JEREMIAH 8 And The Prophet Muhammad pbuh

[Scimitar]

Jeremiah 8: I found some interesting verses here, in context, which align with the prophecy of the Arab prophet (pbuh) which I feel Muslims scholars have not expounded upon.

Jeremiah 8 New International Version (NIV)

8:1 “‘At that time, declares the Lord, the bones of the kings and officials of Judah, the bones of the priests and prophets, and the bones of the people of Jerusalem will be removed from their graves. 2 They will be exposed to the sun and the moon and all the stars of the heavens, which they have loved and served and which they have followed and consulted and worshiped. They will not be gathered up or buried, but will be like dung lying on the ground. 3 Wherever I banish them, all the survivors of this evil nation will prefer death to life, declares the Lord Almighty.’

Theme: Sin and Punishment

4 “Say to them, ‘This is what the Lord says:

“‘When people fall down, do they not get up?
When someone turns away, do they not return?

(verse alluding to repentance - the Semitic word for repentance has its root in the letters used for "return" - meaning,"return to God - or to turn back to God, and away from sin")

5 Why then have these people turned away?
Why does Jerusalem always turn away?
They cling to deceit;
they refuse to return.

(verse proving the Jews were unrepentant)

6 I have listened attentively,
but they do not say what is right.
None of them repent of their wickedness,
saying, “What have I done?”
Each pursues their own course
like a horse charging into battle.

(God clearly expresses his displeasure at the Jews)

7 Even the stork in the sky
knows her appointed seasons,
and the dove, the swift and the thrush
observe the time of their migration.
But my people do not know
the requirements of the Lord.

(God clearly states that the Children of Israel are lost in the jungle of their own making, and will not find their way back because they have "migrated spiritually" away from truth.

8 “‘How can you say, “We are wise,
for we have the law of the Lord,”
when actually the lying pen of the scribes
has handled it falsely?

I posted this verse in the thread to prove that Jews have corrupted scripture - here we find that this was a known problem at the time. Yet, none felt they had the authority to remove such blasphemy. Thus - they feared the opinions of their contemporaries over forgiveness of God)

9 The wise will be put to shame;
they will be dismayed and trapped.
Since they have rejected the word of the Lord,
what kind of wisdom do they have?

(God is revealing that a punishment is warranted - that the Rabbi's have gone too far)

10 Therefore I will give their wives to other men
and their fields to new owners.
From the least to the greatest,
all are greedy for gain;
prophets and priests alike,
all practice deceit.

(the covenant is proven to be shaky here - where God is letting the Jews know that it takes two sides to keep a contract (covenant) but only one side to break that contract - and the Jews did break it each time they rejected, slandered, exiled and killed their prophets and messengers (pbut) - thus, they were to bare the brunt of God wrath. And God is now telling them - I'm gonna take it back [covenant] and give your dearest and most prized things in this world, including your women etc - to an unbelieving folk whom God will use to exact HIS punishment on them.

11 They dress the wound of my people
as though it were not serious.
“Peace, peace,” they say,
when there is no peace.

(the Rabbi's had thus, sought the help of the Romans in a league described as "unholy" whereby the Rabbis exact their own law and not the Mosaic - by prompting the Romans to carry out their dirty work - not realising that the Romans are doing the bidding of God whilst they don't know God - and so the Rabbi's fooled themselves - and history is proof of this. Simulateneously the Babylonians had come to Jerusalem to carry of their slaves and Rome sat by the way side wondering what they had been invited into - didn't quite work out the way the Rabbi's wanted - the Romans however - played a game of thrones - and so, they recorded the incident and when 70 years later Cyrus free'd the Jews, an d returned them - the Romans started to make their plan to bring Judea into their empire as a satrapy that paid its taxes in lieu of peace and protection from invaders - while they themselves (romans) were invaders.

12 Are they ashamed of their detestable conduct?
No, they have no shame at all;
they do not even know how to blush.
So they will fall among the fallen;
they will be brought down when they are punished,
says the Lord.

(The Rabbi's were in cahoots with the Romans now - Evidently the Rabbis were exposed by Jesus pbuh centuries later and the truth made clear for the Children of Israel to see - but the Rabbi's had the backing of the worlds strongest empire - the unbelieving Romans. And thus we find that unholy covenant of Jew and Roman to be the very thing which Jesus warned us of - yet we find that no one heeded his message - small wonder Jesus pbuh needs to return)

13 “‘I will take away their harvest,
declares the Lord.
There will be no grapes on the vine.
There will be no figs on the tree,
and their leaves will wither.
What I have given them
will be taken from them.”

(Covenant is taken from the Jews *see explanation of what covenant means in the broader sense of being in lands hat are fruitful) And Judea is enslaved by the Romans.

14 Why are we sitting here?
Gather together!
Let us flee to the fortified cities
and perish there!
For the Lord our God has doomed us to perish
and given us poisoned water to drink,
because we have sinned against him.

(acceptance of their fate as those who broke the covenant)

15 We hoped for peace
but no good has come,
for a time of healing
but there is only terror.
16 The snorting of the enemy’s horses
is heard from Dan;
at the neighing of their stallions
the whole land trembles.

(most believe that this is referring to the tribe of Dan - when in reality this is where the Roman entered the holy land from - the area where the tribe of Dan lived - the mediterranean coast - the verse is alluding to the Romans - and the location of Dan was a sign that God's punishment will come from this direction)

They have come to devour
the land and everything in it,
the city and all who live there.

(cue the Romans and their overtaking Jerusalem.

17 “See, I will send venomous snakes among you,
vipers that cannot be charmed,
and they will bite you,”
declares the Lord.

(Cue the Rabbi's bowing to the will of the Romans instead of the will of God - venomous snakes refers to both the Rabbis who faltered towards the Romans and the Romans also - they are indistinguishable in their corruptions)

18 You who are my Comforterin sorrow,
my heart is faint within me.
19 Listen to the cry of my people
from a land far away:
“Is the Lord not in Zion?
Is her King no longer there?”
“Why have they aroused my anger with their images,
with their worthless foreign idols?”

(this verse is clearly referencing the Prophet of Arabia, who will set things aright - listen to the cry of my people from a land far away - refers to Arabia - further we find that idolatry was rife in Jerusalem in the 6th century BCE - the CONFORTER here is an adjacent to the term Paraclete used in Deuteronomy which is contextually speaking of the Prophet Muhammad pbuh as we all know now)

20 “The harvest is past,
the summer has ended,
and we are not saved.”
21 Since my people are crushed, I am crushed;
I mourn, and horror grips me.
22 Is there no balm in Gilead?
Is there no physician there?
Why then is there no healing
for the wound of my people?

(these final verses clearly show a lamentation in a collective appeal of those who truly believed yet witnessed the corruptions of the rabbi's and thus - saw the reality of God that HE only lets a people be ruled by a ruler reflective of their collective hearts.

The good hearted God fearing Jews realised this and Jeremiah may have been the very man who propagated to the Good Jews to move to Yathrib in Arabia - 1000 years before the Prophet pbuh was even born... thus we find the timeline of these verses to match with the songs of solomon 5:16 and the Paraclete verse of Jesus pbuh.

The Muslim rendering of context follows a more historical truth as well as contextual than the biblical ones.

Your thoughts, welcome.

Scimi

[Scimitar]

Does anyone have an opinion on this?

Scimi

[AmirEmir]

These are interesting thoughts my friend, I will discuss them at my mosque and with my teacher.

[goodwill]

Does anyone have an opinion on this?

Scimi

The context of the chapter is the invasion of Bablyon’s army from the north, through Dan (v. 16). The people in “a land far away” are the Jews who were subsequently exiled in Babylon. Of the translations I am aware of, the NIV stands alone in rendering the first part of verse 18, “You who are my Comforter in sorrow.” This makes the verse a prayer to God as the Comforter. The New King James Version renders it, “I would comfort myself in sorrow,” making the words part of a lamentation over the Jews’ plight. There is no basis for assuming that Arabia is in view, much less Muhammad as the prophet Jeremiah’s comforter. You must be thinking of the Comforter mentioned in the Gospel according to John. However, the Comforter mentioned there refers not to a human being but to God the Holy Spirit who was poured out on the disciples at the feast of Pentecost, immediately following Jesus Christ’s resurrection from the dead. This event is recorded in chapter 2 of the Book of Acts, which follows the John’s Gospel, in fulfillment of the Old Testament prophecy of Joel.

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[M.I.A.]

all praise is due to Allah swt..

I have felt banishment, it is truly awe inspiring.

[dwa2day]

Hi Scimitar
I find it very interesting that you have chosen to use Jeremiah 8 is a prophetic word for the Arab prophet (pbuh). By doing so you are in fact guilty of not listening to warning given by God (the God of the bible) in verse 4-17, if I may I would like you to consider the following:-

Verse 4-17 is the prophetic words spoken by God of the Bible staring with, “Say to them, ‘This is what the Lord says: Ending “declares the Lord.” From verse 18 it is Jerimiah’s reply to the warning received from God. In simplicity it simple is warning us to repent and follow Gods Law and not become self-righteousness and manipulative in our knowledge of the Law for our own personal gain.

We see this daily from Politics all the way through to personal issue were the human mind manipulates the truth for their own gain. I have experienced this by questioning an elder or more senior members in the work environment. “Who are you to question the Imran he know best, keep quit” is a typical manifestation of my point. More to the point is verse 8 as you have quoted scribes and learned men, informed people like yourself take their red markers and trim Gods Word to whatever is acceptable to themselves, changing Truth into lies. Some choses to reject Gods warning and message completely while others are caught in their own trap. We are warned not rest on our human understanding simple because by human standards we have been elevated to scholars of Gods Law while knowingly are misrepresenting the truth learnt in order to deceive other for whatever cause.

Your comment on verse 8.
“I posted this verse in the thread to prove that Jews have corrupted scripture - here we find that this was a known problem at the time. Yet, none felt they had the authority to remove such blasphemy. Thus - they feared the opinions of their contemporaries over forgiveness of God)”
This is a totally false representation of what is written. “lying pen of the scribes has handled it falsely?”

What have the scribes handled falsely? Scripture has been handled falsely. Dose not say scripture is false or corrupt as you claim. Thus the warning of Jerimiah 8, do not twist the truth written in the bible to suit your personal claim.

Your comment on verse 10.
“the covenant is proven to be shaky here - where God is letting the Jews know that it takes two sides to keep a contract (covenant) but only one side to break that contract - and the Jews did break it each time they rejected, slandered, exiled and killed their prophets and messengers (pbut) - thus, they were to bare the brunt of God wrath. And God is now telling them - I'm gonna take it back [covenant] and give your dearest and most prized things in this world, including your women etc - to an unbelieving folk whom God will use to exact HIS punishment on them.”
It saddens me to say you are 99% correct here. Your only error is the use of (pbut). Mohamed is a prophet of the Islamic faith and is not by any means considered a prophet from a Jewish or Christian perspective. This is the second time you have manipulated biblical scripture to prove your personal point. In doing so have fallen trap to the very warning given to us, but have rather chosen change it meaning to deceive others.
However you are 120% when it comes to the punishment of this prophecy, in the face of our unrepentance the most treasured and prized possession of the Jewish / Christian faith, The Temple mount in Jerusalem is now the site of an Islamic Mosque or as you so elegantly say “unbelieving folk whom God will use to exact HIS punishment on them.”