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Makky
08-24-2007, 10:14 PM
:sl:
few facts to understand:

Its scientifically known that the speed of light is 300,000 km/second

this means that if you have a plan flying by the speed of light then you can cross 20 times the distance between Sydney and Glasgow in less than 1 second only



the light minute is the Distance that the light cross in one minute.

Could you imagine that the sun is away from us by Distance : 190,000,000 km

it would take you about 120 years to reach the sun by car...but the light takes only 8 minutes to reach the earth starting from the sun.

this means that if you are able to fly with the light speed then it would take you 8 minutes to cross the distance of 190 million km from earth to sun.

see the speed of light makes the 120 years to be only 8 minutes...

Do you imagine how fast is light?

Do you imagine how great are the distance between earth and sun

now Wait!


the earth and the sun are in a system called : solar system.

this solar system is a very small system relatively to the other suns ( stars ) in our galaxy .

our galaxy contains millions of suns many of them are much bigger and greater than our sun.

Take a deep breath

the width of our galaxy is......


about


100,000 light years

Do you imagine?

do you know what does this means?

it means that if you could be able to fly with the light speed then it will takes you 100 thousand years to across our Galaxy..


Go wash your face before reading the follwoing fact


Last discoveries proved that the width of the seen universe is between

156 - 180 billion light years.

this is under what we muslims believe its called the 1st heaven : there are 7 heavens each one is like a small ring in a very very wide desert as mentioned in the narrations.

and Allah is above all of these heavens seeing us and hearing us , listening to our supplication ..


brothers and sisters we need to look up to the sky to see ourselves in our real volume...and to see how great is Allah's creation.
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NYCmuslim
08-25-2007, 12:55 AM
Allahu-Akbar!

No phrase but that can describe how big the universe is.
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Science101
08-25-2007, 01:39 AM
Ooooh, Science!

And just think, some say science takes the mystery out of life. In my opinion it only makes life seem more mysterious.

Nice post Makky. :thumbs_up
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Malaikah
08-25-2007, 01:54 AM
Originally Posted by Science101
And just think, some say science takes the mystery out of life. In my opinion it only makes life seem more mysterious.
Amazing! That is exactly what I say to atheists who think we don't need God any more because e have science.
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Science101
08-25-2007, 02:52 AM
We think alike!

The way I see it, science and religion can coexist. The two sometimes being in competition with each other is often beneficial for both. And in my opinion Atheism is also a religion, only difference is there is no deity at all. In religion forums I see that they enjoy many of the same discussions about morality the religious folks do.

When I had to choose a religion when registering for this forum I ended up having to choose "Undisclosed" because I'm not an Atheist. I'm more of an Agnostic but that can imply that I'm not a seeker. I try using scientific reasoning to find the "creator" and have so far found something that gives me peace and comfort. It doesn't say that Allah/God doesn't exist, only adds to the mystery, for me anyway. But that's another topic.
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Makky
08-25-2007, 04:09 AM
Originally Posted by Science101
Ooooh, Science!

And just think, some say science takes the mystery out of life. In my opinion it only makes life seem more mysterious.

Nice post Makky. :thumbs_up
Yeah! every day life is getting more mysterious... This universe proves with know doubt that there is a great power behind the formation of it...or in other words behind its CREATION..

its not just a great hazard power...no

but the small details in all things seen and discovered prove that this power is not just a great power.. the universe is perfect ... its design is very complicated and homogenous in the same time...

By knowing this we are able to understand the attributes of this creator..He is the greatest ever... He wasn't playing when he created the universe ...
His power reachs the deepest point in his universe similarly his words should..

He should tell those creatures why did he created them..that why he sent books..

the sign of his words is that it is not contradicting his universe because they are his words and he himself who created the universe.

among those books spreading nowadays there should be only one book that belongs to this creator..

his words is the only thing among his attributes that you can see (read them)

this is my advise to every soul searching the way... read the Quran.. test it if you want...
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^..sTr!vEr..^
08-25-2007, 09:11 AM
Alllaaaaaaah-u-Akbar!!
SubhanAllah :)
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Science101
08-25-2007, 09:31 AM
Originally Posted by Makky
Yeah! every day life is getting more mysterious... This universe proves with know doubt that there is a great power behind the formation of it...or in other words behind its CREATION..
Yes, that was some awesome "Big Bang". And contrary to what some think, science does not claim that the universe came from nothing. The term "infinitely small" that is sometimes used means that it the universe started from something very small. But "infinitely energetic" and "infinitely dense" is in a sense something very very large.

Originally Posted by Makky
He should tell those creatures why did he created them..that why he sent books..
You used the right word, the "why" that I highlighted. One way I saw science and religion described that makes sense, is that religion answers "why" we are here and science answers "how". For example, scripture does not explain that the plan for making each of us is stored in DNA which uses a four letter code.


http://ircamera.as.arizona.edu/NatSc...s/lifeform.htm

You might like to check out the above link for more cool graphics showing events now known to have occurred in creation of life on Earth.

Originally Posted by Makky
among those books spreading nowadays there should be only one book that belongs to this creator..
his words is the only thing among his attributes that you can see (read them)
There are many that say much the same. Where they came from cannot be proven to have come from Allah in the same way scientists discover new things, but may have been divinely inspired. And there are now many science books explaining "how" life works that adds to the number of books about creation. They didn't come from Allah, they came from Humans, but they still explain a lot of things about how it happened.

Originally Posted by Makky
this is my advise to every soul searching the way... read the Quran.. test it if you want...
I started a conversation in another thread with someone who wanted me to "test" the Koran but I don't think it would be possible for me to do so, there is no error detection system that I know of that would work. Christians say the same thing about the Bible, same problem there too. And scriptures provides an answer to "why" but I now want to know "how" which is not discussed in detail by religion, I need science for that.

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NobleMuslimUK
08-25-2007, 11:45 PM
:sl:
Very interesting Subhanallah, this just deepens the mysteries as mentioned before.
To the science guy well you have to read the whole Quran with an open mind. If you're in the field of science well you will notice many scientific facts in the Quran, even according to your logic impossible to know 14 centuries ago. Also you will realise in the Quran Allah presents this challenge to the people, find one contradiction in the Quran, if its human words then produce even one verse like it. You will have to read the whole Quran to understand this challenge properly.

Since we're on the subject if you do happen to read the Quran all the way through and you come across verses that are heavily misquoted on the media. Do realise the Quran gives a guideline, the Prophet Mohammad PBUH was the only one to make us understand the Quran properly and Islam through his Sunnah(way of life, every situation of His PBUH's life, actions, do's and dont's). Without Prophet Mohammad's PBUH Sunnah we would not understand the Quran properly, Prophets PBUH sunnah explains in detail and demonstrates the command, purpose, genuinity. Basically everything that Allah wants the creation to do and everything they cant do.
Quran and Sunnah takes every aspect of human life into such precise consideration. What is forbidden in Islam is basically good for all humans to stay away from. Similarly what is allowed in Islam is also good for all humans to do.
With the advancement of science we are getting a glimpse into the wisdom behind what Allah has sent down.
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Science101
08-26-2007, 12:07 AM
Thanks for the information NobleMuslimUK

I'm wondering if this website that discusses science in the Koran is what you are saying:

http://www.miracleofkoran.com/

I also like the Adam and Eve story (almost identical to the Christian text) due to the chromosome fusion that suggests to me that humans might have suddenly appeared from a common primate ancestor 2 to 6 million years ago. Although they might not be identical to what we look like now, we should easily be able to recognize them as human.



http://www.evolutionpages.com/chromosome_2.htm
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Makky
08-26-2007, 07:26 PM
Originally Posted by Science101
Thanks for the information NobleMuslimUK

I'm wondering if this website that discusses science in the Koran is what you are saying:

http://www.miracleofkoran.com/

I also like the Adam and Eve story (almost identical to the Christian text) due to the chromosome fusion that suggests to me that humans might have suddenly appeared from a common primate ancestor 2 to 6 million years ago. Although they might not be identical to what we look like now, we should easily be able to recognize them as human.

http://www.evolutionpages.com/images...pe_chrom_2.gif

http://www.evolutionpages.com/chromosome_2.htm
I'm inviting you to join my thread : Allah and camuoflage ... there we are discussing the theory of evolution...I'm very busy this time that why the conversation is pending but insha Allah...before ramadan i hope i'll return to post in it insha Allah...
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Science101
08-27-2007, 01:45 AM
Thank you very much Makky, I would be honored to join your discussion.

Since your thread has become very long and is now in the archives I'm wondering if maybe we could plan to start over with a new one. I have a computer simulation that indicates evolution is "guided" by the force scientists call "natural selection", evolution is not totally random. I presented my findings to educators and scientists and they found nothing wrong with my reasoning.

Also have to mention that natural selection guides the creation of camouflage because the variation in the population that is easy to see by a predator, is first to be eaten. The ones that are hard to see remain to have offspring. That guides their evolution to an increasing amount of camouflage.

There is currently an evolution thread keeping me busy in the Refutations forum.

http://www.islamicboard.com/refutati...ionists-3.html

I'm wondering if we should plan a thread that attempts to find common ground, as opposed to the more finger pointing kinds of arguments that are now common that can go endlessly in circles. You can start the thread if you would like or I can present my program (source code included) then go from there. It's really cool, has a critter that learns how to navigate its environment to feed. It's intelligence is guided by the evolution mechanism, suggesting that evolution is similar to intelligence. It's not what people normally consider evolution to be. What do you think?
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NobleMuslimUK
08-28-2007, 03:04 PM
Well science you make a good point, I dont totally renounce evolution, Islamic text suggest that Adam was 60 feet tall, humans that large existed back then to us we would call them giants. Although today the record height would reach maybe 8 feet. The form we evolve in is to adopt to our surrounding environment. A lot of people suffer from appendix failure due to our completely different diet compared to our ancestors. Its either evolution or we have deviated from the way we;re supposed to live and hence all the health problems, obesity, short sightedness, bad teeth and many other forms of diseases and illnesses unheard of by our ancestors. This way of living of ours has led to a revolution of the working class professionals such as dentists, surgeons, opticians etc, these forms of professions only exist because people have developed a need for them. Science being able to fix some of these problems on a temporary basis, has lead people to believe theres no need for God. Its just amazing how far the innovation of evolution being the beginning of mankind has crept into science.
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Science101
08-30-2007, 05:18 AM
Hi NobelMuslimUK. I was trying to visualize what it would be like to live in a world with no evolution. Variation in the population is what leads to this change so the only way to stop it is for everyone to look exactly the same. Our children would all look exactly like we did when we were that age. We would all want to work at the same place and do the same things. There would be no dogs, because they co-evolved along side of us from wolves. There would not be fluffy cats that make good pets either. After thinking about it, I would not want to live in a world with no evolution.

I was also trying to find information on 60 foot tall people in the Koran but could not find anything. From my religious training I recall the David and Goliath story but if it is based on a true story then Goliath might have been 8 feet or so tall. I did find something about Kent Hovind (Dr. Dino) saying something similar from what he interpreted from scripture but he suffers from megalomania. Poor guy is now in jail maybe for the rest of his life because of it. Not sure if you read about him. He thought he was a demigod, that laws didn't apply to him, and took on the US government. He lost. Things he said in did make no sense but that's what happens when a person loses the ability to reason. Can't take anything he read into scripture seriously. I would though like to know about the 60 foot tall people you read about. Also makes me wonder if dinosaur bones were once thought to be human remains. They appear to have give rise to tales of flying dragons. Can imagine the surprise of people who long ago found some but had no way accurately reconstruct them. Still might make them the worlds first paleontologists, unfortunately there doesn't seem to be any record of their work, just evidence that fossil dinosaurs were found.

Evolution creeping into science certainly is amazing. I agree. For a very long time there were many things that made no sense. Scientists were unable to figure them out. Then Charles Darwin wrote his book then there was something that could explain them. Later, DNA was discovered then science had a mechanism that drives evolution. So we now know why animals including domestic ones, change over time.
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