Sir, may we(Muslims who are resident of India) love India ?

format_quote Originally Posted by azc

Your views are impracticable. If a Muslim is a soldier, he will have to follow the order of his commander without even pondering over this matter whether his country is oppressor or oppressed.... I think Muslims who live in non Muslim lands must prefer to join force whether it's military or para military force or police. If you feel the pulse of the world, can understand why I assert this.

This i strongly disagree with you. In case of a western country for example, one does NOT join the army. One ONLY does join the army if what i said before when defending the country if a force is trying to invade and they are the aggressors. That is the moment one joins the army to defend the country. When as a soldier you still ABIDE by the rulings of war according to Islam NOT according to the Geneva Conventions (Islamic rulings such as: if a soldier gives up, you abstain from killing him, one does not harm children, women, elderly, inhabited houses, trees, animals, monks etc. etc.). One also joins certain groups within the army that does not go according to "collateral damage" like being a pilot, but rather as a foot soldier. That is the moment you have when one thinks about it EVERYTHING under control that one can abide by Islamic rules.

So no you have not thoughts this through. When we talk about a Islamic army (no not Saudi or Egypt or Turkey or Iran..not 1 army right now is Islamic army) like back with Rasullah(saws) and with rightful leaders as back in the history of Islam, that is when one does without questioning.

There are hadith about end times that talk about that one has to retreat themselves to their place of residence. It was asked what if they come in to my house, it was said be the best of the two sons of Adam(as). Also in another hadith it was said when they force you to join them, then make your sword blunt. And i believe in yet another hadith it was said do not take up arms or else you will be joining them in sins or doing harm.

These hadith aren't for the show you know. They are meant as lessons for us that we MAYBE will witness those times and how to act. So what we must ask ourselves is, is our imaan that strong that when they try to force us that we say you better kill me, because i will not join you in your killing.

One of the hadith here..

=====Hadith======
“Before the Hour comes, there will be tribulation like pieces of black night, when a man will wake up as a believer but be a disbeliever by evening, or he will be a believer in the evening but will be a disbeliever by morning. And the one who is sitting will be better than the one who is standing, and the one who is standing will be better than the one who is walking, and the one who is walking will be better than the one who is running. So break your bows, cut their strings and strike your swords against rocks, and if anyone enters upon anyone of you, let him be like the better of the two sons of Adam. (i.e. the one killed, not the killer).”

Source used: https://sunnah.com/ibnmajah/36/36
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In case of a western country for example, one doesNOTjoin the army.

What's the level of prohibition?

One ONLY does join the army if what i said before when defending the country if a force is trying to invade and they are the aggressors. That isthe moment one joins the army to defend the country.

but even in this situation they don't want you to join their force because they know that the representation of large number of Muslims in force will make Muslim community stronger in their country.

When as a soldier you still ABIDE by the rulings of war according to Islam NOT according to the Geneva Conventions (Islamic rulings such as: if a soldier gives up, you abstain from killing him, one does not harm children, women, elderly, inhabited houses, trees, animals, monks etc. etc.). One also joins certain groups within the army that does not go according to "collateral damage" like being a pilot, but rather as a foot soldier.That is the moment you have when one thinks about it EVERYTHING under control that one can abide by Islamic rules.So no you have not thoughts this through.

Islamic laws are not applied on non Muslims army or any other government sector and if a Muslim serves in it, will have to abide by man made laws, simultaneously, abiding by the Islamic laws in his individual capacity in case being a true Muslim.

When we talk about a Islamic army (no not Saudi or Egypt or Turkey or Iran..not 1 army right now is Islamic army) like backwith Rasullah(saws) and with rightful leaders as back in the history of Islam, that iswhen one does without questioning.

yes, there is no Islamic army in any Muslim country.

There are hadith

Most of the referred ahadith belong to the age close to the eta of Hz imam Mahdi ra.

format_quote Originally Posted by Simple_Person

What is the reason a army in the first exist? If we answer this based on logic, rationality and reason, we come to the answer solely based on defensive issues which sometimes offense is also defense, as when somebody oppresses your people and with dialogue they refuse to listen, you wage war against such oppressors, not to conquer, but to remove such oppressors. So rest of the time army does "not" exist. It is not what THEY think of you. You are responsible for your OWN actions. Joining the army without any defensive cause, will only bring harm upon you. I often am reminded of this."And keep yourself patient [by being] with those who call upon their Lord in the morning and the evening, seeking His countenance. And let not your eyes pass beyond them, desiring adornments of the worldly life, and do not obey one whose heart We have made heedless of Our remembrance and who follows his desire and whose affair is ever [in] neglect." Qur'an 18:28When one joins the army not for the sake of protection as it has occurred, you will see that many Muslims will not be with you. You will be with those that do not worship Allah. You will create a bond who neglect the duty they have towards Allah. In other words, you WILL become like them. Do not worry about anyone, it is Allah who protects, not you. You only try to show to Him what is your limit of wanting to please Him, by joining the army while there is no reason right now, is not really something you should even dare to take. You KNOW i am right, although i do not care about me being right or wrong, but what is truth. Think about yourself, because on the Day of Judgement you will be held responsible.I am not sure where you base this on. Islamic law is applied to YOU and every other Muslim individual not the army. As far as i have known is that YOU will be held responsible for what YOU do, not what others do on the Day of Judgement. So you going to do collateral damage..you think Allah will say on the day of Judgement to the ones who had been killed by your collateral damage..be quite. Azc gets a free ticket to Janah. Fear Allah because what you say is the other side of the spectrum you are closely going towards. Remember, you will be held responsible for every deed you do, good or bad. Ponder about what i am saying, it is not simple "opinion" that is based on nothing.Who says that? What is close? Is close 1 month? 1 year? 10 years? 100 years? 100 years? Who says we are not within the scope of his arrival? Do not assume or "postpone" things or assume you are within or not within the time scope of his arrival."Then do they feel secure that there will not come to them an overwhelming [aspect] of the punishment of Allah or that the Hour will not come upon them suddenly while they do not perceive?" Qur'an 12:107If we look at many signs of the end times, many are visible and they are getting worse. Since Arab spring things have gone in fast-mode. Do not expect him to come, but also expect him that he will come within your lifetime. What does that say? PREPARE yourself!! Your attitude is the TYPICAL attitude that i have witnessed many Muslims today. Be like this and the last thing you will witness is following dajjal. Be wise to not assume either the arrival or not the arrival, what stance then do we have to take? Preparation. If it happened within our life time..we say Alhamdulillah we have prepared for it. If it did not happened in our life time but we did prepare for it, we say alhamdulillah that i did not had to go through such fitna. That is the best advice i can five you.

Your attitude is the TYPICAL attitude that i have witnessed many Muslims today. Be like this and the last thing you will witness is following dajjal.

who will face dajjal and who will follow him, Allah swt knows best.

format_quote Originally Posted by azc

who will face dajjal and who will follow him, Allah swt knows best.

Allah knows that exactly, but guidance is as clear as daylight ..what to do to not follow him. That one might follow dajjal has also a reason. Just like a family member of mine, brushing me off by making it as if we will not experience it in our life time. That is why i gave you that aya about the hour. We human beings always THINK things will come way ahead.

This even sub'han'Allah with dajjal etc, is a mercy of Allah, because Rasullah(saws) has made the signs of the Day of Judgement known. If one seeks about those signs that Rasullah(saws) talked about, we already see the minor-signs have appeared, one being his death. With those signs having appeared one talking the necessary steps to ignite change within themselves. It is not easy, but first step of acknowledging that those signs have appeared and will only worsen, thus making preparations for the next step of learning a, b, c, and doing x, y, z.

Allah saves whom He wants from dajjal and hell fire. But to be the one Allah chooses to save, one must ponder about what criteria has Allah so i could be one of those Allah saves. We already know of wiping out arrogance, pride, greed, trust in Him, being thankful for His bounty, envy, having patience, being steadfast, doing dhikr, good character, being humble, etc. etc.

format_quote Originally Posted by Simple_Person

Allah knows that exactly, but guidance is as clear as daylight ..what to do to not follow him. That one might follow dajjal has also a reason. Just like a family member of mine, brushing me off by making it as if we will not experience it in our life time. That is why i gave you that aya about the hour. We human beings always THINK things will come way ahead.This even sub'han'Allah with dajjal etc, is a mercy of Allah, because Rasullah(saws) has made the signs of the Day of Judgement known. If one seeks about those signs that Rasullah(saws) talked about, we already see the minor-signs have appeared, one being his death. With those signs having appeared one talking the necessary steps to ignite change within themselves. It is not easy, but first step of acknowledging that those signs have appeared and will only worsen, thus making preparations for the next step of learning a, b, c, and doing x, y, z.Allah saves whom He wants from dajjal and hell fire. But to be the one Allah chooses to save, one must ponder about what criteria has Allah so i could be one of those Allah saves. We already know of wiping out arrogance, pride, greed, trust in Him, being thankful for His bounty, envy, having patience, being steadfast, doing dhikr, good character, being humble, etc. etc.

You're advised to sit with righteous ulama.

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format_quote Originally Posted by STN

Go and try to slaughter a cow this Eid InshaAllah and see what happens.

Islam injuncts us to refrain from fasad and you're advising him to create fasad.

I think there is a hadith suggesting Muslims not to slaughter cows in India. Not sure though..But that can be followed. Allah doesnt forbid us to be kind to the others. If they are offended by your slaughter of cow why wouldnt you respect them? You still have other options.

format_quote Originally Posted by Captain Howdy

The courtesy of respecting other faiths is expected . Just like we dont throw a pork in your mosques .

I don´t think we can compare slaughtering the cow because people want to eat with throwing dead animal parts to the mosque because thrower wants to insult some others. Slaughtering an animal for the purpose to get a meal fulfills very different needs (than throwing pork to the mosque - then it perhaps fulfills the need to insult others?).