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    A Message To The Non-Muslims. (OP)


    A Message To The Non-Muslims After which they are not Excused by Ignorance


    Bismillaahir Rahmaanir Raheem

    Dear Reader,

    The purpose of this message is to invite you to think of and contemplate about the real purpose of your life on this earth and where you will end up in the Hereafter. Will you end up in Paradise or in Hell-Fire? Please, take note, that when you have read this message, you are considered to have legislatively been given proof and been informed of the admonition of all messengers, and after which you will not be excused by ignorance:

    Take note that Allah the Almighty is the One and Only God. He is Eternal. He is Absolute. He has not begotten and has not been begotten and no one is like Him.
    • Allah says: Say: He is Allah, the One; Allah, the Eternal, Absolute; He begetteth not, nor is He begotten; and there is none like unto Him. Surah No.112, Verses 1-4.
    • Allah says: He is the Creator of the heavens and the earth: He has made for you pairs from among cattle: by this means does He multiply you: there is nothing whatever like unto Him, and He is the One that hears and sees. Surah No. 42, Verse No. 11.
    Learn that Allah the Almighty is the Creator of all creatures. There is no god for this universe and what it holds but Allah.
    • Allah says: Allah is the Creator Of all things, and He is the Guardian and Disposer of all affairs. Surah No.39 Verse 62.
    • Allah says: Such is Allah, your Lord, The Creator of all things, there is no god but He: Then how you are deluded away from the Truth! Surah No.40, Verse No.62.
    • Allah says: To Allah belongs all that is in the heavens and earth: To Allah do all matters return. Surah No.3 Verse No. 109.
    Be informed that Allah the Almighty has created you for one single purpose which is to worship Him alone.
    • Allah says: I have only created Jinns and men, that they may serve Me. Surah No.51 Verse No. 56.
    Allah says: And they have been commanded no more than this: To worship Allah, offering Him sincere devotion, being true (in faith); to establish regular prayer; and to give zakat (i.e. charity given to the needy); and that is the Religion Right and Straight. Surah No.98, Verse No. 5.

    Understand that it is out of sincerity and purity of worship to Allah to avoid worshipping the created whoever and whatever they may be.
    • Allah says: Certainly they disbelieve who say: “(Allah) is Christ the son of Mary." But said Christ: "O Children of Israel! Worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord.” Whoever joins other gods with Allah, - Allah will forbid him the Garden, and the Fire will be his abode. There will for the wrong-doers be no one to help. Surah No. 5, Verse No. 72.
    Allah says: Say: "I do no more than invoke my Lord, and I join not with Him any (false god).” Surah No 72, Verse No. 20.

    Allah says: Say: "I am but a man like yourselves, (but) the inspiration has come to me, that your God is one God: whoever expects to meet his Lord, let him work righteousness, and, in the worship of his Lord, admit no one as partner. Surah No. 18, Verse No. 110.

    Allah says: Those to whom We have given the Book rejoice at what hath been revealed unto thee: but there are among the clans those who reject a part thereof. Say: "I am commanded to worship Allah, and not to join partners with Him. Unto Him do I call, and unto Him is my return. Surah No. 13, Verse No. 36.

    Learn that he, who worships Allah joining with Him another whoever or whatever it may be, has associated partners with Allah and consequently his deeds will turn fruitless and he will be among the losers.
    • Allah says: But it has already been revealed to thee, - as it was to those before thee, - “if thou wert to join (gods with Allah), truly fruitless will be thy work (in life), and thou wilt surely be among the losers. Surah No. 29, Verse No. 65.

    Allah says: This is the Guidance of Allah: He giveth that guidance to whom He pleaseth, of His servants if they were to join other gods with Him, all that they did would be vain for them. Surah No. 6, Verse No.88.

    Take note that Allah the Almighty sent all Prophets and Messengers to reinforce and remind people that there is no god but Allah. That is nothing is worthy of being worshipped but Allah.
    • Allah says: “For we assuredly sent amongst every people a Messenger, (with the command), “serve Allah, and eschew Evil”: of the people were some whom Allah guided, and some on whom Error became inevitably (established). So travel through the earth, and see what was the end of those who denied (the Truth). Surah No.16, Verse No. 36.

    Allah says: Not a messenger did We send before thee without this inspiration sent by Us to him: that there is no god but I; therefore worship and serve Me.” Surah 21 Verse 25. There is no prophet who said to his people but: We sent Noah to his people. He said: “O my people! Worship Allah! Ye have no other god but Him. I fear for you the Punishment of a dreadful Day! Surah No. 7, Verse No. 59.

    Be informed that having faith and believing in all Prophets and Messengers is a must. If anyone rejects faith or doesn’t believe one Prophet or Messenger of Allah’s the Almighty, they are rejecting faith in Allah and disbelieving Him and all His Prophets and Messengers.
    • Allah says: “The Messenger believeth in what hath been revealed to him from his Lord, as do the men of faith, each one (of them) believeth in Allah, His angels, His books, and His Messengers. “We make no distinction (they say) between one and another of his Messengers.” And they say: “We hear, and we obey: (we seek) Thy forgiveness, our Lord, and to Thee is the end of all journeys.” Surah No. 2, Verse No. 285.
    Allah says: “‘Verily it has been revealed to us that the Chastisement (awaits) those who reject and turn away. Surah No. 20, Verse No. 48.

    Allah says: And who does more wrong than he who invents a lie against Allah or rejects the Truth when it reaches him? Is there not a home in Hell for those who reject Faith?” Surah No.29, Verse No. 68.

    Allah says: Those who reject the Book and the (revelations) with which we sent Our messengers: but soon shall they know. Surah No. 40, Verse No. 70.

    Be informed that Muhammad bin Abudullah bin Abdullmutalib (Peace and Blessings of Allah Be Upon Him) (PBBUH ) is the Messenger of Allah, who was sent by Allah as mercy to the worlds, giving glad tidings and warnings and that he is the seal of all Prophets and messengers and there is no Prophet after him.
    • Allah says: “Muhammad is no more than a Messenger: many were the Messengers that passed away before him. If he died or were slain, will ye then turn back on your heels? If any did turn back on his heels, not the least harm will he do to Allah; but Allah (on the other hand) will swiftly reward those who (serve Him) with gratitude. Surah No. 3, Verse No. 144.

    Allah says: “Those who follow the Messenger, the unlettered Prophet whom they find mentioned in their own (Scriptures),-in the Taurat and the Gospel; - for he commands them what is just and Forbids them what is evil; he allows them as lawful what is good (and pure) and prohibits them from what is bad (and impure): He releases them from their heavy burdens and from the yokes that are upon them. So it is those who believe in him, honour him, help him, and follow the Light which is sent down with him, - it is they who will prosper.” Surah No. 7, verse No. 157.


    Allah says: “Say: “O men! I am sent unto you all, as the Messenger of Allah, to who belongeth the dominion of the heavens and the earth: there is no god but He: it is He that giveth both life and death. So believe in Allah and His Messenger. The unlettered Prophet, who believeth in Allah and His words, follow him that (so) ye may be guided. Surah No. 7, Verse No. 158.


    Allah says: “Now hath come to you a Messenger from amongst yourselves: it grieves him that you should suffer, ardently anxious is he over you: to the Believers is he most kind and merciful”. Surah No. 9, Verse No. 128.

    Allah says: Muhammad is not the father of any of your men, but (he is) the Messenger of Allah, and the Seal of the Prophets. And Allah has full knowledge of all things. Surah No. 33, Verse No. 40.

    Allah says: Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah… Surah No 48, Verse No. 29.

    Allah says: And remember, Jesus, the Son of Mary, said: “O Children of Israel! I am the messenger of Allah (sent) to you, confirming the Taurat (which came) before me, and giving Glad Tidings of a messenger to come after me, whose name shall be Ahmad. But when he came to them with Clear Signs, They said, “This is evident sorcery! Surah No.61, Verse No.6. Take note that Allah the Almighty revealed to Muhammad (PBBUH) the Holy Quran which is the word of Allah and which contains Guidance and Light for the worlds. It has alsoexplanation of everything.
    • Allah says: “Ramadan is the (month) in which was sent down The Qur’an, as a guide to mankind, also clear (Signs) for guidance and judgment (between right and wrong) so every one of you who is present (at his home) during that month should spent it in fasting, but if anyone is ill, or on a journey, the prescribed period (should be made up) by days later. Allah intends every facility for you: He does not want to put you to difficulties. (He wants you) to complete the prescribed period, and glorify Him in that He has guided you; and perchance ye shall be grateful. Surah No.2, Verse No.185.

    Allah says: Say: “What thing is most weighty in evidence?” say: “Allah is witness between me and you; this Qur’an hath been revealed to me by inspiration. That I may warn you and all whom it reaches. Can ye possibly bear witness that besides Allah there are other gods?” say: “Nay! I cannot bear witness! Surah No. 6, Verse No. 19.

    Allah says: Verily this Quran doth guide to that which is most right (or stable), and giveth the glad tidings to the Believers who work deeds of righteousness, that they shall have a magnificent reward. Surah No. 17, Verse No. 9.

    Allah says: “We send down (stage by stage) of the Quran that which is a healing and a mercy to those who believe: to the unjust it causes nothing but loss after loss. Surah No. 17, Verse No. 82.

    Allah says: “As for thee, thou receives theQuran from One All-Wise, All-Knowing.Surah No. 27, Verse No. 6.

    Allah says: And We have explained to man, in this Quran, every kind of similitude: yet greater part of men refuse (to receive it) except with gratitude! Surah No. 17, Verse No. 89.

    Appreciate that the Holy Quran, which was revealed to Allah’s Prophet (PBBUH), has been the Greatest Evident Miracle Ever. It is continuing and everlastingly challenging all mankind gathered together to produce something like it or like one of its Surahs.
    • Allah says: “Say: ‘if the whole of mankind and Jinns were to gather together to produce the like of this Quran, they could not produce the like thereof, even if they backed up each other with help and support.’ Surah No. 17, Verse No. 88.

    Allah says: “And if ye are in doubt as to what We have revealed from time to time to Our servant then produce a Sura like thereunto; and call your witness or helpers (if there are any) besides Allah, if ye are truthful. Surah No. 2, Verse No. 23.

    Be informed that Allah has ordered all mankind no matter what their colours, sexes; languages may be to believe in Muhammad the Prophet (PBBUP), follow him and obey him. He who obeys the Prophet (PBBUH) obeys Allah and consequently he will be on the right path; and; he who disobeysthe Prophet (PBBUH), disobeys Allah and consequently he will be on the wrong path.
    • Allah says: “Say: “Obey Allah and His Messenger”: but if they turn back, Allah loveth not those who reject faith. Surah No. 3, Verse No. 32.

    Allah says: O ye who believe! Obey Allah and His Messenger, and turn not away from him when ye hear (him speak). Surah No. 8, Verse No. 20.

    Allah says: He who obeys the Messenger, obeys Allah… Surah No. 4, Verse No. 80.

    Allah says: “Say: “if ye do love Allah, follow me: Allah will love you and forgive you your sins: for Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most merciful. Surah No. 3, Verse No. 31. Take note that he who hears of Muhammad the Prophet (PBBUH) and neither believes in him nor follows him is a disbeliever in Allah, rejecting faith in Him andconsequently worthy to be tortured on the Day of Judgement.
    • Allah says: “We know indeed the grief which their words do cause thee: It is not thee they reject: It is the Signs of Allah, which the wicked deny. Surah No. 6, Verse No. 33.

    Allah says: On that day those who reject Faith and disobey the Messenger will wish that the earth were made one with them: but never will they hide a single fact from Allah! Surah No. 4, Verse No. 42.

    Allah says: “If anyone contends with the Messenger even after Guidance has been plainly conveyed to him, and follows a path other than that becoming to men to Faith, we shall leave him in the path he has chosen, and land him in Hell,- What an evil refuge! Surah No. 4, Verse No. 115.


    The Prophet (PBBUH) says: “By the One in whose hands Muhammad’s soul is, if anyone, anywhere in the world, whether a Jew or Christian hears of me and dies without believing in my Message will definitely be amongst those in Hell-Fire. (Muslim)

    Take note that the Religion before Allah is Islam and it is the religion of all Prophets and Messengers. No religion is accepted of anyone but Islam.
    • Allah says: And Abraham enjoined upon his sons and so did Jacob;” Oh my sons! Allah hath chosen the Faith for you; then die not except in the state of submission (to Me). Surah No. 2, Verse No.132.

    Allah says: “
    The Religion before Allah is Islam..Surah No. 3, Verse No. 19.


    Allah says: If anyone desires a religion other than Islam (submission to Allah) never will it be accepted of him; and in the Hereafter he will be in the ranks of those who have lost. Surah No. 3, Verse No.85.

    Be informed that resurrection after death is coming and absolutely true; the Hour is coming and absolutely true and theaccountability on doomsday is absolutely true.
    • Allah says: “Lost indeed are they who treat it as a falsehood that they must meet Allah, - until on a sudden the Hour is on them, and they say: “Ah! Woe unto us that we neglected; for they bear their burdens on their backs, and evil indeed are the burdens that they bear? Surah No. 6 Verse No. 31.

    Allah says: Verily the Hour is coming- I have almost kept it hidden- for every soul to receive its reward by the measure of its Endeavour.” Surah No. 20, Verse No. 15.

    Allah says: And verily the Hour will come: there can be no doubt about it, or about (the fact) that Allah will raise up all who are in the graves. Surah No. 22, Verse No. 7.

    Allah says: The Unbelievers say, “Never to us will come the Hour”: say, “Nay! But most surely, by my Lord, it will come upon you;… Surah No 34, Verse No. 3.

    Allah says: The Hour will certainly come: therein is no doubt: yet most men believe not. Surah No. 40, Verse No. No. 59.

    Allah says: Again, on the Day of Judgement, will ye be raised up. Surah No. 23, Verse No. 16.

    Allah says: Allah is never unjust in the least degree: if there is any good (done), He doubleth it, and giveth from His Own self a great reward. Surah No. 4, Verse No. 40.

    Allah says: Then shall anyone who has done an atom’s weight of good, see it! And anyone who has done an atom’s weight of evil, shall see it. Surah No. 99, Verses Nos. 7-8. Learn that Paradise and its bounties are absolutely true, therein everlasting goodness and bounties of which no ear has ever heard of, or an eye has ever seen or a mind has ever been able to imagine. All this has been prepared Allah’s righteous believers.
    • Allah says: The parable of the Garden which the righteous are promised! - beneath it flow rivers; perpetual is the fruits therof and the shade therein: such is the End of the Righteous and the End of the Unbelievers is the Fire. Surah No. 13, Verse No. 35.

    Allah says: But give glad tidings to those who believe and work righteousness, that their portion is Gardens, beneath which rivers flow, every time they are fed with fruits therefrom, they say: “Why, this what we were fed with before,” for that are given things in similitude; and they have therein spouses purified; and they abide therein (forever).” Surah No. 2, Verse No. 25.

    Allah says: But those who believe and work deeds of righteousness- to them shall We give a Home in Heaven, - lofty mansions beneath which flow rivers, -to dwell therein for aye; an excellent reward for those who do (good)! Surah No. 29, Verse No. 58.

    Allah says: Verily the Companions of the Garden shall that Day have joy in all that they do. Surah No. 36, Verse No. 55.

    Allah says: (Here is) the description of the Garden which the righteous are promised: in it are rivers of water unstaling; rivers of Milk of which the taste never changes; rivers of wine, a joy to those who drink; and rivers of honey pure and clear. In it there are for them all kinds of fruits; and Forgiveness from their Lord, (can those in such Bliss) be compared to such as shall dwell fro ever in the Fire and be given to drink, boiling water, so that it cuts up their bowels (to pieces)? Surah No.47, Verse No. 15.

    Allah says: Be quick in the race for forgiveness from your Lord and for a Garden whose width is that (of the whole) of the heavens and of the earth, prepared for the righteous. Surah No.3 Verse No 133.


    Allah says: “Be ye foremost (in seeking) forgiveness from your Lord, and a Garden (of Bliss), the width whereof is as the width of heaven and earth prepared for those who believe in Allah and His messengers: that is the Grace of Allah, which He bestows on whom He pleases: and Allah is the Lord of Grace abounding. Surah No. 57, Verse No. 21.

    Learn that the Hell fire is absolutely true; its torture in is true; and fierce. It has a torture that is extremely fierce, harsh, and perpetual. Its torture is something that no ear has ever heard of, or an eye has ever seen or a mind has ever been able to imagine. All this has been prepared for those who associate partners with Allah and who made it false to believe in Allah.
    • Allah says: “Know they not that for those who oppose Allah and His Messenger is the Fire of Hell? - Wherein they shall dwell. That is the supreme disgrace.Surah No.9, Verse No. 63.

    Allah says: …on the Day of Judgement we shall gather them together, prone on their faces, blind, dumb, and deaf: their abode will be Hell: every time it shows abatement, We shall increase for them the fierceness of the Fire. Surah No. 17, Verse No. 97.

    Allah says:And We shall drive the sinners to hell, (like thirsty cattle driven down to water) Surah No. 19, Verse No. 86.

    Allah says: “Verily he who comes to his Lord as a sinner (at Judgement), -for him is Hell: therein shall he neither die nor live. Surah No. 20, Verse No. 74.

    Allah says: But those who reject (Allah) - for them will be the Fire of Hell: not term shall be determined for them, so they should die, nor shall its Chastisement be lightened for them. Thus do WE reward every ungrateful. Surah No. 35, Verse No. 36.

    Allah says: “The Unbelievers will be led to Hell in groups: until, when they arrive there, its gates will be opened. And its Keepers will say, “Did not messengers come to you from among yourselves, rehearsing to you the Signs of your Lord, and warning you of the Meeting of this Day of yours?” The answer will be: “True: but the Decree of Chastisement has been proved true against the Unbelievers! Surah No. 39, Verse No. 71.

    Take note that if you die believing in the oneness of God and in Muhammad (PBBUH), Allah’s last Messenger, you will be amongst those who will be saved and led into Paradise to live in its bounties for ever.
    • Allah says: “But such as come to Him as Believers who have worked righteous deeds, for them are ranks exalted.” Surah No. 20, Verse No. 75.
    Whereas, if you die associating partners with Allah, disbelieving in Him and rejecting faith in Him, you will be among thosewhowill be in Hell Fire for ever and ever.
    • Allah says: “But whosoever turns away from My Message, verily for him is a life narrowed down, and We shall raisehim up blind on the Day of Judgement.SurahNo. 20, Verse 124.

    Allah says: “And who does more wrong than one to whom are recited the Signs of his Lord, and who then turns way therefrom? Verily from those who transgress We shall exact (due) retribution.” Surah No. 32, Verse no. 22.

    Allah says: “Verily he who comes to his Lord as a sinner (at Judgement),-for him is Hell: therein shall he neither die nor live.” Surah No. 20, Verse No. 74

    Allah says: “…and if any of you turn back from their faith and die in unbelief, their works will bear no fruit in this life and in the Hereafter; they will be companions of the Fire and will abide therein.” Surah No. 2, Verse No. 217

    Be informed that there is no force in religion; the right path is clear and the wrong path is clear. So after you have read and thought of and contemplated about the above message, you will not be excused by ignorance. As the warnings and message of all messengers have now reached you, you will be brought to account and be accountable on the Day of Judgment when there is no benefit for money or children but only for those who will come with good deeds and clear hearts. Finally take note that the devils of mankind and Jinn’s and the wicked of the learned among them are scheming day and night to prevent you from listening to this message and to any other message that speaks of the Truth.

    We pray to Allah that He helps you find the right path and guide you to what pleases Him

    Praise be to Allah, the Cherisher and Sustainer of the worlds


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    Re: A Message To The Non-Muslims.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wilberhum View Post
    If there must be a creator, who created the creator?
    This question belongs in another thread. Find one, ask it there, and then PM to it and I will be glad to engage in a scientific dialog with respect to this question that you will find leaves us at the same place with respect to beliefs about the beginnings of the universe that we are from a faith perspective.

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    Re: A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    Greetings,
    Quote Originally Posted by vpb View Post
    dude, there can't be a creator of a creator, it does not make sense , there cannot be a creator[1] of a creator[2], bc then the creator[2] would not be a creator but a creation. the root of everything comes from the creator. the word itself 'creator' tells that he created and he can't be created . Creator[1] is a the devisor. How can someone ie. Creator[2] create a creator[1] that is a deviser? than the the one who created Creator[1] is the deviser, not the creator[1]. and we come to the conclusion that we don't call Creator[1] a creator but a creation.
    Isn't it possible for something to be both a creation and a creator? Artists are creative. If two of them have a child who also turns out to be an artist, then some creators have created another creator. It's not on the same scale as the god question, but doesn't it make sense?

    Peace

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    Re: A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    no one in earth can be called a real creator , i mean every industry that creates things and every artist who paints pictures using the colors or an artist who uses the camera or Pc ,they are not the real creators ,even when a women give birth to her child ,she didn't really create him.

    why is that ?

    because all of the above sub creators has already used the raw materials or their biological materials (just a figure of speech) that is already exists ..

    you can't create a computer without using a single material that already exists in nature.you can't create things from nothing because you don't have the capability to do that.

    even if scientists wanted to create a house fly ,they will have to use the already created materials (such as the biological cells) and this example is clearly obvious in the cloning.


    so here is a question that always bumps out ,Who created those materials ????????

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    Re: A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltoi View Post
    Christians do not see Mary as divine by any definition of the word. She is an important figure in Christendom by the fact that she was mother of Jesus Christ, but beyond that she is never considered to be divine. Catholics probably put more emphasis on the mother of Christ than other denominations, but they don't consider Mary to be divine either.
    Perhaps you haven't heard the Catholic Hail Mary: "Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee; blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen." From my perspective, for someone to be the "Mother of God" that pretty much defines her as divine. The same claim to divinity can be said for someone who is the "Son of God", or for that matter the "Daughter of God". All of these are putting others as equals with Allah which is a most monstrous sin.

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    Re: A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    well its a bit too long to be called a note

    good effort though

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    Re: A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    Quote Originally Posted by wilberhum View Post
    If there must be a creator, who created the creator?
    This is an unanswerable riddle that is a vain attempt at disproving the existence of Allah. I can use logic that proves Allah's existence to my mind, but I can't convince someone else who is insistent upon denial.

    Let me use an analogy. Several years ago, I built a 12'x16' shed that started out as a neatly stacked pile of 2"x4"s, 2"x6"s, plywood, tin roofing, nails and cinder blocks. If I had the ability to throw all of these materials into the air over and over again, how many times would I have to throw them up before they came down exactly in the form of the finished shed that I "created" from scratch? My supposition is that it is mathematically impossible. How much more impossible the creation of even a single celled bacteria much less the entire universe by the Creator that we Muslim know as Allah.

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    Re: A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    Quote Originally Posted by MustafaMc View Post
    Perhaps you haven't heard the Catholic Hail Mary: "Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee; blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen." From my perspective, for someone to be the "Mother of God" that pretty much defines her as divine. The same claim to divinity can be said for someone who is the "Son of God", or for that matter the "Daughter of God". All of these are putting others as equals with Allah which is a most monstrous sin.
    That may be how you understand it. But that isn't what Catholics mean by it.

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    Re: A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grace Seeker View Post
    That may be how you understand it. But that isn't what Catholics mean by it.
    Mother of God=Mother of Jesus, jah? 'Cause the Catholics believe Jesus is God, and Mary was the lucky woman to be chosen to bring him into the world. That about right?

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    Re: A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    Greetings,
    Quote Originally Posted by MustafaMc View Post
    This is an unanswerable riddle that is a vain attempt at disproving the existence of Allah.
    You're right - it is unanswerable. It contradicts your world-view, so you decide to call it vain; your decision here has nothing to do with logic and everything to do with the fear that you might be wrong.

    I can use logic that proves Allah's existence to my mind, but I can't convince someone else who is insistent upon denial.
    Then you're clearly not using logic. A logical argument will convince any rational person, no matter what their prior beliefs, as long as its premises are accepted.

    Let me use an analogy. Several years ago, I built a 12'x16' shed that started out as a neatly stacked pile of 2"x4"s, 2"x6"s, plywood, tin roofing, nails and cinder blocks. If I had the ability to throw all of these materials into the air over and over again, how many times would I have to throw them up before they came down exactly in the form of the finished shed that I "created" from scratch? My supposition is that it is mathematically impossible. How much more impossible the creation of even a single celled bacteria much less the entire universe by the Creator that we Muslim know as Allah.
    Perhaps you can explain how this analogy is relevant to

    a} the specific point you're talking about, and

    b} arguments put forward by non-theists.

    Peace

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    Re: A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    Quote Originally Posted by Count DeSheep View Post
    Mother of God=Mother of Jesus, jah? 'Cause the Catholics believe Jesus is God, and Mary was the lucky woman to be chosen to bring him into the world. That about right?
    That is why she is called that. But that does not mean that Catholics see Mary as divine herself. Those who try to force that point of view are reading into the title something that Catholics don't even imagine.

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    Re: A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    With all due respect, we have heard some of the best in atheist logic-- and the zen of a zero dividing isn't all that logical. Nor readily accepted by a rational mind! Unless you can come up with something better than the so called logical fallacies in the art of debate to disprove the existence of G-D.. are your arguments against his existence just as deficient!

    Many a "rational" persons can't grasp readily accepted logical concepts, from inverse of a c-cycle permuation to the making of cerebral spinal fluid, but that doesn't invalidate the concepts nor does it preclude from their existence.

    peace!
    Last edited by جوري; 03-26-2007 at 01:14 AM.
    A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    Text without context is pretext
    If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him


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    Re: A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    Quote Originally Posted by czgibson View Post
    Then you're clearly not using logic. A logical argument will convince any rational person, no matter what their prior beliefs, as long as its premises are accepted.
    True. But, not everyone who claims to be listening with logic is exactly doing that either. There are many non-believers in God who are just as illogical in reaching the views that they have, and yet false claim that they are the ones being rational, when in fact they just choose a different set of beliefs. They are in fact no more logical in reaching those conclusions than the theists.

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    Re: A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grace Seeker View Post
    That is why she is called that. But that does not mean that Catholics see Mary as divine herself. Those who try to force that point of view are reading into the title something that Catholics don't even imagine.
    I found this and wanted to ask you, of your take on it
    "DEVOTION TO THE MOST HOLY MARY

    (This instruction may serve either for an instruction or for a sermon; but whether it be given in the form of an instruction or of a sermon, the person who gives the spiritual exercises to the priests is entreated not to omit this discourse, which is, perhaps, the most fruitful of all; for without devotion to the divine Mother it is morally impossible for any one to be a good priest.)"

    from this website http://biblelight.net/omnip.htm

    what does Divine Mary mean?... Maybe it is my poor english skills, It is after all not my mother tongue or even my second language but this is what I found in meriam webster
    Main Entry: 1di·vine
    Pronunciation: d&-'vIn
    Function: adjective
    Inflected Form(s): di·vin·er; -est
    Etymology: Middle English divin, from Anglo-French, from Latin divinus, from divus god -- more at DEITY

    Also my take from the writer that he himself thinks it blasphemy to exalt her to such a status... and thankfully the article isn't written by a Muslim!
    Last edited by جوري; 03-26-2007 at 01:11 AM.
    A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    Text without context is pretext
    If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him


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    Re: A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grace Seeker View Post
    That is why she is called that. But that does not mean that Catholics see Mary as divine herself. Those who try to force that point of view are reading into the title something that Catholics don't even imagine.
    I can respect your point of view, but, if one uses logic and the meaning of words without prior biases, then he would come to a different conclusion.

    The simple Islamic belief in the Oneness of Allah without parents, spouse, offspring, or equal is much more understandable and does not need elaborate explanations. God is not the author of confusion (I Cor 14:33).

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    Re: A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grace Seeker View Post
    There are many non-believers in God who are just as illogical in reaching the views that they have, and yet false claim that they are the ones being rational, when in fact they just choose a different set of beliefs.
    You are correct in that Atheism is a belief in the non-existence of God.

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    Re: A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    Asalam alkum warkmatulah wabrkatuh my brothers and sisters i would like to say something why are you brothers and sisters saying fi_sibililah's mistakes or errors he wrote this article so people can understand allah (swt) and most of you people are correcting mistakes you read to gain knowledge not to correct mistakes ok so please keep that in mind and sorry to be rude May Allah (swt) bless us and let us go to paridise AMEEM FONT]
    Last edited by Alpha Jr; 03-26-2007 at 02:38 AM. Reason: I ACCIDENTLY WROTE BLACK FONT

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    Re: A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    Quote Originally Posted by Yanal View Post
    why are you brothers and sisters saying fi_sibililah's mistakes or errors he wrote this article so people can understand allah (swt) and most of you people are correcting mistakes you read to gain knowledge not to correct mistakes
    Please, clarify your point, perhaps by stating your point in another way. I am not aware of anyone pointing out any mistakes in the original message. I thought that it was extremely well written and accurate.

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    Re: A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    Quote Originally Posted by PurestAmbrosia View Post
    I found this and wanted to ask you, of your take on it
    "DEVOTION TO THE MOST HOLY MARY

    (This instruction may serve either for an instruction or for a sermon; but whether it be given in the form of an instruction or of a sermon, the person who gives the spiritual exercises to the priests is entreated not to omit this discourse, which is, perhaps, the most fruitful of all; for without devotion to the divine Mother it is morally impossible for any one to be a good priest.)"

    from this website http://biblelight.net/omnip.htm

    what does Divine Mary mean?... Maybe it is my poor english skills, It is after all not my mother tongue or even my second language but this is what I found in meriam webster
    Main Entry: 1di·vine
    Pronunciation: d&-'vIn
    Function: adjective
    Inflected Form(s): di·vin·er; -est
    Etymology: Middle English divin, from Anglo-French, from Latin divinus, from divus god -- more at DEITY

    Also my take from the writer that he himself thinks it blasphemy to exalt her to such a status... and thankfully the article isn't written by a Muslim!


    LOL

    What to tell you? I think that this person is the one who needs to take a remedial course in English. "Divine" as this person used the term would indeed imply a beleif in Mary as divine. Yet, I also know enough about Catholic teachings in this matter to know that this would be considered to be in error by the Roman Catholic Church.

    Sorry, beyond that I can't help you with the discrepency.

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    Re: A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grace Seeker View Post
    that this would be considered to be in error by the Roman Catholic Church.
    .
    Yes, a cardinal sin of an error!
    A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    Text without context is pretext
    If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him


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    Re: A Message To The Non-Muslims.

    Greetings,
    Quote Originally Posted by PurestAmbrosia View Post
    With all due respect, we have heard some of the best in atheist logic-- and the zen of a zero dividing isn't all that logical. Nor readily accepted by a rational mind! Unless you can come up with something better than the so called logical fallacies in the art of debate to disprove the existence of G-D.. are your arguments against his existence just as deficient!
    Sorry, I couldn't make head or tail of that.

    Many a "rational" persons can't grasp readily accepted logical concepts, from inverse of a c-cycle permuation to the making of cerebral spinal fluid, but that doesn't invalidate the concepts nor does it preclude from their existence.
    What you've mentioned are a mathematical and a biological concept respectively. I don't know why you call them logical concepts.

    True. But, not everyone who claims to be listening with logic is exactly doing that either. There are many non-believers in God who are just as illogical in reaching the views that they have, and yet false claim that they are the ones being rational, when in fact they just choose a different set of beliefs. They are in fact no more logical in reaching those conclusions than the theists.
    I take your point. Atheism is a belief, and hasn't been proven with logic. Agnosticism is more logically rigorous, in that it sees no evidence to support the existence of god and so takes a neutral position. I believe atheism is true largely because I think it is far more likely that god was invented by humans than that he actually exists.

    Peace

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