Truly a dangerous trend on the forum

[جوري]

:sl:

I see no harm personally from people voicing their personal opinion in whatever section.. It is just words at the end of the day.
But I am noticing a very dangerous trend especially on the immunization thread, where people are using ahadith to make haram that which isn't haram, has not been made haram by an Islamic council, nor Medical doctors and we can concede that we've doctors who are Muslim who work in every field from Organic chemistry to immunology.
I am unable to reply in the way I'd like for several reasons. I haven't the time to waste paragraph by paragraph either explaining what the ingredients, exposing frauds, defending positions, going into health risks and benefits of each vaccine, since I don't personally think that all vaccines should be treated the same.. furthermore, even if I wanted to, I couldn't on the account that the pages don't load correctly for me at least, and I can't edit or visit the page I want or even quote paragraph by paragraph, So I don't wish to undertake such a monumental effort against a clique that doesn't seem to think, that there's a slight possibility that they're mislead but from an opposite pole.
I realize it is fun to play doctor, it was fun for me when I was 5 too until you as an individual actually realize like with anything else, be it Islamic jurisprudence, mathematics or civil engineering, is a grueling & charged science that requires sacrifice, study and accreditation at the end of the day not even that would afford you an illustrious recognition as some who choose to malign a science so intricate & have dedicated their life to doing so, the same way we find 'ex Muslims' or 'christian scholars' writing vile and incorrect analyses of the Quran, Sunnah, the prophet etc.
Just consider the dangerous part here. As I stated and repeatedly it doesn't aggrieve me what they personally do or what they impose on their children. But consider the dangers of using hadith and google scholarship to make haram something that isn't. And frankly if it is then I need to see it in an official manner.

Consider also that many people lurk on this forum, and this will unfortunately be their first impression of Islam. I am not even going to touch upon the massive conspiracy theories on other threads as presented by 16 year olds as I don't consider health to be in the same league as politics.. one is words and the other is people's health and well being.

:w:

[ardianto]

:sl:

where people are using ahadith to make haram that which isn't haram, has not been made haram by an Islamic council,

Your concern is also concern of many Muslims in my place. Yes, there is a trend which people make fatawa without reference from fiqh.

[Endymion]

(16:116) And do not utter falsehoods by letting your tongues declare: "This is lawful" and "That is unlawful," thus fabricating lies against Allah. Surely those who fabricate lies against Allah will never prosper.

[Hulk]

Thank you for the reminder sis.

Hey there! Looks like you're enjoying the discussion, but you're not signed up for an account.

When you create an account, you can participate in the discussions and share your thoughts. You also get notifications, here and via email, whenever new posts are made. And you can like posts and make new friends.
Sign Up

[جوري]

I am genuinely just sad about all this.. This is an exact microcosm of the plague that has infested the Muslim world.. Somehow makes people's hearts insensitive to suffering as they see it for suffering as they perceive it, pharisaical but not feeling, condemning but not encouraging, oppressive but not facilitative, rigid and not reasoning...

:w:

[Hulk]

I think it's very important for us to realise that the Quran and Sunnah are not texts to be taken lightly and we need to be careful when we use them to justify a statement we have said. If we are wrong, think about the confusion that was spread because of our negligence. Do we dare be accountable for such confusion? Surely not..

[Scimitar]

I see no harm personally from people voicing their personal opinion in whatever section.. It is just words at the end of the day.

I wish that were the case sister, I really do. But after seeing your behaviour on another thread lately, I don't believe it. I honestly am starting to think that if someone doesn't agree with you, you take it badly... I'm sure this isn't the first time you are reading this.

We all have work to do on ourselves, granted, but to project a flaw which resides within ourselves onto other "forum members" as is the implication with the thread title and first post, is quite contradictory... so I leave this post with a ^o)

Scimi

[جوري]

I wish that were the case sister, I really do. But after seeing your behaviour on another thread lately, I don't believe it. I honestly am starting to think that if someone doesn't agree with you, you take it badly... I'm sure this isn't the first time you are reading this.

We all have work to do on ourselves, granted, but to project a flaw which resides within ourselves onto other "forum members" as is the implication with the thread title and first post, is quite contradictory... so I leave this post with a ^o)

Scimi

Do you notice that it is the same people liking your posts in every section? Should that not be telling of who takes well or bady their views being brought to light and dissected? Not everyone wishes or desires to take scrutiny or stand outside of the herd if they feel their opinion will not be accepted by the majority and I imagine how difficult it is (as I find mysef often doing it alone) to be the only one of your kind in a particular community that shares similar views and agendas no matter how deviant from reality.
Politics is politics, eschatology is eschatology.. following a mazhab is just that at the end of the day.. but bringing evidence based medicine and tampering with peope's lives through religious psychological manipulation is a different story all together.. and btw I wasn't the only one who opposed your (collective) similar views on that thread..

:w:

[IslamicRevival]

I wish that were the case sister, I really do. But after seeing your behaviour on another thread lately, I don't believe it. I honestly am starting to think that if someone doesn't agree with you, you take it badly... I'm sure this isn't the first time you are reading this.

We all have work to do on ourselves, granted, but to project a flaw which resides within ourselves onto other "forum members" as is the implication with the thread title and first post, is quite contradictory... so I leave this post with a ^o)

Scimi

Brave man, 'constructive' criticism at its best and you've truly hit the nail on the head in more ways then one.

[Scimitar]

Whatever the case, did it warrant starting this thread? :D Come on, admit it, you started this thread to spite the people in the other one.

Do you notice that it is the same people liking your posts in every section?

Yes, same way I notice the same of groups of people liking eachothers posts... it's become a bit of a trend here... even rep systems have been abused like that. What's your point? It's not like I'm making them like my posts sis.

Not everyone wishes or desires to take scrutiny or stand outside of the herd if they feel their opinion will not be accepted by the majority and I imagine how difficult it is (as I find mysef often doing it alone) to be the only one of your kind in a particular community that shares similar views and agendas no matter how deviant from reality.

I can agree that if we are saying something away from the maiknstream, that we will indeed invite scrutiny and critique, but hey, if one is firm in their conviction - that should not be an issue - can you agree with that?

As for reality. You mention a deviant one... I just do not know what you meant by that. Please explain, because for me, my reality is what I perceive amongst layers of other realities.

Politics is politics, eschatology is eschatology.. following a mazhab is just that at the end of the day.. but bringing evidence based medicine and tampering with peope's lives through religious psychological manipulation is a different story all together.. and btw I wasn't the only one who opposed your (collective) similar views on that thread..

Whoa, hold your horses. Religious Psychological Manipulation??? My opinions are only opinions, they don't come with a special power that brainwashes everyone on the forum you know sis :D... and it's ok to disagree with me, if you do it well, it makes me smile :)

Scimi

[جوري]

Akhi, I don't hold for you any spite and wish you nothing but happiness with your chosen love.. and Allah swt is a witness over my heart & intention I do apologize if I caused you hurt but that will not deter me from saying what I firmly believe is the truth..It might cost me kinships and friendships but I will not substitute equivocation for that.. The true ones remain in the end..

:w:

[Scimitar]

I feel the same :) May Allah make us all successful Ameen :)

Scimi

[IbnAbdulHakim]

were you to become a journalist, I would definitly read ever article you wrote. so well written, mashAllah

[جوري]

were you to become a journalist, I would definitly read ever article you wrote. so well written, mashAllah

Jazaka Allah khyran.. I have already committed to my path - in shaa Allah we'll see the very best for you & from you..
ameen

[Tyrion]

But I am noticing a very dangerous trend especially on the immunization thread, where people are using ahadith to make haram that which isn't haram, has not been made haram by an Islamic council, nor Medical doctors and we can concede that we've doctors who are Muslim who work in every field from Organic chemistry to immunology.

You've only just noticed this? :p:

same people liking your posts in every section?

I wish mods would start taking this issue seriously. I said this when they introduced the like system, and I"ll say it again... It's a terrible idea. Discussions degenerate into these little clique wars, and people begin supporting others in their ignorance, encouraging them to ignore all opposing information.

[GuestFellow]

I wish mods would start taking this issue seriously. I said this when they introduced the like system, and I"ll say it again... It's a terrible idea. Discussions degenerate into these little clique wars, and people begin supporting others in their ignorance, encouraging them to ignore all opposing information.

Asslamu Aliakum,

I don't know what your going on about. Even without the like feature, arguments/discussions/emotional tantrums will still occur on this forum.

[جوري]

The like system is reps for the lazy :p
I don't mind otherwise garden variety opinions I just don't like factions and have been wondering if this is a shiite forum for the last few days..
Reminds me of a story my grandmother used to tell me when I was a kid to freak me out by..
A man went into those turkish baths in old cairo some time after midnight because he was working hard all day.. He did notice it was bustling with people and figured ok, it isn't so bad he won't be totally alone.. so he goes in does his business and doesn't stare at people until he towels and dries himself and all of a sudden notices that all those people are human on top and have these strange looking legs on the bottom.. and he's deeply disturbed by this, so he goes and sits by the fountain with a cup of tea (yeah back in the day you can get tea with your bath) and he strikes a conversation with the dude next to him.. and he goes do you notice something disturbing about everyone? and the other fellow goes no, what do you mean?
the guy guys I can't help but notice and maybe I am just drowsy from the hot water that they don't have normal looking legs... upon which the other guy goes as he brings his own legs to full view..
Do you mean like these?

so the guy of course went out screaming. .. and that is where she alleges the Egyptian adage 'laou kano ikhtasho kano mato' - meaning those who have shame die..
on the account the guy went out in the nude in lieu of dying with the bathing jinn...

:w:

[ardianto]

I think it's very important for us to realise that the Quran and Sunnah are not texts to be taken lightly and we need to be careful when we use them to justify a statement we have said. If we are wrong, think about the confusion that was spread because of our negligence. Do we dare be accountable for such confusion? Surely not..

Sometime I posted ayaah and hadith, with its interpretation.

However, those interpretation were not made by myself. I just quoted what the ulama said about those ayaah and hadith.

[Endymion]

I wish mods would start taking this issue seriously. I said this when they introduced the like system, and I"ll say it again... It's a terrible idea. Discussions degenerate into these little clique wars, and people begin supporting others in their ignorance, encouraging them to ignore all opposing information.

I don't think these functions are creating any problem.They are just reps and likes limited to the forum and wont come out and effect on our real lives.What if i collect so many rep points and likes but in real,i am a looser?Sister is pointing out a much bigger problem which i can see the problem of this whole Ummah.Dr Iqbal once said "If there is anyone in these times is a victim,it is Islam.Who ever wants it,pick it and use it according to their wish".We look for specialists for our real life problems,for our health issues or any other serious issue,but when it comes to Deeyn,we become scholars our selves.It will be better if we take a break and think.Its time to stop playing Islam,Islam.Let the scholars do their job.If you are not sure in a matter and your views are just your personal opinion,keep them personal.Beware there are lots of new Muslims learning Islam and if anyone get any wrong idea from your posts,you'll be the responsible.Please let the people learn the deeyn from learned people and not Google Scholars.Internet is a bundle of information,it can't teach you the deeyn.

[Hulk]

Sometime I posted ayaah and hadith, with its interpretation.

However, those interpretation were not made by myself. I just quoted what the ulama said about those ayaah and hadith.

I appreciate your sharing akhi!

[~Zaria~]

We look for specialists for our real life problems,for our health issues or any other serious issue,but when it comes to Deeyn,we become scholars our selves.It will be better if we take a break and think.Its time to stop playing Islam,Islam.Let the scholars do their job

SubhanAllah!

Wise words...... hope everyone reads this post, and then reads it again.

I learnt this not so long ago, when I went looking for the ruling on women travelling with/without a mahram.
The last place one should turn to in these types of matters in Sheikh Google!

We tend to find what we are looking for - which in my case, lead me to an incorrect interpretation of this particular ruling.
Alhamdulillah, Allah sent someone to me, at just the right time, with just the right advise (as you have said above) - to make me realise otherwise.

Brothers and sisters,
Know where to find your Islam.

It lies with learned and sincere scholars - those Wallis of Allah who live their lives for their Rabb.


True knowledge is a precious gift......and it comes to those make the correct effort and with the correct intention when seeking it.

:wa:

[GuestFellow]

Meh everyone has their own opinions. If people don't agree with another, then just accept it and move on.

[TrueStranger]

The like system is reps for the lazy :p
I don't mind otherwise garden variety opinions I just don't like factions and have been wondering if this is a shiite forum for the last few days..
Reminds me of a story my grandmother used to tell me when I was a kid to freak me out by..
A man went into those turkish baths in old cairo some time after midnight because he was working hard all day.. He did notice it was bustling with people and figured ok, it isn't so bad he won't be totally alone.. so he goes in does his business and doesn't stare at people until he towels and dries himself and all of a sudden notices that all those people are human on top and have these strange looking legs on the bottom.. and he's deeply disturbed by this, so he goes and sits by the fountain with a cup of tea (yeah back in the day you can get tea with your bath) and he strikes a conversation with the dude next to him.. and he goes do you notice something disturbing about everyone? and the other fellow goes no, what do you mean?
the guy guys I can't help but notice and maybe I am just drowsy from the hot water that they don't have normal looking legs... upon which the other guy goes as he brings his own legs to full view..
Do you mean like these?

so the guy of course went out screaming. .. and that is where she alleges the Egyptian adage 'laou kano ikhtasho kano mato' - meaning those who have shame die..
on the account the guy went out in the nude in lieu of dying with the bathing jinn...

:w:

Those scary jinn stories. I remember someone telling me one similar to this one, but the only think I really recall is that the Jinns had legs of a donkey. LOL! I wonder where these descriptions come from. ;D

[جوري]

Those scary jinn stories. I remember someone telling me one similar to this one, but the only think I really recall is that the Jinns had legs of a donkey. LOL! I wonder where these descriptions come from. ;D

My grandmother Allah yer7mha was one of a kind, if I told you she actually would tell the story over one of those old chamber lamps and would reenact the last portion of the tale by showing her legs and all of us kids screaming ;D.. of course it didn't help that her house was older than sin and you weren't sure half the time if you were talking to a cousin, neighbor or the usual odd creature..
God I miss those days ...

[greenhill]

People will play games. Given a tool, they will use it, rightly or wrongly, for whatever reasons. Some just want reaction, regardless of whether it is good or not, and there will be those who will argue for the sake of it, especially with the anonimity. Some will just shoot off their mouths with whatever thoughts that comes to their head.

We meet all sorts and there will be all sorts and we won't get 100 per cent consensus on forums. We just have to bear in mind that these things exists and have to still be careful with what we read, say and believe. Nobody is forcing anybody here to do anything. Just some more forceful in their beliefs than others and have their way if expressing their opinions.

Whether I get likes or not is not the reason for my input, that just happens, my input is entirely dependent on whether I can contribute to a topic ir not. And I normally would 'like' good, fair comments that adds something else to my own line of thoughts and also to do with the effort they put in to address the topic. Generally, it has to pull at the heart strings....:shade: