Do You Consider Speed-Dating Haram?

[Iceee]

Yes, no? Why?

[Muslim Woman]

:sl:



what is it ? :embarrass

[Qurratul Ayn]

what is it ?

Ditto. My thoughts exactly

[Perseveranze]

I consider anything with the word dating in it haram.

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['Abd Al-Maajid]

dating briefly with multiple partners? The only dates halal in islam are

[Indian Bro]

I just realized the word "date" has three different meanings.

1. The best fruit in the WORLD

2. The time in terms of day, month and year

3. The social activity (which is Haraam)

Are there any other words in the English vocabulary which hold more than two meanings?

Salam 3laikum

[Qurratul Ayn]

I consider anything with the word dating in it haram.

dating briefly with multiple partners? The only dates halal in islam are

Well said. Or written. And shown.

[Alpha Dude]

:sl: Asking random people for their opinion on what is to be considered halal or haram is not a good idea. Whenever you have a question like this, ask someone knowledgeable in your locality, perhaps an imam/mufti. They can tell you what is right according to Islamic law.

Opinions of people who are not learned is not something that should be sought on these kind of matters.

[Iceee]

Just want your opinions.

http://www.muslim-marriage-events.com/how-it-works.html

"Divorce rates among British Muslims are on the rise in line with wider society. According to some Muslim commentators one in eight Muslim marriages now ends in divorce, up from one in 20 in the space of two generations, and increasing numbers of Muslims are seeking alternative avenues to meet their future spouses, without compromising their commitment to Islam. They want to meet members of the opposite sex in a halal environment, and no, I don't mean a date in the local branch of Dixie Fried Chicken.

So they go to Muslim matrimonial websites, "halal speed-dating" and face-to-face matrimonial events to find a husband or wife. Traditionally many second- and third-generation wife- or husband-hunters would expect family and their communities to introduce them to prospective life partners, many even travelling to their parents' country of origin to view future brides and grooms.

Mizam Raja is the Simon Cowell of the British Muslim matrimonial scene. Raja founded the social enterprise Islamic Circles 10 years ago in east London. Raja employs two part-time staff and receives on average 200 calls a day from men and women seeking his advice on how they can meet a compatible partner. Raja is charismatic, chatty and has an acid tongue that he uses to devastating effect in his day-to-day work. "I'm ruthless with some of them. I have no problem telling a man who has hygiene issues to go home, have a shower and shave and to really think about why he wants to get married and what he can offer his wife in a marriage. A successful Muslim marriage is about yin and yang complementing one another. Marriage in Islam is not about yin and yin."

Raja says British Muslims have failed to embrace the best aspects of modernity when it comes to marriage and as a result increasing numbers of highly educated Muslim women find themselves part of the "spinster generation" excelling in their academic and professional lives but left out in the cold when they try to find a husband.

Sociologist Fauzia Ahmad from the Institute for the Study of Muslim Civilisations (ISMC) specialises in Muslim women and relationships in Britain. She says Muslim parents and families are realising how difficult it is for their daughters to find suitable husbands and increasingly communities are realising their daughters are facing a backlash from within.

"Contrary to stereotypes, there has been a real drive for qualifications among Muslim women and their families, with one of the motivating factors being the assumption that a degree would help attract a 'good husband'," says Ahmad. "While this may be a criteria for many Muslim men, women are finding a mismatch in expectations from similarly educated men, many of whom seem to be intimidated by confident women and know that at the end of the day, their parents can always find them a wife 'back home'. British Muslim women are less likely to want to do the same. Instead, the initial 'checklist' or list of criteria that women used to have become increasingly shorter as the years go by."

Raja also agrees that Muslim women are facing challenges on the marriage front. "While I believe that many Muslim men are failing to step up to the plate and take responsibility when it comes to marriage, I've also met many women who talk down to men as if they are talking to a colleague or a client at work," he says.

In the past 10 years Raja has organised hundreds of workshop and gatherings for marriage introductions. The events cater for different Islamic sects, Sunnis and Shias, Muslims with disabilities and special needs – the organisation even runs courses for women on how they can become "surrendered wives". When I ask him if he's for real he is unapologetic in his response. "If you don't have a stable family, you can't have a stable community," he says. "The events we organise enable people to really work on themselves and think about what marriage is really about. Many of our sisters neglect the idea of marriage because they are too focused on their education or careers. Many find it difficult to compromise and hard to adapt to the role of being a wife alongside being a career woman."

Raja insists that these matrimonial events offer a more Islam-centric approach to marriage that can't be found through speed-dating or on matrimonial websites. "Our events are not a place to go shopping for a husband or wife but to fully understand what marriage means in Islam," says Raja.

On SingleMuslim.com, one of the most popular matrimonial websites used by Muslims surfing to find a partner, users are encouraged to believe they are a few clicks away from reaching their goal of meeting Mr or Mrs Right.

Salma, a divorced single mother in her late 20s used a matrimonial website for a year but has decide to deactivate her account and look at other ways of finding a suitable husband. In one year almost 400 men contacted her online from all over the world to discuss marriage.

"I realised very quickly that men and women were on the website with a shopping list trying to tick as many boxes as they could in as little time as possible and get married," she says. "A lot of men lie about how much money they have and most of the ones I came across claimed to earn in excess of £60,000 a year, but are unable to write a sentence in English. It just didn't make any sense."

Salma discovered some men were already married and looking to find wife number three and four without being upfront about it. "There is no real way of knowing who is genuine and who isn't. I even had some men contact me telling me to be aware of certain men on the website who were known liars. By trying to find a husband this way I felt like I was drawing a straw or trying to pick out a lucky number out of a hat – it felt like an illusion. In a traditional arranged marriage a woman or a man have the safety net of growing up in the same village, knowing each other's family for generations. For this reason I've decided to adopt a more organic approach to finding a partner and prefer to meet Muslim men chaperoned in an Islamic environment so we get to interact face to face."

[Periwinkle18]

This is the first time i've heard of such a thing

[Iceee]

This is the first time i've heard of such a thing

Very common practise here in North America.

[Insaanah]

:sl:

Do You Consider Speed-Dating Haram?

Any kind of dating is disallowed in Islam. So-called "Islamic speed dating" is just like a conventional speed dating event, except that there's a "scholar" somewhere in the room. So there are lots of little desks with a man at each desk, and girls move from man to man (or vice versa), you have about five mins to speak to each one, ask questions etc, then move onto the next one etc, and then based on your five minute conversation, you make a decision as to who you'd like to follow up with later, and exchange details It is conventionally called speed dating because for the five minutes you spend with the man, you are considered to be on a date with them.

This is wrong from many perspectives. There is very little if any involvement at all from the girls walis, it is a totally mixed environment, and rather than your wali doing the talking and showing you someone they may have done the background research on already, you have to talk to all these men and find out the background info yourself, in private one to one conversations which no third party is actively listening to, which is contrary to the method Islam has laid down.

In fact the site you've given a link to, explains that girls will be allowed to bring mahrams, but:

The mahram/chaperone will not be allowed to participate in the event, they are merely there for support and will be seated near the back of the room rather than at the participants' table.

http://www.muslim-marriage-events.co...works.html#200

which really makes a mockery of the purpose having a mahram to begin with and shows a limited understanding of the role of a wali.

[Iceee]

:sl:



Any kind of dating is disallowed in Islam. So-called "Islamic speed dating" is just like a conventional speed dating event, except that there's a "scholar" somewhere in the room. So there are lots of little desks with a man at each desk, and girls move from man to man (or vice versa), you have about five mins to speak to each one, ask questions etc, then move onto the next one etc, and then based on your five minute conversation, you make a decision as to who you'd like to follow up with later, and exchange details It is conventionally called speed dating because for the five minutes you spend with the man, you are considered to be on a date with them.

This is wrong from many perspectives. There is very little if any involvement at all from the girls walis, it is a totally mixed environment, and rather than your wali doing the talking and showing you someone they may have done the background research on already, you have to talk to all these men and find out the background info yourself, in private one to one conversations which no third party is actively listening to, which is contrary to the method Islam has laid down.

In fact the site you've given a link to, explains that girls will be allowed to bring mahrams, but:



http://www.muslim-marriage-events.co...works.html#200

which really makes a mockery of the purpose having a mahram to begin with and shows a limited understanding of the role of a wali.

Salaam.

Good point. But here's the thing...
With everyone being present to the event, and most likely the females Wali waiting just outside or even watching, how is that different than usual Islamic pre-marital meetings?

[Insaanah]

:sl:

With everyone being present to the event, and most likely the females Wali waiting just outside or even watching, how is that different than usual Islamic pre-marital meetings?

Because it is not befitting for Muslim girls to have to meet lots of men and talk to them themselves and find out info and see who may be suitable. This is the walis job. The walis job is not to just sit and watch. The fact that there are lots of other people in the room makes no difference. The wali is responsible for meeting the men initially, finding out info and seeing who might be suitable for his ward. He is there precisely so that she does not have to go through this meeting a hundred men, or even one man, unnecessarily.

[crimsontide06]

:sl: Asking random people for their opinion on what is to be considered halal or haram is not a good idea. Whenever you have a question like this, ask someone knowledgeable in your locality, perhaps an imam/mufti. They can tell you what is right according to Islamic law.

Opinions of people who are not learned is not something that should be sought on these kind of matters.

THANK YOU, every time I see a post on here seeking opinions/advice I'm like REALLY??? It's as bad as people going to yahoo answers for advice....

[Iceee]

THANK YOU, every time I see a post on here seeking opinions/advice I'm like REALLY??? It's as bad as people going to yahoo answers for advice....

I don't want advise, just opinions. Nothing wrong with that right?

[Iceee]

:sl:



Because it is not befitting for Muslim girls to have to meet lots of men and talk to them themselves and find out info and see who may be suitable. This is the walis job. The walis job is not to just sit and watch. The fact that there are lots of other people in the room makes no difference. The wali is responsible for meeting the men initially, finding out info and seeing who might be suitable for his ward. He is there precisely so that she does not have to go through this meeting a hundred men, or even one man, unnecessarily.

Salaam.

1. There are some females who would rather prefer this way of meeting the right man. For example, let's say that the girl likes a man but she is attracted to another one more, makes it much easier having them in the same room rather than talking to them one-on-one with Wali's permission; might take a long time especially if she wants to get married sooner.

2. This is the opposite; the female will talk to the man first. Then if she feels comfortable with him and him with her, the Wali is brought in to learn more about the man.

[Alpha Dude]

I don't want advise, just opinions. Nothing wrong with that right?

There is, man. Of what value is the opinion of someone who does not know what he is talking about?

Would you go to a person who knows nothing about cars and ask 'Do you think the legal limit for the wear of my car's break pad is wrong?'. What this person says will be of no benefit to you. A mechanic's advice or opinion would be more appropriate.

Deen is more important than a car, as your afterlife depends on it. It's not the job of random people to deduce what is halal or haram. It's the job of scholars, imams and other people who have studied the religion.

I get that you want to just merely ask opinions but it's really not a good idea in this case. Perhaps it would have been better if you just posted what this so called Islamic speed dating thing was about and left it to the members to discuss (as an open topic) without asking their opinion on the correctness of it. That way you'd get general opinions. But, I'm just saying for your own benefit and I'm sure you are wise enough to know already that knowledge about important stuff should be taken from people who know the field.

[ardianto]

Salaam.

1. There are some females who would rather prefer this way of meeting the right man. For example, let's say that the girl likes a man but she is attracted to another one more, makes it much easier having them in the same room rather than talking to them one-on-one with Wali's permission; might take a long time especially if she wants to get married sooner.

2. This is the opposite; the female will talk to the man first. Then if she feels comfortable with him and him with her, the Wali is brought in to learn more about the man.

Sister Insaanah has explained about speed-dating from Islamic prespective. Now I will talk about it from another prespective. 'Halal' speed-dating is a really bad idea to find a marriage partner. We cannot make decision to marry someone who we never know before just after 5 minutes meeting. It's very speculative.

I've been married for more than 18 years. My wife was not 'stranger'. I knew her and her family, my family knew her too, before I made promise to marry her.

And If I were unmarried?. No thanks, I would not attend in speed dating. I don't want the women treat me like a stuff in marketplace.

[M.I.A.]

...it would probably take me a long time to even utter a sentence.

its definately a disadvantage for some people.


islam vs athiesm thread reaches 200 posts..

maybe speed hating would be better. jk.

[~Zaria~]

Assalamu-alaikum,

Insha Allah, I can provide a personal perspective.

A close friend of mine initiated a similar type of project in our area. May Allah (subhanawataála) reward her good intentions and efforts. Ameen.

As we know, depending on ones location and situation, it can be quite difficult to meet people, in an islamic manner with the intention for marriage.
And this is really the basis for trying to set up such events.

Alhamdulillah, my friend has tried her utmost to ensure that these events are held, maintaining our islamic values to the best of her ability. In fact, this particular project has even gained the approval of our local ulama.

I have been a volunteer at the last event, some months ago. What essentially happens is:

- Men and women write in to admin, describing themselves and what they are seeking from a potential spouse.
- On the day of the event, each persons 'profile' is given a number and posted in the ladies and mens section respectively. In this way, before even meeting, everyone has a chance to read about the other 'participants' and make short notes.
- All sisters are encouraged to bring their wallis to the event - who will be present in the same room.
- The brothers and sisters are divided into 2 groups - e.g. 5 brothers and sisters in each.
- A co-ordinator provides marriage-related questions within the group to try and facilitate discussion - in this way, everyone gets to listen to each others view-points, etc.
- This may last for about ~15 min......and then the groups switch around, and the process is repeated.
- If a brother should be interested in a particular sister/s (and vice versa), he writes down their name......and after the group session, they are given an opportunity to meet and speak together for ~ a further 5 min. Again, the walli is permitted to sit in the same room.
- After the event, the brothers/ sisters can contact admin should they wish to get to know someone further.
- This can be arranged via the girls walli, if they so desire (recommended to all) - and what happens thereafter is left to the participants.

Alhamdulillh, there has been a few marriages that have arisen from these events.

Personally, I feel that if one has the correct intentions and is aware of presence of Allah at all times, he/ she will maintain their conduct in a manner befitting a muslim.

I do have a few reservations with these events though:

1. Even though it is advised for the sisters to bring their wallis, very few if any, do.

2. Although brothers and sisters are advised to observe correct hijab - unfortunately, this is not always the case.
Very often, the sisters are dressed to impress, and observe no form of hijab whatsoever. While it is necessary to see each other, both brothers and sisters forget the importance of lowering their gaze (i.e. not staring at each other).

(The reason why the admin have chosen not to enforce the hijab at their events, is because this would provide an incorrect impression to the brothers. If the sister does not normally wear hijab, then it is only right for the respective brothers to realise this, rather than gain an incorrect assumption on the first meeting)

3. It is important to try to keep the groups as similiar as possible - esp. in terms of age, interests, etc.
What happens very often, is that the brothers often seek out the youngest, most attractive, often hijab-less sisters (no surprises there :P). In this regard, the scenario is not very natural (as under 'normal' circumstances, people are introduced to each other individually).


This is just an individual perspective.

It is everyones duty to seek advice from reliable sources with regards to similiar events that may be held in their area, as each will be held in differently and may not make the effort to provide an islamic enviroment (to the best of their abilities.)


:wa:

[Insaanah]

:sl:

1. There are some females who would rather prefer this way of meeting the right man.

When it comes to Islam, our preferences have no say if they are not in accordance with what the Prophet :saws: taught. There may genuinely be girls and their families that don't know what the Islamic rules and etiquette of finding spouses for girls are. Which is why education on marriage is so important.

For example, let's say that the girl likes a man but she is attracted to another one more, makes it much easier having them in the same room rather than talking to them one-on-one with Wali's permission; might take a long time especially if she wants to get married sooner.

How much longer would it take? Which girl is so desperate to get married that she has to meet all the potential spouses in one night and marry as fast as she can, because she cannot wait for the wali to find out if the person is suitable?

2. This is the opposite; the female will talk to the man first. Then if she feels comfortable with him and him with her, the Wali is brought in to learn more about the man.

This is the opposite of what Islam teaches, that the wali meets the men, and if he feels that a man is right, then the girl can see him.

A wali's role is not that of a back seat spectator, or just to be present, or just to give permission, but to look at potential spouses, meet them, find out about them, and if he thinks they may be suitable for his ward, then to let his ward see him, as well as acting on the girl's behalf should the marriage take place.

I also thank brother Alpha Dude for his point. Asking lay people for opinions is very dangerous. In effect, you're asking strangers on the internet who you don't know, you've no idea of their aqeedah or soundness of belief, and asking for their personal opinions on what is allowed/disallowed in Islam. This is very dangerous. To learn about such matters, you should go to learned people in your locality.

And Allah knows best.

['Abd-al Latif]

Yes, no? Why?

Yes it is haram and there is nothing more that needs to be said about it. Speed dating is when a number of men and women come into a room and each member from one gender gets to talk to each member of the other for a few minutes. This way they get to know everyone in the room and decide if one wants to go on a date with another.

This is haram as there is no 'dating' in Islam.

EDIT:

There is no space for opinions when it comes to matters of halal and haram. I am therefore closing this thread because nothing more needs to be discussed regarding this topic. If one is querying whether dating itself is permissible then the answer is still no.

وَمَا كَانَ لِمُؤۡمِنٍ۬ وَلَا مُؤۡمِنَةٍ إِذَا قَضَى ٱللَّهُ وَرَسُولُهُ ۥۤ أَمۡرًا أَن يَكُونَ لَهُمُ ٱلۡخِيَرَةُ مِنۡ أَمۡرِهِمۡۗ وَمَن يَعۡصِ ٱللَّهَ وَرَسُولَهُ ۥ فَقَدۡ ضَلَّ ضَلَـٰلاً۬ مُّبِينً۬ا

"It is not befitting for a believing man or woman, when a matter has been decided by Allaah and His Messenger, to have any option about their decision." [Qur'an 33:36]

I strongly advise you not to seek "an opinion" in every matter because this is a misguided way of seeking knowledge about Islam. You must turn to the book of Allah and the sunnah of His Messenger to find the correct Islamic stance in every issue.

:threadclo