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    Mental health

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    Quote Originally Posted by Islami.Mu'mina View Post
    Assalamu alaykum. I don't have much advice I can give other than what's already been given.

    Have you ever tried communicating your issues to your family?

    Self isolation is a very bad idea, it can be damaging. I knew a man who went through much trauma and he self isolated which led to him becoming a sociopath..

    I hope that you eventually find peace being around people. There are ways to overcome anxiety:

    I think first and foremost, try to connect to Allah. I have a question, when you read Quran, can you at least feel that connection with Allah? If so, keep it up. Even if your dua hasn't been answered yet. We should always keep our relationship with Allah even if things aren't going the way we expected. Make dua no matter what. Wake up for tahajud to make dua.

    Tie your camels and put your trust in Allah. Let's get to the tie your camels part. Making dua won't magically get rid of your anxiety (at least not in some situationss). You need to try to get rid of you anxiety yourself. Take it as a challenge, to improve yourself as a Muslim, so you can be happy again. Find something that REALLY motivates you to get rid of your fears. For example, I have an extreme fear of the dark (ik its stupid lol but it prevents me from going on with my day..).. Now this is a different example from yours, but it is a fear so its similar in a sense. I've been trying a form of cognitive therapy to get rid of it.. But what gave me the motivation to do this? For me it was actually Allah. Up until now I have always avoided situations of myself having to be in the dark alone.. But I've been slowly exposing myself because I want to be a stronger Muslim. Taking your biggest fears away is an amazing challenge. In the moment, you may be terrified, but right after it ends.. You finished your trial.

    See for me, its not just about getting rid of my fear so that I can finally normally go about my day without having to worry. Because no matter what, we will always have something to worry about. It'll be one fear after the other. For me, it's more about challenging yourself. Taking what scares you the most, and showing that you won't back down.. Not letting your mind control you, but becoming a master of your own mind. Because our emotion is the root to our problems. When I say that I want to make my self stronger.. I don't mean by being able to withstand the entity that scares you.. But being able to withstand the amount of emotional strain(fear) that is caused by it. So I won't be proud that I can make it through the dark (cuz its not something to rlly be proud of, lol), but I will be proud of the fact that I was able to withstand my emotion that was caused by it! So when I feel this anxiety again but with a different situation, I can at least handle it better!

    Um. Still terrified of the dark, its been a childhood fear that hasn't gone away for some reason. InshaAllah it'll go away

    But you could use this concept I mentioned with anything, not even fear. It can be sadness, pain, anger...

    So if you take this as a challenge and focus more on trying to win those internal wars for the reward of mastering your own mind, it may motivate you more than just wanting to be happy so you can speak to your family like a normal man

    (I knew a man who went through much trauma and he self isolated which led to him becoming a sociopath)
    Islami.Mu'mina
    Salam Sister

    Please tell me deatil story of this man and how he is now and how he behaves like
    sociopath because i know someone who is isolated due to trauma.
    Please sister...
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    Re: I don't know how to get better

    Yes, I met this man online because I wanted to interview someone with ASPD (sociopath/psychopath). It has always interested me, the way they think. I also believed a family member of mine is a sociopath which is one reason I contacted this man. I met him online when he made a post about how he has OCD and ASPD. I asked him many questions which has informed me on the way these types of people think. After that I told him about my family member and how he acts, all the signs on why I believe he has ASPD. And to my surprise, this sociopath ended up knowing so much about my family member! He completely laid out the entire history of my relative's past and why he believes my relative is a sociopath. How exactly did this man know about my relative's past? It is because of the compulsive, lifeless, repetitive behaviors that my relative made a ritual, correlating to his traumatic childhood. He mapped out every one of my relative's behavior and made amazing connections. No one could have explained it better than this man. I am very thankful for the time this man took to help me understand ASPD. It was truly an amazing learning experience. It has also let me understand the way my relative thinks, so that when we argue, I can understand him a lot more easier now

    Psychopaths and sociopaths are similar but different. Psychopaths genetically inherit ASPD while sociopaths get it due to trauma. Psychopaths literally cannot feel anything while sociopaths can still feel slightly more (something such as anger)

    I will explain a sociopath because this is what I know the most about.
    -ASPD is basically the inability to feel sympathy or emotion. Sociopaths do not know what happiness is, they do not know what it feels like to be hurt, they cannot feel love or connection to others. Even their depression is different from ours. They don't feel sad and vulnerable like us, they dont cry... Their depression is just the inability to feel anything. Just lifeless
    -Sociopaths can feel a few emotions which are an exception, this includes: Anger, amusement/surprise but this one is RARE(do not confuse this with happiness, they are two different things.) Amusement is very rare for them to feel, most of the times, when you see a sociopath laugh, its fake
    -Some sociopaths have extreme anger issues
    - Sociopaths have common issue with hurting pet animals and little children. Why? this is because they know that these animals cannot defend themselves or get someone else to defend them. Sociopaths take advantage of it. They can do it out of pleasure as well as some people gain pleasure out of harming others
    -Sociopaths feel constant boredom. They feel no emotion unlike us so really their life is very dead
    -They are amazing at manipulating, they do it without even realizing. When sociopaths socialize with others in public, they do not do it because they enjoy it. They do it because they have to, or they want to benefit. It can be for an increase in social status, in order to gain something from someone, to use people, etc..
    -Many sociopaths can be amazing charmers. This is also similar to the manipulation tactic, its just to benefit (There are some who really end up not caring to do it because they already get what they want)
    -They dont feel wrong like we do from doing violent actions. Because they cannot feel sympathy or anger in the way we do
    -They can feel lust/sexual desire but without the emotional connection. This is why you'll see that sociopaths/psychopaths who end up raping women don't even care. Some of them view women as sexual objects to relieve their sexual desire.
    -Any friendship, love, or connection is really just seen as something useful. Nothing else. It's really not their fault for that because they do not have emotional intelligence.
    - They can damage/hurt someone to benefit themselves if they want to. They will not feel remorse. Of course, consequences like jail can stop them because they wouldnt want to suffer those

    Now that I described ASPD... Let me tell you the good things about them and why criminal sociopaths do not have any excuse
    -Although they cannot emotionally sympathize, they have the ability to logically sympathize. Logical sympathy is when you may not feel bad for someone who gets hurt, but you can understand that no one likes to be harmed. So people with ASPD have the ability to tell the difference between good and bad, just not in the typical way humans would. People like you and me do rely on logical sympathy, but it stems from our emotional sympathy, which is why it is very hard for us to do evil deeds to others


    The man I was talking to let me know about his experience on changing. He used his cat as an example. It was actually a really beautiful one. This man is making an attempt to understand what love is. He cannot do it to our level, but he can on a logical level. See, on top of ASPD, this man is also diagnosed with OCD. He has intrusive thoughts to violently harm someone, anyone. He doesn't want to, but he keeps getting it. People without ASPD can have OCD as well just incase you didn't know. Often, since his cat is always around him, he constantly gets thoughts to harm the cat.

    Your average sociopath would probably constantly harm the cat. Why? So they can benefit and relieve their constant intrusive thoughts and since they do not feel bad. Especially he/she cannot face the consequences of animal abuse since no one would know.

    Let me quote something he said about his cat

    " I do sometimes hurt my cat to relieve the obsessive thoughts, but I try my best not to since my cat loves me more than any human ever could and I find love is useful in a way, because I was never shown love growing up I guess that’s why I find it somewhat useful. "

    "Yeah I obsess over thinking about doing violent things to people(OCD). As for my cat, I think she is benefiting me by loving me because I have never truly been loved by anyone or anything, so she is teaching me basically as I see it. I don’t feel bad for hurting her, but I don’t want to hurt her either. Hurting her has taught me that love is actually pretty valuable, like even though I’ve hurt her she has been worried whenever I attempted suicide, and she still thinks I am the best person alive for whatever reason, she has taught me stuff and knowledge is the most powerful thing you can have in my opinion. I wouldn’t say I necessarily try to do good, I basically just try to do bad things less, I dislike being out of control, so I’ve used my therapist to learn how to control myself, it’s me being selfish honestly"

    See over here how he's LOGICALLY starting to understand what love is. He understands it as something beneficial although he cannot feel it. He will not feel guilty to hurt his cat, but he won't do it anyway.

    Here is another quote from him about manipulation, why sociopaths try to please others, and why some sociopaths can be angry

    "
    The anger probably stems from growing up being angry at everything or most things, not being able to express yourself properly, being seen as different, and more; and anger is a hard emotion to control, because we have the ability to be angry so we can protect ourselves, which sometimes happens to be in overdrive in people with ASPD. People with ASPD often become people pleasers so they can get what they want, it’s a common manipulation tactic, you see this behavior throughout many species actually. I am guilty of using this manipulation tactic, I don’t do it so often now, but I still occasionally use it. "

    His quote on logical sympathy

    "
    People with ASPD can sympathize with people but it’s different from someone without ASPD, it’s something often called logical sympathy, basically we can understand why people would feel that pain, but we can’t feel bad for them, this is why we are sometimes good at seeming like we do care about there circumstances, and why other times we seem so cold"

    Now, I was confused on why he would commit suicide if he cannot feel sadness on an emotional level like us. Its because their version of depression is the inability to feel anything. Especially when they are committing suicide. Some people will fail at their suicide attempts because they are too scared to or they aren't emotionally ready. Sociopaths can't really feel that. Here is another quote. I specifically asked him why he would want to commit suicide if he cannot feel the sadness

    "
    Yes we can feel emotions, I just don’t think it’s like normal people experience them. It’s been too long for me to remember how emotions were before I developed ASPD. I think the most common emotion for us is emptiness, the inability to feel alive.Often times I will try to kill myself, because I feel the most alive whenever I am near death"


    For some of them, suicide is more of an urge, to satisfy that missing feeling. They are constantly bored and dead, so this may be the solution (in their heads), to satisfy what they were longing for.



    As I was talking to this man, I noticed that he expressed statements that sounded like he enjoyed talking to me on an emotional level, about his experience. Or that he felt amused connecting to another person. This is how I understood that sociopaths can easily charm. I asked him about the "emotion" he expressed while talking to me and whether it was real or not because I was genuinely curious on how his mind works. He told me that is was fake/to be normal and he doesn't find amusement in anything. I was very impressed on how he simply keeps up an act like that, he told me that it comes naturally for sociopaths

    So why exactly did he develop ASPD and become a sociopath? Everyone has their own different story. His was from abuse, neglect, and years of self isolation after the trauma. Unfortunately victims of abuse are the worst type of people who should be getting self isolation, because this will effect them the most negatively as opposed to a stable person

    He briefly told me his story since he doesn't feel uncomfortable talking about it. They can't get emotional over those things like we would. He was actually offering to tell me everything but I rejected it because I don't think I would have been able to handle it. He understood my choice though and thought it was better for me to decide.

    Basically, he was neglected, abused mentally + physically+ sexually, locked up in lockers and raped. After that he self isolated from everyone for YEARS. What was very disturbing is I started looking through his history and one of his posts. This post was created when he stopped self isolating at last. He was confused on why he felt different. He couldn't feel much other than hate. He was confused on what was going on with his mind. He was getting an urge to hurt others, etc.. He couldn't understand what most emotion is.

    He must've eventually realized after that, that he had developed ASPD.

    He's also diagnosed with OCD now, bipolar.. Hes getting hallucinations often now, hearing things. I think possibly psychosis as well which i remember him talking about that

    I am very grateful for him answering my questions and informing me. He is always willing to answer anything to anyone who is curious.

    He has also made me realize how it is possible for them to understand what is right vs wrong.

    Even though he himself manipulates by accident often without realizing it, he tries not to, even though he doesn't feel guilty about it. He acknowledges the fact that he is trying to be less of a selfish person because he knows what he is doing is wrong.

    Although I do not believe he is selfish, I actually believe he is good because Allah doesn't burden a soul with more than it can take. It seems like he is trying to do good with the mental illness he has

    But keep in mind, i am describing sociopaths, NOT psychopaths. Psychopaths are much more intense I haven't done my research on them but I believe they cannot feel anything at all including anger but I am not sure
    Last edited by Islami.Mu'mina; 12-25-2020 at 10:30 PM.
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    Re: I don't know how to get better

    Sister with all due respect i disagree. If a man know what is good or bad, he will be held accountable. If I get thoughts to commit adultery. I cannot act on it to relieve the tension little bit. This is self justification. The only mentally ill person is a person who is not aware what he is doing or cannot tell the difference between right and wrong. What he is doing is horrible and we shouldn't pity these people.

    I had a horrible childhood, so therefore it's okay for me to abuse people?
    No absolutely not. You have a choice to be good or bad but these people acted on their choice to get this mindset.
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    Re: I don't know how to get better

    If they have no emotions it is test but keep in mind why do sociopaths and psychopaths go to great lengths to hide their crimes? Or lie?

    They know what they are doing is wrong. Many sahabas had horrible lives but they didn't become evil or declare themselves "ill"

    Subahanallah we need to stop defending these evil people. These diseases were created so loopholes can be created and they can get away for crimes commited. This is all a hoax.
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    Re: I don't know how to get better

    Im thinking back now, maybe my ex is a sociopath, or has ASPD and no one's picked up on it yet.... There are a lot of things wrong in my scenario and the great lengths 'they' have gone to in my case in a prolonged unstoppable manner, showing no remorse whatsoever....

    My lot are 'either / and'
    - misguided
    - have shayateen attached to them
    - are mentally ill with ASPD
    - Sociopath

    They hide it so well to people who are not their victims... Yet...
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    Re: I don't know how to get better

    Subahanallah we need to stop defending these evil people.
    No where have I said that the evil deeds they have committed isn't wrong. I only stated how it feels like to be a socio/psychopath and that it is much harder to be a good person because of their inability to feel and understand emotion. I said that it isn't their fault for not having emotional intelligence. Whether the socio/psycho was extremely abused in the past isn't the problem anymore but rather the problem is the fact that they have real structural abnormalities with their brain that prevents them from thinking the same as us. If you go look it up, there are studies done on their brain structure.

    I had a horrible childhood, so therefore it's okay for me to abuse people?
    No, not at all. As I mentioned earlier, when it comes to childhood trauma, some people will go one route or others will take another route. By that, I'm saying that people can end up turning out really good because they learned that they don't want anyone else to suffer like that, or others can end up turning out bad and taking their anger on with them (some of these people may use their trauma as an excuse to hurt others which is even worse). Either way, both can understand what is right and wrong. They cannot be excused from their bad deeds. But there is a third case that can happen to both types of people, where you end up developing mental illness that you didn't even ask for. Trauma can result in things such as schizophrenia, psychosis, hallucinations, ASPD, much more... Even if the person isn't angry or doesn't care about his/her past anymore, it'll still be there, because it isn't in their control. These can make them go out of control without realizing it.

    If they have no emotions it is test but keep in mind why do sociopaths and psychopaths go to great lengths to hide their crimes? Or lie?
    Because they don't want to be at a disadvantage. Most naturally lie and manipulate to benefit because that's all they see in life. They hide their crimes not out of guilt, but so they don't have to face the consequences. So that they can remain at an advantage. It's a selfish way of thinking, but you're more prone to having this mindset if you cannot understand what most human emotion and sympathy is.

    They know what they are doing is wrong. Many sahabas had horrible lives but they didn't become evil or declare themselves "ill"
    Yeah of course the sahabas have had horrible lives but we need to keep in mind like you said, others are tested differently. Not every abused person will develop a mental illness. Some people will have the worst abuse stories that haven't affected them as much mentally. Some will have more minor abuse stories which end up seriously affecting them even if they always tried to be positive. That's because all of the minds we were blessed with function differently. Some people with extreme depression, stress, and trauma may not suffer from special abnormal mental diseases... while others will unlucky enough to genetically possess the trait that gives them this disease even though they haven't gone through anything crazy.

    What he is doing is horrible and we shouldn't pity these people.
    Although I did say that his actions aren't good, I did also mention that I believe he is a good person, and i do pity him. Which I will explain why

    If I get thoughts to commit adultery. I cannot act on it to relieve the tension little bit. This is self justification
    They know what they are doing is wrong
    I think this zina one is a great example you brought up and I will contribute to it. There are two types of sinners: 1. The one who commits it without caring 2. The one who gets too tempted and commits it out of weakness and vulnerability, but then regrets and repents.
    Even though you committed a sin out of weakness, you still did an evil action, but it is much different. Because you want to change that since you repented

    This man suffers from OCD which I'm sure you know about, he has constant intrusive thoughts to hurt others. He is constantly trying to get these thoughts out of his head. So he falls out of weakness and hurts his cat. He doesn't do it whenever he likes. Look at what he said

    "Yeah I obsess over thinking about doing violent things to people(OCD). As for my cat, I think she is benefiting me by loving me because I have never truly been loved by anyone or anything, so she is teaching me basically as I see it. I don’t feel bad for hurting her, but I don’t want to hurt her either. Hurting her has taught me that love is actually pretty valuable, like even though I’ve hurt her she has been worried whenever I attempted suicide, and she still thinks I am the best person alive for whatever reason, she has taught me stuff and knowledge is the most powerful thing you can have in my opinion. I wouldn’t say I necessarily try to do good, I basically just try to do bad things less, I dislike being out of control, so I’ve used my therapist to learn how to control myself, it’s me being selfish honestly"
    So yes he hurts her(the cat) sometimes because it is hard for him to control himself. No, he doesn't feel bad because he doesn't have the ability to feel emotion such as sympathy and love like we do. But he knows its wrong and thats exactly why he said he doesn't want to hurt her. So in reality, he is regretting like we should after hurting someone. He just can't regret and actually feel bad on an emotionally intelligent level. He can only logically understand that something is wrong. I find the fact that he can regret something without having emotional intelligence as something really impressive

    I wouldn’t say I necessarily try to do good, I basically just try to do bad things less, I dislike being out of control, so I’ve used my therapist to learn how to control myself, it’s me being selfish honestly
    And right here, you can tell he's trying to make change by getting a therapist because he doesn't like the fact that he is out of control

    And yeah I pity him because I have what he doesn't.. And if I were in his position, I would be a lot more evil than he is.


    If someone constantly hurt me, I would be angry. But if someone had an underlying problem that caused them much strain on them when they tried restraining themselves from hurting me. I wouldn't excuse their actions, but I would be more forgiving and understanding, realizing that they are trying to change themselves. They are in a much lower spot than I am, making it even more challenging for them to change. And these people who genuinely want to change are the ones that actually DON'T ask for pity and loopholes. They own up to their mistakes.

    These diseases were created so loopholes can be created and they can get away for crimes commited. This is all a hoax
    Psychopaths are accounted for their mistakes, they end up in jail. So it isn't fair to say that this is all a hoax to create loopholes, because there are people out there trying to change. Shutting out their problem and calling it a hoax won't help in any way. These diseases are a real struggle, and there are some people who genuinely can't tell wrong from right.
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    Re: I don't know how to get better

    Quote Originally Posted by Imraan View Post
    Im thinking back now, maybe my ex is a sociopath, or has ASPD and no one's picked up on it yet.... There are a lot of things wrong in my scenario and the great lengths 'they' have gone to in my case in a prolonged unstoppable manner, showing no remorse whatsoever....

    My lot are 'either / and'
    - misguided
    - have shayateen attached to them
    - are mentally ill with ASPD
    - Sociopath

    They hide it so well to people who are not their victims... Yet...
    Yeah she could be either misguided, cruel/oppressive horrible person, or mentally ill.

    If it comes to ASPD (ASPD is is an alternative name for being a socio/psycho), it means that she cannot feel emotions like sadness, happiness, love, stress, or really anything at all.... (I think they can slightly feel fear/stress​ but idk I have never ever seen a psycho/sociopath feeling afraid in the worst of situations. Even when they are caught + punished for their horrid crimes.. Or when something bad is about to happen) But most can still tell the difference between wrong and right because they still have some rationality. Most people who are mentally ill still have a degree of sanity and they can at least understand what they are doing is wrong even if they cannot control themselves (of course, there are those out there who have completely lost sanity and a sense of what is good and evil which my sympathy goes out to them, may Allah make it easy on them). So you don't ever need to feel like that you need to justify her actions because it really seems like she was a very oppressive person who knew she was hurting you.
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    Re: I don't know how to get better

    I think it is hard for us to understand what people have to deal with until we genuinely step into their shoes. All of our minds respond to issues differently. Especially those with mental deformities. Even if you aren't mentally ill, sadness over a specific issue can effect one person MUCH more than it effects another person EVEN if they both try to see life in a positive light. Same with anger and other emotion. Some people get triggered/angry much easier than others, it isn't their fault as long as they make an effort to change. It doesn't mean they are weak, in reality they are stronger because they are bearing a lot more emotion than your average person. Emotion itself can be a burden and a test as it can affect you rationality in many cases

    After speaking with this person, it made me realize how much I truly don't know..
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    Re: I don't know how to get better

    Quote Originally Posted by Islami.Mu'mina View Post
    Yeah she could be either misguided, cruel/oppressive horrible person, or mentally ill.

    If it comes to ASPD (ASPD is is an alternative name for being a socio/psycho), it means that she cannot feel emotions like sadness, happiness, love, stress, or really anything at all.... (I think they can slightly feel fear/stress​ but idk I have never ever seen a psycho/sociopath feeling afraid in the worst of situations. Even when they are caught + punished for their horrid crimes.. Or when something bad is about to happen) But most can still tell the difference between wrong and right because they still have some rationality. Most people who are mentally ill still have a degree of sanity and they can at least understand what they are doing is wrong even if they cannot control themselves (of course, there are those out there who have completely lost sanity and a sense of what is good and evil which my sympathy goes out to them, may Allah make it easy on them). So you don't ever need to feel like that you need to justify her actions because it really seems like she was a very oppressive person who knew she was hurting you.
    My 'former' half was able to express emotions and unusual behaviour not in line with her age, I now realise that age does not define how mature you are.

    I suppose (having thought about it a bit more) I could never differentiate whether her behaviour, reactions and emotions were coming from either her a) ability to express them from her heart or b) whether she was using rationale to make it look like a human response or human behaviour. (this is the scary part now).

    I now ask myself,,,,, how do you judge whether someone is genuine and 'from the heart' instead of them putting on a act to make it look like some kind of 'expected human behaviour'?

    It is really difficult to lean over mental illness with my ex, it really is but considering everything thats happening, someones wires are crossed really badly because normal 'sane' people don't do these things.
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    Re: I don't know how to get better

    Quote Originally Posted by Imraan View Post
    My 'former' half was able to express emotions and unusual behaviour not in line with her age, I now realise that age does not define how mature you are.

    I suppose (having thought about it a bit more) I could never differentiate whether her behaviour, reactions and emotions were coming from either her a) ability to express them from her heart or b) whether she was using rationale to make it look like a human response or human behaviour. (this is the scary part now).

    I now ask myself,,,,, how do you judge whether someone is genuine and 'from the heart' instead of them putting on a act to make it look like some kind of 'expected human behaviour'?

    It is really difficult to lean over mental illness with my ex, it really is but considering everything thats happening, someones wires are crossed really badly because normal 'sane' people don't do these things.


    I see what you're asking and that's actually a really good question.

    Before I state my answer, I do want to mention something about your ex. I honestly believe that she was more of a really misguided cruel oppressive manipulator rather than a sociopath and here is why I say that. I think from the start, there was something off to begin with. Generally when it comes to people with ASPD it takes time to start noticing things. There were also two other things, it wasn't just her, but her family was very off as well. It seems like they all have a similar oppressive wrong mentality. Of course I wouldn't know what goes on in their head. The last thing I wanted to mention was the whole dark taweez, ayn stuff. That family clearly went against the law of Allah. People stepping across the limits are bound to have serious issues going on with them. You said that you had found taweez in her purse and that her family had gone to visit magicians that told them that your mom did something with magic(i forgot what it was smth like that).. This already shows that they were involved in dark things that went against the limits of Allah, and it really isn't safe to be around people who deal with these things. Even then on top of that, a raqi diagnosed her with ayn to make things worse on the relationship.. I am not blaming her for getting it but how do you expect Allah to protect you from this stuff when you have already been involved with this dark stuff? I really do believe that this dark magic stuff, especially ayn, played a major part in this. Because ayn can completely tear marriages up and make things so different. But obviously, if she had a truly believing character as a Muslim, it wouldn't have got this bad. She wouldn't have become this oppressive and she would've made a great effort to get rid of the issue

    Now as for the question.. Its honestly something that takes more time to understand. You may never spot one so easily, but eventually with time you'll notice. Generally you may not be able to tell if the person is a sociopath just by guessing whether they are faking emotion or not. You have to look for other things first then look for more signs of them being fake. They radiate off differently than your extremely abusive person. You get angry, hurt, and confused from someone who oppresses you. But when it comes to people with ASPD, yeah you'll be angry and hurt but you'll also be more creeped out because something feels off.. Especially when they become cold and cruel without any anger.. Anyway, here are some signs that I have witnessed from personal experience and also clarified with others who have knowledge

    -One thing to think about is that many of these people are very good charmers (not all, but they can be manipulative).. They can seduce and capture your heart and seem very warm but also very charismatic and confident
    -Tend to be narcissists. Narcissists are people with an extreme sense of self importance.. They don't feel empathy for others.. They feel above everyone else. They cannot handle criticism
    -Some have extremely violent/anger issues depending on their past. They especially like to take out their anger and bully animals and little children. Unfortunately, anger is the one emotion some of them genuinely feel, if not, probably much more than us for some cases. These ones especially have a strong, extreme hatred for betrayal. They don't feel hurt about it, but rather angry. It's funny because they do it themselves all the time
    -always needing something to amuse/entertain them due to constant boredness
    -Tends to switch jobs very easily
    -Some tend to not care about life at all. Skipping out on responsibilities, not caring for the consequences
    -Always breaking promises
    -Can be very impulsive (by this I'm not just talking about anger). They can be impulsive with random decisions they want to make, it can happen often. Even if these decisions fail often. This can be whether its to start a random business or ways to handle certain situation with issues, etc.
    -finding good ways to manipulate you into believing them again after you've been hurt
    Now obviously, normal cruel/abusive people can have these traits so its important to differentiate between the two which I'll give you an example that'll hopefully help
    -Last sign (which really isn't a sign because you will never tell). Always being fake due to the inability of feeling emotion

    I wanted to bring someone up, I'll call him person X. . Here is one example, he isn't so much of a charmer because he's lucky to get whatever he wants without putting more effort into it. I believe he has ASPD, along with others. On top of that, he is an extremely angry and violent person. Now I'm only going to briefly describe his own signs because I don't want to write a whooooole story about it.

    I can tell this message is already going to be long though. Lol. I think I tend to write longer messages, but I think everyone enjoys it I hope. Better for discussion eh?

    Many of us always thought person X was a horrible angry person with issues, but we never put thought into what it could be because we were more focused on our anger towards him. Until one day someone else and I really put thought into what he could probably have, so we did much research and examined his behaviors for awhile and made connections. After awhile we decided there is a high chance that he has ASPD, we leaned more towards sociopath rather than psychopath(btw psychopaths are worse, and it is genetic). After much research, looking at interviews, etc.. I finally found a good sociopath to talk about it with. At this point I wasn't focused on being angry at person X, but I had become extremely interested in his behaviors and interactions. After talking to this new sociopath man, I learned a lot more about ASPD and a lot more about person X. It was actually amazing because this sociopath knew so much more than me about person X, whom he never met.. On top of that he told me about X's specific manipulation tactics and what his thought process is behind it. After hearing about what X's past probably looked like from this sociopath man (this guy could tell by X's compulsive behaviors and triggers that correlated to his past. It happens to some sociopaths) it kind of did make me emotional and realize I have to understand X when dealing with him. This is all legit info as well, I had predicted something similar to this man, but he did it much more in detail with explanation. I don't think anyone could have explained it better. I pray for people like this man to be guided to Islam, although he cannot feel bad for his actions and he manipulates often, hes trying to change. His past was very bad as well, been oppressed very intensely, sexually, physically, mentally. His past doesn't even bother him though as he cannot even sympathize with himself or feel hurt.

    Person X's signs:

    - physically abusive to pet animals (such as cats), especially the ones that are more scared and fragile rather than the more angry annoying ones. Constantly bullying and scaring them too. Physically/mentally abusive more to children. Abuse itself doesn't mean that a person is a sociopath. Extremely abusive people aren't necessarily sociopaths, but it is all about the patterns and the other signs combined. People with ASPD generally go for those who are weaker and can't speak out so that they don't have to deal with irritating consequences. Even if they faced consequences and people figured out about these nasty abusive actions.. They wouldn't feel guilty or ashamed/embarrassed/nervous about people figuring out this person's darkest sides. This person would just be irritated by the consequences (jail, etc.). Keep in mind since sociopaths develop ASPD based on their history, not all have extreme violent issues.

    -X's physical abuse, especially towards his children, were in pretty creative ways. But it was more for his own sadistic desires rather than the child being disobedient/bad (I know many mean parents usually only abuse their children when they aren't fulfilling their expectations). Even looking at him at the wrong moment could cause him to hurt you

    - There have been times where hes pulled crazy stunts with his abusive but not care right after and be collectively calm. One time his daughter said something rude to him so he calmly walked up to her and pulled a stupid stunt that hurt her. Right after he walked back to the couch and started watching TV without any expression. I'm pretty sure her mom and siblings were freaking out because they thought they'd need to take her to the ER, her mom was crying to her dad calling him cruel but he didn't care.. Didn't make any expression and he never even cared if she had to go to the ER. He kept ignoring everyone and calmly watching his show while everyone was freaking out. Its quite strange to hear that someone never had any reaction after taking something too far. X is generally impulsively angry and mentally abusive but sometimes he can do cruel things without caring and just remaining calm

    -Hes gotten away with evil things even outside of the home.

    -He always talks about how he'd never kill someone because he'll burn in hell.. Of course that isn't a bad thing.. But that really sounds like his only reason if you also got the same vibe from the sentence.

    -His ex wife had an affair. His wife (the one he is with now) told me that he would've set his ex's garage on fire while she is in it to kill her if it WEREN'T for the consequences (he's probably referring to hell).. That's a pretty smart way to kill someone and get rid of evidence huh?

    - He's constantly always on his own. He has no desire to talk to others be be around others, he has no interest in anything at all. He'll use his phone all day watching random things that kill his time. His expression through out the day is lifeless. Unlike other sociopaths, he isn't really charming, but most probably for the reason that he is old and there is nothing more for him to achieve because he gets his basic necessities and what he wants. He doesn't really communicate with anyone unless he needs something OR he'll talk to his wife sometimes but only to talk about who he hates so much. Often he'll ignore her when she wants to genuinely talk

    - He doesn't care for his health issues. Whenever he gets SERIOUS health issues, like im talking about ones that need treatment asap, he will not even care at all. He won't even do anything about it until his family members keep bothering him and end up forcing him b4 it gets much worse and chronic.

    - He is never loyal with his job, sometimes he even leaves because he has issues with people. Switches often

    -This is a really interesting one that we've examined. When he sees people in unfortunate condition he pities them by expressing his hate to those who hurt them. We would do the same, but mostly because we are angry that the person would oppress another.. We'd also feel bad for the oppressed. But it seems like X just hates the oppressor for his own reasons (such as them being able to do what they want)... Even when he does the same

    - Person X doesn't do a very good job at acting normal.. rarely see this, but when he smiles, it looks very off and fake.. He can never apologize and make it look sincere. After hurting someone, he will start laughing it off/acting silly when he is saying sorry because it seems like he can't even fake a sincere apology.


    - He does laugh and find amusement in things, but many times he laughs about abusive actions hes committed against others from the past

    -He doesn't really enjoy the same things as those around him, he may look dead and lifeless while everyone else is laughing together

    -His siblings are completely different.. As in happy and outgoing. Some of them are serious and more negative but in different ways and not like him

    -He only praises and gives his children affection on rare occasions generally when he wants something.. It looks completely fake and cringy though.. He'll especially do it in front of his wife in order to please her so he can get a special something in return...

    - Generally he will say things that sound off. One time X's son was talking to X about a terrifying experience when someone was about to die right in front of him (from a stroke, poor man). X chuckled as if his son was saying a joke when he talked about the story but his son was like "Im being serious! It was scary!" X asked him why he was scared.. He replied "because someone was about to die in front of me!".. (after listening to his story, we all understood that it would be pretty scary to see someone have a stroke right in front of you).. X replied with " But it's not your fault" with a complete dead face throughout the whole conversation. Everyone got quiet. That was one example.

    -It gets more complicated when they believe in a religion. There are even signs that show up in their religious practices and behaviors, especially with X. The man I've talked to also explained about this part as well and he was surprisingly accurate although he doesn't associate himself with a religion. I'm not going to get into that one, its a bunch of more observations as well

    This one seems like a good example overall I feel like


    See, there are little weird interesting behaviors that build up... It makes me interested in psychology. Heh, I get to take it next SEM.. I hope it'll be interesting. Its really interesting understanding the way others perceive and react to situations

    Sometimes I have always thought of pursuing a career in that field but it may be hard if I want to focus more on raising good Muslim kids.... I think maybe when I get older and my future children get old.. Thats actually the perfect time since you have more leisure time. Of course there may be some extra time for Muslimahs to be studying a little bit even when married, but they can really donate time when their children grow up because thats when they start to get more leisure time. I was actually watching this video once by Daniel Haqiqatchou. He explained this stuff in a very interesting way about muslim women working

    - - - Updated - - -

    can tell this message is already going to be long though
    oh lord, I finally sent the message and looked at it. I knew it was going to be long again
    Last edited by Islami.Mu'mina; 12-26-2020 at 06:04 AM.
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    Re: I don't know how to get better

    Sister, again, I respect you and i understand you have good intentions. Please forgive but again I disagree.

    Allah says very clearly those who know right from left. Are aware of their actions...will be held accountable and are evil.

    The hadith of insane person is one who sense of reality is broken such as schizophrenic, autism, or other insane.

    Psychopaths, narcissists, and sociopaths are all evil people. Yes we should educate them but when they make remarks of wanting to hurt people...seriously??

    If I want to cheat on my wife...its okay because I get OCD about it. Sister. I am an OCD person, yet alhamdullah I know whatever I do, bad will be held accountable. It is my test that I'm ocd but it is a test nonetheless.

    Allah said in the quran arrogance is a disease and it should not be there. Narcissist people are arrogant and diseases but also because they chose that route.

    Firawn was a Narcissist and Allah said he will punish him. Did Allah say he was sick?

    Allah forgives those who want to change and who try, but Allah also punishes those who hurt others.

    I praise you for your caring attitude but be careful of who you give it to . These people are evil, and we should give dawah but if they are aware and still persist in their evil, then we need to run the other way.
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    Re: I don't know how to get better

    Sister, again, I respect you and i understand you have good intentions. Please forgive but again I disagree
    Brother, no need to worry, I think it's a healthy discussion that should be talked about

    Allah says very clearly those who know right from left. Are aware of their actions...will be held accountable and are evil.

    The hadith of insane person is one who sense of reality is broken such as schizophrenic, autism, or other insane
    Yeah, I understand that. I just don't think that it is fair for us to judge who is insane and who isn't. From an outside view, some people may not seem insane until you really dive into their mind and witness what they go through. Even when scholars give fatwas to people with personal questions on this, they only mention insane.. They don't limit insanity to a certain group of people with certain mental issues such as schizophrenia and the ones you said. They judge according to the situation and how the person explains it. And Allah knows best as he knows what is in the heart

    Psychopaths, narcissists, and sociopaths are all evil people.
    Just like this, we cannot automatically judge them all to be evil people. Many of these people genetically inherit this trait. So does that mean they are automatically evil people because they got a mental issue they didn't ask for? Aren't truly evil doomed to hell? So is Allah going to doom every sociopath, narcissist, and psychopath to hell for something He gave them? No, because of this verse

    "Allah does not burden a soul with more than it can bear." (Quran 2:286)

    Let's face it, those with ASPD genuinely don't have the ability to feel bad for hurting others even though they wish they did. You and I were gifted with something they don't have, so its natural to not understand what they have to live with

    Allah said in the quran arrogance is a disease and it should not be there. Narcissist people are arrogant and diseases but also because they chose that route.

    Firawn was a Narcissist and Allah said he will punish him. Did Allah say he was sick?
    I was mostly talking about Socio/psychopaths and that narcissism is a sign of some of them. But I can still see what you're saying so I'll respond along to this. Firawn was extremely cruel, but what was even worse is that he didn't even bother to try and change due to his selfish desires.

    This case is completely different from someone who is born with the genetic inability to feel emotion yet tries to be a good person even though he may hurt others while hes at it since he can't feel guilt.

    We all have our own internal jihad, I bet there are some narcissists out their trying so hard to get rid of their arrogance.. Isn't this fighting for the sake of Allah? People like you and I may have less arrogance effortlessly compared to the narcissists who genuinely try extremely hard to get rid of their arrogance. Does that really make you and I better Muslims though? Because it seems like they are fighting a lot harder in their internal jihad/war.

    Allah said in the quran arrogance is a disease and it should not be there. Narcissist people are arrogant and diseases but also because they chose that route
    Yeah I agree as well but look what you said at the end of your sentence

    but also because they chose that route
    When you chase that route, then you're doomed. But if you're trying to change a problem you already have, that means there is good in your heart. And that is why Allah is forgiving


    If I want to cheat on my wife...its okay because I get OCD about it. Sister. I am an OCD person, yet alhamdullah I know whatever I do, bad will be held accountable. It is my test that I'm ocd but it is a test nonetheless.
    I think you're confused about my point, I didn't say they wont be held accountable and I didn't say their actions are okay. But I didn't say they are evil either, because I cannot judge what is in their hearts. But I did say that it is much more difficult to change. To be forgiven for harming someone, you need Allah's forgiveness but you also need the forgiveness from whom you've oppressed.

    As for the OCD thing, it can come in different intensities for different people depending on how severe it is. But regardless of that, maybe you may be strong enough to withstand those thoughts. But not everyone is, they have their own tests and they will fall. I've heard of Muslims constantly shaking practically going crazy and flipping out over their OCD issue such as needing to remake wudu. How many times have they compulsively given into their thoughts and followed it? Since I was defending that sociopath man, now imagine someone who gets those thoughts in the same intensity or even worse except his thoughts are about hurting others? Do you really think he wants that? But on top of that, they have another mental issue that makes them unable to sympathize and feel guilt. It is a lot harder to control yourself in that case.


    The hadith of insane person
    Although we should never be the ones to judge what is in someone's heart, I did mention that most people with ASPD have the rationality to logically tell the difference between good and bad. I never called them insane and that their actions would be unaccountable to begin with.

    I just believe that we cannot judge them to be evil for actions that are hard to control because Allah will not burden a soul with more than it can bear. I will still continue to find it impressive that someone with OCD urges to hurt others + the inability to feel bad for hurting others (due to ASPD) makes an effort to control himself logically knowing that it is the wrong thing to do, even if he may fall weak and end up hurting someone else.. Yeah he won't feel bad, but he probably wishes he could. And after that, he stilll tries to change.

    Remember, isn't there a man who killed 100 men and was forgiven?

    This all boils down to the fact that Allah will not burden a soul with more than it can bear. We cannot automatically assume someone is evil for a deed they did when we don't even understand how their mind works

    now there are some narcissists, sociopaths, and psychos who dont care to try and change even though they can logically understand what's wrong and right. Well this case is completely different, and its a bad case to be in. And this is the case Firuwn falls under.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Thank you to the moderator who created the new thread. I think this is an important one
    Last edited by Islami.Mu'mina; 12-26-2020 at 08:08 AM.
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    Re: I don't know how to get better

    Quote Originally Posted by Islami.Mu'mina View Post
    I see what you're asking and that's actually a really good question.

    Before I state my answer, I do want to mention something about your ex. I honestly believe that she was more of a really misguided cruel oppressive manipulator rather than a sociopath and here is why I say that. I think from the start, there was something off to begin with. Generally when it comes to people with ASPD it takes time to start noticing things. There were also two other things, it wasn't just her, but her family was very off as well. It seems like they all have a similar oppressive wrong mentality. Of course I wouldn't know what goes on in their head. The last thing I wanted to mention was the whole dark taweez, ayn stuff. That family clearly went against the law of Allah. People stepping across the limits are bound to have serious issues going on with them. You said that you had found taweez in her purse and that her family had gone to visit magicians that told them that your mom did something with magic(i forgot what it was smth like that).. This already shows that they were involved in dark things that went against the limits of Allah, and it really isn't safe to be around people who deal with these things. Even then on top of that, a raqi diagnosed her with ayn to make things worse on the relationship.. I am not blaming her for getting it but how do you expect Allah to protect you from this stuff when you have already been involved with this dark stuff? I really do believe that this dark magic stuff, especially ayn, played a major part in this. Because ayn can completely tear marriages up and make things so different. But obviously, if she had a truly believing character as a Muslim, it wouldn't have got this bad. She wouldn't have become this oppressive and she would've made a great effort to get rid of the issue

    Now as for the question.. Its honestly something that takes more time to understand. You may never spot one so easily, but eventually with time you'll notice. Generally you may not be able to tell if the person is a sociopath just by guessing whether they are faking emotion or not. You have to look for other things first then look for more signs of them being fake. They radiate off differently than your extremely abusive person. You get angry, hurt, and confused from someone who oppresses you. But when it comes to people with ASPD, yeah you'll be angry and hurt but you'll also be more creeped out because something feels off.. Especially when they become cold and cruel without any anger.. Anyway, here are some signs that I have witnessed from personal experience and also clarified with others who have knowledge

    -One thing to think about is that many of these people are very good charmers (not all, but they can be manipulative).. They can seduce and capture your heart and seem very warm but also very charismatic and confident
    -Tend to be narcissists. Narcissists are people with an extreme sense of self importance.. They don't feel empathy for others.. They feel above everyone else. They cannot handle criticism
    -Some have extremely violent/anger issues depending on their past. They especially like to take out their anger and bully animals and little children. Unfortunately, anger is the one emotion some of them genuinely feel, if not, probably much more than us for some cases. These ones especially have a strong, extreme hatred for betrayal. They don't feel hurt about it, but rather angry. It's funny because they do it themselves all the time
    -always needing something to amuse/entertain them due to constant boredness
    -Tends to switch jobs very easily
    -Some tend to not care about life at all. Skipping out on responsibilities, not caring for the consequences
    -Always breaking promises
    -Can be very impulsive (by this I'm not just talking about anger). They can be impulsive with random decisions they want to make, it can happen often. Even if these decisions fail often. This can be whether its to start a random business or ways to handle certain situation with issues, etc.
    -finding good ways to manipulate you into believing them again after you've been hurt
    Now obviously, normal cruel/abusive people can have these traits so its important to differentiate between the two which I'll give you an example that'll hopefully help
    -Last sign (which really isn't a sign because you will never tell). Always being fake due to the inability of feeling emotion

    I wanted to bring someone up, I'll call him person X. . Here is one example, he isn't so much of a charmer because he's lucky to get whatever he wants without putting more effort into it. I believe he has ASPD, along with others. On top of that, he is an extremely angry and violent person. Now I'm only going to briefly describe his own signs because I don't want to write a whooooole story about it.

    I can tell this message is already going to be long though. Lol. I think I tend to write longer messages, but I think everyone enjoys it I hope. Better for discussion eh?

    Many of us always thought person X was a horrible angry person with issues, but we never put thought into what it could be because we were more focused on our anger towards him. Until one day someone else and I really put thought into what he could probably have, so we did much research and examined his behaviors for awhile and made connections. After awhile we decided there is a high chance that he has ASPD, we leaned more towards sociopath rather than psychopath(btw psychopaths are worse, and it is genetic). After much research, looking at interviews, etc.. I finally found a good sociopath to talk about it with. At this point I wasn't focused on being angry at person X, but I had become extremely interested in his behaviors and interactions. After talking to this new sociopath man, I learned a lot more about ASPD and a lot more about person X. It was actually amazing because this sociopath knew so much more than me about person X, whom he never met.. On top of that he told me about X's specific manipulation tactics and what his thought process is behind it. After hearing about what X's past probably looked like from this sociopath man (this guy could tell by X's compulsive behaviors and triggers that correlated to his past. It happens to some sociopaths) it kind of did make me emotional and realize I have to understand X when dealing with him. This is all legit info as well, I had predicted something similar to this man, but he did it much more in detail with explanation. I don't think anyone could have explained it better. I pray for people like this man to be guided to Islam, although he cannot feel bad for his actions and he manipulates often, hes trying to change. His past was very bad as well, been oppressed very intensely, sexually, physically, mentally. His past doesn't even bother him though as he cannot even sympathize with himself or feel hurt.

    Person X's signs:

    - physically abusive to pet animals (such as cats), especially the ones that are more scared and fragile rather than the more angry annoying ones. Constantly bullying and scaring them too. Physically/mentally abusive more to children. Abuse itself doesn't mean that a person is a sociopath. Extremely abusive people aren't necessarily sociopaths, but it is all about the patterns and the other signs combined. People with ASPD generally go for those who are weaker and can't speak out so that they don't have to deal with irritating consequences. Even if they faced consequences and people figured out about these nasty abusive actions.. They wouldn't feel guilty or ashamed/embarrassed/nervous about people figuring out this person's darkest sides. This person would just be irritated by the consequences (jail, etc.). Keep in mind since sociopaths develop ASPD based on their history, not all have extreme violent issues.

    -X's physical abuse, especially towards his children, were in pretty creative ways. But it was more for his own sadistic desires rather than the child being disobedient/bad (I know many mean parents usually only abuse their children when they aren't fulfilling their expectations). Even looking at him at the wrong moment could cause him to hurt you

    - There have been times where hes pulled crazy stunts with his abusive but not care right after and be collectively calm. One time his daughter said something rude to him so he calmly walked up to her and pulled a stupid stunt that hurt her. Right after he walked back to the couch and started watching TV without any expression. I'm pretty sure her mom and siblings were freaking out because they thought they'd need to take her to the ER, her mom was crying to her dad calling him cruel but he didn't care.. Didn't make any expression and he never even cared if she had to go to the ER. He kept ignoring everyone and calmly watching his show while everyone was freaking out. Its quite strange to hear that someone never had any reaction after taking something too far. X is generally impulsively angry and mentally abusive but sometimes he can do cruel things without caring and just remaining calm

    -Hes gotten away with evil things even outside of the home.

    -He always talks about how he'd never kill someone because he'll burn in hell.. Of course that isn't a bad thing.. But that really sounds like his only reason if you also got the same vibe from the sentence.

    -His ex wife had an affair. His wife (the one he is with now) told me that he would've set his ex's garage on fire while she is in it to kill her if it WEREN'T for the consequences (he's probably referring to hell).. That's a pretty smart way to kill someone and get rid of evidence huh?

    - He's constantly always on his own. He has no desire to talk to others be be around others, he has no interest in anything at all. He'll use his phone all day watching random things that kill his time. His expression through out the day is lifeless. Unlike other sociopaths, he isn't really charming, but most probably for the reason that he is old and there is nothing more for him to achieve because he gets his basic necessities and what he wants. He doesn't really communicate with anyone unless he needs something OR he'll talk to his wife sometimes but only to talk about who he hates so much. Often he'll ignore her when she wants to genuinely talk

    - He doesn't care for his health issues. Whenever he gets SERIOUS health issues, like im talking about ones that need treatment asap, he will not even care at all. He won't even do anything about it until his family members keep bothering him and end up forcing him b4 it gets much worse and chronic.

    - He is never loyal with his job, sometimes he even leaves because he has issues with people. Switches often

    -This is a really interesting one that we've examined. When he sees people in unfortunate condition he pities them by expressing his hate to those who hurt them. We would do the same, but mostly because we are angry that the person would oppress another.. We'd also feel bad for the oppressed. But it seems like X just hates the oppressor for his own reasons (such as them being able to do what they want)... Even when he does the same

    - Person X doesn't do a very good job at acting normal.. rarely see this, but when he smiles, it looks very off and fake.. He can never apologize and make it look sincere. After hurting someone, he will start laughing it off/acting silly when he is saying sorry because it seems like he can't even fake a sincere apology.


    - He does laugh and find amusement in things, but many times he laughs about abusive actions hes committed against others from the past

    -He doesn't really enjoy the same things as those around him, he may look dead and lifeless while everyone else is laughing together

    -His siblings are completely different.. As in happy and outgoing. Some of them are serious and more negative but in different ways and not like him

    -He only praises and gives his children affection on rare occasions generally when he wants something.. It looks completely fake and cringy though.. He'll especially do it in front of his wife in order to please her so he can get a special something in return...

    - Generally he will say things that sound off. One time X's son was talking to X about a terrifying experience when someone was about to die right in front of him (from a stroke, poor man). X chuckled as if his son was saying a joke when he talked about the story but his son was like "Im being serious! It was scary!" X asked him why he was scared.. He replied "because someone was about to die in front of me!".. (after listening to his story, we all understood that it would be pretty scary to see someone have a stroke right in front of you).. X replied with " But it's not your fault" with a complete dead face throughout the whole conversation. Everyone got quiet. That was one example.

    -It gets more complicated when they believe in a religion. There are even signs that show up in their religious practices and behaviors, especially with X. The man I've talked to also explained about this part as well and he was surprisingly accurate although he doesn't associate himself with a religion. I'm not going to get into that one, its a bunch of more observations as well

    This one seems like a good example overall I feel like


    See, there are little weird interesting behaviors that build up... It makes me interested in psychology. Heh, I get to take it next SEM.. I hope it'll be interesting. Its really interesting understanding the way others perceive and react to situations

    Sometimes I have always thought of pursuing a career in that field but it may be hard if I want to focus more on raising good Muslim kids.... I think maybe when I get older and my future children get old.. Thats actually the perfect time since you have more leisure time. Of course there may be some extra time for Muslimahs to be studying a little bit even when married, but they can really donate time when their children grow up because thats when they start to get more leisure time. I was actually watching this video once by Daniel Haqiqatchou. He explained this stuff in a very interesting way about muslim women working

    - - - Updated - - -


    oh lord, I finally sent the message and looked at it. I knew it was going to be long again
    Jazak Allah sister.
    Breaking someone's behaviour down in details requires effort and patience, on top of that it is unpredictable (random mood swings).

    I think from my experience with my ex and her family it was a mixture of causes. Before I put blame on them I should say that non of are perfect, maybe I could have addressed it differently to help them especially my ex. I did try and I spoke to her many times, despite her agreeing me and my family suffered at the hands of her and her family. To that I say Bi idnillah... However I don't see the good from it (apart from she is kind of out of our lives) but that I see a lot more of bad in it because of all the stuff that happened.

    For me mental illnesses is scary, it has unknowns, I mean no one can get inside someones head, behaviours are unpredictable and while it may seems like theories and unusual traits and behaviours are being anticipated, I personally found it hard to accept these proven without seeing any tangible evidence taken from humans. Most of it is done on observation, some of it derived from analysis of alpha waves, sleep patterns, seratonin and dopamine levels in the body, I studied some but it just wasn't for me.

    After the experience with the ex, I try even harder to make observations on people to summarise and judge a character. I suppose detecting any underlying mental health issues have a better chance of being apparent/detected when you actually spend time with them or live with them. Hope I don't get married to someone like the ex again eh... Insh Allah.

    Reading your posts has made me a bit more paranoid because it goes into so much detail and it is sad that there are people out there suffering. I have a nephew who is diagnosed with autism, it was only after he had been diagnosed with this that I stopped repeatedly asking myself to why my nephew would behave and respond to me in a particular way. After that I researched autism so I can understand him better.

    Still better to try and remain optimistic eh?

    Pray Allah swt save us all from calamities and help maintain our own and everyone else's mental health.. Insh Allah
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    Re: I don't know how to get better

    Greetings and peace be with you Islami.Mu'mina;

    Basically, he was neglected, abused mentally + physically+ sexually, locked up in lockers and raped.
    Sadly; this person has earned the right to be angry; and I feel the label of sociopath is so unfair. More than likely, the perpetrator has not faced justice and has not been punished for what they did and they are free to abuse again.

    The victim has been punished in so many ways, if he has felt anger for twenty years, the peodeophile has controlled his mind for twenty years. He cannot be the kind and caring person he wants to be. Anger has to go somewhere, so the cat suffers, the cat is also an innocent victim. If he finds it difficult to turn his anger against other people, then he will turn it against himself in the form of self harm or suicidal thoughts and attempts.

    The only way to overcome these thoughts is forgiveness. Not because the other person deserves to be forgiven, but mainly to find peace for himself.

    I listened to Glen tell his story in Manchester Cathedral. He had grown up with David Beckham, and they had both been signed up to play football with Leighton Orient. He had a life of fame and fortune ahead of him. Shortly after he went to a night club and was stabbed in the back and beaten up. He spent a year in hospital and has been paralysed from the waist down; he has been in a wheelchair for the last 27 years. They caught the man who did this, he served four years in prison, he was then able to walk out of prison on his own two feet, and justice had been served.

    By this time, Glen had learned to drive a disabled taxi, he tracked down his assailant, and then stalked him with the intention of running him over. Glen saw an opportunity to run his attacker down, but something stopped him. He said he came to understand that true justice could not happen. Justice is not that two people should be crippled, rather, it is that neither of them should be crippled. He knew he could never turn back time. He came to understand that he had to let go of his hatred; if not, he would become worse than his assailant.

    He said he has to live with two diseases, being crippled, and the greater disease was the hate burning away inside him. Forgiveness and letting go of the hatred was a gradual process for his own benefit, his wheelchair has been a daily reminder of the past injustice.

    Glen goes round the country talking about the need to let go of anger, and striving to be the kind and caring person that you want to be. After we heard his story we were asked to say a blessing and we were to keep in mind all the people that we love and cared for. Then we were asked to say the same blessing for all those who had hurt us.

    True justice can never happen here on Earth, only God can put all things right in a greater good life after death.

    In the spirit of praying for a peace that surpasses all understanding.

    Eric
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    Re: I don't know how to get better

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric H View Post
    Greetings and peace be with you Islami.Mu'mina;



    Sadly; this person has earned the right to be angry; and I feel the label of sociopath is so unfair. More than likely, the perpetrator has not faced justice and has not been punished for what they did and they are free to abuse again.

    The victim has been punished in so many ways, if he has felt anger for twenty years, the peodeophile has controlled his mind for twenty years. He cannot be the kind and caring person he wants to be. Anger has to go somewhere, so the cat suffers, the cat is also an innocent victim. If he finds it difficult to turn his anger against other people, then he will turn it against himself in the form of self harm or suicidal thoughts and attempts.

    The only way to overcome these thoughts is forgiveness. Not because the other person deserves to be forgiven, but mainly to find peace for himself.

    I listened to Glen tell his story in Manchester Cathedral. He had grown up with David Beckham, and they had both been signed up to play football with Leighton Orient. He had a life of fame and fortune ahead of him. Shortly after he went to a night club and was stabbed in the back and beaten up. He spent a year in hospital and has been paralysed from the waist down; he has been in a wheelchair for the last 27 years. They caught the man who did this, he served four years in prison, he was then able to walk out of prison on his own two feet, and justice had been served.

    By this time, Glen had learned to drive a disabled taxi, he tracked down his assailant, and then stalked him with the intention of running him over. Glen saw an opportunity to run his attacker down, but something stopped him. He said he came to understand that true justice could not happen. Justice is not that two people should be crippled, rather, it is that neither of them should be crippled. He knew he could never turn back time. He came to understand that he had to let go of his hatred; if not, he would become worse than his assailant.

    He said he has to live with two diseases, being crippled, and the greater disease was the hate burning away inside him. Forgiveness and letting go of the hatred was a gradual process for his own benefit, his wheelchair has been a daily reminder of the past injustice.

    Glen goes round the country talking about the need to let go of anger, and striving to be the kind and caring person that you want to be. After we heard his story we were asked to say a blessing and we were to keep in mind all the people that we love and cared for. Then we were asked to say the same blessing for all those who had hurt us.

    True justice can never happen here on Earth, only God can put all things right in a greater good life after death.

    In the spirit of praying for a peace that surpasses all understanding.

    Eric
    That is the sad reality of this world, but shouldnt we strive to get that justice, isn't that a god given right itself?
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    Re: I don't know how to get better

    Greetings and peace be with you Imraan;

    That is the sad reality of this world, but shouldnt we strive to get that justice, isn't that a god given right itself?
    If we want justice, we can only go as far the law allows. In the case of Glen who was crippled from the waist down for 27 years, his attacker only served four years in prison. Is that justice?

    How could real justice happen for Glen?

    How could the victim of a peodeophile ever have true justice? I know victims who are still traumatised forty years later.

    I don't believe we can ever have true justice here on Earth. Only Allah can restore our lives in a greater good life after death.

    In the spirit of praying for justice for all people.
    Eric
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  22. #18
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    Re: Mental health

    I listened to Glen tell his story in Manchester Cathedral. He had grown up with David Beckham, and they had both been signed up to play football with Leighton Orient. He had a life of fame and fortune ahead of him. Shortly after he went to a night club and was stabbed in the back and beaten up. He spent a year in hospital and has been paralysed from the waist down; he has been in a wheelchair for the last 27 years. They caught the man who did this, he served four years in prison, he was then able to walk out of prison on his own two feet, and justice had been served.

    By this time, Glen had learned to drive a disabled taxi, he tracked down his assailant, and then stalked him with the intention of running him over. Glen saw an opportunity to run his attacker down, but something stopped him. He said he came to understand that true justice could not happen. Justice is not that two people should be crippled, rather, it is that neither of them should be crippled. He knew he could never turn back time. He came to understand that he had to let go of his hatred; if not, he would become worse than his assailant.

    He said he has to live with two diseases, being crippled, and the greater disease was the hate burning away inside him. Forgiveness and letting go of the hatred was a gradual process for his own benefit, his wheelchair has been a daily reminder of the past injustice.

    Glen goes round the country talking about the need to let go of anger, and striving to be the kind and caring person that you want to be. After we heard his story we were asked to say a blessing and we were to keep in mind all the people that we love and cared for. Then we were asked to say the same blessing for all those who had hurt us.
    MashaAllah. I've heard of stories like this. There was actually a ted talk I watched once. It was about an insecure shy girl (i think around 20 probably) who went to a party. And she felt really good because this popular girl was hanging out with her. Eventually this popular girl drove the girl "home". Well she ended up taking her to some place dangerous and the girl ended up being sex trafficked over and over again. It was a really scary story and she had gotten depressed. Eventually she made it out but she started sleeping around and doing drugs (i think she did drugs) because she was so depressed.

    But then she finally decided to challenge herself and show that she was the stronger one. Forgiveness was the route she took, and she became a different person. And thats how she ended up there, on stage, confidently spreading awareness about forgiveness, but also her sex trafficking story.


    Honestly, I don't know how people can do it. I have never been able to forgive and feel at peace. The worst I could do is forget. I feel that it requires some kind of mental strength or realization. I haven't been sex trafficked, nor have I been stabbed.. But even with the more minor ways people have hurt me, the only reason why I've tried "forgiving" is for the sake of Allah since there is a better reward. I just say I forgive, but I don't even know if I actually mean it because I will still be irritated at my past oppressors and the situations, not relieved.

    The victim has been punished in so many ways, if he has felt anger for twenty years, the peodeophile has controlled his mind for twenty years. He cannot be the kind and caring person he wants to be. Anger has to go somewhere, so the cat suffers, the cat is also an innocent victim. If he finds it difficult to turn his anger against other people, then he will turn it against himself in the form of self harm or suicidal thoughts and attempts.

    The only way to overcome these thoughts is forgiveness. Not because the other person deserves to be forgiven, but mainly to find peace for himself.
    Yeah that is very true.. But the thing is, I think his case is a lot more confusing then it seems. You're aware of ASPD right? He's answered many of my questions that I've had for him..

    He really can't feel anything at all. Even with anger, he doesn't feel much unlike some other sociopaths (generally they are able to feel anger). When he brings up his past to talk about it, he wouldn't think much about it. It doesn't feel uncomfortable, sad, nor does he feel angry. He's can't feel happiness or love. He only sees love as something useful and right now he's trying to make an effort on learning about love (but only on a logical level rather than emotional). He said his cat has taught him the value of it.

    This sounds rather cruel to say, but he really is like a robot whose trying to understand what emotion is.

    But along with that he's dealing with OCD. I think you might've seen many Muslims on here talking about OCD. Throughout the day, he will constantly face intrusive thoughts.. He can't stop thinking about hurting others. He doesn't like feeling out of control with these thoughts. In his case, its honestly a lot harder to hold back on hurting others since he cannot empathize or feel bad for hurting others. But he still chooses not to.

    Bless the cat as well honestly. She still shows him and teaches him what love is even when he breaks out and hurts her.

    In addition he now has psychosis and has to deal with manic episodes. He hallucinates and hears crazy things all the time. He has depression but his depression is the inability to feel anything


    I used to assume people with ASPD were evil until I realized that their minds work differently.. Many of them could genuinely be trying to change. I couldn't imagine not being able to understand most emotion like empathy, happiness, love, care. The closest they can get to is understanding it on a logical level. This is why most of them manipulate without even realizing, because most of them only view life as using others to benefit. They cannot connect with other people. They effortlessly fake their personality in front of others just to not seem off(or some do it for some kind of gain) ..But I met this man and finally understood that they aren't all bad people. He is still doing wrong things and manipulating others. But he is trying to change without the ability to empathize. That is an extremely hard thing to do. I think in his position, I wouldn't even care to change especially if I were atheist (he is an atheist so he doesn't have the reward of heaven or fear of hell fire consequences motivating him.)

    The worst part is that ASPD can't be cured and it'll be there forever. The best thing they can do is just understand that it is wrong to hurt others.

    Many people don't understand how it is like to be them because most of us were blessed with the empathy + emotions like normal humans have. Many people assume that they're all evil because they don't have the ability we were blessed with. But I've finally realized that some of them are trying to work with what they have, and make at least some change
    Last edited by Islami.Mu'mina; 12-26-2020 at 05:55 PM.
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    Re: Mental health

    If someone is genuinely trying to change and repent. Then I agree, Allah is most forgiving. But that person needs to fix what he broke if he harmed someone
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    Re: I don't know how to get better

    on top of that it is unpredictable (random mood swings)
    Yes haha this one is crazy at times

    To that I say Bi idnillah... However I don't see the good from it (apart from she is kind of out of our lives) but that I see a lot more of bad in it because of all the stuff that happened
    Sometimes we will not see all the good in this dunya, with patience, it'll come in the hereafter and you will be compensated inshaAllah may Allah reward you for it!

    For me mental illnesses is scary, it has unknowns, I mean no one can get inside someones head, behaviours are unpredictable and while it may seems like theories and unusual traits and behaviours are being anticipated, I personally found it hard to accept these proven without seeing any tangible evidence taken from humans. Most of it is done on observation, some of it derived from analysis of alpha waves, sleep patterns, seratonin and dopamine levels in the body, I studied some but it just wasn't for me.

    After the experience with the ex, I try even harder to make observations on people to summarise and judge a character. I suppose detecting any underlying mental health issues have a better chance of being apparent/detected when you actually spend time with them or live with them. Hope I don't get married to someone like the ex again eh... Insh Allah.
    Yeah it is true, sometimes it can be hidden well from people as well. They may look fine from the outside but they could be hiding something much bigger and you can only tell these things after being with them to see them in their lows.

    Reading your posts has made me a bit more paranoid because it goes into so much detail and it is sad that there are people out there suffering. I have a nephew who is diagnosed with autism, it was only after he had been diagnosed with this that I stopped repeatedly asking myself to why my nephew would behave and respond to me in a particular way. After that I researched autism so I can understand him better.

    Still better to try and remain optimistic eh?

    Pray Allah swt save us all from calamities and help maintain our own and everyone else's mental health.. Insh Allah
    Yeah exactly those with mental illness act differently and its something we need to research about and catch on so at least we can understand how they view things a little better.

    Whats really sad it that some people out there expect these types of people to behave the same as us when they don't have that ability. Not even just with autism, but as I metioned earlier, ASPD, even more.

    Because we as people have a failure to understand how it feels like to be them when we were given the greater mental capacity to understand!

    It's going to be hard on your nephew and his parents especially, inshaAllah things will not turn out bad.

    I have actually met someone my age with autism, he says pretty funny things often but it seems like he likes to get a laugh out of everyone. Unfortunately some people can be cruel to him because they think he's weird. I feel bad because many of the girls especially would be very rude to him when he tried talking to them, most of them thought he was weird and ignored which made him feel lonely. Often he'd come to me when he had no one to talk to sometimes

    I suppose detecting any underlying mental health issues have a better chance of being apparent/detected when you actually spend time with them or live with them. Hope I don't get married to someone like the ex again eh... Insh Allah.
    InshaAllah, and yeah I agree with that as well. Honestly though, if you find the right Muslim as I've mentioned in your earlier posts with the right mentality, you won't have to worry about this. Even if this Muslim has a serious mental illness, they will do their best to cope with it for the sake of Allah. And they will try not to hurt you if they have some serious issue whether its a serious anger issue or some bad mental illness.

    There are people out there who don't care to change and those who do care to change. I think seeing someone who has inabilities (such as mentally ill ppl aas I was talking abt) trying to change and be a good person is much more inspiring.

    I had my specific interest in ASPD because of the fact that these people cannot feel the emotions that we were blessed with. Because the truth is, our emotions (empathy in specific) is a major drive that allows us to treat others kindly

    Still better to try and remain optimistic eh?
    Yeah inshaAllah
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