erm.. fitrah?

[siFilam]

Re: The Australian face of Islam

In The Name of Allah, The Most Gracious, The Most Merciful

If there is a g-d he is not precise with his laws. Within each religion there are different interpretations.

Which can only mean there is no g-d.

there is a Allah and He is very precise with His Laws. There is only one true religion with Allah and thats Islam. Everything else is man made thus subject to change to fit their lifestyle as time changes.


-SI-

 

[Malaikah]

Re: The Australian face of Islam

If there is a g-d he is not precise with his laws. Within each religion there are different interpretations.

Which can only mean there is no g-d.

You seem to have a thing for these type of posts... what next? The grass is green therefore there is no God?

 

[Umar001]

Re: The Australian face of Islam

If you raise a baby in a Hindu culture, it will almost certainly embrace Hinduism; if in a Christian home, Christianity. All theistic beliefs are externally brought to human beings, none of them display inherent hardwiring. If you raise a child devoid of god concepts in the middle of a remote jungle, the child will not arbitrarily and spontaneously generate theism.

Exactly, you've just stated the concept to a certain extend, though you yourself then put forth a presumption, you claim, All theistic beliefs are externally brought to human beings, none of them display inherent hardwiring. what is interesting is that you only confined your statement to thiestic beliefs!! Whilst you have no proof for that confinement.

What amazes me is that you go on to say, If you raise a child devoid of god concepts in the middle of a remote jungle, the child will not arbitrarily and spontaneously generate theism. Bring for your evidence for that please. Because to me, that seems like you believe that because it’s part of your dogma, not because there is any demonstrable truth to your claim.

Regards Eesa,

According to the link you provided...we are to be forgiven for this unfortunate detour until we can speak for ourselves (around puberty it seems)..but then we are in big trouble.

Not really since you will not be judged until the message has been brought to you.

Well, we certainly don’t see primitive South American tribal cultures embracing any of the widely followed polytheistic or monotheistic religions. Neither does the Eskimo culture, American Indian, etc., etc. The list goes on.

I am talking about the fundamental practice of asserting a concept. Religion cannot support its assertions-- it relies on exemptions:

"It's spiritual, not part of the natural world"
"It's a mystery"
"It's blashpemy to ask"
"It's a sin"
"It's a test"
"Who are you to question gods will?"
"We?ll never know?"

Science relies on demonstration -- Conjecture, speculation, hypothesis, collection of data, experimentation, repeatability, falsifiability. From the former, we get dogmatic faith that is never corroborated regardless of the claims it makes, mundane or outlandish. From the latter, we get verified knowledge (a star is a million light years away because it's taken light a million years to get here, I could offer thousands more). If religion cannot pass that same standard, don't blame science.

I think you missunderstand the concept of faith, you see, all the answers you have listed are valid if through scientific reasoning ones to come to a source which withstands the test of truthfulness.

Allow me to explain, a person who examines religions and then through a scientific method arrives at the conclusion that there is a God, which is something that can happen, since scientist cannot prove or disprove with absolute certainity, then once this step is taken the person then finds Islam to the be religion sent by this God, all this while the man has undertook steps of experimentations, falsability and so forth. Then if through all this testing Islam as a religion is still firm then one is justified in accepting the tenents of Islam, so he has scientifically attested the truth of the source of Islam, and when he has done that then it is only logical that he follows it's teachings including some of the statements of above.

 

[جوري]

Re: The Australian face of Islam

If there is a g-d he is not precise with his laws. Within each religion there are different interpretations.

Which can only mean there is no g-d.

Really how so? perhaps you can elaborate on that a little-- in which way are G-D's laws not precise? Is robbing and murdering, and lying a virtue in one religion and a sin in another? that is news to me--perhaps you can lay off the Kibbles & Bits before you write... to avoid the usual simpleton conclusions that you so readily draw from each post.

Peace!

 

[snakelegs]

for whatever it's worth (probably not a whole lot), i'll share my take on fitrah. to atheists this probably won't make any more sense than the islamic view.
i do not find it offensive at all. i think it is referring to the fact that when we come into this world we are with god. as we develop we become more and more separated from god and further and further away and the spiritual quest is to overcome that separation and the distance. so it is referring to a certain natural state of grace, so to speak.
the muslim interpretation of this is that we all born muslims. i guess it's because of the way i interpret that interpretation that i am not offended by it, tho i see it differently,of course.

 

[Everybody]

:bump: Good thread :thumbs_up