format_quote Originally Posted by
Moss
What is hard to believe about all the prophets of God being submitters to him. By definition then they are Muslims. Many of them would never have said "I am a muslim", but by definition they are.
And HeiGou you are misssing the point because i don't think you quite understand the 2 perspectives
Islam says all Prophets came with the same message, but the people and folloowers have changed it in some way. Now this point is what Christians and Jews find difficult to understand. But the actual concept in Islam, that all Prophets are submitters to God, no Jew or Christian i have ever met has found that hard to understand.
Now Sikhism doesn't say all Prophets are Prophets of God and the followers changed it. Instead they say nothing has been changed but the religions that exist today in this current form are all right, even though they contradict each other in many ways.
Do you see what i am saying now?
Hi Moss ji
From my limited understanding I will try and explain this.
Correct me if I am wrong but does not Islam say that it's the only true religion and other religions are either contradictory or false?
Okay try and look at things from another perspective.
God is the creator of all and prophets such as Muhammed (pbuh) and Jesus Christ worship this one God and we are all the creation of him.
Religions are like routes leading to the centre, some take longer than others.
आसा महला ५ ॥
aasaa mehlaa 5.
Aasaa, Fifth Mehl:
ਏਕੁ ਬਗੀਚਾ ਪੇਡ ਘਨ ਕਰਿਆ ॥
एकु बगीचा पेड घन करिआ ॥
ayk bageechaa payd ghan kari-aa.
There is a garden, in which so many plants have grown.
ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਨਾਮੁ ਤਹਾ ਮਹਿ ਫਲਿਆ ॥੧॥
अम्रित नामु तहा महि फलिआ ॥१॥
amrit naam tahaa meh fali-aa. ||1||
They bear the Ambrosial Nectar of the Naam as their fruit. ||1||
ਐਸਾ ਕਰਹੁ ਬੀਚਾਰੁ ਗਿਆਨੀ ॥
ऐसा करहु बीचारु गिआनी ॥
aisaa karahu beechaar gi-aanee.
Consider this, O wise one,
ਜਾ ਤੇ ਪਾਈਐ ਪਦੁ ਨਿਰਬਾਨੀ ॥
जा ते पाईऐ पदु निरबानी ॥
jaa tay paa-ee-ai pad nirbaanee.
by which you may attain the state of Nirvaanaa.
ਆਸਿ ਪਾਸਿ ਬਿਖੂਆ ਕੇ ਕੁੰਟਾ ਬੀਚਿ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਹੈ ਭਾਈ ਰੇ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
आसि पासि बिखूआ के कुंटा बीचि अम्रितु है भाई रे ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥
aas paas bikhoo-aa kay kuntaa beech amrit hai bhaa-ee ray. ||1|| rahaa-o.
All around this garden are pools of poison, but within it is the Ambrosial Nectar, O Siblings of Destiny. ||1||Pause||
ਸਿੰਚਨਹਾਰੇ ਏਕੈ ਮਾਲੀ ॥
सिंचनहारे एकै माली ॥
sinchanhaaray aikai maalee.
There is only one gardener who tends it.
ਖਬਰਿ ਕਰਤੁ ਹੈ ਪਾਤ ਪਤ ਡਾਲੀ ॥੨॥
खबरि करतु है पात पत डाली ॥२॥
khabar karat hai paat pat daalee. ||2||
He takes care of every leaf and branch. ||2||
ਸਗਲ ਬਨਸਪਤਿ ਆਣਿ ਜੜਾਈ ॥
सगल बनसपति आणि जड़ाई ॥
sagal banaspat aan jarhaa-ee.
He brings all sorts of plants and plants them there.
ਸਗਲੀ ਫੂਲੀ ਨਿਫਲ ਨ ਕਾਈ ॥੩॥
सगली फूली निफल न काई ॥३॥
saglee foolee nifal na kaa-ee. ||3||
They all bear fruit - none is without fruit. ||3||
ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਫਲੁ ਨਾਮੁ ਜਿਨਿ ਗੁਰ ਤੇ ਪਾਇਆ ॥
अम्रित फलु नामु जिनि गुर ते पाइआ ॥
amrit fal naam jin gur tay paa-i-aa.
One who receives the Ambrosial Fruit of the Naam from the Guru -
ਨਾਨਕ ਦਾਸ ਤਰੀ ਤਿਨਿ ਮਾਇਆ ॥੪॥੫॥੫੬॥
नानक दास तरी तिनि माइआ ॥४॥५॥५६॥
naanak daas taree tin maa-i-aa. ||4||5||56||
O Nanak, such a servant crosses over the ocean of Maya. ||4||5||56||
Ang, 385
Guru Nanak Dev Ji said "Truth is high but higher still is truthful living"
In this day and age the world is not following the attributes of religion which lead to truthful living. Rather than focusing focusing on slaying the inner demons of kaam,krodh,lobh,moh and ahankar which keep their minds restless and separate the soul from God:-
qRsnw lwgI ric rihAw AMqir haumY kUir ]
thrisanaa laagee rach rehiaa a(n)thar houmai koor ||
They are engrossed in clinging desires; within their hearts there is ego and falsehood.
Guru Arjan Dev Ji
Siree Raag
47
People from different denominations follow different things which they believe will take them closer to God. Some smother ashes over their bodies, some worship the dead, others idol worship etc but these rituals are of no avail.
They look for God on the outside but how many of them realise that God is within them.
ijn kY rwmu vsY mn mwih ]
jin kai raam vasai man maahi ||
within whose minds the Lord abides.
Guru Nanak Dev Ji
Jap
8
Only by followng the hukam of the Guru does the mortal become God realised and the dirt of the mind, from many lifetimes is washed away.
igAwn rqin mnu mwjIAY bhuiV n mYlw hoie ]
giaan rathan man maajeeai bahurr n mailaa hoe ||
When the mind is cleaned with the jewel of spiritual wisdom, it does not become dirty again.
Guru Nanak Dev Ji
Raag Maaroo
992
Guru means
Gu= from darkness
Ru= into light
The Guru has the power to grant mukhti (liberation) to the soul from the suffering of the cycle of reincarnation. By following the Guru's hukam and taking amrit can this be achieved. By taking amrit one becomes Khalsa.
http://www.sikhs.org/khalsa.htm
The Guru Granth Sahib Ji is the living Guru of the Sikhs. There were 10 mortal Guru's but the light of the Guru passed through the 10 mortal frames and now is in the Divine Guru Granth Sahib Ji. (SGGS)
SGGS tells us how to live a truthful life. For a Muslim:
सचु कमावै सोई काजी ॥
sach kamaavai so-ee kaajee.
He alone is a Qazi, who practices the Truth.
ਜੋ ਦਿਲੁ ਸੋਧੈ ਸੋਈ ਹਾਜੀ ॥
जो दिलु सोधै सोई हाजी ॥
jo dil soDhai so-ee haajee.
He alone is a Haji, a pilgrim to Mecca, who purifies his heart.
ਸੋ ਮੁਲਾ ਮਲਊਨ ਨਿਵਾਰੈ ਸੋ ਦਰਵੇਸੁ ਜਿਸੁ ਸਿਫਤਿ ਧਰਾ ॥੬॥
सो मुला मलऊन निवारै सो दरवेसु जिसु सिफति धरा ॥६॥
so mulaa mala-oon nivaarai so darvays jis sifat Dharaa. ||6||
He alone is a Mullah, who banishes evil; he alone is a saintly dervish, who takes the Support of the Lord's Praise. ||6||
ਸਭੇ ਵਖਤ ਸਭੇ ਕਰਿ ਵੇਲਾ ॥
सभे वखत सभे करि वेला ॥
sabhay vakhat sabhay kar vaylaa.
Always, at every moment,
ਖਾਲਕੁ ਯਾਦਿ ਦਿਲੈ ਮਹਿ ਮਉਲਾ ॥
खालकु यादि दिलै महि मउला ॥
khaalak yaad dilai meh ma-ulaa.
remember God, the Creator within your heart.
ਤਸਬੀ ਯਾਦਿ ਕਰਹੁ ਦਸ ਮਰਦਨੁ ਸੁੰਨਤਿ ਸੀਲੁ ਬੰਧਾਨਿ ਬਰਾ ॥੭॥
तसबी यादि करहु दस मरदनु सुंनति सीलु बंधानि बरा ॥७॥
tasbee yaad karahu das mardan sunat seel banDhaan baraa. ||7||
Let your meditation beads be the subjugation of the ten senses. Let good conduct and self-restraint be your circumcision. ||7||
ਦਿਲ ਮਹਿ ਜਾਨਹੁ ਸਭ ਫਿਲਹਾਲਾ ॥
दिल महि जानहु सभ फिलहाला ॥
dil meh jaanhu sabh filhaalaa.
You must know in your heart that everything is temporary.
ਖਿਲਖਾਨਾ ਬਿਰਾਦਰ ਹਮੂ ਜੰਜਾਲਾ ॥
खिलखाना बिरादर हमू जंजाला ॥
khilkhaanaa biraadar hamoo janjaalaa.
Family, household and siblings are all entanglements.
ਮੀਰ ਮਲਕ ਉਮਰੇ ਫਾਨਾਇਆ ਏਕ ਮੁਕਾਮ ਖੁਦਾਇ ਦਰਾ ॥੮॥
मीर मलक उमरे फानाइआ एक मुकाम खुदाइ दरा ॥८॥
meer malak umray faanaa-i-aa ayk mukaam khudaa-ay daraa. ||8||
Kings, rulers and nobles are mortal and transitory; only God's Gate is the permanent place. ||8||
ਅਵਲਿ ਸਿਫਤਿ ਦੂਜੀ ਸਾਬੂਰੀ ॥
अवलि सिफति दूजी साबूरी ॥
aval sifat doojee saabooree.
First, is the Lord's Praise; second, contentment;
ਤੀਜੈ ਹਲੇਮੀ ਚਉਥੈ ਖੈਰੀ ॥
तीजै हलेमी चउथै खैरी ॥
teejai halaymee cha-uthai khairee.
third, humility, and fourth, giving to charities.
ਪੰਜਵੈ ਪੰਜੇ ਇਕਤੁ ਮੁਕਾਮੈ ਏਹਿ ਪੰਜਿ ਵਖਤ ਤੇਰੇ ਅਪਰਪਰਾ ॥੯॥
पंजवै पंजे इकतु मुकामै एहि पंजि वखत तेरे अपरपरा ॥९॥
punjvai panjay ikat mukaamai ayhi panj vakhat tayray aparparaa. ||9||
Fifth is to hold one's desires in restraint. These are the five most sublime daily prayers. ||9||
ਸਗਲੀ ਜਾਨਿ ਕਰਹੁ ਮਉਦੀਫਾ ॥
सगली जानि करहु मउदीफा ॥
saglee jaan karahu ma-udeefaa.
Let your daily worship be the knowledge that God is everywhere.
ਬਦ ਅਮਲ ਛੋਡਿ ਕਰਹੁ ਹਥਿ ਕੂਜਾ ॥
बद अमल छोडि करहु हथि कूजा ॥
bad amal chhod karahu hath koojaa.
Let renunciation of evil actions be the water-jug you carry.
ਖੁਦਾਇ ਏਕੁ ਬੁਝਿ ਦੇਵਹੁ ਬਾਂਗਾਂ ਬੁਰਗੂ ਬਰਖੁਰਦਾਰ ਖਰਾ ॥੧੦॥
खुदाइ एकु बुझि देवहु बांगां बुरगू बरखुरदार खरा ॥१०॥
khudaa-ay ayk bujh dayvhu baaNgaaN burgoo barkhurdaar kharaa. ||10||
Let realization of the One Lord God be your call to prayer; be a good child of God - let this be your trumpet. ||10||
ਹਕੁ ਹਲਾਲੁ ਬਖੋਰਹੁ ਖਾਣਾ ॥
हकु हलालु बखोरहु खाणा ॥
hak halaal bakhorahu khaanaa.
Let what is earned righteously be your blessed food.
ਦਿਲ ਦਰੀਆਉ ਧੋਵਹੁ ਮੈਲਾਣਾ ॥
दिल दरीआउ धोवहु मैलाणा ॥
dil daree-aa-o Dhovahu mailaanaa.
Wash away pollution with the river of your heart.
ਪੀਰੁ ਪਛਾਣੈ ਭਿਸਤੀ ਸੋਈ ਅਜਰਾਈਲੁ ਨ ਦੋਜ ਠਰਾ ॥੧੧॥
पीरु पछाणै भिसती सोई अजराईलु न दोज ठरा ॥११॥
peer pachhaanai bhistee so-ee ajraa-eel na doj tharaa. ||11||
One who realizes the Prophet attains heaven. Azraa-eel, the Messenger of Death, does not cast him into hell. ||11||
ਕਾਇਆ ਕਿਰਦਾਰ ਅਉਰਤ ਯਕੀਨਾ ॥
काइआ किरदार अउरत यकीना ॥
kaa-i-aa kirdaar a-urat yakeenaa.
Let good deeds be your body, and faith your bride.
ਰੰਗ ਤਮਾਸੇ ਮਾਣਿ ਹਕੀਨਾ ॥
रंग तमासे माणि हकीना ॥
rang tamaasay maan hakeenaa.
Play and enjoy the Lord's love and delight.
ਨਾਪਾਕ ਪਾਕੁ ਕਰਿ ਹਦੂਰਿ ਹਦੀਸਾ ਸਾਬਤ ਸੂਰਤਿ ਦਸਤਾਰ ਸਿਰਾ ॥੧੨॥
नापाक पाकु करि हदूरि हदीसा साबत सूरति दसतार सिरा ॥१२॥
naapaak paak kar hadoor hadeesaa saabat soorat dastaar siraa. ||12||
Purify what is impure, and let the Lord's Presence be your religious tradition. Let your total awareness be the turban on your head. ||12||
ਮੁਸਲਮਾਣੁ ਮੋਮ ਦਿਲਿ ਹੋਵੈ ॥
मुसलमाणु मोम दिलि होवै ॥
musalmaan mom dil hovai.
To be Muslim is to be kind-hearted,
ਅੰਤਰ ਕੀ ਮਲੁ ਦਿਲ ਤੇ ਧੋਵੈ ॥
अंतर की मलु दिल ते धोवै ॥
antar kee mal dil tay Dhovai.
and wash away pollution from within the heart.
ਦੁਨੀਆ ਰੰਗ ਨ ਆਵੈ ਨੇੜੈ ਜਿਉ ਕੁਸਮ ਪਾਟੁ ਘਿਉ ਪਾਕੁ ਹਰਾ ॥੧੩॥
दुनीआ रंग न आवै नेड़ै जिउ कुसम पाटु घिउ पाकु हरा ॥१३॥
dunee-aa rang na aavai nayrhai ji-o kusam paat ghi-o paak haraa. ||13||
He does not even approach worldly pleasures; he is pure, like flowers, silk, ghee and the deer-skin. ||13||
ਜਾ ਕਉ ਮਿਹਰ ਮਿਹਰ ਮਿਹਰਵਾਨਾ ॥
जा कउ मिहर मिहर मिहरवाना ॥
jaa ka-o mihar mihar miharvaanaa.
One who is blessed with the mercy and compassion of the Merciful Lord,
ਸੋਈ ਮਰਦੁ ਮਰਦੁ ਮਰਦਾਨਾ ॥
सोई मरदु मरदु मरदाना ॥
so-ee marad marad mardaanaa.
is the manliest man among men.
ਸੋਈ ਸੇਖੁ ਮਸਾਇਕੁ ਹਾਜੀ ਸੋ ਬੰਦਾ ਜਿਸੁ ਨਜਰਿ ਨਰਾ ॥੧੪॥
सोई सेखु मसाइकु हाजी सो बंदा जिसु नजरि नरा ॥१४॥
so-ee saykh masaa-ik haajee so bandaa jis najar naraa. ||14||
He alone is a Shaykh, a preacher, a Haji, and he alone is God's slave, who is blessed with God's Grace. ||14||
ਕੁਦਰਤਿ ਕਾਦਰ ਕਰਣ ਕਰੀਮਾ ॥
कुदरति कादर करण करीमा ॥
kudrat kaadar karan kareemaa.
The Creator Lord has Creative Power; the Merciful Lord has Mercy.
ਸਿਫਤਿ ਮੁਹਬਤਿ ਅਥਾਹ ਰਹੀਮਾ ॥
सिफति मुहबति अथाह रहीमा ॥
sifat muhabat athaah raheemaa.
The Praises and the Love of the Merciful Lord are unfathomable.
ਹਕੁ ਹੁਕਮੁ ਸਚੁ ਖੁਦਾਇਆ ਬੁਝਿ ਨਾਨਕ ਬੰਦਿ ਖਲਾਸ ਤਰਾ ॥੧੫॥੩॥੧੨॥
हकु हुकमु सचु खुदाइआ बुझि नानक बंदि खलास तरा ॥१५॥३॥१२॥
hak hukam sach khudaa-i-aa bujh naanak band khalaas taraa. ||15||3||12||
Realize the True Hukam, the Command of the Lord, O Nanak; you shall be released from bondage, and carried across. ||15||3||12||
Ang, 1084
Taking reinarnation into consideration, by living truthfully and following Gods will the soul will move towards God, not away from him with the main aim of merging with God which is the ultimate bliss or paradise.
Following Gods will is regardless of any religion, there are no false religions as all paths lead to the same destination. Some may take longer than others but they are all going the same way and the Guru Granth Sahib ji emphasises the right way of living and of reaching God.
Thats how I see it :)
Alhu eyku msIiq bsqu hY Avru mulKu iksu kyrw ]
alahu eaek maseeth basath hai avar mulakh kis kaeraa ||
If the Lord Allah lives only in the mosque, then to whom does the rest of the world belong?
Bhagat Kabeer Ji
Raag Prabhaatee
1349