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Thread: Turkey protesters hold Istanbul square after days of violent clashes
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Roasted Cashew

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Residents of Turkey's largest city awoke Sunday to scenes of rain-soaked municipal workers and volunteer activists cleaning up the garbage left after days of violent clashes and angry demonstrations against the government.

Demonstrators remained in control of Taksim Square after Turkish security forces abandoned the district Saturday following 36 hours of vicious clashes.

Protesters erected makeshift barricades at the entrance to the square, which holds huge symbolic importance for Turkey's leftist political parties and labor movement.

Throughout Friday and Saturday, this bustling neighborhood was a battleground as riot police used water cannons, tear gas, pepper spray and armored personnel carriers to prevent protesters from entering this transit and commercial hub at the heart of the city. Saturday afternoon, police withdrew after firing several last volleys of tear gas at crowds, sending thousands of screaming people fleeing for cover.

Police continued to clash with demonstrators in other districts of Istanbul as well as in the capital, Ankara, late Saturday night.
Turkish authorities said more than 900 people have been detained and scores injured in protests and clashes in 30 of Turkey's 81 provinces over the past four days.

What began as a small sit-in to protest against the government's plan to demolish a park in Taksim Square has swelled to the biggest protest movement against Turkey's prime minister since Recep Tayyip Erdogan was elected more than 10 years ago. The crowds have been chanting "Tayyip resign" and "shoulder to shoulder against fascism."

In a televised speech on Sunday, Erdogan remained defiant.
"I ask in the name of God, Tayyip Erdogan is a dictator? If you are the kind of person who can call someone who serves their people a dictator then I have no words for you," Erdogan said.

He went on to praise his accomplishments overseeing a decade of unprecedented economic growth in Turkey. He also defended his record as a leader who has planted many trees.

"They are putting on airs saying we massacre trees," he said. "We have planted approximately 2 billion trees."
But many of the demonstrators say their anger is no longer directed against the proposed government plan to demolish Gezi Park, the last green space in central Istanbul.

"This park was just the ignition of all that," said Yakup Efe Tuncay, a 28-year old demonstrator who carried a Turkish flag while walking through the park Saturday. "The Erdogan government is usually considered as authoritarian. He has a big ego; he has this Napoleon syndrome. He takes himself as a sultan. ... He needs to stop doing that. He's just a prime minister."
The scope of the protests shows there is a bigger issue, about freedom of speech and accusations of authoritative government.
"People are entitled to disagreement with the government, they can exercise their democratic rights, but they can do so within the context of a democratic society," Erdogan's chief adviser, Ibrahim Kalin, said Saturday.
International human rights groups Amnesty International and Greenpeace have denounced what they describe as excessive use of police force against peaceful protesters.

A spokesman for EU foreign policy chief Catherine Ashton issued a statement that said Ashton "regrets disproportionate use of force by members of the Turkish police." Ashton also called for talks between the two sides.

Source:http://edition.cnn.com/2013/06/02/world/europe/turkey-protests/index.html?hpt=hp_t1
 
expected now that their debt is paid and he'd like to bring back Islam, the attaturks and the west won't leave him alone, small price to pay for an islamic awakening!
 
Roasted Cashew said:
Residents of Turkey's largest city awoke Sunday to scenes of rain-soaked municipal workers and volunteer activists cleaning up the garbage left after days of violent clashes and angry demonstrations against the government.
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:sl:

These demonstrators should clean up their own mess.
 
The ones who are protesting now are rebels, they dont agree with erdogan banning alcohol and the 'islamisation' of turkey. Well turkey is a islamic country, majority muslims, wouldnt it be wise to apply some islamic laws then? I certainly dont agree with erdogan's alliance with NATO and israel but this is just bullcrap what these protestors are doing. If they want to be secular then go to the west. If they want to have 'freedom' go emigrate to the west. No secularism anymore in our muslim countries! The law of Allah(SWT) will prevail on this dunya! May Allah(SWT) help the believers in estabilishing HIS law on this earth. Ameen
 
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I don't know that much about Turkey, but isn't the nation over 90% Muslim? Isn't the figure more like 98%? I find this whole thing very confusing. It seems that the protesters are accusing the government of acting in a way that is suppressing free speech and freedom of assembly, but I wonder are any of these sentiments are being echoed within the Islamic community? If not, then it seems as if the protesters are a very small minority. Also, the government's response to the protests looks pretty typical, and by the standards of some Western nations it has been quite mild. Unfortunately, it is not uncommon for protesters to be savagely beaten by authorities during peaceful demonstrations here in America. And, if I'm not mistaken, the Turkish government hasn't enacted any type of martial law, or placed restrictions on social media and internet access.

I'm not taking sides, because I'm far too ignorant of the situation to do so, but the protesters aren't looking too good from this angle. For now, I give my support to a young woman named Ayse Duygu, who was quoted in a New York Times article titled Turkish Leader Says Protests Will Not Stop Plans for Park. She said, "I'm not here for politics, I just want to clean up my city, which these hooligans destroyed."
 
the_stranger said:
It seems that the protesters are accusing the government of acting in a way that is suppressing free speech and freedom of assembly, but I wonder are any of these sentiments are being echoed within the Islamic community? If not, then it seems as if the protesters are a very small minority.
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The flashpoint for the protests was, somewhat bizarrely, a government plan to concrete over one of Istanbul's few remaining central parks. But when you consider that what they want to build there is a barracks, then it might appear to look a little more authoritarian...

The bigger issue is that Erdogan is currently seeking to increase the powers of the Presidency to control the army, over-rule Parliament etc. And guess what? It is likely that he himself will stand for the presidency later in the year. It resembles Putin's tactics in Russia, when he sought to extend his power beyond the permitted terms of office by giving power to the presidency and reducing the prime minister into a proxy. Democracy gives leaders power - but then they want to burn the bridges behind them so that no one else can use to democracy to take their power away from them.

http://www.economist.com/blogs/charlemagne/2013/06/turkish-politics

Turkey is overwhelmingly Muslim but the country is split almost 50-50 between conservatives and modernisers. This protest is certainly big, as this BBC report describes:

"I have covered Syntagma, the Occupy protests and reported from Tahrir Square. This is different to all of them. First, it is massive. The sheer numbers dwarf any single episode of civil unrest in Greece. Second, the breadth of social support - within the urban enclave of Istanbul - is bigger than Greece and closer to Egypt. "Everyone is here - except the AK party," insists one young woman. People nod. In Greece, the urban middle class was split. Here the secular middle class are out in force, united across political divisions, to say nothing of football hatreds."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-22752121
 
Independent said:
The bigger issue is that Erdogan is currently seeking to increase the powers of the Presidency to control the army, over-rule Parliament etc.
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This is interesting. If this is what the protests are about, then I would be right there with them if I could. Here in the States, our Executive branch is still in the process of completing an unprecedented power-grab that began in the Bush terms. Sadly, most Americans are too busy updating their Facebook status to pay attention when their civil liberties are being taken away.

But, is this the sole motivation behind the protests, or is this a way of legitimizing anti-Islamic sentiments? This is not meant to be an antagonistic question, I'm genuinely curious. It's hard to tell what the spirit of the protest is from this side of the planet. I noticed in the BBC article, which is quite informative btw, that protesters are expressing unease about "creeping Islamisation." This is where I get lost. I would imagine that the vast majority of the population would support some Islam based legislation. But, again, I'm about 6,000 miles away, so I can only speculate.
 
the_stranger said:
But, is this the sole motivation behind the protests, or is this a way of legitimizing anti-Islamic sentiments?
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The protests were spontaneous and totally unexpected by anyone. As in other Arab Spring episodes, they seem to have been triggered by youtube videos of excessive police force against what was, in the first place, a modest environmental protest.

As for your wider question - the issue is not whether or not Turkey should be a predominately Muslim country, that's a given. However, roughly half of the population prefer a separation of church and state and a more relaxed form of Islamic culture, whereas the other half want to move to a higher degree of religious influence in governance. Some would presumably support full sharia law although even Erdogan hasn't said this is his target.

The heritage of Kemal Ataturk is central to this argument, you might want to google him.
 
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Independent said:
The protests were spontaneous and totally unexpected by anyone.
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Nope in fact everyone including govt. Officials declared that they were very organized & purposeful. They're nothing more than the children of attaturk not wanting economic up rise or anything Islamic. Ordogan already said if they'll play that game he too can send out protesters but the whole thing is comical especially when they protest with beer bottles in front of them!
Not sure where you come up with your percentages otherwise and really don't care. We're talking the Ottomans here :ia: it will return a khilafah as it is the promise of :Allah::swt:
''''
 
Independent said:
The heritage of Kemal Ataturk is central to this argument, you might want to google him.
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Yeah, I'll make sure I learn more about him.

I wonder if Erdogan is using the prospect of an increasingly Islamic state to distract attention from this increase in power you spoke of. Governments have used this kind of sleight of hand before. Like when the Bush administration capitalized on the events of 9/11 to pass the Patriot Act without anyone batting an eyelash.

Is Erdogan using Islam to push his agenda?
 
the_stranger said:
Is Erdogan using Islam to push his agenda?
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Along with attaturk, please read about the military rule in Turkey and how the previous 'Erdogans' were hung if they brought anything remotely Islamic to the scene, all there is, is that they're trying to set him back to ground zero:

Adnan Menderes google him too!
captureejg.jpg


my sincere advise to you is not to take your info. from kaffirs, they'll always distort it, give you half truths or full lies for their own agenda.

:w:
 
العنود;1585891 said:
Adnan Menderes google him too!
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I surely will research him as well.

Like I mentioned earlier, I admit my ignorance of Turkish affairs and history. Right now, I'm at a point where I just want to collect information and hear different points of view before I can form my own educated opinion.
 
the_stranger said:
I surely will research him as well.

Like I mentioned earlier, I admit my ignorance of Turkish affairs and history. Right now, I'm at a point where I just want to collect information and hear different points of view before I can form my own educated opinion.
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khyer :ia: let me give a few upshots:

was the first democratically elected Turkish Prime Minister between 1950–1960.

e was hanged by the military junta after the 1960 coup d'état, along with two other cabinet members, Fatin Rüştü Zorlu and Hasan Polatkan. He was the last Turkish political leader to be executed after a military coup .
was more tolerant towards traditional lifestyles and different forms of practice of Islam than Atatürk and his party had been[SUP][citation needed][/SUP] – he campaigned in the 1950 elections almost exclusively on the platform of legalizing the Arabic language Islamic call to prayer (adhan), which had been banned in order to wean Turkey from Arabic influences. He re-opened thousands of mosques across the country which had been closed down, and as such, he was blamed by his political opponents for using religion as a tool for political gain. One of his first political moves was to exclude the pictures of İsmet İnönü on Turkish banknotes and stamps and instead put Atatürk pictures back

_________________

So in fact anyone in Erdogan's position was always fought and successfully hung, attaturk like other kaffir, western brown nosing secularists (the many we have in the ME) developed a strong system in place to perpetuate their secular kaffir beliefs. Erdogan barely has any power, just made a few strides and those so-called protesters want to set him back. All we've to fear are these military juntas not the prime ministers.. Poor guy reminds me of Mursi of Egypt, it will always be one step forward and ten steps back.. that's because they're unable to change the system itself and the people are largely ignorant especially of their religion.

:w:
 
[h=1]Protests in Turkey: Will Taksim Become Erdogan’s Tahrir Square?[/h]
Protests on Istiklal Avenue, the heart of Istanbul’s shopping and entertainment district, are nothing new. Over the past year, Turks have protested against the deteriorating state of press freedoms, a reckless construction boom, a draft law placing new curbs on abortion, the government’s response to the civil war raging in neighboring Syria, the jailing of hundreds of top generals on coup charges, the arrests of thousands of Kurdish activists accused of abetting the Kurdistan Workers’ Party, which Turkey labels a terrorist group, and, most recently, new restrictions on alcohol sales.
​


But the mass protests against the moderately Islamist government of Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan that have taken place over the past two days are different. For one, they are the biggest in years. On Friday evening, thousands of people streamed down Istiklal en route to Taksim Square, where the spark that ignited the ongoing unrest was first lit, before being beaten back by police units. The following day, as police abandoned the square, even more protesters arrived, their numbers in the tens if not hundreds of thousands. Protests and clashes have since broken out in a number of other cities across Turkey, including the capital, Ankara. As of Saturday night, 939 people had been arrested and 79 wounded in 90 demonstrations around the country, according to the Ministry of the Interior. Volunteer doctors around Taksim estimated that the number of injured exceeded 1,000.


It all began on May 27 in a small park right behind Taksim, where a number of activists converged to protest plans to turn the area — one of the few green spaces in the city center — into a replica of an Ottoman barracks and shopping arcade. Over the next few days, as construction workers began uprooting trees, police repeatedly raided the sit-in, dispersing the protesters with tear gas, batons and water cannons. Images of wounded young men and women immediately began making the rounds on TV and social media, sparking wave after wave of popular outrage, as well as condemnation from human-rights groups, which decried the excessive use of tear gas against unarmed protesters.


Things reached a boiling point on Friday morning after the police raided Gezi Park once again, burning the protesters’ tents, firing more tear gas and leaving dozens injured. By the end of the day, the streets that feed into Taksim were filled to the brink. The grievances of all groups opposed to the government seemed to have rolled into one. On Istiklal Avenue, Zeynep, a 21-year-old student who had taken part in the protests from Day One, complained about the closing of state theaters, police brutality and runaway development. “We don’t need any more shopping malls, we need trees!” she shouted, her words mixing with chants calling for Prime Minister Erdogan to step down. Nearby, a pair of teenage girls accused Erdogan of restricting free speech and steering Turkey, a secular but Muslim-majority country, toward Islamic rule.


On a parallel avenue, adjacent to Tarlabasi, a poor neighborhood that had been forcibly vacated to make way for an upscale development project, the protests had devolved into violence. Banners advertising the project smoldered. A group of young men were busy tearing down metal barriers raised around the construction site of a new tunnel, parts of which were also in flames. “We’re against the park project, we’re against Tarlabasi, the killings of Kurds. Erdogan doesn’t let people breathe!” one of them yelled. “We’re against everything.” A middle-aged man standing within earshot blamed the government for meddling in Syria. “They’re sending jihadists to Syria, they’re the ones responsible for Reyhanli,” he said, referring to a May 11 car bombing in Reyhanli, a Turkish border town, which left 52 people dead. Police helicopters buzzed overhead. A young man, having removed his shirt and wrapped it around his face, pointed his hands, middle fingers outstretched, toward the sky.


On a small side street, a small group of protesters, partially sheltered by the high walls of the French consulate, were lobbing rocks at police trucks parked on the other side. At the other end of the street, near a small sushi restaurant, a young man, surrounded by others, including a female medic, lay motionless on the ground, blood seeping out of his forehead. Near him, Hasan Gumus, a bespectacled pensioner, quivered with rage. A cheap surgical mask dangled from his chin. “The police have no shame, look at what they’ve fired at me, me, a 77-year-old man,” he said, clutching an empty gas canister in his hand. “I’ll show this to my kids, my grandkids, I’ll even frame it.” He had come out to support the environmentalists, but he was fed up for a host of reasons, not least the new curbs on alcohol sales. Erdogan had justified the measure on health grounds, but opponents saw it as yet more evidence of Turkey’s creeping Islamization and the Prime Minister’s authoritarian turn. “I don’t drink alcohol,” Gumus said. “But who are you to tell me not to drink? Are you my father, my grandfather? You can’t tell me how to live.” As he finished speaking, the young man who had lain on the ground, his forehead now bandaged, struggled to rise to his feet.
In a speech on Saturday, Erdogan struck a defiant tone. The Taksim redevelopment project would go ahead, he said, referring to the protesters occupying the square as “marginal groups.” “If you gather a hundred thousand people,” he said, addressing the opposition, “I will gather a million.” It was the kind of rhetoric designed to rouse the party faithful, not to appease the protesters. As such, it was symptomatic of precisely what brought people to the streets in the first place — the arrogance of power. Within hours of Erdogan’s speech, the crowds once again descended on Taksim.
For a government that enjoys the support of nearly half the population, plus a seeming monopoly on power, and which has presided over a decade of unprecedented growth — the economy has roared ahead at an average of 5% per year since Erdogan’s ruling Justice and Development Party (AKP) took the reins in 2002 — the protests are far from a death knell. They are, however, a wake-up call. Erdogan, who cannot run for a third term as Prime Minister, is believed to be planning on being elected President in 2014, but not before using constitutional changes to endow the post with executive powers, as in the U.S. or France. The ongoing protests, more than anything that’s preceded them — including the efforts of a largely impotent political opposition — threaten to derail such plans for good.


So far, the protests have included mostly young leftists, environmentalists and secularists, all of them core government opponents, but very few religious conservatives. For Erdogan, the greatest danger is that conservative Muslims, who form the AKP’s base, will flinch at the images of police brutality and begin to join the protesters’ ranks. That may be one reason why the government has pulled police forces out of Taksim and clamped down on the media harder and more visibly than ever. Many press outlets are downplaying the protests. On Saturday, one of the country’s leading papers, owned the Prime Minister’s son-in-law, buried the story. Later that evening, as clashes between police and protesters continued around Istanbul and other cities, CNN Turk, a leading news network, aired a cooking show, plus documentaries about a 1970s novelist, dolphin training and penguins.
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I don't know why comparisons like this are getting so much hype.Protestors in Egypt worked like well oiled machine with a solid purpose while here.........
 
Independent said:
The bigger issue is that Erdogan is currently seeking to increase the powers of the Presidency to control the army, over-rule Parliament etc. And guess what? It is likely that he himself will stand for the presidency later in the year.
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May I ask the supporters of Erdogan to comment on this statement?