View Full Version : Shiah are not muslim

11-05-2015, 09:16 AM
Rulings on the Rawafid Shiah by the Earlier Muslims

Ash Shabi- 'They are Jews in disguise' (as-Sunnah 1/497)

Abu Hanifah- 'Whoever doubts the caliphate of Abu Bakr and Umar is a kafir' (al-Sawaiq al-Muhriqah, Page:362-363)

Malik- 'The one who reviles the Companions of the Prophet (Sallallahu Alayhi Wa Salaam) does not have any share in Islam. (as-Sunnah 2/557)

Shafi- 'A Rafidhi will have no intercession, this is only for a Muslim' (al-Kafaaya 1/126)

Hanbal- 'The Rafidhi has nothing to do with Islam' (Usul as-Sunnah, Page: 82)

Bukhari- 'I dont see any difference between praying behind a Rafidhi and a Jew' (Khalq af'aalul-Ibaad, Page: 14)

Ibn Tamiyyah- 'They are the most evil people the people of desires and deserve to be killed more than al-Khawarij' (Majmoo' al-Fataawa 28/482)

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11-05-2015, 11:11 AM
Allah knows best, the best thing to say is that Muslims are Muslims,
there are many differences that can easily be reconciled, but but require all to submit to the authority of Allah which is the most Truthful, Knowledgeable and Wise authority, to acknowledge that none other than Allah is perfect, and that the Prophets and companions were human.
when we look carefully, we see that many differences and schisms have come about by a fitnah and a separation into camps to the extent of rejecting a plain fact simply because those perceived to be "on the other side" upheld it or despite a valid difference of opinion being present.
for instance, Ali (ra) was wise enough to stand down and allow impartial judgement according to the Book of Allah and the kharijis then decided to kill Ali and Mu'awiyah, also bear in mind that it us recorded that Mu'awiyah had told the Ghassani that he and Ali would come and fight the Ghassani after their differences had been settled).
The fact that some recently converted Umayyads were capitalizing on the governerships despite wiser and more seasoned sahabah being more fit for the task was one rut in the smooth progress,
The murder of Uthman (ra) was a crime,
the fact that some companions including Aishah (ra) and later Mu'awiyah demanded that Ali (ra) brimg the perpetrators to justice without giving him bayah didn't help, especially with the breakdown of administration and the fact that Ali was known as a just judge.
the converting of khilafah to hereditary kingship by Mu'awiyah to Yazid indicated a total break from the wise method of selecting the best fitted for the task.
the murders of the Messenger of Allah's beloved grandsons Hassan and Hussain were despicable crimes.
the situation became so foggy that the best of the companions became so confused by the turmoil that they struck their swords on the rocks in order to blunt them and departed to individual prayer and looking after their own families.
those who remained split up till their differences became their defining factor and those differences only magnified with the passing of time.

so you can see that we are all human and are required to obey Allah to the best of our ability, mistakes will happen and we need to resort to unification through the book of Allah and the seeking of His pleasure as soon as there is a difference of opinion.
These problems didn't happen for no reason and woudn't have happened if all of the sahabah (ra) were perfect and were all in perfect tune with the judgement of Allah at every step, we need to learn lessons from them.
You'll also notice that there were amongst the best sahabah in both camps during the initial turmoil.

also, if you judge by the judgement of Allah and hold each individual to account according to their deeds, you will no doubt find that the concentration of crimes taking place in America and by the government of America far outweigh the crimes of ISIS, Al Qaeda, the Shiah, and Assad combined.
let us not strain at a gnat while swallowing a camel whole.

Narrated*Ibn 'Abbas:
When Allah's Apostle was on his death-bed and in the house there were some people among whom was 'Umar bin Al-Khattab, the Prophet said, "Come, let me write for you a statement after which you will not go astray."
'Umar said, "The Prophet is seriously ill and you have the*Qur'an; so the Book of Allah is enough for us."
The people present in the house differed and quarrelled. Some said "Go near so that the Prophet may write for you a statement after which you will not go astray," while the others said as Umar said.
When they caused a hue and cry before the Prophet, Allah's Apostle said, "Go away!"
Narrated*'Ubaidullah: Ibn 'Abbas used to say, "It was very unfortunate that Allah's Apostle was prevented from writing that statement for them because of their disagreement and noise."

— Muhammad al-Bukhari,*
Sahih al-Bukhari

Sa'id b. Jubair*reported from Ibn Abbas that he said:
Thursday, and what about Thursday? Then tears began to flow until I saw them on his cheeks as it they were the strings of pearls. He (the narrator) said that Allah's Messenger (may*peace be upon him) said: Bring me a shoulder blade and ink-pot (or tablet and inkpot), so that I write for you a document (by following which) you would never go astray.
They said: Allah's Messenger (may peace upon him) is in the state of unconsciousness
[yahjur, literal translation: "talking nonsense"; obviously, the Prophet was not unconscious since he was speaking].

— Muslim ibn al-Hajjaj,*
Sahih Muslim
however a question that arises is, but he pbuh didn't write, was the hadith true and he pbuh meant to have it written by a scribe, or was it fabricated? Allah knows best.

11-05-2015, 12:02 PM
I think that this post must be delated!

11-06-2015, 04:21 AM
(Surah Al Hujurat 49:11) O you who have believed, let not a people ridicule [another] people; perhaps they may be better than them; nor let women ridicule [other] women; perhaps they may be better than them. And do not insult one another and do not call each other by [offensive] nicknames. Wretched is the name of disobedience after [one's] faith. And whoever does not repent - then it is those who are the wrongdoers.

Shiahs have been attending Hajj and Umrah for past 1400 years. In some cases even with more zeal than the Sunnis. Only Muslims comes to Hajj and Umrah and believe in Allah (swt) and his Rasool (saw). Its a little too late to call them Non Muslims.

The Muslims who have begun to call them Non Muslims or Kafir are actually creating Fasad in the Ummah.

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11-06-2015, 06:44 AM
Right, lets just analyse what you said, you have now just undeniably said on an open forum that all our scholars created Fasad, men that studied this deen…hmmm
The Furqaan is the Criterion to judge between good and bad!!!!!
So lets use this platform
Aqeedah and Tauheed is the fundamental structure of a muslim, but, aha, yes there is a but, if your TAUHEED (Islamic Monotheism) is wrong then you don’t embrace Islam, hence you can’t be called a muslim!!
Shia Kalimah: The Shia Kalimah is different from the Muslim Kalimah Shahadah. The Shia Kalimah is: La Ila Haa Illallahu Muhammdur Rasoolullahi Aliyun Waliyullahi Wasiyyu Rasulillahi Wa Khalifatuhu Bila Faslin
Muslim Kalimah: Ash-hadu an-laa ilaaha illallaahu wahdahoo laa shareeka lahoo, wa ash-hadu anna Muhammadan abduhoo wa rasooluh
Shia Athaan: In the Shia Adhan the words ‘Ashadu Anna Aliyan Waliyullah’ and ‘Hujjatulllah’ are added and also the words ‘Hayya ‘Ala Khayril ‘Amal’ are added
Muslim Athaan: Allahu Akbar Ash-hadu an-la ilaha illa llah Ash-hadu anna Muħammadan-Rasulullah Hayya ‘alas-salāh Hayya ‘alal-falāh Allāhu akbar Lā ilāha illallāh

Shia Duah: One should recite after every Salah: O Allah! Send down your curses upon Abu Bakr, Umar, Uthman, Muawiyah, Aishah, Hafsah, Hind, and Ummul Hakam
Muslim Duah: O Allah! Bestow Thy peace and blessings on our chief and master Muhammad, his family and companions.
Shia pillars: The five pillars of Shiasm are: Wilayat/Imamat, Salat, Fasting, Zakat, and Hajj
Muslim pillars: The 5 pillars of muslims are: Shahadah, Salaah, Zakaah, Saum and Hajj
And those who disbelieve say, "This [Qur'an] is not except a falsehood he invented, and another people assisted him in it." But they have committed an injustice and a lie. #Quran 25:4
Shia about Quran: Quran is incomplete and it has been tampered with interpolated and altered
The Shia Quran is with the final Imam who has been hiding from the age of five in a cave in Iraq since the last 1200 years
Current Quran completely different from Shia Quran
The current Quran right now has more than 6000 verses but the Shia Quran has more than 17000
What the shia says about Allah:
The doctrine and quality of Badaa is ascribed to Allah which means that Allah makes mistakes and Allah forgets
In a state of anger, God can not differentiate between friends and enemies
Allah was scared of the companions of Prophet Muhammed Sallallahu Alaihe Wasallam
Allah must judge and decide according to what the human intellect deems beneficial for humans
Allah did not create everything
So lets now look at how they view other Prophets and the companions hmm
Prophet Adam (A.S.) is worse than Satan
Accuse Adam (A.S.) of rebellion, jealousy, and malice
Prophets make mistakes which eventually deprives them of Prophethood like Prophet Yusuf (A.S.)
Ismaili Shias believe in the continuation of Prophethood
Prophet Muhammed Sallallahu Alaihe Wasallam was scared of the creation of Allah and did not propagate correctly
Prophet Muhammed Sallallahu Alaihe Wasallam asked for compensation for teaching
The wives of the Prophet are not considered to be from the family of the Prophet
All the Sahabahs except a few turned apostates and turned away from Islam after the demise of Prophet Muhammed Sallallahu Alaihe Wasaalm
One should dissociate with the 4 idols: Abu Bakr, Umar, Uthmaan, Muawiyya and 4 women Ayesha, Hafsa, Hind, and Ummul Hakam.
One should curse the above after each prayer
Aishah (R.A.) and Hafsah (R.A.) poisoned Prophet Muhammed Sallallahu Alaihe Wasallam
Aishah (R.A.) committed adultery
Less than ten Sahabah remained on Islam after the Prophet’s death

IMAMAT: The concept of Imams is an integral belief of Shiaism. This concept is completely different from the four Imams of Fiqh. The four Imams of Fiqh of Islam are cursed by Shia authors and the four illustrious Imams of Fiqh are specifically called ‘dogs’.

Shias believe in the concept of 12 Imams
The Imams are appointed (mansoos alaih) by Allah just as the Prophets
The 12 Imams are on the same level and are on par with Prophet Muhammed Sallallahu Alaihe Wasallam
The first Imam is Ali (R.A.) and the last Imam is hiding since the age of five in a cave in Iraq
Shia Imams are born from the thighs of their mothers because the private parts are unclean
Shia Imams are Hazir Nazir i.e. they are present every where and they are omnipresent
The Imams are ma'soom (i.e. infallible, sinless) like the Prophets
The Prophets received prophethood because they had accepted the imaamat of the Imams
Allah Ta'ala had compelled the entire creation including the Prophets to accept, whether willingly or unwillingly, the wilaayat of the Imams
The Ambiyaa gain 'noor' and light from the 'noor' of the Imams
On the day of Qiyaamah, Ali Radiallahu Anhu will be ahead (in front) of all the Ambiyaa
The reason for Aadam Alaihi Salaam not being included among the Ulool Azam Ambiyaa is that he was jealous of the status of the Imams
Ibrahim Alaihi Salaam was first given nubuwwat, thereafter khullat (i.e. he was made the khaleel and bosom friend of Allah) and only then was he given imaamat
Ayub Alaihi Salaam was afflicted with a severe illness because he doubted the imaamat of Ali Radiallahu Anhu
If Moosa Alaihi Salaam was alive it would be compulsory for him to obey the imams
Yunus Alaihi Salaam was swallowed by the fish because he rejected the wilaayat of Ali Radiallahu Anhu
The entire earth belongs to the imam
Shias attribute the following statement to Ali Radiallahu Anhu: "I grant life and death. I am all living and I never die."
Shias maintain that Rasullullah Sallallahu Alaihi Wasallam told Ali Radiallahu Anhu:
"O Ali! You are the dayyaan (one who will give reward) of this ummah and you are responsible for their account. You will be the 'Rukn e A'azam' of Allah on the day of Qiyaamah. Listen! Certainly the people are going to return to you and you will be responsible for taking their reckoning. The bridge (siraat) will be yours, the scale will be yours and the place of standing (mauqaf) will be yours!"
According to Shia narrations, the souls of the imams go on mi'raj on the eve of every Jumu'ah. During this mi'raj they reach the throne of Allah where vast knowledge is given to them.
According to Shia belief, a special book is revealed to the imams every Laylatul Qadr. It is brought to them by the angels and Ar Rooh.
As soon as the Imams are born, they read all the divine books
The Imams are capable of performing all the miracles of the Prophets
The final Imam has been in hiding since the last 1200 years in a cave in Iraq. When he will appear, the Prophet and Ali (R.A.) will pledge allegiance to him (Bay’ah).
The final Imam will exhume the bodies of Abu Bakr and Umar and he will hang up their naked bodies and flog them and he will cause them to die 1000 times in a day and night
Aishah will be brought back to life and she will be flogged as well by the final Imam
The final Imam will slaughter all the Sunnis and he will start killing their scholars first
If one does not accept the Shia concept of Imaams then the person is a Kaafir and a non-Muslim
The final imam will appear when there will be 313 sincere Shias


1. Shi’ite Beliefs, Shaykh Khalid Mahmud, Ph.D, Islamic Academy of Manchester, UK, 20 Pages
2. Hidayatus Shia, Shaykh Khalil Ahmed Saharanpuri, 844 Pages
3. Tuhfah Ithna ‘Ashariyyah, Shah Abdul Aziz Muhaddith Dehlwi, 826 Pages
4. Shia kay hazar sawalon ka jawab, Shaykh Hafiz Muhammed Miyanwalwy, 547 Pages
5. Aqaidus Shia, Muhammed Farooq, 413 Pages
6. Aayaat Bayyinaat, Shaykh Sayyid Muhammed Mahdi Ali Khan, 360 Pages
7. Masala tahreefay Quran pur Binori Town ka tahqeeqi fatwa, Mufti Muhammed Inaamul Allah, 213 Pages
8. Irshadus Shia, Shaykh Muhammed Sarfraz Khan, Maktabah Safdariyyah, 213 Pages
9. Khomainyism or Islam, Shaykh Dhiyaur Rahman Farooqi, 160 Pages
10. Shi’ism exposed, Majlisul Ulama of South Africa, 150 Pages
11. Sunni standpoint on Shias, compiled by Ahlus Sunnah Wal Jamaat for the Supreme court of Pakistan, 102 Pages
12. The truth about Shi’ism Part 1, Majlisul Ulama of South Africa, 26 Pages
13. The truth about Shi’ism Part 2, Majlisul Ulama of South Africa, 21 Pages
14. Shia Madhab kay chalees bunyadee aqeeday, Shaykh Abdus Shakoor Lakhnawi, 64 Pages
15. Sunni Shia muttafaqah tarjamh Quran ka azeem fitnah, Shaykh Qadhi Mazhar Husain, 28 Pages
16. Shia ithna ashariyya or aqeedah tahreefay Quran, Shaykh Manzoor Nomani, 28 Pages
17. Shia madhab, Shaykh Aashiq Ilahi Bulandshehri, 40 Pages
18. Taayeed madhab ahlus sunnah tarjamah rad rawafidh, Imam Mujaddid Alf Thani, 92 Pages
19. Assawaiqul Muhriqah, Shaykh Ibn Hajar Alhaytami, 2 Volumes
20. The difference between the Shii and the majority of Muslim scholars, Saeed Ismaeel, Carbondale, IL, US, 34 Pages

As for hajj, the hypocrite also performs hajj
'When the hypocrites come to you, [O Muhammad], they say, "We testify that you are the Messenger of Allah ." And Allah knows that you are His Messenger, and Allah testifies that the hypocrites are liars. #Quran 63:1
They have taken their oaths as a cover, so they averted [people] from the way of Allah . Indeed, it was evil that they were doing. #Quran 63:2
That is because they believed, and then they disbelieved; so their hearts were sealed over, and they do not understand
And when you see them, their forms please you, and if they speak, you listen to their speech. [They are] as if they were pieces of wood propped up - they think that every shout is against them. They are the enemy, so beware of them. May Allah destroy them; how are they deluded?
Muslims be careful of the Muslim hypocrites…
O Prophet! strive hard against the Unbelievers and the Hypocrites, and be firm against them. Their abode is Hell,- an evil refuge indeed. #Quran 9:73
And that He may punish the Hypocrites, men and women, and the Polytheists men and women, who imagine an evil opinion of God. On them is a round of Evil: the Wrath of God is on them: He has cursed them and got Hell ready for them: and evil is it for a destination. #Quran 48:6

11-06-2015, 07:40 AM
From a shia scholar: Sheikh Tawhidi (Twitter)
Tweets: You can't compare Imam Ali (a.s) with Allah Almighty because there is no difference between the two for us to compare.

Tweet: As a rafithi, my religion is not Islam. My religion is Imam Ali (a.s)

Tweet: Christians say Jesus was the son of God, if they saw Imam Ali (a.s) they would have said this is God himself.

Tweet: Allah almighty is perfect, and Ali (a.s) is perfection.

This is Sheikh Tawhidi @brothertawhidi......check it out....

Eric H
11-06-2015, 07:47 AM
Greetings and peace be with you ajr;

Firstly my apologies, I meant to press the reply prompt, but pressed the like prompt in error.

Ibn Tamiyyah- 'They are the most evil people the people of desires and deserve to be killed more than al-Khawarij' (Majmoo' al-Fataawa 28/482)
There might be a hundred million Shiah in the world today, only Allah can make judgements on that many people, we should not even attempt that. I really believe all Holy Scripture is best used; when we try and change ourselves, rather than when we use them to try and make judgements on other individuals. It becomes even more fraught with danger, when we make judgements on a whole group of people that we do not even know as individuals. My understanding of the prophet pbuh, was that he was kind, even to his enemies.

In the spirit of praying for justice and mercy for all people.


11-06-2015, 07:57 AM
In the spirit of understanding...Islam isnt a one sided religion, its multi-faceted...as for peace, yes certainly, but there are Criterion to follow

As it stands now, ISLAM is being attacked, by the Jews,Christians and the likes.

We don't join forums such as these for 'likes'

Truth is truth, whether mankind wants to accept it as such, its up to each person

11-06-2015, 08:28 AM
People often, including some muslim, misunderstand the root word of Islam and claim it as 'al-Salaam', which is peace in Arabic.

An Arabic word only has one root and the root word for Islam is 'al-Silm, which means 'Submission' or 'Surrender'
al-Silm(Submission) does not mean the same as as-salaam (Peace), otherwise they would be the same word.

Submission and peace can be very different concepts, even if a form of peace is often brought about through forcing others into submission. As the modern-day Islamic scholar, Ibrahim Sulaiman, puts it, "Jihad is not inhumane, despite its necessary violence and bloodshed, its ultimate desire is peace which is protected and enhanced by the rule of law."

In truth, the Quran not only calls Muslims to submit to Allah, it also commands them to subdue people of other religions until they are in a full state of submission to Islamic rule.

Quran (2:191-193) - "And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah [disbelief or unrest] is worse than killing...
but if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful. And fight them until there is no more Fitnah [disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allah] and worship is for Allah alone. But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zalimun (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.)"

As you can see...there are rules that we must adhere to....al wala wal baraa- love what Allah loves, hate what Allah hates. And you only truly love Allah when you love what he loves and you hate what he hates. Thats what our earlier scholars practised, its sad though, now we have opinionated muslims among us.

Eric H
11-06-2015, 09:22 AM
Greetings and peace be with you ajr;

People often, including some muslim, misunderstand the root word of Islam and claim it as 'al-Salaam', which is peace in Arabic.
I have no such confusion, I believe Islam to be a religion of peace.

"Jihad is not inhumane, despite its necessary violence and bloodshed,
The greater 'Jihad' is about changing oneself.

In the spirit of praying for justice for all people.


11-06-2015, 10:00 AM
Islam means SUBMISSION....salaam means PEACE

As muslims we Submit to the will of GOD. 'This day those who disbelieve have despaired of [defeating] your religion; so fear them not, but fear Me. This day I have perfected for you your religion and completed My favor upon you and have approved for you Islam as religion. (Quran 5:3)

Who said? So if thats the ruling no1 will ever be mujahideen, yes? Because we all are constantly fighting our nafs? You think that Jihad is changing oneself?

People are going to extraordinary lengths to change the image of Islam by reintroducing it to Western society as a religion of peace and rejects violence. Propaganda like this does not fool those that know

The Prophet (SAW) used to send letters to the kings and leaders in surrounding countries, inviting the to surrender to his authority and t believe in him as the Messenger of God. He always ended his letters off with these two words 'Aslim, Taslam!' Do you know what it means? It means 'Surrender and you will be safe'

Narrated Ikrima:
Ali burnt some people and this news reached Ibn 'Abbas, who said, "Had I been in his place I would not have burnt them, as the Prophet said, 'Don't punish (anybody) with Allah's Punishment.' No doubt, I would have killed them, for the Prophet said, 'If somebody (a Muslim) discards his religion, kill him.' "
Bukhari :: Book 4 :: Volume 52 :: Hadith 260 (Book of Jihad)

Narrated Al-Bara bin Azib:
Allah's Apostle sent a group of Ansari men to kill Abu-Rafi. One of them set out and entered their (i.e. the enemies) fort. That man said, "I hid myself in a stable for their animals. They closed the fort gate. Later they lost a donkey of theirs, so they went out in its search. I, too, went out along with them, pretending to look for it. They found the donkey and entered their fort. And I, too, entered along with them. They closed the gate of the fort at night, and kept its keys in a small window where I could see them. When those people slept, I took the keys and opened the gate of the fort and came upon Abu Rafi and said, 'O Abu Rafi. When he replied me, I proceeded towards the voice and hit him. He shouted and I came out to come back, pretending to be a helper. I said, 'O Abu Rafi, changing the tone of my voice. He asked me, 'What do you want; woe to your mother?' I asked him, 'What has happened to you?' He said, 'I don't know who came to me and hit me.' Then I drove my sword into his belly and pushed it forcibly till it touched the bone. Then I came out, filled with puzzlement and went towards a ladder of theirs in order to get down but I fell down and sprained my foot. I came to my companions and said, 'I will not leave till I hear the wailing of the women.' So, I did not leave till I heard the women bewailing Abu Rafi, the merchant of Hijaz. Then I got up, feeling no ailment, (and we proceeded) till we came upon the Prophet and informed him."
Bukhari :: Book 4 :: Volume 52 :: Hadith 264 (Book of Jihad)

Narrated Al-Bara bin Azib:
Allah's Apostle sent a group of the Ansar to Abu Rafi. Abdullah bin Atik entered his house at night and killed him while he was sleeping. Bukhari :: Book 4 :: Volume 52 :: Hadith 265 (Book of Jihad)

Narrated Jabir bin 'Abdullah:
The Prophet said, "Who is ready to kill Ka'b bin Al-Ashraf who has really hurt Allah and His Apostle?" Muhammad bin Maslama said, "O Allah's Apostle! Do you like me to kill him?" He replied in the affirmative. So, Muhammad bin Maslama went to him (i.e. Ka'b) and said, "This person (i.e. the Prophet) has put us to task and asked us for charity." Ka'b replied, "By Allah, you will get tired of him." Muhammad said to him, "We have followed him, so we dislike to leave him till we see the end of his affair." Muhammad bin Maslama went on talking to him in this way till he got the chance to kill him. Bukhari :: Book 4 :: Volume 52 :: Hadith 270 (Book of Jihad)

11-06-2015, 05:50 PM
May Allah (swt) guide us all and forgive us.

The Messenger of Allah (saw) said before he was going to depart from this world "...do not disbelieve by striking each other's necks after I am gone..."

He warned that we would become disbelievers regardless of how great our prayers and fasting and other rituals will be, if our hearts will be devoid of love and mercy to each other, if we called each other kafir and made it legal to spill blood of other Muslims and even non Muslims....

May Allah (swt) increase love and mercy between ourselves...Ameen

11-07-2015, 09:27 AM
So what you are saying brother is you don’t believe in the ayahs of the Quran?
Fighting was only for the time of the Prophet, be it offensive or defensive?
The Quraish were on clear kufr, do you agree?
I have given numerous evidence to show that shia cannot be called muslim even though they are a people that go on hajj. Furthermore, they call the Prophet out as liar? When he said Abu Bakr (ra) was as-Siddique (the Truthful) ‘Nor does he say (aught) of (his own) Desire.’ #Quran 53:3…What does that say about Allah?
Shiasm was started by a Yemeni Jew by the name of Abdullah bin Saba. His main purpose was to SPLIT the Ummah!!!
You then further go, that the earlier scholars caused Fasad. All this in defense of an offspring of Judaisim?
Do you know where the DAJJAL will appear from? ISFAHAN…in modern day IRAN!!!

Brother if your Aqeedah and Tauheed is wrong then how do you propose someone be called muslim?

Those who believe fight in the cause of Allah , and those who disbelieve fight in the cause of Taghut. So fight against the allies of Satan. Indeed, the plot of Satan has ever been weak. #Quran 4:76

Have you not seen those who were told, "Restrain your hands [from fighting] and establish prayer and give zakah"? But then when fighting was ordained for them, at once a party of them feared men as they fear Allah or with [even] greater fear. They said, "Our Lord, why have You decreed upon us fighting? If only You had postponed [it for] us for a short time." Say, The enjoyment of this world is little, and the Hereafter is better for he who fears Allah . And injustice will not be done to you, [even] as much as a thread [inside a date seed]." #Quran 4:77
This ayah tells that there is a time for peace and then there is a time for fighting, yet mankind fear men, some even more so than Allah.
So we cant proclaim peace at every avenue, just because we want the west to tolerate us, that is not how dawah is done.
We should spread the truth, not a watered down version of the truth.
‘Peace’ should be conveyed in its proper format ie. Submitting to the Will of God, its not on a collective, for example is there peace on a battlefield? But the one fighting for the sake of Allah has a sense of ‘peace’ why? Because he Submits to the will of God, he acts on God’s command.
O you who believe! Whoever from among you turns back from his religion (Islâm), Allâh will bring a people whom He will love and they will love Him; humble towards the believers, stern towards the disbelievers, fighting in the Way of Allâh, and never fear of the blame of the blamers. That is the Grace of Allâh which He bestows on whom He wills. And Allâh is All-Sufficient for His creatures' needs, All-Knower. (54) Verily, your Walî (Protector or Helper) is none other than Allâh, His Messenger, and the believers #Quran 5:54
(Fighting in the way of Allah, and never fearing the blame of the blamers.) Nothing prevents them from obeying Allah, establishing His Law, fighting His enemies, enjoining righteousness and forbidding evil. Certainly, nothing prevents them from taking this path, neither someone who seeks to hinder them, nor one who blames or chastises them
"Do people think that they will be left alone because they say: "We believe," and will not be tested. And We indeed tested those who were before them. And Allah will certainly make (it) known (the truth of) those who are true, and will certainly make (it) known (the falsehood of) those who are liars, (although Allah knows all that before putting them to test)." #Quran 29:2-3

Eric H
11-07-2015, 01:11 PM
Greetings and peace be with you ajr;

Originally Posted by ajr

Truth is truth, whether mankind wants to accept it as such, its up to each person
I always think truth is best served, when we use it to strive for compassion, mercy and kindness. We look to the 99 names of Allah for guidance.

In the spirit of praying for justice and peace for all people.


11-07-2015, 01:58 PM
Never will the Jews nor the Christians be pleased with you (O Muhammad Peace be upon him ) till you follow their religion. Say: "Verily, the Guidance of Allah (i.e. Islamic Monotheism) that is the (only) Guidance. And if you (O Muhammad Peace be upon him ) were to follow their (Jews and Christians) desires after what you have received of Knowledge (i.e. the Qur'an), then you would have against Allah neither any Wali (protector or guardian) nor any helper. #Quran 2:120

Never will the Jews nor the Christians be pleased with you (O Muhammad till you follow their religion. Say: "Verily, the guidance of Allah (i.e. Islamic Monotheism) that is the (only) guidance. And if you (O Muhammad ) were to follow their (Jews and Christians) desires after what you have received of Knowledge (i.e. the Qur'an), then you would have against Allah neither any Wali (protector or guardian) nor any helper.) Those to whom we gave the Book recite it as it should be recited (Yatlunahu Haqqa Tilawatihi) they are the ones who believe therein. And whoso disbelieve in it, those are they who are the losers.)
(Never will the Jews nor the Christians be pleased with you (O Muhammad ) till you follow their religion.) meaning, `The Jews and the Christians will never be happy with you, O Muhammad! Therefore, do not seek what pleases or appeases them, and stick to what pleases Allah by calling them to the truth that Allah sent you with.'

There will always be a group of my Ummah fighting upon the truth, having the upper hand, not harmed by their opponents, until the decree of Allah (the Last Hour) comes.)
(And if you (O Muhammad ) were to follow their (Jews and Christians) desires after what you have received of Knowledge (i.e. the Qur'an), then you would have against Allah neither any Wali (protector or guardian) nor any helper.)

This Ayah carries a stern warning for the Muslim Ummah against imitating the ways and methods of the Jews and Christians, after they have acquired knowledge of the Qur'an and Sunnah, may Allah grant us refuge from this behavior. Although the speech in this Ayah was directed at the Messenger , the ruling of which applies to his entire Ummah.

11-07-2015, 04:03 PM
Farhan, what are you waiting for to take this thread down ??

11-08-2015, 12:10 AM
There are NO sects in Islam. If you divide yourselves into sects and start backbiting you are lost and have strayed from the path of righteousness. You have been manipulated by politics and are subjects of the Jinn, the deceivers.

11-08-2015, 10:55 AM
A muslim is one who Submits to the will of GOD...not one who associates partners with GOD...hence shia are not muslim...if Ali(r.a) is held in the same regard with God, if there 12 imams has a higher status than the prophets, if they practise taqiyah (lying is permisable and held in high regard, if they slander the Companions and aylul bayt, yet claiming to be the followers of ahlul bayt (hypocrisy) and lastly the founder of this deviant group is a JEW!!!!!!! so how do you propose to defend them with a clear frame of mind, when their very existance is to mislead man and create mischief and FITNA.

So on a base level they are hypocrites

They have made their oaths a screen. Thus they hinder (others) from the path of Allah. meaning, the hypocrites shield themselves from Muslims when they falsely and sinfully swear to be what they are not in reality. Some Muslims were deceived because they did not know their falsehood, and thus, thought that they were Muslims. Some Muslims believed what hypocrites say and even imitated them in their outward behavior. However, inwardly, hypocrites seek the destruction of Islam and its people, and this is why trusting them might bring great harm to many people.

These people go on hajj, just to spit on the graves of the companions? (witnessed). The recent stampede in Makkah showed them in light of 'falsehood' when clearly the dead Shia's had tattood under their feet slanderous remarks about the Companions (witnessed).

And when you look at them, their bodies please you; and when they speak, you listen to their words. meaning, hypocrites have a graceful outer appearance and are eloquent. When one hears them speak, he will listen to their eloquent words, even though hypocrites are truly weak and feeble, full of fear, fright and cowardice.

They are the enemies, so beware of them. May Allah curse them! How are they denying the right path) means, how they are being led astray to the misguidance, away from the guidance

Now lets talk about their kufr. which nulifies whatever inkling or warped idea they had that they are still bound to the religion of Islam...

ASSOCIATING A PARTNER with Allah...Ali (a.s)

So dear brothers and sisters if after all these facts, given to you, you still persist in calling them your 'brothers' then go ahead, one just has to sit on a shia forum, much like this and read their slander, one just has to converse with them and hear the slander, one just has to witness the day of ''Ashurah'' and see their evil. All of which i have...


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