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sonz
12-04-2006, 03:54 PM
KANDAHAR — Crushed under the vicious cycle of violence, many Afghans see peace as a distant dream and yearn for the peaceful days of the Taliban regime more than five years after its ouster.

"We want peace, whether it is with the Americans or the Taliban," Mohammed Shafik, a young carpet seller in the volatile southern city of Kandahar, told Agence France Presse (AFP) on Sunday, December 3.

"We didn't have problems with the Taliban."

Hadji Ramdullah, a shop owner in the Pashtun-majority city, agreed that the Taliban regime "knew how to keep order".

"In the time of the Taliban, Shari`ah was applied in line with our culture and our traditions," he said.

"We did not see all these thefts, these kidnappings, these murders," white- bearded Ramdullah lamented sitting cross-legged in his empty shop.

The Taliban launched from Kandahar the campaign that took it to power with the capture of Kabul in 1996.

Taliban claimed Sunday shooting down a NATO-chartered helicopter in the south with eight people on board using a surface-to-air rocket.

Also Sunday, a bomber detonated an explosives-laden car near a NATO-led convoy in Kandahar, killing two civilians and injuring three British soldiers.

The southern provinces, especially Kandahar and Uruzgan, have seen a sharp increase this year in Taliban attacks.

The latest report of the Afghani-UN Coordination and Monitoring Board (JCMB) on has warned that attacks in war-ravaged Afghanistan are killing four times more people this year.

Days after the 9/11 attacks, the US invaded Afghanistan to topple the Taliban regime and its ally al-Qaeda group.

Five years on, Afghan officials and right activists insist that the West's strategy has proved failure in putting the country on the "path of progress" as promised.

Bad Business
Business has collapsed in Kandahar after a wave of suicide attacks, bomb blasts and assassinations that have struck the Pashtun-majority city this year.

"Lots of people who returned after the fall of the Taliban have in the past months gone back to Pakistan because of the insecurity," said Shafik.

"It's not good for business."

Businessmen are hoping for a return to peace even if it is with those who are responsible for much of the insecurity, Taliban.

A town of more than 400,000, Kandahar is almost cut off from the rest of the world.

Civilian flights have been suspended and access through road checkpoints is a major risk.

Most of the development projects are crippling as the majority of foreign organizations closed or employing only Afghan staff.

Fearful of abductions and reprisals, Afghans try not to tell anyone where they work.

http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/S...News/NWELayout
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Erundur
12-04-2006, 05:22 PM
Their shooting themselves in the **** foot with such statements, they've obviously forgotten of the execution of innocent women, the raping of little boys, no education of women. Oh yeah, they sure do miss the hypocrasy.
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Ibn Abi Ahmed
12-04-2006, 08:49 PM
:sl:

Lol^ Nice to know your opinion. But the statements of those that actually lived under them is of more credibility, than one from someone thats sitting thousands of miles away and gets his information from CNN or Fox News.

"We didn't have problems with the Taliban."
"In the time of the Taliban, Shari`ah was applied in line with our culture and our traditions,"
"We did not see all these thefts, these kidnappings, these murders,"

That's self explanatory.
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Erundur
12-04-2006, 08:54 PM
Originally Posted by Ahmed.
:sl:

Lol^ Nice to know your opinion. But the statements of those that actually lived under them is of more credibility, than one from someone thats sitting thousands of miles away and gets his information from CNN or Fox News.

"We didn't have problems with the Taliban."
"In the time of the Taliban, Shari`ah was applied in line with our culture and our traditions,"
"We did not see all these thefts, these kidnappings, these murders,"

That's self explanatory.
Who says I didn't know them? :?

I suggest that you stay away from Mullahs who haven't been to Afghanistan.

"In the time of the Taliban, Shari`ah was applied in line with our culture and our traditions,"

Most of those talibs didn't know half the things they recited if they knew how to pray, please tell me is it okay in shariah to drag a body down the road while it has been tied behind the back of a vehicle while chanting "Allahu Akbar"?
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bint_muhammed
12-05-2006, 09:24 PM
is it better now that the taliban have gone?
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imaad_udeen
12-05-2006, 11:47 PM
The United States would like to live in the days when we didn't have to worry about religious zealots, trained in Afghanistan and commanded from Afghanistan, flying hijacked planes into our buildings, killing thousands of innocent people.

The Taliban brought this onto Afghanistan.
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IzakHalevas
12-06-2006, 12:21 AM
Originally Posted by imaad_udeen
The United States would like to live in the days when we didn't have to worry about religious zealots, trained in Afghanistan and commanded from Afghanistan, flying hijacked planes into our buildings, killing thousands of innocent people.

The Taliban brought this onto Afghanistan.
Excellent point. The Taliban may be seen as righteous people because of their strict devotion to Shariah law, but in reality did they really act in the way a Muslim is suppose to act, defined by the Quran?
The Taliban government has been severely criticised for not respecting the human rights of women. Women were prohibited from leaving their homes, unless they were completely covered; no part of their faces, hair or body was to be shown out in the public. Religious police patrols were forcing women to wear burqa of a specified length, and even minor deviations could result in public punishment, as women were beaten with thin sticks at the ankles for wearing burqas that were "too short". The education of women suffered too, and women were deprived even of elementary education.
In March 2001, the Taliban ordered the demolition of two statues of Buddha carved into cliffsides at Bamiyan, one 38 metres tall and about 1800 years old, the other 53 metres tall and about 1500 years old. If you were not aware, Buddhism actually has a long history in the region, and had a presence in Afghanistan way before Islam became the dominant religion.

Abusing women for very minor violations in their dress code, which in many Islamic countries is not required was actually a very common occurrence. As seen in these pictures, the "religious police" could become very brutal sometimes:

http://www.rawa.org/beating.htm

Another interesting part of the Taliban's rule is the lack of education in the country:

Taliban shuts more Afghan schools

BBC News, May 18, 2001

By Afghanistan correspondent Kate Clark

Six schools run by a Turkish Islamic group have been shut down in Afghanistan. In a country where the state education system is suffering from a chronic lack of resources, the Turkish schools were rare centres of educational excellence. The group said problems emerged when the Taleban demanded control of their finances. Some 2,000 pupils attended the six Turkish schools, which were free. They had a curriculum which was strong in science and languages as well as religion and they were well resourced.

Lack of resources
Almost uniquely in Afghanistan, each school had a laboratory and a library. A representative for the schools said they had been ready to accept many of the Taleban's demands - that teachers should grow long beards, for example, and pupils wear turbans - but he said they could not agree to hand over their budget to the Taleban. He said the Taleban had wanted all the Turkish teachers to leave the country, leaving just one official who would hand the budget over to the Taleban education ministry for it to distribute. The representatives said they were faced with no choice but to close the schools. The Taleban may try to keep them running using Afghan teachers. But without proper resources they are likely to deteriorate to the level of the rest of the state education system. Parents and teachers there complain that there is hardly any funding for salaries or books and that each year the curriculum becomes more and more weighed down by religious subjects.

Expense for poor
The Taleban has also ordered all students in private English and computer courses to wear turbans, the headdress that the Taleban says is an Islamic tradition. At the start of the year, they ordered all state sector pupils beyond grade three to wear turbans, a considerable expense for poorer families. Computer and English students in Kabul said the religious police had visited their classrooms, threatening to expel students and close down any school which defied the order.
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Keltoi
12-06-2006, 02:29 AM
If the Taliban was supposedly the Muslim ideal of Shariah Law what does that say about Muslims? I mean seriously. I know that many people base their opinions on things not based in reality many times, and I hope that those who prop up the Taliban as the ideal form of Islamic government are simply so misinformed they don't understand what they are saying.
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Muslim Knight
12-06-2006, 02:36 AM
Originally Posted by IzakHalevas
In March 2001, the Taliban ordered the demolition of two statues of Buddha carved into cliffsides at Bamiyan, one 38 metres tall and about 1800 years old, the other 53 metres tall and about 1500 years old. If you were not aware, Buddhism actually has a long history in the region, and had a presence in Afghanistan way before Islam became the dominant religion.
Just imagine the look on father Abraham's face when he realized you defended the idols that he took painstakingly to denounce and destroy, some with his own hands. You who claim to be strictly monotheistic worshipper of the God of Abraham.

And don't say it's the traditional heritage of the Afghans. Afghanistan is predominantly Muslim.
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Keltoi
12-06-2006, 02:42 AM
Originally Posted by Muslim Knight
Just imagine the look on father Abraham's face when he realized you defended the idols that he took painstakingly to denounce and destroy, some with his own hands. You who claim to be strictly monotheistic worshipper of the God of Abraham.

And don't say it's the traditional heritage of the Afghans. Afghanistan is predominantly Muslim.
What if the Jews had destroyed the Al-Aqsa Mosque in Jerusalem after the 1967 war? As the site of the Temple Mount that could have been justified. This isn't about what you CAN do, this is about basic respect for another religion.
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IzakHalevas
12-06-2006, 02:44 AM
Just imagine the look on father Abraham's face when he realized you defended the idols that he took painstakingly to denounce and destroy, some with his own hands. You who claim to be strictly monotheistic worshipper of the God of Abraham.
Oh, very interesting opinion you have. Now can you tell me what my monotheistic beliefs, and the preservation of an interesting historical statue have anything to do with eachother?

Or are you under the opinion that it is the duty of a every monotheistic believer to destroy every single item that could be worshiped as an idol?

What if the Jews had destroyed the Al-Aqsa Mosque in Jerusalem after the 1967 war? As the site of the Temple Mount that could have been justified. This isn't about what you CAN do, this is about basic respect for another religion.
Valid point. I guess that level of respect for others beliefs can only be found in some cultures.

I'm sure Muslim Knight, would love to run around England and burn down Hindu places of worship, but I would have to decline on that offer.
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Muslim Knight
12-06-2006, 02:57 AM
Originally Posted by IzakHalevas
Valid point. I guess that level of respect for others beliefs can only be found in some cultures.

I'm sure Muslim Knight, would love to run around England and burn down Hindu places of worship, but I would have to decline on that offer.
We were talking about Afghanistan! A country that is predominantly Muslim! Can you tell me how many Buddhists left in that country to be able to make use of the statues? I've never said anything about running England down to burn Hindus' places of worship!
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IzakHalevas
12-06-2006, 02:59 AM
Originally Posted by Muslim Knight
We were talking about Afghanistan! A country that is predominantly Muslim! Can you tell me how many Buddhists left in that country to be able to make use of the statues? I've never said anything about running England down to burn Hindus' places of worship!
Your speaking about idol worshipers. Hindu's are idol worshipers as well. In reality, the idols Hindu's worship are much more of an abomination in G-d's eyes then the Buddha statue which I believe should have been preserved because it was so old and showed a glimpse of the past.

If every religious dominated country attempted to remove all traces of another religions past in the country, then we would have very little history to view and see in museums, where this statue belonged.
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imaad_udeen
12-06-2006, 04:04 PM
Originally Posted by IzakHalevas
Your speaking about idol worshipers. Hindu's are idol worshipers as well. In reality, the idols Hindu's worship are much more of an abomination in G-d's eyes then the Buddha statue which I believe should have been preserved because it was so old and showed a glimpse of the past.

If every religious dominated country attempted to remove all traces of another religions past in the country, then we would have very little history to view and see in museums, where this statue belonged.
It was way too big for a museum. It was fine as it was before the Taliban destroyed it.
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Erundur
12-07-2006, 04:29 PM
Originally Posted by Muslim Knight
We were talking about Afghanistan! A country that is predominantly Muslim! Can you tell me how many Buddhists left in that country to be able to make use of the statues? I've never said anything about running England down to burn Hindus' places of worship!
there are about 1% Hindus in the north of Afghanistan and quite possibly some buddhists as well since Afghanistant does connect to china.

As in regards to the buddist statues before the spread of Islam to Afghanistan, the country was mainly Zoroastrian, Buddist and Hindus.

btw. Excellent point about women and education IzakHavelas.
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Erundur
12-07-2006, 04:32 PM
Originally Posted by ya_Giney
is it better now that the taliban have gone?
For the most part it has gotten better, you can actually walk down the street and have a conversation without the Talibs coming up to and acting all tough. Projects on fixing the infrastructure continues and Rights of Women and Children getting education has increased. But there are a lot of things that stilll needs to be dealt with/fixed.
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Agnostic
12-07-2006, 08:05 PM
Originally Posted by Erundur
For the most part it has gotten better, you can actually walk down the street and have a conversation without the Talibs coming up to and acting all tough. Projects on fixing the infrastructure continues and Rights of Women and Children getting education has increased. But there are a lot of things that stilll needs to be dealt with/fixed.
I'm glad that things are better there but I still think they have a long way to go yet now that the Taliban seemed to have resurfaced in some areas.
Here is an article I read the other day it makes me sad that children have to fear for there lifes to be educated

http://www.latimes.com/news/la-fg-sc...ck=1&cset=true
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Keltoi
12-07-2006, 08:38 PM
I had hoped that the U.S. could give attention to Afghanistan and Iraq at the same times, but unfortunately Iraq has become the focus. The U.S. military in Afghanistan is doing some good work, but they don't have the manpower or the backing to do what really needs to be done there. Yes, they can kill hundreds of enemy fighters, but who is going to protect the people of Afghanistan and give them the bravery they need to stand up to terrorism and extremism. Hopefully more attention will be placed in Afghanistan, where it should have remained in the first place.
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Erundur
12-07-2006, 08:52 PM
More attention needs to be placed in the border region between Afghanistan and Pakistan.
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Woodrow
12-07-2006, 08:59 PM
Originally Posted by Erundur
More attention needs to be placed in the border region between Afghanistan and Pakistan.
That is a tremendous job. That is one of the most rugged and impassable regions on earth. It would take a huge army of foot soldiers to secure it and I do not know of any country with sufficient manpower to take on the task.
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