two party system

The only two party system I believe in is a party on Friday night and a party on Saturday night. ;D

Anyway, I've long said that the President is merely a figurehead, and that Congress has most of the power. Congress is controlled by special interest groups, which is why I think this so-called "War on Terror" was started in the first place. They're just using radical Islam as a scapegoat to justify their wars for oil.

I still support the troops for the most part. My dad was a Vietnam veteran. But I don't believe we should have gone to Iraq or Afghanistan. But we are there so the point is meaningless now.
 
Do you think Left and Right are the same direction?
 
Yes but let me point out that you don't have true Capitalism in America or anywhere in the West for that matter you have Corporatism and Fascism when Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels criticized Capitalism he should of criticized Corporatism not Capitalism Free Markets or Free Enterprise. The Democrats may support a Progressive Tax the Republicans suppprt a Flat Tax but they both believe in a man made US Constitution that can change and in man made laws that can and do change all the time for example Bill Clinton a Democrat raised taxes on the 1.2% or the top earners and on Corporations in 1993 than the Republican George Bush gets into power as President and he cuts or lower taxes for the Rich/Wealthy and the Corporations.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omnibus_Budget_Reconciliation_Act_of_1993

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jobs_and_Growth_Tax_Relief_Reconciliation_Act_of_2003
 
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truthseeker63 said:
Karl Marx criticized Capitalism he should of criticized Corporatism not Capitalism Free Markets or Free Enterprise.
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Please do tell what world famous Corporations existed in Karl Marx's time and how could one in those days obtain Financial information on anybody ?
 
To be honest I respect Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels for many of their ideas but I don't respect their Atheism anyway are you saying that Corporations did not exist back than ?
 
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truthseeker63 said:
Yes but let me point out that you don't have true Capitalism in America or anywhere in the West for that matter you have Corporatism and Fascism when Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels criticized Capitalism he should of criticized Corporatism not Capitalism Free Markets or Free Enterprise. The Democrats may support a Progressive Tax the Republicans suppprt a Flat Tax but they both believe in a man made US Constitution that can change and in man made laws that can and do change all the time for example Bill Clinton a Democrat raised taxes on the 1.2% or the top earners and on Corporations in 1993 than the Republican George Bush gets into power as President and he cuts or lower taxes for the Rich/Wealthy and the Corporations.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omnibus_Budget_Reconciliation_Act_of_1993

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jobs_and_Growth_Tax_Relief_Reconciliation_Act_of_2003
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So you think Republicans and Democrats are the same thing because they both believe in "man made laws" ? I hate to break it to you but every civilization has had a set of changing-man made laws. This is necessary to adapt with new things that might appear in societies. In any case, the policies of the Republicans and Democrats towards economic and social issues are very different and so they are two different parties.
 
Lynx said:
So you think Republicans and Democrats are the same thing because they both believe in "man made laws" ? I hate to break it to you but every civilization has had a set of changing-man made laws. This is necessary to adapt with new things that might appear in societies. In any case, the policies of the Republicans and Democrats towards economic and social issues are very different and so they are two different parties.
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The Republicans and Democrat domestic policies are different but their foreign policy is very similar.
 
I believe that anything resembling democracy requires more than two parties.
 
Agreed. The two-party system is a result of 'winner-take-all' elections where the party in power controls all the government resources. This necessarily makes winning elections the only consideration for the major parties, and makes it impossible for a 'third party' to take root unless one of the major parties self-destructs. All that matters is pleasing campaign contributors and constituents, in that order.

In a multi-party system, no party can control the country by itself, they must form coalitions. Legislation may be slower in such a system, but haste has a price.
 
truthseeker63 said:
Democrats and Republicans are also the same because they are pro Israeli.
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There's more to American politics than Israel vs. Palestine.

Lynx said:
In any case, the policies of the Republicans and Democrats towards economic and social issues are very different and so they are two different parties.
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Agreed. Left and Right are far from the same direction.

truthseeker63 said:
Yes but let me point out that you don't have true Capitalism in America or anywhere in the West for that matter you have Corporatism and Fascism when Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels criticized Capitalism he should of criticized Corporatism not Capitalism Free Markets or Free Enterprise.
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We do have capitalism, at least to some degree, and that's part of the problem with our economy.
 
A Communist economy doesn't work. We saw that with the old Soviet Union, which (IMHO) fell because their government went bankrupt trying to keep pace with the US economy of the 1980's and early 90's.

But capitalism has its flaws too, as we see now with the US economy. After the initial period of prosperity following WW2, the last decade has seen a steady decline of the US economy as consumers went crazy buying things on credit and then defaulting on loans. If this trend continues, the US too will fall just as the Soviet Union did. At the very least, the USA is a declining global empire.
 
Just a Guy said:
A Communist economy doesn't work. We saw that with the old Soviet Union, which (IMHO) fell because their government went bankrupt trying to keep pace with the US economy of the 1980's and early 90's.
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Funny, before the stagnation of the 80s, even right-wing intellectuals grumblingly conceded that Communist economics had been proven to work... ^o)

Russia has always been poorer and less developed than the West. It was so before Communism, and it is so still after it. The Cold War was rigged against it from the start.
 
And regarding the winner-takes-all election system, I certainly see no benefit in it at all compared to a proportional representation system. It effectively prevents any third parties from rising, since few will vote on someone they don't think have any chance of winning anyway and none but the winner counts.
 
Hmm, so maybe I was wrong about the Communist economic model, but the problem is still that while it looks good on paper, it never works in theory. What you always end up with is all of the wealth and power in the hands of a few individuals while the masses suffer. It ends up being more of an oligarchy than anything.

And yes, you are right about Russia being backwards. It is a pity, because the country itself has vast natural resources that could make it an economic powerhouse, but its political and social development has always lagged behind the rest of Europe.
 
Just a Guy said:
Hmm, so maybe I was wrong about the Communist economic model, but the problem is still that while it looks good on paper, it never works in theory. What you always end up with is all of the wealth and power in the hands of a few individuals while the masses suffer. It ends up being more of an oligarchy than anything.
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I think you mean it never works in practice. That's only because the individuals who tried to implement it became too power-hungry. Marxist communism is a brilliant economic theory, in my opinion. Now, what about socialism? I prefer socialism to capitalism because in capitalism people are left out. Socialism includes everyone and every citizen is given a fair chance at success. Economic success, that is.
 
Just_A_Girl13 said:
I think you mean it never works in practice. That's only because the individuals who tried to implement it became too power-hungry. Marxist communism is a brilliant economic theory, in my opinion. Now, what about socialism? I prefer socialism to capitalism because in capitalism people are left out. Socialism includes everyone and every citizen is given a fair chance at success. Economic success, that is.
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Yes, in practice is what I meant. Thanks, sister.
 
It's absurd to point to history as "proof" of Communism (or any other system) not working. Has any system been tried in all of the infinite number of possible ways you could implement it?

Capitalism took thousands of years to develop into its current efficient form, doing much trial and error and fooling around in the process. Communism was never allowed the same grace period, but was instantly thrust into a competition that was rigged against it. Still, it produced a few resounding economic successes that serve as proof of concept, such as Tito's Yugoslavia and Stalin's ludicrously fast industrialization of the Soviet Union.
 

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