Is Ayat 2:177 an important Ayat?

[Callisto]

Greetings Calisto

I don't whether its a genuine problem or Non Muslim do intentionally take an ayat out of context.Can you judge or make a judgement about a whole book by one or two statements.In this Case AUTHOR is the Lord Of All Worlds.
SO Please Read This Again

Indeed, they who conceal what Allah has sent down of the Book and exchange it for a small price - those consume not into their bellies except the Fire. And Allah will not speak to them on the Day of Resurrection, nor will He purify them. And they will have a painful punishment. 2:174

Those are the ones who have exchanged guidance for error and forgiveness for punishment. How patient they are in pursuit of the Fire! 2:175

That is [deserved by them] because Allah has sent down the Book in truth. And indeed, those who differ over the Book are in extreme dissension. 2:176

Righteousness is not that you turn your faces toward the east or the west, but [true] righteousness is [in] one who believes in Allah , the Last Day, the angels, the Book, and the prophets and gives wealth, in spite of love for it, to relatives, orphans, the needy, the traveler, those who ask [for help], and for freeing slaves; [and who] establishes prayer and gives zakah; [those who] fulfill their promise when they promise; and [those who] are patient in poverty and hardship and during battle. Those are the ones who have been true, and it is those who are the righteous. 2:177

O you who have believed, prescribed for you is legal retribution for those murdered - the free for the free, the slave for the slave, and the female for the female. But whoever overlooks from his brother anything, then there should be a suitable follow-up and payment to him with good conduct. This is an alleviation from your Lord and a mercy. But whoever transgresses after that will have a painful punishment. 2:178

And there is for you in legal retribution [saving of] life, O you [people] of understanding, that you may become righteous. 2:179

Prescribed for you when death approaches [any] one of you if he leaves wealth [is that he should make] a bequest for the parents and near relatives according to what is acceptable - a duty upon the righteous 2:180

You may proceed with the debate further.....

Thanks so much for this comment! I love the fact that you posted 7 Ayah. I love that 177 is the middle fulcrum Ayah. The first three are spoken to disbelievers. The last three are spoken to believers. I am currently in a situation where I blew all my money and am engaged in 180, due to becoming more religious and travelling to Egypt to learn about Islam and spending my money and giving up my wealth. That I used to chase the things of the Fire (money, recognition and influence) and now I want to be careful to not be dissentious, but reach my own understanding of the Scripture.

I seek understand and kashf, Allah.

 

[_Y168]

SubhanAllaah! An interesting read!

 

[Callisto]

Assalaam Alaykum,

There are many examples. However, differing interpretations are not always in conflict with each other.

I thought of something else I would like to say here. As laypeople, not educated in Tafseer, but with guidance on differing Ta'weel from educated Islamic scholars and the different interpretations, we can ourselves decide what feels right in our heart. Is that not what the different "interpretations" (I forget the name of the groupings) of Sunni Islam all about?

For sure I feel I can take a little from this group and a little from that group, being new to Islam and all. I am ok if some people in some groups do not like me doing that. I am not sure which group is into the whole kashf thing.

 

[Muhammad]

:salamext:

but thats the whole point, many times iv been humbled by people that i have no idea about.

knowledge is no indicator of importance in the real world.

good conduct and morality are used to judge between us, makes me think about what a position of authority really is.

Knowledge is vitally important in Islam, upon which actions are dependent. Without knowledge, how will one know an action is approved by Allaah (swt) or not?

I'm sorry I did not understand the relevance of what followed in your post.

 

[Muhammad]

Callisto,

2. Can less Tafseer educated Muslims and non-Muslims question interpretations? M.I.A. posts a link that says yes, within reason.

Would you question your doctor's advice upon going to him for help?

M.I.A.'s link does not in any way suggest we should question interpretations. It does not even talk about interpretations. It says very clearly that, 'Knowing all this makes a Muslim realize that in order to properly be able to reflect upon the Quran, he must return to the biography of the Prophet, sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam, and the authentic Sunnah.'

There were also two questions I had about [2:177], that have been answered to the degree we want to get into them:

1. Is it mandated for Muslims to face Mecca? Yes, Allah legislates facing Mecca, but [2:177] says Al-Birr is more important.
2. Are there truths in other Scriptures that are not in the Qu'ran, that can be validated by the Qu'ran, since the Qu'ran is the cryptographic key to validate other Scripture? Yes. [5:116] is a good example of the Qu'ran invalidating common Christian belief.

At the beginning of the discussion, I made it very clear that:

When it comes to detailed interpretation of the Qur'an, this is a science in Islam and requires a great degree of knowledge and understanding. It is based upon various tools and principles, like knowledge of the Arabic language. For this reason, it is not up to lay people to interpret as they wish. Rather they must refer to the scholars who have applied the correct methodology in understanding the Qur'an.

Yet I find you are doing the complete opposite and bringing your own baseless opinions in place of consulting proper tafseer. I find this to be incredibly disrespectful towards the Qur'an and it is quite clear that you are not interested in hearing answers. The Prophet, sallallaahu alayhi wasallam, said, 'Verily the nations before you were destroyed by this action of yours; they would try to contradict part of the Book of Allaah with other parts. Indeed, the Book of Allaah came to confirm its verses with each other (and not to contradict them). Therefore do not reject its verses due to other verses. When you know something from it (the Qur'an), say it, and if you do not know it, then leave it to one who does know!' [Reported by Ahmad and An-Nasaai]

The answer to your first question was already quoted by yourself earlier from Tafseer ibn Katheer:

Then Allah sent revelation which clarified the wisdom behind this command, that is, obedience to Allah, adhering to His commands, facing wherever He commands facing, and implementing whatever He legislates, that is the objective. This is Birr, Taqwa and complete faith. Facing the east or the west does not necessitate righteousness or obedience, unless it is legislated by Allah.


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As for your second question, the Qur'an is not cryptographic at all. For the third time, I will quote the following, which I hope you will note this time:

This Glorious Book, which Allah revealed as the Last and Final Book, is the most encompassing, glorious and perfect Book of all times. The Qur'an includes all the good aspects of previous Scriptures and even more, which no previous Scripture ever contained. This is why Allah made it trustworthy, a witness and dominant over all Scriptures.

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I just want to add that being brand new as a muslim, does not mean I am brand new to history.

Islamic history is a part of Islam aswell, and one's sources and interests in this regard say a great deal. People new to Islam should start with the biography of the noble Prophet, sallallaahu alayhi wasallam, and should not make heretical ideas and movements their first point of study.

we can ourselves decide what feels right in our heart.

For sure I feel I can take a little from this group and a little from that group, being new to Islam and all.

I see you have totally ignored post #9. I hope you will give that more thought. Please also take heed of the following verses of the Qur'an:

So do you believe in part of the Scripture and disbelieve in part? [2:85]

O you who have believed, enter into Islam completely [and perfectly] and do not follow the footsteps of Satan. Indeed, he is to you a clear enemy. [2:208]​

It seems that the only interpretations you are interested in are the improper kind. You will find that every deviant sect that has sprung forth in the history of Islam have misinterpreted verses to support their particular beliefs. Without relying on the proper methodology of tafseer, it is possible to interpret the Qur'an in any way one desires to. The Qur'an itself alludes to this when it says,

It is He Who has sent down to you (Muhammad صلى الله عليه وسلم) the Book. In it are Verses that are entirely clear, they are the foundations of the Book; and others not entirely clear. So as for those in whose hearts there is a deviation (from the truth) they follow that which is not entirely clear thereof, seeking Al-Fitnah (polytheism and trials), and seeking for its hidden meanings, but none knows its hidden meanings save Allah. And those who are firmly grounded in knowledge say: "We believe in it; the whole of it (clear and unclear Verses) are from our Lord." And none receive admonition except men of understanding. [3:7]​

I thus leave you to make your own decision, whether it is guidance from Allaah (swt) that you seek, or your own desires that you seek to please.

There is little more that remains to be said, so this thread is now closed.