how to create stupidity

[جوري]

كيف تتم صناعة الغباء؟
مجموعة من العلماء و ضعوا 5 قرود في قفص واحد​

و في وسط القفص يوجد سلم و في أعلى السلم هناك بعض الموز​

في كل مرة يطلع أحد القرود لأخذ الموز يرش العلماء باقي القرود بالماء البارد​

بعد فترة بسيطة أصبح كل قرد يطلع لأخذ الموز, يقوم الباقين بمنعه​

و ضربه حتى لا يرنشون بالماء البارد​

​

بعد مدة من الوقت لم يجرؤ أي قرد على صعود السلم لأخذ الموز على الرغم من كل الإغراءات خوفا من الضرب​

بعدها قرر العلماء أن يقوموا بتبديل أحد القرود الخمسة و يضعوا مكانه قرد جديد​

فأول شيء يقوم به القرد الجديد أنه يصعد السلم ليأخذ الموز​

ولكن فورا الأربعة الباقين يضربونه و يجبرونه على النزول​

بعد عدة مرات من الضرب يفهم القرد الجديد بأن عليه أن لا يصعد السلم مع أنه لا يدري ما السبب​

​

قام العلماء أيضا بتبديل أحد القرود القدامى بقرد جديد​

و حل به ما حل بالقرد البديل الأول حتى أن القرد البديل الأول شارك زملائه بالضرب و هو لايدري لماذا يضرب​

​

و هكذا حتى تم تبديل جميع القرود الخمسة الأوائل بقرود جديدة​

حتى اصبح في القفص خمسة قرود لم يرش عليهم ماء بارد أبدا​

و مع ذلك يضربون أي قرد تسول له نفسه صعود السلم بدون أن يعرفوا ما السبب​

​

لو فرضنا ..​

و سألنا القرود لماذا يضربون القرد الذي يصعد السلم؟​

أكيد سيكون الجواب : لا ندري ولكن وجدنا آباءنا وأجدادنا له هكذا ​

“عادات وتقاليد”​

 

[ICYUNVMe]

That's a pretty amusing story. Thanks for sharing, and I agree.

Though it does seem that a good number of things are passed down from one generation to the next without firsthand knowledge. Individuals brought up in a particular religion fall into that category as well, don't you think?

 

[جوري]

Individuals brought up in a particular religion fall into that category as well, don't you think?

Especially so!

all the best

 

[Ramadhan]

Though it does seem that a good number of things are passed down from one generation to the next without firsthand knowledge. Individuals brought up in a particular religion fall into that category as well, don't you think?

Yes, and I hope it makes you think too.

 

[جوري]

Yes, and I hope it makes you think too.

narrated by Ibn Maajah from the hadeeth of Anas ibn Maalik, who said: “The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: ‘Seeking knowledge is obligatory upon every Muslim.’” (220. Classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Sunan Ibn Maajah.





one wonders is seeking knowledge is obligatory upon Christians the way they raise generations upon generations of rabid bumpkins!

 

[ICYUNVMe]

narrated by Ibn Maajah from the hadeeth of Anas ibn Maalik, who said: “The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: ‘Seeking knowledge is obligatory upon every Muslim.’” (220. Classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Sunan Ibn Maajah.

one wonders is seeking knowledge is obligatory upon Christians the way they raise generations upon generations of rabid bumpkins!

Now, why go and turn it into an attack against Christians? I'm sure that most Christians are intelligent. Similarly, I'm sure that most Muslims are intelligent. However, just because it says in the Qur'an that knowledge is obligatory for Muslims, doesn't make it so.

If one wishes that the generalizations against Muslims come to an end, then it might be wise to consider doing the same in regard to Christians or Jews or any other group.

 

[جوري]

Now, why go and turn it into an attack against Christians? I'm sure that most Christians are intelligent. Similarly, I'm sure that most Muslims are intelligent. However, just because it says in the Qur'an that knowledge is obligatory for Muslims, doesn't make it so.

Have you done a formal survey on 'christian intelligence' I have always felt the dark ages were a good representative of that intelligence.. be that as it may-- if you'd paid minor attention to what was written you'd have seen that I have disclosed is a hadith and not a quranic verse, and your ending doesn't follow from the premise. Did you just want to tinkle some pearls and take cover?

If one wishes that the generalizations against Muslims come to an end, then it might be wise to consider doing the same in regard to Christians or Jews or any other group.

Did I give you an impression that I care whether you or others like you generalize against Muslims?-- you've in fact done nothing since gracing us with your presence here except just that spew inane platitudes straight from fox news.

all the best

 

[ICYUNVMe]

Have you done a formal survey on 'christian intelligence' I have always felt the dark ages were a good representative of that intelligence.. be that as it may-- if you'd paid minor attention to what was written you'd have seen that I have disclosed is a hadith and not a quranic verse, and your ending doesn't follow from the premise. Did you just want to tinkle some pearls and take cover?

I'll show you the survey I did on Christian intelligence when you show me the evidence you need to support your "Christians are stupid" stance. As far as that verse is concerned, I don't care if its a hadith or a verse from the Qur'an. There is still the general sentiment that the Qur'an requires Muslims to use logic and reason to come to their conclusions. And there is no evidence to suggest that this is true of all Muslims.

Did I give you an impression that I care whether you or others like you generalize against Muslims?-- you've in fact done nothing since gracing us with your presence here except just that spew inane platitudes straight from fox news.

For someone who doesn't care what "outsiders" think of you, you sure spend an awful lot of time making colorful commentary on threads that shouldn't contain anything of value to you. Afterall, if you don't care what non-muslims think of you, why bother posting comments in the "What Muslims want..." and "What Non-Muslims want...." threads? You'd be better served simply speaking to your "own kind", wouldn't you? Considering the fact that Grace Seeker and Woodrow started those two threads in an attempt to start friendly dialogs between Muslims and non-Muslims, you certainly shouldn't feel any need to take part.

Further, I've been careful not to make any nasty generalizations about Muslims on this board. You may not agree with my opinions on a variety of topics but that's fine. I wouldn't expect someone like you to agree anyway (or have a casual dialog, for that matter.) Honestly, who cares? The fact that you think my comments are inane is ultimately meaningless.

One other question though: Considering your stance on the "West", and people of other faiths, and the terrorist state of America and its allies, why do you live there? It might behoove you to move elsewhere, no?

 

[جوري]

I'll show you the survey I did on Christian intelligence when you show me the evidence you need to support your "Christians are stupid" stance. As far as that verse is concerned, I don't care if its a hadith or a verse from the Qur'an. There is still the general sentiment that the Qur'an requires Muslims to use logic and reason to come to their conclusions. And there is no evidence to suggest that this is true of all Muslims.

I haven't come out and said Christians are stupid that is a presupposition on your part although history does attest to said folly, and it is ongoing-- if you were really interested you might want to look into 'new scientist' they have an article comparing the average atheist as having an 0.6 pt. higher IQ than the average christian. I do find the two groups to be equally comparable. Warmongers usually have little else to contribute except perhaps projecting their own hatred and creating mass hysteria and fear!

For someone who doesn't care what "outsiders" think of you, you sure spend an awful lot of time making colorful commentary on threads that shouldn't contain anything of value to you. Afterall, if you don't care what non-muslims think of you, why bother posting comments in the "What Muslims want..." and "What Non-Muslims want...." threads? You'd be better served simply speaking to your "own kind", wouldn't you? Considering the fact that Grace Seeker and Woodrow started those two threads in an attempt to start friendly dialogs between Muslims and non-Muslims, you certainly shouldn't feel any need to take part.

This is an Islamic forum, a forum for 'my own kind' if I really cared about outsiders logic would dictate that I'd spend my time on a christian/Jewish/atheist forum not an Islamic one don't you think? your percentage here as a group of people is as negligible in number as is your opinion!

Further, I've been careful not to make any nasty generalizations about Muslims on this board. You may not agree with my opinions on a variety of topics but that's fine. I wouldn't expect someone like you to agree anyway (or have a casual dialog, for that matter.) Honestly, who cares? The fact that you think my comments are inane is ultimately meaningless.

Indeed-- as to why you insist on replying especially after having declared with that familiar bombastic style that you have no desire to do so-- it is an ongoing conundrum.. but we'll be sure not to lose sleep over it as it is somewhat amusing and virtually appealing

One other question though: Considering your stance on the "West", and people of other faiths, and the terrorist state of America and its allies, why do you live there? It might behoove you to move elsewhere, no?

Where I reside on God's earth is my own business but one wonders where many of you would you be if it weren't for foreigners paying for your unemployment checks and food stamps and perhaps even fostering your basic vocational training so that you are able to make such mediocre remarks? http://www.economicpopulist.org/content/us-asks-gulf-nations-300-billion
tell you what take your GI gays out of the entire Islamic regions east to west and we'll sure comply with your oh so deep requests.
and while at it try leaving without killing more civilians and keeping their body parts as souvenirs..
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-11252987


all the best as always!

 

[ICYUNVMe]

I haven't come out and said Christians are stupid that is a presupposition on your part although history does attest to said folly, and it is ongoing-- if you were really interested you might want to look into 'new scientist' they have an article comparing the average atheist as having an 0.6 pt. higher IQ than the average christian. I do find the two groups to be equally comparable. Warmongers usually have little else to contribute except perhaps projecting their own hatred and creating mass hysteria and fear!

It is unfortunate that I'm unable to post links, but you might be interested in the studies that have been done, which determine that countries that have a Muslim majority have lower average IQs that countries that have Christian or non-religious majorities. Now am I supposed to take that information and assume that Muslims are stupid? Of course not.... because making brash generalizations about an entire group of people would be wrong.... Get the picture?

This is an Islamic forum, a forum for 'my own kind' if I really cared about outsiders logic would dictate that I'd spend my time on a christian/Jewish/atheist forum not an Islamic one don't you think? your percentage here as a group of people is as negligible in number as is your opinion!

The forum may be a Muslim forum, but it doesn't prevent non-muslims from coming on board to discuss things. The threads I mentioned before were for people who desire to speak to people of other faiths and listen. There are plenty of other threads in which you might be more comfortable participating. Or, if you still find the presence of non-muslims troublesome, you could start your own forum, in which Christians and Jews and Atheists wouldn't be permitted to join. That would be an educational experience, I'm sure.

Indeed-- as to why you insist on replying especially after having declared with that familiar bombastic style that you have no desire to do so-- it is an ongoing conundrum.. but we'll be sure not to lose sleep over it as it is somewhat amusing and virtually appealing

I was stating that I wasn't going to respond to your posts in the other thread, as it was obvious that you didn't intend on being a productive participant. But I'm not going to ignore your entirely! That would be rude.... And don't worry, I won't be going anywhere any time soon, so hopefully we'll get to know each other a little better.

Where I reside on God's earth is my own business but one wonders where many of you would you be if it weren't for foreigners paying for your unemployment checks and food stamps and perhaps even fostering your basic vocational training so that you are able to make such mediocre remarks?

This is just sad.... You attached a link regarding a story in which the US Government borrowed money from other allied governments.... As if that's never happened before. It has absolutely nothing to do with you personally propping up the American economy by staying here and working, despite your absolute hatred for this place. However, if that makes you feel like a more productive member of society, by all means, continue that train of thought. (Why would god put one of his most faithful servants in such a horrible place, one wonders?)


All the Best....

 

[Asiyah3]

Could someone summarize the story, please?

 

[جوري]

It is unfortunate that I'm unable to post links, but you might be interested in the studies that have been done, which determine that countries that have a Muslim majority have lower average IQs that countries that have Christian or non-religious majorities. Now am I supposed to take that information and assume that Muslims are stupid? Of course not.... because making brash generalizations about an entire group of people would be wrong.... Get the picture?

It is fortunate for you as it would prove you a liar and a hypocrite which is a fact not lost to most discerning members here:
here is your govt. consensus-- which I didn't come up with:

Middle Eastern immigrants were highly educated, with 49 percent holding at least a bachelor's degree, compared to 28 percent of natives.

Median earnings for Middle Eastern men were $39,000 a year compared to $38,000 for native workers.

they tend to be better-educated than native U.S. residents — about half hold bachelor's degrees, compared to 28 percent of natives. They also perform as well economically as natives — 30- and 40-year-old Middle Eastern males with a college education have the same median income as natives, and Middle East immigrants are more likely be self-employed.




Middle Eastern Immigrants in U.S. Educated, Prosperous, Study Says
Gannett News Service, August 15, 2002

(Also ran in Arizona Republic - 8/15)

WASHINGTON — Middle Eastern immigrants in the United States are well educated, earn more money than most Americans and are predominantly Muslim, according to a report released Wednesday.

They also are among the nation's fastest-growing immigrant groups, according to the report issued by the Center for Immigration Studies in Washington, a think tank that supports reducing the number of immigrants to the United States.

The report says the number of Middle Eastern immigrants increased from fewer than 200,000 in 1970 to almost 1.5 million in 2000. The overall number of foreign-born residents in the United States tripled to 31 million over the same period.

The report offers a rare portrait of an immigrant group that has received intense scrutiny and negative publicity since the Sept. 11 attacks.
Project MAPS, a survey of "Muslims in the American Public Square" conducted in 2001-2002 by researchers at Georgetown University, found that 86 percent of all Muslim professionals were concentrated in three careers: engineering, computer science, and medicine. Law, law enforcement, and politics accounted for a minuscule 0.6 percent. American Muslims, some demographers say, have also been voting well below their numbers in the population -- registering to vote at only half the national rate, according to the 2001 American Religious Identification Survey [PDF], a project of the Graduate Center of the City University of New York. "If they ever did play to their weight" in the electoral arena and in Washington, Muslims "would be a much more considerable force in public policy-making," says Steve Clemons, a Democrat who directs the American Strategy Program at the New America Foundation in Washington.

http://www.wilsoncenter.org/topics/p...ab_America.pdf
http://www.cis.org/articles/2002/mideastcoverage.html

Muslims aren't only more intelligent but in fact are better educated.. not only do we foster your education, food stamps well-fare, give you not loan you billions, accommodate you in our lands under whatever guise you spew when we all know that you are there for no other reason than to steal the wealth of nations, dismantle any attempt at unity amongst Muslims, ravage cultures as far back as ancient Samaria the very birth place of civilization, kill civilians and keep their parts as souvenirs but have the audacity to turn it around and make it as if others are out to get you.. constantly biting the hands that feed you and have taught you and for centuries.. what that smarmy sickness and paranoia of which you've proven yourself a poster child!

The forum may be a Muslim forum, but it doesn't prevent non-muslims from coming on board to discuss things. The threads I mentioned before were for people who desire to speak to people of other faiths and listen. There are plenty of other threads in which you might be more comfortable participating. Or, if you still find the presence of non-muslims troublesome, you could start your own forum, in which Christians and Jews and Atheists wouldn't be permitted to join. That would be an educational experience, I'm sure.

I participate on the threads that please me and merit my comments.. if facts make you uncomfortable or if you don't like the variety of Muslims you meet here, then don't be a member here!

I was stating that I wasn't going to respond to your posts in the other thread, as it was obvious that you didn't intend on being a productive participant. But I'm not going to ignore your entirely! That would be rude.... And don't worry, I won't be going anywhere any time soon, so hopefully we'll get to know each other a little better.

Surely your definition of 'productive' is that of dead beat trailer trash right wingers?.. you need the sort of audience who will imbue your crap and takes it at face value? you must not like being challenged on views that have you so ensnared that you prefer to bury your head in the sand and bark extra loud when contradictions to your conventional 'wisdom' slaps in the face?

This is just sad.... You attached a link regarding a story in which the US Government borrowed money from other allied governments.... As if that's never happened before. It has absolutely nothing to do with you personally propping up the American economy by staying here and working, despite your absolute hatred for this place. However, if that makes you feel like a more productive member of society, by all means, continue that train of thought. (Why would god put one of his most faithful servants in such a horrible place, one wonders?)

It is almost insulting to read such pedantry, must be your inner child with those frequent tantrums-- do see paragraph one and I hope for your sake you can elevate your style a bit!
further you have no idea where I was born nor where I reside.. perhaps that is why your intelligence fails you when planting moles in mosques? http://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=10692713
pounding on your chest less and learning more undoubtedly is the road to pursue to get your ailing economy and soon to be third world style policed country back on its feet.. what a terrible combination to have an immoral govt. catering to foolish people-- one thing has got to give!

all the best

 

[جوري]

here is another to add to the Govt. consensus above:

Iran showing fastest scientific growth of any country

http://www.newscientist.com/article...fastest-scientific-growth-of-any-country.html

you should opt for facts over the usual unsubstantiated, regurgitated, right wing media bull if you desire to sustain your stay on this forum with something outside of your personal M.O.. what say you?

all the best as usual

 

[جوري]

Could someone summarize the story, please?

here is google translator:
http://translate.google.com/#

The translation is a bit off but you get the pic

 

[أحمد]

Could someone summarize the story, please?

Scientists experiment with five monkeys, and some bananas. When a monkey takes a banana from the step; the others (monkeys) get cold water squirted at them. This results in the four monkeys, beating the one which took the banana. The scientists keep replacing each monkey (one by one), until they've replaced all of them. A monkey takes a banana, the other four monkeys beat that monkey. The only difference now is, the monkeys don't know why they're beating the one which took the banana.

The story is about blind-following.

:wa:

 

[Asiyah3]

^^Jazakumullah for the help.

 

[ICYUNVMe]

here is another to add to the Govt. consensus above: Iran showing fastest scientific growth of any country

Try obtaining some historical context when you post links. When you're at the bottom of the intellectual barrel, the only way to go is up. I'm glad that Iran is improving in areas of science. Iran used to be a wonderful country before it was hijacked. Again though, since you started by talking about IQ, the fact that Iran is releasing more scientific papers has nothing to do with the intelligence of the nation or Muslims as a whole.

Regarding those other articles you decided to cut and paste, I'm pretty sure I said countries with a MUSLIM MAJORITY have a lower IQ than non-Muslim majority countries. Last I checked, the U.S. doesn't have a Muslim majority. In addition, due to the fact that the U.S. provides the greatest potential for economic prosperity, it is not a surprise that the best and the brightest from around the world would come here. The smartest Indian immigrants, the the smartest Asians, the smartest Europeans all come to America for education and employment.

Surely your definition of 'productive' is that of dead beat trailer trash right wingers?.. you need the sort of audience who will imbue your crap and takes it at face value? you must not like being challenged on views that have you so ensnared that you prefer to bury your head in the sand and bark extra loud when contradictions to your conventional 'wisdom' slaps in the face?

Contrarily, it seems that you are the one who feels the need to bark louder, increasingly coming with new, and albeit, humorous insults. I wouldn't post in other threads if I didn't want people to read and discuss things with me. While I don't wish to damage your fragile psyche, I just want you to know that some girl sitting behind a computer screen, lobbing weak insults at me, is not very intimidating.

It is almost insulting to read such pedantry, must be your inner child with those frequent tantrums-- do see paragraph one and I hope for your sake you can elevate your style a bit! further you have no idea where I was born nor where I reside.. perhaps that is why your intelligence fails you when planting moles in mosques?

pounding on your chest less and learning more undoubtedly is the road to pursue to get your ailing economy and soon to be third world style policed country back on its feet.. what a terrible combination to have an immoral govt. catering to foolish people-- one thing has got to give!

Oh gosh, if only I could find a random story about a stupid Muslim person, and then use it as a means to extrapolate that ALL Muslims must have a similarly meager intellect.....

You know what I find fascinating about you, Vale's Lily? You're clearly intelligent. But you put together these pieces of information that you think are coherent and prove your case, when in actuality, all they do is show you aren't even paying attention to the original argument. Go through these last few posts again and see how you jump from IQ to Average Income in the US. Or from Muslim immigrants propping up the US economy to the US borrowing money from another country's government (very different things).

On a related note to the economy, read up on globalization, and try to determine what happens if a major economy like the United States suffers. In the global economy that we're all a part of, a rising tide lifts all ships. The opposite is true as well.

And, you live in New York.

All the Best....

 

[جوري]

Try obtaining some historical context when you post links.

Try obtaining some reputed links before you blather one!

When you're at the bottom of the intellectual barrel,the only way to go is up.

Do alert us when that delightful change happens for you!

I'm glad that Iran is improving in areas of science.

improvement is certainly better than inertia and stagnation-although one thing is certain yours isn't the standard by which any 'improvement' is measured.

Iran used to be a wonderful country before it was hijacked.

I enjoy your vacillations between simpleness and conformity.. it is truly a delight for you to live out a prototype that we can simply reference to when we seek amusement!

Again though, since you started by talking about IQ, the fact that Iran is releasing more scientific papers has nothing to do with the intelligence of the nation or Muslims as a whole.

The topic was never about IQ, it was worth it to put things in perspective for you as you are under delusions of grandiosity that your assessment has any weightiness!

Regarding those other articles you decided to cut and paste, I'm pretty sure I said countries with a MUSLIM MAJORITY have a lower IQ than non-Muslim majority countries.

You keep saying that like a child with a temper tantrum. Govt. consensus and modern scientific trends prove otherwise-- and your assurances are as authentic as a three dollar bill. If you had any common sense at then brush up your skills in the fields of epidemiology and statistics before suggesting ambiguous reading material for others-- you'd know that folks east/west/left and right follow a similar bell shaped distribution.. the only difference in any given population that excels over the other is their own personal persuasions, hard work and strong faith in what they do and support from their creator.
Now, to end this statement in that which will acquiesce to your level of expertise I too am PRETTY SURE YOU ARE AN UNDER-EDUCATED TROLL who fell off the turnip truck.. but you see conjectures can only take one so far!

Last I checked, the U.S. doesn't have a Muslim majority. In addition, due to the fact that the U.S. provides the greatest potential for economic prosperity, it is not a surprise that the best and the brightest from around the world would come here. The smartest Indian immigrants, the the smartest Asians, the smartest Europeans all come to America for education and employment.

you check nothing, all you manage to do is stifle a yawn from those who bother click on any page you partook in. Your economy is down the drain with the highest rate of unemployment and it does appear that you are hitting gulf countries for billions while whittling whatever resources on illegal wars and occupations maybe some pork rids and Monday night football and 'jesus loved ya'. Also why do you have to import immigrants smart or otherwise? your red-neck, brutish, vulgar, gun-toting, bible thumping oafs aren't able to sustain the country on their own merits?

Contrarily, it seems that you are the one who feels the need to bark louder, increasingly coming with new, and albeit, humorous insults. I wouldn't post in other threads if I didn't want people to read and discuss things with me. While I don't wish to damage your fragile psyche, I just want you to know that some girl sitting behind a computer screen, lobbing weak insults at me, is not very intimidating.

Again, I understand the needs of your inner child believe me I do-- there there-- but now if none of this is intimidating why do you come back and babble like a baboon hurling out your personal opinions/attempts at insults that manage to elicit a hearty guffaw from the rest without the ability to back up a single thing you write except for dropping your assurances and beliefs left and right as if they have any worth?!

Oh gosh, if only I could find a random story about a stupid Muslim person, and then use it as a means to extrapolate that ALL Muslims must have a similarly meager intellect.....

Ah, if only you could. we'd be happy for you!

You know what I find fascinating about you, Vale's Lily? You're clearly intelligent. But you put together these pieces of information that you think are coherent and prove your case, when in actuality, all they do is show you aren't even paying attention to the original argument. Go through these last few posts again and see how you jump from IQ to Average Income in the US. Or from Muslim immigrants propping up the US economy to the US borrowing money from another country's government (very different things).

We have to accommodate both your tangentiality and circumstantiality of thought which you have displayed from the first post on this thread.. Muslims are known to be generous hosts and I am very much game for the ride.. I think it is also both therapeutic and educational for you!

On a related note to the economy, read up on globalization, and try to determine what happens if a major economy like the United States suffers. In the global economy that we're all a part of, a rising tide lifts all ships. The opposite is true as well.

It would be prudent then to be prepared for the worse.. only stoics and true victors survive global disasters!

And, you live in New York.

NY, isn't nor has it ever been the only place I have- live and I travel where I please on God's earth and where I do the most good far away from your ilk.

All the Best....

Indeed