[Gator]

Just saw this on Youtube. I went to the University of Florida in Gainesville and was surprised. I loved Gainesville as it has a very artistic and open feel, but go right outside a little and you start running up against the type of Southern ignorace you can find (let's call it Southern Baptist*), so there's a tension between the two.

The video is about a protest of a church that put up a sign. Thought it was interesting.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hx0FdnSPS9Q




*joke stolen from comedian David Cross.

 

[GuestFellow]

Meh I am not surprised. It is getting annoying and too repetitive.

 

[Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн]

Wow, people should be nice like that more...other than the sign of course.

 

[rpwelton]

Just goes to show how hard we have to work in spreading the message of Islam and correcting misconceptions.

Thanks to our Jewish brothers in humanity who stood up for us at the beginning of the clip.

 

[Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн]

^^ Yea that was awesome.

 

[glo]

I am shocked by the sign ... and encouraged by the response of people from all religions and none to speak out against it.



But perhaps we can use this as an opportunity to privately search our own hearts and attitudes towards other religions and to explore our own prejudices.

Do you, as Muslims, believe that other religions are 'from the devil'?
If you were told at masjid that Christians (or followers of other religions) have been deceived by Shaitaan, would you be shocked and protest? Or would you actually agree?

 

[glo]

Thanks to our Jewish brothers in humanity who stood up for us at the beginning of the clip.

That rabbi seems like a great guy!

But did you notice the sign he carried which said 'One God. Many paths'?
Do you agree with that message? That all paths lead to God and paradise? :?

 

[rpwelton]

That rabbi seems like a great guy!

But did you notice the sign he carried which said 'One God. Many paths'?
Do you agree with that message? That all paths lead to God and paradise? :?

Didn't notice the "many paths" part. In my belief, there is only one way to God, and that is Islam. Of course if you wish to choose another religion, that is your right; Islam can't be forced upon anyone.

As for the other religions of the world, as Muslims yes we believe that they have all in some way been deceived by Satan, because they have deviated from the truth. However, I would never say that "such and such religion is the devil, or the followers of a religion are from the devil (although I suppose Wiccans wouldn't object :statisfie)

There is a difference between calling a religion "the devil" and saying that its followers have been deceived by the devil. I do not believe a Christian is from the devil, nor a Jew, nor a Hindu, etc.

As Muslims we recognize that there is still bits of truth in many of the world's religions, and while we do not believe the followers can enter paradise without believing in Islam, we must treat all of them with respect and kindness.

Hope that's clear.

 

[glo]

As for the other religions of the world, as Muslims yes we believe that they have all in some way been deceived by Satan, because they have deviated from the truth. However, I would never say that "such and such religion is the devil, or the followers of a religion are from the devil (although I suppose Wiccans wouldn't object :statisfie)

I am sure that most Wiccans would disagree with you and assert that they neither follow nor worship Satan.

There is a difference between calling a religion "the devil" and saying that its followers have been deceived by the devil. I do not believe a Christian is from the devil, nor a Jew, nor a Hindu, etc.

I know what you mean, but the sign didn't say that Islam was the devil; it said that Islam was 'of the devil'.
Perhaps we are getting into semantics here, but to be 'of the devil' can easily mean 'to be influenced by the devil'.
Not so far from saying 'Religion X is not the truth, it has been distorted by Satan' ... and many of us might say or think just that about other faiths.

I am shocked by the sign, but I guess what I am trying to unpick is whether many of us actually do think similarly about followers of other religions - we just might not express it so strongly and openly ... :?

As Muslims we recognize that there is still bits of truth in many of the world's religions, and while we do not believe the followers can enter paradise without believing in Islam, we must treat all of them with respect and kindness.

I like that! :statisfie

Hope that's clear.

Crystal. Thank you for sharing.

 

[rpwelton]

I know what you mean, but the sign didn't say that Islam was the devil; it said that Islam was 'of the devil'.
Perhaps we are getting into semantics here, but to be 'of the devil' can easily mean 'to be influenced by the devil'.
Not so far from saying 'Religion X is not the truth, it has been distorted by Satan' ... and many of us might say or think just that about other faiths.

When you say something is "of the devil" then you are saying that thing wholly comes from the devil.

Basically to me that sign is saying that Islam is a religion that either worships the devil, is completely inspired by the devil, or is completely evil, or something similar of the sort.

If I am to say (which I do) that Christianity has in some ways deviated from the truth as a result of influence by Satan through the minds of men, I am not saying that Christianity is "of the devil".

Saying parts of a religion have been influenced by the whispers of Satan is a big step away from saying that religion is from Satan.

As I said before, most religions of the world still hold some truth to them (with Christianity and Judaism being the ones holding the most truth of any), so they cannot entirely be "from Satan". Rather to say something is from the devil is to say the whole religion was from the devil.

I just don't think it's a matter of semantics. Then again, maybe people have different perceptions as to what that sign means to them.

 

[Rabi'ya]

I have contacted the church which has posted this sign. I shall keep you informed if they reply.

Here is a copy of the email I sent them....I hope they do reply inshAllah.

Greetings,
I am sure you have received plenty of messages regarding the sign and whilst you(as the church) are entitled to your own opinion I would jst like a response to one question if you wouldn't mind. I don'd think it would take too much of your time to help a fellow sister in religion

Did Jesus ever say anything like this and are we following his example by making this statement?

I hope you can clear my mind

regards
Victoria

Let's see what they say.....

 

[Amadeus85]

Haven't the american protestants better things to do, than such questionable "shows".

 

[Zafran]

I am shocked by the sign ... and encouraged by the response of people from all religions and none to speak out against it.



But perhaps we can use this as an opportunity to privately search our own hearts and attitudes towards other religions and to explore our own prejudices.

Do you, as Muslims, believe that other religions are 'from the devil'?
If you were told at masjid that Christians (or followers of other religions) have been deceived by Shaitaan, would you be shocked and protest? Or would you actually agree?

1 - Muslims dont believe other religions are from the devil - but some christains do - Its easier for a muslim to talk to a christain then the other way round.

2 - A lot of people can be decieved by the devil including Muslims - I've never heard another religion being talked about in the masjid - its always about getting close to God and doing our duties and the importance of certain acts.

 

[Pygoscelis]

Isn't "Islam is of the devil" correct according to the teachings of this particular church? I don't think it should have surprised anybody if its already known to be part of the church's dogma. Would you be surprised by a sign saying "Only Christians go to Heaven?" or "Only Muslims go to Heaven" or whatever? These could certainly be read as offensive to those not of those groups but I don't think I'd bat an eye at seeing them.

 

[جوري]

Do you, as Muslims, believe that other religions are 'from the devil'?
If you were told at masjid that Christians (or followers of other religions) have been deceived by Shaitaan, would you be shocked and protest? Or would you actually agree?

does being deceived by shaitaan in your book equal to religion coming from the devil?
one only needs to look at the heinous church history and its apologists against islam from its very inception to appreciate that this most certainly is a one sided hatred..

I challenge you to find me one thing in your bible that reads like this:

2:62
Those who believe (in the Qur-an), and those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Christians and the Sabians, any who believe in Allah and the Last Day, and work righteousness, shall have their reward with their Lord; on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.



or this


5:82 ---and nearest among them in love to the Believers wilt thou find those who say, "We are Christians": because amongst these are men devoted to learning and men who have renounced the world, and they are not arrogant.

_____________________________________________

No!-- religion is from God.. following your own whims and re-writing the book and making gods of men is from the devil-- although the devil can certainly be from man/kind..


all the best

 

[glo]

Isn't "Islam is of the devil" correct according to the teachings of this particular church? I don't think it should have surprised anybody if its already known to be part of the church's dogma. Would you be surprised by a sign saying "Only Christians go to Heaven?" or "Only Muslims go to Heaven" or whatever? These could certainly be read as offensive to those not of those groups but I don't think I'd bat an eye at seeing them.

I was thinking along similar lines, Pygo, but you said it better than me.

Do you think that the insult is caused by the strong wording of the sign, rather than the theological concept that only followers of a certain religion attain salvation (which we know is the teaching and understanding of some religions)?

 

[rpwelton]

Isn't "Islam is of the devil" correct according to the teachings of this particular church? I don't think it should have surprised anybody if its already known to be part of the church's dogma. Would you be surprised by a sign saying "Only Christians go to Heaven?" or "Only Muslims go to Heaven" or whatever? These could certainly be read as offensive to those not of those groups but I don't think I'd bat an eye at seeing them.

What particular sect of Christianity this is which actually holds such beliefs about Islam?

 

[sledge_hammer]

does being deceived by shaitaan in your book equal to religion coming from the devil?
one only needs to look at the heinous church history and its apologists against islam from its very inception to appreciate that this most certainly is a one sided hatred..

I challenge you to find me one thing in your bible that reads like this:

2:62
Those who believe (in the Qur-an), and those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Christians and the Sabians, any who believe in Allah and the Last Day, and work righteousness, shall have their reward with their Lord; on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.



or this


5:82 ---and nearest among them in love to the Believers wilt thou find those who say, "We are Christians": because amongst these are men devoted to learning and men who have renounced the world, and they are not arrogant.

_____________________________________________

No!-- religion is from God.. following your own whims and re-writing the book and making gods of men is from the devil-- although the devil can certainly be from man/kind..


all the best

LOL...the Quran also says this:

""O believers, do not take the Jews and the Christians as your friends and protectors, they are friends of each other. And whoever makes them a friend then he is from amongst them. Verily God does not guide the unjust people. And you will see that those (Muslims) in whose hearts is a disease run towards them saying 'We fear that a calamity may befall us.' So God will soon bring victory or a decision from Him, causing them regret on account of the thoughts they harbored in their hearts." (Quran 5:51-52)"

Totally negates what is said in 2:26

So which one is it?

 

[convert]

Wanna give a tasir of that? When/how was it revealed?

 

[Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн]

LOL...the Quran also says this:

""O believers, do not take the Jews and the Christians as your friends and protectors, they are friends of each other. And whoever makes them a friend then he is from amongst them. Verily God does not guide the unjust people. And you will see that those (Muslims) in whose hearts is a disease run towards them saying 'We fear that a calamity may befall us.' So God will soon bring victory or a decision from Him, causing them regret on account of the thoughts they harbored in their hearts." (Quran 5:51-52)"

Totally negates what is said in 2:26

So which one is it?

Ahh another verse twist.

"LOL"