Surat An-Nasr, Non-Muslims What Do you think

[SATalha]

I just want to pose a question to our non-Muslim friends about this Verse in the Quran:

"When there comes the help of Allah (to you, O Muhammed against your enemies) and the conquest (of Makkah)

And you see that the people that the people enter Allahs religion (Islam) in crowds.

So glorify the praises of your Lord and ask His forgiveness. Varily, He is the One who ever accepts the repentance and Who Forgives."

Surat An-Nasr (The Help)


What do you think of this Verse in relation to today?

Are people comming to the Religion of Allah (Islam) in crowds?

Why do you think that there is this attraction to Islam?

It would help me greatly if you can answer these Questions please.

Salaam

 

[guyabano]

There is no more, no less attraction to Islam, than all the centuries ago. I prefer to use the word 'Religion Shifting'. Still, the reason why Islam is so fast growing nowadays is the birth rate in Africa.
Life in industrialized west countries became so expensive, that both life-partners MUST work in order to be able to finance a house. On the other side, places for kindergardens get less and less, so people prefer not to have children ergo no important birth growth.
Now, since China is growing so fast actually to become a new world power, it might be, that in 100 years, people will go towards buddishm, Taoism, or whatever. It has always been like that, and it will always be.

 

[SATalha]

There is no more, no less attraction to Islam, than all the centuries ago. I prefer to use the word 'Religion Shifting'. Still, the reason why Islam is so fast growing nowadays is the birth rate in Africa.
Life in industrialized west countries became so expensive, that both life-partners MUST work in order to be able to finance a house. On the other side, places for kindergardens get less and less, so people prefer not to have children ergo no important birth growth.
Now, since China is growing so fast actually to become a new world power, it might be, that in 100 years, people will go towards buddishm, Taoism, or whatever. It has always been like that, and it will always be.

religion shifting you say? Why hasnt Islam been shifted with something else? Do you not think that the attraction has increased. Especialy in the west. And what about the amount of people that are reverting in the West? this is a modernised part of the globe aint it? Cant blame birth rate there can you.

 

[Abu Zakariya]

This chapter in the Qur'an is actually a reference to the death of the Prophet (sall Allahu 'alayhi wa sallam).

This was revealed to him when the Arabs started converting to Islam and it was also informing him of his death that was soon to come. And to put the last verse into practice, he used to increase in his glorification of God and seeking His forgiveness. One example is, and this is recommended for every Muslim to do as well, he used to say this in ruku' and sujud (this is said after Subhana Rabbiyal Adhim and Subhana Rabbiyal A'laa respectively):

Subhanak Allahumma Rabbana wabihamdik. Allahumaghfirli.

You are Glorified (Perfect and far removed from any faults), oh God. Our Lord, to You is all Perfect Praise and Thanks. Oh God, forgive me.

 

[Fishman]

religion shifting you say? Why hasnt Islam been shifted with something else? Do you not think that the attraction has increased. Especialy in the west. And what about the amount of people that are reverting in the West? this is a modernised part of the globe aint it? Cant blame birth rate there can you.

I don't actually think that the conversions in the west will have a major impact on demography. They probably are not any more common than conversions to Bhuddism and other eastern religions which are popular in the west, and in the near-future I think that the make-up of western Islam will remain mainly composed of the decendants of immigrants.
On the other hand, conversions to Islam are a major demographic force in the African-American community. Unfortunately racist cults such as NOI soak up most of these conversions.

 

[abu abdurrahman]

Now, since China is growing so fast actually to become a new world power, it might be, that in 100 years, people will go towards buddishm, Taoism, or whatever. It has always been like that, and it will always be.

Or maybe they will come towards Islaam?! May Allah guide them and you. Seeing as China is growing so fast and a recent survey (Shanghai University) shows that there are an estimated 300 Million Muslims in China.

 

[guyabano]

religion shifting you say? Why hasnt Islam been shifted with something else? Do you not think that the attraction has increased. Especialy in the west. And what about the amount of people that are reverting in the West? this is a modernised part of the globe aint it? Cant blame birth rate there can you.

I'm not blaming birth rate, I just say, you cannot really proof which religion is fast growing, and which ones not. It's status quo, and this topic has been discussed many many times in this forum.
Oh, but why am I repeating myself all the time. See here by yourself

Then again, you can see also here (christian Website) contreverse website to what you say

According again to another website (which I just pick out and oh, coincidence, a Muslim Website) we can see, Islam is again fastgrowing.

So, fact is, we stand there where we always stand, nothing changed

 

[Whatsthepoint]

Or maybe they will come towards Islaam?! May Allah guide them and you. Seeing as China is growing so fast and a recent survey (Shanghai University) shows that there are an estimated 300 Million Muslims in China.

No, no, no, you got it all wrong. The study showed that there are an estimated 300 million believers in China, which includes buddhists, taoists, catholics, other christians and muslims. The number of muslims varies from 20 to 60 million, most of which are ethnic minorites, not converts/reverts.
The fastest growing religions in China is Christianity, not Islam.

 

[SATalha]

I'm not blaming birth rate, I just say, you cannot really proof which religion is fast growing, and which ones not. It's status quo, and this topic has been discussed many many times in this forum.
Oh, but why am I repeating myself all the time. See here by yourself

Then again, you can see also here (christian Website) contreverse website to what you say

According again to another website (which I just pick out and oh, coincidence, a Muslim Website) we can see, Islam is again fastgrowing.

So, fact is, we stand there where we always stand, nothing changed

Ok I see your point, but do you aknowledge that the West is comming to Islam? And whats your take on Islam superseeding all ways of life? Iam not saying "watch this will happen". What I am saying is that do you think that there is a slight chance the Islam will be more dominant in say Europe?

I know there have been many articles and reports on this subject, I just need other (non-Muslims) peoples views.

 

[NYCmuslim]

I find it interesting how many Americans converted to Islam after 9/11 because they wanted to study and find out about this "religion of terror." I guess they weren't expecting what they found out.

 

[Gator]

What do you think of this Verse in relation to today? Not too much.

Are people comming to the Religion of Allah (Islam) in crowds? I would think that crowds as used in the verse would be much larger than the current growth of Islam.

Why do you think that there is this attraction to Islam? Islam, like most other religions, offers it answers and a way of life for those seeking those things that fit their beliefs.
It would help me greatly if you can answer these Questions please.

Salaam

Answers above.

Thanks.

 

[جوري]

20,000 americans yearly actually according to American news sources
http://news.propeller.com/story/2007/01/08/angela-collins-truns-to-islam/

turn to islam yearly. I'd say those numbers are staggering but that is just me..

carry on

cheers!

 

[guyabano]

Ok I see your point, but do you aknowledge that the West is comming to Islam? And whats your take on Islam superseeding all ways of life? Iam not saying "watch this will happen". What I am saying is that do you think that there is a slight chance the Islam will be more dominant in say Europe?

I know there have been many articles and reports on this subject, I just need other (non-Muslims) peoples views.

No, I'm sorry. I don't see more or less progress of Islam than 30 years ago. To be honest, in my place, there are maybe a few muslims on 30km radius, not more or less, than usually. Most Muslims here in the Forum come from UK, where are many muslims, so you get the feeling, they get more and more.
It is good, Islam make itself more public. Not only Christanity has a right to exist and plus, we should never neglect the power of Buddism since they are (numerous seen) also very powerful.
A fact is, that many people leave Christianity actually, but that does not automatically mean, that Islam gain them all.

 

[czgibson]

Greetings,

Ok I see your point, but do you aknowledge that the West is comming to Islam?

I haven't seen any evidence for this, so I don't know. However, religious statistics are notoriously an absolute minefield. If you want to see how confusing they are, spend a little time at this site.

And whats your take on Islam superseeding all ways of life? Iam not saying "watch this will happen".

I hope it doesn't happen, for many reasons.

What I am saying is that do you think that there is a slight chance the Islam will be more dominant in say Europe?

[More dominant than what?]

I don't think Islam will ever become dominant in Europe, either intellectually or politically. Far too many things would have to change:

* The legal and financial systems would have to be completely overhauled or even built again from scratch;

* democratic politics, for centuries the pride of Europe and elsewhere, would suddenly have to undergo a dramatic fall in mass acceptance, before being scrapped;

* scientific research would have to be limited to within Islamically acceptable areas (and would therefore no longer be science);

* much of modern biology as we know it would have to be discarded (unless evolution became more widely accepted in the Muslim community);

* philosophers and other intellectuals would have to ignore centuries of progress made in the history of ideas;

* the alcohol, pork and music industries would somehow have to be persuaded to disappear.

There are obviously lots of other things that would need to change, but those are the ones I can think of now. Can you honestly see these things happening? I can't.

Peace

 

[IbnAbdulHakim]

lol czgibson statistics arent really needed that much

i mean these days i say salaam to at least 20 muslims i dont even know per day... :uuh:

observation is enough

 

[Pk_#2]

Greetings,


I haven't seen any evidence for this, so I don't know. However, religious statistics are notoriously an absolute minefield. If you want to see how confusing they are, spend a little time at this site.



I hope it doesn't happen, for many reasons.


[More dominant than what?]

I don't think Islam will ever become dominant in Europe, either intellectually or politically. Far too many things would have to change:

* The legal and financial systems would have to be completely overhauled or even built again from scratch;

* democratic politics, for centuries the pride of Europe and elsewhere, would suddenly have to undergo a dramatic fall in mass acceptance, before being scrapped;

* scientific research would have to be limited to within Islamically acceptable areas (and would therefore no longer be science);

* much of modern biology as we know it would have to be discarded (unless evolution became more widely accepted in the Muslim community);

* philosophers and other intellectuals would have to ignore centuries of progress made in the history of ideas;

* the alcohol, pork and music industries would somehow have to be persuaded to disappear.

There are obviously lots of other things that would need to change, but those are the ones I can think of now. Can you honestly see these things happening? I can't.

Peace

Yah mate Quit bein' silly.

Who eats pork these days,

Not very appetizing. ffended: No offence bro.

 

[Abu Zakariya]

I think that you have painted up some kind of horror scenario czgibson, with some element of truth to some of what you say.

* The legal and financial systems would have to be completely overhauled or even built again from scratch;

This is really hard to tell unless you are an expert in both the Western and Islamic system. One of the recent recipients of the King Faisal award was recognised for his work in the area of economy in Islam, where he had a system of Islamic banking which worked and was succesful whilst still in conformity with modern banking transactions.

* democratic politics, for centuries the pride of Europe and elsewhere, would suddenly have to undergo a dramatic fall in mass acceptance, before being scrapped;

Again, unless you are an expert in how the Islamic system works you aren't really qualified to tell whether or not this would have to be the case. Read this article to learn about one scholarly opinion on democracy in Islam:

http://www.islamtoday.com/showme2.cfm?cat_id=29&sub_cat_id=734

* scientific research would have to be limited to within Islamically acceptable areas (and would therefore no longer be science);

What areas are Islamically unacceptable? I've never heard of some areas that are unacceptable unless you are speaking of things like stem cell reasearch which, I think, Muslim scholars object to but I fail to see how avoding such an area would disqualifiy every other scientific work conducted in a Muslim society from being science.

* much of modern biology as we know it would have to be discarded (unless evolution became more widely accepted in the Muslim community);

So you think that scientists in the Muslim world have a completely different approach to biology? The only different thing would be how they interpret the data from an Islamic point of view. The way one collects data and does scientific research doesn't change.

* philosophers and other intellectuals would have to ignore centuries of progress made in the history of ideas;

There are plenty of ideas that are Islamically acceptable and don't need to be tossed aside. Not every single political philosohpy is implemented in Western states, nor is every single philosophical idea accepted. This doesn't mean that the the progress made in the history of ideas is therefore ignored as a whole.

the alcohol, pork and music industries would somehow have to be persuaded to disappear.

Unless every single person in the West becomes a Muslim, there will still be non-Muslim communities and the above isn't forbidden to them. Why would they want to stop drinking alcohol, eating pork and listening to music?

 

[Gator]

20,000 americans yearly actually according to American news sources
http://news.propeller.com/story/2007/01/08/angela-collins-truns-to-islam/

turn to islam yearly. I'd say those numbers are staggering but that is just me..

carry on

cheers!

I guess its in the eye of the beholder.

From my view, its just at that rate (20K a year), Islam will constitute 5% of the US population by the year 2407, even with the most aggresive current population estimates.

 

[Isambard]

Not a big fan of "coversion rates". From my own perspectives, I see alot of so called 'religious folks' are actually deists or agnostics. Seeing as how that is almost impossibile to measure and there seems to be greater and greater numbers (at least 90% of my school and other post secondardys) imho, the conversion rates of sqewed.

Besides, who cares if a great many of Americans are doing anything? Historically speaking, when a large number of Americans have gotten together and its been promoted in the hopes of attracting more, its usually been a very bad thing. lol

 

[جوري]

I guess its in the eye of the beholder.

From my view, its just at that rate (20K a year), Islam will constitute 5% of the US population by the year 2407, even with the most aggresive current population estimates.

Guess will have to wait and see.. under either circumstance, it is all inconsequential at best. righteousness by virtue of being pious is a solo trip not a communal one, even if you have others to accompany you on your journey. Abrahaem PBUH was an Island, he and his cousin Lut were the only two monotheists in a sea of idolatry.
in the scheme of things, each soul is held in pledge by its own deeds!

cheers!