Salaam
Another update. Part 1
'You're going to be followed...life will be harder for you': the story of Mohammed Emwazi
Mohammed Emwazi first came to CAGE in 2009 after being detained, interrogated and recruited by Mi5 on what was meant to be a safari holiday to Tanzania. Thereafter, the harassment continued and intensified which led to him losing two fiancée's, his job and new life in Kuwait. The harassment and abuse he suffered, was all without criminal charges ever being brought against him, with the legal remedies available to him failing, he attempted to start a new life abroad in Kuwait only to be blocked by the UK security agencies continually. A Washington Post investigation recently alleged he was the British IS member known as “Jihadi John”.
“You’re going to have a lot of trouble ...you’re going to be known...you’re going to be followed...life will be harder for you.”
Background
Mohammed Emwazi is 26 years old British citizen. He was born in Kuwait in 1988, but moved to the UK at the age of six with his family and has lived there since.
Raised and educated in West London, he went on to complete a degree in 2009. He hoped that with this degree he could build a successful career in Arab countries, particularly as he was fluent in Arabic, English and a British citizen.
After completing his studies Mohammed began making plans for settling down, for his future. As for most, this included marriage. Regarding this, he was speaking to a potential spouse and her family over the phone back in his home country, Kuwait and the only step that remained was for him to go there and formally conduct the marriage contract.
As is the case for most students, upon completing his studies Mohammed first wanted a break, a summer holiday with some friends where he could relax for a bit and enjoy himself. With two close friends from childhood, he made plans to go to Tanzania with one of the key attractions there being safari.
Detention in Tanzania
When their plane landed in Tanzania, in August 2009, the three were stopped in the airport. The officers were border control officials, but Mohammed recollected that it was as if they knew who he and his two friends were – as if they knew who to stop.
Without being given an official reason, they were refused entry. Being far away from home, in a non-European country, they thought it would be wise not to make a big fuss and simply requested their passports back and a return flight to take them home. However, their passports were not returned and instead the officers were armed with sticks and were shouting threats and abuse at the friends until a suited man, Emanuel, turned up inquiring as to what was going on. This man became the official contact for Mohammed and his friends as the Tanzanians sought to remove them from the country.
Emanuel told Mohammed and his friends that they had missed the next flight to Holland. They responded by saying they would simply wait in the airport for the next flight, but he did not allow this and proceeded to physically drag the three to two cars waiting outside. Each of them was flanked by two officers and struggling would have been of no use. Mohammed in one car and his two friends in the other, they were taken to the nearest police station to the airport in Dar-es-Salaam and thrown into the same cell where they spent the night.
There was still daylight when they were detained and they remained in the cell for approximately 24 hours. During this time, despite the officers knowing that they had just come off a 12-hour flight, they were not given any food or drink; there were many officers armed with guns and sticks in the station who threatened them; one officer tried to make them strip to their underwear when getting in the cell, which was said to be one of the rules of the police station – something which they refused to do after seeing others in separate cells with full clothing. When night fell they had to sleep rough on the floor. But they didn’t trust the police so Mohammed stayed up while the other two slept, during which time he had a gun pointed at him through the cell and was threatened.
Even after the men managed to secure consular visits the following day, they were simply informed that the Tanzanians could remove them if they wanted. Just before their deportation, the men asked Emanuel why they had been removed. The following afternoon, the man who had taken them from the airport had arrived to return them to the airport where they were put on a plane back to Schipol, Amsterdam in the Netherlands.
“Before we entered the airplane we said to him that you look a big guy here and you have lots of authority so tell us that why we got rejected? What was our fault? He said, “This is not the Tanzanian government.” He even took out a paper and showed us which had our first names, last names, flight details and at the bottom it had a piece of writing which said “refuse entry and send back to the UK with the same flight”. We were shocked. This was the first time someone told us the truth and he was being very honest. So we said “what are you trying to suggest?” and he said, “You know it could be the British, your government who were the reason for your rejection.” We were in a MAJOR shock. He had given us a big clue. He led us to the plane and said we have got nothing against you. I even have his number and email with me. He asked us to come again and he would show us around. He said you seem to be free lads and good people. Find out the reason and come back again. We did not believe him immediately as he had lied to us before but we had no other option. So we boarded the plane back from Tanzania to Amsterdam, the same 10 hour flight, and from there back to UK.”
Interrogation in Amsterdam Schipol, Holland
“As soon we landed and came out of the plane 4 armed men were waiting for us. It was the Schiphol airport in Holland and the men were policemen. They took us three specifically, they checked our passports. They were waiting for three men and had our name cards. So we went with them at least we felt more comfortable with them. This was Europe much closer to home. So we trusted them with our passports and did not ask many questions. We just said if you want to make sure and double check, then do it. So they took us downstairs to the immigration floor. We were waiting downstairs and they had our passport doing all the checks. They called us one by one. A man came in who was the head of immigration in the airport.”
Then they were subjected to the first stage of actual interrogation. In Tanzania officers questioned them through the cell taking notes, but it was more informal questioning. It was in the airport that each was called individually to an interrogation room. His friend was first and then Mohammed was called:
“When my friend came back in the room Nick wanted to see me, so I went in. There was this main guy in immigration. Two other men were also in the room. One was Fernando and the other was Nick. He said to me, “Mohammed you have to enter this cell now and my colleagues Nick and Fernando are going to ask you some questions.” I said that what if I do not want to enter the cell. He said, “Well you are not under arrest to be honest”. Then Nick stood up and started saying that we will let you know, we will let you know just enter the cell. He spoke in a cockney accent as if he was from back home. So we entered the cell and all three of us sat down. He introduced himself and his colleague. He said this is Fernando from Dutch intelligence. I thought ok. And then he said I am Nick from MI5. When he said that I thought wow! I can’t believe it. Am I so special? First I got spotted down and now MI5. This is a major thing. He said to me, “Mohammed not many people get to speak to MI5 so consider yourself lucky.” Like this was a major joke. Then he asked me to introduce myself. I said, “My name is Mohammed. I live in west London. I have just finished my degree so we booked our holiday and came here.” He asked me to tell him about my holiday plan. He asked me to start off from the beginning as how we reached here and everything. As we told you early on that we booked the train from that to ferry and from ferry to the plane. So I told him everything. So he said ok and did exactly the same thing as he did to my friend, in that he took out a map. I remember the map was labelled as East Africa. It was only for those areas. So he took out the map, slammed it on the table and said ok tell me now where were you going.
So he pointed to the map and said ok this is Tanzania and tell me where you were going. I said, “no, this is east Africa and I pointed out towards Tanzania and said this is Tanzania and this is where I was going as my ticket says departure 22nd of May and return on the 21st of June. So he said where else did you want to go? I said to him, “well I have not bought any other ticket. This is the only ticket I booked. Do you know if I have booked any other ticket? This is the only ticket I have going to and coming back from Tanzania. That is it.” He said to me, “no, I think you are lying and you wanted to go to Somalia.” And I just looked at him and said, “why the hell would I want to go to Somalia, where a civil war is going on?” he asked me that how did I know that there is a civil war in Somalia. I asked him if he reads the news or not? Did he not have a TV at home? I said to him that I had a TV at home which tells me that there is a civil war in Somalia so why would I choose to go there? And then I said to him, “Nick my friend, look! In the map there is Tanzania and above that is Kenya and then above that is Somalia. How would I have crossed Kenya to go to Somalia? It is a totally different country.” He just got baffled and then he said that oh, you might have someone in Tanzania to take you over there. I asked him that who I would have there. I have no relation over there, I do not know anyone. I did not know anyone in Amsterdam either. I said to him that it was a holiday and you do not go to places for holiday where only you know people. Whatever you do, wherever you go it is all part of holiday and it stays there. That is how I felt. Then he said that at the end of the day they had been following us and watching us closely. I told him that it was news to me and I had no idea about it. He knew everything about me; where I lived, what I did, the people I hanged around with. He also believed that I was lying and I wanted to go to Somalia. Then he made a face and said, “I am going out of the cell now and by the time I come back, I want you to think about what do you want to say to us.” I said to him that before you go out you have to tell me that what you want from me. He said that he wanted the truth. I said, “Bloody hell! I just told you what was our plan and where were we going and you still think that I am lying. What do you want from us?” he pointed out his finger at me and said to me, “Don’t try to play smart and lie on my face. Don’t try to fool me. YOU WANTED TO GO TO SOMALIA.” I said to him that I have just shown you my ticket for going to Tanzania. Now the argument had started going back and forth, same thing again and again, like in a circle. He just wanted to force it out of my mouth that I intended to go to Somalia. But I stood firm and maintained that I had no reason to go to Somalia. I was in Tanzania, how could I force enter into Kenya? How could have we managed that. So eventually he said ok, go Mohammed. He wanted my phone number before letting me go. He said that he was going to keep in touch and call me regularly. He even said that he would try to visit me. But I refused and told him that I did not want him to pay me a visit. He again said that he was going to keep a check on me and keep a close track of all my activities. It was like a threat. Then I was let go and went back to the immigration office with my friends…”
But after Mohammed explained how he planned only to go on holiday with the logical points set out above, and even his clothes showed how he was only prepared for this, the MI5 agent drifted away from accusing him of terrorism. He moved to courting him to work for the MI5. Mohammed recalled exactly what was said to him:
“Listen Mohammed: You’ve got the whole world in front of you; you’re 21 years old; you just finished Uni – why don’t you work for us?”
All this was said in front of the Dutch Intelligence officer. He asked Mohammed to help them out, telling him that this was an opportunity for him – not a lot of people got to meet MI5.
Of course this offer did not go down well with Mohammed who just been accused of being a terrorist, and lost his time, money and holiday because of these intelligence officers, told them he would not work for them and that, being a normal person, there was nothing he could even help them with.
At this, the MI5 agent’s tone became much more disturbing. He began speaking of freedom and Mohammed responded,
“I’m free, if I’m not going to work with you it doesn’t mean I’m going to go to prison does it?” While assuring him that he would not go to prison for this, he issued a threat letting him know:
“You’re going to have a lot of trouble ...you’re going to be known...you’re going to be followed...life will be harder for you.”
After going through what he had just gone through, Mohammed was shocked to hear this from his own government and decided to just ignore whatever the agent said to him.
The last Mohammed received from the agent was his number on a piece of paper and the words,
“we’ll see you in London mate”.
The other two friends went through a similar interrogation with the same questions and offer to work for them.
The three were made to then book their own tickets back to the UK and were taken to the ferry.
Dover, United Kingdom and Returning Home
Upon reaching Dover, the three were stopped again – just as Mohammed was warned. Suited men claiming to be from the Anti-Terror Unit were waiting at the doors, though they didn’t show any identification. Each of the friends were escorted by two officers and taken to individual rooms in the port. Their bags were searched again, and then the main interrogation began which lasted a couple of hours.
In a room similarly laid out as in Holland, Mohammed was questioned by two anti-terror officers about his thoughts regarding 7/7 and 9/11, where he prayed, who his friends were, and the same questions asked by the MI5 agent in Holland claiming that they had information Mohammed wanted to go to Somalia. Having nothing to hide, he answered them all.
Then, in what came as a complete shock to Mohammed and revealing the sinister intentions of the officers, he was told that, “oh by the way Mohammed, we spoke to your fiancée” – they had paid her a visit. At this Mohammed was left speechless. However, he soon realised, and pointed out, that the intelligence officers actually knew that his plans never involved Somalia and that he always intended to return and get married to the sister in Kuwait. Also he realised that intelligence officers were listening to his phone calls before he even planned his holiday. When Mohammed challenged them regarding listening to his private conversations one of the officers casually shrugged his shoulders saying
“well that’s part of our job mate”.
This contact with Mohammed’s fiancée had the effect of scaring her and her family from him – the marriage was off.
As soon as we came out of the ship they took us for the questioning and we thought that it is going to be another long meeting. They took me to a room, sat me down and introduced themselves. There were two of them from terrorism police and one was called David. So they started asking question and asked about the same things as Nick from MI5 had asked in Amsterdam. The first one was where did I start my journey from. So I told him everything about it. After a long 20 minute conversation about my journey, he started getting personal. He started saying the same things as Nick that we have been watching you closely. So I said to him that I must be special then if you were watching me so closely. I also asked the reason for this “special favour”? He said that we think that you wanted to go to Somalia to participate in terrorist activities and to get some training. So I told him that Tanzania is here and Somalia is all the way up there and then there is Kenya in between, same as I had told Nick. I told him that he had got all this was messed up. I had just finished university and just wanted to have some holidays with my friends. Then he told me that they went to my house and had spoken to my mother and father. I told him that he had no right to do that. So he said that why had I not told my parents that I was going to Somalia? I said if I had told them about my holiday they would not have been very happy. They would have said stay and help us out but I wanted to enjoy myself. But I told him it was none of his business. He said that they have even spoken to a certain person; this was the person I was going to get married to. I said that how on earth had they known about her. They even said the sister’s name. He said that all of this was a part of their job. I asked him was it his job to go through my phonebook and listen to my phone calls. This is the only way they could have known about her. I had not known them before or met them so how else would they know. When I suggested that he laughed, shrugged his shoulders and said that was his job. I was absolutely shocked that they had gone to see the sister and her family and had asked personal questions about me. Then they searched me and my bag. They went through the entire luggage. I told them their colleagues had already searched our luggage, in their own words, 10/12 thousand times so why were they searching it again. They had no answer. I had dropped my hands and they kept on searching through all the pockets. I had a green proper safari style jacket, which was the reason that I had brought it with me. But he took out the jacket and said to me, “this jacket looks like a bit military, Mohammed.” I started laughing and asked how he could even suggest that it was military, what he was trying to prove. I had another jumper, a stylish Rocawear jumper, so I asked him what about this jumper. Was he not going to make any comment about that? He fell silent then. So after some more questions asked me if I was going training. I told him that I did not want to do any such things. However I asked him for his details. I told him that when I go back to London and I will speak to my solicitors, then he would want to know who on earth he was. But he said that he could not show me his badge. I felt stuck. I did not know what to do. The door was shut and I just wanted to walk out of the room. The guy could not show his badge; I did not know what was going on, it all seemed a big joke. How could I be treated like that? I am a British citizen and my government was threatening me and throwing allegations at me. So I just stood quiet and waited for them to finish checking my belongings. All my stuff was on the floor, as soon as they finished they told me to pack up my stuff and go. So I packed my bag, went outside and sat with my friend and together we waited for our other friend.”
“Right at the end of our interview, when I was packing my bag he said to me that he was going to ask me some serious questions now. I told him it was fine by me. But he said that he wanted to ask these face to face so I should finish my packing first. I thought that it must be something serious so it should be done with soon. So I finished my packing and sat down. When I was face to face he said to me, “Mohammed, what do you think of 7/7?” I thought he wanted to see my instant reaction so I told him that it was nothing else but extremism. Then he said, “ok and what do you think of war in Afghanistan?” I said, “What do I think! We see innocent people being killed in news daily.” Then he asked me what I thought of 9/11. I said to him that whatever happened was not right and if it was in my hands to bring all those lives back, I would have. What happened was wrong. Then he asked me of my opinion about Jews, just he had asked others. I told him that it was their religion and every one had a right to have his own belief. I can’t force anyone. He wanted to know about my background, my aqeedah (creed). I told him this is how Islam works. We do not force anyone to come into our religion and I told him whatever has been happening around us, the bombing etc all this is from extremism. After all of this he came back to the same point and said I still believe that you were going Somalia to get trained. I said to him , “after hearing what I just told him and clearly voicing my views are you still suggesting that I am an extremist?” then he started saying this and that and he said that they had been keeping a close eye on me and kept threatening.”
He was asked many other questions, but being back in the UK, he became more comfortable in demanding his rights.
Eventually the three friends were given their luggage and allowed to go free, albeit without any money and any means to get home – something that the anti-terror police did not care much about.
After managing to collect enough change to return home, Mohammed explained to his family what had happened. At this his father informed him they had been visited while he was away in Tanzania (most probably either by anti-terror police or MI5 agents) – meaning that they knew he was in Tanzania and picked this time to make the visit. They fed lies to his family, claiming to be concerned about Mohammed – that he may be a terrorist. Then they moved onto his younger brother, who was 14 at the time, telling his father to watch out for him as he goes to such and such place (naming a normal youth club he went to, which was actually established with the purpose of keeping children off the streets and out of trouble).
his was all an attempt to get his family scared, to make them panic. And with them not knowing the best of English, the plan succeeded. Mohammed’s father even made his younger son stop going to the youth club.
A couple of weeks later, in September, his family presented the idea of Mohammed going to stay in Kuwait with his father’s family to avoid being further harassed in the UK; so later that month he left.
http://cageuk.org/article/youre-going-be-followedlife-will-be-harder-you-story-mohammed-emwazi