disowned because of career choice :(

[MooRocks75]

I am about to be disowned for my career choice. either that or being severely beaten/killed. I hope it wont go that far. But please be patient and read. I am very muslim. I pray every single day, and never miss prayer. I read the Quran with the family, and on my own. I have given Alms, and donated to mosques. I have helped two people convert. But all of this gets thrown out the window because of what I want to do.

I was born here in the United States, by Egyptian parents. I am an Arab(Egyptian)-American. Ive lived in Egypt for my KG and Elementry schooling. I am at the end of my senior year. I have decided I want to enlist in the United States Army to be a Medic/Health Care Specialist. Ive introduced them to fellow brothers in the military, and they are nice to them, but, me. I KNOW I want to be in the Military. I think its haram how they can judge me in such a harsh way considering how I live my deen.

Is this fair what they want to do to me?

 

[AntiKarateKid]

It depends on which military you join. Its great to do what you want BUT the Quran also emphasizes loyalty to God over loyalty to country. The US and British armies are striking against Muslims and are the protectors of the Pariah state of Israel which make all Muslims look evil. How can you say that you are a Muslim but fight for the wrong cause? If you want to see action join a Muslim countries army or do work at the ER in a Hospital or a dangerous neighborhood.

This is the reason your parents are so alarmed. You are helping men that are likely to go to Iraq and kill Muslims. You decide what is more important, your CURRENT desires in this world or your religion.

 

[MooRocks75]

http://www.defendamerica.mil/profiles/jan2004/pr011404a.html

http://www.stripes.com/article.asp?section=104&article=56332&archive=true

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/08/07/nyregion/07marines.html?_r=3&pagewanted=1&oref=slogin

But I know muslims in the US military who did not kill anyone, yet still ae muslims and serve. There are even Imams in the military. But from what you are saying right now, is that based on what I want to do, you as a human will throw away all of my good merits, based on one action, is this correct? That I cant be a muslim AND a soldier?

 

[wilberhum]

It depends on which military you join. Its great to do what you want BUT the Quran also emphasizes loyalty to God over loyalty to country. The US and British armies are striking against Muslims and are the protectors of the Pariah state of Israel which make all Muslims look evil. How can you say that you are a Muslim but fight for the wrong cause?
So if he helped the US get the "Insurgents" that put and detonated the bombs on the 2 handicapped females the other day, that would be banned by the Quran because it helped the US and was fighting against Muslims?
If you want to see action join a Muslim countries army or do work at the ER in a Hospital or a dangerous neighborhood.
da, he needs training to be a Medic/Health Care Specialist. Where/how is he to get this training? I seems you have the cart before the horse.
This is the reason your parents are so alarmed. You are helping men that are likely to go to Iraq and kill Muslims.
Ya, what if he killed an Al-Qaeda member or two. Boy wouldn't that be horrible.
You decide what is more important, your CURRENT desires in this world or your religion.
It seams he would be a credit to his religion. Well, I assume it isn't against Islam to provide health care.

MooRocks75,
What you want to do is honorable. It is what you want to do with your life.

My advise is to do it and do it the best you can.

Also, be aware the AntiKarateKid is a kid. He is probably only a year or two older than you.

 

[YusufNoor]

I am about to be disowned for my career choice. either that or being severely beaten/killed. I hope it wont go that far. But please be patient and read. I am very muslim. I pray every single day, and never miss prayer. I read the Quran with the family, and on my own. I have given Alms, and donated to mosques. I have helped two people convert. But all of this gets thrown out the window because of what I want to do.

I was born here in the United States, by Egyptian parents. I am an Arab(Egyptian)-American. Ive lived in Egypt for my KG and Elementry schooling. I am at the end of my senior year. I have decided I want to enlist in the United States Army to be a Medic/Health Care Specialist. Ive introduced them to fellow brothers in the military, and they are nice to them, but, me. I KNOW I want to be in the Military. I think its haram how they can judge me in such a harsh way considering how I live my deen.

Is this fair what they want to do to me?

They are your parents, and if they demand that you do something unIslamic you must not obey them; in other cases you are supposed to obey them. in this case you are probably better off obeying them as it avoids a major fitnah.

some of what AntiKarateKid says is true and some of what wilberhum is true, but neither of them is a parent of yours.

 

[MooRocks75]

As salaam alikum, cool there is conversing now. Well I have a question, I feel very strongly about this. Like if I dont do this I might be miserable for the rest of my life having not doing it. I dont like the Idea of another person picking what im going to do for the rest of my life, while I cant pick something knowing i will like it and do good.

 

[wilberhum]

They are your parents, and if they demand that you do something unIslamic you must not obey them; in other cases you are supposed to obey them. in this case you are probably better off obeying them as it avoids a major fitnah.

some of what AntiKarateKid says is true and some of what wilberhum is true, but neither of them is a parent of yours.

If "some of what wilberhum is true", please tell me what parts are not true. :hmm:

One should love, honor, and obey your parents.

But, your life is your life. You are old enough to make decisions for your own life. Your parents need to respect that too.

 

[جوري]

As salaam alikum, cool there is conversing now. Well I have a question, I feel very strongly about this. Like if I dont do this I might be miserable for the rest of my life having not doing it. I dont like the Idea of another person picking what im going to do for the rest of my life, while I cant pick something knowing i will like it and do good.

How will joining the millitary make you happy?
perhaps you can start with that to see if you have a realistic view of what it means to be a soldier, that which you couldn't attain being medic in civilian practice!

 

[wilberhum]

As salaam alikum, cool there is conversing now. Well I have a question, I feel very strongly about this. Like if I dont do this I might be miserable for the rest of my life having not doing it. I dont like the Idea of another person picking what im going to do for the rest of my life, while I cant pick something knowing i will like it and do good.

I think ignoring a "Life's Wish" would leave you miserable.

My advise is "Go for it".

IMHO if your parents disown you over this, I would question there love.

I am a father of 2 adult girls.
They have done things that have made me angry.
They have disobeyed me.
They have ignored some requests.
But, they have never "not loved" me and I have never "not loved" them.

Love based on any condition, is not love, it is control.

There is absolutely nothing my girls could do that would make me "not love" them and disowning them is beyond my ability to understand.

Well, any way, that's my advise.

Evaluate everyone's advise.

Then make your decision, go for it, and never look back.

 

[YusufNoor]

If "some of what wilberhum is true", please tell me what parts are not true. :hmm:

What you want to do is honorable

One should love, honor, and obey your parents.

But, your life is your life. You are old enough to make decisions for your own life. Your parents need to respect that too.

Peace be upon those who follow the guidance,

from a "patriotic" point of view, "defending your homeland" may seem like an honorable thing but i would never recommend to ANYONE that they join the US military! not even athiests, agnostics, Jews or Christians, let alone a Muslim!

the military here is commanded by politicians who seem not to care one whit about "patriotism" or even "defending your homeland." all they care about is attaining power and staying in power. i remeber the speech the starts the movie Patton where he says, "You don't win a war by dying for your country. You win a war by making the other poor dumb b-a-s-t-a-r-d die for his!"

imho, if you join the military here, then you are a "poor dumb b-a-s-t-a-r-d"; you don't die for your country, you die because of some stupid a$$ politician!ffended:

now imagine an a military machine commanded by either Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton, Mitt "the Morman Crusader" Romney, the "other Crusader" Huckabee or John "at least i like him, but i think he suffered a little too much in 'Nam" McCain. can you see any of them doing anything honarable?? not to dismiss Ron Paul, but i really don't know enough about him...

and all that is without mentioning George W Bush!:hmm:

 

[AntiKarateKid]

Wilber, I did not say that I am defending al Qaeda. Al Qaeda is an idea. You do not fight an idea by killing the misguided people who believe in it. You fight it through exposing their falsehood. You will kill men and women who have live in turmoil and are doing what they truly think is right in the face of US occupation. They need to be informed of the real Islam and not butchered because of American Interests there. I disagree with this talk about, "if you want to do it, then do it". Actions speak louder than words. You can say that you are a devoted Muslim but when you go out and kill Muslims who need guidance and not death, you are contradicting yourself. I say examine your desires again.

 

[snakelegs]

your parents are threatening you with bodily harm if you choose this career?
no, it is not fair at all.
i think you should be the one to choose, because it is your life, not theirs.
however, i can understand why they are upset. i would be upset too, if my child wanted to join the army. it would be different if the army was about defending the country and not about invading nations that are no military threat to us.
the fact that you are a good muslim, is in a separate compartment and really has nothing to do with this.
can your parents afford to help you get the training to become a medic/health care worker in the civilian sector? maybe a compromise could be worked out - where you would still be helping people/saving lives but not in the army.

 

[wilberhum]

Wilber, I did not say that I am defending al Qaeda. Al Qaeda is an idea.
Ideas don't kill you. People do!
You do not fight an idea by killing the misguided people who believe in it.
The only thing I care about is the fact they believe they have the right to kill me. Since they want death, I would prefer it be there's.
You fight it through exposing their falsehood. You will kill men and women who have live in turmoil and are doing what they truly think is right in the face of US occupation.
Surely there are those who think they are doing the right thing. Then there are the majority who want to kill anyone whom they consider there enemy. By the way, that is usually fellow Muslims.
They need to be informed of the real Islam and not butchered because of American Interests there.
What? Who is butchering the real Islam? That would be Muslims, right?
I disagree with this talk about, "if you want to do it, then do it".
Me thinks a little "Out of Context" and not exactly what I said.
Actions speak louder than words. You can say that you are a devoted Muslim
What? Can't read? Quick to assume? Don't know what an Agnostic is?
but when you go out and kill Muslims who need guidance and not death,
And how do you give guidance to people who strap mentally disabled women with bombs and blow them up?
you are contradicting yourself.
Well since you don't have a clue about me, and have proven so, you will need to explain that contradiction.
I say examine your desires again.
I desire the kid make moral life choices the help him have a good life.
What is your desire?

I will never understand this concept of, by it's absence, not giving a crap about the lives of non-Muslims.
Then think you have a higher moral ground by saying it is wrong to kill Muslims regardless of the evil they do. :-\

 

[YusufNoor]

originally posted by wilberhum
let alone a Muslim? Another who thinks Muslims are superior. How do you define bigot?

Peace be upon those who follow the guidance,

to wilber,

umm, maybe as one who jumps to conclusions based upon stereotype! of course in this instance meaning YOU!

i don't recommend that ANYONE join the service [nor did i before accepting Islam and as i said in my post], but there ARE special considerations for a Muslim[as there might be for a Quaker for instance]! and this being a Muslim forum with a Muslim asking for advice then by all means any special Muslim requirements should be taking into consideration.

and feel free to point out ANYWHERE where i have claimed Muslims to be superior! or remain ignorant in your own bigotry...

or you could just say oops, i'm sorry!

 

[Trumble]

It depends on which military you join

No it doesn't. Army medics save lives, not take them; lives of soldiers on their own side, soldiers on the enemy side, and civilians on either or neither side.

 

[wilberhum]

Peace be upon those who follow the guidance,

to wilber,

umm, maybe as one who jumps to conclusions based upon stereotype! of course in this instance meaning YOU!

i don't recommend that ANYONE join the service [nor did i before accepting Islam and as i said in my post], but there ARE special considerations for a Muslim[as there might be for a Quaker for instance]! and this being a Muslim forum with a Muslim asking for advice then by all means any special Muslim requirements should be taking into consideration.

and feel free to point out ANYWHERE where i have claimed Muslims to be superior! or remain ignorant in your own bigotry...

or you could just say oops, i'm sorry!

I think

from a "patriotic" point of view, "defending your homeland" may seem like an honorable thing but i would never recommend to ANYONE that they join the US military! not even athiests, agnostics, Jews or Christians, let alone a Muslim!

states you bigotry.

The only thing I'm sorry about is that I gave you a pos rep. :hiding:

 

[MustafaMc]

I personally agree with the advice to not oppose your parents. Joining the US Army in any capacity would be supporting the oppression of Muslims. There is nothing to say that the Army will not renege on the promise to make you a medic and instead make you a "foot soldier".

If you want to be in the medical field, then ask your parents to send you to college to study a medical field. My brother and his wife are both nurses.

 

[Malaikah]

What is comes down to is that you will be part of the forces who are unjustly attacking and killing Muslims. How can you ever justify that?

Shaykh: “This is not permissible unless the nation in whose army he is working is not fighting the Muslims.”

Source.

That statement is a confusing because of the two 'not's. It is saying that it is permissible to be a doctor in the non-Muslim army only if the army of that country is not fighting Muslim.

I KNOW I want to be in the Military. I think its haram how they can judge me in such a harsh way considering how I live my deen.

First of all, if you love your deen, then show it by not joining the army that is destroying those who follow your deen!

Secondly, it is none of our business if you love your deen or not, that is in your heart, but joining the army is an outer action, something everyone will see. Whether you like it or not, if is your actions that people are going to judge you on, not what is in your heart [because we don't knwo what is in your heart].

People aren't always judging you, they are judging the action you are doing. You want to do something that is disgusting to the minds of most Muslims and yet you want these Muslims to act like it isn't a big deal?

You really shouldn't be surprise that your parents might disown you. I imagine many, many Muslim parents would do the same.

you as a human will throw away all of my good merits, based on one action, is this correct?

It is a big action. Wouldn't you throw away the good merits of a person who committed murder? You might not be joining the army with the intention to kill, but you will be supporting those who do have hte intention to kill. And that is hardly any better.

That I cant be a muslim AND a soldier?

Maybe you can, but at the very least you will be committing a big sin. Whether what you intend to do is an act of kufr or not, I don't know.

 

[wilberhum]

I personally agree with the advice to not oppose your parents. Joining the US Army in any capacity would be supporting the oppression of Muslims. There is nothing to say that the Army will not renege on the promise to make you a medic and instead make you a "foot soldier".

If you want to be in the medical field, then ask your parents to send you to college to study a medical field. My brother and his wife are both nurses.

Who should fight those people who strap mentally disabled women with bombs and blow them up?

 

[YusufNoor]

Who should fight those people who strap mentally disabled women with bombs and blow them up?

Peace be upon those who follow the guidance,

the above is NOT what we are discussing, we were asked whether or not MooRocks75's parents were being fair and discussing their advice.

as far as:

I think
Quote:
from a "patriotic" point of view, "defending your homeland" may seem like an honorable thing but i would never recommend to ANYONE that they join the US military! not even atheists, agnostics, Jews or Christians, let alone a Muslim!

states you bigotry.

i asked:

and feel free to point out ANYWHERE where i have claimed Muslims to be superior! or remain ignorant in your own bigotry...

simply show me the words superior and Muslim in the same sentence, in fact show me the word superior in the post! YOU are doing the assuming here! we are giving the brother advice so that he NOT put himself in a position where he would have to kill innocent people! [again much like a Quaker]

and Malaikah makes another important distinction:

it is permissible to be a doctor in the non-Muslim army only if the army of that country is not fighting Muslim(s).

also, unlike Americans in general or other Religions, in Islam the Parents HAVE some rights on the children and children in MOST situations are REQUIRED to obey their parents.