Women in Prison..check this out

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Sisters I am by your side Inshallah don't let you hopes down

I don't believe a women should be killed in Islam no matter what she does and thats because it tells us in the quran not to kill women children or the elderly.

Why because men kill for envy and women kill for reasons, not saying that reason is legitimate but yah if she gets a divorce she will also be killed sooner or later or lives in fear of the possibility he will kill. When a man kills he has a gut feeling to slaughter style with all confidence, when a women kills she is shaky and shivering still in rejection why because the poor women wouldnt kill a thing but in this case if the man harms the children or molests them yah he should be killed.
 
The women is a mother she loves her children more than the world she has special status in Islam, on the other hand if the man harms the children yah chop his head off how can he touch those little angels like that. Men and women are different in Islam so the difference is that women are not to be killed but yes, she did it for the protection of her children and yes that is worser than fornication and should be punished what he is having indecency with his children what a role model for the household.

On the other hand a woman is brave to chop his head off but she didnt have to do it, if it was a country living by the shariah law she could of went to the authorities responsibility but since there is no Islam and now sharian law then live in chaos what much can u say when the world is corrupt
 
I don't think it is acceptable either but I doubt that by any measure domestic abuse in America is particularly high - not compared with, say, Gaza. Sure some women end up with abusive partners, but that is a universal problem, not just an American one.

I do think domestic abuse in America is very high, generally crime rate is very high. U check the statistics.


But you are taking an extreme in America - women in prison! - and comparing that to the norm in Saudi? That's not fair.

I didnt, I was trying to say look at the condittion of women in the west, wen they r supposed to be honord n protecting n dignifid, they r left hopeless instead. I didnt compare them to the norm in Saudi. U r the one who brought the eastern n the muslim world in the picture.

Of course in your own first hand experience you are unlikely to meet women who are locked up are you? They are, after all, locked up. You can go to a wide variety of Muslim sites and hear women who say they would like to go out but their husbands will not let them unless he is there. They are not allowed to work or even to go to the Mosque. I do not know how widespread it is, but is happens.

Oh no, I do know such women, who r suffuring with abusive partners. it does happen in a very small percentage. Most femals in saudi (which is described as the home of opression) enjoy wide range of freedom.


I gather men must not stop women studying Islam but can they stop them doing everything else?


Nope men cant stop women from doing the things they like to do as long as it is withing the boundris of Islam.

Are you sure they can go out? But what if they wanted to walk down the street to a Mall? Could they do that without a male guardian being present?

Yes women in the muslim world n in saudi go out all by themselves without any male gurdian, they can walk down the street to a mall or to a beauty palour or to a toilor, wherever they want. I meet my freind in Starbucks, just me n her for like 2 hours, lots of girls do the same.
Come to saudi once, n u will be surprised.

Those people are filthy rich. And not all of them. But what about the poor Saudi women who have no drivers? I think women ought to be given choices myself.

I expect poor saudis cant offord cars in the first place, anyways they still can use cabs or buses.

How can she file for divorce?

She goes to the court n says her hubby is abusing her, present the evidence, n hope the judge will rule for her.

[/quote]
She can protest but do you agree that a woman needs to ask her husband's permission before she can work? Or go outside the home?
Nope I dont think that a woman needs to ask her husbands permission before she can work or work outside, a succesful marrige is wen decisions r taken mutually.


I think that is for the women to decide. It is not free because men have to pay for it. Of course men have to worry about their daughters' education. And do. You have an odd view of the West.

Maybe i do.

I would not think so, but I am not a woman and I do not know. How do you think men in the West behave? Not like this I assure you. Some perhaps but then some do in the Muslim world too. Women have choices in the West. Lots and lots of them. Some good, some bad. You need to realise there is more to the West than Oprah.

Yes I agree women in the west have far more opoortunits than women in the east. But she lost a lot in the same time. The price was too high I belive.


Really? Which Eastern country has had a woman on the Supreme Court or any important woman who was not there because she was someone's sister, daughter or widow?

Pakistan n Bangaldish both had Femal President, the highest post in the country, American never had one, n I strongly doubt they will.

And can you go wherever you want whenever you want? What if your Father or husband forbids you?

if they have a valid reason then I will accept their decision, but no, it never happend that they stopped me from going where i want coz I always tried to stay within the boundris of Islamic law.

Don't need your Father's permission?

In the Hanfi School of thought, a girl doesnt need her father's permission.
Why permission is needed? u see coz girls n guys r not allowed to interract freely, so how can a girl by herslef know if this guy is good enough or not. I mean only the male guardian can check n cross check the guy who wants to marry his daughter. Also elders openion is very valued in the Islamic culture. But lets not forget that a father CANT force his daughter to marry some one she dont agree too. n he cant refuse a guy for no reason unless there is strong valid reason, he has no right to refuse a guy. So He is still bound to marry her off to the guy of her choice.

I am free coz I got the choice to work or stay. coz my husband n my father before him supported me financially in everything, education, clothing, entertainment, vacation.
Nice of them. What could you do if they chose not to?

They wont only if they cant offord it, i would be crazy to ask them for something they cant offird.

As in the West as far as your money goes. But you have fewer options than Western women. And you do not degine what is cheap or what losing your dignity means do you? The government does that for you.

My nature defins wat cheap n wats loosin my dignity means to me, the true nature which i maintaned it follwing Islam. The goverment is helping me n makin the path easier for me.

Surely only half what he does?

Yup I get half of his share of inheritence, only coz he is obliged to spend on me my sister n my mom while I am not. Dont u think thats fair?

Except who is going to see your mind or personality?

First Allah will, from Him i get my biggest reward n satisfaction.
Trust me there r others to see my mind n presonality, we do have lots of options in the muslim world.

Is there a Saudi equivalent of Oprah? How many important Saudi women writers are there

There r many dear...the list is endless.
 
HeiGou said:
I don't think it is acceptable either but I doubt that by any measure domestic abuse in America is particularly high - not compared with, say, Gaza.

I do think domestic abuse in America is very high, generally crime rate is very high. U check the statistics.

I posted this from a WHO report in domestic violence earlier this week. It is a table of Physical Assaults on Women by Intimate Male Partner, 1982-1999. The first figure is the number that have been assaulted in the previous year, the second the number ever as percentages.

Ethiopia, 10, 45
Nigeria, --, 31
Canada, 3, 29
United States, 1.3, 22
Bangladesh, 19, 47
Turkey, --, 58 (east and south-east Anatolia)
Egypt, 16, 34
Israel (Arabs), 32, --
West Bank & Gaza, 52 (any), 37 (severe), --

Draw your own conclusions. I do not think the US has a problem with its 1.3 percent compared to Gaza's 52.

But you are taking an extreme in America - women in prison! - and comparing that to the norm in Saudi? That's not fair.

I didnt, I was trying to say look at the condittion of women in the west, wen they r supposed to be honord n protecting n dignifid, they r left hopeless instead. I didnt compare them to the norm in Saudi. U r the one who brought the eastern n the muslim world in the picture.

How are they hopeless? Ruth Bader Ginsburg sits on the Supreme Court. She did not get there because she was pretty. She did not get there by flaunting herself. She got there because she is smart, educated and hard working. Not because she was someone's sister. Where is the Muslim equivalent?

Oh no, I do know such women, who r suffuring with abusive partners. it does happen in a very small percentage. Most femals in saudi (which is described as the home of opression) enjoy wide range of freedom.

As long as their Fathers and husbands allow them? In the West what seems normal in Muslim society would be called false imprisonment and result in a jail term.

I gather men must not stop women studying Islam but can they stop them doing everything else?

Nope men cant stop women from doing the things they like to do as long as it is withing the boundris of Islam.

Yes. But what is within the boundaries of Islam? A wife has to protect her husband's honor and belongings no? Cana husband interpret that to mean she cannot go out to work? Does a woman need her husband's permission to work in Islam or at least the Saudi interpretation of Islam? Aren't women required to obey their husbands in everything not forbidden by Islam?

How can she file for divorce?

She goes to the court n says her hubby is abusing her, present the evidence, n hope the judge will rule for her.

So no. She can petition a Court to grant her a divorce. Does that happen a lot in Saudi Arabia - courts giving divorces?

She can protest but do you agree that a woman needs to ask her husband's permission before she can work? Or go outside the home?

Nope I dont think that a woman needs to ask her husbands permission before she can work or work outside, a succesful marrige is wen decisions r taken mutually.

Some (relative) moderates would disagree with you

Preventing Wife From Going to Work
Date of Reply 19/May/2005
Topic Of Fatwa Marital relationships
Country Applied Malaysia
Question of Fatwa If a married woman wants to work outside the home, is she obliged to get her husband’s permission? Is it lawful for the husband then to prevent her from going to work? Likewise, is it permissible for a woman to stipulate before marriage that she work outside the house after marriage? If so, would this condition be binding upon the husband? Can he take back his approval of her working after marriage? Would it be permissible for him to stipulate that she share in paying the household expenses in return for his approval of her working? If she helps her husband financially to buy a certain property, does she have the right then to be a co-owner of this property? Or will her participation here be to no avail? Is it permissible for the husband to prevent his wife from going to work solely to cause her harm, or because she continues working when this is against the interest of her family?
Name of Mufti Islamic Fiqh Academy
Content of Reply
In the Name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.

All praise and thanks are due to Allah, and peace and blessings be upon His Messenger.

Dear questioner, we would like to thank you for the great confidence you place in us, and we implore Allah Almighty to help us serve His cause and render our work for His sake.

The relationship between spouses is based on mutual affection, mercy, and kindness. This is in addition to the mutual duties and rights they owe to each other. The husband is to provide his wife with a dwelling, sustenance, clothing, and medical care as needed, according to his income.

The wife, in turn, is to observe her marital obligations to endear herself to her husband and to make their home clean and comfortable so that the husband can find rest and relaxation in it.

The woman may stipulate beforehand that she work outside the house after marriage. If the fiancé agrees to this, he has to fulfill his promise after marriage unless her work would then negatively affect her marital obligations, in which case he can prevent her from working.

HeiGou said:
Really? Which Eastern country has had a woman on the Supreme Court or any important woman who was not there because she was someone's sister, daughter or widow?

Pakistan n Bangaldish both had Femal President, the highest post in the country, American never had one, n I strongly doubt they will.

Yes. Benazir Bhutto who happens to be the daughter of the previous President Zulfikir Bhutto in Pakistan. And Bangladesh has Khaleda Zia, widow of Ziaur Rahman and Sheikh Hasina Wajed, eldest child of Sheikh Mujibur Rahman. As I said, Ginsburg got there on her own, not because of feudal ties that elevates the widows and daughters of powerful men.

HeiGou said:
And can you go wherever you want whenever you want? What if your Father or husband forbids you?

if they have a valid reason then I will accept their decision, but no, it never happend that they stopped me from going where i want coz I always tried to stay within the boundris of Islamic law.

And what if you think they do not have a valid reason and you want to go somewhere anyway - who is entitled to call the police and ask for legal help to get what they want?

In the Hanfi School of thought, a girl doesnt need her father's permission.

Which isn't followed in Saudi Arabia I thought?

Why permission is needed? u see coz girls n guys r not allowed to interract freely, so how can a girl by herslef know if this guy is good enough or not. I mean only the male guardian can check n cross check the guy who wants to marry his daughter.

So girls can't go out anywhere they might meet boys?

HeiGou said:
I am free coz I got the choice to work or stay. coz my husband n my father before him supported me financially in everything, education, clothing, entertainment, vacation.
Nice of them. What could you do if they chose not to?

They wont only if they cant offord it, i would be crazy to ask them for something they cant offird.

Well what if some other girl's parents were not so generous and they decided they did not want their daughter and sister to study or to work. Can they stop her if they want? Regardless of whether they can afford it or not?

But you have fewer options than Western women. And you do not define what is cheap or what losing your dignity means do you? The government does that for you.

My nature defins wat cheap n wats loosin my dignity means to me, the true nature which i maintaned it follwing Islam. The goverment is helping me n makin the path easier for me.

So you happen to agree with your government. Which is convenient. But what if the government decided they were being too liberal and toughen up the conditions so tightly you felt they were too extreme. What could you do about that?

HeiGou said:
Surely only half what he does?

Yup I get half of his share of inheritence, only coz he is obliged to spend on me my sister n my mom while I am not. Dont u think thats fair?

No as it happens. But even if I did, it still would not be equality.

Except who is going to see your mind or personality?

First Allah will, from Him i get my biggest reward n satisfaction.
Trust me there r others to see my mind n presonality, we do have lots of options in the muslim world.

But for the rest of the world it means women being silent and quiet and never being heard. What use it is to have people respect you for your mind if, in fact, they never know what is there? This seems designed to prevent Muslim women from being respected for their minds, because who would know if any of them had one?

HeiGou said:
Is there a Saudi equivalent of Oprah? How many important Saudi women writers are there

There r many dear...the list is endless.

I have time. Who are the important Muslima writers. Feel free not to restrict yourself to Saudi Arabia.
 
I
Draw your own conclusions. I do not think the US has a problem with its 1.3 percent compared to Gaza's 52.

I cant get it, how could u compare USA the most developed country in the world (industrial wise), with Gaza?!

How are they hopeless? Ruth Bader Ginsburg sits on the Supreme Court. She did not get there because she was pretty. She did not get there by flaunting herself. She got there because she is smart, educated and hard working. Not because she was someone's sister. Where is the Muslim equivalent?

Hopeless r those mothers in prison, not Ruth Bader.

As long as their Fathers and husbands allow them? In the West what seems normal in Muslim society would be called false imprisonment and result in a jail term.

Like I said, a husband or a father cant lock female members of the family inside the house.

Yes. But what is within the boundaries of Islam? A wife has to protect her husband's honor and belongings no? Cana husband interpret that to mean she cannot go out to work?

A husband cant stop his wife from working for no reason.

Does a woman need her husband's permission to work in Islam or at least the Saudi interpretation of Islam?

No she dosent need his permission.

Aren't women required to obey their husbands in everything not forbidden by Islam?

No

So no. She can petition a Court to grant her a divorce. Does that happen a lot in Saudi Arabia - courts giving divorces?

Yes

If the fiancé agrees to this, he has to fulfill his promise after marriage unless her work would then negatively affect her marital obligations, in which case he can prevent her from working. [/indent]

A Muslim woman knows that her first priority is her house, her kids n her husband, thats the role which was given to her in Islam. But that dosent make her any less. Now who decides at wat point woking outside is causing her to neglect her house n kids? Both the husband n wife, n so they sit n think whether she change the timings of her job, or she should change her job, or he should change his job, in this way they should reach a satisfactory solution for both of them. Can he come one day n just say "u women leave ur job coz I just dont like u out"?! nope he cant, he must respect his wife n treat her as an equel.

Yes. Benazir Bhutto who happens to be the daughter of the previous President Zulfikir Bhutto in Pakistan. And Bangladesh has Khaleda Zia, widow of Ziaur Rahman and Sheikh Hasina Wajed, eldest child of Sheikh Mujibur Rahman.

Oh come on, still they were elected coz the citizens of their respective countires felt that they can run the country. Now tell me if America Elected Hillary Clinton as the next president, would u say that she didnt deserve it n she is there only coz her hubby was ex-president?

And what if you think they do not have a valid reason and you want to go somewhere anyway - who is entitled to call the police and ask for legal help to get what they want?

hmmmmm, didnt get it.



So girls can't go out anywhere they might meet boys?

They do go out, shopping malls, hospitals, Hypermarkets, Grocery shops ..etc r not segregated, girls can meet any guy they want, but u see the majority dont coz they dont want to break the Islamic rules nor want to do things behind their paretns back. There r some girls who dose meat guys in malls, but thy r a minority, n they wont do it so publicly.


Well what if some other girl's parents were not so generous and they decided they did not want their daughter and sister to study or to work. Can they stop her if they want? Regardless of whether they can afford it or not?

A father cant stop his daughter from studying, coz its her basic right. Also from working unless there is a valid reason.


So you happen to agree with your government. Which is convenient. But what if the government decided they were being too liberal and toughen up the conditions so tightly you felt they were too extreme. What could you do about that?

That wont happen, so no need to worry. N even if it happened, well gonna take some action.


But for the rest of the world it means women being silent and quiet and never being heard. What use it is to have people respect you for your mind if, in fact, they never know what is there? This seems designed to prevent Muslim women from being respected for their minds, because who would know if any of them had one?

U talk as if all muslims women r just locked up in their houses. Thats not the case brother, we do hang around, we walk freely, we work like every one dose. U think we dont have clubs for femals? u think we dont have organizations where we can volunteer? u think we dont have Humanitarian activitis going around here?. Women can work anything as long as they dont cross the boundris, they can even communicate with guys wen only its needed, there r girls who run stors, who run whole bussniss, there is a yearly convention of Arabs Bussniess women held every year in Egypt. Femals can attend any conference of convention n express their openion the way they want to, dont judge the muslim world so harshly bro.


I have time. Who are the important Muslima writers. Feel free not to restrict yourself to Saudi Arabia

hmmmmmm, I will but not today.
 
I posted this from a WHO report in domestic violence earlier this week.
And I responded to this twice:
http://www.islamicboard.com/242350-post34.html
http://www.islamicboard.com/221874-post42.html
How are they hopeless? Ruth Bader Ginsburg sits on the Supreme Court. She did not get there because she was pretty. She did not get there by flaunting herself. She got there because she is smart, educated and hard working. Not because she was someone's sister. Where is the Muslim equivalent?
The list of Muslim women who were jurists is endless. A brief sample.
In the West what seems normal in Muslim society would be called false imprisonment and result in a jail term.
Again your erroneous generalizations. I wonder how many Muslim societies you have lived in to make a claim that it is normal for women to be imprisoned in their houses? Or is this another media-based fallacy?

Yes. But what is within the boundaries of Islam? A wife has to protect her husband's honor and belongings no? Cana husband interpret that to mean she cannot go out to work? Does a woman need her husband's permission to work in Islam or at least the Saudi interpretation of Islam? Aren't women required to obey their husbands in everything not forbidden by Islam?
The position of the husband in Islam is not that of a dictator who can order the wife to do whatever he pleases. The wife and husband are to maintain the house according to mutual consultation. As the Prophet Muhammad pbuh said:
Consult with women. Indeed, you have some rights over your women and they have some rights over you. (Sunan Ibn Majah and Sunan At-Tirmidhi)

None but a noble man treats women in an honourable manner. And none but an ignoble treats women disgracefully. (Sunan At-Tirmidhi)

Thus, a husband and wife should cooperate and both agree on what is best for the family. If they are doing things against the will of eachother, then such a marriage will not be productive in any society, regardless of their religioin.
So no. She can petition a Court to grant her a divorce. Does that happen a lot in Saudi Arabia - courts giving divorces?
The woman's choice in divorce is something that has already been established by the Prophet Muhammad pbuh himself:
Bareerah’s husband was a man named Mugheeth. When Bareerah came to the Prophet for a divorce, Mugheeth came running behind Bareerah and weeping with his tears flowing down his beard. The Prophet said to ‘Abbaas, “O Abbas, are you not astonished at the love of Mugheeth for Bareerah and hatred of Bareerah for Mugheeth?” The Prophet P said to Bareerah, “Why don’t you return to him?” She said, “O Messenger of Allah, are you commading me to do so?” He said, “No I only intercede for him”. She said, “Then I am not in need of him.” (Sahih Bukhari)

Here we have a case where there was no abuse or ill-treatment, but the wife simply did not want to stay with her husband any longer for whatever reason. The Prophet Muhammad pbuh allowed her the divorce and did not prevent her.

And yes, this is also carried out in Saudi courts.
Question: If a woman wants a khul` separation because of her husband’s neglect and bad treatment, and he refuses to grant her request, can the judge force him to grant her a khul`?

Answered by Sheikh Hânî al-Jubayr, judge at the Jeddah Supreme Court

A khul` separation takes place by agreement between the husband and the wife. However, if a woman’s life with her husband becomes unbearable for some reason and her husband refuses to divorce her willingly or accept a khul` resolution, she may take her case before a judge who could terminate their marriage contract if he thinks there are valid reasons to justify it.

In case the husband leaves his wife for a long time and the wife suffers from his absence on account of lack of financial support or lack of fulfillment of her physical needs, she may request the judge to terminate her marriage.

Allah says: “For those who take an oath for abstention from their wives; a waiting for four months is ordained; if then they return, Allah is oft-forgiving, most merciful. But if their intention is firm for divorce, Allah hears and knows all things.” [Sûrah al-Baqarah: 226-227].

In this case, the judge will summon the husband to attend the court and offer him a choice whether to divorce his wife or fulfill his marriage obligations. In case he refuses to do either, the judge will nullify the marriage.
And from Shaykh Munajjid commenting on another divorce narration:
The evidence for that from the Sunnah is that the wife of Thaabit ibn Qays ibn Shammaas (may Allaah be pleased with him) came to the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) and said, “O Messenger of Allaah, I do not find any fault with Thaabit ibn Qays in his character or his religious commitment, but I do not want to commit any act of kufr after becoming a Muslim.” The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said to her, “Will you give back his garden?” Because he had given her a garden as her mahr. She said, “Yes.” The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said to Thaabit: “Take back your garden, and divorce her.”

(Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 5273).


From this case the scholars understood that if a woman cannot stay with her husband, then the judge should ask him to divorce her by khula’; indeed he should order him to do so.
And from Shaykh Abdullah ibn Abdur-Rahman Ibn Jibreen:
Question: Is it possible for the wife to get a khula even if the husband will not agree to it? Can you mention some reasons ?.

Answered by Shaykh ‘Abd-Allaah ibn ‘Abd al-Rahmaan ibn Jibreen

If a woman dislikes her husband’s treatment of her – for example, he is over-strict, hot-tempered or easily-provoked, or gets angry a lot, or criticizes her and rebukes her for the slightest mistake or shortcoming, then she has the right of khula’ [female-instigated divorce].

If she dislikes his physical appearance because of some deformity or ugliness, or because one of his faculties is missing, she has the right of khula’.

If he is lacking in religious commitment – for example, he doesn’t pray, or neglects to pray in jamaa’ah, or does not fast in Ramadaan without a proper excuse, or he goes to parties where haraam things are done, such as fornication, drinking alcohol and listening to singing and musical instruments, etc. – she has the right of khula’.

If he deprives of her of her rights of spending on her maintenance, clothing and other essential needs, when he is able to provide these things, then she has the right to ask for khula’.

If he does not give her her conjugal rights and thus keep her chaste because he is impotent (i.e. unable to have intercourse), or because he does not like her, or he prefers someone else, or he is unfair in the division of his time [i.e., among co-wives], then she has the right to ask for khula’.

And Allaah knows best.

I have time. Who are the important Muslima writers. Feel free not to restrict yourself to Saudi Arabia.
For those you can find online, there is Amatullah Abdullah and Aisha Bewley, the latter being one of the most prolific translators of arabic books, besides writing her own books as well.

Regards
 
Here is a very interesting report. I picked some of the points and thought to share them with u guys adding some of my own comments and reflections.

March 23, 2005 ABC News: Inside a Maximum Security Women's Prison in Atlanta by "Primetime Live"'s Diane Sawyer.

First let me tell u that the report states that 99% of the women in maximum security prison are MOTHERS…..strange huh!



Personally I think that females tend to turn to violence as their last option, either for self defense or to protect their kids, which is in accord to their basic nature. A cat is so cute and calm, but once it becomes a mother and feels that her kids r endangered she becomes so wild and aggressive…..does any one blame these women?!!

Now check out this very astonishing statement….


Both, her and her boy friend, participated in committing this crime, she was given a death penalty and him life sentence with the possibility of parole?!!!...Something is stinking in here!!...

This whole thing of equality of men and women did so much harm for women all around the world, she asked for liberation, started to dress like men and work beside men, the irony?! She still works full time in her house in addition to her career, she have to sponser her family, she earns less than man, and if she wants to enjoy her pension, she should work till she is 67!!!...No woman can bear that, so she quit working before retirement age, here goes her pension!, the result is..75% of the elderly in poverty in USA are women… who is gonna support her now?!..NO ONE..coz she asked for equality.

Now let’s see if she committed a crime, she tends to serve longer sentences than men. She asked for equality and they granted her more than wat she asked for. I feel sick every time I read such stuffs, one can see such reports screaming ‘injustice is committed against women in broad daylight’, some women unfortunately, r so confused, they forgot wat is liberation all about. Enslavement became synonymous to equality and liberation. All those who r wasting their efforts running after the wrong type of liberation… get real!!, look where women r really suffering and restore their lost rights, give them back wat they really deserve, dignity, respect, a life.

Muslim societies, unfortunately, r going in the same direction as like the western ones, we should and must work hard to stop this trend, bring things to order, otherwise our daughters and grand-daughters will fall victims of so called ‘liberation’, they will pay the price high for our INACTION.

:sl:

Welcome to the world of 'democracy'.
 
Re: Swedish Muslims seek separate laws

to pay 4 the pools is ok as its been done in this country but the teachers i admit is a bit overboard :p

I think that the divorce laws would be more of a problem. In Sweden a woman can get divorced and does not have to stay in an abusive relationship. If the Swedish government gave a veto over divorce to Imams, can you imagine the problems? Would Swedish police be required to return battered wives to bad husbands? Would the laws on marital rape apply? It is a can of worms that should be kept shut.
 
Re: Swedish Muslims seek separate laws

I think that the divorce laws would be more of a problem. In Sweden a woman can get divorced and does not have to stay in an abusive relationship. If the Swedish government gave a veto over divorce to Imams, can you imagine the problems? Would Swedish police be required to return battered wives to bad husbands? Would the laws on marital rape apply? It is a can of worms that should be kept shut.

then mayb they can do a benefit kind of law, in other words they pay for those who are struggling to afford it? we got tons of such benefits in this country. Widow benefit, disability, child etc
 
Re: Swedish Muslims seek separate laws

then mayb they can do a benefit kind of law, in other words they pay for those who are struggling to afford it? we got tons of such benefits in this country. Widow benefit, disability, child etc

I may not understand Islamic divorce law properly. Please correct me if I am wrong, but a wife can only ask her husband for a divorce and offer him a lot of money in order to grant it. He does not have to, but he can if he wants. Is that right? I really don't see why the Swedish tax payer ought to be paying large sums of money in what would look a lot like extortion if Husbands just refused to grant divorces. And it does not solve the problem of making wives stay with husbands. Are the Swedish police really expected to enforce Muslim cultural norms on Swedish women who just happen to be Muslim?
 
Re: Swedish Muslims seek separate laws

I may not understand Islamic divorce law properly. Please correct me if I am wrong, but a wife can only ask her husband for a divorce and offer him a lot of money in order to grant it. He does not have to, but he can if he wants. Is that right? I really don't see why the Swedish tax payer ought to be paying large sums of money in what would look a lot like extortion if Husbands just refused to grant divorces. And it does not solve the problem of making wives stay with husbands. Are the Swedish police really expected to enforce Muslim cultural norms on Swedish women who just happen to be Muslim?

what? i think theres a mahr which is given by the husband to the wife, if a divorce is desired then its required that the mahr be given bak to the husband. Correct me if im wrong some1. The wife duznt hav to dish anything out....
 
Re: Swedish Muslims seek separate laws

what? i think theres a mahr which is given by the husband to the wife, if a divorce is desired then its required that the mahr be given bak to the husband. Correct me if im wrong some1. The wife duznt hav to dish anything out....

Well it is her mahr isn't it? So she is giving it back. The question is whether the khul divorce requires just the mahr or if it can be less or if it can be more. As far as I know, which is not far, it is usually the mahr because women rarely own any more. But if the bottomless pit of Swedish taxpayer money is involed.....

But perhaps we could turn this thread into something useful and ask a Mod to clarify the rules for a woman asking for divorce?
 
Re: Swedish Muslims seek separate laws

Hi HeiGou and :sl: 'Abd Majid,
I moved your posts here from the thread on Swedish Muslims.

HeiGou
But perhaps we could turn this thread into something useful and ask a Mod to clarify the rules for a woman asking for divorce?
My response hasn't changed from the one I gave you three weeks ago:
http://www.islamicboard.com/249963-post26.html

Since you never responded, it is possible you missed it, and hence why you raised the same misconception, therefore I've moved the posts to here.

Regards
 

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