Why Islam Disallows women to travel alone.

[Misbah-Abd]

If i accepted that rule as Islam , it would make me a Quran denier..

Quit being ambiguous. Are you a hadith rejector? And are you one of the Quraniyoon? Yes or no. We need to know so we understand what we are dealing with.

 

[beleiver]

I will have google to see what a Quraniyoon is and let you know.
for now i am of the understanding what defines Islam and all Law must be from the Quran, the rest is like advice or a guide.

And the people and companions at the time followed and obeyed Mohamed(pbuh) only in the sense of if he said build a Mosqe there, they built a Mosque there or if he said take this of the spoils they took it and if he said you cant have that they couldnt have that..He was a messenger and leader not the Creator of Truth.

 

[Misbah-Abd]

I will have google to see what a Quraniyoon is and let you know.
for now i am of the understanding what defines Islam and all Law must be from the Quran, the rest is like advice or a guide.

And the people and companions at the time followed and obeyed Mohamed(pbuh) only in the sense of if he said build a Mosqe there, they built a Mosque there or if he said take this of the spoils they took it and if he said you cant have that they couldnt have that..He was a messenger and leader not the Creator of Truth.

You were right to say your religion is "Jedi" and not Muslim. Your understanding is flawed, deviant and arrogant. You couldn't even spell "believer" as your name properly. Let this be a warning to the Muslims on here.

 

[Zzz_]

I will have google to see what a Quraniyoon is and let you know.

https://islamqa.info/en/3440

[TABLE="class: grid, width: 100%, align: center"]
[TR][TD]The misguided sect of al-Qur’aaniyyeen - islamqa.info
assalamu alaykum wa rahmatullahThere is a deviant group of people who claim to follow the Quran onlyand not the Sunnah of the Holy Prophet SAW. Please provide u...[/TD][/TR][/TABLE]

 

[Zafran]

for now i am of the understanding what defines Islam and all Law must be from the Quran, the rest is like advice or a guide.

No....the Quran came within a context - to a community of believers (known as companions/sahahba and the family of the prophet also known as Ahul bayet which includes the wives of the prophet). These people taught through muttwatir (corroborated) evidence the main parts of the deen like the Quran, 5 pillars and certain things that are prohibited and obligations upon the individual Muslim and community.

The Quran was revealed not once but 23 years and the context and history is important. that is why there is Hadith, Usul fiqh, Grammer, mantiq and other sciences in interpreting the Quran and the sunnah - both are revelation.

And the people and companions at the time followed and obeyed Mohamed(pbuh) only in the sense of if he said build a Mosqe there, they built a Mosque there or if he said take this of the spoils they took it and if he said you cant have that they couldnt have that..He was a messenger and leader not the Creator of Truth

where did you get this from? all this information was it in the Quran? He also taught them how to pray - What Ramadan was, zakat, Hajj, Enjoining good and forbidding evil, character development and manners. He is the mercy on all of humanity

"Indeed, in this [Quran] is notification for a worshiping people. And We have not sent you, [O Muhammad], except as a mercy to the worlds." (Quran: 21:106-107)

"There has certainly come to you a Messenger from among yourselves. Grievous to him is what you suffer; [he is] concerned over you [i.e., your guidance] and to the believers is kind and merciful." (Quran: 9:128)

"Certainly you have in the Messenger of Allah an excellent exemplar for him who hopes in Allah and the latter day and remembers Allah much." (Quran33:21)

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It is another question i have , especially praying in a language i dont even understand, I do understand why it would be best to learn Arabic and pray like the Prophet, but untill i do i pray my way and i certainly beleive it helps me.

I'm a non arab like most of the Muslims on earth who are - we have learnt the prayers in arabic and understand there meanings - its not hard if you can do other things for the world then learning the prayers is not difficult - there are plenty of teachers out there as well.

 

[Nikki1234]

There is no need for an explanation.Few words will suffice,which are:
If every woman in the world took a male relative with her outside and never left her house except that she has a male relative with her,will the number of rapes that occur daily not fall down by a mile?

soooo are you saying that it's normal for men to be rapists? Are you saying that its not possible for men to lower their gaze? Are you saying that because society sexualizes women so much they shouldn't leave there homes alone? Soooo do I take my brother with me to the OGBYN to get a papsmear? How would you feel if you were forced to be in the house all the time and never have time alone outside of the house? This is a form of oppression not protection. If you really want to protect sisters from rape, teach your brothers that women are not objects. Teach them that a women looks good for herself its not a come rape me sign. Encourage men that DATE RAPE is not acceptable. Stop blaming women for the poor decisions of men. What happend to Lowering the gaze? Teach men that No is No. There is No such thing as mixed signals when it comes to rape. Teach the men to want for women what they want for themselves.

 

[Zafran]

soooo are you saying that it's normal for men to be rapists?

Nope nobody said that but if wienstein and Trump around the corner then God help you and have fun teaching them to respect women.

 

[MuhammadHamza1]

Read this paragraph copied from Islamqa.It explains alot.
With regard to a woman going out of her house, according to sharee’ah it is not conditional upon her being accompanied by her husband or mahram as long as she is trustworthy and she goes to places where there is no fear for her, and the route she takes is safe. The presence of a mahram is a condition when she is travelling, but she does not have to be accompanied by a mahram everywhere she goes in the city – unless there is some evil or fitnah (temptation, tribulation) involved in her going even a short distance, in which case a woman should not go out on her own. Then it is better to be on the safe side and not go out unless she is with her husband or someone who can protect her and take care of her.

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As for why you cannot say prayer in language other than Arabic is because Allah has said that this is an Arabic Quran.The Quran in Arabic is a miracle.A translation is different.I do not need to explain the fact that translation is not perfect to Christian considering the many inaccurate translations of the New Testament.Even the Old Testament.Where Christians mistranslated many words.

 

[beleiver]

No....the Quran came within a context - to a community of believers (known as companions/sahahba and the family of the prophet also known as Ahul bayet which includes the wives of the prophet). These people taught through muttwatir (corroborated) evidence the main parts of the deen like the Quran, 5 pillars and certain things that are prohibited and obligations upon the individual Muslim and community.

The Quran was revealed not once but 23 years and the context and history is important. that is why there is Hadith, Usul fiqh, Grammer, mantiq and other sciences in interpreting the Quran and the sunnah - both are revelation.


where did you get this from? all this information was it in the Quran? He also taught them how to pray - What Ramadan was, zakat, Hajj, Enjoining good and forbidding evil, character development and manners. He is the mercy on all of humanity

"Indeed, in this [Quran] is notification for a worshiping people. And We have not sent you, [O Muhammad], except as a mercy to the worlds." (Quran: 21:106-107)

"There has certainly come to you a Messenger from among yourselves. Grievous to him is what you suffer; [he is] concerned over you [i.e., your guidance] and to the believers is kind and merciful." (Quran: 9:128)

"Certainly you have in the Messenger of Allah an excellent exemplar for him who hopes in Allah and the latter day and remembers Allah much." (Quran33:21)

I am getting it all from the Quran, my main point is it states numerous times how Allahas word as revealed to the Messenger (pbuh) is complete, perfected and detalied..
There is much emphasis on how Islam was revealed to the Propets before and how the people went astray.
Allha is Creator of the law of Truth that applies to all mankind, Mohamed (pbuh) was his messenger and leader of the people..He didnt create the Law but advised how it was applied..

One Quote from the Quran were he says to take what is given and leave what is forbidden , wasnt in the context that he was creating the Law but dividing up the spoils after a battle..He was to be obeyed in the sense that if he said mount up we are going into battle the people followed his orders, if he said dig a treanch , the people dug a trench..

Now really dont mean to disrespect the Scholars and the companions nor what evolved as Islam , i totally get and admire how it evolved in such an open sourced and documented way so we are all free to read and take note and the Truth is there for those with eyes to see, Islam is uniuqe in this regard and a reason i do beleive.
But in my mind the Quran in the foundation , the building block, and when it says its a clear complete and detailed works, then if its not in the Quran i have to take it as an addition made by man , not to ignore or dissmiss but not a fundemental universal Law that must be followed.

I see this rule as problematic , sound advice yes, but not a universal Law..Zero tollerance to rapists is a fundemtal Law as its clear and conscise and in the Quran and makes sense.



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I'm a non arab like most of the Muslims on earth who are - we have learnt the prayers in arabic and understand there meanings - its not hard if you can do other things for the world then learning the prayers is not difficult - there are plenty of teachers out there as well.

Yes, I started praying with Islamic prayers influencing my words and i get now why its best to learn Arabic, i am trying to learn the Arabic, but there are no Muslims where i live, and i have little time , slowly slowly, Inshalla..

And may God forgive my spelling , my spell check has stopped and i am not the acedemic type.

 

[beleiver]

Read this paragraph copied from Islamqa.It explains alot.
With regard to a woman going out of her house, according to sharee’ah it is not conditional upon her being accompanied by her husband or mahram as long as she is trustworthy and she goes to places where there is no fear for her, and the route she takes is safe. The presence of a mahram is a condition when she is travelling, but she does not have to be accompanied by a mahram everywhere she goes in the city – unless there is some evil or fitnah (temptation, tribulation) involved in her going even a short distance, in which case a woman should not go out on her own. Then it is better to be on the safe side and not go out unless she is with her husband or someone who can protect her and take care of her.

That makes perfect sense, but i think in cases it goes too far, for example i was reading through another thread where a man was worried about her wife travelling a long distance to see her family, he was unable to travel and was afraid it was a big sin letting his wife travel alone..
In Saudi for example i think there is even punishment for women travelling alone, where its that extreme the laws actually make harrasing women mandatory..
There is no clear cut rule that can work for all situations which is why in my heart there is no clear rule in the Quran, and why its good to look to hadith for guidance, but it becomes a problem when clearcut rules are enforced for all situations when they are not clearley prescribed by Allah, and he does know best..

Thanks for this thread its helped me get my head round a problem i have had with Islam.



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As for why you cannot say prayer in language other than Arabic is because Allah has said that this is an Arabic Quran.The Quran in Arabic is a miracle.A translation is different.I do not need to explain the fact that translation is not perfect to Christian considering the many inaccurate translations of the New Testament.Even the Old Testament.Where Christians mistranslated many words.

Even though i do still pray partly in English, over time i have seen why its better in Arabic, for example the 'beneficant the merciful' doesnt transalte, the Arabic has a much deeper meaning there are no english words for. It took me a while to understand and a simple thing like that is important.
That said i still feel i receive great benefits even with my improvised prayer in English, but i see the reasons to improve.

 

[99sobi]

With all due respect, i find it hard to agree with Sheikh Maududi's commentary, and i cant help but think beleiving a mans word over Allahas is a kind of Shirk thats going down the road of corruption all other releigions suffered.
Its still not clear and implies the Quran is incomplete. yet it sates otherwise.
To be honest when i read the Quran with main stream Islam in mind i cant help thinking Allaha is talking about Modern Islam the same way he talks of the Jews and non beleivers, no offence intended..

Here are a few random Quotes so you might better understand my query..

6:38 If you really want to see the signs of Allah, just look at any animal that walks upon the earth and any bird that flies in the air; they too are the communities like you. We have not left out anything from the Book in determining the courses of their lives. They all shall be gathered before

6:114 Say: Should I seek a judge other than Allah, when He is the One Who has revealed this Book (The Qur'an) with full details? Those whom We gave the Book, before you, know very well that it is revealed to you from your Rabb with the Truth; therefore, you should not be of those who have doubts.

7: 52 For We have certainly brought them a Book which provides clear details based on knowledge and which is a guidance and blessing for the true believers.

17.12 We have made the night and the day as two signs. We enshrouded the night with darkness and gave light to the day, to enable you to seek the bounty of your Rabb, and that you may compute the years and count the numbers. Thus, We have set forth all things in detail.

11:1 Alif Lam Ra. This Book, whose verses are perfected and issued in detail by the One Who is All-Wise, All-Aware.

41. 3 A Book whereof the verses are explained in detail a Qur'an in Arabic for people who understand.

12.111 There is a lesson in these stories of former people for the men of common sense. This story of Yusuf revealed in the Qur'an is not an invented tale, but a confirmation of previous scriptures - a detailed exposition of all things, and is a guidance and blessing for the people who believe.

The tafsir is not preferred over the Qur'an. The tafsir is a commentary that is written by the scholars of Islam who have studied it for decades. Their tafsir allows us to understand the context behind the Qur'anic verses, explaining ahadeeth etc, it is not an "addition" to the Qur'an.

66: 1 O Prophet! Why do you make something unlawful, which Allah has made lawful to you in seeking to please your wives? Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.

64. Say: Allah delivereth you from this and from all affliction. Yet ye attribute partners unto Him.
65. Say: He is able to send punishment upon you from above you or from beneath your feet, or to bewilder you with dissension and make you taste the tyranny one of another. See how We display the revelations so that they may understand.
66. Thy people (O Muhammad) have denied it, though it is the Truth. Say: I am not put in charge of you.

With regards to the first verse of At Tahrim you quoted, what is your point? There is context to this (namely that the Prophet forbade himself from having honey because his wives didn't like him, so Allah chastised him for forbidding something which is permissible (and encouraged) for him)

With regards to the second part, it says in many ayat that the Prophet is only a warner and a sender of glad tidings. He is not in charge of anyone to force them to listen to him; he is not a watcher over anyone. His job is just to send the message of Islam

 

[beleiver]

@99sobi I think the point i was trying to make is the main reason for this guardian ruling stems from what the prophet(pbuh) said about travelling in a couple of hadiths, if he cant forbid honey how can he forbid travelling alone?

But of course we can reflect on what he said as guidance, but it desnt make it a sound foundation of Law unless its a clear Revalation from Allah?

I am sure in the times he was living and in many situations its a great idea to have a guardian but not as a rule to be enforced for all the people for all of time.

 

[Zafran]

I am getting it all from the Quran, my main point is it states numerous times how Allahas word as revealed to the Messenger (pbuh) is complete, perfected and detalied..

like this

4.59. O you who believe! Obey God and obey the Messenger, and those from among you who are invested with authority; and if you are to dispute among yourselves about anything, refer it to God and the Messenger, if indeed you believe in God and the Last Day. This is the best (for you), and fairest in the end


Its important to understand the context and the Quran in full which is the Quran itself and the messenger,the people who Know/authority. Tell me if you dont follow any methodological tools that were grounded with the prophet and companions/his family then what are you using arabic Grammar?Logic? Testimonial evidence (hadith). Aximotic principles (usul ul fiqh), Theology (Kalam)?

One Quote from the Quran were he says to take what is given and leave what is forbidden , wasnt in the context that he was creating the Law but dividing up the spoils after a battle..He was to be obeyed in the sense that if he said mount up we are going into battle the people followed his orders, if he said dig a treanch , the people dug a trench..

How do you know the context the Quran is talking about? why, what, who - that is when you need the prophet pbuh and the people who were with him companions when revelation came.

Now really dont mean to disrespect the Scholars and the companions nor what evolved as Islam , i totally get and admire how it evolved in such an open sourced and documented way so we are all free to read and take note and the Truth is there for those with eyes to see, Islam is uniuqe in this regard and a reason i do beleive.

Very mystical but you need solid Epistemological grounding within the Quran and sunnah - One man is history (yourself) isn't exactly solid ground compared to the direct followers of revelation (the prophet, his family and companions) the many genius minds after (scholars) and there muttwatir (corroborated or mass transmitted) actions and reports.

You wouldn't do that with medicine or science or history then why do it the source of meaning of life?

As stated before without the context of the Quran one is blind - its the reason why nobody before the 20th century ever came up with the idea to just follow ones own subjective opinion on such a serious matter.

But in my mind the Quran in the foundation , the building block, and when it says its a clear complete and detailed works, then if its not in the Quran i have to take it as an addition made by man , not to ignore or dissmiss but not a fundemental universal Law that must be followed.

see above the verse of the Quran I quoted (4:59) - No idea where "universal law" came from is that in the Quran or is that an addition? Is that Immanuel Kant?

Yes, I started praying with Islamic prayers influencing my words and i get now why its best to learn Arabic, i am trying to learn the Arabic, but there are no Muslims where i live, and i have little time , slowly slowly, Inshalla..

Fair enough.

 

[beleiver]

@Zafran thanks for your reply, there is food for thought and points i will adress later in more detail , Inshallha, but first the 'universal law' i am a bit shocked a muslim would ask.

What is the Quran if it isnt a book of universal law for all people for all times so they can best submit to the will of the creator?

One example (though there are many) when talking of keeping duty to Allaha , it goes on to say the heavens and the earth were created by Him in Truth, High be he above all else associatied with Him.

For one , the Truth is a universal law, no? and the Quran is a book of Truth? And isnt Allaha the source of all Truth?

 

[azc]

The perfected way to pray is in the Sunnah agreed, but as there is no compulsion in Islam, I suppose Allah is saying its still possible to submit to Allah as long as you remember Him and pray
and live the righetous life and follow Truth?

It is another question i have , especially praying in a language i dont even understand, I do understand why it would be best to learn Arabic and pray like the Prophet, but untill i do i pray my way and i certainly beleive it helps me.


I started a thread with questions regarding prayer, i will continue the disscussion there rather than take this thread off topic, if you like?

Pray salah in Arabic whether or not you understand Arabic

 

[beleiver]

like this

4.59. O you who believe! Obey God and obey the Messenger, and those from among you who are invested with authority; and if you are to dispute among yourselves about anything, refer it to God and the Messenger, if indeed you believe in God and the Last Day. This is the best (for you), and fairest in the end


Its important to understand the context and the Quran in full which is the Quran itself and the messenger,the people who Know/authority. Tell me if you dont follow any methodological tools that were grounded with the prophet and companions/his family then what are you using arabic Grammar?Logic? Testimonial evidence (hadith). Aximotic principles (usul ul fiqh), Theology (Kalam)?

I have and read the Pickthall translation, it puts the context of the verse and has a nice introduction outlying the Prophets (pbuh) history, I have read and listened to many arguments and counter arguments from both sides and ultimatley , I pray for guidance , for Allaha to increase my knowlage and guide me on the right path, and in my mind i am clear he has no partners and its best if i decide the Truth for my self.
And of course I read the Quran, Its the complete, clear and detailed Truth on how we as a speciese are to find Peace, so naturally if a rule is not in it i treat it with susspicion, as the good book advises.
If i look at 4.59 the previous page tells how Islam had previously gone astray, beleiving invented lies , accepting partners its all there in that context..

How do you know the context the Quran is talking about? why, what, who - that is when you need the prophet pbuh and the people who were with him companions when revelation came.

Same again i read what the verse was about and read the whole verse.
I think i have adressed most these points previously in this thread, but the context of the Hadith where the Prophet(pbuh) does advise for guardians is one at a time of war, the other on a pilgrimage, which of course makes sense, it doesnt justify adding or inventing a rule for all the people all the time, which would lead to oppression and an unworkable dilemma..It would mean the numerous ayats where its says the Quran is complete, clear and detailed are wrong.

Very mystical but you need solid Epistemological grounding within the Quran and sunnah - One man is history (yourself) isn't exactly solid ground compared to the direct followers of revelation (the prophet, his family and companions) the many genius minds after (scholars) and there muttwatir (corroborated or mass transmitted) actions and reports.

People have been questioning these rulings from Hadiths as i have for 1000+ years, Islam has split into countless sects, one sect killed the Prophets(pbuh) family, all i know to be True is the Quran, I will use that as the foundation of Truth and look at the rest with intrest and an open mind, but refuse to follow any other than the word of Allaha. His book is clear complete and detailed, nothing need be added, other than advice.

You wouldn't do that with medicine or science or history then why do it the source of meaning of life?

Yes I do do that with medecine and science, this might be a long reply but i can draw a parralell with this to how corrupt the world is and that corruption has spread to everthing.

Medecine is ruled by big pharma corporations we are talking major bucks here in the trillions, The war on drugs was like a war on medecine where the mafia cornered the market, not only can the evil one make tons of tax free dollar to fund black projects, they demonised , outlawed effective natural medecine that has been used from the beggining of recorded history, and further the power of millitary, prison industrial complexes, divide communities and generally cause mischeif in the land.
My children were not vaccinated, long before the internet, i read many books, decided against, they dont know their doctor, they are very seldom ill, when they are ill we see a herbalist first, (ex parcticing doc who after 15 years saw the damage Pharma was doing and went herbal).
One case when we did take one child to a doctor for child croup, the doc said he had asthma and said he need a full face mask ventalin inhailer, we said we will get a seccond opinion and hey presto he did indeed have croup, easy remedy, no life long addiction to ventalin at the cost of 1000$$$. He is helathy, he has NEVER shown any signs of Asthma..
The lies we have been told about the vaccines is beyond reason and way beyond a doctors duty to inform the Truth before consent.
The only other person i actually know in real life that didnt vaccinate that wasnt a hippy type was in fact a pediatrician, they see the damege, but she couldnt make a fuss and kept it quiet , as her well paid job would be in jeopardy.
I could go on and on about medecine, how they use us as guinepigs and cash cows, how real safe medecine is prohibited and how they suppress open scientific research and study, silence and defame critics and genuine Doctors with a conscience...Big pharma will make more $ making us ill than making us better.

It warns in the Quran how Satan will deceive us, with his weapons and his wealth, how he will corrupt..How Islam was corrupted so many times before , he can do it again and certainly do it with the medecine proffesion, so no i dont blindly follow a doctor like i dont blindly follow anyone other than the Word of Allaha through my heart and mind.
I am not saying all doctors are bad nor all scholars, but i heed the clear warnings.

As stated before without the context of the Quran one is blind - its the reason why nobody before the 20th century ever came up with the idea to just follow ones own subjective opinion on such a serious matter.

History was written by the victors, i dont trust it either..But how many sects have split from Ilsam? i was just reading about hadith rejector sects that date from when the Hadiths were compiled, people have questiond the authorty besides Allahas after the Prophets(pbuh) death ever since, there were wars, assasinations there is a long, long history of it, but in all the struggle i have to give it to the scholars for preseving the word of Allha so today with the tech at our findertips, we can all find the Truth if we seek it.

see above the verse of the Quran I quoted (4:59) - No idea where "universal law" came from is that in the Quran or is that an addition? Is that Immanuel Kant?



Fair enough.

 

[beleiver]

Quit being ambiguous. Are you a hadith rejector? And are you one of the Quraniyoon? Yes or no. We need to know so we understand what we are dealing with.

I had a google, very intresting thanks, but sorry its not a yes or no answer, I love the science behind the hafith and the work people went to accuratly record it as possible and preserve the Prophets (pbuh) characature and such, but i cant trust it over the Quran, no way.

You were right to say your religion is "Jedi" and not Muslim. Your understanding is flawed, deviant and arrogant. You couldn't even spell "believer" as your name properly. Let this be a warning to the Muslims on here.

Inshalla i will do Ramadan and learn the shabada in arabic this month and chage my relegion sig and pray for better guidance, in Arabic..
If you will accept me as brother then great, if not no worries you will be just a brother that dissagrees me, and i will continue to just fear Allaha.

 

[Zafran]

f i look at 4.59 the previous page tells how Islam had previously gone astray, beleiving invented lies , accepting partners its all there in that context..

Nope that is not what the Verse is saying - it labels 3 authorities, you need the authorities as the Quran says, who are they? The Quran is detailed and tells you who to follow the prophet and those who know.

People have been questioning these rulings from Hadiths as i have for 1000+ years, Islam has split into countless sects, one sect killed the Prophets(pbuh) family, all i know to be True is the Quran, I will use that as the foundation of Truth and look at the rest with intrest and an open mind, but refuse to follow any other than the word of Allaha. His book is clear complete and detailed, nothing need be added, other than advice.

Nope testimonial evidence that is muttawatir not Hadith (Like praying 5 times, what Ramadan is, what is zakat etc) those have never been rejected by any sect including the Mutazalie, shia and Khawarij.

Hadith has an entire science around it which is thanks to the scholars but not school of thought or sect just took from the Quran - they follow the Quran which says to follow Allah (Quran itself) Prophet Muhammad pbuh (sunnah) and the people who Know (companions, family of the prophet and scholars). The Quran is in Arabic and Grammar is Important to understand the Quran so that is a science - then there is testimonial evidence/ hadith so that is a science - then there axiomatic principles of the Quran or also known as Usul ul Fiqh. There is theology (Kalam) etc etc.

Medecine is ruled by big pharma corporations we are talking major bucks

No I'm talking about the scientific methodology of medical science - Nobody can debate how the penicillin, antibiotics and many cures that have been found thanks to the scientific method. That last 100 years is witness to that. Not some shady practice by capitalist firms.

I am not saying all doctors are bad nor all scholars, but i heed the clear warnings.

You got 1000 years of scholarship and no sect is preaching what your preaching they all agreed with the Quran and the authorities it calls for. Same applies with corroborated history eg Battles, discoveries, empires etc - science medicine, economy, technology and transport. Islam and its sciences.

History was written by the victors, i dont trust it either..But how many sects have split from Ilsam?

so you dont think world war 2 ever happened - Cleopatra existed or 1066 was when the battle of Hastings occurred???

The splits of Islam were to do with politics (shia) Excommunication (Khawarij) Reason vs Faith/ Free will vs determinism/Ethics and God - nothing to do with just going with Quran or religious foundations - non of them had the same view you have.

i was just reading about hadith rejector sects that date from when the Hadiths were compiled, people have questiond the authorty besides Allahas after the Prophets(pbuh) death ever since, there were wars, assasinations there is a long, long history of it, but in all the struggle i have to give it to the scholars for preseving the word of Allha so today with the tech at our findertips, we can all find the Truth if we seek it.

Not talking about hadiths but Muttwatir corroborated reports and actions that have to do with Islamic foundations - no disagreements there.

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thanks for your reply, there is food for thought and points i will adress later in more detail , Inshallha, but first the 'universal law' i am a bit shocked a muslim would ask.

What is the Quran if it isnt a book of universal law for all people for all times so they can best submit to the will of the creator?

where does it say that in the Quran - where is the term universal law? are you mixing that with sharia? - as I said before it sounds Kantian.

 

[Misbah-Abd]

I had a google, very intresting thanks, but sorry its not a yes or no answer, I love the science behind the hafith and the work people went to accuratly record it as possible and preserve the Prophets (pbuh) characature and such, but i cant trust it over the Quran, no way.



Inshalla i will do Ramadan and learn the shabada in arabic this month and chage my relegion sig and pray for better guidance, in Arabic..
If you will accept me as brother then great, if not no worries you will be just a brother that dissagrees me, and i will continue to just fear Allaha.

May Allah make it easy for you and make us all brothers on the Straight Way.

 

[beleiver]

@Zafran, i am a little confusefd, are you saying all scholars and everyone agrees with the ruling about travelling alone, and its actually an enforcable law? or a recognised sin or what?

I really didnt think there was consensus?

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