An Independent Army, Good?

Whether Hezbollah is right or Isreal is right, there is something that puzzles me.

Why would any community want an “Armed Military” in there mist that did not answer to the government and could attack any person, place, or thing, any time they choose and not be accountable to any one?

Why would any government allow an “Armed Military” to become more powerful that that of the government?

What do you have it the government is not in control?

I just don’t understand. I just can’t imagine, say the “Libertarian Party”, creating an “Armed Military” and the US government allowing it to escalate to the point that they were stronger than the US Army.

Why do some of you think that having an independent non-governmental army that can do whatever they chose, is a good thing?

wilberhum said:

Whether Hezbollah is right or Isreal is right, there is something that puzzles me.

Why would any community want an “Armed Military” in there mist that did not answer to the government and could attack any person, place, or thing, any time they choose and not be accountable to any one?

Why would any government allow an “Armed Military” to become more powerful that that of the government?

What do you have it the government is not in control?

I just don’t understand. I just can’t imagine, say the “Libertarian Party”, creating an “Armed Military” and the US government allowing it to escalate to the point that they were stronger than the US Army.

Why do some of you think that having an independent non-governmental army that can do whatever they chose, is a good thing?

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Nice question. I'm curious to hear the responses.


I would think that public acceptance of such an "Armed Military" implicates the Lebanese people.

searchingsoul said:

Nice question. I'm curious to hear the responses.


I would think that public acceptance of such an "Armed Military" implicates the Lebanese people.

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No, I don't want to imply any single "Armed Military". I'm addressing the concept.

Because I can't understand why any one would want that situation.

wilberhum said:

Whether Hezbollah is right or Isreal is right, there is something that puzzles me.

Why would any community want an “Armed Military” in there mist that did not answer to the government and could attack any person, place, or thing, any time they choose and not be accountable to any one?

Why would any government allow an “Armed Military” to become more powerful that that of the government?

What do you have it the government is not in control?

I just don’t understand. I just can’t imagine, say the “Libertarian Party”, creating an “Armed Military” and the US government allowing it to escalate to the point that they were stronger than the US Army.

Why do some of you think that having an independent non-governmental army that can do whatever they chose, is a good thing?

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Very good point point. Very thought provoking topic.

I can recall here in Texas, we had something similar try to take place back in the 1980's one of our local militant groups, "The Texas Militia" was trying to start an internal uncontrolled army to take control of the State and free the "Republic of Texas" from the USA. It got nipped in the bud, for many of the fears and concerns you just mentioned.

I think it depends on the strength of the government in question. Of course the U.S. government isn't going to allow an armed militia group to grow in strength to the point of threatening stability. Weaker governments may choose to ally itself with another armed group to solidify control and power, only to find that this armed group is more like the lion who bites the hand that fed it. I think popular support for such an armed group plays a big part as well. It is hard to stomp out a popular movement completely.

Any army that inlficts harm= bad & should not exist. Weapons= people are lazy

mlsh27 said:

Any army that inlficts harm= bad & should not exist. Weapons= people are lazy

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This is good in theory but is it realistic?

I believe the only reason an independent army would ever happen, is to overthrow the existing government. No country is going to willingly want that. True there may be factions withing a country that desire their government to be overthrown, but a violent overthrow, is not always a wise choice. Because if a government is overthrown forcebly, that means the ones who did the over throwing were stronger then the existing government. That means if they prove to be worse, they will be even harder to remove.

searchingsoul said:

This is good in theory but is it realistic?

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It can be if people follow my plan LOL...I have a huge one about changing the way people think. It's actually something I have thought a lot about, not just some off the wall 2 second idea.

mlsh27 said:

It can be if people follow my plan LOL...I have a huge one about changing the way people think. It's actually something I have thought a lot about, not just some off the wall 2 second idea.

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I TRULY hope you succeed.

Wilberhum, I am far from an informed person, but that being said, this is what I see.

Lebanon has not, for many years now, been an independent-free thinking place.

The “reality” for many people in Lebanon has been distorted.

Hezbollah has been allowed, for a number of years now, to pretend to be the de-facto benefactor of a large segment of the population.

You ask what sort of folks would want such a group in their community, I answer, those getting their needs met, just the same as you or me.

What has been done, has not been done in a vacuum, nor has it been done clumsily till the past 2 or 3 weeks or so (read between the lines).

The good news is it seems to be Hezbollah will be defeated as a military force. That pending defeat was seen, by the thinking world, when Iran and Syria and Saudi Arabia and Jordan and Egypt didn’t openly join Hezbollah in its armed attacks on Israel.

The out come is now a foregone conclusion, you cannot win a war when you only control, sort of, two sides of the triad of modern warfare.

What has to be understood is this, Hezbollah has met many needs.
They were the “go to” group in the areas they controlled.
They fulfilled many of the roles, you and I see, of the government in most other countries doing.
They put up just enough resistance, toward Israel to make folks, like some of the yahoos we see on this board, feel like they were waging enough of a war on Israel, to allow them to sleep at night.

The good news is that the thinking folks of the world have seen the results of allowing Hezbollah, and those like them, to determine the cost of following an agenda.

Hezbollah will not be openly rebuked and diminished in their leadership role, but it will be done none the less.

I think everyone on this board would agree, what has occurred over the last 3 or 4 weeks has changed the, whole world’s, understanding of the basic equation.

We will continue to be at opposite poles, but the status quo has changed.

We are, imo, at a point where the strong will grow stronger, and the weaker will continue to grow weaker.

Hezbollah, imo, is on that weaker side, they will be seen to be of the same cut as those that are killing each other in Iraq.

Hezbollah has wagered on two things, the open support, militarily, from those who have supported them covertly, and a general outrage from the rest of the world.

Where Hezbollah has misjudged is this, imo, is that most folks, from that part of the world, don’t have a very good track record of sticking by their allies when the chips are really down.

Most of the powerful parts of the world are more concerned with their own back yard. They are not really concerned with what happens to some folks that are getting a response to something they started.

BTW, by the way, a very good topic, it drives right down to the root, of at least part, of the impasse.

Thanks
Nimrod

wilberhum said:

Because I can't understand why any one would want that situation.

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Of course, it is not as if anyone has chosen for that situation. It has simply developed during the civil war and due to the Israeli invasion. Now that that civil war is over it has to be recitified, which is obviously no easy task, but I am under the impression that most Lebanese realize this, including many who are related to Hezbollah.

But of course, those that want to fight the Jews are happy there is someone doing it at all, nevermind that this is an irregular force and guerilla movement financed and supplied by another regional power.

Hezbollah is the proxy for Iran and Syria, therefore the people in the south of Lebonon are under the rule of Syria and Iran.

Any patriotic Lebonese person would want to see the goverment of Lebonon in charge. Not the terrorists Hezbollah.

Along the same line as having an Independent Army, I was wondering what you all thought about some radical Christian preacher, like Pat Robinson. Having his own military unit? What would you think of someone who said Islam was an evil religion, walking around in a group of men all armed with AK-47’s?

wilberhum said:

Along the same line as having an Independent Army, I was wondering what you all thought about some radical Christian preacher, like Pat Robinson. Having his own military unit? What would you think of someone who said Islam was an evil religion, walking around in a group of men all armed with AK-47’s?

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That would be a fairly accurate analogy.