Hello aadil 77,
I don't see why worshipping idols is "cowardice" its a personal choice to worship whatever or whosoever one pleases.Same with worshipping no god, would you say that my mother & grandmother are cowards because they revere idols of Jesus & Mary? Or I am a coward because I worship no God? I personally think that we're all intelligent human beings who worship whatever we choose to.
Their cowardice was they would abandon their prophets when they fealt their lives were at risk.
Nothing, I was just saying that they had no religious conflicts before, if the Jews too had believed that the kaaba was built by Abrahim, they in all probability should have objected to this site being used for polytheistic purposes, they didn't.
This is where you will fail at bringing jews into this, jews don't believe prophet Ibrahim renovated the kaabah
Please don't be offended without reason aadil, I am not trying to suggest anything at all, all I say is that, Jews & pagans had co existed peaceful previously, neither objected to the others religious rituals, they intermarried, for that matter, there was no prohibition on conversion to Christianity either, as Waraqa ibn Nawfal shows us. If the Jews had seriously believed that the kaaba was built by Abraham, they might have wanted to stop idolatry & polytheism there,they didn't.
Again jews did not believe prophet Ibrahim had anything to do with the city of makkah, this is what the jews think:
There is no local tradition connecting Abraham with Mecca; and we are forced to put this down as a pure invention on the part of the prophet, based on political as well as on theological reasons. According to Shahrastani (Arabic text, p. 430), this Kaaba was the reproduction of the one in heaven. The "Makam Ibrahim," or Station of Abraham, is still pointed out within the sacred enclosure at Mecca; and the footsteps of the patriarch are believed by the worshipers still to be there (Snouck Hurgronje, "Het Mekkaansche Feest," p. 40; Mekka, i. 11).
Read more: http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/vi...#ixzz0mly1Q3QU
As I asked you, you have shown no proof that it was built by Ibrahim, its only belief, exactly like pagan belief in idolatry, or atheist belief in no god.
Show me proof that it was built by pagans. What proof will you except?
"And when we made the house a place of resort unto men, and a sanctuary, and (said) take the station of Abraham for a place of prayer; and covenanted with Abraham and Ishmael, saying, 'Do ye two cleanse my house for those who make the circuit, for those who pay devotions there, for those who bow down, and for those, too, who adore. . . .' And when Abraham raised up the foundations of the house with Ishmael, 'Lord, receive it from us. Verily, Thou art hearing and Thou dost know. Lord, and make us, too, resigned unto Thee and of our seed also a nation resigned unto Thee, and show us our rites, and turn toward us; verily, Thou art easy to be turned and merciful. Lord, and send them an apostle from amongst themselves, to read to them Thy signs and teach them the Book and wisdom, and to purify them; verily, Thou art the mighty and the wise'" (compare suras iii. 90-93, xxii. 27-31).
But Prophet Muhammad could have asked them to do this all the same, they might or might not have done this, in which case he could've smashed them. As an analogy, if someone enters into a Church with a Quran & begins reciting from it in the Church, I think its best to ask the individual to leave his book behind & come back, or leave the Church, rather than burning the Quran.
The kaabah was no temple as I've made clear, it had belonged to us from years ago, it had no place for idols. After arab pagans waged war against us and were defeated, we rightly conquered the city. When a city is conquered everything in it becomes spoils of war, we don't have to deal with pagans to remove their idols from our holy land, maybe the prophet did ask them -Allah knows, but it was not their place of worship that they could keep idols inside.
I would not call anyone's idols filthy aadil, same as I wouldn't call a mosque or Quran filthy. As I said, people's religious beliefs or lack thereof need to be respected. I know that people have the right to retaliate, but that doesn't include a right to destroy others' religious sites, or holy texts, for eg if Muslims attack a country today, non Muslims do have a right to retaliate, but that doesn't mean they have a right to burn all copies of the Quran or break down all mosques, then ask people to leave Islam. I think everyone has religious rights, & this is a violation of people's religious rights. Even people who have attacked you have basic rights, including rights to freedom of religion.
Yep they have the right to freedom of religion in their own religious places of worship, in this case it weren't theirs.
I realise this, but the kaaba wasn't a mosque then, it was a place of idolatrous worship, believers believed that its a place for worshipping their idols. I asked you to show me proof that it was built by Ibrahim, you didn't do that, in the absence of proof & the Jews' non objection to idolatry there, pagans could well believe that its their religious site.
I've showed you my proof, now if you want to refute this evidence you will have to bring your own 'proof' that the place was built by arab pagans.
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