The admins/moderators of this forum should have the ability to detect and counter trolling. And what do I mean when I say trolling you might ask? Well, this is a list of some of the key attributes of what I'm referring to as a troll:
He/She is a provocateur and display obvious characteristics of dishonesty, lack of understanding and a lack of ability to learn and better himself/herself. Basically wasting everyones time. Because think about it, what reason is there to talk to an Internet user in the first place, isn't it to hopefully help a real person? This is why unless we have the science to truly understand the person behind that Profile Name we are shooting in the dark when replying to people.
This person is lying about who he or she is. This could be the person's gender (could eventually get access to the sister or brother sections without "qualifications" if kept ignored for too long). This could be the person's religion. I've seen many trolls of this type lately, more than when I first joined this forum. They sometimes display obvious kufr and lack of understanding of basic rulings of Islam. When they engage in a discussion they usually come from a narrative of a kafir, it's not hard to see when they expose themselves. This does, however, not apply to a person that creates an account for one question and explicitly state that he/she doesn't want to be identified.
They usually have disposable accounts. You will never see a user with a 100< post count acting blatantly stupid and consequently provoking users into answering his/hers ridiculous questions and statements. Of course the troll will not be satisfied with any answer, because he or she is nothing more than a provocateur. For argument's sake, lets say that a user with a large amount of posts is a troll. This person would value his/her account enough to not make bad moves that would jeopardize his/her credibility. Such a move would be asking a stupid question and keep provoking people for a long period of time into engaging in a discussion that will lead to nowhere.
They have in many cases a bad character. They can be rude or disrespectful. They, as I explained earlier, probably have disposable accounts, i.e. post counts of around 5. The combination of rudeness and a low post count is not a good indicator.
As moderators you should, in my opinion, start to identify trolling and counter it. And as a community we should answer people's questions, how stupid they may be. But if it goes too far and the questioner contradicts him-/herself too severely and in multiple times display those characteristics that I've described above, then we should report him/her. And the moderators should take such reports seriously and investigate the matter and make fair judgments.
A final notes: I'm in no way interested in seeing real users getting shoo'd off from the forum. I'd rather see a troll stay than seeing a real user getting mistreated or worse, banned. This thread is made only to enlighten the community about the issue of trolls. And I'm using this term because it's so vaguely defined on the Internet that I can easily fit all the points above in it, so it's very efficient. I know that the rules of this forum are very well defined and cover most of the issue of trolling. We should be proactive, creative and smart. Not just punish people that do stuff like swearing (I know you do more than punish people that swear, but for the sake of the argument). The thing is: There are some trolls out there that call themselves muslims, make kufr multiple times, have a low post count and are rude. This is what encouraged me to make this thread, to make sure that these points that I brought up are focused on by moderators.
We need to make sure that trolls have to do more than start a new account and say stuff like: "I muslim, I support gay, I do gay, whay Islam no accept gay?" and have honest muslims give them elaborate and lengthy replies.
I would love to hear your thoughts on this, especially from admins and moderators.
Last edited by Snel; 08-13-2015 at 09:41 PM.
Reason: Typos.
assalamu'alaikum, i hear ya bro, sincere, truthful, and "straight" to the point.
you appear to be saying something that i believe most people feel when we read certain posts but give the benefit of doubt or sometimes don't like to be the one to accuse someone of falsehood in case we're wrong.
it gets rampant sometimes and i've noticed old timers take a long break.
best to start using the neg rep feature in order to warn the trolls and alert the mods than shift the burden totally onto them though.
I'm sure the moderators know of these, "trolls." That's a reason why a lot of threads needs approval before it is shown to the public. The mods are doing a good job at blocking the unnecessary material.
However, remember that this is the Internet. Anyone can use it. If it were face-to-face communication, some people won't have the guts to say such things or ask such questions.
My only advise for moderators would be to close threads when questions have been answered. For example, Inshallah the mods close this recently created thread: http://www.islamicboard.com/advice-a...uslim-boy.html
As forum users, REPORT each thread that we feel don't belong or goes against the rules. If we see a question pop-up, refer them to another thread which is similar or exactly the same in nature. For example, if someone asks if marijuana is haram, we should refer them to: http://www.islamicboard.com/advice-and-support/134314709-marijuana.html?highlight=marijuana http://www.islamicboard.com/health-a...ight=marijuana before we answer it.
assalamu'alaikum, i hear ya bro, sincere, truthful, and "straight" to the point.
you appear to be saying something that i believe most people feel when we read certain posts but give the benefit of doubt or sometimes don't like to be the one to accuse someone of falsehood in case we're wrong.
it gets rampant sometimes and i've noticed old timers take a long break.
best to start using the neg rep feature in order to warn the trolls and alert the mods than shift the burden totally onto them though.
I wouldn't like to accuse anybody wrongly, especially when it comes to something like kufr. But we need to take into account that some things in Islam are known by necessity. Some things that these people say, that call themselves muslims, are unbelievable. These words can't come from a muslim. Sure, maybe the person sincerely thinks he is a muslim but has really fallen into kufr and needs guidance. So the question is how do we know if he is sincere. We know at that point that he is not a muslim, but we still need to question his sincerity. If we think the person is not sincere, then we report him and include in the report why we think he's a troll.
To sum it up: How to do an educated guess if a user really is a muslim or not:
See if the person openly displays kufr beliefs. This will require some Islamic knowledge of course. If he does have kufr beliefs, go to step 2.
Is he credible (honest, doesn't contradict him-/herself)? If you find too many flaws for this person to feel credible, and you're confident about taking further actions against him/her, then go to step 3.
Report this person, and include in your report why you think this person is not a muslim and is not credible, to make the work of the moderators easier.
Btw, if he doesn't pass step 2, i.e. is a legit user, then the question is whether he gets to keep his "Islam"-tag on his profile or not. In my opinion, if he doesn't repent and insist on doing whatever he's doing even after he has been given proof about him being misguided, then he shouldn't get to keep it imo. His religious status should at least be unspecified. That's my suggestion.
Last edited by Snel; 08-13-2015 at 09:56 PM.
Reason: Typos.
I'm sure the moderators know of these, "trolls." That's a reason why a lot of threads needs approval before it is shown to the public. The mods are doing a good job at blocking the unnecessary material.
However, remember that this is the Internet. Anyone can use it. If it were face-to-face communication, some people won't have the guts to say such things or ask such questions.
My only advise for moderators would be to close threads when questions have been answered. For example, Inshallah the mods close this recently created thread: http://www.islamicboard.com/advice-a...uslim-boy.html
As forum users, REPORT each thread that we feel don't belong or goes against the rules. If we see a question pop-up, refer them to another thread which is similar or exactly the same in nature. For example, if someone asks if marijuana is haram, we should refer them to: http://www.islamicboard.com/advice-and-support/134314709-marijuana.html?highlight=marijuana http://www.islamicboard.com/health-a...ight=marijuana before we answer it.
Some people just want us to validate their wrong.
That's a very good suggestion. I think that is the best way to avoid problems/warnings/bans, as you said, to give them a good answer and close the thread once the proof has been established (If it's a question about Islam).
I personally don't like to complicate things, I'd rather choose an easy solution that works for everybody. But at the same time, it's good to know about the trolls. And I do indeed acknowledge that the mods are doing a very good job. I'm just making everyone aware of this because I saw a few trolls running around here lately, I don't want this to escalate into a trend where kuffar get to come and troll here as much as they like.
I do also like your suggestion because it's far quicker than trying to find out who they are through discussions. I like it also because it gives the trolls less of what they want, which is our attention. It's not fun for them having their threads closed down and being referred to answers to their questions. Because, as I said earlier, they're not really looking for the answers.
Interesting reflection. The mods and admins usually spot a troll very early on but our default practice has always been to show tolerance for as long as appropriate. Although this practice will vary from person to person we give everyone a chance to contribute appropriately before eventually banning persistently offensive behaviour.
However do you guys and girls contact the mods? Do you report such posts or users?
And verily for everything that a slave loses there is a substitute, but the one who loses Allah will never find anything to replace Him.” [Related by Ibn al-Qayyim in ad-Dâ' wad-Dawâ Fasl 49]
Interesting reflection. The mods and admins usually spot a troll very early on but our default practice has always been to show tolerance for as long as appropriate. Although this practice will vary from person to person we give everyone a chance to contribute appropriately before eventually banning persistently offensive behaviour.
However do you guys and girls contact the mods? Do you report such posts or users?
I've personally reported a thread recently, but there is another one that I have in mind, which is the one that Iceee mentioned. But I think you're aware of it, since you've also replied to it.
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