Shias want to build Sikh shrine in Iraq

[AvarAllahNoor]

Shias want to build Sikh shrine in Iraq


Fired by their zeal to repay a debt to the Sikhs, India’s Shia community has embarked upon a mission to construct a Sikh shrine at Basra in Iraq in the honour of Sikhism founder and first Sikh guru, Guru Nanak.

Maulana Kalbe Jawad, India’s spiritual head of the Shia community, has decided to lead a delegation of prominent Shia leaders to Iraq to persuade Ayatollah Ali Shistani, the supreme authority of the Shia community the world over, to allow construction of the Sikh shrine at Basra near Baghdad.

Isn't that inspiring? Some muslims respect Guru Ji too! :D

[afriend]

Hmmm.....Nice for sihks I guess....But rumours and fake tales are everywhere, you don't know who to trust......Source?

[ManchesterFolk]

I have a feeling someone might die over this.

I mean there killing soccer places because of short length there, are they not?

[afriend]

hmmmm.....Yeah......But Iraq is shi'ia mostly, and i'm sure they'll have it protected somehow.....but u can't avoid death over this....it's bound to hapen cos sum ppl can't tollerate....

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[Mohsin]

Shias want to build Sikh shrine in Iraq


Fired by their zeal to repay a debt to the Sikhs, India’s Shia community has embarked upon a mission to construct a Sikh shrine at Basra in Iraq in the honour of Sikhism founder and first Sikh guru, Guru Nanak.

Maulana Kalbe Jawad, India’s spiritual head of the Shia community, has decided to lead a delegation of prominent Shia leaders to Iraq to persuade Ayatollah Ali Shistani, the supreme authority of the Shia community the world over, to allow construction of the Sikh shrine at Basra near Baghdad.

Isn't that inspiring? Some muslims respect Guru Ji too! :D

Source please?

Isn't that inspiring? Some muslims respect Guru Ji too!

I hope this isn't aimed at me, but i would like to state that I do respect Guru nanak as a human being. He saw evil occurring in india so tried to reform the country, and thus created a new religion in my opinion, to unite the Muslims and Hindus. So i respect him for his intentions, but i don't think you should ever lie in the name of God.

[snakelegs]

Shias want to build Sikh shrine in Iraq


Fired by their zeal to repay a debt to the Sikhs, India’s Shia community has embarked upon a mission to construct a Sikh shrine at Basra in Iraq in the honour of Sikhism founder and first Sikh guru, Guru Nanak.

Maulana Kalbe Jawad, India’s spiritual head of the Shia community, has decided to lead a delegation of prominent Shia leaders to Iraq to persuade Ayatollah Ali Shistani, the supreme authority of the Shia community the world over, to allow construction of the Sikh shrine at Basra near Baghdad.

Isn't that inspiring? Some muslims respect Guru Ji too! :D

yeah, that's cool! i didn't know there was a sikh community in iraq! must be pretty small, no? i've heard there is a very tiny sikh community in afghanistan.

[AvarAllahNoor]

Source please?



I hope this isn't aimed at me, but i would like to state that I do respect Guru nanak as a human being. He saw evil occurring in india so tried to reform the country, and thus created a new religion in my opinion, to unite the Muslims and Hindus. So i respect him for his intentions, but i don't think you should ever lie in the name of God.

Paranoid much? It wasn't aimed at anyone, it was just to show that some muslims are tolerant...

http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/431

http://www.zeenews.com/znnew/article...287862&sid=NAT

http://www.pluralism.org/newsletter/2006-05-04.php

I guess it'll be said it isn't credible sources, but who cares....:rolleyes:

[AvarAllahNoor]

yeah, that's cool! i didn't know there was a sikh community in iraq! must be pretty small, no? i've heard there is a very tiny sikh community in afghanistan.

A handful of people i believe, but there does exist a shrine to Guru Nanak Ji so that's why they've decided to re-build it i trust!

http://www.sikhiwiki.org/index.php?t...nak_in_Baghdad

[AvarAllahNoor]

I have a feeling someone might die over this.

I mean there killing soccer places because of short length there, are they not?

Not sure what you're getting at?

[AvarAllahNoor]

hmmmm.....Yeah......But Iraq is shi'ia mostly, and i'm sure they'll have it protected somehow.....but u can't avoid death over this....it's bound to hapen cos sum ppl can't tollerate....

Well, it's not a new construction it's been there for ages. See link i've provided above!

[north_malaysian]

I've heard that there is a Sikh community built mosque ... somewhere in India...I think.....it's been a while..

[AvarAllahNoor]

I've heard that there is a Sikh community built mosque ... somewhere in India...I think.....it's been a while..

That is true it's known as "Guru ki Maseet" (Guru's Mosque) was being used as a gurdwara (temple) by the Sikh community. The mosque is picturesquely situated on a hill overlooking a curve on the banks of the mighty Beas river in Punjab's Gurdaspur district.

Maulana Hamid Husain Qasmi, the imam of the Jama Masjid in Amristsar, the largest city of the state, was specially called to lead the first prayers in the mosque on March 23. The mosque was constructed by Guru (Sikh Prophet) Hargobind Ji 370 years ago. According to Sikh tradition, the Guru had converted the house of a dead Muslim into a masjid and set up a langar (common kitchen) for the poor. Their tradition records an encounter between Guru Nanak, the first Sikh Guru, and some Muslims which ended with the declaration that "if Hindus are the left hand, then Muslims are the right, and we all believe in the one true God."

http://www.milligazette.com/Archives...1504200294.htm

[north_malaysian]

That is true it's known as "Guru ki Maseet" (Guru's Mosque) was being used as a gurdwara (temple) by the Sikh community. The mosque is picturesquely situated on a hill overlooking a curve on the banks of the mighty Beas river in Punjab's Gurdaspur district.

Maulana Hamid Husain Qasmi, the imam of the Jama Masjid in Amristsar, the largest city of the state, was specially called to lead the first prayers in the mosque on March 23. The mosque was constructed by Guru (Sikh Prophet) Hargobind Ji 370 years ago. According to Sikh tradition, the Guru had converted the house of a dead Muslim into a masjid and set up a langar (common kitchen) for the poor. Their tradition records an encounter between Guru Nanak, the first Sikh Guru, and some Muslims which ended with the declaration that "if Hindus are the left hand, then Muslims are the right, and we all believe in the one true God."

http://www.milligazette.com/Archives...1504200294.htm

Yeah... thanks.

Most of the Punjabis in Pakistan are Muslims right? Are there any Punjabi Muslims in Indian side?

[AvarAllahNoor]

Yeah... thanks.

Most of the Punjabis in Pakistan are Muslims right? Are there any Punjabi Muslims in Indian side?

I asume so, i've only been to India once and that was to the the Golden Temple! - I'd like to go to Pakistan to see the Sikh Shrines, as after partition they were spilt into the side of pakistan. The Musharraf seems to have a good dialogue going with the Sikhs, so that's good!

[north_malaysian]

I asume so, i've only been to India once and that was to the the Golden Temple! - I'd like to go to Pakistan to see the Sikh Shrines, as after partition they were spilt into the side of pakistan. The Musharraf seems to have a good dialogue going with the Sikhs, so that's good!

Have you seen the movie 'Veer Zara', If you had, what's your comment?;)

[S_87]

what what what?
is there even sikhs there?
inshaAllah this will never happen

[AvarAllahNoor]

what what what?
is there even sikhs there?
inshaAllah this will never happen

It IS happening regardless of if you like it or not!! :raging:

[north_malaysian]

what what what?
is there even sikhs there?
inshaAllah this will never happen

According to http://www.worldchristiandatabase.org

There are 1,934 Sikhs in Pakistan.. all from ethnic group called 'Dogri'

There are 966,903 Dogris in Pakistan - 85% Muslims, 12.8% Hindus, 2% Christians and 0.2% Sikhs.

[north_malaysian]

And according to the same source - 0.91% of Punjabis in India are Muslims.

[S_87]

:sl:

to allow construction of the Sikh shrine at Basra near Baghdad

and if it does happens then the rest is with Allah and Allah alone can detroy it

[AvarAllahNoor]

Have you seen the movie 'Veer Zara', If you had, what's your comment?;)

I've not no, why?

[AvarAllahNoor]

:sl:




and if it does happens then the rest is with Allah and Allah alone can detroy it

Think you mean destroy...

But that's not possible as Allah wouldn't destroy a shrine that's made in respect to his Prophet!

[Fishman]

Think you mean destroy...

But that's not possible as Allah wouldn't destroy a shrine that's made in respect to his Prophet!

:sl:
If Islam is true then Guru Nanak is not a prophet, but a man who ascribed lies to Allah (swt).
:w:

[AvarAllahNoor]

:sl:
If Islam is true then Guru Nanak is not a prophet, but a man who ascribed lies to Allah (swt).
:w:

You're a convert but you have no idea what real Islam is. You've adopted the watered down version....

Also please refrain from saying Guru Ji lied!!

[Fishman]

You're a convert but you have no idea what real Islam is. You've adopted the watered down version....

Also please refrain from saying Guru Ji lied!!

:sl:
Give me evidence that what you call the non-watered down version even existed.

But let's leave this for the Sikhism topic, shall we...

P.S: I tried to post a rebuttal to that anti-Islamic article you posted in the rebuttals section, but the topic was deleted before I could post.
:w:

[AvarAllahNoor]

:sl:
Give me evidence that what you call the non-watered down version even existed.

But let's leave this for the Sikhism topic, shall we...

P.S: I tried to post a rebuttal to that anti-Islamic article you posted in the rebuttals section, but the topic was deleted before I could post.
:w:

Ooooh don't make me angry, ya won't loike it....

[Fishman]

Ooooh don't make me angry, ya won't loike it....

:sl:
How come every time I ask you for proof of something you get mad...

ya won't loike it...

Jeepers Scooby, a monster! :p
:w:

[AvarAllahNoor]

:sl:
How come every time I ask you for proof of something you get mad...

Jeepers Scooby, a monster! :p
:w:

Hehe, nah dude i'm not getting angry just messing about. :brother:

It's Friday and i'm at work bored out of my brain.

[Fishman]

Hehe, nah dude i'm not getting angry just messing about. :brother:

It's Friday and i'm at work bored out of my brain.

:sl:
It's Friday and I'm anticipating going to the Masjid for my second Friday prayers ever!
:w:

[AvarAllahNoor]

:sl:
It's Friday and I'm anticipating going to the Masjid for my second Friday prayers ever!
:w:

It consists of 5 a day no? What is duration of each? Sikhs pray 3 times a day!

[Fishman]

It consists of 5 a day no? What is duration of each? Sikhs pray 3 times a day!

:sl:
What I meant was that on Friday, Muslims go to the Masjid for a special prayer, instead of the usual one. Today will be the second time I've been in my life, Insha'Allaah!

The prayers are not very long, but usually last over five minutes.
:w:

[S_87]

Think you mean destroy...

But that's not possible as Allah wouldn't destroy a shrine that's made in respect to his Prophet!

the last and final Prophet is Muhammed :arabic5: bin Abdullah bin Abdul Mutalib from the Hashim tribe of the Quraish

anyone after him who claims to be a Prophet is a liar and a loser both in this world and the hereafter.

[AvarAllahNoor]

the last and final Prophet is Muhammed :arabic5: bin Abdullah bin Abdul Mutalib from the Hashim tribe of the Quraish

anyone after him who claims to be a Prophet is a liar and a loser both in this world and the hereafter.

Yadda yadda...

[Fishman]

Yadda yadda...

:sl:
I could also say that to what you say about me following 'watered-down Islam'.
:w:

[S_87]

Yadda yadda...

upto you to follow who you want :)

[scentsofjannah]

Guru Nanak didnt claim to be a Prophet..but i do believe He was a righteous man..and possibly even a Muslim.

[S_87]

Guru Nanak didnt claim to be a Prophet..but i do believe He was a righteous man..and possibly even a Muslim.

:sl:

no he wasnt. he took some aspects of islam and other religions...

[snakelegs]

I asume so, i've only been to India once and that was to the the Golden Temple! - I'd like to go to Pakistan to see the Sikh Shrines, as after partition they were spilt into the side of pakistan. The Musharraf seems to have a good dialogue going with the Sikhs, so that's good!

guru nanak was born in what is now pakistan. (forget the town). i think on his birthday, some indian sikhs do make a pilgrimage there.

[snakelegs]

:sl:
and if it does happens then the rest is with Allah and Allah alone can detroy it

this was your reply to: "to allow construction of the Sikh shrine at Basra near Baghdad "
so are you saying religious tolerance is both undesirable and impossible - that people of various religions can't live together on this planet?
not a cheerful thought.

[Isa Abdullah]

bismillah

That is interesting.

[scentsofjannah]

:sl:

no he wasnt. he took some aspects of islam and other religions...

how do you know? it could be that his followers changed his teachings?

I dunno but i think he was a righteous man who didnt proclaim that he was God's Prophet.

[S_87]

this was your reply to: "to allow construction of the Sikh shrine at Basra near Baghdad "
so are you saying religious tolerance is both undesirable and impossible - that people of various religions can't live together on this planet?
not a cheerful thought.

the point is that the sikhs themselves are not bulding it...

how do you know? it could be that his followers changed his teachings?

because guru nanak is the founder of sikhism. he himself said he was neither a hindu nor a muslim but a *follower of truth*

[AFDAL]

The shia of india are so wicked peoples that they were the first to ally with the anti muslim BJP , when they came to power in the most comunal part of india - UP . So , in iraq the shia will even allows ome idol worshipers temples .

[scentsofjannah]

The shia of india are so wicked peoples that they were the first to ally with the anti muslim BJP , when they came to power in the most comunal part of india - UP . So , in iraq the shia will even allows ome idol worshipers temples .

Please show some respect the Shia are still muslims..so please don't generalise them..I'm also sure that there are many treacherous sunnis around.

[scentsofjannah]

just a question to some members here..

did you support the destroying of the Buddha statues in Afghanistan?

[SirZubair]

Please show some respect the Shia are still muslims..so please don't generalise them..I'm also sure that there are many treacherous sunnis around.

Exactly. Treat them like your brothers and sisters because at the end of the day, that is exactly what they are, your brothers and sisters.

Keyword is RESPECT.

www.dictionary.com

Check it out.. :rollseyes

[north_malaysian]

I've not no, why?

It's a story about Zara, a Pakistani Muslim girl having a Sikh nanny (who migrated to Pakistan following her Muslim employers). Before her nanny die, she asked Zara to bring her ashes to a river in Punjab, India.

This Zara went to India, while crossing the border her bus crashed and being saved by Veer, a Hindu Indian soldier. Veer was attracted to Zara and helped her to go to that Sikh holy place.

Later, Veer went to Pakistan to search for Zara, but because Zara was engaged to the son of a powerful Pakistani politician - Veer was caught and jailed - accused of being Indian spy. He was jailed without no trial for decades.

Later, a Pakistani Muslim lady (A lawyer) decided to help Veer and later found out that while Veer was jailed while searching for Zara in Pakistan. Zara went to India searching for Veer, for decades she's been helping Veer's family and even manage an orphanage in India.

Finally, Veer being released and met Zara and live happily ever after.

Veer - Shah Rukh Khan
Zara - Preety Zinta
Pakistani lawyer - Rani Mukherjee
Veer's father - Amitabh Bacchan.

[AvarAllahNoor]

Guru Nanak didnt claim to be a Prophet..but i do believe He was a righteous man..and possibly even a Muslim.

NO!

Guru Nanak considers himself neither Hindu nor Muslim. He did not follow Hindu rituals and nor did he join Islamic law. As commanded by God, Guru Nanak introduced a true faith, whose sole purpose is the love towards God. Guru Nanak Dev Ji denounced the superstitions followed by Hindu and Muslims and told them to worship God instead of considering their religion superior.
Many Hindus and Muslims consider their religion superior but Guru Nanak Dev Ji instructed to focus on meditation of God instead of glorifying a religion.

Guru Nanak Dev Ji laid the foundation of Sikhism as instructed by God. The next nine Guru sent to this world by God, strengthened the roots of Sikhism and enlightened people to meditate on One God only. Many people found the true meaning of Sikhism and those who did join and embraced Sikhism with love. Sikhism tells everyone to get rid of egotism, anger, greed, and materialistic things. Sikhism tells everyone to live a humble life and worship God. God sees all and your worship will be fruitful with time.

It is completely ridiculous to consider Sikhism a sect of any other religion. Just like you wouldn’t consider Christianity a sect of Buddhism, you should not consider Sikhism a sect of either Islam or Hinduism or a combination of both.


Scentsofjannah I do admire the respect you show for Guru Nanak. :)

[AvarAllahNoor]

It's a story about Zara, a Pakistani Muslim girl having a Sikh nanny (who migrated to Pakistan following her Muslim employers). Before her nanny die, she asked Zara to bring her ashes to a river in Punjab, India.

This Zara went to India, while crossing the border her bus crashed and being saved by Veer, a Hindu Indian soldier. Veer was attracted to Zara and helped her to go to that Sikh holy place.

Later, Veer went to Pakistan to search for Zara, but because Zara was engaged to the son of a powerful Pakistani politician - Veer was caught and jailed - accused of being Indian spy. He was jailed without no trial for decades.

Later, a Pakistani Muslim lady (A lawyer) decided to help Veer and later found out that while Veer was jailed while searching for Zara in Pakistan. Zara went to India searching for Veer, for decades she's been helping Veer's family and even manage an orphanage in India.

Finally, Veer being released and met Zara and live happily ever after.

Veer - Shah Rukh Khan
Zara - Preety Zinta
Pakistani lawyer - Rani Mukherjee
Veer's father - Amitabh Bacchan.

Hehe, it sound slike a nice story. But i can't see the relevance to this topic though :giggling: Unless you're trying to make the point of a muslim girl going to the Sikh shrine!

[AvarAllahNoor]

just a question to some members here..

did you support the destroying of the Buddha statues in Afghanistan?

Although idolatry is forbidden in Sikhism, i don't think we should destroy statue of faith.

[Muezzin]

Although idolatry is forbidden in Sikhism, i don't think we should destroy statue of faith.

I don't think the statues of Buddha qualify as idolatry. Buddhists don't worship the Buddha, after all.

I just wanted to clarify. :)

[AvarAllahNoor]

I don't think the statues of Buddha qualify as idolatry. Buddhists don't worship the Buddha, after all.

I just wanted to clarify. :)

The prostrate before it and offer it incense, no? This is classed as idolatry!

and Buddhists don't believe in God, Monotheism (only one God) was a foreign concept to the Buddha, his world was filled with many gods. The creator god Brahma being the most important one. So that's part of Hinduism!

[afriend]

Once I went to a gurdwara as a School trip and I saw that the people came and offered money and bowed to the pictures of [i'm guessing the gurus] at the front of the temple....So I am just wondering....

[AvarAllahNoor]

Once I went to a gurdwara as a School trip and I saw that the people came and offered money and bowed to the pictures of [i'm guessing the gurus] at the front of the temple....So I am just wondering....

Well like most people, some are misunderstanding Sikhism (usually the illterate) First of all there should be no pictures (they don't exist as nobody knows what they looked like) of any Gurus in the main Darbar (place of worship) Only pictures of the Gurdwaras and of course the Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Prostrating in front of that is allowed, as it's contains the word of God.

[Muezzin]

The prostrate before it and offer it incense, no? This is classed as idolatry!

I see what you're saying. Hmm. I always thought idolatry denoted some aspect of worship. I'm no expert, but my understanding is Buddhists revere the Buddha, but do not worship him or any other deity.

and Buddhists don't believe in God, Monotheism (only one God) was a foreign concept to the Buddha, his world was filled with many gods. The creator god Brahma being the most important one. So that's part of Hinduism!

Yep, true.

Oh dear - I've driven this thing off-topic. Whatever will people say?

:p

[SirZubair]

Protection of Non-Muslims' Places of Worship

[AvarAllahNoor]

I see what you're saying. Hmm. I always thought idolatry denoted some aspect of worship. I'm no expert, but my understanding is Buddhists revere the Buddha, but do not worship him or any other deity.

I know it's off-topic but I have met a lot of Buddhists who don’t believe in God... And a lot of Buddhists just don’t know. They don't concentrate on God as the main monesthetic relgions do. I find it to be a very complex religion, just like hinduism to comrehend, but some may say it's the most simple to follow! I believe in the one supreme Lord and that is most rewarding!

[AvarAllahNoor]

Even Saddam had respect for the Sikhs and it's shrine! Make sure it's built or.... :p


BAGHDAD: Iraq is keen to rebuild a historic Sikh shrine commemorating Guru Nanak's visit to Baghdad, which had been destroyed by 'fanatics' after the invasion of the country by US-led coalition forces, a top leader said on Friday.

Iraqi National Congress chief Ahmed Chalabi, one of Iraq's prominent leaders, who drove down through the desolate streets of Baghdad to the sacred Sikh site last night under heavy military protection, said 'it has unfortunately been wiped out by fanatics because they thought it was against Islam'.

"It's shameful they cannot respect someone who has millions of followers," he said at the gurdwara site along the river Tigris.

Iraqi officials escorting Chalabi informed him about the original design of the gurdwara that was built alongside the tomb of a Muslim religious leader, which has suffered no damage.

"We will rebuild it," Chalabi said even as he admitted he did not know that a Sikh shrine had ever existed in Baghdad, which houses the Indian embassy.

The Iraqi leader, seen as close to the Bush administration, ruled out the possibility of the gurdwara being destroyed in military fire.

"It was a mortar attack by some fanatic," he said, adding he believed it would have happened after the fall of Saddam Hussein.

News reports during the Iraq war had suggested the gurdwara had suffered damage in the attack, but there has been no official confirmation until now from Iraq about its condition.

The visit to the site revealed complete destruction of the shrine.

Chalabi, who broke the lock at the gate of the shrine's compound to inspect the site, pointed out that the shrine's marble floor had been pulled out and its roof razed to the ground.

Indian spiritual leader Sri Sri Ravi Shankar, who accompanied him, also requested immediate rebuilding of the gurdwara.

Guru Nanak, the founder of the faith, visited Baghdad and had a discourse with Bahlol Dana, a sufi teacher.

The gurdwara commemorating the Guru's visit lies near what is now a devastated railway station in Baghdad.

"The Sikh community has contributed a lot to Iraq. They have worked here in railways, construction and a lot of other activities. We respect them and will see to it that this is rebuilt," Chalabi said.

http://www.dnaindia.com/report.asp?NewsID=1099078

[One Man Army]

If anyone stil stuck Guru Nanak jee 'probably being a muslim', do a search, and read Avar's previous topics, as far as i can remember, he posted a topic regarding this issue.

[Zman]

[B]Shias want to build Sikh shrine in Iraq


Fired by their zeal to repay a debt to the Sikhs, India’s Shia community has embarked upon a mission to construct a Sikh shrine at Basra in Iraq in the honour of Sikhism founder and first Sikh guru, Guru Nanak.

What is that debt?

[- Qatada -]

I wonder how this thread got so far.. it's sectarian, so i'm going to have to close it sorry.



Thread Closed.