd encourage it, then you could put your idea forward to her and see what she says. If she says "that would be my worst nightmare having a co wife" then don't mention it

If the first wife is cool with it (ask her straight up), and the husband is cool with it, and the OP is cool with it, what's your problem? .

Anyways, if she's open to the idea in general, then just ask her lol. Personally, would think its better to ask her and if she approved she can ask the husband. Just as long as she's understanding and your friendship doesn't break up because of this or anything.

Walaikum Assalam sister Aisha,

From the answers you can tell you have the male vote myself included.
If she is your best friend and agrees, then, there is a marriage made in heaven.
Be careful though how you handle it, don't loose your friend over it.
Best wishes

May Allah S.W.T grant you what's best for you.
Masalam

[Alpha Dude]

Wa alaykum salam,

Pray istikarah on it. Then discuss the issue with your friend. Don't bring the issue up with them together, that would be very unwise especially as you'd be catching your friend off-guard and she'd feel embarrassed.

Also know this, your friend may love you and may initially be nice about it, but it would be natural for her to be jealous and annoyed. So know that you'd need to be extra careful in your approach and dealings with her and her husband if you do get married.

[Perseveranze]

Walaikum Assalam sister Aisha,

From the answers you can tell you have the male vote myself included.
If she is your best friend and agrees, then, there is a marriage made in heaven.
Be careful though how you handle it, don't loose your friend over it.
Best wishes

May Allah S.W.T grant you what's best for you.
Masalam

Male or not though, don't think it's anyone's business to "forbid" her from it. Understandable that a woman would naturally feel it undesirable to share her man, I mean the Prophet's wives(pbut) did become jelous of each other, naturally.

But, if the man is capable and is happy, and the first wife, 2nd wife all the way upto the 4th are all happy with the arrangement, then no one should try to judge or anything like that.

[May Ayob]

In the End it is your choice but all i would like to say is that you might want something but it turns out to be bad for you
Just because she is your friend and she generally agrees with Co-wife issues that doesn't mean you can take advantage of her kindness and marry her husband , all of the people in the thread here are making it like it's a piece of cake , well no it's not not for the wife and definatley not for the children, why are you returning her good with something that might be evil.

There is a life lesson i think we need to under stand , correct me if iam wrong but just two years in Kwuait there was this same story going on a man decided to marry his wife's friends, sure they were best friends and everything but guess what on the wedding party , frmer wife took a big barrel or sumthing that's filled with gasoline and lit fire over the whole wedding many people died that day , why and what was this destruction was all for , just to please yourself for a couple of years, honestly the women was senteced to death penalty , is this what you wish for your friend , i don't think and i'm hoping not think over , life isn't a game of desire where you marry one, 2 , or up to the 4rth and they all live happily ever after , yeah right who are you kidding stop deceiving yourself , this is not a wise action please if you actaully cared about your friend leave her husband for her theres no need to make a turmoil there are many muslim bachelors that would love to marry a person like you whos seems very nice.





As i said before this is my opinion , it's all up to you but in the bottom line you have to take responsibilty of your actions



Salaam Peace to all.

[CosmicPathos]

i just wanted to explain a few things based on what i said, i think we muslims should understand each other more, firstly i didn't think it was very nice saying that what i'm saying is non-sense because that's my opinion and i hope you respect it just as i would want to respect yours,


what i said about polygamy wasn't out of ignorant statements as you guys are trying to say , but i think before you accuse me of shunning the Female Sahabas please understand that i said what i said on the basis of this:

A man has one heart and it will belong only to one female , this is what the Quran has confirmed and i think it's pretty clear from the Prophet's Seerah that his heart PBUH was only inclined towards Aisha May God be pleased with her

the Holy Quran also states that IF the man cannot be just and impartial, which the Holy Quran its self has confirmed that Men will never be just towards equality in polygamy , and if you fear (i.e) the men ) that you will not be Just them Marry ONE or What is under your Gaurdian ship ____ CAn anyone here claim that the Quran didn't say this???
i dont think so these verses are Clearly stated in the Chapter of Women, (Correct me if i am wrong)

The other thing is that these verses were in first place revealed regarding orphans, this is one point , and what many muslims fail to understand is that God almighty did not permit Polygamy as a some type of fun or Worldly lust , Polygamy only started occuring in the days or the Sahaba after the Ghazawat ( the Islamic Battles) because more and more female companions were widows and they needed men to care for them as we know at that society there wasn't many options for women to go to , especially the muhajerat.

Another thing about Polygamy is that one has to understand the way God has created Women , read all the prophetic traditions about LAsy Aisha and you will see that even though she was blessed with the prophets love , she was still very jealous of her Co-wifes who werent at the same level with.

Secondly the muslims of today are not the muslims of the Prophet PBUH time , and i don't think anyone can argue with me about that , the time has changed , the peoples mentality has changed, and many people from our global humanitarian community will not understand the issue of polygamy

they will come up with questions like --Do you all sleep in one bed..etc which is very sad because it seem from their point of view that islam is this Arabian,Lustfull , Women surpressing religion which God knows is not true and it is verily the responsibility of all muslims to clarify to their fellow human siblings that this is not what God has created us for..we have a much bigger purpose than to discuss such issues.


One last thing i would like to comment on , some of you muslim women think that you are the female sahabis sisters and that you are the second or third khadija or Aisha this is wrong because you isolate yourselves from other people especially women ar girls who are not at the same religous level as you are and it really shows that you atek islam for granted and you are supporting it is us verses them and belive you are not doing yourself or Your religion any benfit know well that there was a jewsih prostitute who found a thirsty dog and she quenched his thirst by filling her own shoes God Almighty has forgiven her and has granted her paradise, and know as well that there was devoutdly worshipping women who used pray and fast regularly but she used to hurt people with her tongue and God had destined her to Hell fire , and finally i would like you to know an important thing know very well that it is not your good deeds or your externally piety that will take you to Jannah it is Only God's Mercy and Prophet Muhammed Pbuh himself with all his greatness is not excluded from this.



I know i took very long to reply , but i wanted to explain my point of view very further , and honestly Life isn't Worth living if you are going to hurt a human being internally and emotionally




With all respect, Salam Peace be upon you.

there are other hadith which show that Prophet's (pbuh) heart was into Khadijha (as). He used to miss her, even when Ayesha (as) was present. So I am not too sure of the evidence you gave.


As they say in Urdu, jab mian biwi raazi tau kya karay ga qaazi. (when both husband and wife are ready/agreed, what can the Qazi do). I dont need to respect your opinion, nor do you need to respect mine. facts and truthful statements speak for themselves without demanding "respect."

and wsalam.


to OP:

Salahudeen has given good advice. First indirectly ask your friend innocently if she ever has thought about what if her husband were to marry a second wife. See her response. And then take it from there.

[CosmicPathos]

In the End it is your choice but all i would like to say is that you might want something but it turns out to be bad for you
Just because she is your friend and she generally agrees with Co-wife issues that doesn't mean you can take advantage of her kindness and marry her husband , all of the people in the thread here are making it like it's a piece of cake , well no it's not not for the wife and definatley not for the children, why are you returning her good with something that might be evil.

There is a life lesson i think we need to under stand , correct me if iam wrong but just two years in Kwuait there was this same story going on a man decided to marry his wife's friends, sure they were best friends and everything but guess what on the wedding party , frmer wife took a big barrel or sumthing that's filled with gasoline and lit fire over the whole wedding many people died that day , why and what was this destruction was all for , just to please yourself for a couple of years, honestly the women was senteced to death penalty , is this what you wish for your friend , i don't think and i'm hoping not think over , life isn't a game of desire where you marry one, 2 , or up to the 4rth and they all live happily ever after , yeah right who are you kidding stop deceiving yourself , this is not a wise action please if you actaully cared about your friend leave her husband for her theres no need to make a turmoil there are many muslim bachelors that would love to marry a person like you whos seems very nice.





As i said before this is my opinion , it's all up to you but in the bottom line you have to take responsibilty of your actions



Salaam Peace to all.

Yes, and that evil wife in Kuwait who killed innocents attending a joyous event needs to be executed! So you are putting the blame of that murderous first wife on the new wife the husband was marrying? subhanAllah.

salam

[Salahudeen]

A man has one heart and it will belong only to one female , this is what the Quran has confirmed and i think it's pretty clear from the Prophet's Seerah that his heart PBUH was only inclined towards Aisha May God be pleased with her

I'm interested to see where the Qur'an says that a man's heart can only belong to one female, can you show me please. Thank you. We know from the seerah that he loved Ayesha the most after Khadija, but that doesn't mean he did not love his other wifes. Kind of like a mother, she loves all of her children, but there is one that she adores the most out of all of them. That doesn't mean she see's her other children in a lesser way, or would be incapable of being just to all her children. Would you tell a woman she can only have 1 child incase she doesn't love them all equally? or incase her heart is particularly inclined to one child?

the Holy Quran also states that IF the man cannot be just and impartial, which the Holy Quran its self has confirmed that Men will never be just towards equality in polygamy , and if you fear (i.e) the men ) that you will not be Just them Marry ONE or What is under your Gaurdian ship ____ CAn anyone here claim that the Quran didn't say this???
i dont think so these verses are Clearly stated in the Chapter of Women, (Correct me if i am wrong)

You are correct, the Qur'an does address men saying, “And if you fear that you shall not be able to deal justly with the orphan girls then marry (other) women of your choice, two or three, or four; but if you fear that you shall not be able to deal justly (with them), then only one or (slaves) that your right hands possess. That is nearer to prevent you from doing injustice” [al-Nisa’ 4:3]

However where does it confirm that men will never be just in equality? When it talks about a man being just, it is with regards to, his time, and his wealth. So he must divide his time and wealth justly between the two wifes, I.E he must give them both the same number of days, he can't stay with one for 2 days and another for 3 days. He must stay with them both for the same duration of time, it also applies to his wealth, if he buys one a car, he also has to buy the other one a car. And this is the man being just with them. However if he fears he will not be able to do this then he should only marry one. Where does it say he will never be able to deal justly? maybe I'm not reading it correctly.

The other thing is that these verses were in first place revealed regarding orphans, this is one point , and what many muslims fail to understand is that God almighty did not permit Polygamy as a some type of fun or Worldly lust , Polygamy only started occuring in the days or the Sahaba after the Ghazawat ( the Islamic Battles) because more and more female companions were widows and they needed men to care for them as we know at that society there wasn't many options for women to go to , especially the muhajerat.

You are right, but Islamic Law is not bound by time, the rulings of Islamic Law do not change because of time periods, what was Islam 1400 years ago, is Islam today. To say polygamy was only appropriate for that time because of wars can lead one to say this about everything in Islam, whatever we don't agree with, we can disregard it and make up a reason as to why it's no longer viable in todays world. At the end of the day, it is halal, and we should not look at anyone who wishes to indulge in it, as doing something wrong.

Another thing about Polygamy is that one has to understand the way God has created Women , read all the prophetic traditions about LAsy Aisha and you will see that even though she was blessed with the prophets love , she was still very jealous of her Co-wifes who werent at the same level with.

So a woman may get jealous of her co wife, what is your point? that doesn't change the fact it's perfectly fine for a man or woman to do it in Islam. If a woman feels she can not handle a co wife then I'm sure her husband will oblige to her wish, however if she's happy with a co wife I don't see any problem.

Secondly the muslims of today are not the muslims of the Prophet PBUH time , and i don't think anyone can argue with me about that , the time has changed , the peoples mentality has changed, and many people from our global humanitarian community will not understand the issue of polygamy

they will come up with questions like --Do you all sleep in one bed..etc which is very sad because it seem from their point of view that islam is this Arabian,Lustfull , Women surpressing religion which God knows is not true and it is verily the responsibility of all muslims to clarify to their fellow human siblings that this is not what God has created us for..we have a much bigger purpose than to discuss such issues.

I agree the Muslims today are not as amazing as the Muslims of the past, however this doesn't change the fact that polygamy is allowed in Islam for any man or woman who wishes to indulge in it. Who cares if some non Muslims have perverted thoughts, do we change our religion to please other people? What are you suggesting that we should say Islam doesn't allow polygamy, in order to improve the image of it for non Muslims? If they think of such questions then they are simply displaying their own pevertedness are they not?

One last thing i would like to comment on , some of you muslim women think that you are the female sahabis sisters and that you are the second or third khadija or Aisha this is wrong because you isolate yourselves from other people especially women ar girls who are not at the same religous level as you are and it really shows that you atek islam for granted and you are supporting it is us verses them and belive you are not doing yourself or Your religion any benfit know well that there was a jewsih prostitute who found a thirsty dog and she quenched his thirst by filling her own shoes God Almighty has forgiven her and has granted her paradise, and know as well that there was devoutdly worshipping women who used pray and fast regularly but she used to hurt people with her tongue and God had destined her to Hell fire , and finally i would like you to know an important thing know very well that it is not your good deeds or your externally piety that will take you to Jannah it is Only God's Mercy and Prophet Muhammed Pbuh himself with all his greatness is not excluded from this.

Have you ever heard a sister say that she thinks she's the sister of a female sahabi? this is indeed worrying, you should take her to a doctor if she believes she is khadija or ayesha who has come back to life in the 21st century.

[Alpha Dude]

Think very very wisely before you take any action sister AishaRayann.

The moment you bring this discussion up with her, everything will change between you and your friend for better or for worse. Is it a risk you are willing to take?

[Salahudeen]

In the End it is your choice but all i would like to say is that you might want something but it turns out to be bad for you
Just because she is your friend and she generally agrees with Co-wife issues that doesn't mean you can take advantage of her kindness and marry her husband , all of the people in the thread here are making it like it's a piece of cake , well no it's not not for the wife and definatley not for the children, why are you returning her good with something that might be evil.

No one knows the unseen, what might turn out to be evil in your opinion, may also turn out to be abundant good, if her friend agree's with it, how is this taking advantage? rather it would be taking advantage if her friend didn't agree with it and she proceeded. How do you know it's not a piece of cake for her friend? have you had a personal conversation with the OP's friend and heard her views on polygamy that you are able to say it wont be a piece of cake for her? She may even like the idea of her best friend being her co wife.

There is a life lesson i think we need to under stand , correct me if iam wrong but just two years in Kwuait there was this same story going on a man decided to marry his wife's friends, sure they were best friends and everything but guess what on the wedding party , frmer wife took a big barrel or sumthing that's filled with gasoline and lit fire over the whole wedding many people died that day , why and what was this destruction was all for , just to please yourself for a couple of years, honestly the women was senteced to death penalty , is this what you wish for your friend , i don't think and i'm hoping not think over , life isn't a game of desire where you marry one, 2 , or up to the 4rth and they all live happily ever after , yeah right who are you kidding stop deceiving yourself , this is not a wise action please if you actaully cared about your friend leave her husband for her theres no need to make a turmoil there are many muslim bachelors that would love to marry a person like you whos seems very nice.

You've gave an example of a situation where it went wrong, but you fail to realise that does not proof anything except the faults of the individuals in the case you mentioned. I can provide you with stories of women who are happy co wifes and would recommend it to other people. You gave one bad example, but there is plenty of good examples out there also.

[AishaRayann]

As salam(u) alaikum,

I'd like to further discuss why I'm thinking about this...First of all, my best friend and I are very close..I feel like she is my blood family..her and her children I love..and I don't ..mean in a homosexual way...I would take a bullet for her and her children anyday. Her family brings the best joy into my life. I couldn't be jealous of her in any way regardless.even in that situation. I highly respect her. She is of character, a good and knowledgeable Muslim,...I'm not lusting for her husband. I've only seen him once while he dropped her off at my house...I want this because I share bond that goes beyond friendship..but family..and id like to offically be a part of it...i don't know much about him..only that he is friendly and greets me Islamically over the phone when she isnt home and i leave a msg...she is a revert to Islam...for 8 years now I think. Very wise...She must have learned alot from him...hes intelligent from which she tells me he knows all about computers and phones electronics. Qualities I admire..They have a happy home...With the strong feelings i have I thought I could make it even happier :D

[Rhubarb Tart]

As salam(u) alaikum,

I'd like to further discuss why I'm thinking about this...First of all, my best friend and I are very close..I feel like she is my blood family..her and her children I love..and I don't ..mean in a homosexual way...I would take a bullet for her and her children anyday. Her family brings the best joy into my life. I couldn't be jealous of her in any way regardless.even in that situation. I highly respect her. She is of character, a good and knowledgeable Muslim,...I'm not lusting for her husband. I've only seen him once while he dropped her off at my house...I want this because I share bond that goes beyond friendship..but family..and id like to offically be a part of it...i don't know much about him..only that he is friendly and greets me Islamically over the phone when she isnt home and i leave a msg...she is a revert to Islam...for 8 years now I think. Very wise...She must have learned alot from him...hes intelligent from which she tells me he knows all about computers and phones electronics. Qualities I admire..They have a happy home...With the strong feelings i have I thought I could make it even happier :D

:sl:



That all good, sister. Now what you have described is what you feel and want. Next job is to find out how she feels and whether she want you marrying her husband.
And you also need to think about what lowlife said. Simply ask her and then you would have your answer.

[Muezzin]

As salam(u) alaikum,

Im at the age that its essential that I get married. I want to marry.It's so hard to find someone.
My sister in Islam Aisha...is my bestest friend in the whole world..shes family to me.She thinks same as me.Well I've been wanting to ask her if her husband would be interested in a 2nd wife.I'm not sure if he find me attractive or not..hes only seen me once when he dropped her off at my house one time.Me and Aisha have talked about co-wives in general..we both are not opposed to it in general. I think her husband is very attractive,..he seem nice...and she is always happy..so he must treat her well...but I don't know how to go about asking? Should I ask her to ask him...or speak to them both in same room.

However you go about it, it will be... awkward. I think the reason for this is because this marriage appears to be a means of staying close to your best friend (which is lovely), rather than because you share love for her husband. With respect... where does that leave him? :)

[al yunan]

Male or not though, don't think it's anyone's business to "forbid" her from it. Understandable that a woman would naturally feel it undesirable to share her man, I mean the Prophet's wives(pbut) did become jelous of each other, naturally.

What made you think I objected, I'm all for it

[Salahudeen]

As salam(u) alaikum,

I'd like to further discuss why I'm thinking about this...First of all, my best friend and I are very close..I feel like she is my blood family..her and her children I love..and I don't ..mean in a homosexual way...I would take a bullet for her and her children anyday. Her family brings the best joy into my life. I couldn't be jealous of her in any way regardless.even in that situation. I highly respect her. She is of character, a good and knowledgeable Muslim,...I'm not lusting for her husband. I've only seen him once while he dropped her off at my house...I want this because I share bond that goes beyond friendship..but family..and id like to offically be a part of it...i don't know much about him..only that he is friendly and greets me Islamically over the phone when she isnt home and i leave a msg...she is a revert to Islam...for 8 years now I think. Very wise...She must have learned alot from him...hes intelligent from which she tells me he knows all about computers and phones electronics. Qualities I admire..They have a happy home...With the strong feelings i have I thought I could make it even happier :D

Sister, I think the way to go about this is, to ask her how she would react if her husband said he wanted to take a 2nd wife, ask her how she'd feel and if she'd be happy about it or upset. Just generally ask her. Don't give her any ideas that you're interested untill you know how she'd feel about it.

[جوري]

where does that leave him?

death of sardanapalus comes to mind!

[piXie]

A man has one heart

Havent you heard that saying 'A man may have one heart but it has 4 chambers' :p

[CosmicPathos]

Havent you heard that saying 'A man may have one heart but it has 4 chambers' :p

yea, and oblique and transverse sinuses too, for wives to put their icy fingers into! :p

[wildkat]

You want to marry your BEST FRIEND'S husband?!
Why dont you ask her to ask her husband if he knows any good brothers?

[AishaRayann]

It's not just about being closer to her..i want to be close to him..because he is very attractive, Egyptian which is my favorite of all nationalities,hes intelligent,hes good to his children..those are great qualities..i want to know more. I already asked her how she would feel if her husband wanted a co-wife...she said she was open minded to it and it wouldnt be a problem.I think that I can add to his happiness and add goodness to the home in general. I've been making dua late at night..but haven't received an answer yet. but i'll keep trying.

[YusufNoor]

As salam(u) alaikum,

I'd like to further discuss why I'm thinking about this...First of all, my best friend and I are very close..I feel like she is my blood family..her and her children I love..and I don't ..mean in a homosexual way...I would take a bullet for her and her children anyday. Her family brings the best joy into my life. I couldn't be jealous of her in any way regardless.even in that situation. I highly respect her. She is of character, a good and knowledgeable Muslim,...I'm not lusting for her husband. I've only seen him once while he dropped her off at my house...I want this because I share bond that goes beyond friendship..but family..and id like to offically be a part of it...i don't know much about him..only that he is friendly and greets me Islamically over the phone when she isnt home and i leave a msg...she is a revert to Islam...for 8 years now I think. Very wise...She must have learned alot from him...hes intelligent from which she tells me he knows all about computers and phones electronics. Qualities I admire..They have a happy home...With the strong feelings i have I thought I could make it even happier :D

:sl:

May Allah grant you the best of situations in the dunya and the Akhira.

go easy on your sister. why not "put her in charge" of finding you a husband? maybe joke that if she fails then she'll have to share hers. sound her out before asking seriously, she might feel hurt. if she has a good understanding of the Din, she should be OK - just be easy on her. you don't want her to end up thinking that you only want her as a friend so you can get her man. even if you both know that is not true, it might be her first and most painful reaction.

wa Salaam

[Cabdullahi]

As salam(u) alaikum,
she tells me he knows all about computers and phones electronics. Qualities I admire.

I would like to take this opportunity to address all those aliens out there that im a brother who is good with computers and electronics

[Ali Mujahidin]

:sl:

Speaking as a person who had been there and done that with regards to polygamy, I can say with dead certainty that polygamy is not at all what anyone, who had never experienced it, thinks it is. For example:

1. Some men may think that they can treat their multiple wives justly but I can tell you from hard experience that treating multiple wives with justice is as easy as, say, trying to keep your balance with your feet on two different pieces of ice floes.

2. Some women may think that they can accept polygamy. At least that's what they think before they get a co-wife. After they get a co-wife, they will discover emotions in themselves which they never thought they had. No prize for guessing what those emotions might be.

So, the best thing I can suggest is to ask your best friend to ask her husband to help look for a husband for you. And when she asks what kind of husband you would like, say someone like her husband. Make sure to add emphatically you would like to marry someone like her husband but not her husband. Then beg Allah for guidance. Maybe you can try this dua from surah Al-Qasas, verse 24. It is said to be very effective when used to look for a wife. I imagine it would work equally well when used to look for a husband.

One other thing, from what you have said, you have a great friend. Husbands are a dime a dozen but good friends like that can only be found once in a lifetime. WaLLahu aklam.

[Zafran]

I would like to take this opportunity to address all those aliens out there that im a brother who is good with computers and electronics

salaam

By computers and electronics she doesnt just mean the playstation.

On a serious note I think you need to talk to his wife first.

peace

[Muslim Woman]

Salaam


there are so many unmarried / divorced persons around ; but still it's so hard to find partner for marriage .


sis , as already advised , do Istekhara salat first . Also , u must not talk to him or any other non -muharim in private .

[Dagless]

My sister in Islam Aisha...is my bestest friend in the whole world..shes family to me.She thinks same as me.

Her name is Aisha and your online name is Aisha? Anyone else getting hints of "Single White Female" here? If you have the same hairstyle as her I think we might be too late.

Anyway, I agree with everyone else; ask your friend generally first. That's only if you are sure there is no way you can find someone else you like.

Btw this is one of the best topics ever.

[AishaRayann]

I would like to take this opportunity to address all those aliens out there that im a brother who is good with computers and electronics

on a funny note: do you mean outer space aliens or illegal aliens?


I think I'm going to make dua on it for a while. Think it over for a few months...and see if i still feel the same way. I dont want to jump the gun on a big decision like that.Then, if I still feel the same way..I will ask her if dua goes well. Thank you to everyone who replied.

[Hamza Asadullah]

on a funny note: do you mean outer space aliens or illegal aliens?


I think I'm going to make dua on it for a while. Think it over for a few months...and see if i still feel the same way. I dont want to jump the gun on a big decision like that.Then, if I still feel the same way..I will ask her if dua goes well. Thank you to everyone who replied.

Asalaamu Alaikum, Jazakallahu khayr for having the bravery to be upfront about this matter as it is not easy.

Firstly my sister it may be that you want what your friend has. You see the kind of life she is living with her husband and you wished you had the same. But i think you may be a bit naive about this matter. Although your friend may have mentioned she is open minded when it comes to her husband having a possible co-wife it doesnt necesserily mean she would like the idea in reality. Especially if you were to suggest such a thing then it may come as a shock to her and may even ruin your friendship with her. Women can be very jealous creatures and it would not be easy for your friend to accept such a thing in reality. It may also be that you are reading the signs wrong.

Instead of "taking out a few months to think over this matter" i think you should continue your search for a pious man and ask of Allah to do what is best for you with regards to finding you a good pious man. Do not think about this too much because that way you may get distorted thoughts about it and start having scenarious in your head of your life together with your friend and the husband and the children. Although this may be a perfect scenario in your mind it certainly is not reality.

I think you should just concentrate on looking for a partner and ask your friend to also help you and tell her to ask her husband to look out for any potentials. You should never pin your hopes on ths or think about this at all but know that as long as you make the necessery effort in looking for a partner using all of the permissable means and put your full reliance, hopes and faith in Allah then no doubt he will do what is best for you.

And Allah knows best in all matters

[nature]

:sl:


The married sis mite have sed shes open to the idea, but when it actually happens then its a whole different story. The emotions that the first wife has to go thru takes a lot of sabr, and even though you may think your going to be a great addition to the family, the hurt that this sis will be feeling esp in the beginning, it takes a lot of time to get over, and eventually accept. Put yourself in this sister's shoes, how would you feel if you were all loved up 2.4 kids and then another woman tries to muscle in ?? and its your best friend at that ? I think your just craving for something similar to this sisters's life maybe ?


Btw i have nothing against polygamy, i even considered it myself, (& have 2 aunties in polygmaous marriages,) I like you thort it would be relatively easy to do, but after hearing some of the stories from 1st wifes, & thinking how i would personally handle it, i really didnt have it in me to cause pain to another sister. I get its sunnah and power to those that can deal with it, but i personally couldnt do it, and i think those that think its an easy practice, really its not as simple or straightforward as that. Im not married but if i was all loved up and my best friend had eyes on my man, then i would be extremely hurt, yeh im open to polygamy as well but if it came to the crunch i dont think i wud bear it well.


What do your own family think ? Theres plenty of men out there, what about talking to your friend and getting her husband to *look * for someone ?

if your still serious about this then i suggest you talk to other sisters in polygamous marriages and do so deep soul searching...as to what you really want from marriage, would you be happy sharing your husband ? what if the guy wants to take a third wife, will you be able to handle it ? also these kids that they already have together just cos they have love for you now, doesnt mean they'll love you once their dad takes you as a 2nd wife. Depending on the ages, its gona take a lot of time and they'll prob even reject you ? & why does it have to be your best friends husband ?

I'm not trying to be negative sis, i just think you really need to think about this carefully, it takes a lot of courage and sabr from all parties involved.

Just dont give up hope on finding someone single & make plenty of dua.



:wa:

[Cabdullahi]

on a funny note: do you mean outer space aliens or illegal aliens?


.

You know aliens love brothers who are well versed with electronics and computers and brothers love aliens who can take good care of them, living in harmony inside the spaceship,fixing electronics and cooking delicious alien food

[Abu Zainab]

I would like to take this opportunity to address all those aliens out there that im a brother who is good with computers and electronics

ROTFL...Man you are awesome

May Allaah grant you a wife who would be a coolness for your eyes (and who doesn't care if you are good in computers or electronics or playstation lol)

[Ansariyah]

I'm pretty speechless. I would never ever go after my best friends husband. Thats just not right. No matter how good looking, or how happy their household is.

If you really love your friend as much as u claim, u should let her be happy. If she comes to you inviting you to marry her husband thats a different story. Otherwise, look elsewhere.

[S_87]

hmmm DONT ASK HER
what you can do is hint, like tell her youre looking for a husband, wouldnt mind polygamy and ask her if she or her husband knows anyone...but it has to come from her.
and dont think your friendship will be the same/survive after marriage.

[innocent]

I cant speak for anyone else but if my best friend (if I had one) or any friend suggested something like that to me it would change things between us forever and I wouldnt see her in the same way ever again. Why dont you just ask her and her husband to look for a husband for you? If you specifically want to be a second wife (i cant imagine why) then they can look for someone who is looking for a second wife.
I would strongly advise against suggesting that you marry her husband.

[kingkong]

Why do you want to be a 2nd wife when there are plenty of men out there? Back in the time of the Prophet, there were many wars and so the females outnumbered the males and there was no choice but for women to be 2nd and 3rd wives etc.

But the population split is far more even now and there are plenty of good men and good women available, you just have to find them.

Let's say that there isn't a man available who is single and young and pious, why would you marry your friend's husband?

If a woman came to me and wanted to be a second wife, I would say NO NO NO, there are plenty of good brothers out there, find one of them. Or better still, why not do it the recommended way, get yoru family to find you a man.

Actually brings another question, why are you doing this search yourself? Surely your parents/family can help you out?

[جوري]

I think we're all walking on egg shells because it is a religious allowance. But it isn't an injunction!!!.. my opinion is that you're coveting your friend's husband while being envious of her and what she has. You might not see it this way but I have to suspect that you posted the problem here because you wanted an outside view... the view of many here is that even though it is an allowance, you're taking advantage of your friendship and a religious view that your friend has that might not make her emotionally comfortable at all especially when it involves you in the picture...You want what your friend has instead of creating that for yourself with someone else and in my personal opinion that doesn't make you a very good friend.
No woman who truly loves her husband wants to share him.. openness to the idea and acceptance of what God decreed doesn't mean that it won't be subject to human emotions, comparisons, wrangles etc.

visit singleMuslim site they've a zillion brothers there many Egyptians if you like Egyptians who are dexterous in all sorts of electronics and let your friend in peace with her little family. Be a friend not a third wheel!

disclaimer: Allah swt a3lam that isn't my intention to offend you but it is just how this situation comes off!

:w:

[Ghazalah]

:sl:

Firstly, despite you both saying that you don't mind co-wives I still think your friend might have a slightly different view if she found out her husband is going to marry her best friend, however I could be wrong and she might be okay with the idea, but I think you should ask her first and then see how things move on from there.

Secondly, there will always be tension between co-wives as well as jealousy, even with the Prophets wives, so I think you should acknowledge the fact that because of this your friendship with each other might change.

Thirdly if everything goes well and everyone's happy then may Allah SWT bless your marriage inshAllah. :)

[sabr*]

As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم):

The reason why Islam has been resilient and flourishing is because it doesn't require our opinions and uneducated input.

We are not even surprised on the lack of religious advice and the over abundance of in my opinion advice.

The co-wife is an allowance that Allah has granted in various situations.


REREAD OPINION GIVERS!

Sahih Bukhari Volume 7, Book 62, Number 53:

Narrated Thabit Al-Banani:

I was with Anas while his daughter was present with him. Anas said, "A woman came to Allah's Apostle and presented herself to him, saying, 'O Allah's Apostle, have you any need for me (i.e. would you like to marry me)?' "Thereupon Anas's daughter said, "What a shameless lady she was ! Shame! Shame!" Anas said, "She was better than you; she had a liking for the Prophet so she presented herself for marriage to him."


Sahih Bukhari Volume 7, Book 62, Number 27:

Narrated Abu Huraira:

The Prophet said, "A woman is married for four things, i.e., her wealth, her family status, her beauty and her religion. So you should marry the religious woman (otherwise) you will be a losers.

We have no idea even if the brother is able to maintain two wifes. No one knows a persons personal financial situation.

An-Nisa (The Women) 4:3

وَإِنْ خِفْتُمْ أَلاَّ تُقْسِطُواْ فِي الْيَتَامَى فَانكِحُواْ مَا طَابَ لَكُم مِّنَ النِّسَاء مَثْنَى وَثُلاَثَ وَرُبَاعَ فَإِنْ خِفْتُمْ أَلاَّ تَعْدِلُواْ فَوَاحِدَةً أَوْ مَا مَلَكَتْ أَيْمَانُكُمْ ذَلِكَ أَدْنَى أَلاَّ تَعُولُواْ (4:3)
Wain khiftum alla tuqsitoo fee alyatama fainkihoo ma taba lakum mina alnnisai mathna wathulatha warubaAAa fain khiftum alla taAAdiloo fawahidatan aw ma malakat aymanukum thalika adna alla taAAooloo

4:3 (Y. Ali) If ye fear that ye shall not be able to deal justly with the orphans, Marry women of your choice, Two or three or four; but if ye fear that ye shall not be able to deal justly (with them), then only one, or (a captive) that your right hands possess, that will be more suitable, to prevent you from doing injustice.

A woman with a lack of Taqwa and Iman would forget the allowance made by Allah and inject her personal feelings and emotions regarding accepting a co-wife. No one knows what is in the heart of this sister and
disparaging her character stating she is attempting to steal her friends husband is crossing the line.

Those comments would be expected from a Western feminist and not practicing Muslims.

Use your Wali to protect your interests and read our sticky on The Muslim Marriage Process. Insha Allah

http://www.islamicboard.com/showthread.php?t=134292619



Jazakumullahu Khair

[AishaRayann]

Well, my problems are overwhelming and seem impossible..im american revert living in south carolina,usa... in the "bible belt"...seriously you cant go in 5 mile radius where i live without seeing 10-20 churches..as many as 5 on the same road. My parents are divorced. I don't speak to my father for the things he did to me and my mother...for over 10 years now...hes an atheist...my mother is a die hard Christian..the rest of my family are Christians...so I cannot ask my family.

I have and NEVER will do Muslim Marriage sites again.
Then, I met someone on facebook from Egypt...who i knew as a friend for a long time.Knew him altogether for 4 maybe 5 years. At some point when i became Muslim...i become unsure of myself..because my family wouldnt leave me alone..i cried alot...so i stayed gone out of depression a few times maybe a month at a time sometimes.he got enganged to marry a girl while i was away he knew the reasons why i would take off...he supposidly didnt marry her..but i swear he did...especially when i looked at his fb page and said he was enganged to this girl and not me.i become furious...after that nothing but lies...this was the first man i truely loved. so yeh it hurt


Ive been searching and im tired of it...im going to be 26 next month...im getting old...who wants a 30 yr old woman to marry? everyone always search for someone young...im not young anymore.Thats all what men to see to want is a girl not a woman...you see it on marriage profiles all over. age 18-25. where does that leave me?!?! sorry for being angry...im just sick!

second of all... the honest truth about why i want to be a co-wife..even though id prefer 1st...is because i need to be able to keep my health insurance..im on my moms plan..she has very good insurance because she works for the biggest hospitial in the region.I have some health issues that require me to take 12-15 pills a day. The medications are expensive without insurance...i wouldnt be able to afford even one of them off of her insurance. One of the meds is $2500 for 30 day supply without insurance.I need them to live.

Then theres the thought of helping each other out with cooking and cleaning..if one could do half of this and half of that..make things simplier.


I dont know im just aggrevated and confused is all.

[Ghazalah]

^I think you need need a break. From the sound of things a lot of rash decisions were made and you had to bear the consequences, don't worry about age, 26 is not old. So I think you should let yourself heal for a moment from your past. Time is a great healer.

Before thinking of marrying your best friends husband, have you prayed Istikhara? If not, before anything pray it first.

Also, go into your local masjid and talk to the Imaam or even get your best friends husband to ask him on your behalf?

Despite how you're feeling, never forget Allah knows everything, what you have been through, so turn to him and trust him. His plans for our lives are always better than our dreams.

[in-the-shadows]

I think we're all walking on egg shells because it is a religious allowance. But it isn't an injunction!!!.. my opinion is that you're coveting your friend's husband while being envious of her and what she has. You might not see it this way but I have to suspect that you posted the problem here because you wanted an outside view... the view of many here is that even though it is an allowance, you're taking advantage of your friendship and a religious view that your friend has that might not make her emotionally comfortable at all especially when it involves you in the picture...You want what your friend has instead of creating that for yourself with someone else and in my personal opinion that doesn't make you a very good friend.
No woman who truly loves her husband wants to share him.. openness to the idea and acceptance of what God decreed doesn't mean that it won't be subject to human emotions, comparisons, wrangles etc.

visit singleMuslim site they've a zillion brothers there many Egyptians if you like Egyptians who are dexterous in all sorts of electronics and let your friend in peace with her little family. Be a friend not a third wheel!

disclaimer: Allah swt a3lam that isn't my intention to offend you but it is just how this situation comes off!

:w:

while it's true that when you really love someone you may not want to share them in any way with someone else, it's also true that having a part of them is better than not having them at all. but that is not at all the case here. just a thought.

[Alpha Dude]

second of all... the honest truth about why i want to be a co-wife..even though id prefer 1st...is because i need to be able to keep my health insurance..im on my moms plan..she has very good insurance because she works for the biggest hospitial in the region.I have some health issues that require me to take 12-15 pills a day. The medications are expensive without insurance...i wouldnt be able to afford even one of them off of her insurance. One of the meds is $2500 for 30 day supply without insurance.I need them to live.

Are polygamous marriages recognised where you are?

[جوري]

while it's true that when you really love someone you may not want to share them in any way with someone else, it's also true that having a part of them is better than not having them at all. but that is not at all the case here. just a thought.

I disagree with that .. for many it is all or none.. but as I stated it is certainly an allowance and there isn't much room for personal opinions or what Hailey, Sandra or Fatima would personally do with the situation. I assume when folks post on a public forum that they're looking for a more objective view of their situation..

best,

[in-the-shadows]

also, to the OP, after reading your situation i think the only reason you want to marry this brother is because you see how happy your friend is with him and you see their happy family and because you don't have one yourself you see this as a way of getting what you don't have. you may not think this, but this is psychology - google it. of course it is natural to lust after what you don't have. so it is understandable that you want to marry this man because in your mind you see this man = happiness, so you think if i had him, me = happy. but what you need to understand is that how it appears now, all happy and lovey dovey and you getting along with the wife and kids, it may change after you marry him, and in fact i can almost guarantee it would because this is 2011. kids might start hating you and you might not want to take a bullet for the first wife anymore. also, you said you live in the states, where polygamy is illegal. how would you provide legal proof for your marriage? what if you had children? legally what would you do? marriage and everything is ok, but you need to think about these other things too. if you are having trouble finding someone to marry in the States, why do you not consider moving to a muslim country where you can be with more muslims and find someone appropriate? do NOT try to find someone yourself. this is why you have been hurt before. be patient. you are complaining about being 26, there are people with serious disabilities who are treated like crap by everyone and have no marriage prospects ever, so think of people like that and be thankful for all that you do have. instead of looking online, you need to consider moving to a place where there is a huge active muslim community, get really involved at the mosque, find elders to look for someone for you, and do it that way. sitting around and considering your friend's husbands is when you know the situation is getting sad - you're young, it's not the end of the world. however if marriage is SO serious to you (which i personally don't understand why it is, but moving on) then get real and do things properly.

[جوري]

Ive been searching and im tired of it...im going to be 26 next month...im getting old...who wants a 30 yr old woman to marry? everyone always search for someone young...im not young anymore.Thats all what men to see to want is a girl not a woman...you see it on marriage profiles all over. age 18-25. where does that leave me?!?! sorry for being angry...im just sick!

That is very interesting.. Not 'everyone' and not 'always' marries in their twenties .. people marry when Allah swt wills not when it is forced and contrived!

:w:

[in-the-shadows]

I disagree with that .. for many it is all or none.. but as I stated it is certainly an allowance and there isn't much room for personal opinions or what Hailey, Sandra or Fatima would personally do with the situation. I assume when folks post on a public forum that they're looking for a more objective view of their situation..

best,

well yes, the all or none approach, often used by people who have too much pride. "if i can't have all of you, i don't want any of you" - i question whether people like that truly love someone? because lets say you really really love someone. wouldn't you want to at least speak to them or see them once in a while, as opposed to never? saying "if i can't have 100% of you, i'm not ok with that" is like saying "i have too much pride to not have you ALL to myself". at least, that is how i view it. not disagreeing, just sharing my opinion.

wsalam.

[جوري]

well yes, the all or none approach, often used by people who have too much pride. "if i can't have all of you, i don't want any of you" - i question whether people like that truly love someone? because lets say you really really love someone. wouldn't you want to at least speak to them or see them once in a while, as opposed to never? saying "if i can't have 100% of you, i'm not ok with that" is like saying "i have too much pride to not have you ALL to myself". at least, that is how i view it. not disagreeing, just sharing my opinion.

wsalam.

I don't think pride has anything to do with it.. I certainly don't wish to meander the topic.. but when someone you love dies.. do you mummify them and put them in a glass casket where you can keep an eye on them because part of them is better than nothing? Sometimes relationships die just like people die but love doesn't die along with that finality and I think it is rather altruistic not prideful-- anyhow that is a digression that isn't pertinent to her situation..

best,

[Ghazalah]

well yes, the all or none approach, often used by people who have too much pride. "if i can't have all of you, i don't want any of you" - i question whether people like that truly love someone? because lets say you really really love someone. wouldn't you want to at least speak to them or see them once in a while, as opposed to never? saying "if i can't have 100% of you, i'm not ok with that" is like saying "i have too much pride to not have you ALL to myself". at least, that is how i view it. not disagreeing, just sharing my opinion.

Believe it or not people have different levels of love, and even though Islam allows polygamy and I fully understand why, I'd either have all my husband or I'd not have him at all. You need to understand the nature of women, while some can bare the brunt of sharing a husband and have no problem with it, others cannot and it's not to do with having too much pride.

[Cabdullahi]

..also then find out hes an illegal alien from Afghanistan.

Aliens from Afghanistan dont know jack about computers and electronics

[sabr*]

The honest truth about why i want to be a co-wife..even though id prefer 1st...is because i need to be able to keep my health insurance..im on my moms plan..she has very good insurance because she works for the biggest hospitial in the region.I have some health issues that require me to take 12-15 pills a day. The medications are expensive without insurance...i wouldnt be able to afford even one of them off of her insurance. One of the meds is $2500 for 30 day supply without insurance.I need them to live.

Then theres the thought of helping each other out with cooking and cleaning..if one could do half of this and half of that..make things simplier.


I dont know im just aggrevated and confused is all.

As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم):

We will still support sisters in the face of bias views and negative social stigmas against women.

That being said Ukhti AishaRayann your negative experience had nothing to do with Islam and everything to do
with the chauvinistic brother who implemented cultural and tribal habits if the account of events you stated are
factual. There is no need for us to apologize for his un-lslamic deeds.

Now we request you delete the personal information that you provided in your post. That was just too much information
and surprised a moderator didn't advise you regarding it.

The amount of information we quoted is enough.

Now your true intent of desiring a Muslim marriage to maintain and continue health insurance should be reevaluated.
This will only confirm those who stated you had nefarious reasons to desire that marriage.

Visit your local Masjid immediately for guidance and assistance. It will difficult to find it in a opinionated forum.

http://www.almasjid.com/

Masjid search for your area:

http://www.islamicity.com/orgs/actio...nding&-lop=and

[AishaRayann]

Aliens from Afghanistan dont know jack about computers and electronics

I don't know brother..I was on Islam chat 4 years ago and saw a man in a cave on a labtop...with webcam on..I didnt understand what he was saying as i do not read arabic. I'm actually serious about this..which is the scary thing lol

[Cabdullahi]

I don't know brother..I was on Islam chat 4 years ago and saw a man in a cave on a labtop...with webcam on..I didnt understand what he was saying as i do not read arabic. I'm actually serious about this..which is the scary thing lol

shizzle! it must have been this guy

[in-the-shadows]

I don't think pride has anything to do with it.. I certainly don't wish to meander the topic.. but when someone you love dies.. do you mummify them and put them in a glass casket where you can keep an eye on them because part of them is better than nothing? Sometimes relationships die just like people die but love doesn't die along with that finality and I think it is rather altruistic not prideful-- anyhow that is a digression that isn't pertinent to her situation..

best,

lol, your logic there is quite interesting to say the least. no of course when someone you love dies you can't mummify them and keep them. my point was about something completely different. that for a living person, you want them part of the time even if you can't have them all the time. so if doctors told me someone who i loved was brain dead and would never speak or react ever again, i would want them in that capacity as opposed to never having them around at all. my original post was about love though, that when you love a (living) person who you can marry according to Islam, and you truly love them, you want them in any capacity even if you cannot have them 100%. isn't this what polygamy is all about? wives sharing the same husband because they would rather have a part of their husband's life rather than not have them at all?

also, you said relationships die but love doesn't. well if love doesn't die, i would say it's rather stupid to say "actually Allah said i COULD have you as a co-wife, but i can't even though yes i do love you" - i mean talk about an oxymoron. it's like saying, yes i love you, but i love my pride more, because i can't bear to share you with someone else, so my solution to that is to completely not have you at all - i think actually any logical person would say that is quite stupid. because by saying no to that you're inflicting a punishment on yourself and the other person who loves you, so in no way is it altruistic to say "sorry all or nothing" when Islam allows otherwise, rather it's quite selfish and a person who does such a thing does indeed have a lot of pride, that OR a severe lack of love, because it's their pride/lack of love that stops them from saying ok i will make a compromise. what else would you call that other than pride and selfishness? if you love someone and you can marry them according to Islam but choose not to, it's your pride and ego that got in the way, nothing else. the rest is all dressed up in lace and flowery, the bit about "relationships die, love doesn't" yeah well to me that's just a claim that it didn't die, obviously that sort of love isn't what i count as love in my books because when you love someone you don't stop wanting them unless it's something Allah made haram. i'm an odd type though so i don't expect others to understand the way i love or think i suppose. i respect your opinions though sister, and i do understand where you are coming from, of course you are entitled to your own opinion just as i am to mine. if i said anything which was rude/hurtful i am sorry, i just have very strong opinions so it seems i am rude sometimes when i am not trying to be.

wsalam

[in-the-shadows]

Believe it or not people have different levels of love, and even though Islam allows polygamy and I fully understand why, I'd either have all my husband or I'd not have him at all. You need to understand the nature of women, while some can bare the brunt of sharing a husband and have no problem with it, others cannot and it's not to do with having too much pride.

i do understand the nature of women, i am one myself. it says otherwise on my profile as i do not wish to be contacted by some odd men on the internet who are looking for a girl. but moving on, yes, i definitely agree people have different levels of love. when you say you don't want someone at all, you don't love them enough, you love your pride more. when you love someone so much and in such a crazy way that you would rather have them 2 minutes in a day and sit down and see them, rather than not at all, that is a different (higher) level of love than someone who says yes i love you but sorry can't be with you because you won't return my love the way i want. no offense to you, just my opinion. don't say it's not something with having too much pride, it is, you call it personal choice, i say it like it is and call it pride, because your personal choice stems from your ego/pride which says no i can't share. you need more love and overall higher levels of imaan to be able to "bear the brunt" as you call it, but maybe if you looked at it differently, you would see it's not exactly a burden, it's something Allah made halal, so all these women who say oh you don't understand the NATURE of women, um, actually, Allah is the one who created you, HE knows your nature better than anyone, even you yourself, and if He thought women should be able to "bear the brunt" then anyone who cannot, simply doesn't have enough imaan and also thinks they know better than Allah. sorry, not to throw flames at you, as my sister i love you and respect you, but don't say it's not about pride, it is. because if it was only your heart talking based on Islam free of these contrived ridiculous ideas of monogamy that western media has tried to imprint into our minds, you would say something else.

of course if i had someone and i didn't have to share them i wouldn't. no woman wants to. i get that. but if your husband says to you, i want to marry someone else also, and you say, sorry then divorce me, that is both against Islam and that also means you have too much pride and not enough love. when it comes down to between having someone you love yes, optimally we want them all to ourselves, but if you can't and you choose 0 instead of 50%, it's because you didn't love the person themselves, you loved the way they loved you, and your love was dependent on other things. that's not love. so in that case it's actually good you would leave them, cause you didn't love them, you loved the relationship.

[جوري]

lol, your logic there is quite interesting to say the least. no of course when someone you love dies you can't mummify them and keep them. my point was about something completely different. that for a living person, you want them part of the time even if you can't have them all the time. so if doctors told me someone who i loved was brain dead and would never speak or react ever again, i would want them in that capacity as opposed to never having them around at all. my original post was about love though, that when you love a (living) person who you can marry according to Islam, and you truly love them, you want them in any capacity even if you cannot have them 100%. isn't this what polygamy is all about? wives sharing the same husband because they would rather have a part of their husband's life rather than not have them at all?

Thank you for acknowledging my logic indeed. I have my own (medical) views on keeping someone who is brain dead on life support which might not be compatible with yours given the above. But outside of medicine, from a humanitarian view I don't think keeping someone who is medically declared brain dead alive by artificial means as any form of love either. I accept that death is natural and that we shall all taste it and that it is the only way to attain eternal life. it would be more painful for me to see someone I love with tubes going in and out of them from every orifice along with a loss of dignity, decline in function for my own selfish reason of wanting them around in any physical form!

also, you said relationships die but love doesn't. well if love doesn't die, i would say it's rather stupid to say "actually Allah said i COULD have you as a co-wife, but i can't even though yes i do love you" - i mean talk about an oxymoron. it's like saying, yes i love you, but i love my pride more, because i can't bear to share you with someone else, so my solution to that is to completely not have you at all -

I am afraid you lost me with a part of that statement above, and I see a need to inject 'pride' into it as well when as stated pride has nothing to do with it. Sometimes circumstances are above love. Love is just an emotion that is independent from worldly constraints and I certainly don't need to paint several scenarios where it is possible to love someone very much but have to let them go for a greater good!

i think actually any logical person would say that is quite stupid. because by saying no to that you're inflicting a punishment on yourself and the other person who loves you, so in no way is it altruistic to say "sorry all or nothing" when Islam allows otherwise, rather it's quite selfish and a person who does such a thing does indeed have a lot of pride, that OR a severe lack of love, because it's their pride/lack of love that stops them from saying ok i will make a compromise.

I think this is just either your inner child speaking through rose tinted glasses or a lack of abstract thought to what real life circumstances might throw your way!

what else would you call that other than pride and selfishness? if you love someone and you can marry them according to Islam but choose not to, it's your pride and ego that got in the way, nothing else. the rest is all dressed up in lace and flowery, the bit about "relationships die, love doesn't" yeah well to me that's just a claim that it didn't die, obviously that sort of love isn't what i count as love in my books because when you love someone you don't stop wanting them unless it's something Allah made haram. i'm an odd type though so i don't expect others to understand the way i love or think i suppose. i respect your opinions though sister, and i do understand where you are coming from, of course you are entitled to your own opinion just as i am to mine. if i said anything which was rude/hurtful i am sorry, i just have very strong opinions so it seems i am rude sometimes when i am not trying to be.

Again, see previous responses and try to differentiate between an allowance and an injunction!
It maybe ok for you to take one or two wives, and it maybe ok for your wives to share, by the same token that is an unacceptable living arrangement for someone else.. As God has made an allowance of polygamy he has also made an allowance with divorces and we have seen many during the time of the prophet.. perfectly pious people who couldn't live under certain circumstances. It isn't up to you to decide what is considered selfish or oxymoronic.

on a last note, I am not 'hurt' at all by what you've written we're exchanging opinions. I may not like your certain choice of words but I accept that this is your line of thinking, I am not denigrating your opinion either.. I am just painting a picture that is outside what you might conceive in your mind as having to be 'logical' to everyone else. Also since when is love at all logical?

best,

[جوري]

i do understand the nature of women, i am one myself.

That is kind of creepy!
Would you like it if a male made his profile to female and applied to the sister section?
I don't think that it is forthcoming and somewhat disrespectful to your brothers and sisters on board.

:w:

[CosmicPathos]

Most men and women would like to stay in a 1-to-1 relationship but what if someone wants to "enjoy" marriage yet not share himself/herself totally with the other person in marriage. I think we call it in modern times "personal space." But how huge should be personal space?

Regarding life-prolonging equipment for a brain-dead person, it indeed would be selfish to keep your loved-one alive just because "you dont want to let them go." but what if this want was mutual, we wanted to not them go because they let us that far through mutual understanding? Moreover, I do not agree with DNR. But yes, it is painful to see a pious Muslim with metastatic cancer in similar pain on death bed as an atheist with metastatic cancer. But, I guess, workings of God. Made us without asking us, will do whatever He wishes without asking us.

but yes, this was not the topic of this thread. I got acarried away.

[Ali Mujahidin]

the honest truth about why i want to be a co-wife..even though id prefer 1st...is because i need to be able to keep my health insurance

:sl:

Sorry for this stupid question but you lost me there. How does becoming a co-wife keep you on your mom's insurance plan?

[AishaRayann]

because it wouldnt be legally recognized in my country as being married...if i get marryed as 1st wife..it takes my me off my moms insurance plan...fine print

[ProudMuslimSis]

:sl:

Speaking as a person who had been there and done that with regards to polygamy, I can say with dead certainty that polygamy is not at all what anyone, who had never experienced it, thinks it is. For example:

1. Some men may think that they can treat their multiple wives justly but I can tell you from hard experience that treating multiple wives with justice is as easy as, say, trying to keep your balance with your feet on two different pieces of ice floes.

2. Some women may think that they can accept polygamy. At least that's what they think before they get a co-wife. After they get a co-wife, they will discover emotions in themselves which they never thought they had. No prize for guessing what those emotions might be.

So, the best thing I can suggest is to ask your best friend to ask her husband to help look for a husband for you. And when she asks what kind of husband you would like, say someone like her husband. Make sure to add emphatically you would like to marry someone like her husband but not her husband. Then beg Allah for guidance. Maybe you can try this dua from surah Al-Qasas, verse 24. It is said to be very effective when used to look for a wife. I imagine it would work equally well when used to look for a husband.

One other thing, from what you have said, you have a great friend. Husbands are a dime a dozen but good friends like that can only be found once in a lifetime. WaLLahu aklam.

Wise advice above. Thanks for all for sharing because I have learned a lot on the topic.
In the past, I did hear that polygamy was almost necessary because widows and their children would starve to death if it was not for another man taking them in. Also, I have heard that Christian have/had the similar idea where a brother was obligated to marry his sister in-law if his brother passed. But, in this case, I don't see a survival emergency as there is still assistance from a parent (i.e. insurance from mother.) Therefore, it might be better to concentrate on feeling better, getting to know one's self, and giving it more time instead of complicating things further.

[sabr*]

i do understand the nature of women, i am one myself. it says otherwise on my profile as i do not wish to be contacted by some odd men on the internet who are looking for a girl.

As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم):

Subhanallah! Deception runs rampant. What makes a woman think that men in a Muslim forum would even be
attracted to someone that practices deception. Your profile could allow you to enter into the brothers section
because the moderator thinks you are male.

This is a classic case just because a person claims to be Muslim you have no idea what you are dealing with.

We could be overreacting but just provides a look inside of the created persona in this forum. If a male posted
that they used a female gender so women wouldn't contact them their account would be disabled.

It wouldn't even make sense to disable it because the person would just go create another profile.

And the person hasn't as of this post changed the deceptive profile gender.

That user profile reputation should be a perpetual zero.

The double standard in action.

[CosmicPathos]

As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم):

Subhanallah! Deception runs rampant. What makes a woman think that men in a Muslim forum would even be
attracted to someone that practices deception. Your profile could allow you to enter into the brothers section
because the moderator thinks you are male.

This is a classic case just because a person claims to be Muslim you have no idea what you are dealing with.

We could be overreacting but just provides a look inside of the created persona in this forum. If a male posted
that they used a female gender so women wouldn't contact them their account would be disabled.

It wouldn't even make sense to disable it because the person would just go create another profile.

And the person hasn't as of this post changed the deceptive profile gender.

The double standard in action.

I would be shocked and angry indeed if a brother was acting as a sister in the profile, I am sure everyone would dislike him. But this sister acting as a brother did not come as shocking or worrisome to me, not sure why. I guess modern stereotypes about male chauvinism has made us (me) ignore the opposite side's ill doings.

But I guess this is internet.

[nature]

Ive been searching and im tired of it...im going to be 26 next month...im getting old...who wants a 30 yr old woman to marry?

Statements like this we can do without thank you very much. In fact you would be suprised how many men actually preferred the "wiser woman" that has a couple of years past the teen, hormonal stages.:D Im not far from that age, & im sure there are plenty of sisters on this board, that are more in their mature years. ask any1 in the western world whether 30 is 2 old ?? If your meant to marry then you will by allahs will. Move to a muslim country, get established in the area, make yourself known at halaqas/mosque, chat to other sisters and find some1 the halal way. oh and make plenty of dua. If allah wants you to marry at 35 or 40, then so be it. dont act like life is over just cos you cant get married at a certain age, and put other sisters down cos of your own closed views.

:sl:

That is very interesting.. Not 'everyone' and not 'always' marries in their twenties .. people marry when Allah swt wills not when it is forced and contrived!

:w:

Wouldnt it just be great, if people actually took note of this ?

[in-the-shadows]

i was new to this forum and thought maybe i would meet some brothers and sisters, perhaps some who would have similar values and thoughts, but i believe the maturity levels here are a bit low. you guys are generally just very unfriendly to newcomers and seem to have your own "ring" and make others feel like an outsider. just a reminder, that is not how good muslims act really. you all just love to act like internet thugs and act all tough, i'd love to see how you all are in real life. it's easy to hide behind a screen all day. how is it deception if i am doing it to protect myself as a woman? there is too much free mixing on this forum. what makes you think there is not? look at this place. all this "brother/sister" stuff, dressed up as being halal, it's actually not. just FYI. in fact, i think most people on this forum need to re-think their own Islam because they claim to be muslim but pseudo-flirt all day with free interaction between the genders, which is against shariah. i am free to use my judgement as i wish and if i want to conceal my gender, that's my wish. i have less than 15 posts, you need hundreds to apply to the guys section. if i have no intention to even talk to a guy in ANY way, there is no way i would have any interest in going and joining the guys section? how is that even logical? you all need to calm down and before you go telling others they are deceptive try and understand others perspectives. you could have said oh by the way, sorry, noticed you were new sister, hey, did you know, you can NOT specify your gender on here if you are worried? nice way of treating someone who might not know? yeah, no, jump to a conclusion and say i am a deceiver and i'm not a muslim, i "claim" to be one. shame on you. you are the one who claims to be one and your username is sabr when you have none. Islam requires you to think well of all your brothers and sisters, what sort of a muslim are you to say i claim to be a muslim based on one stupid post on a forum, who handed you the right to be mr. know it all and tell me i'm not muslim? keep your opinions to yourself sir. it's men like you i needed staying away from me. i did not expect any of my muslim brothers to ever act like this towards me and your words were extremely rude and hurtful. there are non-muslims on this website who yes i do not trust them. yes i am rude, and it's so you don't get any "ideas". that's what a good muslim woman is supposed to act like. we are supposed to alter our voices when we talk to men, alter our appearance to make it non-attractive, so no way was i going to go on a forum and reveal my gender, because to me it is wrong, and i am islamically right. i did not know there was an "undisclosed" option, maybe you could have given me the benefit of the doubt and told me about it before jumping to your irrational and rude conclusions. as women, we are supposed to act in a rude way and not be so "oh brother, salaam, how was your day" yeah that's what i call halal flirtation. you guys try to dress it up as something when in reality it's something totally wrong. so don't go all scholarly on me, learn your own facts before you come preaching because you seem to have a lot to learn.

[in-the-shadows]

Thank you for acknowledging my logic indeed. I have my own (medical) views on keeping someone who is brain dead on life support which might not be compatible with yours given the above. But outside of medicine, from a humanitarian view I don't think keeping someone who is medically declared brain dead alive by artificial means as any form of love either. I accept that death is natural and that we shall all taste it and that it is the only way to attain eternal life. it would be more painful for me to see someone I love with tubes going in and out of them from every orifice along with a loss of dignity, decline in function for my own selfish reason of wanting them around in any physical form!


I am afraid you lost me with a part of that statement above, and I see a need to inject 'pride' into it as well when as stated pride has nothing to do with it. Sometimes circumstances are above love. Love is just an emotion that is independent from worldly constraints and I certainly don't need to paint several scenarios where it is possible to love someone very much but have to let them go for a greater good!


I think this is just either your inner child speaking through rose tinted glasses or a lack of abstract thought to what real life circumstances might throw your way!

Again, see previous responses and try to differentiate between an allowance and an injunction!
It maybe ok for you to take one or two wives, and it maybe ok for your wives to share, by the same token that is an unacceptable living arrangement for someone else.. As God has made an allowance of polygamy he has also made an allowance with divorces and we have seen many during the time of the prophet.. perfectly pious people who couldn't live under certain circumstances. It isn't up to you to decide what is considered selfish or oxymoronic.

on a last note, I am not 'hurt' at all by what you've written we're exchanging opinions. I may not like your certain choice of words but I accept that this is your line of thinking, I am not denigrating your opinion either.. I am just painting a picture that is outside what you might conceive in your mind as having to be 'logical' to everyone else. Also since when is love at all logical?

best,

salam,

has anyone ever told you that you may have a slight personality disorder? i think you do. you go around on the boards all day flaunting your medical expertise. do you think it makes you better than everyone else? your attitude is quite rude and condescending. you seem to value your opinion higher than others. there are nice ways of saying all the things you want to say, but since you have decided to be rude and Allah has stated in the Quraan that we do not need to be nice to those who hurt us, i will return the favour. first off, your medical opinion or not, i don't care about really, i don't see why you need to always mention your medical expertise in everything to validate your thoughts and opinions, perhaps because you are insecure about your opinions so you think that you need to tell others you indeed have been told you are smart be some medical school. well let me tell you, your logic is so flawed in so many ways it is quite laughable to me. i mean look at this " it would be more painful for me to see someone I love with tubes going in and out of them from every orifice along with a loss of dignity, decline in function for my own selfish reason of wanting them around in any physical form!" RIGHTTTTTT and THAT is not selfishness, that YOU would be the one with the problem seeing them in pain?! now that is a contradictory statement if i ever saw one, it's truly hilarious. well it is to someone at a slightly higher level of understanding/logic than you.

secondly, you would not have been able to understand this, because you need to have understood what i wrote in the first place, which you did not, but let me clarify - i was speaking about a very SPECIFIC situation where you love someone, you can marry them, there are no other problems between you, and you decide to NOT marry them based just on the fact that you do not wish to be a part of a polygamous marriage just because you do not want to share. you can say it any way you like: those personal opinions about not wanting to be a part of a polygamous marriage, assuming all else is fine, which is what i was suggesting in my post, those stem from pride and a lack of understanding of Islam. cause a true muslim woman who is free of trashy western emotions, will blindly follow what Allah says and would be ok with her husband being married to someone else in addition to her and would not say "all or nothing".

my inner child eh - you seem like the most childish one here as you need aggression and rage to get a point across? secondly, i am well aware of what life may or may not through my way, who are you to tell me i have a rose tinted view of the world when you do not even know me? i mean talk about judgemental people on this forum. perhaps it can be expected, it's the internet. i do know there can be many other problems in life alright. but i was talking about a SPECIFIC situation, about women who are happily married and their husband says i want to marry someone else and they say sorry no can do, i can't share you. sure i understand life is complicated and can throw a lot at you, but it's you who has a black and white view of the world because it's that all or nothing thought process, which is by the way, also unIslamic. do you think you know better than Allah? shame on you. your ego is so great that not only do you think you are better than others, you also think you know better about Islamic matters.

i also get it's a choice, not an obligation. i believe i addressed that when i said, sure all women want to be with the one they love and optimally not share. but life can throw a circumstance at you where you have to make a choice between allowing your husband to marry again OR leaving your husband. you girls who say "all or nothing" would divorce your husbands, which is ridiculous and unislamic and stupid, and it's due to too much pride, lack of love, and overall lack of understanding of life and religion in general. the sooner you women realize that men are polygamous BY NATURE and ALLAH has decreed this, you will get over your pompous internet thug selves.


and i see you agree with me that "It isn't up to you to decide what is considered selfish or oxymoronic." - well you said something was selfish in the beginning of the post, so are you disagreeing with yourself? make up your mind first?

also, are you really a doctor? it's shocking to me. you are one of the most judgemental people i have ever seen. i am saying this not just based on my interaction with you right now, but i have been reading posts by you before this also and you have some serious personality problems. the internet is not for you to unload all your problems. you, of all people, should be more sensitive about talking about "mummifications" and what not, because you should realize the sensitivity of such issues are realize the other person may have been though something very hurtful and hearing this is painful for them. don't just blindly write whatever you want. live up to your responsibilities, if you really are a doctor. and if you can't do that, at least be a good muslim, which you don't act like on here. how you are in real life, i don't know, so i will not comment on that. but as for here, you come across as someone who doesn't understand simple things, loves jumping to conclusions, has no regard for others opinions and overall has too much of an inflated ego due to your doctor status. get over yourself and stop thinking you're better and more mature than everyone else due to your age or education. i may be half your age and no where nearly as educated as you, but i may have been though much more in life than you can imagine sitting behind your screen, so learn to be humble. come back down to Earth. you head floats in the clouds. i have an exceedingly good intuition and i can tell you something, you probably have many problems in life due to this flaw in your character, so please try to fix it.

wsalam and i have changed my gender to undisclosed and will for sure, not be posting here ever again because this is just not a nice welcoming place where people have good healthy friendly discussions. everyone needs to resort to being rude to get some attention.

[May Ayob]

Salaam

Sister Aisha i'm sorry i've been a little too strong about my opinions, now that you have clarified your situation , i would like to share my opinion :)

i know you are going through difficult times , and you feel down because You think age matters and all that , but honestly age doesn't matter at all , the prophet PBUH marrie Lady Khadija RA nwhen he was 25 and she was 40 and he didn't marry another woman during his life time. which i thnk says alot , people who have ethic and some kind of integrity don't really mind things , such as age, race or nationality, skin color, level of handsomness or beauty at all , all they want is someone who shares the same thoughts, ideas and someone who is compatible, all that matters is what is inside , Never listen to conceited people around you whether they are muslims or nonmuslims telling you that there is no hope of you getting marrierd God is capable of providing you Something so wonderfull they will and envy you and regret the mean things or any type of hurting they caused you

you need to focus on your inner self beleive there is no point of marrying someone because you think they are attractive or they speak about things that interest you, i'm sorry but i don't even think you know hios personality or character to me he would be a stranger maybe there is going to be a problem in sharing your ideas with this person i personally agree with some members in this forum you really have to pray for someone that suits you . I think you're problem is from inside and this is why you started searching for happiness by limited means.

My advice for you is to leave her husband , regarding your friendship she is your best friend now , but if you get married , you will be her number one enemy,
i beleive the chilren love you because their own mother loves you , and i think they trust you and marrying their father will make them more than just hate you because they will think that you have deceived their mother, children are if not always then most of the time loyal to their mother. and it is more likely that they will strong feelings of hatred towards you they will never put you in place of their mother and they will see you as a woman who is trying to steal their father's heart from their mother.


Search for someone else , this is my advice , you don't have to follow it , otherwise i am very aware of the fact no matter how much i speak or write against it if God has willed for it to happen then it Will happen , and same No matter how much i speak or write for it if God doesn't will for it to happen then it will never happen. I think you have already enough to face in your life and this will cause even more hardship.


I hope i helped


regarding the gender issue , you know what it's here choice if she's insecure about males contacting her then i think we should leave her alone, i'm sorry you feel that people here are some what not very nice , i'm new as well and ive had the same feeling but it really doens't matter , it's their choice you , and i and everyone will not be asked about how someone behaves, we should focus on being as courteous as possible and returning evil with good :)

I hope i helped.

[nature]

i have changed my gender to undisclosed and will for sure, not be posting here ever again because this is just not a nice welcoming place where people have good healthy friendly discussions. everyone needs to resort to being rude to get some attention.

:sl:

Ive only skimmed over this thread, sis theres a lot of strong personalities on this board, & its the net so things are going to get misconstrued from time to time. No need for anyone to leave the board, if you want to remain undisclosed thats your choice, nothing to do with anyone else. We should always try to purify our intentions.

I see a lot of posts written in anger on this board, maybe before we press submit we could all sit back and think of what were posting first ?

Keep posting sis, were all here to learn.:D

:wa:

[Cabdullahi]

this sister did what she thought was necessary to protect herself from the smelly ass bad bachelor brothers

her intention was not to apply to the brothers section or cause deception

but are we brothers really that bad that sisters have to act as brothers to deter brothers

[YusufNoor]

because it wouldnt be legally recognized in my country as being married...if i get marryed as 1st wife..it takes my me off my moms insurance plan...fine print

:sl:

i'm not sure if that's true. if you just do nika'a without getting and signing a marriage certificate then it's the same if you did that as a 2nd wife.

what you need to do is ask an Imam if it's OK to "lie to the state" in order to get the benefits you need. TECHNICALLY, whether you are 1st, 2nd or whatever number wife you are, THAT MAN cannot marry you if he cannot SUPPORT you. providing your health care is part of supporting you. it's a difficult situation and i see many immigrants who readily lie in order to get their free health care, food stamps, their Section 8 housing and even their "no cost [but really no obligation] TOTALLY FREE 2nd wives. i know Imams who do it. having rechecked the thread [for a cool post that i didn't find], i see you're 26, that means in 2 years you are off of your mom's insurance anyway. so this is something that you need to figure out.

I cant speak for anyone else but if my best friend (if I had one) or any friend suggested something like that to me it would change things between us forever and I wouldnt see her in the same way ever again. Why dont you just ask her and her husband to look for a husband for you? If you specifically want to be a second wife (i cant imagine why) then they can look for someone who is looking for a second wife.
I would strongly advise against suggesting that you marry her husband.

that bold part is what you need to consider. women are women, and even though ploygyny IS allowed, NO ONE says that a "current" wife will act rationally regarding the matter.

you are between a rock and a hard place because of your health. THAT is not your friends fault. you might be seen as wanting her husband for "dunya" reasons [so you can lie and keep your insurance] instead of Islamic reasons.

i don't envy you, but i actually sympathize. why? because i think that you should be able to lie to get health care, NOT food stamps and Section 8 though. it's a truly difficult situation.

May Allah make it easy on you and may He guide you throughout all of your life!

wa Salaam

[sabr*]

i was new to this forum and thought maybe i would meet some brothers and sisters, perhaps some who would have similar values and thoughts, but i believe the maturity levels here are a bit low. you guys are generally just very unfriendly to newcomers and seem to have your own "ring" and make others feel like an outsider. just a reminder, that is not how good muslims act really. you all just love to act like internet thugs and act all tough, i'd love to see how you all are in real life. it's easy to hide behind a screen all day. how is it deception if i am doing it to protect myself as a woman? there is too much free mixing on this forum. what makes you think there is not? look at this place. all this "brother/sister" stuff, dressed up as being halal, it's actually not. just FYI. in fact, i think most people on this forum need to re-think their own Islam because they claim to be muslim but pseudo-flirt all day with free interaction between the genders, which is against shariah. i am free to use my judgement as i wish and if i want to conceal my gender, that's my wish. i have less than 15 posts, you need hundreds to apply to the guys section. if i have no intention to even talk to a guy in ANY way, there is no way i would have any interest in going and joining the guys section? how is that even logical? you all need to calm down and before you go telling others they are deceptive try and understand others perspectives. you could have said oh by the way, sorry, noticed you were new sister, hey, did you know, you can NOT specify your gender on here if you are worried? nice way of treating someone who might not know? yeah, no, jump to a conclusion and say i am a deceiver and i'm not a muslim, i "claim" to be one. shame on you. you are the one who claims to be one and your username is sabr when you have none. Islam requires you to think well of all your brothers and sisters, what sort of a muslim are you to say i claim to be a muslim based on one stupid post on a forum, who handed you the right to be mr. know it all and tell me i'm not muslim? keep your opinions to yourself sir. it's men like you i needed staying away from me. i did not expect any of my muslim brothers to ever act like this towards me and your words were extremely rude and hurtful. there are non-muslims on this website who yes i do not trust them. yes i am rude, and it's so you don't get any "ideas". that's what a good muslim woman is supposed to act like. we are supposed to alter our voices when we talk to men, alter our appearance to make it non-attractive, so no way was i going to go on a forum and reveal my gender, because to me it is wrong, and i am islamically right. i did not know there was an "undisclosed" option, maybe you could have given me the benefit of the doubt and told me about it before jumping to your irrational and rude conclusions. as women, we are supposed to act in a rude way and not be so "oh brother, salaam, how was your day" yeah that's what i call halal flirtation. you guys try to dress it up as something when in reality it's something totally wrong. so don't go all scholarly on me, learn your own facts before you come preaching because you seem to have a lot to learn.

Peace be to you:

If you review our posts in this thread we defended the sister as all our threads do. (Until she revealed her true
motive). If you research our threads we are the opposite of chauvinistic and omit cultural and tribal slants.

The backlash we endure because we adhere to implementing Quran and Sunnah without the tribal and
cultural biases puts us outside the forums select circle.

Review our threads, we promote the rights Allah has given women.
You might learn how Muslimah conduct themselves.

We will accept your criticism while realizing the source. That rant would warrant a firm response but we realize
your foundation. Our posts and threads never include smiley faces or flirts. Not the reason we visit this forum.

We perform du'a Allah increases your Taqwa (Allah consciousness) and Iman (Conviction, belief).

We suggest you start here in the following threads. There isn't a need for you to post anymore.

1. http://www.islamicboard.com/showthread.php?t=134306261

2. http://www.islamicboard.com/showthread.php?t=134306485

3. Ideal Muslimah : http://www.msacarleton.com/Library/e...20Muslimah.pdf



Beneficial Threads


Morals & Manners

http://www.islamicboard.com/manners-...b-manners.html

http://www.islamicboard.com/manners-...-andalusi.html

http://www.islamicboard.com/manners-...ers-islam.html

http://www.islamicboard.com/manners-...m-bukhari.html

http://www.islamicboard.com/manners-...b-manners.html


Purification of the Soul

http://www.islamicboard.com/manners-...aw-yishah.html

http://www.islamicboard.com/manners-...epentance.html

http://www.islamicboard.com/manners-...plication.html

http://www.islamicboard.com/manners-...ake-allah.html

http://www.islamicboard.com/manners-...ing-stone.html

[sabr*]

As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم):

The moderator that is assigned to this thread should consider closing it.

The best advice has been provided to the OP and the posts are becoming far
from edifying or educating.

[Muhaba]

quick way to turn your bestest friend into your worst enemy: by asking to marry her husband

[جوري]

salam,

has anyone ever told you that you may have a slight personality disorder?

wa3lykoum aslaam..
Not really.. but would be interested in your diagnosis!

i think you do. you go around on the boards all day flaunting your medical expertise.

'flaunting' medical expertise doesn't cause one a personality disorder but I am sure we can amend the DSM with your personal opinions :)

do you think it makes you better than everyone else?

Not at all do you?

your attitude is quite rude and condescending.

That is an adequate assessment of your person so far!

you seem to value your opinion higher than others. there are nice ways of saying all the things you want to say, but since you have decided to be rude

Another adequate assessment of your person.. what is with the rant?

and Allah has stated in the Quraan that we do not need to be nice to those who hurt us, i will return the favour. first off, your medical opinion or not, i don't care about really, i don't see why you need to always mention your medical expertise in everything to validate your thoughts and opinions, perhaps because you are insecure about your opinions so you think that you need to tell others you indeed have been told you are smart be some medical school. well let me tell you, your logic is so flawed in so many ways it is quite laughable to me. i mean look at this " it would be more painful for me to see someone I love with tubes going in and out of them from every orifice along with a loss of dignity, decline in function for my own selfish reason of wanting them around in any physical form!" RIGHTTTTTT and THAT is not selfishness, that YOU would be the one with the problem seeing them in pain?! now that is a contradictory statement if i ever saw one, it's truly hilarious. well it is to someone at a slightly higher level of understanding/logic than you.

Why would I want to seek your validation? Also you're quite apt as posing a faulty scenario and then answering it yourself with the same linear tract that created it in the first place!

secondly, you would not have been able to understand this, because you need to have understood what i wrote in the first place, which you did not,

ha? ;D

but let me clarify - i was speaking about a very SPECIFIC situation where you love someone, you can marry them, there are no other problems between you, and you decide to NOT marry them based just on the fact that you do not wish to be a part of a polygamous marriage just because you do not want to share. you can say it any way you like: those personal opinions about not wanting to be a part of a polygamous marriage, assuming all else is fine, which is what i was suggesting in my post, those stem from pride and a lack of understanding of Islam. cause a true muslim woman who is free of trashy western emotions, will blindly follow what Allah says and would be ok with her husband being married to someone else in addition to her and would not say "all or nothing".

Again, nothing selfish about that even if we're to stick to your very narrow view of a marriage. It is a matter of what one will be able to psychologically tolerate and still be a good wife!

my inner child eh - you seem like the most childish one here as you need aggression and rage to get a point across? secondly, i am well aware of what life may or may not through my way, who are you to tell me i have a rose tinted view of the world when you do not even know me? i mean talk about judgemental people on this forum. perhaps it can be expected, it's the internet. i do know there can be many other problems in life alright. but i was talking about a SPECIFIC situation, about women who are happily married and their husband says i want to marry someone else and they say sorry no can do, i can't share you. sure i understand life is complicated and can throw a lot at you, but it's you who has a black and white view of the world because it's that all or nothing thought process, which is by the way, also unIslamic. do you think you know better than Allah? shame on you. your ego is so great that not only do you think you are better than others, you also think you know better about Islamic matters.

Who said it is unislamic to not want to share your husband? Perhaps you can evince that for us from the Quran and Sunnah before speaking as if an authority figure on the subject!

i also get it's a choice, not an obligation. i believe i addressed that when i said, sure all women want to be with the one they love and optimally not share. but life can throw a circumstance at you where you have to make a choice between allowing your husband to marry again OR leaving your husband. you girls who say "all or nothing" would divorce your husbands, which is ridiculous and unislamic and stupid, and it's due to too much pride, lack of love, and overall lack of understanding of life and religion in general. the sooner you women realize that men are polygamous BY NATURE and ALLAH has decreed this, you will get over your pompous internet thug selves.

Again, evince for me from the Quran or Sunnah that it is 'Unislamic' to divorce your husbands based on such grounds!

and i see you agree with me that "It isn't up to you to decide what is considered selfish or oxymoronic." - well you said something was selfish in the beginning of the post, so are you disagreeing with yourself? make up your mind first?

There there.. Why are you so angry and confused? what is with the 47547647864986 word rant? :D Go ahead show me in a quote the contradiction that has so upset you!

also, are you really a doctor? it's shocking to me. you are one of the most judgemental people i have ever seen. i am saying this not just based on my interaction with you right now, but i have been reading posts by you before this also and you have some serious personality problems. the internet is not for you to unload all your problems. you, of all people, should be more sensitive about talking about "mummifications" and what not, because you should realize the sensitivity of such issues are realize the other person may have been though something very hurtful and hearing this is painful for them. don't just blindly write whatever you want. live up to your responsibilities, if you really are a doctor. and if you can't do that, at least be a good muslim, which you don't act like on here. how you are in real life, i don't know, so i will not comment on that. but as for here, you come across as someone who doesn't understand simple things, loves jumping to conclusions, has no regard for others opinions and overall has too much of an inflated ego due to your doctor status. get over yourself and stop thinking you're better and more mature than everyone else due to your age or education. i may be half your age and no where nearly as educated as you, but i may have been though much more in life than you can imagine sitting behind your screen, so learn to be humble. come back down to Earth. you head floats in the clouds. i have an exceedingly good intuition and i can tell you something, you probably have many problems in life due to this flaw in your character, so please try to fix it.

Does it matter to you whether I am a doctor or not? If you really are a doctor, if you really are a doctor, if you really are a doctor? why are you seething with this much hate? Where have I said to you that I am a doctor in such words or 'flaunted' my medical expertise?
Also what do you know of Good Islamic character? I mean surely you've heard of:
Abou Hurayrah relates that Allah's Messenger (peace be upon him) said: "Whoever believes in Allah and the Last Day should speak a good word or remain silent. And whoever believes in Allah and the Last Day should show hospitality to his neighbor. And whoever believes in Allah and the Last Day should show hospitality to his guest."� [Sahih Al-Bukhari and Sahih Al Muslim]

For a good pious Muslim who also has tremendous knowledge in psychology and diagnosing random folks on a forum and reached milestones in Islamic jurisprudence, and fiqh you sure are exasperated!
calm down pls.

wsalam and i have changed my gender to undisclosed and will for sure, not be posting here ever again because this is just not a nice welcoming place where people have good healthy friendly discussions. everyone needs to resort to being rude to get some attention.

Al7mdlillah .. we thank you!

best,

[جوري]

yes i am rude,

Then why project?

that's what a good muslim woman is supposed to act like.

You should evince that as well from the Quran and Sunnah..

best,

[in-the-shadows]

wsalam

at least i'll give you this: you have some manners and some patience. intelligence? severely lacking. sorry, but it's true. sometimes we DO need someone else to see us and give us their opinion because you may think you and the rest of your bully friends are helping others and you're all so awesome, but in no way are your posts non-chauvinistic. rather they are very intimidating and rude, especially to newcomers. and if someone speaks out against you, you try and thwart them and get rid of them. it's high time someone got you all off your high horses. i see nice people coming into this forum all the time and them leaving while all you goons intimidate them. if when i say i am a sister simple because i do not want to be contacted by men, which is actually a smart thing to do as a muslimah, could be deception to your ignorant eyes, but i don't really care, YOU jumped to the conclusion that i was here to deceive people and to get into the guys section and all of these other things - overactive imagination at work. calm down. if you stopped thinking everyone was out to "get you" maybe you'd realize i have no need or want to decieve anyone. it's all in your head. you all just want to jump on your newest pray and rip them to pieces, it's what your hobby is.


and you sir need not tell me how a muslimah conducts herself, i am well aware of this. in fact i am a step ahead of other "sisters" on this forum because i, unlike them, have realized that interacting with "brothers" on this forum is haram, unless i am of course speaking to them exactly how i am speaking to you now, in a harsh manner. in other ways, inshaAllah i will become better, i am in no way saying i am the best muslim, sure i have a lot to learn, but a little less to learn than others. moreover your logic is not at work here - if i was a deceiver, why would i say "i am a sister?" - that would get in the way of my supposed master plan to get into the guys section wouldn't it? lol. i mean just crazy. plus, i need not post examples of flirtation that goes on here. go check any thread, you will have brothers replying to sisters with all sorts of smiley faces and being nice and what not. sure, be nice, but it's too much to be doing it on the internet with the opposite gender, you wouldn't do it in the street, so it's not ok to do it on the internet.

also, might i add. i have a view that all these links you people post trying to give dawah, these all promote bidaah actions. i will not read what you posted in the form of a link because if you knew your Islam well, you would realize, reading some link you gave to me on the internet is not a means of me increasing my taqwa or piety, only and strictly direct forms of worship as decreed by my Allah, those i will use to increase my taqwa and piety. your adherence to Sunnah and Shariah in my opinion at least is off track when you are trying to give dawah but don't even realize that you are telling someone to waste time reading a link that God knows who wrote, i don't know the source of it, it may or may not contain wrong and unreliable information, may contain biddah innovations, may be by a kaafir raafidi or an athiest posing as a muslim, i don't know who wrote all that. even IF it's a very good muslim who wrote it, even the great scholars of Islam can be wrong, eg. Imam Hanifa who promoted the use of amulets, may Allah forgive him and reward him with Jannah, but my point being that PEOPLE are PEOPLE, we all make mistakes, so in religious matters, we should not trust what other PEOPLE say or their opinions, we need to strictly stick to the Quraan and that is where it ENDS. i accept no one person as my awliah. there is no doing this AND that. doing all the prescribed means of worship, AND reading your links. what does that mean? are you saying your links would have some information better than the Quraan? When Allah said in the Quraan that he has completed our religion for us with the Quraan. finished! END of discussion. there is no room for all this lace and whipped cream on top that you try to give others. you are promoting biddah stuff. it needs to stop. i have enough intelligence also to realize not only do i need to pick my sources carefully, but also to realize that THIS IS NOT A FORM OF WORSHIP - which is what you people have turned it into. you go i hope you increase your taqwa and piety and inshaAllah i will, but the way you tell me to do it is a biddah action, which is to do it via the reading if your links as opposed to telling me to go read the glorious Quraan in it's pure and original and untainted form. if you had told me to do that and pray even more, fast more, read more Quraan, i would actually believe you when you said that you strictly adhere to sunnah and shariah. but in this regard you are not. Islam is simple. that is the beauty of it. you do not need links on the internet to learn in and in fact a muslim who knows what they are doing does not even trust stuff on the internet and knows he/she does not need to read up on personal opinions of others to increase their piety, they know in fact that that is biddah and incorrect. when there are guaranteed ways of worship which my Prophet conveyed to me through his sunnah and my Allah has told me of in the Quraan, i would first engage more in those than engage in these biddah actions. there are unaltered sources of getting that information, the Quraan and Sahih al-Bukhari, those are the ONLY links you should be giving and that is it. there should be no words from anyone else in there when it comes to a religious matter. literally zero. we as young muslims need to be ever aware of this growing issue if too much biddah in our religion and we need to thwart this disease where everyone becomes an internet scholar and starts writing up articles and giving them to others, your intentions may be right, but the action is in fact wrong if you ask a learned scholar of Islam. our next generations would follow a different form of Islam if this continues, so it is a disease. you will have sisters on this forum, who will become mothers and who think this is a good idea, an online forum, telling their kids here babies, sit here and read this article, here kiddo, go see this discussion, and the kids will learn that this is how you worship and draw closer to Allah, which is WRONG. brothers i don't care about, sure i hope they improve for the sake of Allah, but they have a limited role of teaching children, but the quality of sisters around here is just alarming to me, it scares me that so much time is wasted on these forums by people who in fact should be drawing closer to Allah via prescribed methods of worship, not this, especially the girls it's worrisome because they will have kids and if they don't even know this basic thing about Islam, how are they supposed to pass it on to the next generation? a head full of biddah leads to more biddah in the next generation. really, someone needs to cause a revolution in our generation because wow, we have come so far from the time of the sahabah, where you have someone saying they are not chauvinistic and acting like that in the next line and saying you should increase your piety, here start at this INTERNET FORUM. THINK about how wrong that is! use your brain and wake up! please, i beg you. save yourself before you die.

call me a backward wahabi if you like, i stick to sunnah and shariah and know it a lot better than you might think i do. i have strict interpretations yes, and strict opinions, but if you can share yours, i can share mine. i will in fact post because i am alerting people of your biddah actions which involve but are not limited to:

1) interaction between genders, REGARDLESS of what it is for/what method it is in - HARAM
2) intimidating/fighting with others and making them feel bad when they have not provoked you in any way - HARAM
3) promoting internet links as a method of worship - SUPER HARAM + BIDDAH

everyone need to STOP wasting precious valuable time on this website before they become like this vale's lily person with thousands of posts mostly fighting with others, all that precious time could have been spent praying instead. maybe that would soften all of your hearts more.




[QUOTE=sabr*;1439448]

Peace be to you:

If you review our posts in this thread we defended the sister as all our threads do. (Until she revealed her true
motive). If you research our threads we are the opposite of chauvinistic and omit cultural and tribal slants.

The backlash we endure because we adhere to implementing Quran and Sunnah without the tribal and
cultural biases puts us outside the forums select circle.

Review our threads, we promote the rights Allah has given women.
You might learn how Muslimah conduct themselves.

We will accept your criticism while realizing the source. That rant would warrant a firm response but we realize
your foundation. Our posts and threads never include smiley faces or flirts. Not the reason we visit this forum.

We perform du'a Allah increases your Taqwa (Allah consciousness) and Iman (Conviction, belief).

We suggest you start here in the following threads. There isn't a need for you to post anymore.

[Ar-RaYYan]

As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم):

Subhanallah! Deception runs rampant. What makes a woman think that men in a Muslim forum would even be
attracted to someone that practices deception. Your profile could allow you to enter into the brothers section
because the moderator thinks you are male.

This is a classic case just because a person claims to be Muslim you have no idea what you are dealing with.

We could be overreacting but just provides a look inside of the created persona in this forum. If a male posted
that they used a female gender so women wouldn't contact them their account would be disabled.

It wouldn't even make sense to disable it because the person would just go create another profile.

And the person hasn't as of this post changed the deceptive profile gender.

That user profile reputation should be a perpetual zero.

The double standard in action.

Asalamu Alaykum

I havent posted for a long time but your hurtful post (and couple of others) was hard to ignore and I would like to clarify few things:

You are being very unfair to the sister. There was no deception in her post at all just a reasonable answer why she did not want to disclose her gender. Believe it or not there has been sisters here who kept receiving non-purposely messages from 'brothers'. The sister stated that she does not want to be contacted by men; what is so deceiving about that? Her intention was not to deceive the moderators or the members and in anywhere in her post has she come across as wanting to apply to the brothers section. I think that is the purpose for the 'undisclosed' gender option: for people who dont feel comfortable disclosing their gender for any reasons and anyways islamicboard would have removed the option if they viewed as deceiving.

Actually no you cant enter any of the gender section if you are 'undisclosed'. Your gender must be displayed on your profile.

I think this sister especially since she is a newcomer deserves an apology.

[جوري]

wsalam

wa3lykoum-- I take it you're not leaving?

[جوري]

1) interaction between genders, REGARDLESS of what it is for/what method it is in - HARAM

you need to evince that from the Quran and Sunnah.. Islamic society wasn't a segregated society pls, do not pass fatwa ad lib!

best,

[جوري]

Asalamu Alaykum

I havent posted for a long time but your hurtful post (and couple of others) was hard to ignore and I would like to clarify few things:

You are being very unfair to the sister. There was no deception in her post at all just a reasonable answer why she did not want to disclose her gender. Believe it or not there has been sisters here who kept receiving non-purposely messages from 'brothers'. The sister stated that she does not want to be contacted by men; what is deceiving about that? Her intention was not to deceive the moderators or the members and in anywhere in her post has she come across as wanting to apply to the brothers section. I think that is the purpose for the 'undisclosed' gender option: for people who dont feel comfortable disclosing their gender for any reasons islamicboard would have removed the option if they viewed as deceiving.

Actually no you cant enter any of the gender section if you are 'undisclosed'.

I think this sister especially since she is a newcomer deserves an apology.

:sl:

This sister didn't put her gender as 'Undisclosed' she posed as a brother to be honest I already have doubts to her/his gender. A member here was banned before for doing just that. it is dishonest and dangerous especially when there is the 'undisclosed' option.. also there is an option in the profile to not receive messages at all if one were really worried about unlawful contact, in lieu of labeling everyone as a would be flirt.. If any thing it casts doubt to the integrity of the brothers here!

:w:

[piXie]

Come on brothers and sisters, Let it Go!

[Cabdullahi]

:sl:

This sister didn't put her gender as 'Undisclosed' she posed as a brother to be honest I already have doubts to her/his gender. A member here was banned before for doing just that. it is dishonest and dangerous especially when there is the 'undisclosed' option.. also there is an option in the profile to not receive messages at all if one were really worried about unlawful contact, in lieu of labeling everyone as a would be flirt.. If any thing it casts doubt to the integrity of the brothers here!

:w:

Sisters are subtle with their jibes but they make sure it hits you really hard, brothers talk with their fists

Female response : salam sister, how are you, hope you are doing well insha'Allah, has anyone ever told you that you may have a slight personality disorder

Male response : dont mess with me, im gonna punch you down


the sister is a sister, maybe it was a poor decision to act as a brother but her intentions were good, she wanted to escape the desperados

[Ar-RaYYan]

:sl:

This sister didn't put her gender as 'Undisclosed' she posed as a brother to be honest I already have doubts to her/his gender. A member here was banned before for doing just that. it is dishonest and dangerous especially when there is the 'undisclosed' option.. also there is an option in the profile to not receive messages at all if one were really worried about unlawful contact, in lieu of labeling everyone as a would be flirt.. If any thing it casts doubt to the integrity of the brothers here!

:w:

Wa Alaykumu Salaam

Like I said before I havent been on the forum for a long time and I saw and can still see the sister has opted for the 'undisclosed' option and havent seen her posing as a 'brother' so I found it unfair when some people accused her of deception. Anywas if she has once opted as a brother I dont think her intention was to deceive anyone rather she viewed as a protection from unneccessary messages from the opposite gender.

[جوري]

Sisters are subtle with their jibes but they make sure it hits you really hard, brothers talk with their fists

Female response : salam sister, how are you, hope you are doing well insha'Allah, has anyone ever told you that you may have a slight personality disorder

Male response : dont mess with me, im gonna punch you down


the sister is a sister, maybe it was a poor decision to act as a brother but her intentions were good, she wanted to escape the desperados

wasn't this amusing? walhi I didn't even roll up my sleeves as I hate arguing against Muslims and I am not quite sure why the diatribe for seemingly innocuous observations or why they mertited this gore like reaction?..whatever form of catharsis was exercised and for whatever reason.. this is a prime example of what one guy can expect if he takes more than one wife!
so kudos to those who can

Wa Alaykumu Salaam

Like I said before I havent been on the forum for a long time and I saw and can still see the sister has opted for the 'undisclosed' option and havent seen her posing as a 'brother' so I found it unfair when some people accused her of deception.

khyer insha'Allah.. S/he changed it this morning after comments were made..

:w:

[in-the-shadows]

Then why project?



You should evince that as well from the Quran and Sunnah..

best,

i already did my job as a muslimah in acting towards you in a manner which would tell you what you are doing wrong. beyond this, i simply don't have that much time to engage in childish discussions with you. maybe you have all the time in the world judging from your post count, i don't. for you, this is a game, you just love fighting with others, there is nothing constructive there, and overall, i only spend time on those who i feel are worthy of some attention and capable of improvement. you too, engage in all sorts of biddah actions so it was necessary to speak up against you, but beyond that, at this point, i feel as though your heart is too closed in a shell of ego and arrogance for you to ever benefit from anything anyone else says, so i will not waste my time. you did not even respond to the actual arguments in my post, because i know that you know that you are in fact wrong, so it was quite sad that you had to resort to such childish actions again instead of actually intellectually challenging me. find something better to do than being an internet bully, it's quite sad.

you don't have your Islam right if you think that due to a personal opinion a woman can "legally" divorce her husband if he remarries. and for you to be posting on these forums where others can read it and learn wrong things, is a serious crime. i will say it again, not for you , but for others reading this - there is no room in Islam for a woman to rule over her husband and tell him what to do and act in an unislamic way and say i have a CHOICE to leave you if you marry again. we have loosened up too much with all this choice stuff, oh i have the choice to do it so i will. what sort of a woman can do that? i have zero respect for women like that who have no patience, and really, have no shame as a woman, because your husband is supposed to be your everything, he is a means of you gaining jannah, so to throw away such an important person due to an obviously unislamic reason, it is WRONG. Allah has made it halal, end of discussion, no room for personal opinions left. this is biddah that you are promoting and are ok with, saying that oh people can CHOOSE not to be with someone who re-marries, says who, you? Allah said otherwise. Prophet's wives did not ask for divorces when he got married again. so are we better than the Mothers of the Believers who were undoubtedly the best of all women? just stop. learn what a real muslim woman is and learn she has to make sacrifices and YES it's tough to see someone you love with someone else, i KNOW how it feels, jealousy is in the nature of a woman, but there is no fairness for a woman to divorce on the grounds that her husband re-married. unless her "opinions" she values more than Allah and the Prophet. maybe this is why the Prophet stated that women are lacking in their religion, they will let stupid worldly things get in the way due to hormones. especially women nowadays, i just don't understand. what happened to good quality women, seriously? women used to have babies in villages by themselves, no one to help them, they would rear them and raise them to be amazing muslims, and women would be patient and love their husbands even if they married 4 times, and now look at all these princesses influenced by trash in the world saying oh i can't POSSIBLY BEAR THE BRUNT of seeing someone i marry being with someone else. men have desires! maybe Allah will reward you much more if you are patient and let him gain a halal way of getting rid of these desires. women like these marry for themselves ONLY and not for the sake of Allah, because if they did it for the sake of Allah, they would be completely ok with their husband coming to them and saying i wish to marry someone else, because they would say Allah has sent this trial i will be patient and will seek my reward with Allah. in fact i would be happy if my husband was THAT honest with me, and told me that instead of going behind my back or even worse committing zina. women like these throw their husbands into sin and they resort to zina. being torn apart and devastated in your heart, i understand, projecting that to the extent of saying i will divorce you if you re-marry, that is wrong. that husband could also have said, i will divorce you and go marry someone else, but if he is just saying i want to get married again, that is halal, staying with him, it is a way of protecting your children and yourself financially, emotionally and legally. gain some sense. if he wants to go marry someone else, BE SMART, stay as his wife, even Allah rewards you, your kids will be grateful when they grow up that their mother is not divorced which has serious repercussions in society, you also have financial security and you can still also be with the person who you love, at least some of the time. Allah has protected us SO much in Islam and then you see girls like this who say oh i know better, and then you're divorced and sitting around with kids who resent you and no finances, men luring at you because you have no mahram, and you look stupid because if you had had some patience, it would all be different, and you only have your own stupid self to blame. it's frustrating to see such women, no deen, no dunya, no aakhirah.

stop promoting biddah actions, learn some patience, stop being such princesses and get over yourself. get that the point of marriage is to please Allah, not to please yourself.


and ms. vale's lily, here is your evidence, have a good life:

“No woman asks her husband for a divorce for no reason, but the fragrance of Paradise is forbidden for her.” (Narrated by Abu Dawood and others, and classed as saheeh by al-Albaani, may Allaah have mercy on him).



thank you to those who are nice on here, i appreciate your support. my intention was not to deliberately deceive anyone whatsoever, i am new and didn't know about the undisclosed option. now i do, so i changed it. i'm only human, i did not need to be flamed so much for a simple thing. i wouldn't SAY i am a woman if i was out to deceive absolutely everyone, it's against logic.

[Ghazalah]

to "bear the brunt" then anyone who cannot, simply doesn't have enough imaan and also thinks they know better than Allah. sorry, not to throw flames at you, as my sister i love you and respect you, but don't say it's not about pride, it is.

Who the hell are you to question my Imaan purely cuz I don't want to share my husband? Did I say I'm totally against it? No, I accept and understand the reason behind it. And I do not think I know better than Allah, why would I think like that? When I know the Creator knows more than the created. You seriously need comprehension skills, and I seriously doubt you understand the nature of women if you think it has anything to do with pride.

[Salahudeen]

Praise be to Allaah.

If a man is able to marry a second wife, physically and financially, and he can treat both wives in a just manner, and he wants to take a second wife, then he is allowed to do so according to Islam. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“… then marry (other) women of your choice, two or three, or four…” [al-Nisaa’ 4:3]

And this was the practice of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), and of his Companions (may Allaah be pleased with them), but apart from the Prophet, no one is permitted to have more than four wives.

It is well known that women are by nature jealous and reluctant to share their husband with other women. Women are not to be condemned for this jealousy, for it existed in the best of righteous women, the Sahaabiyyaat, and even in the Mothers of the Believers [the wives of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him)]. But women should not let jealousy make them object to that which Allaah has prescribed, and they should not try to prevent it; a wife should allow her husband to marry another woman for this is a kind of cooperating in righteousness and piety. According to a hadeeth whose authenticity is agreed upon, the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Whoever pays attention to his brother’s needs, Allaah will pay attention to his needs.”

The first wife’s consent is not a prerequisite for a man to take another wife. The Standing Committee for Issuing Fatwas was asked about this and replied as follows:

“It is not obligatory for the husband, if he wants to take a second wife, to have the consent of his first wife, but it is good manners and kindness to deal with her in such a manner that will reduce the hurt which women naturally feel in such situations. This is done by being kind to her and speaking to her in a gentle and pleasant manner, and by spending whatever money may be necessary in order to gain her acceptance of the situation.”

Concerning her request for divorce if her husband wants to marry another wife, this is a mistake. But they should examine the situation, and if she really cannot cope with living with another wife, then she can ask him for khula’ [ a kind of divorce instigated by the wife, whereby she forgoes the mahr]. If she can cope with living with the second wife, but it hurts her to do so, then she should be patient and seek the pleasure of Allaah. Thawbaan (may Allaah be pleased with him) narrated that the Messenger (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said:

“No woman asks her husband for a divorce for no reason, but the fragrance of Paradise is forbidden for her.” (Narrated by Abu Dawood and others, and classed as saheeh by al-Albaani, may Allaah have mercy on him).

If she bears it with patience, then Allaah will make it easier for her and will expand her chest (i.e., grant her peace and calm), and will compensate her with something good. The husband must also help her by treating her kindly, being patient with her for any jealousy etc. on her part, and overlooking her mistakes. And Allaah is the source of help.

Shaykh ‘Abd-Allaah al-Haydari.


http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/452/mariage

[جوري]

i already did my job as a muslimah in acting towards you in a manner which would tell you what you are doing wrong.

You need to refresh your handbook on your job as a Muslimah!

beyond this, i simply don't have that much time to engage in childish discussions with you.

That is interesting considering every time you grab hold of the keyboard your spewing a diatribe of puerile nonsense in non-paragraph format that we've to strain our eyes to sort through to find a morsel not borne of emotive nonsense and that has some sound basis in Islam! Unfortunately you've become a poster girl for the holier than thou Tartuffe.. preaching one thing and doing exactly the opposite .. what is with all the drive by shootings?

maybe you have all the time in the world judging from your post count, i don't. for you, this is a game, you just love fighting with others, there is nothing constructive there, and overall, i only spend time on those who i feel are worthy of some attention and capable of

Do tell where you've been constructive? All you have done thus far is self-congratulate while calling just about everyone else dumb, stupid, etc. etc. Are you really that blind to your own state of being?

improvement. you too, engage in all sorts of biddah actions so it was necessary to speak up against you, but beyond that, at this point, i feel as though your heart is too closed in a shell of ego and arrogance for you to ever benefit from anything anyone else says, so i will not waste my time. you did not even respond to the actual arguments in my post, because i know that you know that you are in fact wrong, so it was quite sad that you had to resort to such childish actions again instead of actually intellectually challenging me. find something better to do than being an internet bully, it's quite sad.

Go ahead and list the bida3as one by one I'll be waiting!

you don't have your Islam right if you think that due to a personal opinion a woman can "legally" divorce her husband if he remarries. and for you to be posting on these forums where others can read it and learn wrong things, is a serious crime. i will say it again, not for you , but for others reading this - there is no room in Islam for a woman to rule over her husband and tell him what to do and act in an unislamic way and say i have a CHOICE to leave you if you marry again. we have loosened up too much with all this choice stuff, oh i have the choice to do it so i will. what sort of a woman can do that? i have zero respect for women like that who have no patience, and really, have no shame as a woman, because your husband is supposed to be your everything, he is a means of you gaining jannah, so to throw away such an important person due to an obviously unislamic reason, it is WRONG. Allah has made it halal, end of discussion, no room for personal opinions left. this is biddah that you are promoting and are ok with, saying that oh people can CHOOSE not to be with someone who re-marries, says who, you? Allah said otherwise. Prophet's wives did not ask for divorces when he got married again. so are we better than the Mothers of the Believers who were undoubtedly the best of all women? just stop. learn what a real muslim woman is and learn she has to make sacrifices and YES it's tough to see someone you love with someone else, i KNOW how it feels, jealousy is in the nature of a woman, but there is no fairness for a woman to divorce on the grounds that her husband re-married. unless her "opinions" she values more than Allah and the Prophet. maybe this is why the Prophet stated that women are lacking in their religion, they will let stupid worldly things get in the way due to hormones. especially women nowadays, i just don't understand. what happened to good quality women, seriously? women used to have babies in villages by themselves, no one to help them, they would rear them and raise them to be amazing muslims, and women would be patient and love their husbands even if they married 4 times, and now look at all these princesses influenced by trash in the world saying oh i can't POSSIBLY BEAR THE BRUNT of seeing someone i marry being with someone else. men have desires! maybe Allah will reward you much more if you are patient and let him gain a halal way of getting rid of these desires. women like these marry for themselves ONLY and not for the sake of Allah, because if they did it for the sake of Allah, they would be completely ok with their husband coming to them and saying i wish to marry someone else, because they would say Allah has sent this trial i will be patient and will seek my reward with Allah. in fact i would be happy if my husband was THAT honest with me, and told me that instead of going behind my back or even worse committing zina. women like these throw their husbands into sin and they resort to zina. being torn apart and devastated in your heart, i understand, projecting that to the extent of saying i will divorce you if you re-marry, that is wrong. that husband could also have said, i will divorce you and go marry someone else, but if he is just saying i want to get married again, that is halal, staying with him, it is a way of protecting your children and yourself financially, emotionally and legally. gain some sense. if he wants to go marry someone else, BE SMART, stay as his wife, even Allah rewards you, your kids will be grateful when they grow up that their mother is not divorced which has serious repercussions in society, you also have financial security and you can still also be with the person who you love, at least some of the time. Allah has protected us SO much in Islam and then you see girls like this who say oh i know better, and then you're divorced and sitting around with kids who resent you and no finances, men luring at you because you have no mahram, and you look stupid because if you had had some patience, it would all be different, and you only have your own stupid self to blame. it's frustrating to see such women, no deen, no dunya, no aakhirah.

See previous paragraphs on the matter and evince your accusations with facts! Also what is with all this logorrhea? Do you have something of substance to impart beyond your personal opinion? I can't sort through bulky miasma and continuous catharsis!
What is upsetting you so much?

stop promoting biddah actions, learn some patience, stop being such princesses and get over yourself. get that the point of marriage is to please Allah, not to please yourself.

As stated pls. list the bid3as!

and ms. vale's lily, here is your evidence, have a good life:

“No woman asks her husband for a divorce for no reason, but the fragrance of Paradise is forbidden for her.” (Narrated by Abu Dawood and others, and classed as saheeh by al-Albaani, may Allaah have mercy on him).

When did I say that one should divorce her husband for no reason? do quote me on that!

best,

Concerning her request for divorce if her husband wants to marry another wife, this is a mistake. But they should examine the situation, and if she really cannot cope with living with another wife, then she can ask him for khula’ [ a kind of divorce instigated by the wife, whereby she forgoes the mahr]. If she can cope with living with the second wife, but it hurts her to do so, then she should be patient and seek the pleasure of Allaah. Thawbaan (may Allaah be pleased with him) narrated that the Messenger (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said:

Jazaka Allah khyran!

:w:

[in-the-shadows]

oh get a life. i quoted the same hadith that the brother above did, you say JazakAllah to him for the part of the fatwa that is the Sheikh's opinion (correct, but an opinion nevertheless) and then the SAME Hadith that is quoted in that fatwa, when i post that you dare to speak back? you need basic understanding of the english language. learning some big words and throwing them into a sentence doesn't make you smart. asking for a divorce from your husband due to the fact that he wants to re-marry based on your personal views on the matter, which are unislamic, they count as "no reason" as stated by the scholar in that fatwa. you're just stupid. get a life. not worth arguing with you.

[in-the-shadows]

it is biddah for you to go around saying that it is ok for a woman to divorce her husband as she may not be able to live with that situation due to her personal beliefs, if those beliefs are unislamic. there you go. happy?

[in-the-shadows]

Who the hell are you to question my Imaan purely cuz I don't want to share my husband? Did I say I'm totally against it? No, I accept and understand the reason behind it. And I do not think I know better than Allah, why would I think like that? When I know the Creator knows more than the created. You seriously need comprehension skills, and I seriously doubt you understand the nature of women if you think it has anything to do with pride.

sorry if the truth hurts. but in Islam we are supposed to let others know if they do something wrong. you are wrong, no question about it. your views on all or nothing are unislamic and therefore wrong. Hadith says if you ask your husband for a divorce for no reason, you would not be able to go to Paradise. this means asking for a divorce for no valid Islamic reason. reasons can be constructed by anyone. women can even say i want to divorce my husband because he snores. doesn't make it a valid reason. a valid reason has to be something that is backed by Islam. divorcing because you do not want to share is not backed by Islam and is not a valid reason. you are the one who need better comprehension skills cause you don't even understand basic concepts. go and learn. it does have to do with your ego and your pride because it sure has nothing to do with Islam, these views on oh i can't share, stop watching so many movies and get real.

[Ghazalah]

Wow this thread has gone too far, sis vale leave it inshAllah, obviously we don't agree with everything in-the-shadows has said, nevertheless everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

Abu Umamah Al-Bahili (May Allah be pleased with him) reported: The Messenger of Allah (PBUH) said,

"I guarantee a house in Jannah for one who gives up arguing, even if he is in the right; and I guarantee a home in the middle of Jannah for one who abandons lying even for the sake of fun; and I guarantee a house in the highest part of Jannahfor one who has good manners.''

[Abu Dawud]

I apologise -in-the-shadows if anything I have said offended you.

:sl:

[Ar-RaYYan]

oh get a life. i quoted the same hadith that the brother above did, you say JazakAllah to him for the part of the fatwa that is the Sheikh's opinion (correct, but an opinion nevertheless) and then the SAME Hadith that is quoted in that fatwa, when i post that you dare to speak back? you need basic understanding of the english language. learning some big words and throwing them into a sentence doesn't make you smart. asking for a divorce from your husband due to the fact that he wants to re-marry based on your personal views on the matter, which are unislamic, they count as "no reason" as stated by the scholar in that fatwa. you're just stupid. get a life. not worth arguing with you.

Sis I know you are trying to make a point but you can do that without insulting the person especially since you dont know her and she also happens to be your sister in Islam. I think you are capable of having constructive grown-up discussion without any personal attacks.


Anywas I think we have all gone off-topic..

[in-the-shadows]

you need to evince that from the Quran and Sunnah.. Islamic society wasn't a segregated society pls, do not pass fatwa ad lib!

best,

are you muslim? just wow. you have so much down that is so wrong. what makes you think it was not segregated? have you not read the Quraan already that you should know this? about not mixing freely with men and that you should no interact with non-mahrams? what is wrong with you? and if you have not read it or ever heard of that being wrong, which frankly surprises me, i am sure you have and are just acting like you don't know, still, here, fatwas full of Quraan references:

1- Attraction between the sexes can occur in any circumstances, no matter how much men and women may deny that. The attraction may start within the bounds of sharee’ah and end up going beyond those bounds.
Even if a person protects himself (by marriage), he is not safe from the snares of the Shaytaan.
3- Even though a person may be able to guarantee himself and he works with the opposite sex within reasonable limits, he cannot guarantee the feelings of the other party.
Finally, there is nothing good in mixing and it does not bear fruit as they claim. On the contrary, it corrupts sound thinking.

- i had inserted links but due to the discrimination on this website it will not let me post links to prove you wrong. how ironic that you can go around saying whatever stupidity comes into your brain and someone who has something constructive to say, they won't let them post it. but moving on.

internet forums did not exist at the time on the Prophet so i would not be able to give you any direct Hadith which mentions that. but you see i, unlike you, am not one to challenge my Allah. i don't go up to brothers with beards and say salam even, i look down when i walk on the street and they pass me, therefore, if it's the internet, i still have my heart in hijab and don't want to even talk to them, as i would not talk to them in real life. end of story. you may need lots of evidence to convince you because you are too arrogant, a good muslim looks at the Quraan and says, ok Allah said this is wrong, meaning it's wrong in every way, any way, all ways. finish. if there were ANY exceptions, Allah would state them. He did not. Prophet did not. so therefore, neither can you pass fatwas according to you messed up views. go study Islam and stop wasting time on forums. this is by no way a good halal thing to engage in when you are talking to all sorts of guys on here. it is not even related to work so it's in fact the worst type of interaction. it is completely unwarranted and unnecessary. for instance, i saw a post last night about you going swimming - was that really necessary - why do you want people to know how you dress when you swim? do you not realize weak men may start picturing you or being curious about how you must look? have some sense! you're not a child i am sure. for all your claim to be smart, your actions are quite stupid. it is absolutely necessary to speak up against wrong people like you so you fail miserably in your agenda to spread lies and get other people off track!

again it was necessary to post this for smart people, excluding you, to read this and understand, you have too much of an ego to ever admit you are wrong. but hopefully other sisters will read this and smarten up. i posted this for their benefit.

men are weak creatures at heart. they can literally even be attracted to so much as a fingernail that is really nice looking and the colour of the skin around it. why has Allah told us women to be ever so careful. even our attitude and our rudeness can be attractive to some. perhaps having our gender as undisclosed can still make them wonder, oh i wonder if she's a girl, oh i wonder how she looks, oh i wonder this and that. i'm not saying all brothers on here are like that. but many are, which i can tell from the fact that you will always see them posting in the common forums and engaging in wrong topics. there are even topics on here about intimate relationships and very sensitive stuff, and you will see brothers jumping up to comment on those. i do question the integrity of any of those who talk to or ever reply to a female on this forum. they should not be doing it, end of story. we are muslims and we need to be responsible and stop all this nonsense of brother/sister, these people are not your mahrams, there is no need to interact with them. the fact that you need to have so many posts before you can gain access to a girls only section is sad. it's not like i never have to interact with men in real life, i definitely do, BUT that is necessary, and work related and it ends at that. this on here is unwarranted and it's not like you are getting any reward for it, and isn't it better to be cautious and protect yourself? who do you know is out there? be smart girls. stop posting in the common forums and post only where other sisters read your threads, because YOU do NOT realize even things which you would never think could attract a man, they could attract him, you don't know yourself as well as your Allah does. so obey him and stop being such a question machine asking for "evidence" and asking people to convince you. read what Allah expects from you, follow that, be happy, finish. if our Prophet even prohibited us from looking or talking, how about mixing freely on the internet talking about sex and other filthy topics? it angers me and cannot find people who engage in it good in any way.

someone needs to break your ego and put you in your place. don't act like you know all that, you barely know Islam. you choose not to answer to valid points and try to stick up fights on stupid little points. just wow. borderline personality disorder much?

[Hamza Asadullah]

Can we please stay on topic or the thread will be closed. There is no need for any personal attacks by anyone. Let us remember that our evety post should be to please almighty Allah NOT our enemy shaythan. Jazakallahu khayr

[in-the-shadows]

i am polite to those who are polite themselves. here is a Quraan ayat which lets me act in retaliation to those who are rude to me. i am sorry to those who have to see this side of me, but really, i will not sit by and watch so much wrong stuff being said, i absolutely need to speak up against these people who are promoting biddah actions. and inshaAllah my Allah will reward me for it.

quoted from islam q and a:

But if this forgiveness will lead to humiliation, then the Muslim has to settle the score. Concerning that Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“And those who, when an oppressive wrong is done to them, take revenge”

[al-Shoora 42:39]

Imam Ibn Rajab al-Hanbali said, commenting on this verse:

With regard to the phrase “And those who, when an oppressive wrong is done to them, take revenge” – this does not contradict the idea of forgiveness, because taking revenge may mean demonstrating the ability to take revenge, then one may forgive after that, in which case forgiveness will come in a better context. Al-Nakha’i said concerning this verse: They do not like to be humiliated, so if they are in a position to settle the score, then they will forgive. Mujaahid said: They did not like for the believer to let himself be humiliated, which would lead the evildoers to feel contempt for him.

If the believer is wronged, then he should show that he is able to take revenge, then he should forgive after that. Many of the salaf did that, including ‘Ata’, Qutaadah and others.

Jaami’ al-‘Uloom wa’l-Hukam, 1/179

Hence forgiveness is not good in all cases, rather it may be blameworthy if it results in humiliation of the Muslim or encourages the aggressor even further, etc.

Allaah has referred to that in the verse (interpretation of the meaning): “but whoever forgives and makes reconciliation, his reward is with Allaah” [al-Shoora 42:40]. Here Allaah states that forgiveness is only good if it is done for the sake of reconciliation; if it leads to bad consequences then it is not good.

Hence the Muslim should look at which serves the greater interest – forgiveness or seeking revenge – and act accordingly. This will vary according to circumstances and the people involved. What Imam Ahmad said about forgiving everyone who causes harm except for an innovator (mubtadi’) is in accordance with this, because he thought that forgiving the followers of bid’ah would have bad consequences, which is that the people would be encouraged to follow innovation. So he stated clearly that innovators were not to be forgiven, as a way of putting people off from those innovations.

end of quote

in this case, there is more harm in allowing this toxic individual to further her agenda of bullying people, intimidating them, going around saying WRONG INVENTED things and giving NO islamic evidence to support her claims and filling others minds with filth like her own. she needs to be banned from this board and needs some serious counselling and help.

[in-the-shadows]

Can we please stay on topic or the thread will be closed. There is no need for any personal attacks by anyone. Let us remember that our evety post should be to please almighty Allah NOT our enemy shaythan. Jazakallahu khayr

i agree. then why is it that the biggest bullies on this website get a free ride? why are they not contacted by the moderators and admins? do you guys not see how they make others leave through their actions? why is it like this? this vales lily person can say whatever she wants and if someone says anything to her, the thread gets shut down. i am posting a lot in this thread so more people can read it and understand the wrong things going on on this forum. and to you and other moderators and the admin staff i would like to say, kindly speak to this ring of goons and inform them that they better be polite to others. i did not attack anyone first, it was her who started it and i am not the first nor am i the last who she will do this to. it needs to stop. plus she never says anything correct or backs it up with Islam. it's just her own ridiculous opinions which are often unIslamic. then why is she protected here?

[in-the-shadows]

at least i'm posting some useful information and advice for others. her posts are just to pick on me exclusively and to show off her medical knowledge. in her last few posts, someone please show me anywhere where she actually said something useful or constructive. and then look at mine and see how much good stuff i posted. don't just take sides based on who has been here longer. such people do not deserve respect.

[جوري]

it is biddah for you to go around saying that it is ok for a woman to divorce her husband as she may not be able to live with that situation due to her personal beliefs, if those beliefs are unislamic. there you go. happy?

Quote me saying it is ok for a ''woman to divorce her wife because she is not able to live with the situation because of her personal beliefs!'' in those exact words..



best,

[جوري]

]are you muslim?

are you passing takffir on me?

just wow. borderline personality disorder much?

define border line personality disorder.. in fact I implore you to do so!

best,

[Salahudeen]

oh get a life. i quoted the same hadith that the brother above did, you say JazakAllah to him for the part of the fatwa that is the Sheikh's opinion (correct, but an opinion nevertheless) and then the SAME Hadith that is quoted in that fatwa, when i post that you dare to speak back? you need basic understanding of the english language. learning some big words and throwing them into a sentence doesn't make you smart. asking for a divorce from your husband due to the fact that he wants to re-marry based on your personal views on the matter, which are unislamic, they count as "no reason" as stated by the scholar in that fatwa. you're just stupid. get a life. not worth arguing with you.

Yes it is a sheikh's opinion and therefore we are free to take it if we so desire, you or no body can force us to accept your opinion or your point of view. The scholar in the fatwa said if she can't handle her husband marrying a 2nd wife she can get a khula so I don't see your point. The sheikh has deemed it to be a valid reason otherwise he would not have given her the advice to get a khula if she couldn't handle it.

A valid reason could be that she's no longer happy in the marriage and she's afraid she won't behave in an Islamic manner as a result of her husband taking another wife. It all depends on the individual as a person, you can't forbid every sister who's husband gets married to a 2nd wife from seeking khula because not every woman is the same, some women will break down and stop functioning to the point they can no longer fulfill their husbands rights in the marriage, other women will be able to deal with it. So you see whether she has a right to khula depends on her as an individual and how she is able to deal with it. If she can't handle it to the point that it prevents her from fulfilling her wifely duties then she is well with in her right to ask for a khula.

"The Purpose of khula is to provide the women a way out from the marriage if she fears that she will not be able to uphold the limits and boundaries of Allah (ie the rights of marriage). so in reality, its legislation is in order to remove any harm upon the woman, if she has lost her will to remain in marriage to him."

If she feels that by him taking another wife she won't be able to fulfill his rights upon her, then she can ask for her khula because this is a valid reason.

[جوري]

her posts are just to pick on me exclusively and to show off her medical knowledge

again, show me where I have 'show off my medical knowledge' and where I have picked on you 'exclusively'-- when it was in fact you who have directed your first post at me!

I can't get past any and I mean any of your posts without going through a barrage of tasteless insults, and non-information which you pose as Islamic knowledge!
show me where I have used words like stupid on you, or having a personality disorder or worst of all in my book passing takfir.

What is wrong with you?


best,

[Salahudeen]

Ibne Abbas (radiyallahu anhuma) reports that the wife of (the Sahabi) Thabit ibne Qays (radiyallahu anhu) came to Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) and said, "O Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam), I have no complaints about the character and piety of Thabit, but I fear ungratefulness (of my husband) after accepting Islam." Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) asked her, "Are you prepared to return to him his garden, (which he had given as mahr)?"

She replied in the affirmative. Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) then asked Thabit (radiyallahu anhu) to accept the garden and divorce her. (Sahih Al-Bukhari)


In the above hadith, she asked for khula because she feared she would be ungrateful, and Thabit didn't even do anything wrong, however she felt she wouldn't be able to fulfill his rights upon her so she asked for a khula. If a sister feels that she will also not be able to fulfill her husbands rights upon her, she can ask for a khula even if her husband has not doing anything wrong. This is what the female companion in the hadith did. She was unhappy in the marriage, she wanted out, for no other reason other than she wasn't happy in the marriage and was worried it would make her ungrateful to her husband thus she would not be fulfilling his right upon her.

[جوري]

Ibne Abbas (radiyallahu anhuma) reports that the wife of (the Sahabi) Thabit ibne Qays (radiyallahu anhu) came to Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) and said, "O Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam), I have no complaints about the character and piety of Thabit, but I fear ungratefulness (of my husband) after accepting Islam." Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) asked her, "Are you prepared to return to him his garden, (which he had given as mahr)?"

She replied in the affirmative. Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) then asked Thabit (radiyallahu anhu) to accept the garden and divorce her. (Sahih Al-Bukhari)


In the above hadith, she asked for khula because she feared she would be ungrateful, and Thabit didn't even do anything wrong, however she felt she wouldn't be able to fulfill his rights upon her so she asked for a khula. If a sister feels that she will also not be able to fulfill her husbands rights upon her, she can ask for a khula even if her husband has not doing anything wrong. This is what the female companion in the hadith did. She was unhappy in the marriage, she wanted out, for no other reason other than she wasn't happy in the marriage and was worried it would make her ungrateful to her husband thus she would not be fulfilling his right upon her.

I was thinking of that example but I was too pressed for time to cite it properly Jazaka Allah khyran..
and it actually proves another point.. Here a female talking to the prophet, an example of many like a very detailed description of a black slave woman standing up against Omar Ibn Ilkhtab in the mosque to talk of woman's mahr.. obviously the details of her status and position were also to make a point of a woman's status in Islam compared to pre-Islamic societies at large!
Does that seem like a no contact whatsoever between male and female in whatever form in an Islamic society?

Sobhan Allah.. I worry about the state of the ummah for multiple reasons.. Everyone is a google scholar and no reflection whatsoever is exercised when reflecting about the sunnah and the lives of the prophet, the sahaba and the sahabiaat, or even when addressing fellow Muslims giving them their basic due rights!

:w:

[in-the-shadows]

Quote me saying it is ok for a ''woman to divorce her wife because she is not able to live with the situation because of her personal beliefs!'' in those exact words..



best,

well women can't divorce their wives, lol, but either way, you didn't say it in those exact words, but your evidence-seeking arrogance i see will not be laid to rest unless in throw your own words in your face, so here you go, see the bolded part:

Thank you for acknowledging my logic indeed. I have my own (medical) views on keeping someone who is brain dead on life support which might not be compatible with yours given the above. But outside of medicine, from a humanitarian view I don't think keeping someone who is medically declared brain dead alive by artificial means as any form of love either. I accept that death is natural and that we shall all taste it and that it is the only way to attain eternal life. it would be more painful for me to see someone I love with tubes going in and out of them from every orifice along with a loss of dignity, decline in function for my own selfish reason of wanting them around in any physical form!


I am afraid you lost me with a part of that statement above, and I see a need to inject 'pride' into it as well when as stated pride has nothing to do with it. Sometimes circumstances are above love. Love is just an emotion that is independent from worldly constraints and I certainly don't need to paint several scenarios where it is possible to love someone very much but have to let them go for a greater good!


I think this is just either your inner child speaking through rose tinted glasses or a lack of abstract thought to what real life circumstances might throw your way!

Again, see previous responses and try to differentiate between an allowance and an injunction!
It maybe ok for you to take one or two wives, and it maybe ok for your wives to share, by the same token that is an unacceptable living arrangement for someone else.. As God has made an allowance of polygamy he has also made an allowance with divorces and we have seen many during the time of the prophet.. perfectly pious people who couldn't live under certain circumstances. It isn't up to you to decide what is considered selfish or oxymoronic.

on a last note, I am not 'hurt' at all by what you've written we're exchanging opinions. I may not like your certain choice of words but I accept that this is your line of thinking, I am not denigrating your opinion either.. I am just painting a picture that is outside what you might conceive in your mind as having to be 'logical' to everyone else. Also since when is love at all logical?

best,

so there you go, you said, Allah has made an allowance for divorces too as well a polygamy, then you also said this is an unacceptable living arrangement for some people, and then you said perfectly pious people might not be able to live under such circumstances. meaning you said people who cannot see their husband get married can ask for a divorce and they would be ok in doing so simply by virtue of their personal preferences. THIS = BIDDAH. an innovation. you invented this. others have invented this, this room for personal opinion in front of what Allah has decreed. there are STRICT VALID REASONS in Islam under which it is ok for a woman to seek a divorce, and this is not one of them. here is a quote from a fatwa:

Secondly:

It is permissible for a woman to ask her husband for a divorce, if there is a reason for that to be permissible, such as if he fails to give her her rights or he wrongs her or mistreats her, and does not respond to advice to treat her well and be kind to her.

But if a woman asks for a divorce with no reason, that is haraam and is a major sin.

The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Any woman who asks her husband for a divorce for no reason, the fragrance of Paradise will be forbidden to her.”

Narrated by Abu Dawood (2226) and al-Tirmidhi (1187); classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Abi Dawood.

Al-Mubaarakfoori said: i.e., without there being strong reason that compels her to seek a separation.

Tuhfat al-Ahqadhi, 4/410

Al-Haafiz Ibn Hajar said:

The reports which warn a woman against asking her husband for a divorce are to be understood as referring to cases where there is no reason for doing that. End quote from Fath al-Baari, 9/402

See also questions no. 9481, 12496 and 34579.

Asking for khula’ is also permissible if it is done for a shar’i reason, so as to ward off wrongdoing or to protect one's rights or other such reasons. This has already been explained in the answer to question no. 1859.

What is haraam is asking for khula’ with no good reason.

It says in a hadeeth that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Women who seek khula’ are hypocrites.” Narrated by al-Tirmidhi (1186) and al-Nasaa’i (3461), both of whom classed it as da’eef. Ibn Qudaamah said in al-Mughni (7/248): Ahmad mentioned it and quoted it as evidence, and Ibn Hajar was of the view that it is saheeh, as it says in Fath al-Baari, 9/403. It was also classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Sunan al-Tirmidhi, 1186.

Al-Mubaarakfoori said:

i.e., those women who ask for khula’ and divorce from their husbands for no reason. End quote.

Tuhfat al-Ahwadhi, 4/409

end quote of fatwa



if a woman cannot live under the circumstances that her husband re-marries and exclusively wants a divorce only because of her jealously and inability to accept that he is also with someone else, this is not a pious person, and their views are unIslamic, which is evidenced by the fact that the Prophet said no woman is allowed to seek divorce for no reason, and when Allah has made multiple marriage halal, it is not a woman's place to go around saying this is unacceptable to me, because if her Creator thinks she should be able to live with it, she should. therefore, when you go around putting into people's head these ideas that you can be a "pious person" and choose to go against something which Allah has not allowed you to do (that is, seek divorce on the grounds that your husband re-married, because this is an unsuitable living arrangement for you PERSONALLY, not islamically) this is an innovation and you are wrong in doing so.

i hope you are understanding what exactly my issue here is. in short, here it is in bold: my issues here is that you have said that these living arrangements may be unsuitable for someone, so they may not be able to live with it and you claimed thatt that is ok and you said that divorce is permissible due to this, when it is NOT. Islam has strict guidelines about when it is ok for a woman to ask for a divorce from her husband, you cannot just make things up and say "oh well Islam allows polygamy and also allows divorces, and there are pious people who may not be able to live like that, so basically divorce is permissible if you can't live with it." NO. that is not how it works! where did you even get this idea? i would love to see YOU madam give me some evidence this time. i know you will have none though!

again, show me where I have 'show off my medical knowledge' and where I have picked on you 'exclusively'-- when it was in fact you who have directed your first post at me!

I can't get past any and I mean any of your posts without going through a barrage of tasteless insults, and non-information which you pose as Islamic knowledge!
show me where I have used words like stupid on you, or having a personality disorder or worst of all in my book passing takfir.

What is wrong with you?


best,

um, actually no, it was not me. i was polite to you and if you see the post quoted above #63 in this thread, that was the one in which YOU said something wrong, YOU were rude first, had a condescending attitude, and it had biddah, and it infuriated me because you have no idea what you are talking about, it is not based on Islamic shariah, you are just innovating stuff as you go which is a shame since you are so influenced by the west and are teaching other girls that it's ok to have no patience and divorce is permissible so why not get it, this is all WRONG. you are not a scholar so refrain from saying stuff as you please. and i felt i needed to correct you and bring down your massive ego. mission accomplished. at least i have proven myself right each time, with Islamic backing, i would love to see some proof from you now about why you said that and show me how what you said is NOT biddah. if you're so tough how about we move past the schoolyard insults and why don't you actually prove me wrong Islamically as opposed to flaming me and insulting me? you know you are wrong, that is why you are hiding and resorting to asking me for evidence - how about YOU bring some yourself. what a joke of a person. google scholar = you. learn some Islam.

[جوري]

well women can't divorce their wives, lol, but either way, you didn't say it in those exact words, but your evidence-seeking arrogance i see will not be laid to rest unless in throw your own words in your face, so here you go, see the bolded part:

my humble apologies for the typo.. unlike some I don't have all day to write meaningless essays on the forum!

so there you go, you said, Allah has made an allowance for divorces too as well a polygamy, then you also said this is an unacceptable living arrangement for some people, and then you said perfectly pious people might not be able to live under such circumstances. meaning you said people who cannot see their husband get married can ask for a divorce and they would be ok in doing so simply by virtue of their personal preferences. THIS = BIDDAH. an innovation. you invented this. others have invented this, this room for personal opinion in front of what Allah has decreed. there are STRICT VALID REASONS in Islam under which it is ok for a woman to seek a divorce, and this is not one of them. here is a quote from a fatwa:

None of what I have written is construed as what you are alleging. In fact when I said perfectly pious people, I intended to use the example of br. Salahudin

Ibne Abbas (radiyallahu anhuma) reports that the wife of (the Sahabi) Thabit ibne Qays (radiyallahu anhu) came to Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) and said, "O Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam), I have no complaints about the character and piety of Thabit, but I fear ungratefulness (of my husband) after accepting Islam." Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) asked her, "Are you prepared to return to him his garden, (which he had given as mahr)?"

She replied in the affirmative. Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) then asked Thabit (radiyallahu anhu) to accept the garden and divorce her. (Sahih Al-Bukhari)


In the above hadith, she asked for khula because she feared she would be ungrateful, and Thabit didn't even do anything wrong, however she felt she wouldn't be able to fulfill his rights upon her so she asked for a khula. If a sister feels that she will also not be able to fulfill her husbands rights upon her, she can ask for a khula even if her husband has not doing anything wrong. This is what the female companion in the hadith did. She was unhappy in the marriage, she wanted out, for no other reason other than she wasn't happy in the marriage and was worried it would make her ungrateful to her husband thus she would not be fulfilling his right upon her.

Secondly:

It is permissible for a woman to ask her husband for a divorce, if there is a reason for that to be permissible, such as if he fails to give her her rights or he wrongs her or mistreats her, and does not respond to advice to treat her well and be kind to her.

Indeed!

But if a woman asks for a divorce with no reason, that is haraam and is a major sin.

Again, I am waiting for you to quote me specifically where I said seek a divorce for no reason!

The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Any woman who asks her husband for a divorce for no reason, the fragrance of Paradise will be forbidden to her.”

Narrated by Abu Dawood (2226) and al-Tirmidhi (1187); classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Abi Dawood.

Al-Mubaarakfoori said: i.e., without there being strong reason that compels her to seek a separation.

Tuhfat al-Ahqadhi, 4/410

Al-Haafiz Ibn Hajar said:

The reports which warn a woman against asking her husband for a divorce are to be understood as referring to cases where there is no reason for doing that. End quote from Fath al-Baari, 9/402

See also questions no. 9481, 12496 and 34579.

Asking for khula’ is also permissible if it is done for a shar’i reason, so as to ward off wrongdoing or to protect one's rights or other such reasons. This has already been explained in the answer to question no. 1859.

What is haraam is asking for khula’ with no good reason.

It says in a hadeeth that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Women who seek khula’ are hypocrites.” Narrated by al-Tirmidhi (1186) and al-Nasaa’i (3461), both of whom classed it as da’eef. Ibn Qudaamah said in al-Mughni (7/248): Ahmad mentioned it and quoted it as evidence, and Ibn Hajar was of the view that it is saheeh, as it says in Fath al-Baari, 9/403. It was also classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Sunan al-Tirmidhi, 1186.

Al-Mubaarakfoori said:

i.e., those women who ask for khula’ and divorce from their husbands for no reason. End quote.

Tuhfat al-Ahwadhi, 4/409

end quote of fatwa

See previous!

if a woman cannot live under the circumstances that her husband re-marries and exclusively wants a divorce only because of her jealously and inability to accept that he is also with someone else, this is not a pious person, and their views are unIslamic, which is evidenced by the fact that the Prophet said no woman is allowed to seek divorce for no reason, and when Allah has made multiple marriage halal, it is not a woman's place to go around saying this is unacceptable to me, because if her Creator thinks she should be able to live with it, she should. therefore, when you go around putting into people's head these ideas that you can be a "pious person" and choose to go against something which Allah has not allowed you to do (that is, seek divorce on the grounds that your husband re-married, because this is an unsuitable living arrangement for you PERSONALLY, not islamically) this is an innovation and you are wrong in doing so.

Not being able to withstand a particular living arrangement isn't a non-reason!

i hope you are understanding what exactly my issue here is. in short, here it is in bold: my issues here is that you have said that these living arrangements may be unsuitable for someone, so they may not be able to live with it and you claimed thatt that is ok and you said that divorce is permissible due to this, when it is NOT. Islam has strict guidelines about when it is ok for a woman to ask for a divorce from her husband, you cannot just make things up and say "oh well Islam allows polygamy and also allows divorces, and there are pious people who may not be able to live like that, so basically divorce is permissible if you can't live with it." NO. that is not how it works! where did you even get this idea? i would love to see YOU madam give me some evidence this time. i know you will have none though!

again I challenge you to quote me directly other than that your feelings toward me or the matter are inconsequential!
I don't think along the same tracts you do and we thank God for that for surely a servant who is knowledgeable is still better than a servant who worships all day.. or is that not how the pious Barsisa ended up a murderer and a devil worshiper after having spent a lifetime in the temple? so don't allege things as having been said by my person when they're only concocted in your very interesting mind!

Also spare me all the extraneous and puerile details of what you think I am, where you think I should be or what you think I should do, I have let it go on several occasions hoping you'd see the error in your ways with everyone gently handling you with kid gloves. I will not be this kind with later posts nor will I grant the benefit of the doubt as you have clearly used them all up!

um, actually no, it was not me. i was polite to you and if you see the post quoted above #63 in this thread, that was the one in which YOU said something wrong, YOU were rude first, had a condescending attitude, and it had biddah, and it infuriated me because you have no idea what you are talking about, it is not based on Islamic shariah, you are just innovating stuff as you go which is a shame since you are so influenced by the west and are teaching other girls that it's ok to have no patience and divorce is permissible so why not get it, this is all WRONG. you are not a scholar so refrain from saying stuff as you please. and i felt i needed to correct you and bring down your massive ego. mission accomplished. at least i have proven myself right each time, with Islamic backing, i would love to see some proof from you now about why you said that and show me how what you said is NOT biddah. if you're so tough how about we move past the schoolyard insults and why don't you actually prove me wrong Islamically as opposed to flaming me and insulting me? you know you are wrong, that is why you are hiding and resorting to asking me for evidence - how about YOU bring some yourself. what a joke of a person. google scholar = you. learn some Islam.

Again and adequate assessment of your person-- as for the rest of your diatribe, you need to come up with new material and actually evince it with what we've actually written and superimpose it on shari3a.
I doubt very much you understand the basics of sharia'a and rather prune to emotive outbursts, suspicion in mannerism and character and given to deception as well which is why we suspect you put up this front, makes you all the more far removed from the very basic tenets of Islam.

But I am not lowly enough to pass takffir on you although I have doubts at all that you're who you allege the second time around and not some bubah from some cesspool in Arkansas unleashed on the forum and you certainly wouldn't be the first of your kind!

best,

[Salahudeen]

My dear sister in the shadows, please calm down and relax, what you have presented are hadiths that state a woman asking for kuhla without a valid reason is wrong, and we all agree with you on this. The issue at hand is, what constitutes a valid reason?

If a woman is no longer able to function happily in a marriage because her husband marries another woman is this a valid reason according to you? Does her happyness not matter at all? Is the woman supposed to be a robot and just get on with things and live a miserable life?

If a woman is no longer able to fulfill her husbands rights upon her because he marries another woman is this a valid reason? Lets say the idea of him being touched by another woman repulses her to the point she no longer has any desire to by intimate with him and as a result can no longer perform in certain scenarios and situations. Then is this a valid reason for her to ask for khula? because she would be denying him his rights?

You see sister it's not a black and white issue, every individual is different. Also sister you've presented those hadiths, however you have not presented an understanding from one of the scholars that says "Because of these ahadith, it is forbidden for a woman to ask for khula if her husband takes another wife"

In the fatwa that I posted earlier, the scholar mentioned the hadith you mentioned, and the ruling he derived from it differed from the ruling you're deriving from it. He said if a woman can't handle it then she can seek the khula. That was his understanding of the hadith, a scholar of Islam.

Now if you could kindly tell us why we should take your understanding and your interpretation of the hadith rather than the scholars understanding and intrepretation that would be very helpful.

[in-the-shadows]

i have posted enough here to educate others about your stupidity so my job here is done. good luck with your career as a doctor, which i am sure is a huge lie, i know of no doctors who have so much time during the day to be sitting on the internet arguing with strangers. i proved you wrong, now if you still don't want to accept it, your problem. anyone else reading this would clearly be able to see how wrong you were in what you said/did.

good job ignoring the part where i asked you for evidence by the way. i see you work extremely hard at learning lingo which you think will impress people on the net, but in reality there is no substance to anything you say and anyone with any sense can see through your foolishness and immaturity. you don't even have enough knowledge to back up your own innovated claims. i'm not here to interact with men, unlike you, so i will not respond to whatever that guy above posted. i sure can tear that to pieces just like your dumb posts though. but it's sad that you need someone to come save you and you can't even defend yourself properly. probably because you realize your verbal diarrhea makes no sense so of course you would never find anything to back you up, neither are you that educated in Islam that you would know anything to begin with. i suppose the rest of your posse isn't here, so you were lonely for a bit, don't worry they will all come later and try to help you out and then you can be like "yeah! what he said!" lol, what a joke.

joke of the year: my humble apologies for the typo.. unlike some I don't have all day to write meaningless essays on the forum!

Posts
8,672

LOL. nice.

[SlaveOfGod]

Just to keep this thread on topic inshallah.....

It might be a bit awkward sharing a husband with a close friend. I would advise you to tread lightly and indirectly ask you friend how she would feel in order to prevent awkwardness or a loss of a friend. You will get a brother to marry inshallah, don't worry sister.

[جوري]

i have posted enough here to educate others about your stupidity so my job here is done. good luck with your career as a doctor, which i am sure is a huge lie, i know of no doctors who have so much time during the day to be sitting on the internet arguing with strangers. i proved you wrong, now if you still don't want to accept it, your problem. anyone else reading this would clearly be able to see how wrong you were in what you said/did.

good job ignoring the part where i asked you for evidence by the way. i see you work extremely hard at learning lingo which you think will impress people on the net, but in reality there is no substance to anything you say and anyone with any sense can see through your foolishness and immaturity. you don't even have enough knowledge to back up your own innovated claims. i'm not here to interact with men, unlike you, so i will not respond to whatever that guy above posted. i sure can tear that to pieces just like your dumb posts though. but it's sad that you need someone to come save you and you can't even defend yourself properly. probably because you realize your verbal diarrhea makes no sense so of course you would never find anything to back you up, neither are you that educated in Islam that you would know anything to begin with. i suppose the rest of your posse isn't here, so you were lonely for a bit, don't worry they will all come later and try to help you out and then you can be like "yeah! what he said!" lol, what a joke.

joke of the year: my humble apologies for the typo.. unlike some I don't have all day to write meaningless essays on the forum!

Posts
8,672

LOL. nice.

Thank God for your presence here :)

best,

[Salahudeen]

i have posted enough here to educate others about your stupidity so my job here is done. good luck with your career as a doctor, which i am sure is a huge lie, i know of no doctors who have so much time during the day to be sitting on the internet arguing with strangers. i proved you wrong, now if you still don't want to accept it, your problem. anyone else reading this would clearly be able to see how wrong you were in what you said/did.

good job ignoring the part where i asked you for evidence by the way. i see you work extremely hard at learning lingo which you think will impress people on the net, but in reality there is no substance to anything you say and anyone with any sense can see through your foolishness and immaturity. you don't even have enough knowledge to back up your own innovated claims. i'm not here to interact with men, unlike you, so i will not respond to whatever that guy above posted. i sure can tear that to pieces just like your dumb posts though. but it's sad that you need someone to come save you and you can't even defend yourself properly. probably because you realize your verbal diarrhea makes no sense so of course you would never find anything to back you up, neither are you that educated in Islam that you would know anything to begin with. i suppose the rest of your posse isn't here, so you were lonely for a bit, don't worry they will all come later and try to help you out and then you can be like "yeah! what he said!" lol, what a joke.

joke of the year: my humble apologies for the typo.. unlike some I don't have all day to write meaningless essays on the forum!

Posts
8,672

LOL. nice.

You had no problem responding to brother Hamza, am I not equally worth a response sister? http://www.islamicboard.com/showthre...=1#post1439563

My sister, you're showing your lack of sincerity by making this into a "I'm right you're wrong, I win hahaha" situation, you mentioned you could tear to pieces what I wrote above, is that all this is about to you? Imam shafi said "I never argued or debated with a person in order to win. I debated to learn the truth". Please contemplate on this statement. It's not about being right or wrong, it's about reaching the truth in any given matter.

[in-the-shadows]

he is an admin, i was complaining to him.


here are some fatwas for anyone interested in knowing why women should NOT be asking for divorce at every small thing:


She wants a divorce but he does not want to divorce her
I have a sister who is married, but her husband has not consummated the marriage with her yet. Everything was fine until my sister suddenly said that she does not want to live with her husband because she no longer loves him. They have not lived together in their house as husband and wife. When her husband heard her say this he got very angry and refused to divorce her. My sister is insisting that she does not want to live with him and he is insisting that he will not divorce her. We have told her that she cannot get divorced without a legitimate shar’i reason and proof, but she says that he gets angry quickly, and discloses secrets. It should be noted that she has not yet lived with him in the same house. Her husband admits that and says that he will change. What is the shar’i solution to this difficult problem?.

Praise be to Allaah.
If the husband is giving his wife her rights as prescribed in sharee’ah, then it is haraam for her to ask him for a divorce, because the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Any woman who asked for a divorce for no reason, the fragrance of Paradise is forbidden to her.” Narrated by al-Tirmidhi, 1187; Abu Dawood, 2226; Ibn Maajah, 2055; classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Abi Dawood).

What is meant by the words “for no reason” is without any urgent situation which makes it hard for the marriage to continue.

If the wife is being harmed and the situation is too difficult for her because of the husband’s falling short in giving her her rights, or his withholding her rights from her, or because of his bad treatment and other similar reasons, then she has the right to ask for divorce, and she may refer to the qaadi and tell him what is happening, and he in turn can ask the husband to give her her rights or to divorce her.

If she has found out that he has some bad characteristics, he should not hasten to ask for a divorce, rather she has to be kind to him and advise him in the way that is best, and help him to change his character for the better. He acknowledges the way he is and has promised to change. This is a positive step on the husband’s part and it is the first step in dealing with the problem. The wife should help her husband to do good. If every wife wanted a divorce when he was quick to get angry or transmitted some words that were spoken between him and his wife, or other mistakes, there would be no household that was not broken up and its members scattered.

For more information see the answers to questions no 3758 and 12496.

And Allaah knows best.



Complaint from a wife about her husband’s treatment in bed
My question is very embarrassing but there is nobody I can ask about this.
My husband is good and pious, and I have no reason not to trust him, but he is not giving me my rights in bed. Is it permissible for me to ask him for a divorce, or will I be one of those who will not smell the fragrance of Paradise?

Praise be to Allaah.

If a husband is fulfilling his Islamic duties towards his wife, it is not permissible for her to ask him for a divorce, because the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “If any woman asks her husband for a divorce for no compelling reason, she will be deprived of the fragrance of Paradise.” (Reported by Imaam Ahmad, 21874, and Ibn Maajah, 2055). The meaning of the phrase “for no compelling reason” is anything that gives her a strong motive for seeking divorce. (Sharh Ibn Maajah ‘ala al-Sanadi).

As for intercourse in bed, if the wife’s demands are greater than what is normal, it is not permissible for her to seek a divorce (the word “normal” refers to what is usual, such as once a week or once every ten days and so on, and people vary in their capacity in this regard). For more information, please see Question # 1078.

If the husband has some defect or sickness that prevents him from having intercourse (i.e., he is impotent), then it is permissible for his wife to ask for a divorce. And Allaah knows best.

Islam Q&A
Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid



and hoping this one will be sufficient to prove exactly what i have been saying all along:



She asked him to divorce her if he takes a second wife
My wife and i have discused me having a second wife and she sayes that if i do then she would devorse me.we did not get married by the kafirs but we do have a islamic contract. and there was no agreement on that contract forbiding me from taking a second wife.so my question is .Is it permisable for her to deny me this?And is'nt she making the hallal harram on me. my wife is a good muslimah (I.S.A.) and she would respect a answer whith proof. jazallahkum ma lakair

Praise be to Allaah.

If a man is able to marry a second wife, physically and financially, and he can treat both wives in a just manner, and he wants to take a second wife, then he is allowed to do so according to Islam. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“… then marry (other) women of your choice, two or three, or four…” [al-Nisaa’ 4:3]

And this was the practice of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), and of his Companions (may Allaah be pleased with them), but apart from the Prophet, no one is permitted to have more than four wives.

It is well known that women are by nature jealous and reluctant to share their husband with other women. Women are not to be condemned for this jealousy, for it existed in the best of righteous women, the Sahaabiyyaat, and even in the Mothers of the Believers [the wives of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him)]. But women should not let jealousy make them object to that which Allaah has prescribed, and they should not try to prevent it; a wife should allow her husband to marry another woman for this is a kind of cooperating in righteousness and piety. According to a hadeeth whose authenticity is agreed upon, the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Whoever pays attention to his brother’s needs, Allaah will pay attention to his needs.”

The first wife’s consent is not a prerequisite for a man to take another wife. The Standing Committee for Issuing Fatwas was asked about this and replied as follows:

“It is not obligatory for the husband, if he wants to take a second wife, to have the consent of his first wife, but it is good manners and kindness to deal with her in such a manner that will reduce the hurt which women naturally feel in such situations. This is done by being kind to her and speaking to her in a gentle and pleasant manner, and by spending whatever money may be necessary in order to gain her acceptance of the situation.”

Concerning her request for divorce if her husband wants to marry another wife, this is a mistake. But they should examine the situation, and if she really cannot cope with living with another wife, then she can ask him for khula’ [ a kind of divorce instigated by the wife, whereby she forgoes the mahr]. If she can cope with living with the second wife, but it hurts her to do so, then she should be patient and seek the pleasure of Allaah. Thawbaan (may Allaah be pleased with him) narrated that the Messenger (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said:

“No woman asks her husband for a divorce for no reason, but the fragrance of Paradise is forbidden for her.” (Narrated by Abu Dawood and others, and classed as saheeh by al-Albaani, may Allaah have mercy on him).

If she bears it with patience, then Allaah will make it easier for her and will expand her chest (i.e., grant her peace and calm), and will compensate her with something good. The husband must also help her by treating her kindly, being patient with her for any jealousy etc. on her part, and overlooking her mistakes. And Allaah is the source of help.


Shaykh ‘Abd-Allaah al-Haydari.

[sabr*]

As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم):

our suggestion to the moderator to evaluate and close this thread because it was going extremely off topic.

We will not provide a appropriate response to the scandalous false claims but use restraint and perform du'a
that Allah increases the sister with Taqwa and Iman.

Usually when you witness that long ongoing rants there is something else going on in a persons life
and they usually use this space to vent.

I suggest the practicing Muslimah embrace this sister and offer dawah and tabliqh (: جماعة التبليغ‎).

It would do more harm that good to continue assuming anything positive could result from continuing a
dialogue.

If the no other forum member has a positive contribution to offer on this request for advice this
thread has run it's course and should be closed. Insha Allah

Allahu 'Alim

[in-the-shadows]

now if some silty trashy woman wants to still make up some fake reason like "omg he does not fulfill my rights, it's unbearable for me, i want a divorce" and get one, sure, Islam allows it, but Allah knows what the akhirah would be for some horrible woman like that.

[Ğħαrєєвαħ]

i have posted enough here to educate others about your stupidity so my job here is done. good luck with your career as a doctor, which i am sure is a huge lie, i know of no doctors who have so much time during the day to be sitting on the internet arguing with strangers. i proved you wrong, now if you still don't want to accept it, your problem. anyone else reading this would clearly be able to see how wrong you were in what you said/did.

good job ignoring the part where i asked you for evidence by the way. i see you work extremely hard at learning lingo which you think will impress people on the net, but in reality there is no substance to anything you say and anyone with any sense can see through your foolishness and immaturity. you don't even have enough knowledge to back up your own innovated claims. i'm not here to interact with men, unlike you, so i will not respond to whatever that guy above posted. i sure can tear that to pieces just like your dumb posts though. but it's sad that you need someone to come save you and you can't even defend yourself properly. probably because you realize your verbal diarrhea makes no sense so of course you would never find anything to back you up, neither are you that educated in Islam that you would know anything to begin with. i suppose the rest of your posse isn't here, so you were lonely for a bit, don't worry they will all come later and try to help you out and then you can be like "yeah! what he said!" lol, what a joke.

joke of the year: my humble apologies for the typo.. unlike some I don't have all day to write meaningless essays on the forum!

Posts
8,672

LOL. nice.

Assalaamu Alaaykum

I think its better if you do actually read what 'the guy above you said' insha'Allaah..

And I think we should be careful with the words we use, and also we need to respect one another insha'Allaah..
This goes for everyone insha'Allaah.

Also we shouldnt be so quick in judging one or creating doubt in our minds about what we think of another especially when we are mentioning it in public i.e. insulting someone or especially when we dont even know them in person, knowing nothing about them. It is the hate that makes us say such stuff, by Allaah if we cared for one another as we are suppose to we wouldnt be so quick in judgment. Lets realise that insulting someone causes one to feel hurt, this is something that should be taken seriously a reminder for myself aswell and everyone here insha'Allaah

When will we realise that, we should be careful of the words we use, the intentions we have? before its too late? when you will be judged for what you did and why you did it?!? I am only saying this because it is good for me and its good for everyone, not that i will recieve the deeds of another but me for myself only.

Like Brother Hamza said please Allaah and not the shaytaan. If we have no good to speak then remain silent or be patient and speak words of good rather than showing how 'good of a muslim' you are..or remain silent which is easy but some make it sound like it is difficult, it is not!..

And dear sister the aim of the posts is aimed at everyone reading this and not just you, so i apologise if it makes you think it is you because i quoted your post..I have no intention to offend nobody and please forgive me if so.. recite Bismillah and start over again or I would suggest Mods to close up..

.. peace ..

[in-the-shadows]

no lets NOT close this thread so people can read some correct stuff on here for a change.

[in-the-shadows]

here they come, the vale lily's posse. listen, save it for someone else. why don't you go say all that to her? she is ruder than i am. the doctor doesn't like a dose of her own medicine and her little friends come running.

[Ghazalah]

no lets NOT close this thread so people can read some correct stuff on here for a change.

Closing the thread means no one else can post, however it remains opened so it can still be read.

[جوري]

You had no problem responding to brother Hamza, am I not equally worth a response sister? http://www.islamicboard.com/showthre...=1#post1439563

My sister, you're showing your lack of sincerity by making this into a "I'm right you're wrong, I win hahaha" situation, you mentioned you could tear to pieces what I wrote above, is that all this is about to you? Imam shafi said "I never argued or debated with a person in order to win. I debated to learn the truth". Please contemplate on this statement. It's not about being right or wrong, it's about reaching the truth in any given matter.

A fool's mind is at the mercy of his tongue and a wise man's tongue is under the control of his mind.


:w:

[in-the-shadows]

pearl of wisdom, my didn't you quote the vale's lily ridiculous posts and tell her not to be rude and hurtful? this is what i had meant before about this ring of people and you all support each other and tell others they are wrong, even when they prove that they are right. you all have no sense left of what is right and what is wrong. you just support your friends, you don't open up your eyes and see that they can also be wrong. and in fact most of the regular posters on here ARE quite wrong a lot of the time and they never get reprimanded, and GOD FORBID if someone says something to THEM, everyone comes preaching and saying shut down the thread.