My concerns about the reaction of many Muslims worldwide is that it seems unrelated to what I believe were the problems Muslims had with the west in general.
My understanding was that our meddling in ME countries and our support of Israel was the root of problem. And that by withdrawing from these endeavors we could hope for a peaceful relationship with the Muslim world.
That made sense to me. I could accept that because I know I wouldn't want some foreigners coming to my country and meddling in our affairs. I can relate to that 100%.
But this issue is quite different. This seems as if Muslims not only want to restrict speech within the muslim world, but they want to restrict it for everyone all over the world or else.
I can't accept this. I was strongly against the war, and I'm against our sworn alliance with Israel. I can understand why so many would be upset over these things to the extent that they are.
So it appears that you not only want to get us to leave you alone, you want to tell us how to live. And in doing so, restrict our freedoms.
I can honestly tell you that this won't go over well in the west. Some people here will fight for money, some for power, and some for revenge. But if there is anything that we will all unite together and fight for, it's our freedoms.
So I have to ask, is it the general sentiment in the Muslim world that we should not have free speech.
My concerns about the reaction of many Muslims worldwide is that it seems unrelated to what I believe were the problems Muslims had with the west in general.
My understanding was that our meddling in ME countries and our support of Israel was the root of problem. And that by withdrawing from these endeavors we could hope for a peaceful relationship with the Muslim world.
That made sense to me. I could accept that because I know I wouldn't want some foreigners coming to my country and meddling in our affairs. I can relate to that 100%.
But this issue is quite different. This seems as if Muslims not only want to restrict speech within the muslim world, but they want to restrict it for everyone all over the world or else.
I can't accept this. I was strongly against the war, and I'm against our sworn alliance with Israel. I can understand why so many would be upset over these things to the extent that they are.
So it appears that you not only want to get us to leave you alone, you want to tell us how to live. And in doing so, restrict our freedoms.
I can honestly tell you that this won't go over well in the west. Some people here will fight for money, some for power, and some for revenge. But if there is anything that we will all unite together and fight for, it's our freedoms.
So I have to ask, is it the general sentiment in the Muslim world that we should not have free speech.
Salaam
Muslims believe in freedom of speech, as a british citizen I respect the cultures of this country and the people, but what I wont tolerate is people insulting, so the answer is we believe in freedom of speech as long as it's not insulting us.
Common sense tell us what freedom of speech is and what it isn't. We don't necessarily have to abide by the Quran or fatwa just to make sure that we aren't insulting anyone. There are boundaries to freedom of speech. No one can just go to a nun and tell her that she is being oppressed by wearing her hair covering. Common sense tells us how to approach someone even if we are enabled to use freedom of speech. The prime typical example-the cartoons. Muslims worldwide are protesting everywhere. Is this not freedom of speech? If we were secluded from freedom of speech we wouldn't have defended ourselves if the danish newspapers have published those cartoons. Yes, it made us enraged all over the world. I can certainly say at the point we didn't care if we can have freedom of speech or not. It was our Prophet they had ridiculed. The first thing that jumped in our minds was defense. We were offended by those cartoons, now we defend.
Do your charity in the name of Da'wah and help us out
I believe in free speech. But I will not insult other religions because it hasn't any sense. I'm agains any censorship but I don't want to insult anyone.
There should be laws put in place, and yes I think if someone says something insulting to a perticular religion, then the law should deal with them.
This is quite disturbing.
Having your own cultures guidelines to live by is one thing. But what you are saying is that you require everyone else to live by it.
I applaud peaceful protests and boycots. Those are the proper chanels to respond in. And I especially like the respons in Iran to solicit people to make Jewish cartoons. That's how it works. Tit for tat.
But to think that you have the right to hurt or lock someone up becaues they merely offended you with words is something that will never work in the western culture. Such an attack on our dearly held freedoms will unite the west in a way that hasn't been seen since WWII.
With every freedom come responsibilities. I think the debate in western country today about this fact is a good thing. Mass media has gone far beyond any given limits many times not only in this issue.
I do also believe that western countries are very found of the freedom to speech; they have fought for it a long time. To be able to say and express their thoughts. And as I see it is nothing wrong with this freedom as long as you use it with responsibility coming with this freedom.
I think if the Muslim world had gone out united in peace and demonstrated they soon had found sympathy around western countries for their sake among people in general. But the violence has made it very difficult. Because if you go out in sympathy against the lack of responsibility you at the same time would have to stand up for the violence coming from the demonstrations. That is the real shame about this issue.
But this issue is quite different. This seems as if Muslims not only want to restrict speech within the muslim world, but they want to restrict it for everyone all over the world or else.
Muslims don't want to restrict anyone. We protest against the blatant attack on a religious minority in europe because we believe that freedom of speech should be excericsed responsible and without inciting hatred towards others. All freedoms in the west are already restricted by law, by what is considered 'reasonable limits'.
Regards
The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "Surely I was sent to perfect the qualities of righteous character" [Musnad Ahmad, Muwatta Mâlik]
First of all muslims are not those who kill, torture, oppress and steal from ther people in the world. The west is the mother of all crimes against muslims in the muslim world in particular. The west oppress our people, steal our ressources and occupy our lands. The west has done these crimes ever since they destroyed the islamic state of muslims. They occupied the islamic land of Palestine, the heart of muslims and they rape , kill, torture, oppress and even insult our great prophet (sallallahu alayhi wa salam) in the name of freedom of speech. This is something we never can accept, call it a freedom you love or worship we will destroy it oh disbelievers. Your freedoms are only corrupt and it only brings you to misery. Now you are doomed to destroy as you insult the best man in the world. Muhammed sallallahu alayhi wa salam. Muslims never occupy, terrorize or insult you in any matter. Muslims are those who are in fight all the time as they are attacked by your foolish weapons, political and military terrorism and oppression. Muslims suffer from the oppressions your corrupt goverments and leaders of the west make in the middle east and all over the muslim world. Oh disbelievers, now your time has come, either you choose to debate in a mature way instead of insulting our holy things in Islam.
Therefor I call to all western countries to be mature and intellectual, yes we accept you debate and critizise islam and muslims but we dont accept that you insult and attack us.
Be an adult and responsible to your acts. Do not hoild fast on some joke freedoms that not even children cant mention since its fake anyway.
Caliphate,
I think its a little inappropriate to generalize in the way you did about the west and its freedoms; and Muslims do not intend to destroy anything either.
Nevertheless, I agree with your comment on being mature, especially in excericisng freedom of speech.
The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "Surely I was sent to perfect the qualities of righteous character" [Musnad Ahmad, Muwatta Mâlik]
This is something we never can accept, call it a freedom you love or worship we will destroy it oh disbelievers. Your freedoms are only corrupt and it only brings you to misery. Now you are doomed to destroy as you insult the best man in the world.
In partial answer to the question in the title of this thread, here's one Muslim who wants freedom of speech destroyed!
Muslims never occupy, terrorize or insult you in any matter.
You're right about occupation. I'm confused about the terrorism part. I think your whole post is an insult really, isn't it? Combined with aspects of a threat?
Oh disbelievers, now your time has come, either you choose to debate in a mature way instead of insulting our holy things in Islam.
Or....?
Therefor I call to all western countries to be mature and intellectual, yes we accept you debate and critizise islam and muslims but we dont accept that you insult and attack us.
Good. I quite agree.
There's no reason why we shouldn't all be able to live together on this planet in:
Your freedoms are only corrupt and it only brings you to misery. Now you are doomed to destroy as you insult the best man in the world. Muhammed sallallahu alayhi wa salam. Muslims never occupy, terrorize or insult you in any matter.
And yet you just did. My freedoms are dear to me, as dear as your prophet is to you. Note, however, that I do not feel you must now die for insulting me.
format_quote Originally Posted by Caliphate
Oh disbelievers, now your time has come, either you choose to debate in a mature way instead of insulting our holy things in Islam.
This is what you call mature debate? Interesting.
format_quote Originally Posted by Caliphate
Therefor I call to all western countries to be mature and intellectual, yes we accept you debate and critizise islam and muslims but we dont accept that you insult and attack us.
The attitude of some Muslims is sometimes quite perplexing to us western infidels. We sometimes have no idea why you react the way you do. Most of us find something as small and insignificant as a cartoon to be fairly innocuous. We find it surprising that it engenders so much anger. Riots and embassy burnings seem to me, and to others like me, to be a disproportionate response. What I am trying to say is that I have no idea what will send some Muslims into a muderous rage. How am I to know beforehand? If a cartoon is justification for embassy burning (an act of war, by the way), maybe I've already said something that warrants my death.
format_quote Originally Posted by Caliphate
Be an adult and responsible to your acts. Do not hoild fast on some joke freedoms that not even children cant mention since its fake anyway.
Ma'salaama
I'd like for you to understand that it appears to be child-like to respond violently to percieved injustices or insults. If you tell a child something he doesn't want to hear, he will often become uncontrollably violent. But as the child matures, he becomes better at self-restraint, and learns to deal with criticims in ways other than temper tantrums. That is how rioting Muslims appear to many western observers. Grown adults behaving like children, in violent temper tantrums.
There Is Only One God, And There Is Proof....you Can Say What You Want, But Your Toungue Will Testify Against You..allah(swt) Knows Everything In The Heavens And Earth And In Between...we As A Religion , Not Race, Donot Portray Any Prophet Or Say Anything Wrong About Them, It Is Wrong, But Then Again Look Whos Telling Us Its Ok, People Who Think Nudity, Drinking, Gambling, Sex, Murdering, Raping, Killing And More, Is Ok!! We Disagree With These People Becuase This Is The Right Way
If this were true, there's be a lot less disagreement about the nature of God. In reality, there is no proof. That's why you have 'faith'. Faith takes the place of proof.
format_quote Originally Posted by abdul Majid
....you Can Say What You Want, But Your Toungue Will Testify Against You..
If I said evereything I wanted to here, people would want to kill me. Literally.
format_quote Originally Posted by abdul Majid
allah(swt) Knows Everything In The Heavens And Earth And In Between...
And presumably you have proof for this also.
format_quote Originally Posted by abdul Majid
we As A Religion , Not Race, Donot Portray Any Prophet Or Say Anything Wrong About Them, It Is Wrong,
Why? Is your faith so fragile that it cannot withstand some mild criticism?
format_quote Originally Posted by abdul Majid
But Then Again Look Whos Telling Us Its Ok, People Who Think Nudity, Drinking, Gambling, Sex, Murdering, Raping, Killing And More, Is Ok!! We Disagree With These People Becuase This Is The Right Way
Nudity is ok, it is how God made us, right? Why is it so wrong if it is natural?
Gambling doesn't turn my crank personally, but who am I to judge how some idiot chooses to throw their money away?
Sex is, again, a perfectly natural part of being human. To deny your sexuality is to deny a large part of your humanity. Why would God make such a fundamental aspect of our nature wrong?
Murdering? Here's a little litmus test I like to use. If an action infringes on someone else's person or property, it is probably not a wise thing to do. Murder definately falls under that category. Mass murder is particularly appauling. Think London and Madrid bombings.
Rape? See above.
Killing? See above. Killing anyone, for any reason, at any time, is wrong, in my book. Some Muslims seem to disagree. I wouldn't want to be Salman Rushdie. Or one of his translators.
I Not Gonna Have A Debate With You Fred, But If You Think Nudity And Sex Are Ok Openly..then Let Your Kids Watch You Do It....you See...
Now About God... Lemme Ask You Something Did You Create Your Self, Or Do You Beleive In The Biggg Bbbaaannngggg.....then Poof Everything Came In To Play Tell Me Fred..
Please - we are not having a discussion about the existence of God in this thread. There are already discussions on that topic in the comparative religion section.
Nudity is ok, it is how God made us, right? Why is it so wrong if it is natural?
I hope you are aware that in most western countries it is a criminal offence to appear nude in public. Freedom of expression has reasonable limits in all societies.
Why? Is your faith so fragile that it cannot withstand some mild criticism?
The offence that such caricatures cause has nothing to do with criticising the religion. I welcome criticism and intellectual debate. This, however, is about insulting and inciting hatred towards a visible minority - something that is unacceptable.
Regards
The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "Surely I was sent to perfect the qualities of righteous character" [Musnad Ahmad, Muwatta Mâlik]
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