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Dawud_uk
01-24-2007, 02:24 PM
Assalaamu Alaykum,

It saddens me that many have chosen to slander the noble students of knowledge, the taliban with vile allegations of being outside Ahlus sunnah wal jammat, others have even called them mushriks in the past.

To counter such allegations i would like them to be listed here so they can be rebutted and that those who make such allegations can read previous discussions on this topic so that they do not just repeat old lies and mistakes without seeing if they are correct for themselves.

I admit i have never been to afghanistan, but several ulema and students of knowledge i have spoken to have done so and travelled there during the rule of amir al mumineen - Mullah Mohammed Omar and from those conversations i have nothing but love for

Now those who wish to slander the taliban do so here, and i will insha'allah with the help of others show you that you are in error or if you believe me correct you can show me the error of my ways.

Assalaamu Alaykum,
Abu Abdullah
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FollowingAlhuda
01-24-2007, 02:34 PM
Salamo Aleikom,

This is an earlier post of mine in another topic.
__________________________________________________ _________
This is an Arabic audio from Sheikh Fawzaan about the situation in Afghanistan.

http://www.spubs.com/sps/sad/mp3.cfm?scn=dl&LeID=4

and this is an article read it insha Allah:
__________________

Shaykh Saalih as-Suhaymee speaks about current affairs...



After praising and thanking Allaah and sending prayers and peace upon the Messenger, Shaykh Saalih as-Suhaymee said:



The correct and upright Islam is a religion which has finalised all other religions (i.e. is the seal of all other religions) and it is a complete religion for all affairs of life. Allaah has decreed happiness and success for the one who abides by and applies it, in this life and next.



{Thus We have made you [true Muslims - real believers of Islamic Monotheism, true followers of Prophet Muhammad and his Sunnah (legal ways)], a Wasat (just and balanced) nation, that you be witnesses over mankind and the Messenger (Muhammad) be a witness over you}, [Soorah al-Baqarah, Aayah 143]



Hence, Islam is a balanced and moderate way, and it does not enter into negligence on the one hand and nor exaggeration or extremism on the other. It is balanced in between and the Muslim nation is also balanced and upon a middle course.



Thus, Islam is balanced in everything, in its creed, in its worship, and it is far removed from both shortcoming and exaggeration. Likewise, in its economy it is also balanced in between those who wish to confiscate money by every right and between those who wish excessive liberalism and encourage it to be given in abundance (above and beyond what is appropriate). In addition, Islam encourages equity and justice amidst both Muslims and non-Muslims.



{Verily, Allaah enjoins al-'Adl (i.e. justice) and al-Ihsaan (good conduct), and giving (help) to kith and kin: and forbids al-Fahshaa. (i.e all evil deeds, e.g. illegal sexual acts, disobedience of parents, polytheism, to tell lies, to give false witness, to kill a life without right, etc.), and al-Munkar (i.e all that is prohibited by Islamic law), and al-Baghy (i.e. all kinds of oppression), He admonishes you, that you may take heed}, [Soorah an-Nahl, Aayah 90]



Further, Allaah has also prohibited oppression for himself, and has likewise prohibited His servants from oppression, [saying, as quoted by the Messenger (sal-Allaahu `alayhe wa sallam) in the Hadeeth Qudsee]:



«O My servants, I have forbidden oppression for Myself and have made it forbidden amongst you, so do not oppress one another», [Reported in Saheeh Muslim from Abu Dharr al-Ghifaaree]



He has also forbidden transgression and aggression and enmity and harm against others, whatever form this may take. He has also ordered the fulfilment of agreements and obligations and has also forbade the killing of those non-Muslims which Muslim countries have agreements with. The Prophet (sal-Allaahu `alayhe wa sallam) said:



«Allaah has forbidden the smell of Paradise for the one who kills a Mu'aahid (one with whom there is a pact or agreement»).



And He also forbade the Mujahideen from killing women, children, the elderly, and the ascetics who are devoted to worship, as well as forbidding the cutting down of trees and so on – despite the fact that the associates of these categories of people may be involved in fighting with the Muslims.



Based upon what has preceded, then we say that that which we believe and hold as our religion concerning what happened to the World Trade Centre in America – and in Allaah lies success – that the terrorist attacks that took place and what occurred of general (mass) killing, then it is not permissible and Islam does not allow it in any form whatsoever. Islam frees itself from this action, regardless of whether those responsible for it were Muslims or non-Muslims. And none of the scholars who are upon the correct form of Islam, affirm the likes of these actions. The likes of these actions, in any place or time, which happen here and there, were never known in Islam, ever. In fact, never since Allaah sent the Prophet (sal-Allaahu `alayhe wa sallam) till this time of ours. These actions were never known amongst Islam and the Muslims – assassination of innocent people and bombings and widespread murder.



So Islam does not allow them and nor do Muslims perform them, and the true followers of Islam – which is balanced and moderate – then they free themselves from these actions and from those who performed them, regardless of whether they were Muslims or non-Muslims. This is oppression and Islam forbids it.



In this Centre there were none but innocent non-Muslims and Muslims, from all the various parts of the world, of different races. They had material possessions and assets in these buildings, and so all of this is impermissible and this is oppression upon both Muslims and non-Muslims. Even if people (who were responsible) claim that they had valid reasons for perpetrating this, then this is not the correct way.



It is obligatory upon the Muslims in this country and elsewhere and upon the students of knowledge to explain that this action is free from Islam, and that Islam is free from these actions. I request them to make clear this issue, with certainty and to be truthful when they explain this issue, without compromising the religion of Islam, and without giving a bad impression of Islam.



And we say, to whomever has justice and fairness amongst the non-Muslims, that they should reflect upon this matter, and not take it out on innocent Muslims and Arabs, for there are millions of them in the United States. They should also not take anything from the media without question. It is desirable for the American people to understand that Islam does not support these affairs, and that they should not use the media in order to ascribe these actions to Islam. And the Muslims in those areas should participate in explaining that these affairs are not from Islam.



In ending, I hope from the students of knowledge specifically and the Muslims generally that they return to the scholars in the likes of these affairs, and that they should return to the Muftee of our country, and to what they have explained of the freedom of Islam from the likes of these affairs. It is obligatory upon the world to listen to the word of the Muslims, and to the correct Islam, just like it is upon the students of knowledge in the West that they strive to explain the correct Islam, balanced between neglect and exaggeration – the Islam that calls to justice and which calls for the removal of oppression.



May Allaah guide us to what He loves and is pleased with. Prayers and peace upon the Prophet, his family and companions.



Question: What is your ruling or view on the Taliban?



Response: They are a mixture of Soofiyyah and other things, but they are still Muslims, most of them in that land are Muslims. And we do not say that just because of that it is permissible to raise a war against them. But most of them are not upon the correct 'aqeedah and the correct form of Islam. And what is amazing is that some people want to help Islam but by not having the correct 'aqeedah they do more harm to Islam. But we still do not say that they are Kuffaar. Because Afghanistan is a Muslim country overwhelmingly. As for what is happening now of aggression against Afghanistan, we hold it is not from wisdom and it is not correct to do this. Since there is no proof at all. Even some of the so called hijackers, some of them have actually been dead for a number of years [and others alive]. So there is no clarity yet at all.



And the Afghanis, they used to fight each other for power and other affairs. But now they must unite together and come together and they should unite upon the word of Tawheed and purify themselves. As for what happened on 11th September then that does not justify in any way, making conquests in the lands of the Muslims.
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Skillganon
01-24-2007, 02:34 PM
Here is my first question:

It is ok to side with the desbelievers, hunt down & kill talibans (or anyone who resist)and set up a state that is Kuffar itself, because the Taliban is oppressors, the women are oppressed by the Hijab, they don't let women to go to school, e.t.c?
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Dawud_uk
01-24-2007, 02:34 PM
A Witness To the Taliban Endeavour



An Interview with Shaykh Ghulaamullaah Rahmatee
(Former Deputy of Shaykh Jameel ur-Rahmaan, May Allaah have mercy upon him)

This interview was published in al-Bayaan Magazine in Arabic, no. 170, 22nd Shawwaal, 1422/January, 2002

Al-Bayaan: Welcome, Shaykh; We ask Allaah to bless you in your life and deeds and to benefit Islam and the Muslims with your knowledge. We would like you to start, Shaykh, by introducing yourself to our readers.

Shaykh Ghulaamullaah: In the name of Allaah, the Beneficent, the Most Merciful. All Praise is for Allaah, and that is sufficient; and may Allaah grant blessings and peace to His chosen servants.
My dear brethren, my name is Ghulaamullaah Rahmatee, from Afghanistan, from the province of Qunduz. I was a graduate of Deobandi madrasahs, then, by the mercy of Allaah, I happened to read books on tawheed and the books of Ahlus-Sunnah, such as the books of Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyyah, Shaykh Ibn al-Qayyim and Shaykh Muhammad ibn 'Abdul-Wahhaab an-Najdee. I adopted the beliefs of Ahlus-Sunnah wal-Jamaa'ah and learned the categories of tawheed and their opposites of the categories of shirk. After arriving at knowledge of the true belief, Allaah enabled me to explain it in Afghanistan, in the province of Qunduz. I was sentenced to ten years in prison for doing so during the reign of Zaher Shah, on charges of being a ******* who denied the Sufi tareeqahs and did not stick to one of the four math-habs in fiqh issues. I had had a madrasah there, in which I used to teach.
After being released from prison, I emigrated to Pakistan, to the city of Quetta. There was a brother by the name of Shamsuddeen who was a salafee, and he had founded a madrasah called al-Jaami'ah al-Athariyyah. He had studied with me in Afghanistan. When he heard of my arrival in Pakistan, he sent me an invitation to teach in his madrasah, so I proceeded to Peshawar and taught in al-Jaami'ah al-Athariyyah for a number of years. I founded a newspaper there called "The Muslims in Afghanistan," in which we publicized religious issues related to belief, practice and ethics. Then the Society for Calling to the Qur'aan and Sunnah (Jamaa'ah ad-Da'wah ilal-Qur'aan was-Sunnah) was founded, whereupon I became a member of it, and I was a deputy to Shaykh Jameel ur-Rahmaan (may Allaah have mercy upon him) throughout his life until he was killed. We ask Allaah to accept him as one of the martyrs.
After the killing of Shaykh Jameel ur-Rahmaan, our Shaykh, Samee'ullaah Najeebee (may Allaah protect and preserve him) became the leader of the Society for Calling to the Qur'aan and Sunnah. I was with him until the Russians withdrew. After the Russian withdrawal some things happened that caused me to leave Jamaa'ah ad-Da'wah, for political reasons, not due to a difference in basic outlook. After that I founded a madrasah in Peshawar by the name of Daar al-Qur'aan wal-Hadeeth as-Salafiyyah. It has been running ever since that time, al-hamdu lillaah, and I continue to teach there from the books of hadeeth, belief, etiquette and other subjects.

Al-Bayaan: You mentioned that you had a close relationship with Shaykh Jameel ur-Rahmaan (may Allaah have mercy upon him). What was the background of that relationship?

Shaykh Ghulaamullaah: While I was imprisoned in Qunduz and other provinces on charges of corrupting [people's] 'aqeedah and threatening security, they would transfer me from the prisons of one province to another, because they considered me a corrupting influence on my fellow prisoners. During the final part of Daawood's reign I heard from some of the brothers that there was a man who concentrated on tawheed al-uloohiyyah [Allaah's exclusive right to be worshipped], who refuted the beliefs of grave worshippers, and he lived in the province of Kunar. I heard about him but didn't see him. After I emigrated to Pakistan, I asked about him and was told that he was a commander in Hizbi Islami, under the leadership of Hikmatyar. From that time a line of communication was established between me and him, and I knew that he was indeed the same man I had heard about, and I found out that the shaykh had been a student of a Pakistani shaykh by the name of Muhammad Thaher, who was a Hanafee and a Maatureedee and a Naqshbandee and who called himself a Deobandee. Be that as it may, he placed a great emphasis on tawheed al-uloohiyyah, and Shaykh Jameelur-Rahmaan was influenced by him. However, Shaykh Jameelur-Rahmaan was extraordinarily intelligent and arrived at independent judgment and read the books of the two Shaykhs of Islam and the books of Ahlus-Sunnah, which changed him, and he became salafee [in his outlook].
When we met in Peshawar, I told him, "You won't be able to stay with these organizations forever. You need to set up an organization especially for the salafees." He did not agree in the beginning, but he did agree when Hikmatyar's Hizbi Islami removed him from the command of Kunar. I took that opportunity to tell him, "We must establish our organization." We reached an agreement there, and we founded Jamaa'ah ad-Da'wah.

Al-Bayaan: You mentioned that you emigrated to Pakistan and that you did not participate in the activities of the various Islamic organizations. How would you evaluate the performance of those organizations in the period that followed the Russian withdrawal, starting from the short-lived regime of Sibghatullaah Mujaddidi?

Shaykh Ghulaamullaah: After the murder of Shaykh Jameelur-Rahmaan (May Allaah have mercy upon him) the key members of the Shooraa of Jamaa'ah ad-Da'wah agreed to make Shaykh Samee'ullaah his successor. During the period of Shaykh Samee'ullaah's leadership, the Russians withdrew from Afghanistan. The leaders of the jihad organizations met in Islamabad, Pakistan, where they agreed that there had to be an alternative government to the communist government in Afghanistan. They also agreed that Shaykh Sibghatullaah Mujaddidi would be president for a period of two months and after that the leader of that temporary government would be Shaykh Rabbani. On that basis, Sibghatullaah Mujaddidi took the president's seat and became leader of the republic. However he was unable to do anything, because he had no power, and his organization was the smallest of all the organizations. The real power during his reign was with Mas'ood and Dostum. An indication of his lack of power is that when he became president he went to see Dostum rather than Dostum coming to see him, and he announced in his presence in Mazar Sharif that Dostum was the Khaalid ibn Waleed of this age.
During this period, the Shooraa council of Jamaa'ah ad-Da'wah decided to join that government so that the Jamaa'ah would not remain isolated in Pakistan and end up having no role in the future government of Afghanistan. However, I disagreed with that opinion, for Sibghatullaah was a Soofee who [believed in and preached] fantastic drivel and wrote books preaching clear, unadulterated shirk [assigning partners to Allaah]. An example of that is a small book he wrote called "Matn Bayaaniyyah Sibghatullaah Mujaddidee," in which he wrote that the world had four corners and that in each corner there was a friend of Allaah (waliyullaah) called the Qutb or the Badl, and that those four Qutbs had a free hand in running the affairs of the creation. I had called Sibghatullaah Mujaddidi by telephone while Shaykh Jameelur-Rahmaan was still alive and I told him, "I was informed that you wrote a book by that name; is that true?" He replied, "Yes. Would you like a copy?" I said, "I don't want it, for a copy has already reached me. But I would like to discuss the book with you, for I have some comments on it." He asked me my name, and I told him that I was Ghulaamullaah from Qunduz. He knew me by name, and he laughed and said, "Ah! I know you. You are the big ******* who spoiled the 'aqeedah of the Muslims in Afghanistan, and now you want to ruin the 'aqeedah of the refugees in the camps in Pakistan." He hung up without further comment.

Al-Bayaan: What is your view about the period in which Rabbani was in power?

Shaykh Ghulaamullaah: Rabbani took power for a period [that was supposed to last] six months after Sibghatullaah Mujaddidii's allotted period expired. However, he never had power even in Kabul. He was not able to leave Kabul to go to any other city due to the fighting between the various factions. Kabul itself was divided between various organizations of the communists and the Shee'ah, and they had considerable power there. Another area was under Hikmatyar's domination. As a result, Rabbani was unable to move from one area of Kabul to another, although he was, in name, the president of the country. Nothing happened during his reign worth mentioning that you could say, "He did such-and-such." The only thing that happened was infighting between him and Hikmatyar's party, as a result of which more than 50,000 Muslims were killed. There was also fighting between the party of 'Abd Rabbir-Rasool Sayyaaf and the Shee'ah, in which a lot of them were killed. There was also infighting between the factions of Rabbani and Dostum. The relationship between Rabbani and Dostum took a number of turns. At one point Rabbani named Dostum as his deputy in his absence during his trip to Egypt. During that period he would receive him with unparalleled deference and esteem, and he would call him the great general and the great conqueror, because he had conquered Kabul. After that Rabbani's party had a falling out with Dostum, and Rabbani announced that Dostum was a communist, atheist kaafir, and that it was obligatory to fight and kill him. That is all that took place in Rabbani's reign, nothing else.

Al-Bayyaan: What you have mentioned has to do with political matters and the complexities of political differences, but what about the state of Afghan society itself? Did any changes take place in it under Rabbani's reign, whether in the original six-month period or in the four years during which his reign was extended?

Shaykh Ghulaamullaah: During Rabbani's era, corruption, immorality, oppression, killing and transgression reached a pinnacle, to the point that it couldn't have gotten any worse. Things happened in his era that should make one cry, but Rabbani didn't have the power to stop it. I mean, every commander dealt with him as if he had no authority, and no one had a right to ask any commander about what he had done. There was no security, and no ordinary man could go from one village to another without fearing for his life or an attack on his property or honor.
During that period, Shaykh Samee'ullaah went to Rabbani and spoke to him, and Rabbani promised to give him a cabinet post. He ended up giving him the ministry of martyrs and the handicapped. Shaykh Samee'ullaah said to me, "We have to go to Kabul to operate the ministry." I told him, "If the Shaykh [Rabbani] were sincere toward you and the salafee methodology, he would have given you the ministry of education. What are you going to do with the ministry of martyrs and the handicapped? It seems [to me] that it would be better for you to maintain good relations with charitable individuals outside the country, from whom you can collect donations. For myself, I don't want to participate in this ministry." During Rabbani's era, there was no administrative apparatus, no organization, no committee and no ministry for us to work with to enjoin good and forbid evil.

Al-Bayyaan: If we were to look past what actually took place and discuss any public declarations of an intention to reform and improve, were there any projects proposed for a step-by-step reform process with the intention of implementing the Sharee'ah?

Shaykh Ghulaamullaah: No, no, there was no ability to do even that, because Rabbani, on some occasions was not even able to venture out of his own house. He wasn't able to protect himself, let alone implement the Sharee'ah. For example, shrines and mausoleums were being visited and worshipped with all forms of worship, and he did nothing about that at all. Also, women dressed in revealing ways, worse than the revealing fashions of the first period of pre-Islamic Ignorance, and he did nothing about it. And oppression had reached a pinnacle; no one's person was safe; no one's property was safe; no one's honor was safe; there was no security of any kind, and he did nothing about it. He had no ability to do so. Highway robbers were everywhere. The state had no constitution and no law to refer to, and the Sharee'ah was not implemented at all. In fact, when Hikmatyar became prime minister, I personally heard Hikmatyar on the radio announce that the cinemas must be closed and corruption must be prohibited. Many people were happy that Hikmatyar was going to do something positive. He had also prohibited women from dressing in revealing ways. However, the next day Mas'ood, who was the actual ruler, personally announced that what Hikmatyar had announced on the radio the previous day represented his personal opinion and did not represent government policy. That was the state of affairs with Rabbani. He did nothing for me to mention. In shaa Allaah, I am not some one who had any personal enmity with Rabbani; in fact Rabbani was closer to Ahlus-Sunnah than the leaders of any of the other organizations, for he had previously announced that he wanted to implement the Qur'aan and the Sunnah without being bound to a particular math-hab. However, after becoming the ruler, he didn't do anything. Anyone allied with him became a virtual saint [in his eyes], while anyone who opposed him became an enemy whose blood became lawful and who must be killed.

Al-Bayyaan: Some people say that Rabbani's regime was the lawful regime according to the Sharee'ah and that it was unlawful to rebel against it.

Shaykh Ghulaamullaah: No one with the least knowledge could say that that regime was a lawful regime according to the Sharee'ah. How was it a lawful regime according to the Sharee'ah when it was only empowered to last for two months or six months? That was the first matter in which it opposed the Sharee'ah.

Al-Bayyaan: But that six months was supposed to be temporary until elections were held.

Shaykh Ghulaamullaah: Yes, but he extended his own term in office unilaterally and then held onto power by force after that. Fighting broke out because of that, because he didn't give up power after six months and said, "I am the lawful ruler, and I will not leave the government." Therefore his regime lacked the attribute of a lawful government. Also, a government has to have authority and power, and he didn't have that. Also, a government is supposed to establish and enforce laws and legal punishments, and he wasn't able to do that. In fact, everyone who had occupied positions under Najeebullaah's government continued to work in the government offices during his reign. [Rabbani's] government was a government in name only.

Al-Bayyaan: Can we say that these deteriorated conditions that had become widespread during Rabbani's reign were an immediate cause for the emergence of the Taliban movement?

Shaykh Ghulaamullaah: Yes, that's what I'm saying. I can also say that Rabbani's government gave birth, so to speak, to the Taliban movement, because it arose in response to the conditions that called for a movement to confront the corruption and chaos and to rein in the manifestations of chaos. I have already told you what kind of conditions prevailed in the country during Rabbani's reign. Chaos and corruption were prevalent in everything.
I'll mention to you one of the immediate causes for the rise of the Taliban movement. Muhammad Omar was a student of knowledge, but he didn't have much knowledge. Before that he had participated in jihad with one of the jihad organizations. After the Russians pulled out, he left all that, thinking that now there was a government made up of Mujaahideen, and there was no further need for jihad after the Russians left, so he returned to studying knowledge in Pakistan. One day a relative of his from Afghanistan came to him in his masjid, weeping. Muhammad Omar asked him, "Why are you crying? Did one of your relatives die?" He told him, "No. Death would be less serious, even if all of us died. What makes me cry is worse than death." The man was from Ruzgan, one of the central provinces of Afghanistan. He began to relate his story to Muhammad Omar.
His wife had gotten sick, and he decided to bring her to Pakistan for treatment. He took her by car. On the way, every warlord had an area that he commanded, and every one of them imposed "taxes" on the people and "tolls" on anyone passing through their area. Every time the man would pass from one zone to another he was stopped at a checkpoint, and at each checkpoint some of his money was taken in "tolls". Finally he reached a checkpoint, and the warlord stopped him and demanded money. He said, "I don't have anything left. It's all been taken at the previous checkpoints, and my wife is sick, and I need to take her to Pakistan for treatment." The warlord said, "In that case, leave her with me, and I'll see she gets treatment." He asked, "Do you have a clinic here?" He replied, "No, just leave her with me for three nights, and when you come back, you'll find her perfectly healthy." He became certain that the man intended evil, and they started fighting. The warlord's men came and beat the man half to death. They actually thought they had killed him and threw him into a room and took the woman. The man came to in the dark of night, crept out of there and made his escape, until he reached Mullah Omar and related his story to him. Mullah Omar told him, "All right. Stay here. After six days I will return to Afghanistan, to Qandahar, and consult some brothers there, then I will get back with you. What you have told me represents an overthrow of Islam."
So Mullah Omar went and gathered his companions with whom he had made jihad against the Russians. There were around 17 of them, and they continued with him after that and were ministers in his government. He gathered them, told them what the man had related to him, and said, "We made jihad those long years. Is the fruit of our jihad going to be that we hear about oppression and depravity? I think what is required of us now is that we act on the basis of what we have learned. This is not the time to increase our knowledge, rather it is time to implement what we know." They all agreed that it was necessary to return to jihad. They stood up, got their weapons and attacked the checkpoint where the warlord had abducted the woman. They killed some of them, captured some, and some of them fled, and they killed that warlord who had done that odious act. When they killed him there were about 500 fighters along with him, and they all joined the Taliban. They told them that their commander had been a corrupt dissolute and that they had not been able to oppose him, because he would kill anyone who did so. [They said,] "You have done well, and we are with you."
Those religious students then decided to go after another of the commanders that was known to be corrupt, but he heard the news and ran away. However, many of his soldiers joined the Taliban. When they returned to Qandahar, it came under their authority without a fight. Then they gained control of Helmand province. At that time political relations between Afghanistan and Pakistan were not good, for Mas'ood's policy was diametrically opposed to the Pakistani government, and his orientation was more toward the Russians than to any Islamic country, and he was also well respected by the French. There were French advisors working with him. The Pakistani government was afraid that Rabbani's government would continue and that it would persist in its orientation toward the Russians. Russia cooperated closely with India, and India was Pakistan's enemy. That was detrimental to Pakistan's strategic interests, so when the Pakistani government heard about Mullah Omar's movement, they contacted him and offered him aid.
Mullah Omar continued to bring more and more provinces under his control. When he reached Hikmatyar's province, Hikmatyar was locked in fierce fighting with Rabbani, so Rabbani, Mas'ood and Sayyaaf seized the opportunity to contact Mullah Omar. They sat down with the Taliban's leadership, welcomed them and told them, "You all are qualified and have the best right to rule Afghanistan, for you have accomplished many things."
We observed that whenever the Taliban gained control of an area they would set up a committee to enjoin good and forbid evil. Then they would enforce the legal penalties for crimes set by the Sharee'ah (the hudood), so the security situation quickly stabilized. I can say that the security they established, if it was not greater than the security established by other states, it was not less than that. So everyone was happy about that after having suffered from chaos and fighting. So Rabbani came, according to what I heard, and reached an agreement with them that if they overpowered the evildoers and corrupters and reached Kabul, Rabbani would step down and hand over power to them. Mas'ood and Sayyaf then began helping the Taliban with weapons and money, but their intent in doing so was simply to get rid of Hikmatyar. After the Taliban took control of Hikmatyar's province with minimal fighting, Hikmatyar fled to Laghmaan province and ordered his troops to withdraw along with him, but many of his soldiers went over to the Taliban. Then the combined forces headed for Kabul. They requested Rabbani before entering it to do what he had promised. He responded, "Are you crazy? You are students of religious schools and you want to take over the government? I am the legal head of state recognized by the leaders and heads of state inside the country and outside of it. What you need to do now is go back to your madrasahs and leave the ruling to us." When they heard that reply, fighting broke out between them and Rabbani. During that period they killed the commander of the Shee'ah forces, 'Alee Mazaaree, who controlled the largest armed forces after Hikmatyar. Fighting occurred in Kabul between the Taliban and the Shee'ah militia and between the Taliban and Sayyaaf, and between the Taliban and Mas'ood and Rabbani, without a conclusive result. Then Rabbani turned to Hikmatyar a second time. He sent a delegation to him, saying, "We are both brothers, and the Taliban are our mutual enemy." He invited him to come to Kabul and appointed him prime minister. Then their mutual differences surfaced once more, because Hikmatyar announced the necessity of fighting corruption and immorality and of reducing the number of women employees in the government offices, and Mas'ood declared him mistaken. Fighting broke out once more with the Taliban, who gained control of Kabul and drove Rabbani and Hikmatyar out to the north. Shaykh Samee'ullaah then left Kabul [for Peshawar].

Al-Bayyaan: Did you observe the Taliban's behavior in the first days after their entry into Kabul?

Shaykh Ghulaamullaah: A few months after the Taliban took power, they ordered the closing of the shrines and mausoleums and said that such things are not permitted. You may have heard of one such shrine in Mazar Sharif. It is a mausoleum built on a grave that is supposed to be the grave of 'Alee [ibn Abee Taalib] (may Allaah be pleased with him). This grave is called the Sakhee in Afghanistan. By that they mean the one who gives whatever is asked to whoever asks. Men and women, the crippled and the blind would all come to that grave in the hope that the Sakhee would fulfill their needs. There was a custom in Afghanistan that persisted until before my birth that on the first day of spring (Nowrooz) in the reign of a new king they would have to raise a flag known as the flag of the shrine of the Sakhee. The wisdom behind doing so, according to them, was that if the flag was raised and stayed up without falling over, it was sign that the state would not collapse, and if it did fall over, it was sign that the state would soon collapse. A three-day holiday would be declared every year for the occasion of raising the flag, and during it people would come to that shrine in huge crowds, the like of which can not be seen except in Makkah during Hajj. When the Taliban came and the Festival of Raising the Flag drew near, they announced that this act is not in accord with the Sharee'ah and is not permissible, that it is, in fact, opposed to Islam and would not be done from that day onward. And no one would be permitted to come to the shrine during those three days, and those days would not be taken as a holiday, and if anyone stayed away from work on those three days, he would be fired from his job. They prohibited that [act of] shirk, and that is how they acted in Kabul, and that is how they acted in the rest of Afghanistan. There were graves everywhere that were visited and worshipped, but they only allowed graves to be visited between Thuhr and 'Asr on Thursdays, and only for visits in accord with the Sharee'ah. They announced that anyone who visited a grave in order to seek help from it or to increase his provision or to seek a cure for illness or to use the person in the grave as an intermediary with Allaah, all of that is unlawful, and the person doing it was liable to imprisonment, beating or execution, if he refused to repent. This happened after they came, after Rabbani's government.

Al-Bayyaan: Did you have any personal experience with any of this? Did you see any of this with your own eyes, or is it something you only heard about?

Shaykh Ghulaamullaah: Yes, I did have a personal experience. There is a shrine in Kabul known as Shaahid Shaamsheraa, which means: The Shrine Of The King With Two Swords. It was a very well known and famous shrine. They say that this king used to fight against the enemy with two swords. When the two swords were broken, he was killed, seeking martyrdom, and he was buried there. This shrine was worshipped with all forms of worship. I personally entered into it and saw the statements of shirk and slogans of kufr written on its walls and stones. Written on the tomb in Pushtu was the following slogan: "We have no refuge and no resort and none to turn to except you," and so on. At that time I had come to Kabul and spoken to Shaykh Rabbani while Shaykh Samee'ullaah was present. I said to him, "You all have announced an Islamic government and said that this is an Islamic republic, so why don't you put an end to the centers of shirk?" Rabbani laughed and said, "Shaykh, you want an automatic Islamic government. You have to be patient." I said, "There has to be, at the very least, a committee for enjoining good and forbidding evil, for these people are dying in a state of shirk, and there has to be someone present to prevent them from these acts of shirk." He laughed and said, "The Islamic government is not going to come about in an automatic form."
But what I saw when the Taliban came is that they put an end to all of that. They took out everything from those mausoleums, locked their doors and prohibited visits to the graves except for visits that were in accord with the Sharee'ah. I came to Kabul after the word was spread around Peshawar that they were agents of America. And before coming to Afghanistan, I too used to say, "Who are these Taliban?" I used to think that they were agents of America and agents of Pakistan, and it was said about them that they were also grave worshippers and a sect of Ash'arees and Maatureedees immersed in superstitions and fantastic beliefs. All of that was before I came to Afghanistan. When I came, I did so quietly, for I was afraid that those grave worshippers would kill me. I came quietly in a taxi, and the other passengers were a man and his wife and two small children, a boy and a girl. He had a sack with him, filled with a stuffing so that it looked like a pillow. When we arrived in Kabul the man put the sack down in front of a restaurant, then his son, daughter and wife got down. I also got down and took a room in a hotel, where I spent the night. In the morning I passed by that restaurant and noticed that the sack the man had placed was still in the same place. I said to myself, "Isn't that the same bag that the man left here yesterday?" I didn't pay it much mind and said, "Maybe it is another one." Two days later I passed by the same place and there it was, still. After three days I passed by again, and it was still there. I had intended to pass by the Shamsheraa Shrine, believing that the Taliban were grave worshippers. I said, "I'll see what additional manifestations of shirk they have introduced to the shrine." When I got there I found the door locked. I had four friends with me, all of them bearded students of knowledge. I knocked on the door. An old man came and opened it up, but he appeared sad and dispirited.

Al-Bayyaan:
Sorry, Shaykh, but you didn't finish telling what happened to the sack.

Shaykh Ghulaamullaah: I'll tell you the story; I haven't forgotten it; the different parts of the story are connected. When I entered the mausoleum I kept my shoes on, which is a forbidden practice [in such places], but we all entered with our shoes on, not caring, and the old man thought that we were Taliban, so he kept quiet. I entered the mausoleum and found no placards or signs or anything expressing shirk. I saw only one sign, which said, "I used to prohibit you from visiting the graves, but now visit them, for they remind one of the hereafter." And there was one other sign that said, "If anyone comes to this grave in order to take it as an intermediary with Allaah or seeking a cure from it or seeking help from it, the penalty for that is death." I was so happy and said, "By Allaah, this is what we were seeking for so long in the past." I stepped out to talk to the old caretaker. I asked him, "Where are the visitors and the old slogans and the boxes for donations in fulfillment of vows? Where did they all go?" The old man thought I was a grave worshipper saddened at what happened to the grave. He said, "Quiet! If those Taliban hear about you, they will kill you. They are ******* kaafirs who have prohibited all these things." I became intensely happy, then I advised him after that. When he understood that I was of the same opinion as the Taliban, he became downcast and said, "Yes, they say the same things you are saying." I left the mausoleum and went to the marketplace. I didn't see one woman improperly dressed. Before that the Kabul I knew was a place where improperly dressed women were everywhere. When the Taliban came they prohibited all that. They also prohibited women from working in all the government offices. When they first came they announced that any woman who had been working and receiving a salary would continue to receive her salary if she stayed at home and took care of some orphans. And I saw that they prohibited songs and immorality.
I stayed in Kabul for a week, and when I decided to leave it and return [home], I went to the taxi stop where the sack had been in front of the restaurant, but I didn't find it there. While waiting for the taxi I asked the restaurant owner, "There was a sack here for a number of days. Where did it go?" He told me, "Shaykh, that sack has an amazing story to it." I asked him what it was, and he said, "That sack belonged to a man who came here from Peshawar in Pakistan. His house was in Herat. When he got down in Kabul, he forgot the sack and went on. Last night he came back and got the sack. The mouth of the sack was tied tight with a string. When he opened it, it turned out that it was full of money." I joked with him, "Where were you all that time? Were you dead or sleeping?" He said, "Shaykh, the Taliban would have arrested me. No one would dare to try that, because the Taliban keep a watch from hidden places and see who will stretch his hand out to steal what doesn't belong to him, and they cut people's hands for that." That is also something I personally observed.
When I returned to Peshawar I gave a khutbah in which I said that the Taliban were far better than those who were before them. One of my colleagues heard about that and said to me, "O Shaykh! How did you give the khutbah?" I told him, "According to the Sunnah, with the essential constituents and the praiseworthy non-essential elements as well." He said, "That's not what I meant; rather, what did you say about the Taliban?" I said, "What you have seen." He responded, "How can you say that when they are mushriks?" I said, "By Allaah, that's amazing! How are they mushriks when I saw that they have prohibited the centers of shirk and put an end to manifestations of shirk, whereas Rabbani himself raised the flag of the shrine of Mazar Sharif for the Nowrooz festival during his regime?" I said to him, "So they have succeeded in putting an end to these centers of polytheism, which you all didn't do, and you used to say that the Islamic government will not come about automatically. But when they came to power they did it. So how are they mushriks?" Then I said, "By Allaah, a person needs two basic things in this life: security, in order to live in this world, and faith, in order to live in the hereafter. These Taliban, even if it is said that there is some flaw in their faith, by Allaah, they have brought security, and we hope and expect that they will bring the proper faith as well. As for you people, you brought neither security nor the proper faith." That's what I said, and these words spread among the Muhaajireen and the Mujaahideen.

Al-Bayyaan: Did you meet any members of the Taliban movement and hear their views?

Shaykh Ghulaamullaah: Yes, I went to Afghanistan another time, and I met some of the brothers there, and found them to be good in their belief and their deeds. For example, Muhammad Rabbani, who was the prime minister until his recent death (may Allaah have mercy upon him), I met him and heard from him amazing, wonderful speech. He wanted to bring Islamic government to Afghanistan 100%. Because of that they put an end to the outward manifestations of corruption and immorality as well as all the prominent manifestations of shirk. They started with that in Qandahar itself. There was a piece of cloth there that was attributed to the Prophet r. One of the kings, by the name of Ahmad Shah Abdaali, had brought it from Bukhara and placed it there. This piece of cloth was worshipped by every form of worship: with words, bodily acts and by donations of wealth. That piece of cloth was placed on a guarded rack, beneath which was an empty place. People would go down beneath it, make tawaaf around it, touch it and rub their hands over themselves for spiritual blessings. When the Taliban took power in Qandahar they removed that piece of cloth from there and told the people, "There is no evidence that this piece of cloth really did belong to the Prophet r, but since the possibility cannot be ruled out, we will preserve it. However, it is not lawful for you to make tawaaf around it, touch it for spiritual blessings or perform salaah toward it. They prohibited all that and guarded it in a safe place.
The point is that I met some of them and found them - O my brother, as far as I could tell - to be good people. By Allaah, I never pledged allegiance to the Taliban, nor did I work for them or with them, nor did any of them come to see me here, but I say the truth, because a Muslim is obligated to speak the truth without overshooting the mark and without falling short. People with regard to the Taliban tend to either exaggerate in their favor or against them. Some say they are all pure salafees, which is wrong, while others say they are all mushriks. This last statement is, by Allaah, a lie. Based on what I have seen of the Taliban from personal contact, they fall into three categories:
The first group, which is the majority, are Hanafees who studied in Deobandi madrasahs, and they place a great emphasis on tawheed al-uloohiyyah and ar-ruboobiyyah. Regarding Allaah's names and attributes, they are Ash'arees, but not fanatically so. I discussed certain issues regarding Allaah's names and attributes with some of them. I said to them, "How can you abandon the view of Ahlus-Sunnah wal-Jamaa'ah and the view of Aboo Haneefah in 'aqeedah, yet you say you follow Aboo Haneefah in the secondary matters? Did Aboo Haneefah make mistakes in the fundamentals of the religion that you have abandoned his 'aqeedah?" They would laugh and say, "That's how our teachers taught us." One of them said, "Imaam Ibn Hajr al-'Asqalaanee, wasn't he an Ash'aree?" I answered, "Yes." He asked, "Do you consider him to be a disbeliever?" I said, "No." He said, "And Imaam an-Nawawee, wasn't he also an Ash'aree? Do you consider him to be a disbeliever?" I said, "No." What I understood from them was that they were not fanatic about those issues, nor did they call to them, and they liked the salafee methodology.
The second group, by Allaah, are salafees. One of those I know from among them is 'Abdul-Wakeel Mutawakkil, the Taliban foreign minister. He is the son of Shaykh 'Abdul Ghaffaar, and that Shaykh was killed based on an accusation that he was a *******. The communist Afghan government killed him at the airport when he returned from Hajj, saying, "You have connections with the *******s." 'Abdul-Wakeel's family are salafees, and I have known them for forty years. And there are others beside. One of them, his name is 'Abdur-Raqeeb, a graduate of the Islamic University of Madeenah, his 'aqeedah is salafee. I know him personally. He was the minister of mining and industry, and there are many others like him.
The third group consists of Soofees; I don't care to name any of them, so as not to become a source of controversy and dispute, but this element is a minority. That is what I have seen of the Taliban and know about them, and this assessment and testimony are a part of my deen, by which I worship Allaah.

Al-Bayyaan: Could you shed some light on the term "Deobandi"?

Shaykh Ghulaamullaah: There is a place in India known as Deoband, which is the site of a major madrasah, founded by certain scholars who called it the Deoband Madrasah. Everyone who graduates from that madrasah is called a Deobandi. They are Hanafees, but there is a difference between them and the rest of the Hanafees. I mean, the rest of the Hanafees include the Brelvis [grave worshippers], and the Deobandis differ with them so drastically that they consider each other disbelievers. The Deobandis have a concern for tawheed al-uloohiyyah and they oppose grave worship. Most Deobandis are Maatureedees. That is the Deobandis in a nutshell. One of the graduates of Deoband is a Shaykh by the name of 'Abdul-Haqq. He has a madrasah in Peshawar called al-Madrasah al-Haqqaaniyyah, named after his [family] name. He was quite a learned scholar and taught all the major books of hadeeth. Most of the Taliban graduated from his school and schools like his. As for Mullah Omar, he is not a Deobandi nor a Hanafee, because he has a general, undetailed belief in all that Allaah's Messenger r brought from Allaah, the Blessed and Exalted. That is his belief and his 'aqeedah. However, if you asked him about issues in detail, he might not know the Ash'aree or the Maatureedee position. He used to say in his public pronouncements, "I want to establish the kind of government established by Muhammad, the Messenger of Allaah r in Madeenah, the city of purity; that is a government by the Qur'aan and the Sunnah." That's what he used to say. And he is not a scholar, but he acts according to the fatwaas of the scholars. He says, "The scholars give their fatwaas, and I implement what they decree." He is neither a Soofee nor a Deobandi, but he likes the salafee methodology, even if he doesn't know about all its details.

Al-Bayyaan: But do you think he is sincere in what he says and the positions he takes?

Shaykh Ghulaamullaah: By Allaah, my brother, he is a man of sincerity, worship and asceticism (zuhd). By Allaah, he is neither a relative of mine, nor is he related to me in any way, nor did he study with me, nor did I study with him, nor is he from my village, nor my province. He is from Ruzgan and I am from Qunduz. By Allaah, the first time I laid eyes on him, I thought to myself, "This is a Muslim who is living Islam and practicing zuhd. If his disinterest in the pleasures of this life and his fear of Allaah were distributed over a great number of people like me, it would suffice them." That is what I perceived about him. When I spoke to him, he always spoke about Allaah and supplicated him: "O Allaah…O Allaah…Allaah grant us victory…and there is no victory except from Allaah." He would keep repeating Qur'aanic aayahs such as this. And when he was faced with any difficulty, he would make a lot of salaah.

Al-Bayyaan: You have spoken to us about the positive aspects of the Taliban endeavor. How do you see the negative aspects in comparison to the positive?

Shaykh Ghulaamullaah: You know that there is no one in this era who is totally without negative points. Even in the early period of Islam, the society had its negative points. However, regarding the Taliban, their positive accomplishments and the improvements they brought are far greater and more numerous than their shortcomings. By Allaah, I have never heard of any king in Afghan history who implemented Sharee'ah as fully as the Taliban did. To stop women from dressing improperly in public is something that was practically impossible among the Afghans, especially in Kabul. No one was able to do it, but the Taliban did it, al-hamdu lillaah. And regarding the graves, by Allaah, what happened was a total change, because most Afghans are very ignorant. Maybe they will be excused because of their ignorance, but the fact remains that most of them know practically nothing [about Islam]. There is not one village in Afghanistan that does not have one grave or more that is worshipped instead of Allaah. But, al-hamdu lillaah, they were able to fight that during the period of their rule. You may have heard that when the Northern Alliance captured Mazar Sharif a journalist asked one of the caretakers of the shrine there, "How are things now? Are they better now or were they better during the reign of the Taliban?" He answered, "What are you saying, Brother? Do you know what's happened? Today is a day of celebration for us." The journalist asked, "How is that?" He said, "For many reasons. You see how we are able to enter the shrine. Those kaafirs prevented us from entering this shrine for five years. Now, al-hamdu lillaah, you see us, men and women, entering the shrine all together. Another reason is that you don't see anyone now preventing us from shaving our beards. In fact, people are lined up in crowds to have their beards shaved. Another reason: These oppressed women were imprisoned for the last five years."

Al-Bayyaan: Despite that, we can surely say that they made errors: political errors and errors in religious issues. They are not infallible. Nor do we say that they are 100% salafees.

Shaykh Ghulaamullaah: Even people who call themselves salafees and use that label for themselves have their negative points. We established a salafee organization in Kunar that had many good points, but it also had shortcomings. We had graves that were worshipped, and we were not able to get rid of the practice entirely. There was drug dealing going on amongst us, and we were not able to stop it. Some of the scholars among us smoke cigarettes. So you can't say that an Islamic government will be able to get rid of all negative practices. Perfection didn't occur even in the era of the Prophet r, so how are the Taliban going to achieve it at the end of the Twentieth Century CE?

Al-Bayyaan: The international media is promoting the idea that the Afghan people hated the Taliban rule and that it was imposed upon them against their will. One of the major leaders of the Northern Alliance characterized the Taliban rule as a nightmare for the Afghan people. What's your comment on that?

Shaykh Ghulaamullaah: This statement is correct from a certain angle, and incorrect from another angle. For example, those who were forced to leave their beards unshaved out of fear were not pleased with the Taliban, nor were women who liked to come out of their houses with their bodies exposed. Likewise, those accustomed to drinking alcohol and the communists did not support them. As for the average people, they loved the Taliban. The majority were pleased with them.
I'll tell you this: Mullah Omar gathered the people after three days of continual bombing and said to them, "O people! If you are tired of this bombing, [you should know that] it's going to increase in severity many times over what you have already seen. If you've had enough of it, I will turn myself over to that kaafir tyrant, Bush, so that you be spared this tribulation and bombing." The people responded with one voice, "No. By Allaah, as long as a single man of us remains, we will not abandon our resistance to America." That is the feeling of the people in general. And the opinion of the people of corruption, immorality and grave worship is of no consequence.

Al-Bayyaan: A criticism that some have made of the Taliban is that no one from the other ethnic groups besides the Pushtuns played any role in their government. What is your view on this issue?

Shaykh Ghulaamullaah: This claim is made by those who either don't know what is happening in Afghanistan and don't know anything about the Taliban or by those who are diehard opponents of the Taliban and simply want to defame them. The Taliban are composed of Muslims from all the ethnic groups in Afghanistan. Yes, the majority of them are Pushtuns, because Pushtuns make up 65% of the population of Afghanistan, so, naturally, there will be more Pushtuns [among them]. If they say that a majority of them are Pushtuns, that is correct, but if they say there is no one but Pushtuns among their leadership, that is an unadulterated lie.

Al-Bayyaan: People have been dismayed at the Taliban's continual retreats since they first pulled out of Mazar Sharif, then Kabul, then Herat and Qunduz and elsewhere. The international media interpret this as weakness, surrender and defeat. Is there another explanation beside the mainstream interpretation?

Shaykh Ghulaamullaah: There is no weakness in that, because no real fighting took place between them and the Northern Alliance so that it could be said they expelled them. They left based on their own decision, which left [the Northern Alliance] and America bewildered, wondering, "Where are the Taliban? Where have they hidden?" It is true that some of them were killed and injured, but some of their enemy were killed as well. However the Taliban no longer have any media to explain the reality. The media that are disseminating information now are all the enemies of the Taliban and enemies of the Muslims. There is one matter that is clear to both the enemies and the friends of the Taliban, that when you hear something from them, they don't lie, whereas their enemies lie.

Al-Bayyaan: We would like to thank Shaykh Ghulaamullaah for responding to our invitation to this discussion. And we ask Allaah to accept from him and from us our sincere deeds and truthful statements.
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IbnAbdulHakim
01-24-2007, 02:36 PM
every nation will have its mistakes but the taliban from what i have heard i can say are striving most to establish sunnah. therefore how can we not assume that there from ahlus sunnah. Didnt they break graveyard stones and idols etc even though certain muslims slandered them for doing so. I have respect for them, and i will do till i see very authentic and reasonable evidence that they are corrupt.

We dont look at the mistakes of a few, we look at the goal as a whole... the talibans goal is beautifuL!
Reply

Dawud_uk
01-24-2007, 02:38 PM
Question: What is your ruling or view on the Taliban?



Response: They are a mixture of Soofiyyah and other things, but they are still Muslims, most of them in that land are Muslims. And we do not say that just because of that it is permissible to raise a war against them. But most of them are not upon the correct 'aqeedah and the correct form of Islam. And what is amazing is that some people want to help Islam but by not having the correct 'aqeedah they do more harm to Islam. But we still do not say that they are Kuffaar. Because Afghanistan is a Muslim country overwhelmingly. As for what is happening now of aggression against Afghanistan, we hold it is not from wisdom and it is not correct to do this. Since there is no proof at all. Even some of the so called hijackers, some of them have actually been dead for a number of years [and others alive]. So there is no clarity yet at all.



And the Afghanis, they used to fight each other for power and other affairs. But now they must unite together and come together and they should unite upon the word of Tawheed and purify themselves. As for what happened on 11th September then that does not justify in any way, making conquests in the lands of the Muslims.
this is hearsay not daleel, he does not provide any proofs for his allegations and as such you still have to proove your allegation.

assalaamu alaykum,
Abu Abdullah
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Dawud_uk
01-24-2007, 02:41 PM
Originally Posted by Skillganon
Here is my first question:

It is ok to side with the desbelievers, hunt down & kill talibans (or anyone who resist)and set up a state that is Kuffar itself, because the Taliban is oppressors, the women are oppressed by the Hijab, they don't let women to go to school, e.t.c?
assalaamu alaykum,

here the rabid followers of the talafi scholars expose themselves to their own arguments even if such allegations against the noble taliban are true.

if they believe it is haram to rebel and attack their rulers in saudia even though they have committed clear kufr in taking the kuffar as their awliyah then how can they justify their attacks and support for such attacks against the taliban for allegations of fasq?

assalaamu alaykum,
Abu Abdullah
Reply

FollowingAlhuda
01-24-2007, 02:46 PM
Originally Posted by IbnAbdulHakim

We dont look at the mistakes of a few, we look at the goal as a whole... the talibans goal is beautifuL!
The goal may be beautifull, but the way had to be also beautifull...

Listen i dunno about their Aqeedah and Manhadj and if they are of Ahlu Sunnah...
I never really saw another side of the Taliban. But i will read that article brother Dawud posted, and respond insha Allah. And i don't know the sheikh of the article, so i will search about him to. It's gonna take a while though
I do not want to begin a discussion with someone, i avoid them... These kind of things are supposed to be figured out by the scholars.

May Allah clarify everything!

Wassalamo Aleikom
Reply

Dawud_uk
01-24-2007, 02:49 PM
Originally Posted by FollowingAlhuda
The goal may be beautifull, but the way had to be also beautifull...

Listen i dunno about their Aqeedah and Manhadj and if they are of Ahlu Sunnah...
I never really saw another side of the Taliban. But i will read that article brother Dawud posted, and respond insha Allah. And i don't know the sheikh or the article, so i will search about him to. It's gonna take a while though
I do not want to begin a discussion with someone, i avoid them... These kind of things are supposed to be figured out by the scholars.

May Allah clarify everything!

Wassalamo Aleikom
good points sister,

but you made the allegation it seems based upon this article but you are not the first to do that. nor even the first to qoute this article at me and say there you are, proof.

when is anything but, that is why i prefer to take from those who were there. as for those who were not, sure they're opinion is still good but it is only as valid as the proof they can bring and their reasoning on the matter.

assalaamu alaykum,
Abu Abdullah
Reply

IbnAbdulHakim
01-24-2007, 02:54 PM
a lot of brothers i know, throw a LOT of allegations at the taliban, allegation after alegation. Allegations which can be thrown at absolutely anyone. A sister forced, a brother beaten, this happens everywhere.

Im not going to go into the authenticity about these allegations, but why cant we see the main people involved, sheikh azzam etc... why are these people ignored? how many people know of the shaheeds of taliban?
Reply

FollowingAlhuda
01-24-2007, 03:03 PM
Originally Posted by Dawud_uk
good points sister,

but you made the allegation it seems based upon this article but you are not the first to do that. nor even the first to qoute this article at me and say there you are, proof.

when is anything but, that is why i prefer to take from those who were there. as for those who were not, sure they're opinion is still good but it is only as valid as the proof they can bring and their reasoning on the matter.

assalaamu alaykum,
Abu Abdullah

True,
But as for the scholar that went there, i never heard of that name. (Yeah i know that's my problem). So i will try to find out if there is a tazkiya or something else about this scholar Insha Allah.
Reply

FollowingAlhuda
01-24-2007, 03:05 PM
Originally Posted by IbnAbdulHakim
a lot of brothers i know, throw a LOT of allegations at the taliban, allegation after alegation. Allegations which can be thrown at absolutely anyone. A sister forced, a brother beaten, this happens everywhere.

Im not going to go into the authenticity about these allegations, but why cant we see the main people involved, sheikh azzam etc... why are these people ignored? how many people know of the shaheeds of taliban?

Yes i agree,
That's bcz i said i just know one side of the story and based my way of looking at the Taliban at that.

Well insha Allah it will be al clear
Reply

Dawud_uk
01-24-2007, 03:06 PM
Assalaamu alaykum,

here is an excellent article from Sheikh ash-Shu'aybi, before the extreme followers of Sheikh Madkhali begin to slander him as they usually do when his name is mentioned then they need to remember that Sheikh ash-Shu'aybi was one of Sheikh Madkhali's teachers!

Yes he had not travelled to Afghanistan, but the noble Sheikh (may Allah's mercy be upon him) was constant in his seeking news of the mujahadeen and i doubt there is anyone during his day who was a well aqainted with the news of the mujahadeen than Sheikh ash-Shu'aybi and his knowledge was wide ranging on this matter.

so here is the fatwah on the need for Muslims to aid the Taliban and on their virtues from Sheikh ash-Shu'aybi.


Fatwa of Sheikh Hamoud ibn 'Uqlaa ash-Shu'aybi on Taliban and Afghanistan

Hamoud ibn 'Uqlaa ash-Shu'aybi

Sheikh Hammoud Al-Uqlaa' Ash-Shuaibi is one of the senior-most and leading scholars in the Arabian Peninsula. He lives in the city of Buraydah in the Qaseem region of the Arabian Peninsula and is currently in his mid-eighties. He is one of the many teachers of Sheikh Salman Al-Awdah (also from Buraydah, who was imprisoned by the Saudi Regime from 1994 to 1999) and is well-known for speaking the Truth under all circumstances. May Allah protect him.

This fatwa was issued by the Sheikh on 2 Ramadan 1421 AH/ 29 November 2000 in response to American threats to impose new sanctions against the Taliban for their failure to curb 'terrorism'.

The Muslims are encouraged to distribute this fatwa everywhere over the Internet (avoiding Spam mail), fax and by printing it out and putting it up in mosques, Islamic centres and prayer rooms providing relevant permission is obtained.



In the Name of Allah the Most Merciful the Most Kind

Fatwa on the Shariah Implementation of the Taliban Government in Afghanistan

by His Excellency, Sheikh Hammoud bin Uqlaa' Ash-Shuaibi
2nd Ramadan, 1421 Hijri/ 29 November 2000 Al-Qaseem, Arabian Peninsula

Question: "Some people hold doubts about the Shariah implementation of the Taliban Government in Afghanistan. What is the reality regarding this government? We request from you a comprehensive answer backed up by evidences. May Allah protect you."

Answer:

Praise be to Allah, Lord of the Worlds, and Peace and Blessings be upon our Prophet Muhammad, upon his family and his companions altogether. As for what follows:

Indeed to determine the implementation or rejection of Shariah by a country depends on a number of factors:

Firstly:

Its legislation by the Book of Allah and the Sunnah of His Messenger (SAWS) in all the branches of ruling and other than it in other worldly dealings.

Secondly:

Indeed one of the most important components of a country is its control of land. It is well-known that the Taliban Government has over 95% of Afghanistan under its control.

Thirdly:

That its relations and dealings with other countries are established on the basis of the Noble Deen.

The Taliban Regime in Afghanistan has been proven to fulfil these factors, so it is the only country in the World in which there are no man-made laws and legislations. Rather, indeed its legislation is established on the Shariah of Allah and His Messenger in the Courts of Law, in the ministries, in the governmental circles and in other establishments.

As for the Muslim countries other than Afghanistan, amongst them are those which legislate with man-made laws in their totality and amongst them are those who contain Courts of Law which are man-made in their totality, but under the label of the Shariah of Allah and His Messenger (SAWS). Even the vast proportion of the rulings in the so-called 'Shariah' Courts in these countries are based on man-made institutions and legislative acts, so in reality there is no difference between this type of ruling and the ruling of man-made laws except by name.

Amongst the evidences that the Taliban Government is a Shariah Government is the fact that the disbelieving countries who are enemies of Islam and the Muslims are hostile towards it, have imposed an economic boycott on it, isolated it and tightened their grips on it for no reason other than its adherence to the Deen of Islam.

Furthermore, military strikes are about to be carried out on Afghanistan just like America attacked it with Cruise Missiles in 1998. At the same time, these same disbelieving countries continue to support the Opposition Northern Alliance (of Ahmad Shah Masood) with funds, weapons and advisors. This itself is clear evidence on the Shariah implementation of the Taliban Government and that they are upon Truth in their fighting against the Northern Alliance. In addition, the failure of the disbelieving nations to recognise the Taliban Regime as a nation and a government further removes any doubt in the Shariah implementation of the Taliban Government.

Amongst other reasons that point to the fact the Taliban Government is a Shariah Government is the fact that it fulfils certain criteria as mentioned earlier, with the exception that it is in urgent need of financial assistance due to its limited financial resources. Therefore we appeal to our Muslim brothers and sisters around the World to assist it with financial and material means and to support it with their media capabilities because the enemies of Islam and their agents have deceived and misguided most of the people until they have become confused as to whether this is a Muslim Government or not.

At this time, the Taliban Regime remains in a state of warfare against its opposition, the Northern Alliance, so Jihad with it is ordained by the Shariah because Jihad with the Taliban is against the Northern Alliance which is being funded by the forces of Disbelief like America, Britain and Russia and others who are calling for a broad-based government in Afghanistan established upon a Western legislative system. Since the situation is like this, then indeed it is obligatory to assist the Taliban Regime and to make Jihad with it in order to bring victory to Islam and in order to cooperate upon all acts of piety and fear of Allah, as Allah (SWT) says in the Quran:


"And cooperate with one another in all acts of piety and the fear of Allah" [Quran 5:2].

In addition, the Messenger of Allah (SAWS) said: "The similitude of the believers in their mutual love, mutual feelings and mutual relations is like a single body: if one part of it is in pain, the entire body feels discomfort." He also said (SAWS): "A Muslim and his fellow Muslim is like a building, one part of which supports the other (whilst interlocking his fingers)."

And from the greatest qualities further proving the validity of the Muslim Taliban Government are:

Its efforts to support the Mujahideen and defend them against their enemies. This has been witnessed in this government. It does not contain any forms of media which are forbidden in the Shariah. Indeed it is adamant, sincere and honest in its efforts to implement Shariah from its establishment of the Islamic Penal Code (hudood) to forbidding open acts of disobedience to Allah and His Messenger, meting out suitable punishments for them and Islamicising education and media. Indeed it is the only country in the World which is striving for women's rights according to the Shariah and not according to the ways of the Secularists who encourage the women to display their beauty, cast off their hijabs, mix freely with men, drive cars alone and other things like that. It is the only country in the World which has a separate ministry by the name of the Ministry to Encourage Good and Forbid Evil.

To conclude

Just as we pray for the Taliban Government for ability and guidance from Allah, we also appeal to them to remain firm and steadfast upon these aforementioned great Islamic qualities and to hold fast to the Book of Allah (SWT), the Sunnah of His Messenger (SAWS) and the ways of the Salaf-us-Saalih (Pious Predecessors) and that they do not worry about pressure and intimidation from the disbelieving countries and others like them. Allah (SWT) says in the Quran:


"And whosoever fears Allah, He will make for him a way out (from every difficulty) and provide for him from where he could never have imagined" [Quran 65:2-3]

and "And whosover fears Allah, He will provide for him a solution to all his affairs" [Quran 65:4]


and "And the end will belong to the Allah-Fearing" [Quran 7:128].

For them is an example in the Messenger of Allah (SAWS) and the Muslims with him when they were boycotted by the Quraish to the valley on the outskirts of Makkah in an attempt to prevent them from establishing Allah's Deen, but the end belonged to the Allah-Fearing. We also appeal to the other Muslim countries to follow in the footsteps of the Taliban in the implementation of Shariah in respect to all worldy dealings in judgements, media, economics, internal and foreign politics, women's affairs and education and that they do not blindly follow the West in its anti-Islamic and misguided ways and policies.

And all ability is from Allah (SWT) and peace and blessings be upon our Prophet Muhammad, his family and companions altogether.

Written by His Excellency, the Sheikh, the Teacher
Hammoud bin Uqlaa' Ash-Shuaibi

2nd Ramadan, 1421 Hijri/ 29 November 2000 Al-Qaseem, Arabian Peninsula

(For a copy of original Arabic text, visit qoqaz.net)
Reply

FollowingAlhuda
01-24-2007, 03:17 PM
Originally Posted by Dawud_uk
Assalaamu alaykum,

here is an excellent article from Sheikh ash-Shu'aybi, before the extreme followers of Sheikh Madkhali begin to slander him as they usually do when his name is mentioned then they need to remember that Sheikh ash-Shu'aybi was one of Sheikh Madkhali's teachers!
I don't know about this situation of Shu'aybi but i know that if sheikh Rabi3 gives a Djar3 he does it with knowledge...
However the fact that he is his teacher doesn't say a lot. It's like the situation of Sheikh Albaani and his student Abu Ishaak Alhuwaini. This student was the whole time on the right aqeedah and manhadj but a little before Albani (rahimao Allah) died, sheikh Albani warned about him because Alhuwaini abberated a little...

Well i have to look up a lot of names and read a lot now, your making it hard for me bro :)

Wassalamo Aleikom
Reply

Dawud_uk
01-24-2007, 03:24 PM
Originally Posted by FollowingAlhuda
I don't know about this situation of Shu'aybi but i know that if sheikh Rabi3 gives a Djar3 he does it with knowledge...
However the fact that he is his teacher doesn't say a lot. It's like the situation of Sheikh Albaani and his student Abu Ishaak Alhuwaini. This student was the whole time on the right aqeedah and manhadj but a little before Albani (rahimao Allah) died, sheikh Albani warned about him because Alhuwaini abberated a little...

Well i have to look up a lot of names and read a lot now, your making it hard for me bro :)

Wassalamo Aleikom
assalaamu alaykum,

only as hard as you should have made it for yourself before making that kind of accusation against your brothers and sisters in islam but everyone makes mistakes especially me.

assalaamu alaykum,
Abu Abdullah
Reply

FollowingAlhuda
01-24-2007, 04:47 PM
Originally Posted by Dawud_uk
assalaamu alaykum,

only as hard as you should have made it for yourself before making that kind of accusation against your brothers and sisters in islam but everyone makes mistakes especially me.

assalaamu alaykum,
Abu Abdullah

It wasn't a personally acusation. I said i based my post on what i read, and that i will read what you posted too that means i don't have an opinion yet....
Why are you being so harsh bro..
Reply

Dawud_uk
01-24-2007, 04:52 PM
assalaamu alaykum sister,

i am being as harsh as i would be if someone came to me and told me terrible things about you without providing the smallest evidence, i would ask them to prove their statements or withdraw them if they cannot.

it is not personal against you, but that fatwah you produced is not in itself evidence but an opinion of a scholar without anything to back it. it could be true or not but in itself it does not constitute evidence of the allegation.

so just as if someone couldnt provide proof against you if they said something, they have to withdraw such an allegation and so therefore do you for your own allegation not just against one brother or sister but a whole movement of them.

now under such circumstances i dont think i am being too harsh, it is not personal against you.

assalaamu alaykum,
Abu Abdullah
Reply

FollowingAlhuda
01-24-2007, 05:05 PM
Originally Posted by Dawud_uk
assalaamu alaykum sister,

i am being as harsh as i would be if someone came to me and told me terrible things about you without providing the smallest evidence, i would ask them to prove their statements or withdraw them if they cannot.

it is not personal against you, but that fatwah you produced is not in itself evidence but an opinion of a scholar without anything to back it. it could be true or not but in itself it does not constitute evidence of the allegation.

so just as if someone couldnt provide proof against you if they said something, they have to withdraw such an allegation and so therefore do you for your own allegation not just against one brother or sister but a whole movement of them.

now under such circumstances i dont think i am being too harsh, it is not personal against you.

assalaamu alaykum,
Abu Abdullah

Like i said i have no opinion
Reply

Dawud_uk
01-25-2007, 10:03 AM
assalaamu alaykum,

here is another excellent fatwa from a scholar of ahlus sunnah on aiding the taliban.

assalaamu alaykum,
Abu Abdullah

=====================================
SHEIKH IBN JIBREEN'S FATWA ON AIDING THE TALIBAAN
=====================================

In the Name of Allah, the Most Merciful, the Bestower of Mercy
The eminent Sheikh al-Allaamah, ‘Abdullaah ibn ‘Abdur-Rahmaan ibn Jibreen, may Allah bless you.

Question: It is not hidden from you what has befallen our brothers in Afghanistan, from the hardships of the enemies of Allah besieging them, and constrained livelihood, and lack of helpers and aides, and by being fiercely attacked from all directions by the enemies of Islam upon this state [The Taliban State of Afghanistan]. In spite of it all, [the government] does not cease to be firm in establishing the laws of Allah on the earth of Allah, and thus they are in need of help and to be allied with in their trial. Therefore, what is the ruling regarding aiding this movement with wealth, persons and supplications? What are your directions for the students of knowledge and the competent, skilful people? May Allah reward you with good.

Response:
Praise be to Allah and that suffices, and peace be upon His chosen slaves.

To proceed: When the Muslims throughout the world come to know that a group from their brothers have been oppressed and harmed, it becomes obligatory upon them to aid them and to strive to help them with whatever they can from the wealth, persons, opinions and statements. [Especially] when we know of the State of Taliban in Afghanistan that it rules with the Laws of Allah, establishes the Islamic education [system], prevents the means to Shirk, demolishes worshipped objects and idols, exhibits the manifestation of Islam by announcing the call for prayers, establishes the Friday [prayers] and congregational [prayers], prohibits sins and the forbidden acts, as indeed these are all apparent signs of their good intentions and sound faith. And since the Kafir states, such as the Christian, the Jews, the Communists and the Atheists, all of them, are against the correct [version of] Islam, and similarly the Kafir innovators, for verily it is obligatory upon the Muslims to help their brothers in this [Taliban] State of Muslims, and to endeavour to repel the plots of their enemies, those who seek to cripple the Muslims’ movement and to exterminate them. For Allah the Exalted has said:

“And co-operate upon righteousness and piety”,

and in the Hadeeth:
“Make Jihaad against the Mushrikeen with your wealth, your persons and your tongues”.

The Muslims should aid their brothers with wealth and men, and should increase in their supplications for them, for victory and dominion, as Allah is the one who responds to calls of those who supplicate, and indeed He is All-Hearing and Near.

Stated and Written by

'Abdullaah ibn 'Abdur-Rahmaan al-Jibreen
The retired member of al-Ifta.

And may the Salaah and Salaam be upon Muhammad, and his followers and companions.
[Signed]

http://anahona.vr9.com/fatwa1.jpg
Reply

FollowingAlhuda
01-25-2007, 10:45 AM
Djazaaka Allaho gheiran
Reply

mahdisoldier19
01-30-2007, 06:20 AM
Assalam Alaikam

Brother Dawud Al Hamdulillah i have met a brother like you perhaps we can discuss more indepthly, btw here is a article for those brothers and sisters seeking fatwas.

Finally no Talafis!

Three Notable Scholars Endorses Taliban Leader Mullah Omar In Letter of Support

Three notable Saudi scholars have broken ranks and sent a letter to Commander of the Faithful and Taliban Supreme Leader Mullah Omar in November, 2006 praising his efforts and calling the Taliban leader “the Omar of his time in Afghanistan.

Here is the letter, published uncut and uncensored, in its entirety.

We remind our viewers that the opinions and points of view expressed in this statement are those of the author and shall not be deemed to mean that they are necessarily those of JUS, the publisher, editor, writers, contributors or staff

Letter To Mullah Muhammad Omar From The Scholars

In The Name Of Allah The Most Gracious The Most Merciful

To the Commander of the Believers (Amir Al-Mu’minin) the Mujahid, the Mullah Muhammad Omar, may Allah preserve him and protect him and conceal his errors with the truth:

As-Salamu Alaykum Wa Rahmatullahi Wa Barakatuh. We ask Allah, the Most High, that this letter of ours reaches you while you are in the fullest of health and wellbeing.

Commander of the Believers (Amir Al-Mu’minin), We, the collective scholars, are honored to have the likes of you attributed to our nation (Ummah), because you have affirmed, in reality, the supremacy and honor of the believers. You were not satisfied with declaring that you are the dominant, rather you confirmed this great meaning through your noble deeds, as the dominance in the land is not merely the material dominance, rather its most important and its greatest, is the dominance of religion and moral values. As Allah, the Most High, said:

“And do not become weak (against your enemy), nor grieve, and you will be superior (in victory) if you are indeed (true) believers. Qur'an 3: 139

So this Verse descended upon the Messenger of Allah,(swt), and his Companions, may Allah be pleased with them, on the day they were defeated at Uhud. So the real supremacy is the supremacy of moral values and religion. Ibn Abbas, may Allah be pleased with them, said, “Islam is dominant and is not dominated.” Al-Bukhari narrated this in his Sahih as a dangling narration (Mu’allaq), and At-Tahawi narrated it with an authentic chain. So Islam and the People of Islam are dominant, even if they are defeated in battle.

And Allah, the Most High, said:

“But honour, power and glory belong to Allah, His Messenger and to the believers.” Qur'an 63:8

So the supremacy is directly connected to Allah and His Messenger and to every believer who truly adheres to his Religion. So he is supreme with the supremacy (bestowed) by Allah and with his faith (Imaan). So whoever adheres to the morals of truth, then he is supreme according to the clear text of the Qur’an and the Sunnah.

Amir Al-Mu’minin, verily, the ignorance of many of the Muslims, concerning your right, does not decrease anything from your stature, as you have become a symbol from the symbols of this nation (Ummah) and we will write it with our hands, the history of this era and affirm for future generations that you were the leaders of this worldly life. Even if you are killed prior to that, then your biography will be written in ink of gold and we will all bear witness for you, before Allah, the Most High, that you are from the most sincere and truthful slaves to this nation (Ummah). We assume this about you and do not approve anyone except with Allah’s (approval). And we will bear witness that you alone were the ones who raised your heads, in a time when many of the Muslims lowered their heads to the country of kufr and the cross; America. So the Muslims were not honored by a single man who would say, “No! and again, No!” to what America sought in this time, except with you. So congratulations to the Muslims due to the likes of you.

Amir Al-Mu’minin, in your actions, the meanings of justice, equity, supremacy, nobility, victory, security, allegiance and disavowal have become apparent. You have given the nation (Ummah) a lesson, through actions, in these meanings when you began your blessed journey to Afghanistan and you harvested for the nation (Ummah), the fruits of Jihad against the Soviets. Then, at the time when Afghanistan was on the verge of crumbling into the hands of the secularists and the Communist and the Rafidhah (i.e. Shi’ah), and just when our hope for the fruits of Jihad was about to cease, you revived the hope of the Ummah, with Afghanistan and it has become, today, the focus of the eyes of all the Muslims and they all seek the supremacy and the victory for your land. And then you took control of Afghanistan and implemented the Shari’ah, so we said: “Alhamdulillah”. Allah has given victory to the Jihad through you on the day that you built upon the ruins of a destroyed, torn and mutilated country, an Islamic state, in statements and actions. So justice and correct religion became the leadership and you waged war against Shirk and the graves and you divided (the wealth) according to equality and were just in matters, to the point where, if someone were to say that the wolf is being herded with the sheep under your emirate, this would not be inconceivable.

Next, you challenged the entire world by destroying the statues (Bamiyan Buddha’s), acting upon the Shari’ah of Muhammad, (pbuh) which was sent for this purpose. So we said, “Allah has provided to the Ummah, someone to revive, within it, the legacy of Ibrahim (AS); the destroyer of statues and the rejecter of idolatry!” And we were pleased with your actions when you revived the meanings of Tawheed, which were absent from the Ummah for centuries, as statues in all their various shapes, types and sizes fill the countries of the Muslims. However, Amir Al-Mu’minin was not satisfied to live in a country in which, beside him, there were gods who were worshipped besides Allah the Most High. Then you destroyed those objects of worship and humbled its worshippers and our hearts were on the verge of flying out of happiness due to the revival of Tawheed, in this matter. Then you enforced upon the People of Thimmah [i.e. those disbelievers who live in Islamic states, who pay the Jizyah (tax) to the Muslim authority], subjugation and humiliation, acting upon the Book of Allah, the Glorious, Most High, and upon the Sunnah of His Messenger, (pbuh), just as they were in the origins of Islam, humiliated; paying the Jizyah willingly, while feeling themselves subdued. So we said, “The Omar of his time is in Afghanistan, enforcing humiliation and subjugation upon the disbelievers (Kuffar) in his land!”


Hamud Ibn Uqla Ash-Shu”aybi
Sulayam Ibn Nasir Al-Ulwan
Ali Ibn Khudhayr Al-Khudhayr
Reply

Dawud_uk
01-30-2007, 07:22 AM
jazakallah khairain,

a beautiful letter indeed. do you have the original source for it as it is better that way so no one can say it is not genuine.

i am just beginning to gain a great appriciation for sheikh ash shu'aybi, but there is so little of his work in english.

assalaamu alaykum,
Abu Abdullah
Reply

khushnood
01-30-2007, 07:29 AM
i didnt read all d previous posts.but,i may ask,'why did the taliban opress their women?
Reply

Dawud_uk
01-30-2007, 08:17 AM
Originally Posted by khushnood
i didnt read all d previous posts.but,i may ask,'why did the taliban opress their women?
insha'allah the brother who has travelled there and lived there can answer your queries better than i can but i believe they did not oppress their women.

if they enforce the hijab is it oppression or helping sisters by them not getting the sin of causing fitnah? same with making brothers keep a beard and pray in the masjid is this oppression or just enforcing the shariah?

were they oppressing women when they banned the practice of exchanging girls to solve tribal disputes or to pay off debts?

were they oppressing women when they got rid of the warlords who's men raped and murdered so many women?

i will let the brother who has been there answer now insha'allah.

assalaamu alaykum,
Abu Abdullah
Reply

north_malaysian
01-30-2007, 08:38 AM
Are the Taliban Muslims? - YES

Are the Taliban from Ahlus Sunnah - I DONT CARE...
Reply

mahdisoldier19
01-30-2007, 05:46 PM
Originally Posted by khushnood
i didnt read all d previous posts.but,i may ask,'why did the taliban opress their women?
JazakAllah Khair Dawud

What oppression of Women? To enfore the Hijab , Islamic Law? Is that Oppression. Those who say women werent allowed outside of their homes. BRING your evidence if you are truthful, i have relatives, females during the taliban era in Afghanistan in which they were outside without a male escort. The requirement for a male escort were in certain areas of Afghanistan due to the danger of some of the runaway criminals.

Is Covering a Woman According to the Sunnah to show her Piety to Allah swt Oppression?

Yes theyre was education for Women, in certain developing parts. It took America and all these other great nations years to develope, yet the world expects Afghanistan to do it in less than 5 years? Especially when Implying it in a Sharia Format?

The evidence is clear, the Taliban did establish Sharia.

Ya Akhi, You have to understand the difference between a Muslim and A Mumeen

Simply saying your a Muslim does not suffice, you have to be a Believer.
Reply

SilentObserver
01-31-2007, 06:59 AM
Originally Posted by mahdisoldier19
JazakAllah Khair Dawud

BRING your evidence if you are truthful,
I have an idea, how about you provide evidence of your claims about the taliban. After all, it is you that is claiming they were good while the rest of us know the truth.

Originally Posted by mahdisoldier19
The requirement for a male escort were in certain areas of Afghanistan due to the danger of some of the runaway criminals.
I thought it was said earlier that the Taliban had set up a wonderful society inAfghanistan without this kind of crime. Seems pretty dangerous to me if a woman cant go in public without an escort. :rolleyes:


Originally Posted by mahdisoldier19
The evidence is clear, the Taliban did establish Sharia.
The evidence is clear, the Taliban did establish oppression.
Reply

Dawud_uk
01-31-2007, 07:10 AM
Originally Posted by SilentObserver
I have an idea, how about you provide evidence of your claims about the taliban. After all, it is you that is claiming they were good while the rest of us know the truth.


I thought it was said earlier that the Taliban had set up a wonderful society inAfghanistan without this kind of crime. Seems pretty dangerous to me if a woman cant go in public without an escort. :rolleyes:


The evidence is clear, the Taliban did establish oppression.
hi silent observer.

this is an islamic message board, that means that we go by islamic manners on such matters, and the correct way of doing things in both the western and islamic culture is that an allegation against someone has to be proved first.

then if there is evidence against them then they can be defended against that. it is not for the innocent party to prove their innocence, but for those who allege their guilt to prove their guilt first and then be responded to.

Finally could i ask people to stay on topic or i will ask the moderators to remove your threads.

this is because this thread is to rebut those specific allegations against those who say that the taliban are not from ahlus sunnah and i call them liars or the messengers of liars, conveying their lies for them.

now as a non muslim i do not feel you have a place in this discussion as it involves discussing the beliefs of the taliban and whether that makes them part of the mainstream of islam or not and to be fair i do not believe you to be qualified to take part in that discussion.

if some muslims wish to allege that the taliban did x or y, then state how you feel this takes them outside the fold of ahlus sunnah or i will also ask for such threads to be removed by the moderators as off topic.

if someone wishes to start another thread on why the taliban were oppressive them please be my guest, put it in the basics of islam or world affairs section and i am sure myself and others will respond to it there.

Abu Abdullah
Reply

abubakr rishel
01-31-2007, 05:10 PM
abu abdullah did you read that artical with Shaykh Ghulaamullaah Rahmatee the former deputy of sheikh jaleel ur rahman? that should answer any questions about the taliban. if you dont know who is jaleel ur rahman is, he is the salafi sheikh whom the ulema where going to give bay'ah, to be the khalifah of the muslim, including sheikh al albaani and others, until hykmatyar and the ikhwanies assainated him ,raheemahullah. and this is also a proof for those who think the salafi ulema are against shariah and the khalifa.
Reply

mahdisoldier19
01-31-2007, 06:09 PM
Originally Posted by abubakr rishel
abu abdullah did you read that artical with Shaykh Ghulaamullaah Rahmatee the former deputy of sheikh jaleel ur rahman? that should answer any questions about the taliban. if you dont know who is jaleel ur rahman is, he is the salafi sheikh whom the ulema where going to give bay'ah, to be the khalifah of the muslim, including sheikh al albaani and others, until hykmatyar and the ikhwanies assainated him ,raheemahullah. and this is also a proof for those who think the salafi ulema are against shariah and the khalifa.
Ya Akhi what does this have to do with Taliban?
Reply

abubakr rishel
01-31-2007, 09:10 PM
what i am saying is an insider (Shaykh Ghulaamullaah Rahmatee ) someone who knew the situation about the taliban has told us about them, and what makes up their ranks. as he said people go to extreams with them , either they over prays them or call them mushriks, and in both cases it is not true. as he said they make up 3 types, deobandi asharies, salafees, and sufies. and this coencides with what the ulema have been saying about them for years. the other fatwas that have been put up in support with the taliban in my opinion cannot be taken as they are fatwas from few in midst of many. there is no dought sheikh ibn jabreen is a true scholar but it must also be realized that the majority of the ulema have had issues with some of his fatwas and they have refuted them. and this is the way it should be, ulema refute eachother , it is not our job to try to refute them as we have no right.
Reply

mahdisoldier19
02-01-2007, 04:41 AM
Originally Posted by abubakr rishel
what i am saying is an insider (Shaykh Ghulaamullaah Rahmatee ) someone who knew the situation about the taliban has told us about them, and what makes up their ranks. as he said people go to extreams with them , either they over prays them or call them mushriks, and in both cases it is not true. as he said they make up 3 types, deobandi asharies, salafees, and sufies. and this coencides with what the ulema have been saying about them for years. the other fatwas that have been put up in support with the taliban in my opinion cannot be taken as they are fatwas from few in midst of many. there is no dought sheikh ibn jabreen is a true scholar but it must also be realized that the majority of the ulema have had issues with some of his fatwas and they have refuted them. and this is the way it should be, ulema refute eachother , it is not our job to try to refute them as we have no right.
And what about the 2 other sheikhs that i have mentioned? And Also Sheikh. Muhammad Maqdisi?
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abubakr rishel
02-01-2007, 06:04 AM
i do not know about the two other that are mentioned, but i will say and this is my opinion but it is held by many, that it is best and safest to fallow what the mojority of the scholars have said about these technical issues (ie. issues that we really dont know much about). i am not saying that what ever the majority agree upon is always the mosy correct but if we do not have the ability to fully understand the situation it is prbably the safest between us and Allah. if we get more knowledable about an issue than we can look at the daleel that both sides may argue and than make an educated dissision from that.
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khushnood
02-01-2007, 07:46 AM
Originally Posted by mahdisoldier19
JazakAllah Khair Dawud

What oppression of Women? To enfore the Hijab , Islamic Law? Is that Oppression. Those who say women werent allowed outside of their homes. BRING your evidence if you are truthful, i have relatives, females during the taliban era in Afghanistan in which they were outside without a male escort. The requirement for a male escort were in certain areas of Afghanistan due to the danger of some of the runaway criminals.

Is Covering a Woman According to the Sunnah to show her Piety to Allah swt Oppression?

Yes theyre was education for Women, in certain developing parts. It took America and all these other great nations years to develope, yet the world expects Afghanistan to do it in less than 5 years? Especially when Implying it in a Sharia Format?

The evidence is clear, the Taliban did establish Sharia.

Ya Akhi, You have to understand the difference between a Muslim and A Mumeen

Simply saying your a Muslim does not suffice, you have to be a Believer.
HEY!STOP BEING MAD AT ME.I WAS DIDNT MEAN TO SAY THAT TALIBAN ARE WOMEN OPRESSORS.BUT MANY PEOPLE THINK SO.WITH ALL THESE TALIBAN BASHING BOLLYWOOD MOVIES LIKE ESCAPE FROM THE TALIBAN AND KABUL EXPRESS,THE TALIBAN HAVE BEEN DEMONISED BEYOND MEASURE AND THAT IS WHAT MOST OF THE PEOPLE ARE BOUND TO THINK.
Reply

S_87
02-01-2007, 04:30 PM
Originally Posted by mahdisoldier19
Assalam Alaikam


Finally no Talafis!
:sl:

im curious to know what this means?
Reply

muthenna
02-07-2007, 08:56 AM
Yes part of Ahli Sunnah in aqidah, maybe somewhat different on fiqh issues.
Reply

Dawud_uk
02-07-2007, 09:11 AM
Originally Posted by muthenna
Yes part of Ahli Sunnah in aqidah, maybe somewhat different on fiqh issues.
assalaamu alaykum,

which particular fiqh issues are you referring to?

assalaamu alaykum,
Abu Abdullah
Reply

mahdisoldier19
02-07-2007, 06:43 PM
Yes i am curious which fiqh issues is the brother referring to. Where did they error in the Sharia of Allah swt?
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