The purpose of this thread is to expose the contents of the bible that alot of people including christians and jews are unaware of. Its also to expose the hypocrisy of some christians and jews who try but fail at attacking the quran and at the same time will overlook the verses in their own bible. The purpose is also to show how badly the original true scriptures sent down by Allah and preached by our prophets have been modified and added to.
I don't expect christians or jews to justify these verses - since the meanings are quite clear, you're welcome to do so though. But please do not use the following excuses: meaning was lost in translation, the verse had a metaphorical meaning, verse not to be taken literally, you dismiss parts of bible eg; the OT, verse was not by god or jesus or whoever, they're out of context etc etc. At the end of the day its in your 'holy book' called the bible.
I'll start off with the violent verses advocating murder
-Ezekiel 9:5-7 "Then I heard the LORD say to the other men, "Follow him through the city and kill everyone whose forehead is not marked. Show no mercy; have no pity! Kill them all – old and young, girls and women and little children. god threatens to kill women and children
-Hosea 13:16 (King James) Samaria will bear her guilt because she has rebelled against her God.
They will fall by the sword; their little ones will be dashed to pieces, and their pregnant women ripped open.god threatens to kill pregnant women and children by the sword
-Ezekiel 23 - 25 I will direct my jealous anger against you, and they will deal with you in fury. They will cut off your noses and your ears, and those of you who are left will fall by the sword. They will take away your sons and daughters, and those of you who are left will be consumed by fire. 26 They will also strip you of your clothes and take your fine jewelry. god threatens more slaughter
-Exodus 31:15 For six days, work is to be done, but the seventh day is a Sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD. Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day must be put to death. god commands you to kill those who work on the sabbath
-If a man or woman living among you in one of the towns the LORD gives you is found doing evil in the eyes of the LORD your God in violation of his covenant, and contrary to my command has worshiped other gods, bowing down to them or to the sun or the moon or the stars of the sky… Take the man or woman who has done this evil deed to your city gate and stone that person to death. – Deut 17:2-7 god commands you to kill anyone who worships other gods
-Suppose you hear in one of the towns the LORD your God is giving you that some worthless rabble among you have led their fellow citizens astray by encouraging them to worship foreign gods. In such cases…you must attack that town and completely destroy all its inhabitants, as well as all the livestock. Then you must pile all the plunder in the middle of the street and burn it. Put the entire town to the torch as a burnt offering to the LORD your God. Deuteronomy 13:7-12: Again you must massacre everyone follows different religions
-If your own full brother, or your son or daughter, or your beloved wife, or you intimate friend, entices you secretly to serve other gods …do not yield to him or listen to him, nor look with pity upon him, to spare or shield him, but kill him. - Deut 13:7-12 no mercy for anyone who worships another god - they all must die even if they're family
-Anyone who blasphemes the name of the LORD must be put to death. The entire assembly must stone him. – Lev 24:16 who says blasphemy of god isn't a big deal - the 'LORD' commands you to kill them
-All who curse their father or mother must be put to death. - Leviticus 20:9 disrespectful children must be killed too, funny how alot of people in this country are still alive
-If someone has a stubborn and rebellious son who will not obey his father and mother, who does not heed them when they discipline him, then his father and his mother shall ... say to the elders of his town, ‘This son of ours is stubborn and rebellious. He will not obey us. He is a glutton and a drunkard.’ Then all the men of the town shall stone him to death. - Deut 21 looks like big emphasis on respect to parents otherwise you face death
-If your hand or your foot causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life maimed or crippled than to have two hands or two feet and be thrown into eternal fire. And if your eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into the fire of hell. - Matthew 18:7-9 big emphasis on not sinning to the extent you should amputate yourself, what's jesus salvation good for then?
-Now therefore, kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman who has known man by lying with him. But all the young girls who have not known man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves. - Numbers 31 god wants you to kill little boys and women who have fornicated, little girls can be kept as slaves
-If a man beats his male or female slave with a rod and the slave dies as a direct result, he must be punished, but he is not to be punished if the slave gets up after a day or two, since the slave is his property. - Exodus Chapter 21:20 killing a slave not a big deal
-"Take all the heads of the people and hang them up before the Lord against the sun.” -- Numbers 25:4 I wonder which people?
-"... at midnight the Lord smote all the first born in the land of Egypt, from the first born of the pharaoh...unto the first born of the captive that was in the dungeon; and all the first born cattle" -- Exodus 12:29 god says he killed all newly born children in egypt
- "Their children shall be dashed to pieces before their eyes! There houses spoiled, and their wives raped...Dash the young men to pieces...have no pity on the fruit of the womb, the children shall not be spared" -- Isa 13:16-18 god wants you to rape women, kill pregnant women and kill children
-“Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones.” --Psalms 137:9 god recommends killing your children
-“And he went up from thence unto Bethel: and as he was going up by the way, there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head. And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them.” -- 2kings2:23-24 god kills children for mockin a bald girl
-46 "This is what the Sovereign LORD says: Bring a mob against them and give them over to terror and plunder. 47 The mob will stone them and cut them down with their swords; they will kill their sons and daughters and burn down their houses. Reminds us of all the war crimes against muslims dont it? palestine, iraq, afghanistan...
Next up verses with the obsession of human waste and pornographic description
Last edited by aadil77; 04-28-2010 at 12:45 AM.
Reason: added some more
He it is Who sends blessings on you, as do His angels, that He may bring you out from the depths of Darkness into Light: and He is Full of Mercy to the Believers. [Quran {33:43}] www.QuranicAudio.com www.Quran.com
Coincidently I was reciting Ali Imran this evening, and the following verses from the surah remind me of those stealth crusaders.
QS. 3: 69-72
A party of the people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians) wish to lead you astray. But they shall not lead astray anyone except themselves, and they perceive not.
O People of the Scripture! Why disbelieve ye in the revelations of Allah, when ye (yourselves) bear witness (to their truth)?
O people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians): "Why do you mix truth with falsehood and conceal the truth while you know?"
sadaqa Allah al3atheem!
Text without context is pretext If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him
Christians follow the teachings of Christ. Where any teaching of Christ contradicts something in the old testament, the teachings of Christ will prevail.
Well, no because Christ taught love and so those verses cannot be used for anything.
So you've just destroyed the trinity because according to you Jesus is not the God gave have Moses the 10 commandments and all those other strict laws , .
Jesus is different and he taught love and that means you now believe in 2 different Gods with 2 different set of laws for mankind
Whereas If you believe that Jesus is the same God of the OT. So basically what we have is this:
1- Jesus is God
2- Jesus is the God of the Old Testement
3- Christians believe that the OT is the inspired word of God
4- The OT is authentic to the Christian
5- The God in the OT is Jesus
So since Jesus is the God of the OT, we shall now look at the God of the OT ordering the KILLINGS of many people:
Zephaniah 2:12-15
"You Ethiopians will also be slaughtered by my sword," says the LORD. And the LORD will strike the lands of the north with his fist. He will destroy Assyria and make its great capital, Nineveh, a desolate wasteland, parched like a desert. The city that once was so proud will become a pasture for sheep and cattle. All sorts of wild animals will settle there. Owls of many kinds will live among the ruins of its palaces, hooting from the gaping windows. Rubble will block all the doorways, and the cedar paneling will lie open to the wind and weather. This is the fate of that boisterous city, once so secure. "In all the world there is no city as great as I," it boasted. But now, look how it has become an utter ruin, a place where animals live! Everyone passing that way will laugh in derision or shake a defiant fist
Ezekiel 9:5-7
"Then I heard the LORD say to the other men, "Follow him through the city and kill everyone whose forehead is not marked. Show no mercy; have no pity! Kill them all – old and young, girls and women and little children. But do not touch anyone with the mark. Begin your task right here at the Temple." So they began by killing the seventy leaders. "Defile the Temple!" the LORD commanded. "Fill its courtyards with the bodies of those you kill! Go!" So they went throughout the city and did as they were told."
These are just 2 examples the God in the OT ordering the death and destruction of the people. In fact the verses are very explicit; the God of the OT is making it clear that it is HIS SWORD which shall slay the people.
So since Jesus is God, and is the God of the OT, this means that it was Jesus who ordered these killings and it was Jesus who killed all these people! Hence your myth is DEBUNKED. Jesus did kill, and Jesus ordered the killings of women and children, the fact that you claim that Jesus never killed anyone is a plane intentional lie why would you make such a blatant lie? And it also leaves us with another question, which is what else do you Christians lie about? What other myths and propaganda do they create on their made up faith? We can only guess, but no doubt each lie will get caught and exposed.
Last edited by Predator; 05-11-2010 at 09:08 PM.
When truth is hurled at falsehood , falsehood perishes. because falsehood by its nature is bound to perish [21:18- Holy quran]
Truth is not a personal opinion but a historically accurate fact!
Banking on Br. woodrow's wisdom doesn't exempt you from exercising some common sense or remaining silent until you learn it!
all the best
Text without context is pretext If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him
The Bible my friend is the word of God. Just like the Quran.
God is not always nice but he is always good and kind.
Some verses in the Bible are intentionally inserted in order to catch
the eyes of evil people (like we know there are everywhere) and
by that punishing them by twisting their souls.
The Quran tells us that parts of the other religions are wrong -
but he does not tell us what parts.
Above all - he does not say that the Bible itself is wrong. We have to be
very careful in that. Because we might say that something is wrong
but if it is indeed the word of God we are doing a great error.
I think that this is the place were we are not succeeding. We must
very carefully study the other religions - and find exactly where they
are wrong. If we would be able to do that we would be able to explain
ourselves better.
The Bible my friend is the word of God. Just like the Quran.
I see from your status that you are a muslim.
Please provide evidence that bible is the word of God. from the Qur'an verses and hadith hasan or shahih. Because as far as I know, the God decreed Taurat, Zabur, Injeel to the prophets prior Muhammad SAW, but not bible.
God is not always nice but he is always good and kind.
this is meaningless.
Some verses in the Bible are intentionally inserted in order to catch
the eyes of evil people (like we know there are everywhere) and
by that punishing them by twisting their souls.
Please give evidence from the Qur'an or hadiths.
I see that you claim to be a muslim scholar, so could you please be a little more scholarly when giving opinions?
How interesting lately we have a barrage of people claiming to be whatever they are, and yet what came out in writing totally negate their claim.
Sorry there is nothing wrong in showing the falsehood in the bible
The Bible my friend is the word of God. Just like the Quran.
my friend even christians do not believe the bible is the word of god, stop dreaming
God is not always nice but he is always good and kind.
May Allah forgive you, do not associate human qualities to Him
Some verses in the Bible are intentionally inserted in order to catch
the eyes of evil people (like we know there are everywhere) and
by that punishing them by twisting their souls.
The Quran tells us that parts of the other religions are wrong -
but he does not tell us what parts.
The quran is not a person that 'he' tells us, its Allah that has told us in the Quran that previous scriptures are corrupted
Above all - he does not say that the Bible itself is wrong. We have to be
very careful in that. Because we might say that something is wrong
but if it is indeed the word of God we are doing a great error.
Well we'll know if its wrong if it contradicts with the Quran
I think that this is the place were we are not succeeding. We must
very carefully study the other religions - and find exactly where they
are wrong. If we would be able to do that we would be able to explain
ourselves better.
Thats exactly what I've done so read the thread again
Blessings.
Are you actually muslim? we refer to the one god as Allah not god
He it is Who sends blessings on you, as do His angels, that He may bring you out from the depths of Darkness into Light: and He is Full of Mercy to the Believers. [Quran {33:43}] www.QuranicAudio.com www.Quran.com
I do not associate human attributes to him as kindness is not a human attribute.
We all call him Rahaman which means merciful. Is mercy a human attribute?
No. Humans are capable of it but it is not a human attribute.
The Quran, as the word of Allah, tells us that previous scriptures are corrupted.
But he does not tell you which scriptures it is. There are many scriptures and not
all of them are corrupted.
In fact we should be very careful not to dispute scripture which the Quran, as the
word of Allah approves because then we are doing a mistake.
I have no problem saying when things are wrong. On the contrary - when things are
wrong I would do anything to correct the mistake - as we are commanded.
As for contradiction.
What we as humans in our small mind see as contradiction is hardly what he blessed be he views
as contradiction. In fact, as the word of Allah, there is nothing in the world that can contradict
the words of the Quran.
It is only people who can choose to follow the perfect way described in it or not.
As for what you have done - the direction you are taking is blessed. However, we must be more careful.
Don't get me wrong my friend - I believe that what you do is blessed. However, we must be more careful.
As for evidence. The Bible is not the word of him in the same way that the Quran is. They are different
books.
As you know, the Quran is Allah's message to humanity.
This is not what the Bible is.
The books do not contradict each other. They are just different.
In short, I would not dispute anything that I think might have a chance
to be correct in the eyes of Allah. I am simply careful with that.
In fact, as a Muslim, I believe that anything belongs to him and
therefore, at the end, everything is his word including this one.
The only thing that is mine is wether I choose to be a Muslim
and follow the path paved for us - or not.
And this only he can know. I do not need to prove that to anybody and indeed
I cannot and neither can anybody else. It is not about proving.
As for verses which are inserted in the Bible in order to twist the souls of people. I do not need to go to Hadith for proving you this. You can see that by yourself at your local newspaper my friend.
I do not associate human attributes to him as kindness is not a human attribute.
Yh so why did you say Allah is not 'nice' sometimes? Be very careful and ask for forgivenes
The Quran, as the word of Allah, tells us that previous scriptures are corrupted.
But he does not tell you which scriptures it is. There are many scriptures and not
all of them are corrupted.
All previous scriptures are corrupted, He did not say 'some' are corrupted, all of them are. Corrupted does not mean everything within them is incorrect rather parts of it are incorrect
In fact we should be very careful not to dispute scripture which the Quran, as the
word of Allah approves because then we are doing a mistake.
What do you mean?
What we as humans in our small mind see as contradiction is hardly what he blessed be he views
as contradiction. In fact, as the word of Allah, there is nothing in the world that can contradict
the words of the Quran.
I dont get what you're talking about, I said parts of the bible which contradict with the quran are obviously incorrect
As for evidence. The Bible is not the word of him in the same way that the Quran is. They are different
books.
I'm afraid you don't have the knowledge about that, as we have never seen the true uncorrupted scriptures we cannot say how they were different, we can only compare what is left of them with the quran. The torah and injeel could have been the direct words of Allah in the same way as the quran, but we dont know for certain
The books do not contradict each other. They are just different.
This is where you are seriously misguided, if the bible is different and does not contradict do you accept it as the complete true words of Allah? They clearly contradict, I doubt you are any religious scholar as you claim. Everyone knows they contradict, can you prove they don't?
In fact, as a Muslim, I believe that anything belongs to him and
therefore, at the end, everything is his word including this one.
What is His words?
I think you need to read the bible and accept that muslims cannot call it the true word of god
He it is Who sends blessings on you, as do His angels, that He may bring you out from the depths of Darkness into Light: and He is Full of Mercy to the Believers. [Quran {33:43}] www.QuranicAudio.com www.Quran.com
As for verses which are inserted in the Bible in order to twist the souls of people. I do not need to go to Hadith for proving you this. You can see that by yourself at your local newspaper my friend.
What do you mean 'inserted in the Bible in order to twist the souls of people'?
He it is Who sends blessings on you, as do His angels, that He may bring you out from the depths of Darkness into Light: and He is Full of Mercy to the Believers. [Quran {33:43}] www.QuranicAudio.com www.Quran.com
The Quran, as the word of Allah, tells us that previous scriptures are corrupted.
But he does not tell you which scriptures it is. There are many scriptures and not
all of them are corrupted.
If there were scriptures which were the word of God and had not been corrupted what would be the reason to reveal the Quran? Why would God have more than one correct religion at any one time?
format_quote Originally Posted by Gabriel Ibn Yus
As for evidence. The Bible is not the word of him in the same way that the Quran is. They are different
books.
As you know, the Quran is Allah's message to humanity.
This is not what the Bible is.
Please elaborate.
format_quote Originally Posted by Gabriel Ibn Yus
In short, I would not dispute anything that I think might have a chance
to be correct in the eyes of Allah. I am simply careful with that.
I agree with this comment, but only for those things which cannot be confirmed or refuted using verses from the Quran, and even then in a very very limited way (like you cannot follow them or use them; the most you can say is they are neither confirmed nor rejected). However, I am not a scholar, and if this is the wrong view to take please provide me with evidence for a more correct view.
In fact, as a Muslim, I believe that anything belongs to him and
therefore, at the end, everything is his word including this one.
This makes no sense. What about the words which go against what the Quran says? You cannot believe 2 opposing views.
You can only believe in one voice my friend. This is true.
But all voices. Even the ones you should not believe in are his.
It is just impossible otherwise.
As I said. There is only one religion and this is the religion of Islam.
In fact show me a definition of the religion of Judaism show me a
definition of the religion of Christianity. You cannot.
I do not speak about things I do not know what they are.
I do not think that you are wrong, on the contrary you are very right my friend.
I think that we should be neutral with respect to things which we should be neutral
about and to attack when the things we believe in are violated as to make sure
that other people are not corrupted in the way.
If I compare the Quran to the Bible there is one striking difference
which I can see.
Although the Quran is the word of Allah it is written in a clear and
straight forward way so that any human can understand that -
thus it is a message for all humanity. An absolute message that is.
On the other hand - the Bible is not clear, not straightforward, confusing
and inconsistent to our eyes.
This does not mean that it is wrong or flawed but rather - that it is not
to be viewed as a message to humanity in the sense that the Quran is.
In my eyes, the Bible is a necessary preliminary to the Quran much like
a ground is a necessary preliminary to a flower. I think this is the best
example I can give.
You can only believe in one voice my friend. This is true.
But all voices. Even the ones you should not believe in are his.
It is just impossible otherwise.
I have never seen this kind of stance in Islam before but I would like to understand what you mean, since so far I do not.
Lets start with an easy example:
Christian belief: "Jesus is the son of God".
Muslim belief: "Jesus is not the son of God".
How can you reconcile these 2 beliefs? You cannot say that you are neutral because being neutral or unsure of the first statement is in itself a form of disbelief in Islam.
format_quote Originally Posted by Gabriel Ibn Yus
and to attack when the things we believe in are violated as to make sure
that other people are not corrupted in the way.
I can be neutral on things which have nothing to do with belief in Islam.
For instance.
If a Christian would come to me and tell me I believe that Jesues was
the son of God - I would say that he is an idolater not as an insult but
simply because this is the definition of the word - idolizing something
which you by yourself acknowledge is not God himself.
I think this is clear.
However, if a Christian would come to me - I see the term "son" as an
abstract term which says the Christ was on a very high spiritual level and
he was so free from the bounds of this world that he was not a "slave" but
rather such a devoted believer that he was to Allah's world almost like a son
in a kingdom. I would say this starts to make sense and goes into the domain
of neutral.
Because - it is not literal belief in foolish things but rather shows of a certain
devotion. We might agree with the terminology or not (and with this we are
free to argue) however, you must agree with me that it is a much less problematic statement.
Now, it might be that for the founders of the Church, and even for Christ himself (which we
do acknowledge as an important religious leader and a prophet) this was the real meaning of the
word.
Thus it is very reasonable that through the course of time it is the meaning of the words which
has been corrupted but not verses themselves. This is because the verses are not straightforward.
Even if you would read the New Testament itself you would see that it is Jesus that says that it
is said in riddles.
However, the Quran is not like that. The Quran is straightforward and can never, Allah forbid, be
given different meanings.
The Bible and the New Testament can. And this is where the problem begins.
Thus, it is the task of Muslim to explain and sometimes remind to others, when they are wrong, that they are wrong.
Aadil, being nice is not always good. Allah is always good but not
always nice. Maybe I said my words to hastily and presented them
in a way which might sound offensive while, Allah forbid, I am not.
Let me explain -
What I meant to say is that Allah is not always nice
because sometimes, when needed, when those who do not
believe obey his will, he is also harsh and sometimes he is vengeful.
When necessary.
Indeed, you can see I am right, for the non-believers do we not refer to
him by the name "Al-Muntaqin" and "Al-Mumit" and by the name "Ad-daar"?
Of course, for a believer, these sides of him are far away from our mind and
it is only a sign of strong belief when it is. Yet, sadly, sometimes when judgment
is needed for some we know he needs to be harsh.
As for corruption.
Only people are corrupted. And they are corrupted by their evil inclinations and Jinns.
Corruption is a human word. The prophecies and scriptures
we have, from Prophets acknowledged by our Prophet cannot be corrupted because a prophecy or
scripture given by force of prophecy does not come from human words at all. And in case of
the prophets which we acknowledge does not come from the Jinn either.
I can be neutral on things which have nothing to do with belief in Islam.
For instance.
If a Christian would come to me and tell me I believe that Jesues was
the son of God - I would say that he is an idolater not as an insult but
simply because this is the definition of the word - idolizing something
which you by yourself acknowledge is not God himself.
I think this is clear.
However, if a Christian would come to me - I see the term "son" as an
abstract term which says the Christ was on a very high spiritual level and
he was so free from the bounds of this world that he was not a "slave" but
rather such a devoted believer that he was to Allah's world almost like a son
in a kingdom. I would say this starts to make sense and goes into the domain
of neutral.
Because - it is not literal belief in foolish things but rather shows of a certain
devotion. We might agree with the terminology or not (and with this we are
free to argue) however, you must agree with me that it is a much less problematic statement.
Now, it might be that for the founders of the Church, and even for Christ himself (which we
do acknowledge as an important religious leader and a prophet) this was the real meaning of the
word.
Thus it is very reasonable that through the course of time it is the meaning of the words which
has been corrupted but not verses themselves. This is because the verses are not straightforward.
Even if you would read the New Testament itself you would see that it is Jesus that says that it
is said in riddles.
However, the Quran is not like that. The Quran is straightforward and can never, Allah forbid, be
given different meanings.
The Bible and the New Testament can. And this is where the problem begins.
Thus, it is the task of Muslim to explain and sometimes remind to others, when they are wrong, that they are wrong.
This sounds more and more like a stealth crusader.
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