So the US calls together many mid eastern countries to try and work out the issues between Palestine and Israel, almost everyone attends except Iran, and what is Irans response? Lets have those who are still launching rockets and provoking the other side come together and discuss ______ (you fill in the blank, mine was how to continue a pointless endless war... )
Iran to host militants for 'alternative' Mideast meet 2 hours, 53 minutes ago
TEHRAN (AFP) - Iran said on Tuesday that it had invited Palestinian militant factions to a meeting in Tehran aimed at countering a US-hosted Middle East peace conference seeking to kickstart the peace process.
"These groups are planning to come to Tehran within the next week or two and they are all the Palestinian groups that are struggling for the freedom of their land," government spokesman Gholam Hossein Elham told reporters.
Iran is one of the most vocal backers of Palestinian militant groups like Hamas and Islamic Jihad and pledged millions of dollars in 2006 to the then Hamas government crippled by a Western aid cut.
The Islamic republic does not recognise Israel and its President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad has provoked outrage by calling for the Jewish state to be wiped off the map.
Elham indicated the Tehran meeting would be a riposte to the conference bringing together Israeli and Palestinian leaders which started in Annapolis outside Washington on Tuesday.
"It means that the Annapolis conference is not representing the Palestinians and not talking on their behalf, but on the contrary is moving against their rights," he said.
More than a dozen Arab countries, including Saudi Arabia and Iran's top regional ally Syria, have sent representatives, leaving Tehran conspicuously isolated.
On Monday Ahmadinejad told Saudi King Abdullah in a telephone call that he "wished" the kingdom was not taking part in the peace conference.
Tehran's arch foe Washington, which is hosting the meeting, dismissed the Iranian criticism as "not surprising," and charged that Tehran backs the extremists sidelined by the talks.
"War does not determine who is right - only who is left."
- Bertrand Russell
"He who fears being conquered is sure of defeat." - Napoleon Bonaparte
"There is nothing so likely to produce peace as to be well prepared to meet the
enemy." - George Washington
I'm only going to say this once. There is no legitimate Islamic government in the world to the full use of it. And you may not worry about oil but If Saudi alone were to stop selling their oil to U.S then you guys would be in tatters. why do u think caused the 1974 oil crises in America. Prices rocketed just because king Faisal stopped selling oil then His brother from guess where was sent to assassinate him. Your only lying to yourself.
Stop bloody talking about terrorists, Terrorist that Terrorist this, thats all you people ever say. If you added all the terrorists in the world since 2001 Invasion Started then counted how many people died because of them it would not even equal quarter of what The Western Kufar states did. Somebody defends their land then he's a terrorist, Somebody fights for his religion then he's a terrorist. Thats the only word westerners use.
Nobody wants a bloodbath, how simple can this be, get our of land that doesn't belong to you. Somalia is not Ethiopia so get the hell out. how simple is that. You people make it seem like the craziest thing ever. There's an unwanted country in our land. Get out of our land. Now all you kufr people start saying well get out of Sweden, England etc.... Which Muslim army is there. Many Christians live in peace in Muslim countries. Why can't we just have peace. Everybody live on their own land. War is very tiring but you people don't understand the concept of resistance. Their can only be peace when our land is rid of armies that have invaded. Imagine how far we would be technologically if there was no war and countries weren't invading others. We'll live our way you live your way and we'll live in peace. These "fake" Muslim countries can't be trusted to protect the Ummah so we need a khaleef to protect us. We don't want western ideologies. We ruled most of the known world for almost 1200 hundred years under Islamic law and we were the superpower then guess what happens with Western Democracy, we break up into pity states that are so corrupt. It's very simple, We want to live in a certain way, If you stop us from living our lives the way ordained for us then we will fight you. If you bring your armies here we'll send them back in different conditions.
Nobody wants a bloodbath, how simple can this be, get our of land that doesn't belong to you. Somalia is not Ethiopia so get the hell out. how simple is that. You people make it seem like the craziest thing ever. There's an unwanted country in our land. Get out of our land. Now all you kufr people start saying well get out of Sweden, England etc.... Which Muslim army is there. Many Christians live in peace in Muslim countries. Why can't we just have peace. Everybody live on their own land. War is very tiring but you people don't understand the concept of resistance. Their can only be peace when our land is rid of armies that have invaded.
It's not 'simple' because your apparent understanding of the conflicts is so simplistic. The Arab/Israeli problem aside it has nothing to do with 'land'. The whole 'resistance' thing is romantic fantasy. Western troops are not in Iraq or Afghanistan for 'land', they are desperate to get out of both places. In both countries, although Western military action certainly created the conditions of conflict, the struggle is an internal one for political power not 'land'. Nobody is fighting for their 'religion' either, or at least if they are it is only because puppet-masters use it as a tool to whip up enough gullible patsies to fight and die to achieve their ends.
In Somalia one faction is being assisted by Ethiopian forces. Nobody is pretending that help is being provided on an altruistic basis but nonetheless the Ethiopians have not 'invaded' Somalia or seized 'land'. They are supporting one faction over another and your gripe is simply that it is not the faction you support. If other countries sent a division or two to do the fighting for the Islamic Courts we wouldn't hear a peep.
As to what we were originally talking about, the whole Arab Israeli problem is that both sides believe land (the borders or which are debatable, and more importantly negotiable) to be theirs.
The whole 'resistance' thing is romantic fantasy. Western troops are not in Iraq or Afghanistan for 'land', they are desperate to get out of both places. In both countries, although Western military action certainly created the conditions of conflict, the struggle is an internal one for political power not 'land'. Nobody is fighting for their 'religion' either, or at least if they are it is only because puppet-masters use it as a tool to whip up enough gullible patsies to fight and die to achieve their ends.
In Somalia one faction is being assisted by Ethiopian forces. Nobody is pretending that help is being provided on an altruistic basis but nonetheless the Ethiopians have not 'invaded' Somalia or seized 'land'. They are supporting one faction over another and your gripe is simply that it is not the faction you support. If other countries sent a division or two to do the fighting for the Islamic Courts we wouldn't hear a peep.
You have no Idea what is going on...
The Prophet (SAW) told us that their would come a time when Every Muslim leader would be a dictator and That Muslims would become oppressed in Iraq, That Afghanistan and Sham (Palestine & Lebanon) would become lands for jihad. You don't understand this one bit. The mujahideen aren't simply fighting to get the invaders out their fighting but the dictators also. The War in Iraq is a gift from God, Why? Because it took out the leader and now lets the mujahideen take control. Ask any Muslim in any country around the world. If the Muslim world was rid of dictators put there by the west during the British planned Arab Revolt against the Ottoman Caliphate then they they would love to go back. Muslim Countries are always better than western ones. Seville in the Islamic Age had no Rival. Dubai and Abu Dhabi today have no rival.
As In Somalia, the ICU is supported by the majority but once they tune a few things up then the whole of Somalia will be with them. If another country came to Somalia? loll, There are many Arab and Chechen Mujahideen fighting in Somalia, There are even Australians who are fighting there and Americans who teach them how to fight and make bombs! When a Nation Is a Muslim Country and Is not followed by the Nation name like "Caliphate" Then any Muslim can become a citizen, run office, become Caliph etc...
Every Muslim is fighting for their religion in Jihad. Bush and the Media were always trying to say "this is not against Islam" crap. But any war against a Muslim country is against Islam because it haram to surrender and hand span of land to Kufr Nations.
The War in Iraq is a gift from God, Why? Because it took out the leader and now lets the mujahideen take control.
WHAT 'mujahideen'?! Who are they? Who exactly is "oppressed" and who is doing the oppressing? The assorted Sunni and Shia version of 'mujahideen' are quite happy killing each other in order to establish their own power base. The imported version of 'mujahideen' will quite happily slaughter anyone who doesn't agree with them; as here, now nobody wants to play their silly games any more.
A 'gift from God'? You don't think if God had anything to do with it he might have come up with a more elegant solution?!
There are some people who claim to be Mujahideen but are not.
The Prophet gave us guidelines for war. among these are
Do not Attack at night. You will disturb a nursing mother
Do Not cut trees
Do not pollute water
Do not kill old men, woman, or children
Do not fight men whom practice religion peacefully
fight those only whom fight you
I condemn the actions of some so called mujahideen but the true ones never lose
They are the greatest warriors on earth. They are holy fighters of Islam. but some claim to be mujahideen but aren't. A Mujahid is a very pious person and a respected person yet he is very fierce on the battle field.
A 'gift from God'? You don't think if God had anything to do with it he might have come up with a more elegant solution?!
Allah SWT tells us in the Quran that just because we say we believe doesn't mean we won't be tested. These times of tests and tribulations from the western media and all really bring out the true muslims from the munafiqs
There are some people who claim to be Mujahideen but are not.
The Prophet gave us guidelines for war. among these are
Do not Attack at night. You will disturb a nursing mother
Do Not cut trees
Do not pollute water
Do not kill old men, woman, or children
Do not fight men whom practice religion peacefully
fight those only whom fight you
I condemn the actions of some so called mujahideen but the true ones never lose
Too bad that fighting for a just cause is not included in the list.
Too bad that fighting for a just cause is not included in the list.
190. And fight in the Way of Allâh those who fight you, but transgress not the limits. Truly, Allâh likes not the transgressors. [This Verse is the first one that was revealed in connection with Jihâd, but it was supplemented by another (V.9:36)]. "To those against whom war is made, permission is given (to defend themselves), because they are wronged - and verily, Allah is Most Powerful to give them victory - (they are) those who have been expelled from their homes in defiance of right - (for no cause) except that they say, 'Our Lord is Allah'.... " 22:39-40
"Fight in the cause of Allah against those who fight against you, but do not transgress limits. Lo! Allah loves not aggressors. ... And fight them until persecution is no more, and religion is for Allah. But if they desist, then let there be no hostility except against transgressors." 2:190,193
Based on above, all fights are legitimate and for "just cause" in Palestine, iraq, afghanistan, Somalia and other Muslims countries where the westerners are the outsiders and are the oppressors, occupiers, invaders and transgressors.
Only fights that are not "just cause" are the westerners who invade muslim lands to plunder their resources.
US deputy defence secretary - War for Oil http://www.truthout.org/docs_03/060503A.shtml
190. And fight in the Way of Allâh those who fight you, but transgress not the limits. Truly, Allâh likes not the transgressors. [This Verse is the first one that was revealed in connection with Jihâd, but it was supplemented by another (V.9:36)]. "To those against whom war is made, permission is given (to defend themselves), because they are wronged - and verily, Allah is Most Powerful to give them victory - (they are) those who have been expelled from their homes in defiance of right - (for no cause) except that they say, 'Our Lord is Allah'.... " 22:39-40
"Fight in the cause of Allah against those who fight against you, but do not transgress limits. Lo! Allah loves not aggressors. ... And fight them until persecution is no more, and religion is for Allah. But if they desist, then let there be no hostility except against transgressors." 2:190,193
Based on above, all fights are legitimate and for "just cause" in Palestine, iraq, afghanistan, Somalia and other Muslims countries where the westerners are the outsiders and are the oppressors, occupiers, invaders and transgressors.
Only fights that are not "just cause" are the westerners who invade muslim lands to plunder their resources.
US deputy defence secretary - War for Oil http://www.truthout.org/docs_03/060503A.shtml
But I guess the difference between us is I don't think evil justifies evil.
You asked for a just cause and i gave you one, now quit twisting things and whining about it. Self-defense against occupiers and invaders is a just cause for any nation.
Last edited by islamirama; 12-02-2007 at 09:55 PM.
You asked for a just cause and i gave you one, now quit twisting things and whining about it. Self-defense against occupiers and invaders is a just cause for any nation.
Why not come back to the truth?
The only thing I ever ask from you was a Pakistani news source.
Just how ignorant do you think I am?
Do you think I am as ignorant as you?
Too bad that fighting for a just cause is not included in the list.
I said is wasn't on the list of requirements not that it never happened.
I was born at night, but it wasn't last night.
Do you think I am one of those idiots that think any group is all bad?
Not like you, I know every groups contain some good and some bad.
Only fights that are not "just cause" are the westerners who invade muslim lands to plunder their resources.
Oh dear God. I thought we had finished with that. Tell us, please, how many barrels of Iraqi oil have been expropriated by the US. What ship did they go on? Did returning US servicement smuggle them in their luggage? You claim is preposterous. That you would again offer it shows that you are a parrot who lacks the capacity for independent thought and can only mimic the utterances of others (or link to a youtube hatchet job).
BTW..how goes the construction on the Aghan pipeline?
what do you consider just, Isn't defending one's brethren just from foreign occupation just?
Depends why there is foreigh occupation?
If a group waged war on a country and that country’s government protests that group and you know that group will attack and continue to attack what choice would that foreign power have?
That is only one of a thousand reasons. Wouldn’t it be nice if everything was simple?
If a group waged war on a country and that country’s government protests that group and you know that group will attack and continue to attack what choice would that foreign power have?
That is only one of a thousand reasons. Wouldn’t it be nice if everything was simple?
I take it you are referring to 9-11. Let's say it's true for the sake of the argument. let's say its not an inside job even though it is. The war and occupation of Iraq has nothing to do with it. Saddam didn't get along with al-qaeda one bit. Even top US generals and greenspan and other official's have stated it was a war for oil. And the whole war was waged on a pack of lies of WMD which are still never found. On top of all that, US defied UN and attacked Iraq for deifying UN. How pathetic is that?
Anyways, let's say the US got attacked and feels the need to protect itself. As their reports indicate, most of the hijackers were from Saudi and Iraq had nothing to do with it. Wouldn't it make sense to attack saudi instead?
"The speaker also repeats his claim of sole responsibility for the September 11, 2001, attacks on New York and Washington, which killed nearly 3,000 people"
This is OBL's latest message to Europe, how can you continue to believe these conspiracy theories, it makes you look like an idiot
format_quote Originally Posted by islamirama
The war and occupation of Iraq has nothing to do with it. Saddam didn't get along with al-qaeda one bit.
I agree, however SH did threaten the US many times over of an attack with WMD, and at the time it was looked at like the terrorist could join with Saddam and have WMD capability, really the attack just made it so SH seemed as more of a threat to US security
format_quote Originally Posted by islamirama
Even top US generals and greenspan and other official's have stated it was a war for oil. And the whole war was waged on a pack of lies of WMD which are still never found. On top of all that, US defied UN and attacked Iraq for deifying UN. How pathetic is that?
A war for oil? How many times do you say this and then someone says show me evidence and you have none? It makes your credibility look badly, unless you have proof of a single drop of free oil, I dont think it is right for you to make this accusation.
As far as the lies about WMD, I dont really disagree with you on that, but it is easy to see how america was dupped regarding it since SH himself was notorious for threatening the US with them. In reality he simple gave that extra confidence to Bush, pretty stupid on his part in retrospect isnt it?
Finally in regard to the US defying the UN, yes it was stupid and yes the Iraq war, whether it is won or lost does certainly appear unnecessary and stupid.
format_quote Originally Posted by islamirama
Anyways, let's say the US got attacked and feels the need to protect itself. As their reports indicate, most of the hijackers were from Saudi and Iraq had nothing to do with it. Wouldn't it make sense to attack saudi instead?
I dont think the origin of the country really makes the country guilty, it is the fact that Afghanistan was where the perpetrator was at and the Taliban could have handed him over and instead they choose to go to war. They were told at the time that if they didnt a military campaign would be launched, so in effect they chose to go to war. Sorry about their luck.
"War does not determine who is right - only who is left."
- Bertrand Russell
"He who fears being conquered is sure of defeat." - Napoleon Bonaparte
"There is nothing so likely to produce peace as to be well prepared to meet the
enemy." - George Washington
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