Jesus and Muhammad

[Grace Seeker]

There are no idiotic questions, i believe just idiotic people, I thank you for being a prime example of one.

Glad first Christians were Jews, considering Jesus was indeed sent to the Israelites

But he replied, "I was sent only to the lost sheep of the nation of Israel." 15:24

http://bible.cc/matthew/15-24.htm


are you the lost sheep of bani Israel? as far as I am concerned Jesus was sent to a handful of those who have gone astray, NOT to all people!
So quite your complaining!
cheers

Paul has no authority when it comes to Jesus ( he is the devil) you were warned against.. as for Barnabas, isn't it amazing that his so-called bible was banned for teaching that which is very opposite of saul's view?

I think any clear discerning mind can indeed see, Jesus was sent to a handful, who refused him anyway.. Prophet Mohammed PBUH was sent to man kind. period!

cheers

How about letting Jesus himself speak to the subject then?

"For the Son of Man came to seek and to save what was lost." Luke 19:10

"All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age." (Matthew 28:18-20)

"You will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you; and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth." (Acts 1:8)

 

[جوري]

How about letting Jesus himself speak to the subject then?

"For the Son of Man came to seek and to save what was lost." Luke 19:10

"All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age." (Matthew 28:18-20)

"You will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you; and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth." (Acts 1:8)

:haha:.. unfortunately for you we are not as undereducated as your typical bible belter.. be that as it may.. who gave Jesus the power? his alter ego?.. got to tell you it is a but of a difficult concept, when he states his father is greater than he, then he claims the father gave him all the power, yet the father forsake him shortly thereafter and he was all the same person.. hey if that works for you :sunny:

the other verse is also interesting, you'll receive power when the 'holy spirit' comes to you? How does a spirit come to you? isn't he a ghost? Perhaps again, something was lost to you in the translation, after all your God didn't speak English, and I doubt very much those are his words..

I'd go take care of the other thread too where you claimed no where in your bible is pork forbidden.. it seems, you have many holes in this vessel, it is about to give way from all the contradictions.

cheers

 

[Grace Seeker]

:haha:.. unfortunately for you we are not as undereducated as your typical bible belter.. be that as it may.. who gave Jesus the power? his alter ego?.. got to tell you it is a but of a difficult concept, when he states his father is greater than he, then he claims the father gave him all the power, yet the father forsake him shortly thereafter and he was all the same person.. hey if that works for you :sunny:

the other verse is also interesting, you'll receive power when the 'holy spirit' comes to you? How does a spirit come to you? isn't he a ghost?
cheers

How? About 50 days after the Passover there was a Jewish celebration called Pentecost. Jews would again assemble in Jerusalem for the celebration. The disciples were there as well.

Acts 2

1When the day of Pentecost came, they were all together in one place. 2Suddenly a sound like the blowing of a violent wind came from heaven and filled the whole house where they were sitting. 3They saw what seemed to be tongues of fire that separated and came to rest on each of them. 4All of them were filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues as the Spirit enabled them.

No, the Spirit is not a ghost in the since of Casper or something like that. Some of the older English versions use the term Holy Ghost instead of Holy Spirit, but by either term they are referring to the presence of God that indwells within a person.

 

[جوري]

How? About 50 days after the Passover there was a Jewish celebration called Pentecost. Jews would again assemble in Jerusalem for the celebration. The disciples were there as well.

except for the Jews it was/is a holy day celebrated on the sixth of Sivan to celebrate Moses receiving the Ten Commandments..
not the case for Christians.. they are there to celebrate eating pig

No, the Spirit is not a ghost in the since of Casper or something like that. Some of the older English versions use the term Holy Ghost instead of Holy Spirit, but by either term they are referring to the presence of God that indwells within a person.

oh so more like a monomania where gluttonous debauchees decide they love pig too much and so God possesses them so they can male allowances that he clearly proscribes?

 

[Grace Seeker]

except for the Jews it was/is a holy day celebrated on the sixth of Sivan to celebrate Moses receiving the Ten Commandments..
not the case for Christians.. they are there to celebrate eating pig



oh so more like a monomania where gluttonous debauchees decide they love pig too much and so God possesses them so they can male allowances that he clearly proscribes?

The disciples were in Jerusalem because they had been told by Jesus to stay there until they received this power. And thought Christians are today free to eat anything we want, that had not been revealed to the disciples yet.

But you are right God does indeed possess us. I am not my own. I belong to Jesus Christ. He doesn't do that to lead me into any sort of debaucherie, but into righteousness. Thus we are to avoid behaviors that he proscribes; however, it just so happens that eating pork is not among the proscribed behaviors. And ridiculing it, doesn't change that reality.

 

[جوري]

The disciples were in Jerusalem because they had been told by Jesus to stay there until they received this power. And thought Christians are today free to eat anything we want, that had not been revealed to the disciples yet.

aha

But you are right God does indeed possess us. I am not my own. I belong to Jesus Christ. He doesn't do that to lead me into any sort of debaucherie, but into righteousness. Thus we are to avoid behaviors that he proscribes; however, it just so happens that eating pork is not among the proscribed behaviors. And ridiculing it, doesn't change that reality.

There is no ridicule it is the reality as others see it.
Again, if your God abrogated his own commandments and you are comfortable with that, then more power to you.. :sunny:

cheers

 

[doorster]

Reading from these quotes and counter quotes, I could be forgiven for thinking that it looks like more than one "Jesus"at work (in the gospels), therefore I am gonna stick with our Messiah namely Hazrat Eesa Alahisalaam.

wa salaam

 

[doorster]

"What does NT mean? according to the Jews, there is no NT."

Even Jews who do not believe that Jesus of Nazareth was the Messiah are not so idiotic as to question the existence of a document known as the New Testament. It is the primary source for information about the life and teaching of Jesus and was produced by the community of people who knew him.

Incidentally, the overwhelming majority of the first Christians were Jews and almost all of the New Testament was written by Jews. If Luke was not a Jew then he was the exception.

I think that the thread was intended for finding similarities or things we can agree on. I do not think it was made so that you can hijack it so we end up finding what divides us, that has been done here 100 times already:mmokay:

why don't you go make your own threads and see if anyone want to join in your crusades?

 

[Grace Seeker]

I think that the thread was intended for finding similarities or things we can agree on. I do not think it was made so that you can hijack it so we end up finding what divides us, that has been done here 100 times already:mmokay:

why don't you go make your own threads and see if anyone want to join in your crusades?

Agreed, I think this thread was intended at least for making comparisons between what Muhaamad taught (presumably in the Qur'an and Hadith) and what Jesus is recorded as having said (presumably in the Christian scriputres). Hence it's posting in "comparative religion". Since those Christian scriptures where Jesus' words are located are generally called the New Testament not only by those who use them as their sacred scripture, but even by those of other faiths, it seems rather divise for someone to dispute the that a collection by such a title even exists.

What does NT mean? according to the Jews, there is no NT.

Perhaps this is where we got off track, for I can't figure out how such a comment constructively moves the conversation along. But before this thread can begin the type of comparisons asked for I think we do need to know what source documents the opening poster intends us to be looking at to make our comparisons.

Al Habeshi, do you intend those statements to be credited to Christ to come from any source that might claim to have the words of Christ, or only those recognized as authoritative by those who call themselves Christians?

 

[جوري]

Perhaps this is where we got off track, for I can't figure out how such a comment constructively moves the conversation along. But before this thread can begin the type of comparisons asked for I think we do need to know what source documents the opening poster intends us to be looking at to make our comparisons.

There is really nothing to compare or move along, when at the crux of all your arguments is an absurdity at variance with reason.
1- a confused God
2-A god who abrogates his own commandments
3-Doesn't abrogate his old commandments in an openly acceptable way.
4-A God who at one point is all knowing all hearing, and the next can't even speak of what he should know as an all knowing God, but of what 'he hears'
5-He prays to himself
6-He curses the earth he supposedly created because it doesn't bear fruit for him
7-he forsakes himself
8-he isn't in concert with anything collectively know of God from all previous messengers sent -- I never heard of Joseph, or Issac or Job praying to Jesus and a holy spirit
9- has a mother, and an alter ego, whose job is so dubious it is remarkable really the exculpations you keep giving these passages rather than concede a very viable.probable explanation.
the list goes on and on.. but at the end.. Christians have the nerve to classify this under monotheism .. what do you take people for? I don't think most four year olds believe in Santa clause, let alone a God this confused ...

I hate comparative religion on the account there is nothing to compare..
I only partake whenever I see one of those loony bible thumpers take leave from the belt to join the rest of the world and expect that this nonsense should swoon people from the dark ages into the 'enlightenment', considering Christianity has never had anything but a very dark, lamentably unenlightened existence throughout the ages -- and the only way for it to make viable itself as an option is to malign the only true contender (although I personally wouldn't even put Islam in the same league) and still, not even in an overt way to make its intentions known, by way of your new presidential candidate sending anti-islamic rhetoric by mail-- truly pitiable!

 

[Grace Seeker]

Just to refocus us on the question at hand.

As Salam Alaykum,
I was wondering if it was possible to compile teachings attributed to Jesus and teachings attributed to Muhammad which are parralel, would yall help??

There might be a couple of different ways to do this.

For instance, one could simply search for things such as YusufNoor has done (post #4 of the thread) and see what are some of the differences/similarities that individuals find. The list is likely to include those things that are most meaningful to those posters, but may not show us the breadth of topics they address.

Keltoi (post #5) suggested just taking a small pericope of Jesus' teachings such as the Sermon on the Mount, and combing it to see what of it was also addressed by Muhammad.

I have a third suggestion, but it would require people of differing faiths actually working together rather than competing against each other: What if we came up with a list of topics that we could agree we would like to see what, if anything, Jesus and Muhammad had to say about them? Then those who knew the Qur'an and Hadith well would comb through it for anything Muhammad might have said on the subject and those who knew the New Testament well would comb through it for anything Jesus might have said on the subject. And if some people think that we need to look at other sources beyond them, then they could do the same thing with those sources. But we would begin by agreeing on a list of topics which we were most interested in seeing what may or may not have been said.

 

[Hamayun]

There is really nothing to compare or move along, when at the crux of all your arguments is an absurdity at variance with reason.
1- a confused God
2-A god who abrogates his own commandments
3-Doesn't abrogate his old commandments in an openly acceptable way.
4-A God who at one point is all knowing all hearing, and the next can't even speak of what he should know as an all knowing God, but of what 'he hears'
5-He prays to himself
6-He curses the earth he supposedly created because it doesn't bear fruit for him
7-he forsakes himself
8-he isn't in concert with anything collectively know of God from all previous messengers sent -- I never heard of Joseph, or Issac or Job praying to Jesus and a holy spirit
9- has a mother, and an alter ego, whose job is so dubious it is remarkable really the exculpations you keep giving these passages rather than concede a very viable.probable explanation.
the list goes on and on.. but at the end.. Christians have the nerve to classify this under monotheism .. what do you take people for? I don't think most four year olds believe in Santa clause, let alone a God this confused ...

I hate comparative religion on the account there is nothing to compare..
I only partake whenever I see one of those loony bible thumpers take leave from the belt to join the rest of the world and expect that this nonsense should swoon people from the dark ages into the 'enlightenment', considering Christianity has never had anything but a very dark, lamentably unenlightened existence throughout the ages -- and the only way for it to make viable itself as an option is to malign the only true contender (although I personally wouldn't even put Islam in the same league) and still, not even in an overt way to make its intentions known, by way of your new presidential candidate sending anti-islamic rhetoric by mail-- truly pitiable!

I think you summed it up Sister Skye.