Originally Posted by MeMama
Sharing 97% of your DNA with an Ape, 70% with a mouse or 50% with a banana hardly denotes you share a common ancestor or were manifest from the same glob of goo -- least of which if the only claim to fame is some fossil in a display case ( who is to say they aren't of species gone extinct with assertion?)... All the above percentages are actually true... (do you believe there is a good chance you have evolved from a banana?) --
There is a very specific way the Amino Acids form to make different genetic information. The genetic code is degenerate, more than one codon may code for the same amino acid, it is commaless, nonoverlapping, it is UNIVERSAL with the exceptions in mitochondria, mycoplasma and some yeasts... It isn't a matter of putting it in a centrifuge and seeing what comes out from beneath your supernatant-- wow we have some sugar, some phosphate, some, Adenine, Thymine, Uracil, Guanine, Cytosine, Purine, and Pyrimidine--formed in all of us creatures up to an including beetles thus we all share a common ancestor?-
please don't mistake commonalities to mean that we share a common ancestor. Even one or two amino acid differences, is enough to induce the most violent reaction by your immune system if it were to be introduced to your body.
Further with all the genetic engineering and expression vectors we have got at our disposal, it would be very easy for instance to introduce a plasmid into a bacteria thus enabling it to express something like insulin as opposed to growing it in the tissues of dead animals like pigs or cows or subsequently killing humans and extracting Insulin from their pancreas (you can see where that would be unethical) in spite of our similarities with these pigs and cows, Insulin grown in their tissue would still be rejected by your body in spite of the overwhelming similarities...
Imagine inducing human insulin to be expressed in bacteria? ( by the way this is actually how Insulin is manufactured in bacteria through the use of plasmids)... How difficult then would it be to play around with the genetic code and cause an entire population of apes to differentiate into humans? we can't use plasmids in humans of course but we can certainly use viruses, specifically retro-viruses manipulated with the DNA of interest or we can even use liposomes to bring the vectors of interest inside the cells...so why not? we do it to manufacture Insulin, we do it to be rid ourselves of deadly genetic DZ such as SCID, we can even make lab diamonds, don't we? something that takes ages in nature, can be made with ease in the lab-- Diamonds by the way can go back to graphite, which takes millions of years under inert atmosphere--if we were to apply the same scientific laws to humans could possibly mean at some point we too will degenerate back to the previous primordial soup from which we came---there is really no reason to progress forward as some suggest a better product from further evolution.. ask any chemist of this... I have minored in chemistry in my under graduate ages ago, and that was something very striking to me ( a diamond really isn't forever)
C(diamond) → C(graphite). it will satisfy the laws of thermodynamics by not becoming a more brilliant diamond but by becoming graphite--
if we were to apply the same laws of nature to us as a specie (humans) we'll devolve with the passage of time, not become a better specie-- (perhaps that is where atheism plays a role?) but I digress!
If it were just a matter of common ancestry that split and morphed, why with all this technology and I have demonstrated the ease of use albeit it in simple terms, that we can very much alter gene expression-- so why not, why are we not able to reproduce these evolutionary findings in the laboratory thus putting all doubt to rest?
let's talk about collagen a little see how many varieties can be from one general heading! the most abundant protein in the human body, it functions to organize and strengthen the matrix, basically connective tissue made from protein, no different than the protein you eat in a stake, in its making , from collagen Alpha chains translation on the rough endoplasmic reticulum, in the specific polypeptide of Gly-X-Y,( X, Y) being proline, hydroxyproline, and hydroxlysine, on to ER hydroxylation which occurs for specific residues, then on to the Golgi, for glycosylation of the pro-alpha chain, to the formation of procollagen, which are then exocytosed because they are too large to be worked on further inside the cell, think about it, it makes perfect sense... this couldn't make itself-- then specific peptidases cleave only the terminal regions, forming insoluble tropocolagen, which are then reinforced by covalent lysine-hydroxylysine cross linking to make these collagen fibrils, and from then we have multitudes of different types of this general heading, similar yet very distinct... no different than creation... (same component, different varieties) -- Type one in bone, tendon and fascia, type II, in cartilage, the virteous body, type III in blood vessels, type IV in basement membrane, type V in epiphyseal plate, and understand that any mal-function in any specific type would cause a completely different type of problem for instance a Type III malfunction would give you Ehlers-Danlos syndrome whereas a type IV gives you Alport's syndrome.
If you'd concede to the fact that every nucleated cell in the body has the capability of doing this process over and over, yet for some reason only fibroblasts are programmed to make collagen while say something like a beta cell though carries the entire genetic information-- codes for Insulin by a process not very un-similar to the collagen synthesis in its details and complexity, and if you'd like though it would be a complete waste of my time but I can go in its details if you'd like... I don't think anyone needs it really to appreciate the virtuoso, the engineer, the chemist , the aesthete, the anatomist, the physiologist that designed it all -- This isn't a matter of I am going to eat protein from an egg, and bam energy will transform it into 19 different types of collagen across all vertebrates
.. If evolution were the answer we'd all be having very successful Xenograft, (tissue from Apes) in fact they are the fastest rejected-- we don't match on HLA-DP , HLA-DQ. and HLA-DR and their numerous subclasses... if it were as easy as sharing some basic components, there would be no long lists awaiting a liver, or a kidney or a corneal transplant ....There would no reason on the simplest level for blood typing even amongst us as a specie.
I am not into using obscure terms, I have no interest in impressing you with confounders, or quoting you Herodes Atticus or talk above you in display of what I know that you don't, or even assume through my conclusions that my knowledge is superior to yours or that you are not my equal... those weren't the Qualities of prophet Mohammed PBUH --
whereas I agree with you that there is nothing in the Quran to argue against evolution, save the creation of man--I'll argue that these are simply the building blocks of our universe.. no different than your usage of 26 consonants to make a seemingly endless number of meaningful words.... I have used all 26 consonants in here and repeatedly, but hope that this composition makes sense to you in the end?--- Why would an engineer use a different formula to create another creature, when one works perfectly? already in the Quran it states [24. Surah An-Nur : Ayah 45]
"And Allah has created from water every living creature: so of them is that which walks upon its belly, and of them is that which walks upon two feet, and of them is that which walks upon four; Allah creates what He pleases; surely Allah has power over all things." w/out going into too much detail of the verse, you can see we have in common.
An engineer will use concrete, brick , mortar, cement, and metal for a small hut as he would the tallest building-- but they don't magically make themselves. Energy doesn't create a building and then suddenly tons of little houses bud off its side and take different forms.
In closure--I really promised myself that I wouldn't be baited back into these sorts of debates as it has been discussed here AD nauseam under evolution/ under Atheism/ under creationist dealt a blow.. and frankly I don't enjoy the mannerism of some of the members here.
At the end of the day, it is nothing more than a sophisticated belief-- -- I am not impressed with a huge congregation upholding a summit to enforce a theory, admittedly I haven't watched the last video, but have a general idea what it would encompass-- and it can unravel with a few un-answered questions--
believing in evolution doesn't preclude the existence of an engineer to have set it all in motion.. Even though I have very strong doubt that evolution is how it happened, unless we wish to put a spin on adaptation to mean evolution.. seems like a simplistic conclusion to a very complex formula. it is merely a swap for some who think they can substitute a handy me down outfit from the salvation army for a fancy Salvatore Ferragamo, (if it doesn't look good, on you or fit you all that well, then it wouldn't matter who the label maker) even if it is an initiation right into the illuminati club, you won't feel comfortable in it!
It has nothing to do with being programmed to think a certain way, it has to do with what is in your heart, what is a symbiotic part of you, your innate need to find your reason for being.. the purpose of life, and why are you here, what are you for... life's long questions are a personal quest...its glory lies in its details and the trip one takes to get there... and it is incumbent upon each self to make that search, not to have it enforced by people who believe the use of sophisticated terminology can hide under lying fluff.
I wish you well on your quest...
peace and goodbye for a while...