Please do not lock important threads

[Born_Believer]

I think this is the correct place to post this.

There was a thread recently called "Islam spread by the sword".

There was a group, with a particular poster who was claiming that muslims had the right to kill those who would not convert, I provided via Islamic evidence as to why that is not true but rather than have a deeper discussion on the issue the thread was closed with those who are ignorant of the truth having the last word.

This not only send out the wrong message to non-Muslims but also misguides Muslims who are too prone to believe everything they read on the internet (especially young ones) and/or unable to do research of their own on the subject.

I believe this isn't right unless the thread itself is deleted so that future generations do not fall into the trap laid down by those who are trying to misguide others, whether purposefully or through their own ignorance on the matter.

Simply locking threads such as these does not help or educate anyone.

 

[anatolian]

I am totally against to close the threads that easily. If someone is breaking the rules delete their posts but when you close the thread you disallow peoeple to defend themselves

 

[aaj]

I agree. It is easy to close threads and wash your hands off from it all but a forum is a place for discussions and debates. There are bound to be arguments and disagreements. A moderator is suppose to moderate and guide that discussion to stay on topic and not shut it down all together. Otherwise, this will only put others off from bothering to discuss or post on a topic and/or go elsewhere.

 

[Serinity]

What should be done, rather, is to delete posts that cause hate, etc. But, obviously, there are some pretty pertinent topics.

we should be more mature. otherwise infractions should be issued.. I think.

Allahu alam.

 

[*charisma*]

Assalamu ALaikum

While I can agree with most of you, the issue is that the arguments, whether they are inappropriate (ie. insulting others) or off-topic do not stop. You all carry on with adding to the fire instead of reporting the post before it gets out of hand. The fastest way to get our attention is to report or tag an admin/mod, and I cannot stress that enough. We are not online 24/7 to moderate each and every thread, and often by the time we get there, the arguments are too long, complex, and thread cleanup becomes tedious. While I'm personally all for the important dialogues, you must all also practice some self-control and follow the rules and not expect moderators to do that aspect for you. As muslims we should not watch members insult each other in the manner that is done here and not do anything about it.

Infractions have been and will continue to be implemented, but if this is becoming more of a bigger issue and ruining the dynamics of the board, then perhaps the admin team will discuss a more effective discourse to ensure that the posts that come through are proper, and the members that continue to break rules will be banned.

Again, I urge you all that if you feel passionate about a topic and would love to keep the thread open, then remind one another to follow the rules and report posts that break them. Otherwise from our point of view, it is not deserving to allow a thread topic to stay open if no one had the decency to help stop the arguing, insulting, off-topic posts. Put more efforts in preventing the closures of the threads rather than arguing about why the thread was closed or why posts were deleted.

 

[Born_Believer]

Assalamu ALaikum

While I can agree with most of you, the issue is that the arguments, whether they are inappropriate (ie. insulting others) or off-topic do not stop. You all carry on with adding to the fire instead of reporting the post before it gets out of hand. The fastest way to get our attention is to report or tag an admin/mod, and I cannot stress that enough. We are not online 24/7 to moderate each and every thread, and often by the time we get there, the arguments are too long, complex, and thread cleanup becomes tedious. While I'm personally all for the important dialogues, you must all also practice some self-control and follow the rules and not expect moderators to do that aspect for you. As muslims we should not watch members insult each other in the manner that is done here and not do anything about it.

Infractions have been and will continue to be implemented, but if this is becoming more of a bigger issue and ruining the dynamics of the board, then perhaps the admin team will discuss a more effective discourse to ensure that the posts that come through are proper, and the members that continue to break rules will be banned.

Again, I urge you all that if you feel passionate about a topic and would love to keep the thread open, then remind one another to follow the rules and report posts that break them. Otherwise from our point of view, it is not deserving to allow a thread topic to stay open if no one had the decency to help stop the arguing, insulting, off-topic posts. Put more efforts in preventing the closures of the threads rather than arguing about why the thread was closed or why posts were deleted.

I understand the point you're making here but simply closing at hread that can mislead people is not enough, it should also be deleted. If the latter is not going to happen, then you should allow the discussion to take place but with moderation on your part.

 

[*charisma*]

I understand the point you're making here but simply closing at hread that can mislead people is not enough, it should also be deleted. If the latter is not going to happen, then you should allow the discussion to take place but with moderation on your part.

I was speaking in general. Threads which are closed are left at the mod/admin's discretion. If you believe that a closed thread should have been deleted/removed, then again report the thread with your commentary so we can review, or alternatively you can send a PM to the mod who closed it or post in the help desk.

 

[Futuwwa]

Here's a suggestion: If a mod decides that a particular discussion should not happen and a thread should be closed, the thread should just be closed. The mod should not be allowed to take a stance at the actual topic of the discussion. That's abuse of mod power to forcibly get the last word in a debate.

 

[anatolian]

Here's a suggestion: If a mod decides that a particular discussion should not happen and a thread should be closed, the thread should just be closed. The mod should not be allowed to take a stance at the actual topic of the discussion. That's abuse of mod power to forcibly get the last word in a debate.

Good to hear you are alive bro

 

[Muhammad]

:wasalamex

There was a group, with a particular poster who was claiming that muslims had the right to kill those who would not convert, I provided via Islamic evidence as to why that is not true but rather than have a deeper discussion on the issue the thread was closed with those who are ignorant of the truth having the last word.

This not only send out the wrong message to non-Muslims but also misguides Muslims who are too prone to believe everything they read on the internet (especially young ones) and/or unable to do research of their own on the subject.

I think the thread you are referring to is this one:
https://www.islamicboard.com/clarifications-about-islam/18265-success-islam-spread-sword-3.html

I do not think anyone was claiming that Muslims had the right to forcibly convert. Some people were saying this has happened in history, but pointed out that it was wrong. The reason it was eventually closed is because it became an argument over historical facts. It did not seem that a useful discussion was about to take place any time soon.

I agree with you that where threads can spread misinformation, it is better to remove them rather than simply close them. If there are any posts in the above thread that concern you, please report them and we can review :ia:.

Here's a suggestion: If a mod decides that a particular discussion should not happen and a thread should be closed, the thread should just be closed. The mod should not be allowed to take a stance at the actual topic of the discussion. That's abuse of mod power to forcibly get the last word in a debate.

This is kind of going against what the OP is saying. We have a responsibility to ensure that the message being given out is correct. In a number of situations it can be important to make a clarifying post. For example, if you have a have a hadeeth rejector posting various arguments in support of his view, clarifying the correct position is praiseworthy, not an abuse of power. In other situations where things are not so black and white, perhaps you have a point. There needs to be a balance as well as direction, but this isn't always easy to attain. And Allaah :swt: knows best.

 

[Futuwwa]

This is kind of going against what the OP is saying. We have a responsibility to ensure that the message being given out is correct. In a number of situations it can be important to make a clarifying post. For example, if you have a have a hadeeth rejector posting various arguments in support of his view, clarifying the correct position is praiseworthy, not an abuse of power. In other situations where things are not so black and white, perhaps you have a point. There needs to be a balance as well as direction, but this isn't always easy to attain. And Allaah :swt: knows best.

So provided that you are right and the other guy is wrong, using mod power as a bully pulpit is the right thing to do? Can I have that power too? First, I would use it to get the last word on this topic, for on it, I am right and you are wrong.

 

[Muhammad]

So provided that you are right and the other guy is wrong, using mod power as a bully pulpit is the right thing to do?

Using one's authority to clarify what is right is not bullying. It's a responsibility. After all, the purpose of the forum is da'wah, not for every whim or conjecture to be entertained.

 

[greenhill]

There are many threads that was closed that I cannot remember them. All I can remember are my feelings when I could not post after reading through pages of debate….

My suggestion would be to put the thread under moderation. Even better, put those who constantly go off topic, making misleading claims etc under moderation rather than close the entire topic.

There must be a better way.


eace:

 

[sister herb]

There must be a better way.

Yes, there is one better way: all members learn to behave respectfully towards of other members, avoid bad language and remember their manners while taking part to some discussions.

I am very tired to notice how many good discussions here have changed as the battlefield because of lack of manners of talking.

 

[islamirama]

There are many threads that was closed that I cannot remember them. All I can remember are my feelings when I could not post after reading through pages of debate….

eace:

when you get PM every other day that so and so thread is closed or deleted, it does put you off from posting and participating. :skeleton:

 

[Umm Abed]

when you get PM every other day that so and so thread is closed or deleted, it does put you off from posting and participating. :skeleton:

You should clarify and PM a mod and they will explain; perhaps you can come to an agreement.

 

[Muhammad]

:salamext:

There are many threads that was closed that I cannot remember them. All I can remember are my feelings when I could not post after reading through pages of debate

I'm sorry for the disappointment. Sometimes we do allow people to contribute even after closing a thread, where something important is being added. If you want to add something, let us know and we can consider the options.

My suggestion would be to put the thread under moderation. Even better, put those who constantly go off topic, making misleading claims etc under moderation rather than close the entire topic.

There must be a better way.

I'm not sure it's possible to put a specific thread under moderation, but users do get moderated. We also try different approaches depending on the situation. There are times when we've closed threads, deleted a bunch of posts and then re-opened them, then eventually had to close them for good. Sometimes we post warnings that the thread will get closed. Sometimes we simply delete off-topic posts and see how the thread will go. It's also worth mentioning that threads get closed for a variety of reasons and in the end, it comes down to moderator discretion as to whether a thread is serving more harm than good. Some threads go on for several pages before they get closed, whilst others can close within the first couple of pages. So it depends on the specific situation.

In any case, it is not our intention to make things difficult for people who are here for genuine reasons. We are simply trying to ensure it is a good environment for all, :ia:. When people report posts and mention their concerns/advice, we do try to respond to this and use it to help guide our actions. Sometimes we get it right and other times we get it wrong (which we are sorry for). We are human beings at the end of the day. : )

May Allah :swt: guide us and forgive us, Aameen.

 

[greenhill]

:salamext:

I'm sorry for the disappointment. Sometimes we do allow people to contribute even after closing a thread, where something important is being added. If you want to add something, let us know and we can consider the options.

I'm not sure it's possible to put a specific thread under moderation, but users do get moderated. We also try different approaches depending on the situation. There are times when we've closed threads, deleted a bunch of posts and then re-opened them, then eventually had to close them for good. Sometimes we post warnings that the thread will get closed. Sometimes we simply delete off-topic posts and see how the thread will go. It's also worth mentioning that threads get closed for a variety of reasons and in the end, it comes down to moderator discretion as to whether a thread is serving more harm than good. Some threads go on for several pages before they get closed, whilst others can close within the first couple of pages. So it depends on the specific situation.

In any case, it is not our intention to make things difficult for people who are here for genuine reasons. We are simply trying to ensure it is a good environment for all, :ia:. When people report posts and mention their concerns/advice, we do try to respond to this and use it to help guide our actions. Sometimes we get it right and other times we get it wrong (which we are sorry for). We are human beings at the end of the day. : )

May Allah :swt: guide us and forgive us, Aameen.

Thank you for that.

I remember several times where my posts are not immediately displayed but 'vetted' before uploaded… I was just saying the same thing to apply to posts after the debates in the thread start to 'spark' some trouble (for the lack of a better word)..


eace:

 

[*charisma*]

when you get PM every other day that so and so thread is closed or deleted, it does put you off from posting and participating. :skeleton:

A question to you and other members on the board, would you prefer that you do not receive PMs when your posts are deleted? As in, should this auto feature be eliminated? Often times we do mass deletions and our reasoning is generalized such as "off-topic" or "thread cleanup." It's not necessarily to make anyone feel off-put by the PMs, but just to give reasoning so that we don't get a hundred PMs or posts asking why their post got deleted.

 

[sister herb]

A question to you and other members on the board, would you prefer that you do not receive PMs when your posts are deleted? As in, should this auto feature be eliminated? Often times we do mass deletions and our reasoning is generalized such as "off-topic" or "thread cleanup." It's not necessarily to make anyone feel off-put by the PMs, but just to give reasoning so that we don't get a hundred PMs or posts asking why their post got deleted.

Not knowing about others, but when I get such a PM, I am as "uh oh do they soon ban me". hew

But in general, those PMs are ok. They remind me to be more careful.