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View Full Version : Beard and the Pants above the ankles What the Salaf said

09-07-2013, 05:52 PM
In the name of Allah the most merciful.
This one of the things to prove my point, a person who call himselfe a Salafi does not mean that they follow the Salaf they could follow the recent "Salafi" scholars more.

Salam Alikom,

In deen ALL scholored agreed on when the prophet prayres and peace be upon him make an order without an exception in different occasion then it is a Fard (Mandatory) the beard is like that. Now to cut from it is allowed because Ibn Omar did it and non of the companions said anything to him though personally I dont prefer trimming it. Akhi if you dont have a beard it is OK admit it and ask Allah to give you the strength to have one. I did not have one at point but I would ve admite that I was wrong till Allah blessed me, and if somebody trims his beard and make it not too long dont act like he is a Fasiq...

Pants above the ankles.

It really shocks me when people will act as the pants above the ankle is mandatory and this is the strong opinion. Brothers and sisters this is THE WEAK opinion and may Allah forgive the "shaikhs" who dont tell you all the opinions. Brothers and Sisters this is really something serious and everytime I talk to somebody they dont know about it, JUST most of the recint scholars such Ibn Othaimen and Ibn baz said that this is the strong opinion the Jomhor of the SALAF which mean the majority of the credited salaf scholars said if it is not for arrogance it is NOT haram and then they argued about whether it is Makrooh or Not. Wallahi we are in time that is so sad where recent scholars who are like a drop of the ocean of our salaf give different opinions about stuff that is already settled and we leave the SALAf scholars opinions to follow the recent ones though they call themselves SALAF. If you want to follow IBn Othaimean I have no problem with that but pls note that this is the minority opinion. Here a post that I am going to copy that I have wrote recently just to save time.

Isbal, pants above the ankle. If it is not out of arrogance it is NOT haram and the scholars are the Jomhour who say that such from Shafie Nawai and Ibn Hajar, Ibn Abd Albar From Hanbali Shaikh al islam and also reported a narration from Ahmad that it is Makrooh to have it lower the ankles. Also Alshawkani said the same thing. From the maliki in the book of Albajy Fe Almoltaka in the explination of Almowata that it is harm for arrogance.People who said that is Haram both ways are the current scholars beside few recent Maliki like IBn alarabi and others.

The Hadeeth is clear in Bukhari when our prophet prayres and peace be upon him told Abu bakir you dont do it out of arrogance so it is OK and there is no exception from the religion to a Human even if it is Abu bakir as our prophet prayers and peace be upon him said if Fatima the daughter of Muhammad steeled I wouldve cut her hand.

Conclusion it is a sunnah and no problem with it but it is not haram, and believe it or not that I have doubts that some people who will do the Isbal out of arrogance and Allah knows their intentions!!!

What is more important these days are the 100,000$ Mercedes or 11 bedrooms house this is much closer to the Haram than 5 cm of clothe. Pls lets understand and apply the beautiful soul of our religion and the great goals that it was sent to.

To check some of the resources and there are many more,
Ibn Miflih 351 reported this opinion of Abu Hanifa
Ibn Abd Albar fe Altamheed 3/244
Shafie in Majmoo 177/3
Hanbali Aliknaa 139

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09-07-2013, 05:53 PM
Also I have noticed that some people dont know who are these scholars or what is their real status so here is a post that I have responded to a brother from another forum.

My own opinion based on Hawa ????? brother what I have been talking about all day long, what about Malik, Shafie, Nawawi, IBn Hajar, IBn Abd Albar, Ahmad, Shaikh Alislam, Abu Hanifa, Alshawkani, Bukhari, brother do you know who these people are?????

Brother Alrisala for shafie was read by one of his students 600 times and every time the student would learn something new.

Who is Ahmad? Ahmad one person asked him can some one make a Fatwa and memorize 100,000 Hadeethes he said No they asked him 2 he said no they asked 3 he said no then he asked him 4 he said I hope. Some narrations says he had 1000,000 Hadeethes memorized.

Who is Shafei? Shafi used to cover one page from the book because when he reads the page one time he memorize it

Who Nawai. Nawai died at 40 something years old did not get married when they asked him why he said I forogot I was busy with knowledge

Who is Ibn Hajar? Ibn Hajar is the one who explained Albukhari

Who is Ibn Taymyah? Scholars at his time said no body was like him nor he saw anybody like him. The one who was welling to drop himselfe with a sufi in Fire to prove him wrong and he was sure that Allah will save him like Ibrahim, The one who did not just talk he applied and ride his horse and fought the Tatar, did not just stay in the Masjid giving fatawi

Who is Malik, Malik is the one who some malik pray with hands beside their sides because they saw him doing this but they did not know that he could not left his hands out of torture.

Brother I am speaking about GIANTS when these GIANTS agree on something PlS NO BODY OPEN HIS MOUTH.

09-07-2013, 05:55 PM
And here is a respond to a brother who posted two Hadeethes and told me this is clear ..

No it is not clear it is a lot more complicated thats why there are few scholars in the world... The only time it is clear when the person finishes studying Ossol Fiqh such qyas, Motlak and Mokayad, Aam and 5as, then Fiqh then Arabic language besides no All the Nasikh and Mansookh and become a Mojtahid in Mathhab then Mojtahid Motlak moreover add to that studying Arabic Grammer add Balagha then it is going to be clear. When I tell you Ahmad ibn Hanbal you should shake and would think 100 million times before saying an opinion against him especially when you are not supported from a scholar better than him. In some narrations Ahmad ibn Hanbal had 1 million hadeethes memorized yes 1 million so he wont know such famous two hadeethes???? OK if you want me to make a "taaseel" no problem you was lucky that I know the taseel of this.

In ossol fiqh there is something called Motlak and Mokyad. This means that an Aya or a Hadeeth would say something general but then another Aya or Hadeeth would give an exception for this rule and this plenty of examples in our deen. Imajin I come to tell you brother it is very clear that liquer is Halal, you would be like what!!!! I would tell you Allah sobhanah wa talah said in the Quran in Surat Al araf in verse 31 "O Children of Adam! Look to your adornment at every place of worship, and eat and drink, but be not prodigal. Lo! He loveth not the prodigals. (31)" so I will tell you as long as I dont waste or drink a lot it is OK which includes liqure, you would tell me no brother you made a mistake, I would tell you why, you would say this is Motlaq and Allah did the Mokyad in the famous verse that Made Liquer Haram. The same thing here In genral our prophet prayers and peace be upon him ordered not to let the pants go lower the ancle but in another Hadeeth there is the Mokaiad which the hadeeth of Abu baker In Bukhari that Abu Baker asked the prophet about his Thob goes under his ankle our prophet prayers and peace be upon him said o Abu Baker you are not from the ones who do them out of arrogance. BROTHERS AND SISTERS the hadeeth is very clear and the scholars all of them support this hadeeth so lets stop here about something abvois like this, and sorry to say that but if you are still not convinced you are not from the Salaf and you dont belong to them because non of the Salaf would stick with their shaikhs opinon and leave a hadeeth and ALL the four Imams beside Shaikh Alislam and Alshawkani. Here is the Arabic version of the hadeeth sorry I dont read hadeethes in English and one more thing for why there is Motlak and Mokyad it is an Arabic thing that I can talk about it later inshalah I am just a bit nervouse because I have been talking about this simple thing for too long..

1-عن ابن عمر رَضِيَ اللَّهُ عَنهُ أن النبي صَلَّى اللَّهُعَلَيهِ وَسَلَّم قال: "من جر ثوبه خيلاء لم ينظر اللَّه إليه يوم القيامة" ، فقالأبو بكر: يا رَسُول اللَّهِ إن إزاري يسترخي إلا أن أتعاهده. فقال رَسُول اللَّهِصَلَّى اللَّهُ عَلَيهِ وَسَلَّم: "إنك لست ممن يفعله خيلاء" رَوَاهُ البُخَارِيُّتحت باب (من جر إزاره من غير خيلاء) فكأنه يرى الجواز، وروى مسلم بعضه.


09-07-2013, 06:43 PM
So , not wanting to cause trouble here , but do you think that in the hereafter there will be people in hell for not having a beard? I mean the Qur'an gives two conditions to go to heaven : believe & do good deeds.

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09-07-2013, 08:15 PM
Another clarification
Yes probably I should make my tone down, I was angry not acting arrogant.

"You're not helping your case by writing in that sort of manner"
It is not my case, I cant force you or other brothers or sisters to follow this, it is up to you, I did what I have to do infront of Allah.

and when I said he was lucky I meant that if I would not know the Taseel ,which there are many that I dont, of it then I would not be able to respond and many people would think that the Jomhour did not follow such a straight forward hadeeths like those.

09-07-2013, 08:17 PM
You are not going to cause any trouble. It is like Do I think there will be people will go to hell for looking at woman, or lying, or making any sin. I did not say he will go to hell but it is a sin and there are sins counting on him till he gets the beard. In the day of judgment everything is gone except Hassanat and Sayiat.

Urban Turban
09-09-2013, 12:47 PM



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