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  1. #1
    truthseeker63's Avatar
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    Post Difference between public apostasy and or private apostasy ?

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    As Salamu Alaykum my question is I heard in Islam for Muslims that there is a difference between public apostasy and or private apostasy my question is if someone can leave Islam in private like they can stop praying at home fasting or stop going to a Mosque or a Masjid I have heard Muslims say this I posted a video below but my question is i heard in a Islamic State in a Caliphate under a Caliph that Muslims must go to a Masjid or they wil be punished by the State or lashed or even killed or jailed if they fail to go or have no excuse for not going my question is would Police spy or knock on people's homes making sure they go to Jummah on Fridays I thought Spying was Haram not Halal thank you for you're time ?


    Capital Punishments in Islam - Misconceptions - Yusuf Estes.Part 16.
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    Capital Punishments in Islam - Misconceptions.Part 16. by Sheikh Yusuf Estes on Huda Tv.


    A Series of Programmes on Huda tv which removes and answers the misconceptions and false allegations raised against Islam.
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    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gTLthgMkqPU
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    anatolian's Avatar
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    Re: Difference between public apostasy and or private apostasy ?

    Bro, we have told you before. Majority of Muslims do not have such behaviors. We believe Islam do not teach such things. It is Wahhabi s who do it and they don't represent Islam.
    Difference between public apostasy and  or private apostasy ?

    “Either seem as you are or be as you seem” Rumi

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    M.I.A.'s Avatar
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    Re: Difference between public apostasy and or private apostasy ?

    the covering of faults.. yada..yada.. blah.. blah..

    also its been two years since i last fasted.. i have a doctors note but i guess its probably something to talk about.. or think about.


    i dont go to the mosque much unless im away from home.. too much nationalism.

    dissallusioned is not the same as unbelief..

    let me hand over the keys and see how you drive.


    he crashed success!! howd he manage to do that?


    ...some people have no respect for this borrowed life.

    makes no sense to me.

    edit..

    and he says.. pbuh

    ...by the one in whos hands my life is in.


    monday afternoon hype.. nobody wants a crash.
    Last edited by M.I.A.; 10-17-2016 at 02:07 PM.
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    aaj's Avatar
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    Re: Difference between public apostasy and or private apostasy ?

    Quote Originally Posted by anatolian View Post
    Bro, we have told you before. Majority of Muslims do not have such behaviors. We believe Islam do not teach such things. It is Wahhabi s who do it and they don't represent Islam.
    There is no such thing as "wahabism", it is a term coined by the west for anyone standing up against colonialism and practicing Islam according to the Quran and Sunnah. I would suggest stop using that term like the ignorant Muslims and learn about it's history and the great imam in question.

    Muhammad ibn ʿAbd al-Wahhab was a Sunni Muslim preacher and scholar from Nejd in central Arabia who called for return to real Islam consisting of the original principles of that religion as the salaf, the first three generations of Muslims, and cleaning it up from the innovations and bidah introduced into it and was common in his days.


    Quote Originally Posted by truthseeker63 View Post
    As Salamu Alaykum my question is I heard in Islam for Muslims that there is a difference between public apostasy and or private apostasy my question is if someone can leave Islam in private.

    I have heard Muslims say this I posted a video below but my question is i heard in a Islamic State in a Caliphate under a Caliph that Muslims must go to a Masjid or they wil be punished by the State or lashed or even killed or jailed if they fail to go or have no excuse for not going my question is would Police spy or knock on people's homes making sure they go to Jummah on Fridays I thought Spying was Haram not Halal thank you for you're time ?


    Capital Punishments in Islam - Misconceptions - Yusuf Estes.Part 16.
    Wa'alaikum as'salaam,

    While there is a punishment for apostasy. It isn't a witch hunt with spies and all that paranoia of hunting down people. I believe the punishment is there to deter such people from causing fitna. Apostasy in theology based governance is akin to treason and if that person starts making trouble in public, inviting others to the same path and making noise then of course he will be arrested and punished by the law. If it's all private then no one knows and no one cares.
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    Re: Difference between public apostasy and or private apostasy ?

    Quote Originally Posted by aaj View Post
    There is no such thing as "wahabism", it is a term coined by the west for anyone standing up against colonialism and practicing Islam according to the Quran and Sunnah. I would suggest stop using that term like the ignorant Muslims and learn about it's history and the great imam in question.

    Muhammad ibn ʿAbd al-Wahhab was a Sunni Muslim preacher and scholar from Nejd in central Arabia who called for return to real Islam consisting of the original principles of that religion as the salaf, the first three generations of Muslims, and cleaning it up from the innovations and bidah introduced into it and was common in his days.
    Salam ajj.

    Firstly, I didnt use the word "Wahhabism". I said "Wahhabi". Generations are called after their founders name everywhere. The followers of Imam Azam Abu-Hanifa are called Hanafi, the followers of Imam Shaafi'i are called Shaafi and like that the followers of Muhammad ibn ʿAbd al-Wahhab are called "Wahhabi"..There is nothing wrong with that. I prefer to use "Wahhabia" to refer the madhab since Wahhabism is regarded a derogatory term by the followers as you mentioned. As for "Salafi", I cannot use this word to refer to Wahhabis since these two are completely different things. Salaf means the early generations of Muslims as you mentioned but Wahhabi means the generation of Abdul Wahhab, a 18th century Imam.

    Secondly, there is not any misinformation in what I say. Wahhabis are doing this in KSA. Majority of Muslims don't do such things.

    Thirdly, I know who Muhammad ibn ʿAbd al-Wahhab was historically and I am planning to create a thread on this matter soon if I find some time Inshallah.
    Difference between public apostasy and  or private apostasy ?

    “Either seem as you are or be as you seem” Rumi

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    aaj's Avatar
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    Re: Difference between public apostasy and or private apostasy ?

    Quote Originally Posted by anatolian View Post
    Salam ajj.

    Firstly, I didnt use the word "Wahhabism". I said "Wahhabi". Generations are called after their founders name everywhere. The followers of Imam Azam Abu-Hanifa are called Hanafi, the followers of Imam Shaafi'i are called Shaafi and like that the followers of Muhammad ibn ʿAbd al-Wahhab are called "Wahhabi"..There is nothing wrong with that. I prefer to use "Wahhabia" to refer the madhab since Wahhabism is regarded a derogatory term by the followers as you mentioned. As for "Salafi", I cannot use this word to refer to Wahhabis since these two are completely different things. Salaf means the early generations of Muslims as you mentioned but Wahhabi means the generation of Abdul Wahhab, a 18th century Imam.

    Secondly, there is not any misinformation in what I say. Wahhabis are doing this in KSA. Majority of Muslims don't do such things.
    .
    wa'alaikum as'salam bro,

    Both of the words are derogatory and have negative connotation. The four great imams were well known and followed in their time period. The difference between them and abd al-wahhab is that they offered interpretations, rulings and everything else that came to form a whole school of thought. Where as this imam called for the people to return the way of the as-salaf. He and those who followed were called "extremists" because he put an end to grave worship and other bidahs that people had introduced. If you go to saudi and ask where you can find 'wahabi' they will look all confused and wonder what you are talking about. No such term or school of thought exists there. They follow imam hanbali as did the imam himself. So there is no madhab of wahibism or wahabi.

    2ndly, the 'wahabis' are not doing this in saudi. Do you have any evidence of that? There are thousands of hypocrites and apostates living in saudi, no one is going around hunting them. The apostates turned atheists who start their blogs to bash Islam thinking they can say whatever they want get arrested and punished. They bring it on themselves because of their tongues. Otherwise there are no special witch hunts going as you state.

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    Delete.'s Avatar
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    Re: Difference between public apostasy and or private apostasy ?

    Quote Originally Posted by anatolian View Post
    Bro, we have told you before. Majority of Muslims do not have such behaviors. We believe Islam do not teach such things. It is Wahhabi s who do it and they don't represent Islam.
    A'salamu alaykum. How can you say that? If the majority of Muslims stop practicing Sharia it doesn't mean Islam doesn't teach those things. Our Deen is very simple, the teachings of the Quran and Sunnah are clear, and they don't change along with the times. Denying something that the Quran and Sunnah regards as Fard is kufr (I'm not directing this at you, don't misunderstand).

    As for the question of the thread, I don't know. In sha Allah someone can answer this for you.
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    AHMED PATEL's Avatar
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    Re: Difference between public apostasy and or private apostasy ?

    this a juristic issue and deep debate..

    my take on the recent itv programme

    why did they leave ........the dire need for an altruistic and pragmatic approach



    im sure many have heard by now about the recent itv programme about apostates/atheists however its phrased.

    i only have questions,they are genuine and also for reflection for the communities which they left.

    some observations and assumptions first. yes ..i could be wrong

    1 :it appeared the issues and grievances were with retrogressive culture and bad parenting primarily and not religion..i could be wrong

    2 :vulnerable and lonely people were looking for love and support..i could be wrong

    3parents and communities in their ignorance overreacted and in fact made the situation worse..i could be wrong

    4:self righteousness and lazy cultural parenting along with an ignorance of the spiritual aspect of islam may be to blame..i could be wrong

    5:the inability and refusal of the muslim community ,to address its own failings and rot constantly shoved under the proverbial carpet came to the surface..i could be wrong.

    the carpet itself has now rotted away,and no new carpet will be able to cover the rot we constantly try to shove under it..of course...i may be wrong



    murdering people on the streets makes things worse,calling for murder makes things worse,shunning people and not listening to them makes things worse.
    ignoring people with doubt and confusion makes things worse.over reaction and ignoring the voice and feelings of those in deep pain and dilemmas makes things worse.shunning and excommunicating makes things worse.mocking and hunting and dehumanising someones daughter,son makes things worse

    islam is a way of life which makes things better,it heals,it manages,it comforts.
    it draws people near and embraces humanity without prejudice.

    am i right?

    AND ALLAH TAALA KNOW BEST

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    anatolian's Avatar
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    Re: Difference between public apostasy and or private apostasy ?

    Quote Originally Posted by ___ View Post
    A'salamu alaykum. How can you say that? If the majority of Muslims stop practicing Sharia it doesn't mean Islam doesn't teach those things. Our Deen is very simple, the teachings of the Quran and Sunnah are clear, and they don't change along with the times. Denying something that the Quran and Sunnah regards as Fard is kufr (I'm not directing this at you, don't misunderstand).

    As for the question of the thread, I don't know. In sha Allah someone can answer this for you.
    salam sister..I think you have totally misunderstood my post. I am not saying that Islam do not teach to perform the Fard ibadaah. What I am saying we cant force this on people. There is no compulsion in Religion...by the way your screen name is so geometric
    Difference between public apostasy and  or private apostasy ?

    “Either seem as you are or be as you seem” Rumi

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    Re: Difference between public apostasy and or private apostasy ?

    Quote Originally Posted by anatolian View Post
    salam sister..I think you have totally misunderstood my post. I am not saying that Islam do not teach to perform the Fard ibadaah. What I am saying we cant force this on people. There is no compulsion in Religion...by the way your screen name is so geometric
    Oh okay I'm so sorry yes I did misunderstand and forgive me for the sake of Allah. Sometimes on text you can't really decipher the clear meaning of a post. Wa'salamu alaykum.


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