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Mustafa16
09-28-2016, 07:16 PM
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/liveco...cid=spartanntp

two children and a teacher were injured and have been taken to the hospital....
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Serinity
09-28-2016, 07:45 PM
:salam:

Pretty angry teenager.............

And Allah :swt: knows best.
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Born_Believer
09-28-2016, 08:58 PM
Why do the American people not get behind better gun control laws in the US?
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Mustafa16
09-28-2016, 09:05 PM
Originally Posted by Born_Believer
Why do the American people not get behind better gun control laws in the US?
Because Americans believe 1) that if guns are made illegal, then criminals will have access to guns and law-abiding citizens will not, thus leaving them defenseless...2) the constitution gives americans the right to own guns and 3) the founding fathers are believed to have put the 2nd amendment (which allows for guns) to deter tyranny, because if the people are armed, the government will, to them, be more reluctant to become harsh on its people due to the fear of revolt. as the saying goes, "the people should not be afraid of their governments....the government should be afraid of its people."
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Born_Believer
09-28-2016, 09:14 PM
Originally Posted by Mustafa16
Because Americans believe 1) that if guns are made illegal, then criminals will have access to guns and law-abiding citizens will not, thus leaving them defenseless...2) the constitution gives americans the right to own guns and 3) the founding fathers are believed to have put the 2nd amendment (which allows for guns) to deter tyranny, because if the people are armed, the government will, to them, be more reluctant to become harsh on its people due to the fear of revolt. as the saying goes, "the people should not be afraid of their governments....the government should be afraid of its people."
Yeah, I know all that but reality shows an entirely different picture.

That last point always gives me a chuckle. The American people are some of the most oppressed on earth and of all the so-called civilised/developed nations, it is the only one with a universal healthcare system. If a country in which trying to stay healthy almost bankrupts a family, isn't regarded as oppression then I don't know what is.

It really is a sick and twisted mindset which would support the US gun laws in light of all these shootings.

Edit: I am in no way insinuating you hols those opinions lol I was talking more about American gun nuts.
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AnnaK
09-28-2016, 09:55 PM
Originally Posted by Born_Believer
Why do the American people not get behind better gun control laws in the US?
Truth be told 93% of Americans want gun reform, but the NRA (National Rifle Association) spends billions legally rigging our Congressional votes through "lobbying" or bribery as I call it. The United States will only pass better gun laws when it passes strict laws on lobbying and campaign donation towards election funds, but good luck getting anything like that to happen. The Super PACS speak with their money, and the people are silent because of our inability to compete economically. That's why so many Black Lives Matter protests and riots are happening in the United States. We want reforms in our guns and our cops, but Congress would rather listen to the corporations than the people.
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Born_Believer
09-28-2016, 10:07 PM
Originally Posted by AnnaK
Truth be told 93% of Americans want gun reform, but the NRA (National Rifle Association) spends billions legally rigging our Congressional votes through "lobbying" or bribery as I call it. The United States will only pass better gun laws when it passes strict laws on lobbying and campaign donation towards election funds, but good luck getting anything like that to happen. The Super PACS speak with their money, and the people are silent because of our inability to compete economically. That's why so many Black Lives Matter protests and riots are happening in the United States. We want reforms in our guns and our cops, but Congress would rather listen to the corporations than the people.
I had no idea. Was this a national survey?

In terms of the reforms, why not just an outright ban? Like the case in the UK (there are strict regulations on actually being able to buy a gun) where we have exceptionally low numbers of mass shootings and gun crime in general when compared to the US.
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LaSorcia
09-28-2016, 11:55 PM
Originally Posted by Born_Believer
I had no idea. Was this a national survey?

In terms of the reforms, why not just an outright ban? Like the case in the UK (there are strict regulations on actually being able to buy a gun) where we have exceptionally low numbers of mass shootings and gun crime in general when compared to the US.
True, but stabbing deaths went up a lot when guns were banned. Granted, there should be more reforms, and it's much more difficult to have a mass murder with knives.
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AnnaK
09-29-2016, 12:05 AM
Originally Posted by Born_Believer
I had no idea. Was this a national survey?

In terms of the reforms, why not just an outright ban? Like the case in the UK (there are strict regulations on actually being able to buy a gun) where we have exceptionally low numbers of mass shootings and gun crime in general when compared to the US.
That number came from a nationwide poll, and I truly believe the best thing to do is to have that outright ban like the uk and Japan because death by guns has drastically decreased in those countries (well Japan specifically, I don't know the statistics in the uk).
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crimsontide06
09-29-2016, 01:24 AM
Guns are the enemy!! They wake up in the morning thinking of who to shoot. Humans cannot stop it, they have to be controlled!! Oh no!! I think there is a gun laying in the street outside, IT'S COMING TO GET ME!!!!! No!!!!! :heated:


Mental health..etc is the issue not.. "gun control"

Originally Posted by Born_Believer
Why do the American people not get behind better gun control laws in the US?
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Little_Lion
09-29-2016, 01:47 AM
Actually, taking guns away from the "mentally incompetent" people kind of scares me. First off many people with mental health issues do not get help, so they're only going to take guns away from people who are responsible enough to SEEK help. Secondly, I fall into that category (anxiety, depression, PTSD, psychosis, etc.) and I am a gun owner. I own one gun (two if you count my pellet rifle) and I use it for hunting. I am most apt to go hunting when I am feeling at my worst, because it gets me exercise, it gets me out in nature and closer to Allah's creation, and it gets me doing something productive (I hunt for food only). But if they take guns away from people with a mental health record, they'll take away my gun, and I consider myself a VERY responsible gun owner.
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Born_Believer
09-29-2016, 05:58 PM
Originally Posted by crimsontide06
Guns are the enemy!! They wake up in the morning thinking of who to shoot. Humans cannot stop it, they have to be controlled!! Oh no!! I think there is a gun laying in the street outside, IT'S COMING TO GET ME!!!!! No!!!!! :heated:


Mental health..etc is the issue not.. "gun control"
this is not a smart argument and you know that. Countries where guns are largely banned or very, very difficult to buy, i.e. the UK, gun crime is a fraction of what is present in the US.
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Born_Believer
09-29-2016, 05:59 PM
Originally Posted by AnnaK
That number came from a nationwide poll, and I truly believe the best thing to do is to have that outright ban like the uk and Japan because death by guns has drastically decreased in those countries (well Japan specifically, I don't know the statistics in the uk).
We don't really have a gun crime problem, probably not as low as Japan as we can still buy guns here and getting a license is possible.
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Born_Believer
09-29-2016, 06:00 PM
Originally Posted by LaSorcia
True, but stabbing deaths went up a lot when guns were banned. Granted, there should be more reforms, and it's much more difficult to have a mass murder with knives.
Where? When? Any direct correlation between the two? Has there been a statistically analysis which proves the point you made?
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Serinity
09-29-2016, 06:07 PM
:salam:

Since guns are so prevalent, taking guns away won't stop criminals from attaining them because they don't care about law, which endangers the innocent even more.

And Allah :swt: knows best.
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noraina
09-30-2016, 01:46 PM
Wa alaykum assalam,

Gun control would be immensely helpful (I'm sorry, I suppose growing up in the UK with its extremely stringent laws I find the abundance of guns in America both startling and frightening), but only as a secondary measure. It's like treating a symptom and not the problem.

And the problem seems to be prevalent in all societies these days, mistrust, hatred, suspicion, senseless violence....ect.

At the end of the day a gun is a tool, it can be used for either good or bad. The one who wields it decides what to use it for, and even if we take the gun away, that twisted unstable mind will still be there, capable of the same violence.

But still, maybe more gun control would mean such people are given less chances to do horrific acts like this. Honestly, shooting in a school?
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