EBook: Black Flags from the East - any basis?

[جوري]

What is that determining factor? Big question.

Why can't they all be members of one family in different regions for one sole purpose to coalesce at some point?? Also who is to say that they're the prophesied army?..
my understanding otherwise is that all the events will unravel like a string of pearls in the order of the army, the mahdi the dajjal then Isa the son of Mary.. but Allah swt knows best.. we certainly have to change ourselves so we can be the people worthy of victory.. A woman doesn't conceive and give birth in one day and the situation here is no different. Victory can't come upon fornicators, ignoramuses and drunkards.. we have to be folks worthy of the change!

and Allah swt knows best

 

[Scimitar]

Why can't they all be members of one family in different regions for one sole purpose to coalesce at some point?? Also who is to say that they're the prophesied army?..

They can't, because more than half of these supposed Taliban armies are run by war lords who use innocent people to fight their wars for them. CIA sponsored cells which operate under the guise of "freedom fighters" - this has been covered in WUP and other places on the net lots of times.

Pakistan, Afghanistan, Iraq, (and now) Yemen... total mess. No one knows which army is doing what?

The very fact that the hadeeth mentioning the black flags are weak - do not help us in any way also. Found this:

Question: Are the hadîth about an army coming from Khorasan with black flags and entering Jerusalem authentic?

Answered by Sheikh Salman al-Oadah

The hadîth about the army with black banners coming out of Khorasan has two chains of transmission, but both are weak and cannot be authenticated. If a Muslim believes in this hadîth, he believes in something false. Anyone who cares about his religion and belief should avoid heading towards falsehood.

The hadîth is related on the authority of Thawbân that the Prophet (peace be upon him) said: “If you see the black banners coming from the direction of Khurasân, then go to them, even if you have to crawl, because among them will be Allah’s Caliph the Mahdî.” [Related by al-Hâkim (8572) and Ahmad (22387)]

All the chains of transmission for this hadîth are weak and inauthentic, though some people have been overly lenient about it and declared it authentic by virtue of the many chains of transmission that it has.

Some people have used this hadîth to support their claim that the Mahdî is from the family of al-Abbâs and that the Mahdî is from of the Abbasid dynasty. There were Abbasid Caliphs who went by the name al-Mahdî.

The banners of the Abbasid State were black. It is not hard to see how this weak hadîth might have been fabricated or at least tampered with to support the Abbasid cause.


interesting, eh?

my understanding otherwise is that all the events will unravel like a string of pearls in the order of the army, the mahdi the dajjal then Isa the son of Mary.. but Allah swt knows best.. we certainly have to change ourselves so we can be the people worthy of victory.. A woman doesn't conceive and give birth in one day and the situation here is no different. Victory can't come upon fornicators, ignoramuses and drunkards.. we have to be folks worthy of the change!

and Allah swt knows best

Eschatology is hazy at the best of times... and "if's when's and maybe's - paint a picture hazy"

Let us keep our faith in Allah that HE will guide as as we are meant to be guided, Ameen.

 

[جوري]

They can't, because more than half of these supposed Taliban armies are run by war lords who use innocent people to fight their wars for them. CIA sponsored cells which operate under the guise of "freedom fighters" - this has been covered in WUP and other places on the net lots of times.

supposed is the operative word here.. everything we know of the taliban is hearsay and the book itself gives a different account.
and yes those ahadith are authentic-but like i said that army is meant to come on horses, and the last war will not be a modern style warfare which leads me personally to believe that there will be major destruction. either this or they're keeping primitive means to avoid 'big brother'
and yes I have read about the rafida type mahdi and the mahdis of days yore.. we know that he's an end of time real person nothing magical about him and even Isa PBUH will pray behind him.


Allah :swt: knows best,

 

[جوري]

 

[Scimitar]

like i said that army is meant to come on horses, and the last war will not be a modern style warfare which leads me personally to believe that there will be major destruction. either this or they're keeping primitive means to avoid 'big brother'

EMP will take care of that. And I do believe it to be a possibility that when the last ten major signs drop like the beads of pearls from a necklace, the frequency of the 10 signs (happening real fast) will also contribute a greater understanding of how that army will have to be on horses.

Let's say the sun disappears for 3 days, behind an otherworldly mass in space - the electromagnetic energy of which, nullifies all the electrics on earth? Much like the EMP tech we have today, and have had now for some time. The result will be astounding, the world will literally go dark - everywhere. All electrics: fried egg. No lights, streetlamps, torches, batteries not working etc etc etc... back to primitive type living, and for many in the west, this does not bode well.

Small wonder why we are taught in hadeeth to migrate to a mountain and take a few sheep and goats with us?

Allah knows best.

Scimi

 

[- Qatada -]

Small wonder why we are taught in hadeeth to migrate to a mountain and take a few sheep and goats with us?

Allah knows best.

Scimi

:salamext:

The hadith is that that will be the best life for the believer.

Looking at the big brother type of world we're living in now, and other things like that, it looks like that is the better life for the believer nowadays and will only be better in the times to come.

 

[AbuMuslimasf]

The Hadith
a) Marfu Hadith (Saying of Prophet peace be upon him)
Thawban (May Allah be pleased with him) narrated, "The Prophet(Sal Allah hu alayhe wasallam) said:
: ( يقتيل عند كنزكم ثلاثة كلهم ابن خليفة . ثم لا يصير إلى واحد منهم . ثم نطلع الرايات السود من قبل المشرق . فيقتلونكم قتلا لم يقتله قوم )
ثم ذكر شيئا لا أحفظه . فقال فإذا رأيتموه فبايعوه ولو حبوا على الثلج . فإنه خليفة الله المهدي
"Three men will be killed at the place where your treasure is. Each of them will be the son of a Khalifah, and none of them will get hold of the treasure. Then black banners will come out of the east...' If you see him, go and give him your allegiance, even if you have to crawl over ice, because he is the Khalifah of Allah, the Mahdi."[Ibn Majah no:4084]


b) Moquf Rout (saying of Companion)
Thawban said:
إذا رأيتم الرايات السود خرجت من قبل خراسان فأتوها ولو حبوا ، فإن فيها خليفة الله المهدي "
If you see the black flags coming from Khurasan then go there even if you have to crawl because there is the Khalifah of Allah, the Mahdi."[Mustadrak al Hakim hadeeth no: 8578, Behaqi in Dalail an-Nabuwwah 6/516].

Authentications
a) Imam al-Bazzar said after narrating،
وإسناده إسناد صحيح .
Chain is authentic.

b) Imam Hakim said after narrating:"
هذا حديث صحيح على شرط الشيخين
.This hadeeth is authentic on the criteria of Shaykhayn (Bukhari and Muslim)(end quote)
.
c) Ibn Katheer said
" وهذا إسناد قوي صحيح .This chain is powerful authentic
.
d) Qurtubee authenticated [Tadhkirah 1201]
.
e) Buseri authenticated [Misbah az-Zajjaj 3/263]
.
f) Sindee said
كذا إسناده صحيح رجاله ثقات ورواه الحاكم في المستدرك وقال : صحيح على شرط الشيخين .
Chain is authentic Narrators are trustworthy, narrated by al Hakim in Mustadrak and said Authentic on the criteria of Shaykhayn(Bukhari and Muslim)[Zawaid e Ibne Majah under this hadeeth]
.
g) Hamood at taweejari authenticated [Ittehaaf al Jamah bimaja fi al Fitan wal Malahum wa Sharaait as-Sa`ah 2/187]
.
h) Shaykh Zubair Ali Zai said the marfu rout is weak because of Sufiyan thawri who is mudallis and narrating from (an), but he said regarding the moquf rout
.
The chain of this rout is Hasan Lidhatihi and this is Marfu in hukam.[Al Hadith no: 80 page no: 6]

He also said "Authenticated by Buseri, and al-Hakim authenticated on the criteria of Shaykhayn (Bukhari and Muslim) 4/463,364 and 502. Ad-Dahabee agreed with him, Authenticated by Ibn Katheer[Notes of Ibn Majah hadeeth no: 4084]

These hadith are more authentic than everything else in this issue. There is only one person missing in the chain of transmission and generally you will not find a better chain of transmission. Those people who expect the Mahdi from Medina in KSA find the solution to declare them as weak which is nonesense. Those who declare them as fabricated are rejecting the prophet Mohammad saas.

And Ibn Abi Shaybah, Nu'aym ibn Hammad in al-Fitan, Ibn Majah and Abu Nu'aym narrated from Ibn Mas'ud [radhiyallahu 'anhu] that he said:

"Once we were with the Messenger of Allah [sallallahu 'alayhi wa-sallam], when a group of youths fromBanu Hashim approached. When the Prophet [sallallahu 'alayhi wa-sallam] saw them, his eyes filled with tears and his colour changed.

He [i.e. Ibn Mas'ud] said: "I said: "We see in your face something that worries us." So he said:

"We, the Ahl al-Bayt, are a people for whom Allah has chosen the hereafter over this world. And my household after me will face trials, banishment and pursuit, until a people from the east come with black banners, and they will ask for what is due, but not be given it. So they will fight and be victorious, and be given what they asked for. But they will not accept it from them until they hand it over to a man from my household, who will fill it [i.e. the earth] with equity, as they had filled it with tyranny. So whoever among you reaches that time, then let him go to them, even if he must crawl over ice, for he is the Mahdi."


This hadith came already true with the turks til to the Mahdi part. The turks were living in the east (khorasan)
and settled in anatolia and with the conquest of egypt they have took the trust (Uqab) and will hand over it tho the mahdi.



As for the book the talibans are not this promised army. Hadith about the balck banners do not state they will fight the americans about 11 years. They will be youth and fight only the sufyani in khorasan.

 

[جوري]

:jz: for that!

 

[Samiun]

I used to love this theories, but I got less interested when I was getting a bit paranoid. Still I'm hoping I won't be facing Dajjal in these times and even if I did I want to escape from him Inshallah. Also, I really hope that what Sh. Imran Hosein said about the events that occur in 21st of December will not happen(not the end of Humans, just some whistle blowing events).

 

[ba51th]

I can't wait to face dajjal. I really want to spit on his face, and he will chop my head, and my struggle from the oppressor will be finish...

 

[جوري]

It isn't a good thing to wish to meet with the enemy let alone Dajjal.. all we can ask is for Allah swt to make us steadfast and save us the tribulations.. incidentally today is a good day to recite suret Al kahf to be saved the tribulations of Dajjal

 

[Scimitar]

I remember my grandfathers look of amazement last week when I was in India, and after Jummah I asked him what surah he wanted to hear and he said al Kahf, then I asked him "recited by who?" and he said Sudais, so I immiediatly put it on for him on my laptop and he was like "You have this all recorded?" I didn't have the patience to begin to explain the internet to him, so I just said "yes, something like this".

Scimi

 

[islamica]

I read the book and there's a few things I would have to disagree with. I thought I share my thoughts on it inshallah since others may read this book and it would help in understanding with a broader spectivie.

The book talks about AQ a lot, giving them a lot of credit for just about everything. The book talks about how OBL was planning and was behind 9/11 and the zionists in US were aware of it and allowed it to happen as it would benefit them as well. When this did happen, OBl made a statement stating He was not the one behind it. That was his first and only statement on it. Why would he say that when he is not afraid to take responsibility for what he does. After that we saw many fake OBL video released by the US taking responsibility for it. I think the author is giving AQ and OBL credit where it's not due. There is ample evidence out there about US officials meetings with Taleban prior about running pipelines through Afghan from north and the clear threat made to have the pipelines in place by a certain date. Post 9/11 that was the first thing that was set in motion. If one has kept abreast of everything that had been going on prior to 9/11 up to today then only they would understand the bigger picture and the all players and their roles.


The next topic was of Pakistan TTP. The book asserts that they are part of AQ. While there may be a few that are in agreement with them, it is not true for others. There are so many groups claiming to be Pak Taleban and each one has their own agenda. There are local thugs and gangs being paied by outside forces to cause chaos impersonating at PT, there are inside poor and illiterate being manipulated and trained to do evil in the name of islam and being trained by CIA like Raymond Davis who got caught by Pak intelligence. And there are mercenaries like black water undercover engaged in terrorists activities (as illustrated in another thread) while pretending to be the Taleban.

The book also gives credit to AQ in the India bombay bombing, stating Pakistan - Lashkar e Tayba (LeT) - has been responsible for the Mumbai attacks in India, 2008. Which is not true either. India's own journalists covered evidence of false flag op by hindu extremists, the video of the shooter show clearly him wearing a orange wrist band, same one hindu extremists wear.

Lastly, Somali pirates are given credit as a hand of AQ who are hijacking ships for ransom for millions to further their cause. The fact of the matter is that western ships were illegally dumping radioactive materials and waste into somali waters. The fishing lively hood of the somalis was ruined as well as clean water for living. Also, they started to have defects in the kids. The somali pirates are engage in their activities to stop the western corporations from making their backyard a radioactive waste dumping ground.

A naive person may believe everything in this book, which makes AQ out to be a global giant with far reaching powers and hands. As much as it seems like a pro AQ one, it can also be seen as written by the west in which case it can easily justify why the west wants to invade every country. Different versions of AQ in every country, sleeper cells in the west and the east, new tech savy younger recruits, it all goes well with western interests as well. And yet the books claims AQ to be the army that will emerge and join mahdi. I don't believe any of that. I don't think it's them at all. It has some interesting stuff in it to read but I wouldn't take everything at face value.