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_PakistaN_
11-11-2011, 08:00 PM
I've come across a lot of non muslims who only believe in one God. How will Allah judge them?

I've also come across a couple of Christians who had tremendous amount of noor on their face. This type of noor I have never seen on anyone's face. How come that is?
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Predator
11-11-2011, 08:06 PM
Allah says so in the Quran

The Holy Qur'an 5:82 –83 Translation by Yusuf Ali
Strongest among men in enmity to the believers wilt thou find the Jews and Pagans; and nearest among them in love to the believers wilt thou find those who say, "We are Christians": because amongst these are men devoted to learning and men who have renounced the world, and they are not arrogant.
And when they listen to the revelation received by the Messenger, thou wilt see their eyes overflowing with tears, for they recognize the truth: they pray: "Our Lord! We believe; write us down among the witnesses.

The first verse says that the you will find Jews and Pagans hate the believers(Muslims) the most. Next it says Christians are devoted to learning and they are not arrogant. The next verse says the Christians listen to the revelation(Qur'an) received by the Messenger(Prophet Mohammed(pbuh)) and “thou wilt see their eyes overflowing with tears, for they recognize the truth: they pray: "Our Lord! We believe; write us down among the witnesses.

To sum those verses up, some of the Jews and Pagans are arrogant and harder to show the Truth and only some care to learn about the Truth, but among Christians there are definetly those who want to learn the Truth
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Fakrun
11-11-2011, 10:02 PM
Asalaamu alaikum,

I posted this earlier in another thread and I think it applies here. As a non-Muslim, I am naturally drawn to what the Quran says about non-Muslims.

Quran 3:113
They are not [all] the same; among the People of the Scripture is a community standing [in obedience], reciting the verses of Allah during periods of the night and prostrating [in prayer].

5:8
O you who have believed, be persistently standing firm for Allah , witnesses in justice, and do not let the hatred of a people prevent you from being just. Be just; that is nearer to righteousness. And fear Allah ; indeed, Allah is Acquainted with what you do.

5:42
[They are] avid listeners to falsehood, devourers of [what is] unlawful. So if they come to you, [O Muhammad], judge between them or turn away from them. And if you turn away from them - never will they harm you at all. And if you judge, judge between them with justice. Indeed, Allah loves those who act justly.

5:56
And whoever is an ally of Allah and His Messenger and those who have believed - indeed, the party of Allah - they will be the predominant.

3:199 (my personal favorite and the first ayat that I remembered in my heart, if not BY heart)
And indeed, among the People of the Scripture are those who believe in Allah and what was revealed to you and what was revealed to them, [being] humbly submissive to Allah . They do not exchange the verses of Allah for a small price. Those will have their reward with their Lord. Indeed, Allah is swift in account.
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جوري
11-11-2011, 10:11 PM
^^ this doesn't make a case for how non-Muslims will be judged with Allah, rather letting you know that judgment is with Allah swt! We don't know who is righteous or who is wicked, who's sincere & who is a hypocrite.. We're indeed commanded to be just & truthful and implement God's law on this earth but we're not commanded to be judges along with Allah swt...
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Insaanah
11-11-2011, 10:24 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Fakrun
3:199 (my personal favorite and the first ayat that I remembered in my heart, if not BY heart)
And indeed, among the People of the Scripture are those who believe in Allah and what was revealed to you and what was revealed to them, [being] humbly submissive to Allah . They do not exchange the verses of Allah for a small price. Those will have their reward with their Lord. Indeed, Allah is swift in account
The emphasis being on "what was revealed to them", not scriptures adulterated and changed with the word of man ("they do not exchange the verses of Allah for a small price"). What was revealed to them is that they should believe in and worship one God, with no sons, no 3-in1s, no associates/sharers whatsover in His Exclusive Divinity, and that they must obey the messenger, and that there was a messenger to come. It also says, and they believe in "what was revealed to you", you being the prophet Muhammad, peace and blessings of Allah be upon him. To believe in that (the Qur'an), you have to accept the Messenger it was revealed to (Muhammad peace be upon him) and follow the commands contained therein. And many Christians at the time of the Prophet did exactly that.

It does not include nowadays Christians who worship a trinity while still saying they believe in one God, and who also reject the final Messenger of Allah, and the final unchanged word of Allah.
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islamica
11-11-2011, 10:25 PM
At end of the day, Judgement Day that is, it is up to Allah to decide what He plans to do. But we are told in the Quran:


"This day have I perfected your religion for you, completed My favour upon you, and have chosen for you Islam as your religion". (Soorah Al-Maa'idah 5:3)

"If anyone desires a religion other than Islam (submission to Allah (God) never will It be accepted of Him"
(Soorah Aal'imraan 3:85)
Reply

Fakrun
11-11-2011, 10:42 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ßlµêßêll
We don't know who is righteous or who is wicked, who's sincere & who is a hypocrite..
Asalaamu Alaikum,

Actually, Mohammad told us who is a hypocrite. I read it just today in fact. Here's the Hadith I read:

Volumn 003, Book 043, Hadith Number 639.
-----------------------------------------
Narated By 'Abdullah bin 'Amr : The Prophet said, "Whoever has (the following) four characters will be a hypocrite, and whoever has one of the following four characteristics will have one characteristic of hypocrisy until he gives it up. These are: (1) Whenever he talks, he tells a lie; (2) whenever he makes a promise, he breaks it; (3) whenever he makes a covenant he proves treacherous; (4) and whenever he quarrels, he behaves impudently in an evil insulting manner." (See Hadith No. 33 Vol. 1)
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جوري
11-11-2011, 10:57 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Fakrun
Asalaamu Alaikum,

Actually, Mohammad told us who is a hypocrite. I read it just today in fact. Here's the Hadith I read:

Volumn 003, Book 043, Hadith Number 639.
-----------------------------------------
Narated By 'Abdullah bin 'Amr : The Prophet said, "Whoever has (the following) four characters will be a hypocrite, and whoever has one of the following four characteristics will have one characteristic of hypocrisy until he gives it up. These are: (1) Whenever he talks, he tells a lie; (2) whenever he makes a promise, he breaks it; (3) whenever he makes a covenant he proves treacherous; (4) and whenever he quarrels, he behaves impudently in an evil insulting manner." (See Hadith No. 33 Vol. 1)
Indeed, but hypocrites are also good at hiding said traits.. hence the definition: to conceal his or her real feelings or motives while professing what others desire to see.
Only Allah swt knows what lies hidden in the breasts of wo/men..

best,
Reply

Fakrun
11-11-2011, 11:02 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Insaanah
The emphasis being on "what was revealed to them", not scriptures adulterated and changed with the word of man ("they do not exchange the verses of Allah for a small price"). What was revealed to them is that they should believe in and worship one God, with no sons, no 3-in1s, no associates/sharers whatsover in His Exclusive Divinity, and that they must obey the messenger, and that there was a messenger to come. It also says, and they believe in "what was revealed to you", you being the prophet Muhammad, peace and blessings of Allah be upon him. To believe in that (the Qur'an), you have to accept the Messenger it was revealed to (Muhammad peace be upon him) and follow the commands contained therein. And many Christians at the time of the Prophet did exactly that.

It does not include nowadays Christians who worship a trinity while still saying they believe in one God, and who also reject the final Messenger of Allah, and the final unchanged word of Allah.
Asalaamu alaikum,

This is the Tafsir that I've read as posted on qtafsir dot com from Tafsir Ibn Kathir. Since I'm so new, I can not post the arabic script text so please excuse me for that. The red text is a highlight added by me.


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
The Condition of Some of the People of the Scriptures and their Rewards

Allah states that some of the People of the Book truly believe in Him and in what was sent down to Muhammad , along with believing in the previously revealed Books, and they are obedient to Him and humble themselves before Allah.

(Arabic text here)

(They do not sell the verses of Allah for a small price) ﴿3:199﴾, for they do not hide what they know of the glad tidings about the description of Muhammad , his Prophethood, and the description of his Ummah. Indeed, these are the best people among the People of the Book, whether they were Jews or Christians. Allah said in Surat Al-Qasas,

(Arabic text here)

(Those to whom We gave the Scripture before it, they believe in it (the Qur'an). And when it is recited to them, they say: "We believe in it. Verily, it is the truth from our Lord. Indeed even before it we were Muslims. These will be given their reward twice over, because they are patient,) ﴿28:52-54﴾. Allah said,

(Arabic text here)

(Those to whom We gave the Book, recite it (follow it) as it should be recited (i.e. followed), they are the ones who believe therein.) ﴿2:121﴾,

(Arabic text here)

(And of the people of Musa there is a community who lead with truth and establish justice therewith.) ﴿7:159﴾,

(Arabic text here)

(Not all of them are alike; a party of the people of the Scripture stand for the right, they recite the verses of Allah during the hours of the night, prostrating themselves in prayer.) ﴿3:113﴾, and,

(Arabic text here)

(Say: "Believe in it (the Qur'an) or do not believe (in it). Verily, those who were given knowledge before it, when it is recited to them, fall down on their faces in humble prostration.'' And they say: "Glory be to our Lord! Truly, the promise of our Lord must be fulfillled.'' And they fall down on their faces weeping and it increases their humility.) ﴿17:107- 109﴾.

These qualities exist in some of the Jews, but only a few of them. For instance, less than ten Jewish rabbis embraced the Islamic faith, such as `Abdullah bin Salam. Many among the Christians, on the other hand, embraced the Islamic faith. Allah said,

(Arabic text here)

(Verily, you will find the strongest among men in enmity to the believers the Jews and those who commit Shirk, and you will find the nearest in love to the believers those who say: "We are Christians.'') ﴿5:82﴾, until,

(Arabic text here)

(So because of what they said, Allah rewarded them Gardens under which rivers flow (in Paradise), they will abide therein forever) ﴿5:85﴾. In this Ayah,

Allah said,

(Arabic text here)


(for them is a reward with their Lord) ﴿3:199﴾.

When Ja`far bin Abi Talib recited Surah Maryam ﴿chapter 19﴾ to An-Najashi, King of Ethiopia, in the presence of Christian priests and patriarchs, he and they cried until their beards became wet from crying. The Two Sahihs record that when An-Najashi died, the Prophet conveyed the news to his Companions and said,

(Arabic text here)


(A brother of yours from Ethiopia has passed, come to offer the funeral prayer.) He went out with the Companions to the Musalla lined them up in rows, and after that led the prayer.

Ibn Abi Najih narrated that Mujahid said that,

(Arabic text here)

(And there are, certainly, among the People of the Scripture), refers to those among them who embraced Islam. `Abbad bin Mansur said that he asked Al-Hasan Al-Basri about Allah's statement,

(Arabic text here)


(And there are, certainly, among the People of the Scripture, those who believe in Allah).



Al-Hasan said, "They are the People of the Book, before Muhammad was sent, who believed in Muhammad and recognized Islam. Allah gave them a double reward, for the faith that they had before Muhammad , and for believing in Muhammad (after he was sent as Prophet).'' Ibn Abi Hatim recorded both of these statements. The Two Sahihs record that Abu Musa said that the Messenger of Allah said,

(Arabic text here)


(Three persons will acquire a double reward. )

He mentioned among them,


(A person from among the People of the Book who believed in his Prophet and in me.)

Allah's statement,

(Arabic text here)

(They do not sell the verses of Allah for a small price), means, they do not hide the knowledge that they have, as the cursed ones among them have done. Rather, they share the knowledge without a price, and this is why Allah said,


(Arabic text here)

(for them is a reward with their Lord. surely, Allah is Swift in account.)



Mujahid commented on the verse,

(Arabic text here)

((Surely, Allah is) swift in account), "He is swift in reckoning,'' as Ibn Abi Hatim and others have recorded from him.
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جوري
11-11-2011, 11:11 PM
have you also come across these verses?

"The Religion in the sight of Allah is Islam." (Qur'an 3:19)

In another verse of the Holy Qur'an, Allah states:
"If anyone desires a religion other than Islam (Submission to Allah), Never will it be accepted of him; and in the Hereafter he will be in the ranks of those who have lost."(Qur'an 3:85)

best,
Reply

Abz2000
11-11-2011, 11:28 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by _PakistaN_
I've come across a lot of non muslims who only believe in one God. How will Allah judge them?
when a person has rejected the worship of idols etc and has believed through his/her intellect and natural prompting that these are not gods, but there is only one God.
and they are sincere - they are believers.
if they hear of a prophet and reject him - they become disbelievers,
when people who had accepted the prophets who came before them - they were believers, when they rejected John (yahya pbuh) (and Jesus pbuh), they became rejecters (disbelievers),
in the same way, when the Prophet (pbuh) came to them with clear signs - those who were sincere in seeking the truth and accepted the truth - believed, those who didn't bother to ponder or accept the truth staring them in the face became rejecters (disbelievers).

it is recorded that the Prophet (pbuh) said that he had seen Waraqah bin naufal in paradise in his dream - he was a follower of Jesus (pbuh) and when told that the Prophet (pbuh) had received revelation from Gabriel, he was elated, but he died before any instructions came while he was still following the guidance revealed to Jesus (pbuh),
similarly - there was another man by the name of Zayd bin 'Amr bin Nufail from makkah who was a haneef, someone who believed in One God and rejected the idols,
Muhammad bin Ishaaq from ‘Hisham b. Urwah from his father on the authority of his mother Asmaa b. Abee Bakr said that
she saw Zayd as a very old man leaning his back on the Ka’bah and saying,
‘O Quraysh, By Him in whose hand is the soul of Zayd, not one of you follows the religion of Ibraaheem but I.’
Then he said: ‘O Allaah, if I knew how you wished to be worshipped I would so worship you; but I do not know.’ Then he prostrated himself.’

he died before the Prophet (pbuh) received revelation and the Prophet pbuh is reported to have said - he will be raised on the day of judgement as a nation on his own.

Zayd’s son, Sa‘eed bin Zayd, became a Muslim when he was less than twenty.
He and his wife, Fatimah (‘Umar ibn al-Khattab’s sister) were among the first followers of the Prophet, and the story of their pivotal role in 'Umar ibn Al Khattab's guidance to Islam is well known.

this applies to those who were sincere and followed the best of what was available to them.
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Insaanah
11-11-2011, 11:29 PM
In reference to post #9

Sahih International
So woe to those who write the "scripture" with their own hands, then say, "This is from Allah", in order to exchange it for a small price. Woe to them for what their hands have written and woe to them for what they earn. (2:79)

Peace.
Reply

Fakrun
11-12-2011, 11:09 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by ßlµêßêll
have you also come across these verses?

"The Religion in the sight of Allah is Islam." (Qur'an 3:19)

In another verse of the Holy Qur'an, Allah states:
"If anyone desires a religion other than Islam (Submission to Allah), Never will it be accepted of him; and in the Hereafter he will be in the ranks of those who have lost."(Qur'an 3:85)

best,
Asalaamu Alaikum,

I have actually. Many times.

I will not get into a dialog with you about this Ayat though. I've spent over a year learning about Islam and have never hid that fact, from anyone.

You do not know me. You do not know my beliefs and this is not the place for me to even attempt to try and teach you. You don't care to learn and you don't want to learn. Also, this is a Muslim forum and so the focus is not on the belief systems and practices of the Haudenoshaunee, but on Islam. Your only concern, regarding me should be, "Is this person posting accurate knowledge about this Deen?". If the answer is yes, then there is problem or threat. If the answer is no, and honest and respectful attempts to correct the knowledge go unheeded, THEN there is cause to worry.

Keep in mind though, not ALL mistakes warrant a conspiracy theory. Sometimes, a mistake is just a mistake and the person is unaware of the error.

EDIT:

BOY! Twice in one thread in the same day....the line in red SHOULD have read: "If the answer is yes, then there ISN'T a problem or thread"....
Reply

Fakrun
11-12-2011, 11:11 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by abz2000
when a person has rejected the worship of idols etc and has believed through his/her intellect and natural prompting that these are not gods, but there is only one God.
and they are sincere - they are believers.
if they hear of a prophet and reject him - they become disbelievers,
when people who had accepted the prophets who came before them - they were believers, when they rejected John (yahya pbuh) (and Jesus pbuh), they became rejecters (disbelievers),
in the same way, when the Prophet (pbuh) came to them with clear signs - those who were sincere in seeking the truth and accepted the truth - believed, those who didn't bother to ponder or accept the truth staring them in the face became rejecters (disbelievers).

it is recorded that the Prophet (pbuh) said that he had seen Waraqah bin naufal in paradise in his dream - he was a follower of Jesus (pbuh) and when told that the Prophet (pbuh) had received revelation from Gabriel, he was elated, but he died before any instructions came while he was still following the guidance revealed to Jesus (pbuh),
similarly - there was another man by the name of Zayd bin 'Amr bin Nufail from makkah who was a haneef, someone who believed in One God and rejected the idols,
Muhammad bin Ishaaq from ‘Hisham b. Urwah from his father on the authority of his mother Asmaa b. Abee Bakr said that
she saw Zayd as a very old man leaning his back on the Ka’bah and saying,
‘O Quraysh, By Him in whose hand is the soul of Zayd, not one of you follows the religion of Ibraaheem but I.’
Then he said: ‘O Allaah, if I knew how you wished to be worshipped I would so worship you; but I do not know.’ Then he prostrated himself.’

he died before the Prophet (pbuh) received revelation and the Prophet pbuh is reported to have said - he will be raised on the day of judgement as a nation on his own.

Zayd’s son, Sa‘eed bin Zayd, became a Muslim when he was less than twenty.
He and his wife, Fatimah (‘Umar ibn al-Khattab’s sister) were among the first followers of the Prophet, and the story of their pivotal role in 'Umar ibn Al Khattab's guidance to Islam is well known.

this applies to those who were sincere and followed the best of what was available to them.
Asalaamu alaikum,

What a wonderful post!! Jazakallah khair for taking the time to post it. There's information in there that I'm unfamiliar with...names I don't remember seeing ect. The mercy and patience in your heart shines through the text................not an easy thing to do. May your Noor continue to get brighter. :)
Reply

Fakrun
11-12-2011, 11:12 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by Insaanah
In reference to post #9

Sahih International
So woe to those who write the "scripture" with their own hands, then say, "This is from Allah", in order to exchange it for a small price. Woe to them for what their hands have written and woe to them for what they earn. (2:79)

Peace.
Asalaamu alaikum,

Then its a good thing I didn't write the Tafsir then, now isn't it....
Reply

Insaanah
11-12-2011, 12:02 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Fakrun
Asalaamu alaikum,

Then its a good thing I didn't write the Tafsir then, now isn't it....
Peace, Fakrun.

Please note, that Ibn Kathir (may Allah be pleased with him) did not write the Qur'an, and nor did he say anywhere that his words were the word of Allah.

In quoting what I did, I provided supporting evidence for what I had said. That does not mean that Ibn Kathir is wrong, as verses can have more than one valid interpretation.

Peace.
Reply

Fakrun
11-12-2011, 12:20 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Insaanah
In quoting what I did, I provided supporting evidence for what I had said. That does not mean that Ibn Kathir is wrong, as verses can have more than one valid interpretation.
Asalaamu alaikum,

AH! ok...not I understand your intent.

EDIT:

Sorry, that was a typo...it SHOULD have read, "AH! ok...NOW I understand your intent".....

My vision was a bit askew this morning due to a various reasons relating to my brain. I apologize if it caused confusion.
Reply

Ramadhan
11-12-2011, 02:06 PM
Salam Fakrun,

You seem to believe that Islam is the truth and that Qur'an is the word of God, but you claim you are not a muslim.
This intrigues me, because it is such a contradiction. If you don't mind, would you please explain?
(I think this is still within the topic)
Reply

جوري
11-12-2011, 05:01 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Fakrun
Asalaamu Alaikum,

I have actually. Many times.

I will not get into a dialog with you about this Ayat though. I've spent over a year learning about Islam and have never hid that fact, from anyone.

You do not know me. You do not know my beliefs and this is not the place for me to even attempt to try and teach you. You don't care to learn and you don't want to learn. Also, this is a Muslim forum and so the focus is not on the belief systems and practices of the Haudenoshaunee, but on Islam. Your only concern, regarding me should be, "Is this person posting accurate knowledge about this Deen?". If the answer is yes, then there is problem or threat. If the answer is no, and honest and respectful attempts to correct the knowledge go unheeded, THEN there is cause to worry.

Keep in mind though, not ALL mistakes warrant a conspiracy theory. Sometimes, a mistake is just a mistake and the person is unaware of the error.
You're right in the fact that I don't know your beliefs and that is indeed your business & I should respectfully say that how you practice or what you believe doesn't concern me in the slightest. I am not into swapping a conversion by overlooking a few misquotes, my concern is that the noble Quran & ahadiths shouldn't be misused or quoted out of context and without understanding.
As you said I don't know you so I am not emotionally invested so why do you seem to be? I don't wish to lower every reply with you to a common denominator that belongs on some street corner. We're here to exchange proper knowledge not to one up another. pride is up there with hypocrisy on the list of cardinal sins!

best,
Reply

Ğħαrєєвαħ
11-12-2011, 05:55 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Fakrun
Asalaamu alaikum,
This is the Tafsir that I've read as posted on qtafsir dot com from Tafsir Ibn Kathir. Since I'm so new, I can not post the arabic script text so please excuse me for that. The red text is a highlight added by me.
Wa Alaaykum As'Salaam

I believe you have not understood what sister Insaanah mentioned in her post in which you quoted the sister in..


Surah Al Qasaas verses 199

"And there are, certainly, among the People of the Scripture (Jews and Christians), those who believe in Allah and in that which has been revealed to you (i.e Muhammad (SAW), and in that which has been revealed to them, humbling themselves before Allah. They do not sell the verses of Allah for a small price, for them is a reward with their Lord. Surely, Allah is swift in account".
Sister Insaanah said as quoted..
format_quote Originally Posted by Insaanah
("they do not exchange the verses of Allah for a small price"). What was revealed to them is that they should believe in and worship one God, with no sons, no 3-in1s, no associates/sharers whatsover in His Exclusive Divinity, and that they must obey the messenger, and that there was a messenger to come.
The verse states those who believe in Allaah, meaning they believe in one God, do not associate partners, in other words believe that which was revealed to Muhammad (SAW).

Allah states that some of the People of the Book truly believe in Him and in what was sent down to Muhammad , along with believing in the previously revealed Books, and they are obedient to Him and humble themselves before Allah.



﴿لاَ يَشْتَرُونَ بِـَايَـتِ اللَّهِ ثَمَناً قَلِيلاً﴾



(They do not sell the verses of Allah for a small price) ﴿3:199﴾, for they do not hide what they know of the glad tidings about the description of Muhammad , his Prophethood, and the description of his Ummah. Indeed, these are the best people among the People of the Book, whether they were Jews or Christians. Allah said in Surat Al-Qasas,



﴿الَّذِينَ ءَاتَيْنَـهُمُ الْكِتَـبَ مِن قَبْلِهِ هُم بِهِ يُؤْمِنُونَ وَإِذَا يُتْلَى عَلَيْهِمْ قَالُواْ ءَامَنَّا بِهِ إِنَّهُ الْحَقُّ مِن رَّبِّنَآ إنَّا كُنَّا مِن قَبْلِهِيُؤْتُونَ أَجْرَهُم مَّرَّتَيْنِ بِمَا صَبَرُواْ﴾



(Those to whom We gave the Scripture before it, they believe in it (the Qur'an). And when it is recited to them, they say: "We believe in it. Verily, it is the truth from our Lord. Indeed even before it we were Muslims. These will be given their reward twice over, because they are patient,) ﴿28:52-54﴾. Allah said,



﴿الَّذِينَ آتَيْنَـهُمُ الْكِتَـبَ يَتْلُونَهُ حَقَّ تِلاَوَتِهِ أُوْلَـئِكَ يُؤْمِنُونَ بِهِ﴾



(Those to whom We gave the Book, recite it (follow it) as it should be recited (i.e. followed), they are the ones who believe therein.) ﴿2:121﴾,



﴿وَمِن قَوْمِ مُوسَى أُمَّةٌ يَهْدُونَ بِالْحَقِّ وَبِهِ يَعْدِلُونَ ﴾



(And of the people of Musa there is a community who lead with truth and establish justice therewith.) ﴿7:159﴾,



﴿لَيْسُواْ سَوَآءً مِّنْ أَهْلِ الْكِتَـبِ أُمَّةٌ قَآئِمَةٌ يَتْلُونَ ءَايَـتِ اللَّهِ ءَانَآءَ الَّيْلِ وَهُمْ يَسْجُدُونَ ﴾



(Not all of them are alike; a party of the people of the Scripture stand for the right, they recite the verses of Allah during the hours of the night, prostrating themselves in prayer.) ﴿3:113﴾, and,



﴿قُلْ ءَامِنُواْ بِهِ أَوْ لاَ تُؤْمِنُواْ إِنَّ الَّذِينَ أُوتُواْ الْعِلْمَ مِن قَبْلِهِ إِذَا يُتْلَى عَلَيْهِمْ يَخِرُّونَ لِلاٌّذْقَانِ سُجَّدًا - وَيَقُولُونَ سُبْحَانَ رَبِّنَآ إِن كَانَ وَعْدُ رَبِّنَا لَمَفْعُولاً - وَيَخِرُّونَ لِلاٌّذْقَانِ يَبْكُونَ وَيَزِيدُهُمْ خُشُوعًا ﴾



(Say: "Believe in it (the Qur'an) or do not believe (in it). Verily, those who were given knowledge before it, when it is recited to them, fall down on their faces in humble prostration.'' And they say: "Glory be to our Lord! Truly, the promise of our Lord must be fulfillled.'' And they fall down on their faces weeping and it increases their humility.) ﴿17:107- 109﴾.



These qualities exist in some of the Jews, but only a few of them. For instance, less than ten Jewish rabbis embraced the Islamic faith, such as `Abdullah bin Salam. Many among the Christians, on the other hand, embraced the Islamic faith. Allah said,



﴿لَتَجِدَنَّ أَشَدَّ النَّاسِ عَدَاوَةً لِّلَّذِينَ ءَامَنُواْ الْيَهُودَ وَالَّذِينَ أَشْرَكُواْ وَلَتَجِدَنَّ أَقْرَبَهُمْ مَّوَدَّةً لِّلَّذِينَ ءَامَنُواْ الَّذِينَ قَالُواْ إِنَّا نَصَارَى﴾



(Verily, you will find the strongest among men in enmity to the believers the Jews and those who commit Shirk, and you will find the nearest in love to the believers those who say: "We are Christians.'') ﴿5:82﴾, until,



﴿فَأَثَابَهُمُ اللَّهُ بِمَا قَالُواْ جَنَّـتٍ تَجْرِى مِن تَحْتِهَا الاٌّنْهَـرُ خَـلِدِينَ فِيهَا﴾



(So because of what they said, Allah rewarded them Gardens under which rivers flow (in Paradise), they will abide therein forever) ﴿5:85﴾. In this Ayah,



Allah said,



﴿أُوْلـئِكَ لَهُمْ أَجْرُهُمْ عِندَ رَبِّهِمْ﴾



(for them is a reward with their Lord) ﴿3:199﴾.



When Ja`far bin Abi Talib recited Surah Maryam ﴿chapter 19﴾ to An-Najashi, King of Ethiopia, in the presence of Christian priests and patriarchs, he and they cried until their beards became wet from crying. The Two Sahihs record that when An-Najashi died, the Prophet conveyed the news to his Companions and said,



«إِنَّ أَخًا لَكُمْ بِالْحَبَشَةِ قَدْ مَاتَ، فَصَلُّوا عَلَيْه»

(A brother of yours from Ethiopia has passed, come to offer the funeral prayer.) He went out with the Companions to the Musalla lined them up in rows, and after that led the prayer.



Ibn Abi Najih narrated that Mujahid said that,



﴿وَإِن مِّنْ أَهْلِ الْكِتَـبِ﴾



(And there are, certainly, among the People of the Scripture), refers to those among them who embraced Islam. `Abbad bin Mansur said that he asked Al-Hasan Al-Basri about Allah's statement,



﴿وَإِنَّ مِنْ أَهْلِ الْكِتَـبِ لَمَن يُؤْمِنُ بِاللَّهِ﴾



(And there are, certainly, among the People of the Scripture, those who believe in Allah).



Al-Hasan said, "They are the People of the Book, before Muhammad was sent, who believed in Muhammad and recognized Islam. Allah gave them a double reward, for the faith that they had before Muhammad , and for believing in Muhammad (after he was sent as Prophet).'' Ibn Abi Hatim recorded both of these statements. The Two Sahihs record that Abu Musa said that the Messenger of Allah said,



«ثَلَاثَةٌ يُؤْتَوْنَ أَجْرَهُمْ مَرَّتَيْن»



(Three persons will acquire a double reward. )



He mentioned among them,



«وَرَجُلٌ مِنْ أَهْلِ الْكِتَابِ آمَنَ بِنَبِيِّهِ وَآمَنَ بِي»



(A person from among the People of the Book who believed in his Prophet and in me.)



Allah's statement,



﴿لاَ يَشْتَرُونَ بِـَايَـتِ اللَّهِ ثَمَناً قَلِيلاً﴾



(They do not sell the verses of Allah for a small price), means, they do not hide the knowledge that they have, as the cursed ones among them have done. Rather, they share the knowledge without a price, and this is why Allah said,



﴿أُوْلـئِكَ لَهُمْ أَجْرُهُمْ عِندَ رَبِّهِمْ إِنَّ اللَّهَ سَرِيعُ الْحِسَابِ﴾



(for them is a reward with their Lord. surely, Allah is Swift in account.)



Mujahid commented on the verse,



﴿سَرِيعُ الْحِسَابِ﴾



((Surely, Allah is) swift in account), "He is swift in reckoning,'' as Ibn Abi Hatim and others have recorded from him.
Reply

Ğħαrєєвαħ
11-12-2011, 06:08 PM
Greetings of peace

format_quote Originally Posted by Fakrun
"Is this person posting accurate knowledge about this Deen?". If the answer is yes, then there is problem or threat.
Yes, that would most certainly be a main concern, but another concern would be, whether the knowledge is applied accurately. For example there are many anti-islamists who may post accurate knowledge ,however, they may do so in the wrong context. There intention may certainly not be sincerety but rather to hate or bash, also lack of knowledge.
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Fakrun
11-12-2011, 06:24 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Jεώel oғ ωïѕdoм
Yes, that would most certainly be a main concern, but another concern would be, whether the knowledge is applied accurately. For example there are many anti-islamists who may post accurate knowledge ,however, they may do so in the wrong context. There intention may certainly not be sincerety but rather to hate or bash etc.
Asalaamu alaikum,

Hmmm...Not something I had even thought about. While the line quoted isn't what I had intended (it should have read ISN'T a problem), you make quite a valid point.

I could tell you things like 'I respect Mohammad' and I have many Muslim friends and I certainly do not hate Islam and have stood up to people who DO bash Islam', but you wouldn't believe it. I happen to know Sister Riham, Sister Harb, Brother Futuwwa, and Sister Starrynight so I would suggest asking them what I am like on other boards. That's the best I can do.
Reply

Ğħαrєєвαħ
11-12-2011, 06:29 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Fakrun
Asalaamu alaikum,
Hmmm...Not something I had even thought about. While the line quoted isn't what I had intended (it should have read ISN'T a problem), you make quite a valid point.
I could tell you things like 'I respect Mohammad' and I have many Muslim friends and I certainly do not hate Islam and have stood up to people who DO bash Islam', but you wouldn't believe it. I happen to know Sister Riham, Sister Harb, Brother Futuwwa, and Sister Starrynight so I would suggest asking them what I am like on other boards. That's the best I can do.
Wa Alaaykum As'Salaam

I wish to mention that I wasn't using you as an example, i replied to a previous post of yours which i felt i needed to address. I have no knowledge about you, about your belief, your character etc, therefore giving me nor anyone any right to judge you. But all I know of you is of the posts you have made on the forum so far.

So, if it seems as if I am judging you I do apologise.
Reply

transition?
11-12-2011, 07:11 PM
There's multiples types of righteous. It is not enough to be just a "good person." The problem with this is that we think we see "good people" and assign our own definition of righteous/morality above the definition Allah gives it. There are people who believe in One God, who give charity, help others and treat others well but what about the other obligations of morality? Allah (swt) commands us to pray, to say the shahadah...which are all necessary to be a righteous person. Wouldn't a truly righteous person recognize the importance of all of Allah's Commands? Ultimately, Allah (swt) knows Best. He is the Most Just.

We have separated goodness into moral goodness and "religious goodness"/rituals but Allah (swt) combines this in Islam.

Nouman Ali Khan goes over this principle toward the end of this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dF1qP9ymXqk
Reply

Insaanah
11-12-2011, 11:17 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Fakrun
Asalaamu alaikum,

AH! ok...not I understand your intent.

EDIT:

Sorry, that was a typo...it SHOULD have read, "AH! ok...NOW I understand your intent".....

My vision was a bit askew this morning due to a various reasons relating to my brain. I apologize if it caused confusion.
No problem, I figured it was a typo.

Peace.
Reply

Hamza Asadullah
11-13-2011, 12:05 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by _PakistaN_
I've come across a lot of non muslims who only believe in one God. How will Allah judge them?

I've also come across a couple of Christians who had tremendous amount of noor on their face. This type of noor I have never seen on anyone's face. How come that is?
Asalaamu Alaikum, there are two types of non believers. The first type are the disbelievers and they are those who were shown "clear" signs that Islam was the truth but they rejected it due to arrogance, pride and ignorance. They will certainly burn in Hell but Allah forgives who he wants and his judgement is final.

The second type are those non believers that were not given "clear" signs about Islam. They will be tested in the hereafter. Some scholars say they will be tested by Allah by being sent a Prophet who will call upon them and whoever follows the Prophet will succeed. Some say they will be tested in other ways. But what we do know is that they will have some sort of test in the hereafter which Allah knows best what it will be. Whatever happens Allah is MOST just and fair.

And Allah knows best in all matters
Reply

Fakrun
11-13-2011, 12:29 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by Hamza Asadullah
Some scholars say they will be tested by Allah by being sent a Prophet who will call upon them and whoever follows the Prophet will succeed.
Asalaamu alaikum,

Brother, would you please go into more detail about this? I've never heard about this and it fascinates me!
Reply

Fakrun
11-13-2011, 12:30 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by Insaanah
No problem, I figured it was a typo.

Peace.
Asalaamu Alaikum Ukti,

WHEW! :) I had to correct it though so....I glad you understood it. :)
Reply

Hamza Asadullah
11-13-2011, 01:52 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by Fakrun
Asalaamu alaikum,

Brother, would you please go into more detail about this? I've never heard about this and it fascinates me!
Wa Alaikum


The Prophet (Sallallahu Alaihi Wasallam) said: “Four types of people will be tested on the day of judgement: a deaf man who cannot hear anything, a mad man, an old aged man and a man who died during fatrah (a period of time when no messenger was sent to people). The deaf man will say: “Oh Allah, Islam came while I cannot hear anything!”. The mad man will say: “Oh Allah, Islam came while the boys throw animals’ excrement on me!”. The old aged man will say: “Oh Allah, Islam came while I can understand nothing”. And the man who died during a fatrah will say: “Oh Allah, I witnessed no messenger from You”. Then Allah takes a promise from them to obey Him. Then He will command them to enter hell, and who enters it will find it peace and cool, and who disobeys will be dragged to hell” (Ahmed, Bayhaqi)

Again it is not known exactly how the non believers who were not given clear signs of Islam will be tested, this could be one of the tests they face, Allah knows best, but what we do know is that Allah is most fair and just.

And Allah knows best in all matters
Reply

Fakrun
11-13-2011, 11:47 AM
Asalaamu alaikum,

Sister Inshannah, I just saw this on IslamQA and thought I'd share it since we were talking "tafsir". It was part of a whole fatwah about the tafisir of Surah 60:5 but I still thought of our discussion when I read it.

"The basic principle in tafseer is that if the verse may be interpreted in two ways that do not exclude one another, then it must be interpreted in both ways."

I just thought that was an interesting statement...
Reply

Fakrun
11-13-2011, 11:54 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by Ramadhan
Salam Fakrun,

You seem to believe that Islam is the truth and that Qur'an is the word of God, but you claim you are not a muslim.
This intrigues me, because it is such a contradiction. If you don't mind, would you please explain?
(I think this is still within the topic)
Wa Alaikum Asalaamu Ramadhan,

I just wanted to let you know that I have not forgotten about your question. Please understand, this question (or others similar to it) is probably the most asked question of me. Typically, once I answer it, the Muslims just vanish...poof...and never speak to me again. Not because of what I've said but simply because their curiosity was sated. The only reason why they would pm me at all is to ask that question. It turns me into a circus freak...

I've grown to hate this question.

I beg for your patience in the matter.
Reply

Fakrun
11-13-2011, 12:00 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Hamza Asadullah
Wa Alaikum


The Prophet (Sallallahu Alaihi Wasallam) said: “Four types of people will be tested on the day of judgement: a deaf man who cannot hear anything, a mad man, an old aged man and a man who died during fatrah (a period of time when no messenger was sent to people). The deaf man will say: “Oh Allah, Islam came while I cannot hear anything!”. The mad man will say: “Oh Allah, Islam came while the boys throw animals’ excrement on me!”. The old aged man will say: “Oh Allah, Islam came while I can understand nothing”. And the man who died during a fatrah will say: “Oh Allah, I witnessed no messenger from You”. Then Allah takes a promise from them to obey Him. Then He will command them to enter hell, and who enters it will find it peace and cool, and who disobeys will be dragged to hell” (Ahmed, Bayhaqi)

Again it is not known exactly how the non believers who were not given clear signs of Islam will be tested, this could be one of the tests they face, Allah knows best, but what we do know is that Allah is most fair and just.

And Allah knows best in all matters
Asalaamu Alaikum,

Brother, in your previous post you said that the SCHOLARS say that "they (non-Muslims) will be tested by Allah by being sent a Prophet who will call upon them and whoever follows the Prophet will succeed.".

Where did you see this information? Which Scholars say this? What is their proof of that statement? Like I said, its fascinating.....I've heard the above Hadith tho. There are some topics in Islam that I'm just now starting to explore deeper so some things catch my eye.
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